What state posts the worst control cities? The best?

[Roadgeekteen]

Who thought of Milford on I-84 in PA?

This one is worse than Waco in Texas. Milford is a small borough and no major crossroads there. Port Jervis in NY or Newburgh should be used.  It do t even have regional significance either.

PA loves in state cities and hates out of state cities.

[wanderer2575]

* Use Gary, IN instead of Indiana if wanting a closer destination, otherwise use South Bend or Toledo for I-80 and I-90.

Here's the problem with EB I-80/94 and I-90 in the Chicago area. The routes intersect and cross each other at Lake Station, so some of the EB traffic is going to follow 94 toward Detroit and the rest will follow 80/90 toward South Bend. Using either one as a control city disregards the traffic that will be heading toward the other. And that's not even taking into consideration traffic that's going to head south on 65.

Using a local destination like Gary doesn't work because there is no one predominant local destination.

Indiana really is about the best descriptor here.

Quite a few potential control cities would make some sense along at least part of 80/94 (such as Indianapolis, Detroit, South Bend, Toledo, or even Grand Rapids), but none fit perfectly.

I can't remember off the top of my head but isn't Holland used before Grand Rapids when you're going northbound on I-196? I'm thinking it should mention both cities.

Both Holland and Grand Rapids are on the BGS at the exit from eastbound I-94.  From there, only Holland is on the signage at I-196 interchanges until past the US-31 split.

[hbelkins]

Who thought of Milford on I-84 in PA?

This one is worse than Waco in Texas. Milford is a small borough and no major crossroads there. Port Jervis in NY or Newburgh should be used.  It do t even have regional significance either.

Port Jervis is no more significant than Milford. You can't tell where Milford stops and Port Jervis begins, except there's a river to cross.

If anything, Middletown should be posted, as it's where I-84 crosses the STE/NY 17/I-86, since you reach it before the Thruway/I-87.

[bing101]

I think all states have at least 1 or 2 control city decisions that I disagree with. But in general I agree with Georgia's and South Carolina's control cities and I sometimes agree, sometimes disagree with North Carolina's control cities.

And it's not like California "never" uses out-of-state cities. Most people that say that, are only thinking of I-10 east from LA. I-10 east does use Phoenix, although beginning from Indio.

D3 Caltrans in Sacramento  has out of state control cities I-80 East for Reno as a control city once it enters Sacramento and US-50 east for South Lake Tahoe. (Note South Lake Tahoe is in California) The Nevada portion of South Lake Tahoe is Stateline.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stateline,_Nevada


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Lake_Tahoe,_California

[Roadgeekteen]

Who thought of Milford on I-84 in PA?

This one is worse than Waco in Texas. Milford is a small borough and no major crossroads there. Port Jervis in NY or Newburgh should be used.  It do t even have regional significance either.

Port Jervis is no more significant than Milford. You can't tell where Milford stops and Port Jervis begins, except there's a river to cross.

If anything, Middletown should be posted, as it's where I-84 crosses the STE/NY 17/I-86, since you reach it before the Thruway/I-87.

I normally don't like using states but "New England" might actually be appropriate.

[SkyPesos]

Who thought of Milford on I-84 in PA?

This one is worse than Waco in Texas. Milford is a small borough and no major crossroads there. Port Jervis in NY or Newburgh should be used.  It do t even have regional significance either.

Port Jervis is no more significant than Milford. You can't tell where Milford stops and Port Jervis begins, except there's a river to cross.

If anything, Middletown should be posted, as it's where I-84 crosses the STE/NY 17/I-86, since you reach it before the Thruway/I-87.

I normally don't like using states but "New England" might actually be appropriate.

How about "Other Northeastern Cities" ? 

[TXtoNJ]

I-35 between San Antonio and Dallas-Fort Worth should only use these cities:

San Antonio, Austin, Dallas, Fort Worth.

Not Waco.

I think the reasoning behind Waco is that it is very close to where IH 35 splits into IH 35E and IH 35W..  And Denton is where they rejoin.  That's the reason for those if I had to guess.  Plus Waco is also where IH 35 meets SH 6, an incredibly important corridor.   

Yep, this exactly.

I-35 is densely populated enough that there should be at least two control cities between Austin and Hillsboro:

NB between Austin and Waco: (Waco, Dallas/Fort Worth)
NB North of Waco: (Dallas, Fort Worth)

SB between Dallas/Fort Worth and Waco: (Waco, Austin)
SB between Waco and Austin: (Austin, San Antonio)

[jmacswimmer]

Who thought of Milford on I-84 in PA?

This one is worse than Waco in Texas. Milford is a small borough and no major crossroads there. Port Jervis in NY or Newburgh should be used.  It do t even have regional significance either.

Port Jervis is no more significant than Milford. You can't tell where Milford stops and Port Jervis begins, except there's a river to cross.

If anything, Middletown should be posted, as it's where I-84 crosses the STE/NY 17/I-86, since you reach it before the Thruway/I-87.

I normally don't like using states but "New England" might actually be appropriate.

There actually are a few one-off instances where I-84/New England appears on supplemental signs:

-On I-81 just before the I-78 split
-On I-80 EB at the I-81 interchange
-On I-84/I-380 just before they split
-On I-287 approaching the NJ/NY line, followed downstream by I-87 approaching exit 16

[Roadgeekteen]

Who thought of Milford on I-84 in PA?

This one is worse than Waco in Texas. Milford is a small borough and no major crossroads there. Port Jervis in NY or Newburgh should be used.  It do t even have regional significance either.

Port Jervis is no more significant than Milford. You can't tell where Milford stops and Port Jervis begins, except there's a river to cross.

If anything, Middletown should be posted, as it's where I-84 crosses the STE/NY 17/I-86, since you reach it before the Thruway/I-87.

I normally don't like using states but "New England" might actually be appropriate.

How about "Other Northeastern Cities" ? 

. My logic is that I-84 is heavily used by long-distance trucks and other traffic headed to New England. Sign "Boston" or "Hartford" if you need a city.

[andrepoiy]

Ontario's control cities I find are okay. It's just that control cities are not posted in urban sections of Toronto, which perhaps isn't really useful anyway since most trips are local trips.

[sprjus4]

I-35 between San Antonio and Dallas-Fort Worth should only use these cities:

San Antonio, Austin, Dallas, Fort Worth.

Not Waco.

I think the reasoning behind Waco is that it is very close to where IH 35 splits into IH 35E and IH 35W..  And Denton is where they rejoin.  That's the reason for those if I had to guess.  Plus Waco is also where IH 35 meets SH 6, an incredibly important corridor.

Not saying any of them aren't important, but Dallas-Fort Worth is easily the most important control city.

[hobsini2]

Rolla is way too small for a major cross-country Interstate, especially with Springfield and Tulsa not far away.

I would argue that if you want one that is in state and will not confuse people, why not just use Joplin on 44?  I believe ODT uses Joplin going east of Tulsa.

[Roadgeekteen]

Rolla is way too small for a major cross-country Interstate, especially with Springfield and Tulsa not far away.

I would argue that if you want one that is in state and will not confuse people, why not just use Joplin on 44?  I believe ODT uses Joplin going east of Tulsa.

Joplin should only be used after Springfield. I don't like skipping over bigger cities for smaller cities on control city signs.

[hobsini2]

Rolla is way too small for a major cross-country Interstate, especially with Springfield and Tulsa not far away.

I would argue that if you want one that is in state and will not confuse people, why not just use Joplin on 44?  I believe ODT uses Joplin going east of Tulsa.

Joplin should only be used after Springfield. I don't like skipping over bigger cities for smaller cities on control city signs.

Then just use Tulsa if not Joplin. Springfield, as many have pointed out, is problematic. Joplin is not.

[Flint1979]

* Use Gary, IN instead of Indiana if wanting a closer destination, otherwise use South Bend or Toledo for I-80 and I-90.

Here's the problem with EB I-80/94 and I-90 in the Chicago area. The routes intersect and cross each other at Lake Station, so some of the EB traffic is going to follow 94 toward Detroit and the rest will follow 80/90 toward South Bend. Using either one as a control city disregards the traffic that will be heading toward the other. And that's not even taking into consideration traffic that's going to head south on 65.

Using a local destination like Gary doesn't work because there is no one predominant local destination.

Indiana really is about the best descriptor here.

Quite a few potential control cities would make some sense along at least part of 80/94 (such as Indianapolis, Detroit, South Bend, Toledo, or even Grand Rapids), but none fit perfectly.

I can't remember off the top of my head but isn't Holland used before Grand Rapids when you're going northbound on I-196? I'm thinking it should mention both cities.

Both Holland and Grand Rapids are on the BGS at the exit from eastbound I-94.  From there, only Holland is on the signage at I-196 interchanges until past the US-31 split.

On I-75 at the US-127 northern terminus coming SB I-75's control cities are Saginaw and Detroit, after that it's Saginaw until you get to the northern terminus of I-675 where it becomes Flint, then Detroit isn't used again until I-475's northern terminus.

Bay City appears on one at the Zilwaukee exit on I-75 which at that point the control city is Mackinac Bridge.

[Roadgeekteen]

Rolla is way too small for a major cross-country Interstate, especially with Springfield and Tulsa not far away.

I would argue that if you want one that is in state and will not confuse people, why not just use Joplin on 44?  I believe ODT uses Joplin going east of Tulsa.

Joplin should only be used after Springfield. I don't like skipping over bigger cities for smaller cities on control city signs.

Then just use Tulsa if not Joplin. Springfield, as many have pointed out, is problematic. Joplin is not.

Yes, I agree with the use of Tulsa.

[MattHanson939]

PA loves in state cities and hates out of state cities.

New Mexico is the same way.  The worst examples are I-25 going north from Santa Fe, I-10 west out of Las Cruces, and I-40 east out of Albuquerque.  From Santa Fe, the control city on I-25 north is Las Vegas; and in my thinking that probably confuses out-of-state motorists because they're much more familiar with Las Vegas, Nevada.  Then from there, Raton is the control city.  On I-40 east, Santa Rosa is the control city from Albuquerque, then changes to Tucumcari.  Both are too small to use as control points despite there being junctions with US highways.  And on I-10, Deming is the westbound control city from Las Cruces, then Lordsburg becomes the control city.  Before the I-25/I-40 interchange in Albuquerque was rebuilt in the early 2000s, Belen was the control city on I-25 south, and Grants was the westbound control city on I-40.  Another really bad example in New Mexico is US 285 signing Vaughn going south from Clines Corners where it intersects I-40.  I get that three US highways meet in Vaughn (54, 60, and 285); but Roswell would be a lot more logical choice because it is WAY bigger considering it's the fifth largest city in the state.  And Vaughn is almost a ghost town.

Santa Fe and Las Cruces are OK control points on I-25 from Albuquerque, since they are important cities in the state.  However, I would sign Denver as the primary control city going north, and use Santa Fe as a secondary (e.g. signing Santa Fe / Denver on the overheads within Albuquerque or signing Santa Fe at onramps for NB 25 north of Albuquerque but south of Santa Fe).  From Santa Fe to the Colorado border, only sign Denver.  And going south from Albuquerque on I-25, I would sign El Paso as the primary control city and Las Cruces as a secondary.  I-40 east, just sign Amarillo.  I-40 west should be Flagstaff, but Gallup can be signed as a secondary.  I-10 west from Las Cruces should only be signed for Tucson.  I-25 south from the Colorado border, sign Albuquerque as the primary control city and Santa Fe as a secondary.  And last but not least, I-10 east from the AZ state line should only sign Las Cruces and El Paso (former being a secondary, the latter being the primary).

[hbelkins]

The following states post the worst control cities:

Illinois
Indiana
Ohio
Kentucky
Tennessee
Possibly Missouri

Why?

Because they all use, at some point, Louisville as a control city.

[hotdogPi]

How does this thread not have the five-letter L word in it yet?

[ilpt4u]

The following states post the worst control cities:

Illinois
Indiana
Ohio
Kentucky
Tennessee
Possibly Missouri

Why?

Because they all use, at some point, Louisville as a control city.

Louisville is posted in Missouri, along with Chicago and Indianapolis, on I-55/I-64/US 40 on Missouri side of the Poplar Street Bridge heading into Illinois

That said, Illinois does worse than Louisville. Using Cairo as a Control in Southern IL for I-57 is almost ridiculous. Same with using East St Louis. I-57 itself is also not a good Control for I-24. Tulsa on I-255 is also a bit silly. And those are just Southern Illinois examples

The (directional) suburbs Controls in Chicagoland on I-355, I-290, and I-88 are also silly

[webny99]

I have no issues with any of NYSDOT's control cities.. NYSTA on the other hand..

[ethanhopkin14]

PA loves in state cities and hates out of state cities.

New Mexico is the same way.  The worst examples are I-25 going north from Santa Fe, I-10 west out of Las Cruces, and I-40 east out of Albuquerque.  From Santa Fe, the control city on I-25 north is Las Vegas; and in my thinking that probably confuses out-of-state motorists because they're much more familiar with Las Vegas, Nevada.  Then from there, Raton is the control city.  On I-40 east, Santa Rosa is the control city from Albuquerque, then changes to Tucumcari.  Both are too small to use as control points despite there being junctions with US highways.  And on I-10, Deming is the westbound control city from Las Cruces, then Lordsburg becomes the control city.  Before the I-25/I-40 interchange in Albuquerque was rebuilt in the early 2000s, Belen was the control city on I-25 south, and Grants was the westbound control city on I-40.  Another really bad example in New Mexico is US 285 signing Vaughn going south from Clines Corners where it intersects I-40.  I get that three US highways meet in Vaughn (54, 60, and 285); but Roswell would be a lot more logical choice because it is WAY bigger considering it's the fifth largest city in the state.  And Vaughn is almost a ghost town.

Santa Fe and Las Cruces are OK control points on I-25 from Albuquerque, since they are important cities in the state.  However, I would sign Denver as the primary control city going north, and use Santa Fe as a secondary (e.g. signing Santa Fe / Denver on the overheads within Albuquerque or signing Santa Fe at onramps for NB 25 north of Albuquerque but south of Santa Fe).  From Santa Fe to the Colorado border, only sign Denver.  And going south from Albuquerque on I-25, I would sign El Paso as the primary control city and Las Cruces as a secondary.  I-40 east, just sign Amarillo.  I-40 west should be Flagstaff, but Gallup can be signed as a secondary.  I-10 west from Las Cruces should only be signed for Tucson.  I-25 south from the Colorado border, sign Albuquerque as the primary control city and Santa Fe as a secondary.  And last but not least, I-10 east from the AZ state line should only sign Las Cruces and El Paso (former being a secondary, the latter being the primary).

At least I-25 get an El Paso or two once you get to Las Cruces. 

Also, that one oddball "ARIZONA" for westbound I-10 at the US-70 intersection in west Las Cruces. 

[jaehak]

Best: Arizona, Utah, Tennessee, Indiana, New York

Worst: Colorado, Pennsylvania, New Mexico, North Carolina, Missouri

Today at least. Tomorrow it could be something else.

[JayhawkCO]

Worst: Colorado, Pennsylvania, New Mexico, North Carolina, Missouri

Other than Limon, which has been discussed here ad nauseum, is there anything that egregious? South of Pueblo could be Albuquerque or Santa Fe I suppose, but everything else makes sense. One or two weird ones don't get lumped in with the Hazeltons, Bensons, and Lordsburgs of the world.

[Roadgeekteen]

What's the problem with Missouri?