Worst Highway Ideas

[Bryant5493]

Insurance/Fire Commissioner John Oxendine's Highway Idea

I don't think it's bad idea, but it'll be too costly and it's already been tried before -- and it died a horrible death.


Be well,

Bryant

[mgk920]

-Not building I-35 to directly feed into the four-lane MN 61 at the NE end of Duluth, MN

-WisDOT's redo of the US 12/US 53/WI 93 (Clairemont Ave/Hastings Way/London Rd) area in Eau Claire, WI.  When the US 53 bypass freeway was built to the north of US 12 a few years ago, Hastings Way to the north (old US 53) should have been rerouted to feed directly into London Rd (WI 93) to the south, with the former WI 93/US 53 trumpet interchange by the dead London Square Mall abandoned completely and the new US 53/US 12 (Clairemont Ave) interchange being a simple diamond or SPUI.  It would have been MUCH cheaper, simpler, more logical and better laid out than the mess of roadways that was ultimately built.

-WisDOT's recently built 'Bypasses-Lite' (ie, US 151 around Fond du Lac, US 12 around Whitewater, etc).  Even though they are on fully upgradable rights of way, WisDOT cut too many corners in their initial construction designs simply to save money and they have been traffic disasters from the days that they opened.

-WI 26 between US 41 and US 151 - it should have been four lanes decades ago and still no bypass of Rosendale.

-WI 13 (Veterans Parkway) in Marshfield.  It should have been a full bypass freeway, but rich NIMBYs (Marshfield sports a large and renowned medical center complex) on the city's outskirts put a kibosh on it.  The boulevard street on a new through-town ROW was built instead.

-US 41 (Richfield Interchange to Fond du Lac).  It should have been built parallel/adjacent to the former CNW railroad from the end of the modern-day US 45 West Bend Spur freeway to FdL's southside, where it would pick up its modern-day routing, with close-in bypasses of Kewaskum, Campbellsport and Eden.  The current split US 41 and US 45 routings and freeways between those points are wastefully duplicative.  The original two-lane US 41 on its modern-day ROW was laid out in the late 1940s.

-Not building the Stadium and Park-West freeways in Milwaukee.

-US 151's entrances into the Madison metro area (BOTH of 'em!).

Mike

[nerdly_dood]

They say that weaving is a sign of bad traffic planning... and it's pretty much an integral part of cloverleaf interchanges. So why exactly does Roanoke (Va) have 4 cloverleaf interchanges along Interstate 581/us-220? Oh but of course it's just the fact that this is Virginia... (VDOT has a bad reputation, and it's running out of money very very fast)

Another thing is the turn radius on some of the ramps. On one ramp in particular, I estimate the turn radius to be about 60 feet (hence the 15mph exit speed) - specifically it's the turn from US220-northbound to Wonju Avenue westbound. On google maps

Yet another thing is the Elm Avenue intersection in downtown, where the I-581 designation ends. This is the most crowded intersection in the city, and it's a pain to navigate - yet with as much traffic as it has to deal with, it's a plain, boring traditional diamond intersection! I think it would be much better with either a SPUI or one of those roundabouts above the highway.
On Google Maps

It's quite a pain to go from I-581SB to Orange Ave westbound, then turn left onto Gainsboro Rd. On Google Maps

And last but not least, is the unfinished trumpet next to Valley View Mall. The loop ramp that would have gone from I-581 southbound around to Valley View Blvd towards the mall was partially graded, but never completed. Even the bridge has "RAMP CLOSED" signs on that side, and it's had freeway dividers to keep traffic moving properly. I'll just let Google Maps show what it looks like.

[Brandon]

Worst highway ideas?

Here are a few for Chicagoland off the top of my head.

*The rebuild of the I-80 and I-55 interchange.  A lot of trucks use this one to go around or into Chicago, yet IDiOT rebuilt it as a slightly larger cloverleaf. 
*The lack of any interchange between the Tri-State Twy and I-57.
*The lack of any freeway or tollway in Lak County beyond the Tri-State Twy.  Come on folks, build IL-53 already.  We got I-355 done at our end.
*IDiOT's willingness to wait to add lanes or capacity until at least 20-30 years after it is needed, and they've been told about the need.
*The rebuild of IL-59.  IDiOT decided to widen the road with a median.  However, there are traffic signals every 1/2 to 1/4 mile now.  Wouldn't compact interchnages have worked better?

I'm sure there's more.

[Revive 755]

Insurance/Fire Commissioner John Oxendine's Highway Idea

I don't think it's bad idea, but it'll be too costly and it's already been tried before -- and it died a horrible death.

Could use someone like him to come to St. Louis and work for reviving a south extension of I-170.

As for other bad ideas around Atlanta, how about the stoplight on GA 10/Freedom Parkway at Boulevard Drive in Atlanta?  Looks like there was enough space for an interchange, and why have overpasses on either side of it?

I'm also looking at the side by side section of GA 13 and I-85, and it seems a possible combination of a dual divided freeway with a Texas double deck design around the elevated section of I-85 would work better.  At the least better connections between GA 13, I-85, and GA 400 could have been provided.

[Bryant5493]

As for other bad ideas around Atlanta, how about the stoplight on GA 10/Freedom Parkway at Boulevard Drive in Atlanta?  Looks like there was enough space for an interchange, and why have overpasses on either side of it?

I'm also looking at the side by side section of GA 13 and I-85, and it seems a possible combination of a dual divided freeway with a Texas double deck design around the elevated section of I-85 would work better.  At the least better connections between GA 13, I-85, and GA 400 could have been provided.

It's a horribly timed light at that. It doesn't stay green long enough on the Freedom Parkway segment. Also, of course, there's a red light camera at this intersection. An interchange would be nice as Freedom Parkway's limited access from the Carter Center to where it becomes Andrew Young International Blvd., at about Piedmont Ave.

Also, GDOT had an open house about directly connecting I-85 South with S.R. 400 North and S.R. 400 South to I-85 North. I didn't get a chance to go, however.


Be well,

Bryant

[Ian]

The fact that I-476 narrows from 3 to 2 lanes south of exit 9 (PA 3) is the worst thing ever. Gridlock anyone??

[akotchi]

The fact that I-476 narrows from 3 to 2 lanes south of exit 9 (PA 3) is the worst thing ever. Gridlock anyone??

Let's add to that the fact that I-95 narrows to two through lanes in both directions at the southern terminus of I-476.  This section was congested even before the Blue Route opened.

[Marc]

Though it cost a lot of money, I don't really think the Katy Freeway plan that was chosen was the best one. There is one place where it goes from five lanes, down to four, and back to five again. Creates a traffic nightmare in the evenings.

[agentsteel53]

ever since I've started driving a stick-shift car I've noticed just how many completely frivolous stop signs there are in the US.  The European method of putting yield signs everywhere is much, much better.

in general, multiple consecutive four-way stop signs on the through route ... very bad idea!  Traffic calming should be reserved for quiet residential streets, not the main drag.  Let the through traffic get through.

[J N Winkler]

Strictly speaking, the "European" approach toward stop sign usage is actually British.  The reason "Give Way" signs are used in Britain in contexts where stop signs would be used in the US and most continental European countries is that each stop sign in Britain requires the authorization of the Secretary of State for Transport, which is given only when there is a nonremovable sight obstruction.  Another peculiarity of British road traffic law is that, for fixed permanent installations, it is actually the "Give Way" line (not the sign or the triangular pavement marking) which imposes the legal requirement to yield priority.  The upright sign and triangular pavement marking are used to add emphasis.

[agentsteel53]

speaking of "yield" signs, does anyone actually know how the old "priority to the right" system works at unsigned intersections?  That right there is another Bad Idea; having the ancient "priority to the right" rule on the books (sometimes, but not always, using it in T-intersections too!) and leaving intersections unsigned, but luckily they tend to be in small-town back streets with very little traffic.

a lot of people assume an unsigned intersection is an all-way stop (priority to the first arrival) but it's priority to the right, so someone who approaches from the right and, correctly, does not stop, may get plowed by someone who got there first and assumed the other driver would stop too.

France, apparently, has intersections of significance still operating under this system, including some major boulevards in Paris.

[J N Winkler]

I understand priority-to-the-right, and at least in Kansas it is still on the books, still taught in driver's education, and (I think) still a question on the driver's license exam.  But slowing down at an unmarked crossroads is just defensive driving--you don't know whether the other driver even knows about the priority-to-right rule or comes from a jurisdiction (like Britain) which has no such priority assignment rule.

Given the rarity (even in traditional priority-to-right countries like France) of major intersections not subject to some form of explicit control through signs, markings, or signals, dealing with uncontrolled intersections is largely a problem of planning subdivisions to require a minimal number of transits through uncontrolled intersections to reach a collector or arterial.

[Revive 755]

"Priority to the right" is/was mentioned in the driver manuals for Missouri and Nebraska, but in both states it seems to rarely be observed - try to follow it often leads to a funny look given by the driver on the right.

As for another bad idea, how about the placement of ramps on I-70 between the west end of the PSB and the McKinely Bridge in St. Louis?  Take a day when the I-55 entrance to the PSB is backed up to the merge with I-44 and for some reason the Memorial Drive ramp is closed.  The next chance to just exit WB I-70 is near Madison Street, two miles north of the PSB.  But is it possible to simply make a u-turn and head back on EB I-70 to the MLK Bridge?  No, as EB I-70 also has an exit in that area, and does not have an entrance until back at the west end of the PSB.  Same situation at the Branch Street exit.  A simple u-turn option is not available until the Salisbury/McKinely Bridge interchange, or via a long trek via the outer roads through a really wonderful part of St. Louis.

Then how about the reversible/express lanes on I-70?  Seem to be closed more than open, have the same speed limit of 55 as the regular lanes even with no access points for miles, and require a lane shift at their east end for EB I-70 traffic that renders EB I-70 unusable in the afternoon.  I'm not sure whether this is a result of the US 40 closure, but right now they are also set for reverse commutes - outbound from downtown in the morning, inbound in the afternoon.  And they are still extremely empty.

Then there is the maze of streets under the elevated section of I-70 downtown where a simpler one-way outer road design would work better.