PA Turnpike News

[bzakharin]

As of right now, Google is very strange along that entire area. The I-95 to 276 interchange is shown as if it already exists, but shows up closed to traffic. The extension is shown closed WB but not EB. Various ramps are closed or open depending on zoom level

[Stephane Dumas]

As of right now, Google is very strange along that entire area. The I-95 to 276 interchange is shown as if it already exists, but shows up closed to traffic. The extension is shown closed WB but not EB. Various ramps are closed or open depending on zoom level

Talk about jumping the gun and the shark with a zest of nuking the fridge.

I saved a screenshot showing the interchange as if it's already there. https://archive.is/LM0dv

[briantroutman]

^ I saw that, too, although it doesn't appear to be using those ramps for routing purposes.

[PHLBOS]

A conventional paper road map (that shows actual interchange ramp layouts) would've shown those future interchange ramps as a dashed line; hinting that such is still under construction.

[74/171FAN]

PennLIVE:  E-ZPass signal lights to disappear from the Pa. Turnpike

The Pennsylvania Turnpike will be getting rid of the familiar red, yellow and green traffic lights used to tell E-ZPass drivers that their transponders are working correctly.

Starting March 17, the Turnpike Commission will gradually replace the lights with more simplified signage due to a change in federal guidelines. The old signals glowed green when the transponder was working and yellow when the customer's balance was low.

I am unsure how to react to this.

[jeffandnicole]

PennLIVE:  E-ZPass signal lights to disappear from the Pa. Turnpike

The Pennsylvania Turnpike will be getting rid of the familiar red, yellow and green traffic lights used to tell E-ZPass drivers that their transponders are working correctly.

Starting March 17, the Turnpike Commission will gradually replace the lights with more simplified signage due to a change in federal guidelines. The old signals glowed green when the transponder was working and yellow when the customer's balance was low.

I am unsure how to react to this.

Any idea what the new federal guideline is?  It would've been nice for the article to kinda mention that little factoid.

[Revive 755]

4K.01 Paragraph 02 of the 2009 MUTCD (which is only a should statement, and not really new anymore)?

Traffic control signals or devices that closely resemble traffic control signals that use red or green circular indications should not be used for new or reconstructed installations at toll plazas to indicate the success or failure of electronic toll payments or to alternately direct drivers making cash toll payments to stop and then proceed.

[Beeper1]

It will probably look like the "EZ-Pass GO"  / "Low Bal" display signs that a number of NY Thruway plazas have

[MASTERNC]

It will probably look like the "EZ-Pass GO"  / "Low Bal" display signs that a number of NY Thruway plazas have

Or the little CMS displays NJ has at its booths.  They normally say "E-ZPass Paid" when a transaction is successful and probably say something like "Call E-ZPass" or "Bal Low" when there is an issue.

[vdeane]

It will probably look like the "EZ-Pass GO"  / "Low Bal" display signs that a number of NY Thruway plazas have

Except those signs supplement the traffic lights at MOST toll booths on the Thruway.  The PTC ones would presumably be stand-alone.  In any case, I don't see why the PTC would spend the money when they're supposed to be going all electronic soon.  Looks like Act 44 isn't the only thing bleeding the agency dry - this would seem to indicate that financial mismanagement is a big problem too.

[jemacedo9]

"Signal light technology currently in use has become outdated and cumbersome," said PTC Chief Operating Officer Craig Shuey. "As the Commission prepares to update toll equipment in the lanes with more modern hardware and software, we are incorporating new federal signage standards. While the removal of signals may cause some initial confusion, it will soon become the norm as our customers adjust to the change."

It seems to me that they are not replacing the signals just for the sake of replacing the signals...but related to other changes which may make these signal changes actually cost efficient. 

And the article mentioned that this will be gradual...not an immediate widespread change.

[briantroutman]

4K.01 Paragraph 02 of the 2009 MUTCD (which is only a should statement, and not really new anymore)?

Traffic control signals or devices that closely resemble traffic control signals that use red or green circular indications should not be used for new or reconstructed installations at toll plazas to indicate the success or failure of electronic toll payments or to alternately direct drivers making cash toll payments to stop and then proceed.

I assume they're specifically referring to the vertical R-Y-G signal that's located at roughly torso height beside the booth where a toll taker would normally be stationed. But there are two other sets of circular red and green lights at nearly all of the PA Turnpike's traditional toll lanes.

Mounted on a gantry ahead of the toll plaza, there's a VMS that indicate the lane's current status (E-ZPass/NO TICKETS, TICKETS AND E-ZPass, LANE CLOSED), above which is a horizontally oriented R-Y-G traffic signal. The light flashes yellow for E-ZPass only, is steady green if tickets are accepted, and steady red if the lane is closed.

And in addition to that, flush mounted on the toll plaza canopy itself is a horizontal R-G light assembly that stays steady green if the lane is open for that direction of travel and red if closed.

These other signals don't specifically "indicate the success or failure of electronic toll payments" , but I wonder if these are the appropriate signals in these applications. Wouldn't the green downward arrow/red X be more correct?

[jeffandnicole]

Still, the article referring to 'MUTCD Compliant' controls, which specifically hasn't been named nor indicated as to what that is.  I've mentioned my issues with reporters not knowing what they're talking about in the past, so this could be one of those instances.  It appears they're really get rid of non-compliant controls and signage, which is the traffic signal, and just have to use something that isn't prohibited by the MUTCD. 

Several agencies have used the traffic signal in the past, although it appears they are doing away with it in some form.  I believe in Maryland on I-95, they simply leaves theirs on green.  The DRBA had both a traffic light and sign; I believe they are only using the sign now (although they tend to change so often it's hard to keep up with what they're doing).  The AC Expressway uses a 2 headed R/G signal.  The DRPA bridges uses a high-speed gate and something...I don't think I've actually looked at the sign in years since I'm only worried about the gate going up.

[vdeane]

"Signal light technology currently in use has become outdated and cumbersome," said PTC Chief Operating Officer Craig Shuey. "As the Commission prepares to update toll equipment in the lanes with more modern hardware and software, we are incorporating new federal signage standards. While the removal of signals may cause some initial confusion, it will soon become the norm as our customers adjust to the change."

It seems to me that they are not replacing the signals just for the sake of replacing the signals...but related to other changes which may make these signal changes actually cost efficient. 

And the article mentioned that this will be gradual...not an immediate widespread change.

Even so, why invest anything in the existing booths when they're switching to AET soon?  Or did that get cancelled?

[Alps]

4K.01 Paragraph 02 of the 2009 MUTCD (which is only a should statement, and not really new anymore)?

Traffic control signals or devices that closely resemble traffic control signals that use red or green circular indications should not be used for new or reconstructed installations at toll plazas to indicate the success or failure of electronic toll payments or to alternately direct drivers making cash toll payments to stop and then proceed.

If the signals reached the end of their useful lives, it makes more sense to replace them with one of those blankout signs than put up new signals, based on MUTCD. If this was any other state/agency, I'd probably assume that was the case. This being PA, who knows!

[cl94]

4K.01 Paragraph 02 of the 2009 MUTCD (which is only a should statement, and not really new anymore)?

Traffic control signals or devices that closely resemble traffic control signals that use red or green circular indications should not be used for new or reconstructed installations at toll plazas to indicate the success or failure of electronic toll payments or to alternately direct drivers making cash toll payments to stop and then proceed.

If the signals reached the end of their useful lives, it makes more sense to replace them with one of those blankout signs than put up new signals, based on MUTCD. If this was any other state/agency, I'd probably assume that was the case. This being PA, who knows!

But all at once? You'd think they'd do like NYSTA and replace with blankout signs as signals fail. But again, this is Pennsylvania.

[jeffandnicole]

"Signal light technology currently in use has become outdated and cumbersome," said PTC Chief Operating Officer Craig Shuey. "As the Commission prepares to update toll equipment in the lanes with more modern hardware and software, we are incorporating new federal signage standards. While the removal of signals may cause some initial confusion, it will soon become the norm as our customers adjust to the change."

It seems to me that they are not replacing the signals just for the sake of replacing the signals...but related to other changes which may make these signal changes actually cost efficient. 

And the article mentioned that this will be gradual...not an immediate widespread change.

Even so, why invest anything in the existing booths when they're switching to AET soon?  Or did that get cancelled?

I wonder how soon that'll truly be.  The NJ/PA Turnpike is probably a good trial to see how many actually pay those bills.  If there's a significant non-collection of those payments, I'd think the PTC will hold off until they figure out how to improve on those collections.

Also, remember they just built a new toll plaza for tickets/cash payments just west of I-95, so I think they know there's probably going to be a bit of time before the conversion occurs.

[cpzilliacus]

I wonder how soon that'll truly be.  The NJ/PA Turnpike is probably a good trial to see how many actually pay those bills.  If there's a significant non-collection of those payments, I'd think the PTC will hold off until they figure out how to improve on those collections.

Also, remember they just built a new toll plaza for tickets/cash payments just west of I-95, so I think they know there's probably going to be a bit of time before the conversion occurs.

The original plan by  PTC was to build a cash/E-ZPass toll plaza for traffic coming west (I-95 south) off the bridge between the bridge landing and Exit 358 (U.S. 13). It would presumably have been similar to the eastbound barrier (GSV here) entering the Pennsylvania Turnpike from the Ohio Turnpike in Lawrence County.

Then PTC announced that they  were going to transition to all-cashless tolling, and the question was (IMO properly) asked - "why build a new plaza that accepts cash west of the Delaware River when we are going to convert to all electronic toll collection?" and the result was the no-cash toll point that's there now.

Things may get more interesting (in terms of unpaid/uncollectable tolls) once I-95 is completed near here in Bristol, and more "thru" I-95 southbound traffic from non-E-ZPass states starts to come through.

[MrDisco99]

The original plan by  PTC was to build a cash/E-ZPass toll plaza for traffic coming west (I-95 south) off the bridge between the bridge landing and Exit 358 (U.S. 13). It would presumably have been similar to the eastbound barrier (GSV here) entering the Pennsylvania Turnpike from the Ohio Turnpike in Lawrence County.

Curious... When did the ticket system on the west side of the turnpike move to Warrendale?  What was the rationale behind that and the one way toll at Gateway?

[PHLBOS]

The original plan by  PTC was to build a cash/E-ZPass toll plaza for traffic coming west (I-95 south) off the bridge between the bridge landing and Exit 358 (U.S. 13). It would presumably have been similar to the eastbound barrier (GSV here) entering the Pennsylvania Turnpike from the Ohio Turnpike in Lawrence County.

Curious... When did the ticket system on the west side of the turnpike move to Warrendale?  What was the rationale behind that and the one way toll at Gateway?

The move took place just over a year ago and the rationale for the one-way toll at the bridge was to match/mimic what has been done at the other tolled Delaware River crossings. Oops, I thought the question was for the eastern gateway (from Delaware Valley (US 13) to just east of Bensalem (US 1)).

Never mind!

[cpzilliacus]

Curious... When did the ticket system on the west side of the turnpike move to Warrendale?  What was the rationale behind that and the one way toll at Gateway?

It moved sometime between 2000 and 2008 (not sure when). This from the Pittsburgh Post Gazette in 2005 discusses some of the relevant dates associated with the west end of the Pennsylvania Turnpike.

As I understand it, the locals (Cranberry Township) were tired of the breezewood at the junction of I-76 (the East-West Mainline of the Pennsylvania Turnpike) and I-79 (when  the breezewood was there, traffic had to use a section of U.S. 19 to get between I-76 and I-79).  As part of the elimination of that breezewood, the ticket system's west terminus was moved to a point just east of I-79, and the old Gateway toll plaza was converted to a one-way barrier toll for traffic entering Pennsylvania from Ohio.

I speculate that this might also have had to do with the inability of the side toll plaza at U.S. 19 not being able to handle the traffic entering and especially exiting the Turnpike.

[jeffandnicole]

The original plan by  PTC was to build a cash/E-ZPass toll plaza for traffic coming west (I-95 south) off the bridge between the bridge landing and Exit 358 (U.S. 13). It would presumably have been similar to the eastbound barrier (GSV here) entering the Pennsylvania Turnpike from the Ohio Turnpike in Lawrence County.

Curious... When did the ticket system on the west side of the turnpike move to Warrendale?  What was the rationale behind that and the one way toll at Gateway?

The move took place just over a year ago and the rationale for the one-way toll at the bridge was to match/mimic what has been done at the other tolled Delaware River crossings.

Actually, it took place way back in 2003, so we're talking nearly 14 years now!  There was a series of changes that occurred over the next few years after that, including widening toll plazas and installing express EZ Pass lanes.

[thenetwork]

Curious... When did the ticket system on the west side of the turnpike move to Warrendale?  What was the rationale behind that and the one way toll at Gateway?

It moved sometime between 2000 and 2008 (not sure when). This from the Pittsburgh Post Gazette in 2005 discusses some of the relevant dates associated with the west end of the Pennsylvania Turnpike.

As part of the elimination of that breezewood, the ticket system's west terminus was moved to a point just east of I-79, and the old Gateway toll plaza was converted to a one-way barrier toll for traffic entering Pennsylvania from Ohio.

IIRC, the entire Westgate toll barrier was completely rebuilt (eastbound & westbound) only a few years before they decided to tear down the "new" westbound booths (wasting money there) and turning the eastbound border entrance into a flat-rate-per-class toll barrier.

[jemacedo9]

Per the PA Turnpike News Release:

As the PTC replaces its equipment with enhanced technology, customers may temporarily see the decommissioned light stations wrapped in yellow plastic at certain Harrisburg-area interchanges and at "E-ZPass Only"  interchanges north and east of Philadelphia. Thereafter, the signals – which have been in service since E-ZPass was launched in 2001 – will go away at several interchanges each month until the upgrade is completed by the end of 2017.

As far as the conversion to AET...I would imagine that if it were decided and approved TODAY, to design the construction plans to do the conversions, and then actually bid those out, and start construction...would take what - 10 years in PTC terms? And I don't get the impression that the decision to go AET is imminent. So, if this is an upgrade to cover the next 10 years...that may actually make sense.

[PHLBOS]

Actually, it took place way back in 2003, so we're talking nearly 14 years now!  There was a series of changes that occurred over the next few years after that, including widening toll plazas and installing express EZ Pass lanes.

Monday-morning brain freeze at work.  I thought MrDisco99 was asking about the Turnpike's eastern end conversions.  I've since corrected my earlier post.