New Jersey Turnpike

[jeffandnicole]

Two of the new hybrid lane control signs , this one on the ramps from Int 7A to the southbound NJTPK. Looks to be a 4 panel drum with a 2 line VMS board. I'm addition to the 2 panels shown, I'd guess the other two panels are "Cars Only" (for the left ramp; "All Traffic" on the right ramp), and a blank green panel, which I saw on another, uninstalled sign.

[Pete from Boston]

Two of the new hybrid lane control signs , this one on the ramps from Int 7A to the southbound NJTPK. Looks to be a 4 panel drum with a 2 line VMS board. I'm addition to the 2 panels shown, I'd guess the other two panels are "Cars Only" (for the left ramp; "All Traffic" on the right ramp), and a blank green panel, which I saw on another, uninstalled sign.

I'm amazed that they still put up these analog-panel signs.  Is this some kind of insurance against power loss?

[jeffandnicole]

Well, in most cases, the worst that'll happen is a truck winds up in the cars only lanes.  And when any ramp is closed for any reason, that's going to happen.  I guess the absolute worst is a vehicle gets on a closed road, but there'll be stuff further down the road to block them.

If they have to, they can just use barrels to shut down a ramp that's closed as well.

[Zeffy]

Two of the new hybrid lane control signs , this one on the ramps from Int 7A to the southbound NJTPK. Looks to be a 4 panel drum with a 2 line VMS board. I'm addition to the 2 panels shown, I'd guess the other two panels are "Cars Only" (for the left ramp; "All Traffic" on the right ramp), and a blank green panel, which I saw on another, uninstalled sign.

That gantry looks extremely old.

[motorway]

Well well look at NJTA kicking it old school...I approve! Now they just need to curtail their newfound MUTCD enthusiasm and we'll be all set.

[Pete from Boston]

Two of the new hybrid lane control signs , this one on the ramps from Int 7A to the southbound NJTPK. Looks to be a 4 panel drum with a 2 line VMS board. I'm addition to the 2 panels shown, I'd guess the other two panels are "Cars Only" (for the left ramp; "All Traffic" on the right ramp), and a blank green panel, which I saw on another, uninstalled sign.

That gantry looks extremely old.

Ones like it have sprung up all over the Parkway (and presumably the Turnpike) the past couple of years.

[1995hoo]

Well, in most cases, the worst that'll happen is a truck winds up in the cars only lanes.  And when any ramp is closed for any reason, that's going to happen. I guess the absolute worst is a vehicle gets on a closed road, but there'll be stuff further down the road to block them.

If they have to, they can just use barrels to shut down a ramp that's closed as well.

In my observation they usually block off the closed roadway (whether at the split or on a ramp) whenever possible to deter the situation where people decide to ignore the sign. I wouldn't admit to it if I'd ever ignored the sign in my younger and dumber days. (It may have been a heck of a lot of fun if I did, though, given the lack of other vehicles and the resulting insanely high speeds that would have occurred.)

[jeffandnicole]

Speaking of MUTCD crap on the Turnpike. Here are the underwhelming arrows on the Exit 6 BGSs... (Apologies for the dirty windshield & sunglare)

[Zeffy]

I used to think I wanted the NJTP to adopt MUTCD-style signage. Keyword: used to. They should go back to how they signed it originally - the New Jersey Turnpike is a symbol of New Jersey, and the NJTA should pride itself from being 'different from the rest' - After all, you have to grow up in Jersey to love Jersey (or hate it). 

I can't wait for the Exit 6 sign to have an I-95 south shield on there - that'll confuse the hell out of drivers for the first few months.

[NE2]

They should go back to how they signed it originally

Round exit tabs popping out of the middle?

[SignBridge]

Odd, they're still not putting the exit number on a separate tab. And yeah, those down arrows look a little small. I guess NJTA is still getting the hang of this MUTCD stuff, but you'd think the sign manufacturers would know how to do it from experience elsewhere. Those right-pointing up arrows don't look like MUTCD spec to me though. What's with that?

[hotdogPi]

I would rather have them stay the way they are, instead of changing to the MUTCD.

[Alps]

Odd, they're still not putting the exit number on a separate tab. And yeah, those down arrows look a little small. I guess NJTA is still getting the hang of this MUTCD stuff, but you'd think the sign manufacturers would know how to do it from experience elsewhere. Those right-pointing up arrows don't look like MUTCD spec to me though. What's with that?

The signs on this particular contract were still designed to the old standard. Believe it or not, those arrows were there before the MUTCD compliance kicked in.

[Zeffy]

Odd, they're still not putting the exit number on a separate tab. And yeah, those down arrows look a little small. I guess NJTA is still getting the hang of this MUTCD stuff, but you'd think the sign manufacturers would know how to do it from experience elsewhere. Those right-pointing up arrows don't look like MUTCD spec to me though. What's with that?

http://www.alpsroads.net/roads/nj/i-95/2.html

The down arrows seem to only be used on the 'THRU TRAFFIC' signs that accompany all exit direction signs.

[SignBridge]

I stand corrected. They've been using standard down arrows for a while at some other exits. (like 16E northbound)  And now I'm not sure about those up arrows either. They might be standard spec, and just look different due to camera angle or whatever.

[PHLBOS]

Odd, they're still not putting the exit number on a separate tab. And yeah, those down arrows look a little small. I guess NJTA is still getting the hang of this MUTCD stuff, but you'd think the sign manufacturers would know how to do it from experience elsewhere. Those right-pointing up arrows don't look like MUTCD spec to me though. What's with that?

The signs on this particular contract were still designed to the old standard. Believe it or not, those arrows were there before the MUTCD compliance kicked in.

While I don't doubt that; but it certainly looks like that NJTP was indeed throwing a bone towards MUTCD w/that pull-through BGS.

[roadman65]

I am sad that NJT has gotten rid of some of its unique signing practices, but on the other hand it is interesting to see control cities for a change.  I know many would prefer Baltimore over Wilmington, though, but I see nothing wrong with Wilmington being used.  Too bad NJT won't sign the Penn Turnpike for Harrisburg, even if it gets changed for Philadelphia once I-95 gets routed across the Delaware River Turnpike Bridge and PA gets going with getting the long awaited I-95/ I-276 interchange completed.

[jeffandnicole]

Well, in most cases, the worst that'll happen is a truck winds up in the cars only lanes.  And when any ramp is closed for any reason, that's going to happen. I guess the absolute worst is a vehicle gets on a closed road, but there'll be stuff further down the road to block them.

If they have to, they can just use barrels to shut down a ramp that's closed as well.

In my observation they usually block off the closed roadway (whether at the split or on a ramp) whenever possible to deter the situation where people decide to ignore the sign. I wouldn't admit to it if I'd ever ignored the sign in my younger and dumber days. (It may have been a heck of a lot of fun if I did, though, given the lack of other vehicles and the resulting insanely high speeds that would have occurred.)

They do have gates that block off the lane as well when the ramp is closed (similiar to the HOV road gates in VA on 95 below DC), but since the comment was regarding power loss, I figured those gates wouldn't be of use during a power failure.

I can't wait for the Exit 6 sign to have an I-95 south shield on there - that'll confuse the hell out of drivers for the first few months.

I'd go further out and say a year or two.  I would imagine a lot of people use the Turnpike once a year - around Thanksgiving or Christmas - and will get a bit confused at that time. 

Odd, they're still not putting the exit number on a separate tab. And yeah, those down arrows look a little small. I guess NJTA is still getting the hang of this MUTCD stuff, but you'd think the sign manufacturers would know how to do it from experience elsewhere. Those right-pointing up arrows don't look like MUTCD spec to me though. What's with that?

It's a bit tough to tell, but I think the arrows are made to spec...they're just undersized from what we're used to seeing on a highway. 

Usually the sign manufacturers just do what they're told to do, so if the NJTA plans had small arrows, the sign manufacturers make the signs with small arrows.

[Steve D]

Two of the new hybrid lane control signs , this one on the ramps from Int 7A to the southbound NJTPK. Looks to be a 4 panel drum with a 2 line VMS board. I'm addition to the 2 panels shown, I'd guess the other two panels are "Cars Only" (for the left ramp; "All Traffic" on the right ramp), and a blank green panel, which I saw on another, uninstalled sign.

I'm trying to figure out what messages will be in the VMS space, other than an arrow.  The NJTA likes to keep signs and messages to the bare-bone, so I'm not sure what's not already covered by the rotating drums: "All Traffic/No Traffic/Roadway Congested/Cars Only/Cars-Trucks-Buses" etc..

[Flyer78]

I think it is interesting it is "ALL EXITS" and not "ALL TRAFFIC" -- the VMS may indicate which vehicle classes are permitted.

ALL EXITS
=======
CARS ONLY

[1995hoo]

I think it is interesting it is "ALL EXITS" and not "ALL TRAFFIC" -- the VMS may indicate which vehicle classes are permitted.

ALL EXITS
=======
CARS ONLY

I am 100% certain that I remember, when I was a little kid in the 1970s and the split was located near Exit 9, the large overhead sign at the actual split reading "ALL TRAFFIC FOR ALL EXITS" when one roadway was closed. I don't have any pictures of it and I can't find any online, nor does the paperback book I have with historical Turnpike photos contain a picture of that usage. Nobody else on this forum remembered that either the last time I mentioned it. So maybe the cobwebs of another 30 years have distorted my memory, but I also remember either my brother or I making a paper sign with that wording and taping it over a Lego "sign gantry" once.

[jeffandnicole]

I could understand why, if the sign did say that.  The Turnpike is extremely unique in that there are two carriageways that serve every interchange and every Service Plaza.  Even more so, the exits are always on the right.  It's an expensive design, but something the Turnpike determines is money well spent.

(OK, there's one exception to this: The northbound split for the western & eastern spurs)

Usually when there's two roadways, one is a express, bypassing some exits.  Or the inner roadway will have left ramps.

[Steve D]

I think it is interesting it is "ALL EXITS" and not "ALL TRAFFIC" -- the VMS may indicate which vehicle classes are permitted.

ALL EXITS
=======
CARS ONLY

I am 100% certain that I remember, when I was a little kid in the 1970s and the split was located near Exit 9, the large overhead sign at the actual split reading "ALL TRAFFIC FOR ALL EXITS" when one roadway was closed. I don't have any pictures of it and I can't find any online, nor does the paperback book I have with historical Turnpike photos contain a picture of that usage. Nobody else on this forum remembered that either the last time I mentioned it. So maybe the cobwebs of another 30 years have distorted my memory, but I also remember either my brother or I making a paper sign with that wording and taping it over a Lego "sign gantry" once.

I definitely remember that "ALL TRAFFIC FOR ALL EXITS" too (going northbound at exit 9) from when I lived in NJ.  On the southbound side it is/was slightly different - as exits 14 to 14C (prior to 1995 I believe) were only accessed through the truck/bus lanes, the "All traffic for all exits" was used when the cars only lanes were closed, but when the reverse happened (truck/bus lanes were closed) the sign said "NJ Turnpike South" for the cars only lanes and "To Exits 14 to 14C only" for the trucks/bus lanes.  Since 1995 I believe this only happens on the eastern spur, as the western spur had a new access ramp for 14 to 14C built in the 1995 widening.

[akotchi]

To a few of the different posters immediately above:

The southbound arrows at Exit 6 are to spec.  While the signing was designed prior to the Authority's adoption of the MUTCD, the pull-through sign style recognizes the major split and (future) routing of I-95 off of the mainline.

The southbound sequence used (down arrows followed by right up arrows) was adapted from what is at Exit 11 southbound, just adding more information to the panels.  I think the Exit 11 arrows are larger ones than the Exit 6 ones.

Harrisburg was considered for a destination at Exit 6, replacing Penn Turnpike (and adding the keystone logo in the route marker line).  It was nixed during design, though.  You won't see Harrisburg until crossing the river into Pennsylvania.  Philadelphia is hidden under the overlay in the blank bottom line.

Regarding the new hybrid signs on the ramps, my understanding is that because the dual-dual section will extend from 6 to 14 when all is said and done, it may not be practical to close an entire barrel (55 miles or so) in the case of work or emergency.  One sign would say All Exits, as it is likely that one of the two roadways would be open all the way through, while the other would indicate in the VMS portion what exit the other roadway closes.  I am not up on all the specifics, but there are a number of different conditions that can be covered by the new panels.

Finally . . . both spurs southbound have access to a dedicated roadway over the rail yards to Exits 14-14C, so neither the car lanes nor the truck lanes have the exit any longer.  The south side of the "mixing bowl" has six different roadways (northbound has a separate roadway for Exit 14 entering traffic).

Thanks for giving me a lot to talk about in this post!

[Don'tKnowYet]

Regarding the new hybrid signs on the ramps, my understanding is that because the dual-dual section will extend from 6 to 14 when all is said and done, it may not be practical to close an entire barrel (55 miles or so) in the case of work or emergency.  One sign would say All Exits, as it is likely that one of the two roadways would be open all the way through, while the other would indicate in the VMS portion what exit the other roadway closes.  I am not up on all the specifics, but there are a number of different conditions that can be covered by the new panels.

This is exactly what the reasoning has to be.  It also takes the NJSP more than an hour to physically run (back and forth) the length of a barrel closing say in planned construction to give the "all clear" so that workers can proliferate the roadway.  For a 6 to 14 barrel, this could take upwards of 3 hours essentially ruining the purpose of an 8 hour construction window.  So the Turnpike must be ready to do partial closings up to EXIT X on the opposite VMS and then the confimatory message for positive guidance on the sign shown is ALL EXITS.