Michigan Notes

[Rothman]

Toll Battle Creek for what? Battle Creek is a city not a highway.

Toll them for highway funds.  Sort of like how a lot of major roads to get into NYC are tolled.

[NWI_Irish96]

Guess that surplus Terry was talking about went pfffffft.

Wrong!  There's still going to be about a $9 billion dollar budget surplus, but apparently none of this surplus is going towards roads!  Whitmer had previously proposed a .45/gallon ADDITIONAL gas tax, which neither party wanted. That massive increase would have generated $2.5 billion in additional revenue, but only $1.2 billion would have actually gone towards roads.  This state has plenty of money and generates plenty of revenue, but not enough is earmarked for roads.
https://michiganadvance.com/2023/01/13/state-has-huge-9-2b-surplus-to-help-navigate-a-likely-economic-downturn/

Read what you've said again very slowly and then see how it's the same as what I said.

No, it's not the same thing!  Out state government is running a $9 billion budget surplus!  Obviously, we pay more than enough taxes and tolls certainly are not necessary.  It's simply a matter of re-prioritizing the budgeting process and sorting out where it's being spent.  School funding is showing an excess of $4.1 billion and a good portion of school funding comes from diverted fuel taxes!  We don't need more taxes.  We don't need tolls.  We need to keep fuel tax monies going exclusively to roads.  But you really shouldn't be worried about our state when the state that employs you is currently running a $3 billion budget deficit, is over $160 billion in debt and projected to be over $200 billion in debt by 2027, despite all the massive taxes and tolls you pay there!
https://www.statista.com/statistics/305318/new-york-state-debt/

If you have to re-prioritize, there's not enough funding to do everything, the surplus is really just a charade given MI's needs across the board and roads are not a priority in MI.  Therefore, you need more revenue to pay for roads.

Time to toll Battle Creek.

Not enough money in that. Toll Ann Arbor. Every road leading there, but only inbound. It costs you to get there but it's free to leave.

[Flint1979]

Toll Battle Creek for what? Battle Creek is a city not a highway.

Toll them for highway funds.  Sort of like how a lot of major roads to get into NYC are tolled.

Battle Creek isn't even comparable to NYC.

[Flint1979]

I have a better idea. Let's toll every Ohio license plate at the border.

[Flint1979]

You know one thing I'm getting sick and tired of. That'd be Michigan winters. This winter has been stupid. It snows, melts, snows again, melts again, snows again, melts again seriously this state sucks in the winter. Like oh it's winter time in Michigan it's gotta snow, we gotta have snow on the ground. I wish I was in Texas right now.

[Rothman]

Guess that surplus Terry was talking about went pfffffft.

Wrong!  There's still going to be about a $9 billion dollar budget surplus, but apparently none of this surplus is going towards roads!  Whitmer had previously proposed a .45/gallon ADDITIONAL gas tax, which neither party wanted. That massive increase would have generated $2.5 billion in additional revenue, but only $1.2 billion would have actually gone towards roads.  This state has plenty of money and generates plenty of revenue, but not enough is earmarked for roads.
https://michiganadvance.com/2023/01/13/state-has-huge-9-2b-surplus-to-help-navigate-a-likely-economic-downturn/

Read what you've said again very slowly and then see how it's the same as what I said.

No, it's not the same thing!  Out state government is running a $9 billion budget surplus!  Obviously, we pay more than enough taxes and tolls certainly are not necessary.  It's simply a matter of re-prioritizing the budgeting process and sorting out where it's being spent.  School funding is showing an excess of $4.1 billion and a good portion of school funding comes from diverted fuel taxes!  We don't need more taxes.  We don't need tolls.  We need to keep fuel tax monies going exclusively to roads.  But you really shouldn't be worried about our state when the state that employs you is currently running a $3 billion budget deficit, is over $160 billion in debt and projected to be over $200 billion in debt by 2027, despite all the massive taxes and tolls you pay there!
https://www.statista.com/statistics/305318/new-york-state-debt/

If you have to re-prioritize, there's not enough funding to do everything, the surplus is really just a charade given MI's needs across the board and roads are not a priority in MI.  Therefore, you need more revenue to pay for roads.

Time to toll Battle Creek.

Not enough money in that. Toll Ann Arbor. Every road leading there, but only inbound. It costs you to get there but it's free to leave.

I could get behind that.

Heck, it doesn't have to be exclusive.  We could do both.

Anyway, point is that MI needs more money for roads and either has to tax or toll given other political pressures on its budget.

[Flint1979]

I noticed a new roundabout at the northern terminus of M-13 at US-23 yesterday. It used to be just an overpass with loop ramps now it's a through roundabout looks a lot better without the overpass there.

[The Ghostbuster]

Since US 23 will likely forever remain a two-lane highway between Standish and Mackinaw City, a roundabout at the M-13/US 23 intersection seems logical, at least to me.

[Flint1979]

Since US 23 will likely forever remain a two-lane highway between Standish and Mackinaw City, a roundabout at the M-13/US 23 intersection seems logical, at least to me.

Yeah it's better than it used to be.

[wanderer2575]

Eastbound I-94 in Ann Arbor between the M-14 exit and Ann Arbor-Saline Road, and Liberty Road over I-94, are closed for emergency repairs after a high-load hit today at the Liberty Road bridge.

https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2023/03/13/part-of-i-94-closes-near-ann-arbor-following-bridge-damage/70005009007/

It is beyond time to seriously lower the monetary/criminal penalty hammer on these a-holes who drive their vehicles under bridges and over railroad crossings that are clearly posted as inadequate for said vehicles.

[Terry Shea]

Guess that surplus Terry was talking about went pfffffft.

Wrong!  There's still going to be about a $9 billion dollar budget surplus, but apparently none of this surplus is going towards roads!  Whitmer had previously proposed a .45/gallon ADDITIONAL gas tax, which neither party wanted. That massive increase would have generated $2.5 billion in additional revenue, but only $1.2 billion would have actually gone towards roads.  This state has plenty of money and generates plenty of revenue, but not enough is earmarked for roads.
https://michiganadvance.com/2023/01/13/state-has-huge-9-2b-surplus-to-help-navigate-a-likely-economic-downturn/

Read what you've said again very slowly and then see how it's the same as what I said.

No, it's not the same thing!  Out state government is running a $9 billion budget surplus!  Obviously, we pay more than enough taxes and tolls certainly are not necessary.  It's simply a matter of re-prioritizing the budgeting process and sorting out where it's being spent.  School funding is showing an excess of $4.1 billion and a good portion of school funding comes from diverted fuel taxes!  We don't need more taxes.  We don't need tolls.  We need to keep fuel tax monies going exclusively to roads.  But you really shouldn't be worried about our state when the state that employs you is currently running a $3 billion budget deficit, is over $160 billion in debt and projected to be over $200 billion in debt by 2027, despite all the massive taxes and tolls you pay there!
https://www.statista.com/statistics/305318/new-york-state-debt/

If you have to re-prioritize, there's not enough funding to do everything, the surplus is really just a charade given MI's needs across the board and roads are not a priority in MI.  Therefore, you need more revenue to pay for roads.

Time to toll Battle Creek.

Whatever you say, Mr. $200 billion debt.  We need to be just like New York, and have the highest taxes in the country while also having the most debt.  I bow to your tyrannical thinking... not!

[Terry Shea]

Toll Battle Creek for what? Battle Creek is a city not a highway.

Toll them for highway funds.  Sort of like how a lot of major roads to get into NYC are tolled.

Does the name Battle Creek trigger you?  Does it sound too violent or something?  Now if you people in New York had any smarts you'd let people into the state and/or city without tolls... and then toll the Hell out of them trying to escape the grasp of your tyrannical, tax-happy, toll-happy, God-forsaken city and/or state!  

[Terry Shea]

You know one thing I'm getting sick and tired of. That'd be Michigan winters. This winter has been stupid. It snows, melts, snows again, melts again, snows again, melts again seriously this state sucks in the winter. Like oh it's winter time in Michigan it's gotta snow, we gotta have snow on the ground. I wish I was in Texas right now.

Yeah.  It was just announced that the Grand Rapids area may have its snowiest winter ever.  That's seems unbelievable because days with snow on the ground have been quite rare.  And it's been well warmer than normal.

[Terry Shea]

Eastbound I-94 in Ann Arbor between the M-14 exit and Ann Arbor-Saline Road, and Liberty Road over I-94, are closed for emergency repairs after a high-load hit today at the Liberty Road bridge.

https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2023/03/13/part-of-i-94-closes-near-ann-arbor-following-bridge-damage/70005009007/

It is beyond time to seriously lower the monetary/criminal penalty hammer on these a-holes who drive their vehicles under bridges and over railroad crossings that are clearly posted as inadequate for said vehicles.

Aw c'mon man!  He couldn't have missed by more than a foot or 2!

[Terry Shea]

I noticed a new roundabout at the northern terminus of M-13 at US-23 yesterday. It used to be just an overpass with loop ramps now it's a through roundabout looks a lot better without the overpass there.

Wait... are you saying they removed the overpass and replaced it with a roundabout?  What's the sense in that?

[Terry Shea]

Guess that surplus Terry was talking about went pfffffft.

Wrong!  There's still going to be about a $9 billion dollar budget surplus, but apparently none of this surplus is going towards roads!  Whitmer had previously proposed a .45/gallon ADDITIONAL gas tax, which neither party wanted. That massive increase would have generated $2.5 billion in additional revenue, but only $1.2 billion would have actually gone towards roads.  This state has plenty of money and generates plenty of revenue, but not enough is earmarked for roads.
https://michiganadvance.com/2023/01/13/state-has-huge-9-2b-surplus-to-help-navigate-a-likely-economic-downturn/

Read what you've said again very slowly and then see how it's the same as what I said.

No, it's not the same thing!  Out state government is running a $9 billion budget surplus!  Obviously, we pay more than enough taxes and tolls certainly are not necessary.  It's simply a matter of re-prioritizing the budgeting process and sorting out where it's being spent.  School funding is showing an excess of $4.1 billion and a good portion of school funding comes from diverted fuel taxes!  We don't need more taxes.  We don't need tolls.  We need to keep fuel tax monies going exclusively to roads.  But you really shouldn't be worried about our state when the state that employs you is currently running a $3 billion budget deficit, is over $160 billion in debt and projected to be over $200 billion in debt by 2027, despite all the massive taxes and tolls you pay there!
https://www.statista.com/statistics/305318/new-york-state-debt/

If you have to re-prioritize, there's not enough funding to do everything, the surplus is really just a charade given MI's needs across the board and roads are not a priority in MI.  Therefore, you need more revenue to pay for roads.

Time to toll Battle Creek.

Not enough money in that. Toll Ann Arbor. Every road leading there, but only inbound. It costs you to get there but it's free to leave.

I could get behind that.

Heck, it doesn't have to be exclusive.  We could do both.

Anyway, point is that MI needs more money for roads and either has to tax or toll given other political pressures on its budget.

Well fortunately, you aren't the Michigan Tyrantasoreass (although it sure sounds like you would like to be) and you have no say in what goes on here whatsoever.  If you ever visit our state, please feel free to stop by Lansing and pay all the voluntary tolls your little heart desires. 

[Flint1979]

You know one thing I'm getting sick and tired of. That'd be Michigan winters. This winter has been stupid. It snows, melts, snows again, melts again, snows again, melts again seriously this state sucks in the winter. Like oh it's winter time in Michigan it's gotta snow, we gotta have snow on the ground. I wish I was in Texas right now.

Yeah.  It was just announced that the Grand Rapids area may have its snowiest winter ever.  That's seems unbelievable because days with snow on the ground have been quite rare.  And it's been well warmer than normal.

Grand Rapids gets an average of 75 inches per year, on January 13th they were at 68 inches which at that point was 31 inches more than normal. But here's the kicker they say Detroit had only received 7 inches of snow for the entire season on January 13th. The totals are all over the place but it seems strange that Grand Rapids would get that much more snow than Detroit. But then again I think Grand Rapids is right in the path of lake effect snow.

[Rothman]

Toll Battle Creek for what? Battle Creek is a city not a highway.

Toll them for highway funds.  Sort of like how a lot of major roads to get into NYC are tolled.

Does the name Battle Creek trigger you?  Does it sound too violent or something?  Now if you people in New York had any smarts you'd let people into the state and/or city without tolls... and then toll the Hell out of them trying to escape the grasp of your tyrannical, tax-happy, toll-happy, God-forsaken city and/or state!

I don't think I'm the one that's triggered...

[Flint1979]

In NYC they do toll you as you are coming into the city but when you are leaving you don't pay a toll. The toll of course is off set as if you paid in both directions it's like $17 to cross the GWB. Even our toll bridges don't cost that much, for a round trip over the Mackinac Bridge it's $8. I think the Ambassador Bridge is like $7 to cross in each direction which is more expensive than the tunnel, Bluewater Bridge and International Bridge.

[wanderer2575]

I noticed a new roundabout at the northern terminus of M-13 at US-23 yesterday. It used to be just an overpass with loop ramps now it's a through roundabout looks a lot better without the overpass there.

Wait... are you saying they removed the overpass and replaced it with a roundabout?  What's the sense in that?

I don't know for a fact the reason, but if that bridge needed work then MDOT might have decided the better investment was to remove it.  A US-23 freeway extension isn't going to happen.

[Rothman]

In NYC they do toll you as you are coming into the city but when you are leaving you don't pay a toll. The toll of course is off set as if you paid in both directions it's like $17 to cross the GWB. Even our toll bridges don't cost that much, for a round trip over the Mackinac Bridge it's $8. I think the Ambassador Bridge is like $7 to cross in each direction which is more expensive than the tunnel, Bluewater Bridge and International Bridge.

Hm.  You're right.  MI had better toll both directions.

[Flint1979]

In NYC they do toll you as you are coming into the city but when you are leaving you don't pay a toll. The toll of course is off set as if you paid in both directions it's like $17 to cross the GWB. Even our toll bridges don't cost that much, for a round trip over the Mackinac Bridge it's $8. I think the Ambassador Bridge is like $7 to cross in each direction which is more expensive than the tunnel, Bluewater Bridge and International Bridge.

Hm.  You're right.  MI had better toll both directions.

I very highly doubt Michigan will ever toll their roads so they won't even be tolled in one direction.

[Flint1979]

I noticed a new roundabout at the northern terminus of M-13 at US-23 yesterday. It used to be just an overpass with loop ramps now it's a through roundabout looks a lot better without the overpass there.

Wait... are you saying they removed the overpass and replaced it with a roundabout?  What's the sense in that?

I don't know for a fact the reason, but if that bridge needed work then MDOT might have decided the better investment was to remove it.  A US-23 freeway extension isn't going to happen.

It was an old overpass.

[The Ghostbuster]

This is the past/present configurations on Google Maps: https://www.google.com/maps/@43.9509262,-83.9664833,982m/data=!3m1!1e3 for overhead; https://www.google.com/maps/@43.9501701,-83.9738689,3a,75y,93.64h,93.31t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1syBPlu8xOkMsQcHAfcj_wMQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 for Street View. The last Street View is dated September 2019, so one will have to wait to get a Street View image of the roundabout.

[Flint1979]

This is the past/present configurations on Google Maps: https://www.google.com/maps/@43.9509262,-83.9664833,982m/data=!3m1!1e3 for overhead; https://www.google.com/maps/@43.9501701,-83.9738689,3a,75y,93.64h,93.31t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1syBPlu8xOkMsQcHAfcj_wMQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 for Street View. The last Street View is dated September 2019, so one will have to wait to get a Street View image of the roundabout.

I've already driven through it so already seen it myself.