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Started by iBallasticwolf2, August 29, 2015, 08:18:14 PM

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ysuindy

ODOT is planning for a multi-year rehabilitation of I-680 in Youngstown

https://publicinput.com/MAH-680#tab-52979

The project includes 680 from the start at the I-80, Ohio 11, 680 interchange in Austintwon to just east of the South Avenue exit.

The proposal includes the permanent closure of the Mahoning Avenue entrace ramp to 680 South.
I-680 North will be closed from January 2026 through October 2027 from US 62 (East River Crossing) to Ohio 193 (West River Crossing).  The detour will include US 422 (Madison Avenue Expressway).

IIRC correctly the ramps to and from US 422 and US 62 are single lane ramps.  Seems those could lead to some backups.



coldshoulder

#1401
  ^  ^  ^  ^

I saw a Facebook post on this proposal and the comments were overwhelmingly negative, as almost all posters seemingly regularly use the Mahoning Ave. entrance ramp that will be eliminated. Those folks will be initially inconvenienced but I'm sure will ultimately find a  decent alternative, because they'll have no other choice.

That entire stretch of I-680 is hampered by now-disfavored early 1960's design and engineering, unfavorable ROW and geographical constraints, and actual speed levels (from my experiences) typically near 65- to 70-mph where conditions dictate 55- to 60-mph for safe travel.

Also, the ODOT press release (linked in ysuindy's post) was poorly worded resulting in some confusion from those Facebook posters who wondered how South Avenue ended up in Austintown Twp (it isn't!); and others thinking the Mahoning Ave. ramp being eliminated referred to the OH-11 and Mahoning Ave. interchange in Austintown.
You're just like crosstown traffic
All you do is slow me down
And I got better things on the other side of town

seicer

As someone who worked in the Youngstown area for years, I found the site confusing. It should have been very specific (exit number, milepost), and it wasn't.

I agree that the Mahoning Avenue ramp should be closed; a ramp to Interstate 680 is one mile (3 minutes) away.

I am wondering about the removal of the Lanterman Road overpass.

coldshoulder

#1403
Quote from: seicer on December 13, 2024, 10:05:15 AMAs someone who worked in the Youngstown area for years, I found the site confusing. It should have been very specific (exit number, milepost), and it wasn't.

I agree that the Mahoning Avenue ramp should be closed; a ramp to Interstate 680 is one mile (3 minutes) away.

I am wondering about the removal of the Lanterman Road overpass.

Regarding the Lanterman Road overpass, this passage from ODOT is the "company line".  I could not find the traffic count data that was part of that analysis.

 "This project was originally proposed in 2019, and ODOT held a public involvement meeting and gathered comments from the public in November of that year. ODOT conducted a comprehensive analysis of three options in the Bridge Removal Study: bridge replacement, bridge rehabilitation, and bridge removal. This bridge is nearing 60 years old and approaching the end of its useful life, posing safety concerns for traffic on Lanterman Road and IR 680 below.
  This study assessed the cost-benefit of rehabilitating the structure versus removing it from use. The findings indicated that the costs associated with rehabilitating and maintaining the bridge render it infeasible. The cost of constructing cul-de-sacs is a one-time expense with minimal ongoing maintenance, whereas replacing the bridge involves a significantly larger investment and ongoing maintenance costs over time.
  ODOT conducted traffic counts along Lanterman and used this data in the bridge removal study, with traffic volume being a factor in the decision to remove the structure."
You're just like crosstown traffic
All you do is slow me down
And I got better things on the other side of town

Bitmapped

Quote from: coldshoulder on December 14, 2024, 09:25:24 PM
Quote from: seicer on December 13, 2024, 10:05:15 AMAs someone who worked in the Youngstown area for years, I found the site confusing. It should have been very specific (exit number, milepost), and it wasn't.

I agree that the Mahoning Avenue ramp should be closed; a ramp to Interstate 680 is one mile (3 minutes) away.

I am wondering about the removal of the Lanterman Road overpass.

Regarding the Lanterman Road overpass, this passage from ODOT is the "company line".  I could not find the traffic count data that was part of that analysis.

 "This project was originally proposed in 2019, and ODOT held a public involvement meeting and gathered comments from the public in November of that year. ODOT conducted a comprehensive analysis of three options in the Bridge Removal Study: bridge replacement, bridge rehabilitation, and bridge removal. This bridge is nearing 60 years old and approaching the end of its useful life, posing safety concerns for traffic on Lanterman Road and IR 680 below.
  This study assessed the cost-benefit of rehabilitating the structure versus removing it from use. The findings indicated that the costs associated with rehabilitating and maintaining the bridge render it infeasible. The cost of constructing cul-de-sacs is a one-time expense with minimal ongoing maintenance, whereas replacing the bridge involves a significantly larger investment and ongoing maintenance costs over time.
  ODOT conducted traffic counts along Lanterman and used this data in the bridge removal study, with traffic volume being a factor in the decision to remove the structure."


In 2019, ODOT said only about 300 vehicles per day use the bridge. With another crossing less than a mile away, removal seems reasonable IMHO.

countysigns

New I-475 ramps now not expected to open until spring

Motorists eager to use the new U.S. 20A interchange on I-475/U.S. 23 will likely have to wait until spring for that opportunity.

The interchange on Maumee's west side, with the roadway known in the city as Illinois Avenue and in neighboring Monclova Township as Maumee-Western Road, was built as part of a $102 million freeway widening project and was originally supposed to open in the fall.

But when it became uncertain whether everything would be done before winter arrived, the Ohio Department of Transportation and contractor Kokosing Construction Co. prioritized opening all lanes on the freeway while leaving the ramps' openings to the vagaries of winter weather.

ODOT cautioned more than a month ago that the ramps might not open before 2025. With winter coming to life this week, it's now looking more like springtime, when final paving on the northbound side is also planned.

"At this point, I think it will be spring, March, or April before the interchange is open," Mike Benton, ODOT's project engineer, said this week. "It will probably be February before the signals and lights are ready. Then there is some weather-sensitive striping that would need done."

Mr. Benton said that because of the diverging-diamond layout used for the interchange ramps' intersections with U.S. 20A, there are "numerous" traffic and pedestrian signals to install, and street lights also remain to be installed. All of that involves pouring foundations, erecting supports or poles, running conduit and wire, and connecting power supplies.

"By the time that work is complete, there is a good possibility we do not have temps to property stripe until those spring months," the project engineer said. [snip]

coldshoulder

Interesting proposal for a study to reconfigure/reimagine a stretch of a 4-lane divided expressway that carries part of US-422 in Youngstown.

https://www.wfmj.com/story/52170360/grant-awarded-to-study-calming-youngstowns-madison-avenue-expressway
You're just like crosstown traffic
All you do is slow me down
And I got better things on the other side of town

thenetwork

Quote from: coldshoulder on January 14, 2025, 01:29:26 PMInteresting proposal for a study to reconfigure/reimagine a stretch of a 4-lane divided expressway that carries part of US-422 in Youngstown.

https://www.wfmj.com/story/52170360/grant-awarded-to-study-calming-youngstowns-madison-avenue-expressway

I always thought the freeway loop around downtown Youngstown was a carbon copy of Rochester NY's Inner Loop. 

Both are too much for an area that is not as populated as it once was.  Plus now that the long-ago proposed US-62 Freeway between downtown and I-80 is not needed and will never happen, might as well make a more-friendly connection between YSU and the neighborhood just to the north of it.

IIRC, the Madison Freeway was last rehabbing in the early-mid 2000 and will be needing some significant maintenance in the next decade or so.

seicer

Agreed. With the freeway effectively severing YSU's campus, this project could serve to reconnect the two disconnected halves. Downtown + YSU + Wick Park are one of the only growth areas in the city, so investing in that rather than funneling traffic through it would be welcomed.

wanderer2575

Quote from: countysigns on January 03, 2025, 08:11:39 PMNew I-475 ramps now not expected to open until spring

Motorists eager to use the new U.S. 20A interchange on I-475/U.S. 23 will likely have to wait until spring for that opportunity.

The interchange on Maumee's west side, with the roadway known in the city as Illinois Avenue and in neighboring Monclova Township as Maumee-Western Road, was built as part of a $102 million freeway widening project and was originally supposed to open in the fall.

But when it became uncertain whether everything would be done before winter arrived, the Ohio Department of Transportation and contractor Kokosing Construction Co. prioritized opening all lanes on the freeway while leaving the ramps' openings to the vagaries of winter weather.

ODOT cautioned more than a month ago that the ramps might not open before 2025. With winter coming to life this week, it's now looking more like springtime, when final paving on the northbound side is also planned.

"At this point, I think it will be spring, March, or April before the interchange is open," Mike Benton, ODOT's project engineer, said this week. "It will probably be February before the signals and lights are ready. Then there is some weather-sensitive striping that would need done."

Mr. Benton said that because of the diverging-diamond layout used for the interchange ramps' intersections with U.S. 20A, there are "numerous" traffic and pedestrian signals to install, and street lights also remain to be installed. All of that involves pouring foundations, erecting supports or poles, running conduit and wire, and connecting power supplies.

"By the time that work is complete, there is a good possibility we do not have temps to property stripe until those spring months," the project engineer said. [snip]

Not only the ramps.  Because this is a diverging diamond, doesn't that mean US-20A itself now will remain closed all winter?

thenetwork

#1410
Quote from: seicer on January 14, 2025, 03:11:48 PMAgreed. With the freeway effectively severing YSU's campus, this project could serve to reconnect the two disconnected halves. Downtown + YSU + Wick Park are one of the only growth areas in the city, so investing in that rather than funneling traffic through it would be welcomed.

And with the SR-711 freeway completed around the same time, nobody had to use the Madison Freeway anymore to US-62/SR-7 or SR-193/Belmont Avenue to access I-80 East or SR-11 North.

PColumbus73

Quote from: thenetwork on January 14, 2025, 04:00:20 PM
Quote from: seicer on January 14, 2025, 03:11:48 PMAgreed. With the freeway effectively severing YSU's campus, this project could serve to reconnect the two disconnected halves. Downtown + YSU + Wick Park are one of the only growth areas in the city, so investing in that rather than funneling traffic through it would be welcomed.

And with the SR-711 freeway completed around the same time, nobody had to use the Madison Freeway anymore to US-62/SR-7 or SR-193/Belmont Avenue to access I-80 East or SR-11 North.

For 16,000 AADT, it could be removed and no one would bat an eye. They could just redirect traffic on the frontage roads and redevelop the old freeway space, maybe keep the eastbound lanes between Elm St and 5th Ave.

tigerwings

Quote from: wanderer2575 on January 14, 2025, 03:50:57 PM
Quote from: countysigns on January 03, 2025, 08:11:39 PMNew I-475 ramps now not expected to open until spring

Motorists eager to use the new U.S. 20A interchange on I-475/U.S. 23 will likely have to wait until spring for that opportunity.

The interchange on Maumee's west side, with the roadway known in the city as Illinois Avenue and in neighboring Monclova Township as Maumee-Western Road, was built as part of a $102 million freeway widening project and was originally supposed to open in the fall.

But when it became uncertain whether everything would be done before winter arrived, the Ohio Department of Transportation and contractor Kokosing Construction Co. prioritized opening all lanes on the freeway while leaving the ramps' openings to the vagaries of winter weather.

ODOT cautioned more than a month ago that the ramps might not open before 2025. With winter coming to life this week, it's now looking more like springtime, when final paving on the northbound side is also planned.

"At this point, I think it will be spring, March, or April before the interchange is open," Mike Benton, ODOT's project engineer, said this week. "It will probably be February before the signals and lights are ready. Then there is some weather-sensitive striping that would need done."

Mr. Benton said that because of the diverging-diamond layout used for the interchange ramps' intersections with U.S. 20A, there are "numerous" traffic and pedestrian signals to install, and street lights also remain to be installed. All of that involves pouring foundations, erecting supports or poles, running conduit and wire, and connecting power supplies.

"By the time that work is complete, there is a good possibility we do not have temps to property stripe until those spring months," the project engineer said. [snip]

Not only the ramps.  Because this is a diverging diamond, doesn't that mean US-20A itself now will remain closed all winter?

2 lanes have been open for while.

coldshoulder

Quote from: thenetwork on January 14, 2025, 03:08:35 PM
Quote from: coldshoulder on January 14, 2025, 01:29:26 PMInteresting proposal for a study to reconfigure/reimagine a stretch of a 4-lane divided expressway that carries part of US-422 in Youngstown.

https://www.wfmj.com/story/52170360/grant-awarded-to-study-calming-youngstowns-madison-avenue-expressway


I always thought the freeway loop around downtown Youngstown was a carbon copy of Rochester NY's Inner Loop. 

Both are too much for an area that is not as populated as it once was.  Plus now that the long-ago proposed US-62 Freeway between downtown and I-80 is not needed and will never happen, might as well make a more-friendly connection between YSU and the neighborhood just to the north of it.

IIRC, the Madison Freeway was last rehabbing in the early-mid 2000 and will be needing some significant maintenance in the next decade or so.

Agree that Youngstown's freeway system does mirror Rochester NY's.  And Rochester in the past decade successfully (?) removed/repurposed part of it's loop, similar to what is being proposed here.

And actually, over the past 25 years there have been some occasional rumblings by some elected officials and/or agencies to possibly revive the US-62 "Hubbard Expressway" segment you reference that has never been built. Here are a couple of recent links to talks/proposals that don't directly address that potential road but are somewhat adjacent or related to that corridor; along with some older "dreams-that-won't-die, pie-in-the-sky" rumblings:

(October, 2024):
https://www.tribtoday.com/news/local-news/2024/10/new-hubbard-interchange-eyed/

(February, 2024):
https://www.wkbn.com/news/local-news/youngstown-news/looking-at-the-future-of-youngstowns-crab-creek-corridor/

(January, 2006):
https://vindyarchives.com/news/2006/jan/21/valley-needs-to-make-a-push-for-the-hubbard/

(October, 1999):
https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/106/hr3026/text
You're just like crosstown traffic
All you do is slow me down
And I got better things on the other side of town

Rothman

Youngstown needs all the help it can get.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

silverback1065

youngstown is another city i argue should never have had any downtown freeways in the first place.

thenetwork

Quote from: silverback1065 on January 15, 2025, 07:56:36 AMyoungstown is another city i argue should never have had any downtown freeways in the first place.

When the downtown loop was envisioned and gradually built, downtown Youngstown was still healthy with retail, the University, and most importantly -- the steel mills which nearly surrounded the area.  The factories were the reason why they needed all the freeways in the area -- mostly to keep the factory traffic from choking up the city streets.

Unfortunately, when the "loop" was completed in the mid-70s, the steel mill industry collapsed and ultimately closed while the malls in the outlying areas of Youngstown pretty much took what was left of the downtown retail. And practically overnight, the freeway loop became overkill for the town.

coldshoulder

Quote from: thenetwork on January 15, 2025, 08:31:31 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on January 15, 2025, 07:56:36 AMyoungstown is another city i argue should never have had any downtown freeways in the first place.

When the downtown loop was envisioned and gradually built, downtown Youngstown was still healthy with retail, the University, and most importantly -- the steel mills which nearly surrounded the area.  The factories were the reason why they needed all the freeways in the area -- mostly to keep the factory traffic from choking up the city streets.

Unfortunately, when the "loop" was completed in the mid-70s, the steel mill industry collapsed and ultimately closed while the malls in the outlying areas of Youngstown pretty much took what was left of the downtown retail. And practically overnight, the freeway loop became overkill for the town.

In another thread (maybe even this one ?) a few years back, I commented on at least one other reason why Youngstown seems to have more than it's share of freeway/expressway miles compared to some of it's like-sized peers: 

Youngstown native J. Phillip Richley had served as Youngstown City Engineer, then Mahoning County Engineer; then was the Director of the Ohio Department of Transportation (ODOT) from 1971 thru 1974, a period of time when freeway planning and/or expansion occurred including this "Madison Avenue Expressway"/US-422 and the southward extension of I-680 out to Boardman and beyond.  Richley then worked for Youngstown-based national mall developer the Cafaro Company before he served a two-year term as Youngstown Mayor in 1978-79.

One particular example of Richley's likely influence is the overbuilt loop interchange near the east end of the Madison Avenue Expressway with the US-62 expressway on the city's East Side very near (at-the-time) the Cafaro Company's McGuffey Mall, a first-generation shopping plaza that was partially converted to a mall-like facility (and which has now been abandoned and demolished). This interchange would have carried traffic onto the infamous "Hubbard Expressway" ~ mentioned upthread but never built or even preliminary engineered.

You're just like crosstown traffic
All you do is slow me down
And I got better things on the other side of town

thenetwork

It seems like the bulk of the plans for US-62 to be at least a 4-lane controlled access highway between Canton and Hubbard/Sharon PA never came to fruition, which explains it's weird alignments it has today.

If all the original 4-lane divided highway and freeway plans just in the Northeast Ohio region alone came to fruition, it would make today's North Carolina highway system blush!

The Ghostbuster

I think, at the very least, that the US 62T bypass of Alliance should have been connected to the OH 14T/US 62 bypass of Salem. I also would have liked to see the US 30 corridor become completely four lanes across the entire state and am disappointed that improvements sputtered out in East Canton. Outside of those two, and further upgrades to US 23 between Columbus and Toledo, I don't have a burning desire to see Ohio replicate North Carolina.

thenetwork

Quote from: The Ghostbuster on January 16, 2025, 01:37:02 PMI think, at the very least, that the US 62T bypass of Alliance should have been connected to the OH 14T/US 62 bypass of Salem. I also would have liked to see the US 30 corridor become completely four lanes across the entire state and am disappointed that improvements sputtered out in East Canton. Outside of those two, and further upgrades to US 23 between Columbus and Toledo, I don't have a burning desire to see Ohio replicate North Carolina.

Those plus the only other nixed projects I wish were completed:

Completion of the US-250/SR-13 bypass northeast of Norwalk to connect with the 4-lane section by Milan.

I would also go with the 4-laning of SR-585 between Wooster and Akron (Norton).  The current 2-lane section is a little too curvy and hilly -- add to that the occasional Amish buggy or farm tractor out of the blue.  Plus, SR-3 and 83 are the only other 2-laners connecting Wooster to points north and northeast of Wooster.  Either that or make SR-83 a 4-lane limited access highway from Wooster to I-71 near Lodi.

TempoNick

Stop screwing around. Time for that outer outerbelt or at least portions of it.

"Lancaster to be awarded federal funding for road feasibility study"

The intensive study will work towards the goal of expanding the roads by paying for engineers to closely evaluate the roads, soil and traffic patterns.

"At certain times of day it can be truck after truck after truck coming through ..."

https://www.10tv.com/article/news/local/boomtown-ohio/lancaster-ohio-federal-funding-for-road-feasibility-study/530-36dc1c94-5dcd-4d1d-90bc-e8a226950bf8

GCrites

US-22 is the big driver of truck traffic through Downtown Lancaster now that the US-33 bypass is 20 years old. Circleville has also looked at ways to get the US-22 truck traffic to go around their downtown, possibly by way of a Crites Road/Progress Parkway/Kingston Pike connector.

vtk

Wait, it's all Ohio? Always has been.

PColumbus73

Looks like they're proposing building it on top of the Hocking River. I imagine that would be an instant dealbreaker.



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