New Jersey Turnpike

[jeffandnicole]

You were asked to stop discussing your desired lane balances on the NJ Turnpike. Please heed moderator requests.

Why?  Nobody ever answered why the NJTP doesn't like doing 4 lanes in each direction.

To answer that very specific question: The NJ Turnpike does have 4 lanes in each direction in the outer (truck lanes) roadway between Interchange 11 & 14, except thru the Interchange 13 area where it remains 3 lanes.  A project listed in their Capital Plan will widen the Turnpike to 4 lanes in that area, to allow for a continuous 4 lane outer roadway from 11 - 14.

Also listed is a project to widen the Newark Bay-Hudson County Extension between Interchange 14 & 14A from 2 lanes per direction to 4 lanes per direction.

[SignBridge]

How are they going to add lanes over the Newark Bay Bridge?

[jeffandnicole]

How are they going to add lanes over the Newark Bay Bridge?

Per https://www.njta.com/media/5832/2020_njtalongrangecapitalplan_v1-as-approved-may-2020.pdf , pdf page 40, via a new bridge.  It doesn't get more specific, but my best guess would be a new span for one direction of traffic, and the existing span will be retrofitted for the opposing traffic.

[D-Dey65]

EZ-Pass express lanes opened at 18E.
https://www.facebook.com/TurnpikeAuthority/posts/4529787643764160

Link requires a login.

https://twitter.com/NJTurnpike/status/1462756312148762625

But the twitter page doesn't, and thanks to this, I was able to get to their official page and found out they were auctioning off their old equipment the day after I used it to get to NYC.

https://www.njta.com/newsroom/njta-is-selling-surplus-equipment-vehicles-and-parts-sealed-bids-are-due-by-11-am-nov-22nd

I also used E-Z Pass for the first time with Sun Pass Pro that day, and not just on the New Jersey Turnpike.

[jeffandnicole]

EZ-Pass express lanes opened at 18E.
https://www.facebook.com/TurnpikeAuthority/posts/4529787643764160

Link requires a login.

https://twitter.com/NJTurnpike/status/1462756312148762625

But the twitter page doesn't, and thanks to this, I was able to get to their official page and found out they were auctioning off their old equipment the day after I used it to get to NYC.

https://www.njta.com/newsroom/njta-is-selling-surplus-equipment-vehicles-and-parts-sealed-bids-are-due-by-11-am-nov-22nd

I also used E-Z Pass for the first time with Sun Pass Pro that day, and not just on the New Jersey Turnpike.

The day after they used what? Most of their auction items are old vehicles and off-roadway maintenance equipment for grass and tree trimming.

BTW, they have these auctions every several months, so if there's something you see worth bidding on, not a bad idea to check it out before the auction.

[D-Dey65]

The day after they used what? Most of their auction items are old vehicles and off-roadway maintenance equipment for grass and tree trimming.

I said the day after I used it, and that's the Turnpike I was referring to. The auction was on November 22nd, I was on the turnpike on November 21st. I was hoping that besides the old vehicles, and maintenance equipment and such, there could've been some hope for the leftover neon VMS.

[bluecountry]

You were asked to stop discussing your desired lane balances on the NJ Turnpike. Please heed moderator requests.

Why?  Nobody ever answered why the NJTP doesn't like doing 4 lanes in each direction.

To answer that very specific question: The NJ Turnpike does have 4 lanes in each direction in the outer (truck lanes) roadway between Interchange 11 & 14, except thru the Interchange 13 area where it remains 3 lanes.  A project listed in their Capital Plan will widen the Turnpike to 4 lanes in that area, to allow for a continuous 4 lane outer roadway from 11 - 14.

Also listed is a project to widen the Newark Bay-Hudson County Extension between Interchange 14 & 14A from 2 lanes per direction to 4 lanes per direction.

Yes but how come they do not have 4 lanes total in each direction on the mainline, it is just 2,3 or 3/3, 3/4?

[roadman65]

The NJ Turnpike has 12 lanes in each direction with dual carriage ways and 14 between Woodbridge and Elizabeth.  That to me is one better than 4-4. Plus you get three cars only lanes separate from the trucks ( 4 lanes being the outer roadway still bans trucks so cars can still pass slow moving trucks on that roadway) that other freeways do not adopt.

Having dual carriage way set up is even safer, not allowing too many lanes to choose between at once cutting out excessive weaving. Especially with young millennial drivers with insecurities who have to weave  around cars with loud sports cars with sporty features. Having the dual carriage ways limits their use of lanes to weave and show off themselves to feel powerful.

Why worry about a 4-4 set up.  To me I wonder why the Pearl Harbor Extension has different verbiage then the mainline does to keep trucks out of the left lane.  However I am not going to keep asking over and over again if I don't get the answer to it.

Life is full of things we see that are odd out there to want to question. This is the same like why does the left lane use yellow lane striping for its border only on the inside lanes of the dual Turnpike Carriageways and not on the left of the outside lanes.  It's just happening.

[Rothman]

I sometimes wonder if the cars only lanes clog up more often.

[famartin]

I sometimes wonder if the cars only lanes clog up more often.

Depends on time of day and year, but during rush hours in the peak direction, and busy holiday travel, I suspect this is indeed the case.

[vdeane]

Life is full of things we see that are odd out there to want to question. This is the same like why does the left lane use yellow lane striping for its border only on the inside lanes of the dual Turnpike Carriageways and not on the left of the outside lanes.  It's just happening.

But they do use yellow on the outside lanes? 

[famartin]

Why worry about a 4-4 set up.  To me I wonder why the Pearl Harbor Extension has different verbiage then the mainline does to keep trucks out of the left lane.  However I am not going to keep asking over and over again if I don't get the answer to it.

I don't recall any such signs on the Penn Extension... and a (rather quick) trip thru GSV didn't reveal anything. It occurs to me that such signs would be rather ineffective considering the express lanes are the two left ones at the plaza and also that if the truck lanes are closed, they all have to stay in the two left lanes anyway as they close in on the mainline.

[jeffandnicole]

Why worry about a 4-4 set up.  To me I wonder why the Pearl Harbor Extension has different verbiage then the mainline does to keep trucks out of the left lane.  However I am not going to keep asking over and over again if I don't get the answer to it.

I don't recall any such signs on the Penn Extension... and a (rather quick) trip thru GSV didn't reveal anything. It occurs to me that such signs would be rather ineffective considering the express lanes are the two left ones at the plaza and also that if the truck lanes are closed, they all have to stay in the two left lanes anyway as they close in on the mainline.

Going back further when there were no dual lanes thru Interchange 6, only 1 express lane, and before that, just an ordinary plaza for the Int. 6 toll plaza, there was at least 1 sign just east of where 295 crosses over the Extension.  The sign was posted for both directions and stated "CARS USE LEFT LANE FOR PASSING ONLY". https://goo.gl/maps/GTRGiGTnogqVuSpu7

In 2014, near the opening of the dual lanes, the sign was taped up for EB traffic: https://goo.gl/maps/SqUJ7CCiVMtTBqfb9 , but not for WB traffic.  About the time the dual-dual section opened on the mainline, the signs disappeared for both directions.

The Extension was kind of a forgotten stepchild to the Turnpike anyway.  Even though the mainline got heavily reinforced jersey barriers back in the 1980's to keep traffic from crossing the median into each other, the Extension didn't even have so much as a guardrail within the narrow grassy median until around 2013 or so, except where it needed to protect bridges and signs.  https://goo.gl/maps/fzARXmtrFuLiUqPM9 .  The NJTA gives it a bit more respect now.

I sometimes wonder if the cars only lanes clog up more often.

Depends on time of day and year, but during rush hours in the peak direction, and busy holiday travel, I suspect this is indeed the case.

I've learned to use those truck lanes during holidays and weekends when truck traffic is generally lighter, and motorists not as familiar with the Turnpike keep to the Car Only lanes, and drive a bit slower than the regular weekday traffic that zooms along the Turnpike.  But on weekdays, especially weekday mornings after rush hours, those truck lanes are packed with truckers.

Overall, does one side congest more than the other?  Not so much intentionally, but rather when there's a few left lane hogs that can quickly bottleneck traffic behind them.

[storm2k]

Why worry about a 4-4 set up.  To me I wonder why the Pearl Harbor Extension has different verbiage then the mainline does to keep trucks out of the left lane.  However I am not going to keep asking over and over again if I don't get the answer to it.

I don't recall any such signs on the Penn Extension... and a (rather quick) trip thru GSV didn't reveal anything. It occurs to me that such signs would be rather ineffective considering the express lanes are the two left ones at the plaza and also that if the truck lanes are closed, they all have to stay in the two left lanes anyway as they close in on the mainline.

Going back further when there were no dual lanes thru Interchange 6, only 1 express lane, and before that, just an ordinary plaza for the Int. 6 toll plaza, there was at least 1 sign just east of where 295 crosses over the Extension.  The sign was posted for both directions and stated "CARS USE LEFT LANE FOR PASSING ONLY". https://goo.gl/maps/GTRGiGTnogqVuSpu7

In 2014, near the opening of the dual lanes, the sign was taped up for EB traffic: https://goo.gl/maps/SqUJ7CCiVMtTBqfb9 , but not for WB traffic.  About the time the dual-dual section opened on the mainline, the signs disappeared for both directions.

The Extension was kind of a forgotten stepchild to the Turnpike anyway.  Even though the mainline got heavily reinforced jersey barriers back in the 1980's to keep traffic from crossing the median into each other, the Extension didn't even have so much as a guardrail within the narrow grassy median until around 2013 or so, except where it needed to protect bridges and signs.  https://goo.gl/maps/fzARXmtrFuLiUqPM9 .  The NJTA gives it a bit more respect now.

I sometimes wonder if the cars only lanes clog up more often.

Depends on time of day and year, but during rush hours in the peak direction, and busy holiday travel, I suspect this is indeed the case.

I've learned to use those truck lanes during holidays and weekends when truck traffic is generally lighter, and motorists not as familiar with the Turnpike keep to the Car Only lanes, and drive a bit slower than the regular weekday traffic that zooms along the Turnpike.  But on weekdays, especially weekday mornings after rush hours, those truck lanes are packed with truckers.

Overall, does one side congest more than the other?  Not so much intentionally, but rather when there's a few left lane hogs that can quickly bottleneck traffic behind them.

My general rule of thumb is that during daytime periods when there are a lot of trucks out, I'll stick to the inner roadway. Other times, I'll stick to the outer. You mix with the trucks, but they generally stay out of the left lane and even if they veer in there, they get back over very quickly, so the left lane stays open to pass slower cars, versus being in the inner roadway where some out of state driver who has no idea how it all works, drives in the left lane 5 mph below the speed limit and causes waves of slowness to build behind since no one can pass other slow drivers in the right or middle lanes.

[roadman65]

I was referring to No Trucks In Left Lane of This Roadway signs on the Extension verses No Trucks and Busses In Left Lane on the mainline to warn trucks to stay out of the left lanes as an example to Blue Country.  I don't know now what white signs are used now and the verbiage on them presently, but the point was you can't expect an answer to every question as Blue Country was demanding to know why the Turnpike has no eight lane segments.

[jeffandnicole]

I was referring to No Trucks In Left Lane of This Roadway signs on the Extension verses No Trucks and Busses In Left Lane on the mainline to warn trucks to stay out of the left lanes as an example to Blue Country.  I don't know now what white signs are used now and the verbiage on them presently, but the point was you can't expect an answer to every question as Blue Country was demanding to know why the Turnpike has no eight lane segments.

That sign you're referring to was and still is on the mainline in the dual-dual roadway.

Just North of Interchange 9:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/2VcPujgjRUx1LuL17

[fwydriver405]

There are more barriers now, so I think that they've really made it so you can't pay through the 16E lanes and then try to slide over towards 18E. Not that there were too many people doing that before, but it's definitely not really possible now. 18E is a greater toll than 16E even though the plaza is at the same point (given the further distance to the end of the official part of the Turnpike, even though they obviously own the 95 segment all the way to the GWB.

Here is an drive thru of the new ORT toll plaza I captured from the perspective of exiting onto 16 E from a recent trip I took (2021-12-29):
https://youtu.be/emuTt_83Y-Y

Why doesn't Route 3 appear on the first sign in the series? The MUTCD encourages consistent message through the series of advance signs for an exit.

Honestly, they could be fine with a "3 Secaucus Use Cash Lanes" aux sign to convey the message without much issue and just have that last sign ahead of the plaza area. That would get the job done.

It appears they may have updated the first signs to add NJ Route 3 to the 18 E sign between to what was posted in reply 4248 (10 Dec 2021):


...and my trip to Manhattan (basketball trip) on the 29th of December, 2021:




I could be wrong, but I think this sign I saw as well...


...may be misleading to a driver continuing north on I-95/NJTP, as the left 2 lanes actually lead to the ORT lanes, and the right lane has access to the cash lanes, Lincoln Tunnel XBL, NJ Route 3, and NJ Route 495 East as shown in these two photos:

[storm2k]

That's an improvement. I can tell you that they did build a new jersey barrier past the plaza so that 16E and 18E traffic through the plaza is now physically segregated, so you do have to pay the 18E toll to exit to Patterson Plank Rd now.

[roadman65]

So you have to pay extra to exit for Paterson Plank Road. The tolls for that ramp and Route 495 are now different rates?

I don't think the NJTA would stoop that low.  Yeah they do when you enter the Turnpike South from the Sports Complex, have you pay the 18W rate cause the ramp merges from before the plaza. Most people who arrived at the event at the Complex i am sure exited 16W at the lower rate that they are returning from, but thats really not as low as this.

[Alps]

That's an improvement. I can tell you that they did build a new jersey barrier past the plaza so that 16E and 18E traffic through the plaza is now physically segregated, so you do have to pay the 18E toll to exit to Patterson Plank Rd now.

Current Google Maps aerials show the barrier configuration with all exits through the 16E side and only mainline as 18E. This would be a toll increase for PPR.

[storm2k]

That's an improvement. I can tell you that they did build a new jersey barrier past the plaza so that 16E and 18E traffic through the plaza is now physically segregated, so you do have to pay the 18E toll to exit to Patterson Plank Rd now.

Current Google Maps aerials show the barrier configuration with all exits through the 16E side and only mainline as 18E. This would be a toll increase for PPR.

Looks like there's a fresh GSV capture as of December 2021. You can see that they've erected a jersey barrier past the toll plaza so that you have to have gone through the 18E cash lanes to get to PPR/Rt 3. So, yes, this is a toll increase for that exit.

[kernals12]

The NJTA is looking at demolishing the former Marist High School for the expansion of the Newark Bay Bridge

[SignBridge]

I'm a little surprised the NJTA is pulling a scam like that on drivers heading for Route 3. For many years the Route 3 exit was part of Exit 16E.

The old signs back in the day said: Exit 16, Lincoln Tunnel, NJ 3, Secaucus.

And way before 1964, Route 3, Secaucus was Exit 17 in both directions.

[NoGoodNamesAvailable]

This is all disappointing but not surprising. Gives me even more reason to shunpike when I'm in NJ...

[jeffandnicole]

This is all disappointing but not surprising. Gives me even more reason to shunpike when I'm in NJ...

Because of an exit you weren't going to use anyway?  If you were already shunpiking, would leaving access to this ramp from 16E encouraged you to pay tolls to unrelated destinations?