Wisconsin notes

[SEWIGuy]

- 'Windsor' - Someone explain to me the border between them and the Village of De Forest.  The two should merge.

Windsor's incorporation was part of a state budget bill that allowed them to bypass the traditional process as long as a referendum was passed.

I think it is ridiculous as well.  I think the State should require towns who want to incorporate to do so with an adjacent city or village.  I also think a number of these incorporations should be forced upon towns that meet certain situations.  I also think school districts should be forced to merge in certain situations.  (There is no reason that smaller school districts surrounded by larger districts with capacity should remain.  Williams Bay and Johnson Creek are examples.)  We have way too many governmental units in this state.

[mgk920]

The entire civil township of Somers did not incorporate.   The lesser-developed western half remains unincorporated.  This reflects conditions of incorporation implemented by the WI Department of Administration stating that if there are discrepancies in the level of development within a town, that only the urban portion should incorporate.   

To prevent another Fitchburg-type situation?  There are still plenty of parts of the City of Fitchburg that are very much rural and unchanged from when I grew up there 30-40 years ago.

How does this mesh with the map (it was drawn up by Kenosha County) that I linked in my above posting?  The remaining township is the bits and shreds that are on the City of Kenosha side of their boundary agreement line.

Mike

[mgk920]

The Maine/Brokaw/Texas story is really quite incredible as municipal interactions go.   It is worth reading about. 

I would think that it the incorporation of Salem Lakes would be appropriate to show as it occurs one week after the release of the state highway map. 

The entire civil township of Somers did not incorporate.   The lesser-developed western half remains unincorporated.  This reflects conditions of incorporation implemented by the WI Department of Administration stating that if there are discrepancies in the level of development within a town, that only the urban portion should incorporate.  This explains why only part of Harrison and Bloomfield incorporated recently.  It does not explain why all of Windsor incorporated.  Other incorporation efforts to watch:  Midway in LaCrosse County, Ledgeview in Brown County, Town of Beloit, Town of Lisbon and Town of Brookfield in Waukesha County.   How about Grand Chute?  This was shot down in the 1980s, any effort to revive it? Any other incorporations?   It should also be noted that the towns of Blooming Grove, Burke, and Madison have agreements in place to dissolve into the surrounding incorporated municipalities (Cities of Madison or Sun Prairie or DeForest or Fitchburg) that are well mapped in each of the boundary agreements that can be found online.  These dissolutions will occur within the next 20 years, and seem to be appropriate and create logical new boundaries.

I'm doubtful on many of the townships shown trying to incorporate, although in the cases of Harrison and Menasha townships, they did a *VERY SLIMY* workaround on the geographic standards requirements by incorporating a small 'logical' part and then, by using a secretly-negotiated boundary agreement with mandatory transfer of territory, 'transferred' the rest (or major parts) of the remaining townships into the new villages.  Appleton and Menasha are still in court over the Harrison case.  Fast-growing Sherwood suddenly found itself landlocked by Harrison in 2013 because of this.  To say that they were not happy is a total understatement.

Lisbon Township tried incorporating about ten years or so ago and was rejected by the state with a recommendation to negotiate a boundary agreement with Sussex and then to resubmit their amended petition. To date, they have not.

Grand Chute Township is in a 'pickle' with Appleton.  They have a non-expiring boundary agreement with Appleton that puts several of their densely populated eastern neighborhoods on the Appleton side of the line - the city's protected growth area.  It carries over to any potential 'village' to the west, which Appleton will not oppose the creation of.  The township doesn't want to leave those residents behind and be lost to that big, bad, *EVIL* city, so they do nothing.

One 'Fox Crossing' (man, that is an AWFUL name, too!  ) thing - on their 'east' side (check a very detailed map to see this), even though several of its chunks of territory are on the Appleton side of the city's mutual boundary agreement line with the City of Menasha (who is totally *POed* over that incorporation/sham boundary agreement!) and much of what is on the Appleton side of that line is 100% surrounded by Appleton - APPLETON DOES NOT WANT IT.  (Appleton mayor Tim Hanna about a year ago - "If they (Menasha Township) want it, they can have it.  We don't want it".)  It is either a very large block of questionable, at best, quality apartments or some of the smallest house/lot worn-out early to mid 20th century blue collar single family residential anywhere that would cost the city more in public works upgrades and, especially, ongoing police resources than it would take in in added tax revenue.  Interestingly, too, is that there is an Appleton fire station that is literally right next door to this worn out small house township neighborhood.  It will not respond to any call to the houses next door or across the street due to that municipal border, except to actually rescue someone whose life is in immediate danger.  Appleton does have a full 'first response' mutual aid pact with the merged Neenah-Menasha (city) Fire-Rescue (ditto with Grand Chute Township, BTW), but not Menasha Township/'Fox Crossing', which has their own volunteer department.

Mike

[mgk920]

- 'Windsor' - Someone explain to me the border between them and the Village of De Forest.  The two should merge.

Windsor's incorporation was part of a state budget bill that allowed them to bypass the traditional process as long as a referendum was passed.

I think it is ridiculous as well.  I think the State should require towns who want to incorporate to do so with an adjacent city or village.  I also think a number of these incorporations should be forced upon towns that meet certain situations.  I also think school districts should be forced to merge in certain situations.  (There is no reason that smaller school districts surrounded by larger districts with capacity should remain.  Williams Bay and Johnson Creek are examples.)  We have way too many governmental units in this state.

I would also seriously consider forcing mergers between urbanized townships and their adjacent 'legacy' cities, and I would include adjacent incorporated suburban cities and villages in this.  Yes, even in the 'little' metros (ie, Village of Lohrville/City of Redgranite).  One stand-alone 'forced' incorporation that I would definitely do is in the totally unincorporated Minocqua-Woodruff area - take a very wide, broad area of territory there and create a 'City of Lakeland'.

There is no reason why the Fox Valley (the general Appleton area) needs all of those separate cities, villages and townships, plus all of the other nit-pikky entities (school districts, etc) to serve an area with fewer total residents than live in two of the state's existing cities.  Ditto most of the rest of the state's metros.

As for nonsensical school district lines, here in the Fox Valley we have the Little Chute School District, which is smaller in land area than the current Village of Little Chute, and is totally surrounded by the Kaukauna School District (north of the Fox River).



Mike

[SEWIGuy]

Regarding school district boundaries, my favorite example is Franklin (south side of Milwaukee County).  Despite there being a Franklin School District, depending on where you live, you can also go to the Oak Creek schools or the Whitnall schools.  The school district lines cut through City of Franklin neighborhoods as the City has evolved.

I have a friend out in Waukesha County that lives in the Town of Delafield, with a Pewaukee mailing address and is in the Hartland Arrowhead school district.

It is a mess.

[The Ghostbuster]

I just ordered my copy of the 2017-18 map from the Department of Tourism webpage. The page shows the new state highway map on the top of the page, but in the place where you click to order print versions of the maps still shows the 2015-16 map decal. I hope I don't get that one by mistake (I already got a copy when that edition first came out).

[dcharlie]

Can anyone share the link on where to get the map from?  Thanks!

[Big John]

^^  DOT link: http://wisconsindot.gov/Pages/travel/road/hwy-maps/default.aspx

[tchafe1978]

Regarding school district boundaries, my favorite example is Franklin (south side of Milwaukee County).  Despite there being a Franklin School District, depending on where you live, you can also go to the Oak Creek schools or the Whitnall schools.  The school district lines cut through City of Franklin neighborhoods as the City has evolved.

I have a friend out in Waukesha County that lives in the Town of Delafield, with a Pewaukee mailing address and is in the Hartland Arrowhead school district.

It is a mess.

I grew up in Brookfield and went to Elmbrook schools, graduating from Brookfield Central High School. But about 1/2 mile to the west of our house is a corner of the City of Brookfield, west of Brookfield Rd. that has a Brookfield mailing address, but is part of the Waukesha School district. An elementary school in the town of Brookfield and Waukesha school district was actually closer than the elementary school I attended. And there are parts of the town of Brookfield east of Brookfield Rd. that are part of Elmbrook school district, while parts west of Brookfield Rd. are Waukesha school district. Confusing as all hell.

[jw1]

Regarding school district boundaries, my favorite example is Franklin (south side of Milwaukee County).  Despite there being a Franklin School District, depending on where you live, you can also go to the Oak Creek schools or the Whitnall schools.  The school district lines cut through City of Franklin neighborhoods as the City has evolved.

I have a friend out in Waukesha County that lives in the Town of Delafield, with a Pewaukee mailing address and is in the Hartland Arrowhead school district.

It is a mess.

I grew up in Brookfield and went to Elmbrook schools, graduating from Brookfield Central High School. But about 1/2 mile to the west of our house is a corner of the City of Brookfield, west of Brookfield Rd. that has a Brookfield mailing address, but is part of the Waukesha School district. An elementary school in the town of Brookfield and Waukesha school district was actually closer than the elementary school I attended. And there are parts of the town of Brookfield east of Brookfield Rd. that are part of Elmbrook school district, while parts west of Brookfield Rd. are Waukesha school district. Confusing as all hell.

School districts are completely separate units of government, so their boundaries do not have to match municipal boundaries even when there are annexations or other changes to a municipal boundary.

Here is a fun example: About 7 years ago, there was a gas station right on the Shorewood-Whitefish Bay boundary that got torn down for a new mixed-use (apartments & ground floor retail) building. Shorewood cut a deal with Whitefish Bay so that the entire parcel would become part of Shorewood. However, the school districts did not reach a deal, so if you rent an apartment on the north end of the building, you're in the Whitefish Bay school district (and vote in WFB school elections,) and if you rent an apartment on the south end of the building, you're in the Shorewood school district.

[DaBigE]

Regarding school district boundaries, my favorite example is Franklin (south side of Milwaukee County).  Despite there being a Franklin School District, depending on where you live, you can also go to the Oak Creek schools or the Whitnall schools.  The school district lines cut through City of Franklin neighborhoods as the City has evolved.

I have a friend out in Waukesha County that lives in the Town of Delafield, with a Pewaukee mailing address and is in the Hartland Arrowhead school district.

It is a mess.

I grew up in Brookfield and went to Elmbrook schools, graduating from Brookfield Central High School. But about 1/2 mile to the west of our house is a corner of the City of Brookfield, west of Brookfield Rd. that has a Brookfield mailing address, but is part of the Waukesha School district. An elementary school in the town of Brookfield and Waukesha school district was actually closer than the elementary school I attended. And there are parts of the town of Brookfield east of Brookfield Rd. that are part of Elmbrook school district, while parts west of Brookfield Rd. are Waukesha school district. Confusing as all hell.

School districts are completely separate units of government, so their boundaries do not have to match municipal boundaries even when there are annexations or other changes to a municipal boundary.

Here is a fun example: About 7 years ago, there was a gas station right on the Shorewood-Whitefish Bay boundary that got torn down for a new mixed-use (apartments & ground floor retail) building. Shorewood cut a deal with Whitefish Bay so that the entire parcel would become part of Shorewood. However, the school districts did not reach a deal, so if you rent an apartment on the north end of the building, you're in the Whitefish Bay school district (and vote in WFB school elections,) and if you rent an apartment on the south end of the building, you're in the Shorewood school district.

Madison is a great example of school district boundaries not coinciding with municipal boundaries. Fitchburg, Monona/Cottage Grove, Middleton, and Sun Prairie all overlap.

For example, everything (including a large, new residential development) roughly bordered by the interstate, Lein Rd and north all belongs to the Sun Prairie School District, despite being in the city of Madison. Somehow, SPSD negotiated to keep that area in order to take advantage of the commercial tax base along the interstate and 151, (despite the new, rapid growth that will soon strain the existing Sun Prairie schools).

[triplemultiplex]

Thanks for the updates on the new incorporations, guys.  I don't have my ear to the ground for them these days.
I've got some play maps to update.

[Big John]

 

Saw this months ago while in I-94. A hobbyist plate that's black on white. Aren't they always yellow on green?

Also... just found a forum user with the name 'lizmo' http://forums.nicoclub.com/fs-ft-98-vw-jetta-vr6-t351518.html ...has WI plates. Maybe I should just ask directly!

you posted that on 8/23/16 (page 46) too.  I checked the website again and they still show green for that. http://wisconsindot.gov/Documents/formdocs/mv2388.pdf

[colinstu]

Saw this months ago while in I-94. A hobbyist plate that's black on white. Aren't they always yellow on green?

Also... just found a forum user with the name 'lizmo' http://forums.nicoclub.com/fs-ft-98-vw-jetta-vr6-t351518.html ...has WI plates. Maybe I should just ask directly!

you posted that on 8/23/16 (page 46) too.  I checked the website again and they still show green for that. http://wisconsindot.gov/Documents/formdocs/mv2388.pdf

Oops! Sorry, deleted the double post. Was going through my pictures and never recalled an answer/idea (figured I forgot and didn't post it).

Strange.

[midwesternroadguy]

Mike--thanks for all the updates about incorporation efforts.  You answered several questions that I've had for awhile. 

I also agree with your point about consolidating governmental units.  In the interest of providing comprehensive and more efficient services, it makes sense to have a metropolitan perspective.  In Fox Crossing 's case, how many people live, work and shop exclusively within it? ( I think the name is silly too, even something like Little Butte des Morts would have made more sense). I suspect that most households within it have a daily interaction with Appleton or Neenah, Menasha, or Grand Chute. 

I grew up in an very old incorporated Wisconsin suburb, and on an emotional level, I would hate to see it merge with the surrounding city, but I realize that it can't be as efficient anymore and is increasingly sharing services with adjacent communities. 

[Roadguy]

New state budget proposal removes 94 East-West between the Marquette and Zoo from additional design work the next two years.  That $31 million is proposed to be spent on bringing 94 North-South between 894 and the Illinois border closer to completion.

http://www.jsonline.com/story/news/politics/2017/02/08/gov-scott-walker-wants-restore-some-his-past-cuts-wisconsin-schools-and-universities/97608986/

http://www.bizjournals.com/milwaukee/news/2017/02/08/gov-walker-expected-to-drop-funding-for-i-94-east.html

If design is not progressed on 94 east-west over the next few years, FHWA may revoke approval and in turn set the project back for years (if it were ever to get completed). 

The bridges and roadway surface in this stretch are nearing the end of their designed lifespan.  The roadway has 4 overlays on it.  The next step is bridge replacement and full pavement replacement.  If SE district opts to do pavement replacement and bridge rehabilitation work with the regular budget (which is already short changed) outside of the SE Freeways program then the originally designed full rebuild of the highway and reconfiguration of interchanges as it's been studied the last few years is probably dead. 

[colinstu]

LAME

what an IDIOT. There's just no words. Delaying stuff NEVER saves money... can these people ever look past a single or couple years?
Not only that, we're all stuck with unsafe, slow, antiquated, suboptimal freeway connection between the Marquette / Zoo.

[SEWIGuy]

LAME

what an IDIOT. There's just no words. Delaying stuff NEVER saves money... can these people ever look past a single or couple years?
Not only that, we're all stuck with unsafe, slow, antiquated, suboptimal freeway connection between the Marquette / Zoo.

People are so conditioned with the short term savings that they never realize the long-term costs.  If you raise the gas tax NOW and pay for it NOW, you are saving the taxpayers money in the long-run. 

[triplemultiplex]

New state budget proposal removes 94 East-West between the Marquette and Zoo from additional design work the next two years.  That $31 million is proposed to be spent on bringing 94 North-South between 894 and the Illinois border closer to completion.

In my opinion, those two priorities should be flipped.  41/94 can wait for its fourth lane longer than the Stadium Interchange area can stave off functional obsolescence.

But the Republicans are just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic that is WisDOT.  They've been running this state for a long-ass time now, so they own this funding problem.  They've had the power to fix it for many years, but decided it was more important to give the John Menards of the state more tax handouts.  Time to let someone else drive.

[The Ghostbuster]

Something has to be done to that corridor, and soon! It has been in operation since the early 1960's. If they just reconstruct the road, and add the additional lane later, that should be sufficient. Of course, that all depends on whether design and construction will be funded in the near-future.

[mgk920]

Mike--thanks for all the updates about incorporation efforts.  You answered several questions that I've had for awhile. 

I also agree with your point about consolidating governmental units.  In the interest of providing comprehensive and more efficient services, it makes sense to have a metropolitan perspective.  In Fox Crossing 's case, how many people live, work and shop exclusively within it? ( I think the name is silly too, even something like Little Butte des Morts would have made more sense). I suspect that most households within it have a daily interaction with Appleton or Neenah, Menasha, or Grand Chute. 

I grew up in an very old incorporated Wisconsin suburb, and on an emotional level, I would hate to see it merge with the surrounding city, but I realize that it can't be as efficient anymore and is increasingly sharing services with adjacent communities.

In the case of 'Fox Crossing', the name that they proposed when they tried incorporating their entire township back in the very early 1980s was 'Bridgeview', a far better name, IMHO.  That's a big reason why I refer to it as the 'Bridgeview Interchange'.  That said, it is my belief that the USPS will not be acknowledging its presence, especially on their east side, and to them they will remain divided between Appleton (54914 or 54915), Menasha (54952) and Neenah (54956).  The vast majority of their west side is served by the Neenah Post Office and it is all in the Neenah School District.  Their entire east side is in the Menasha School District.  BTW, there are *no* either grocery nor department stores anywhere within their borders.  All of the grocery stores in NE Winnebago County (east of Little Butte des Morts) are in either the Cities of Appleton or Menasha.  West of it, the nearest grocery stores, IIRC, are the west Appleton WalMart (in Grand Chute Township) and the Pick N' Save and WalMart in Neenah (city).

Mike

[JREwing78]

Random notes from this weekend's travels:

- US-51 north of the Hwy 29 east interchange in Wausau is still posted for 65 mph. There's 27 more miles of freeway before you hit the first at-grade crossroad at Lincoln Dr north of Merrill. Seems kinda silly when US-41/141 south of Abrams merits a 70 mph limit.

- A 5-mile stretch of US-51 south of Hazelhurst (between US-8 and Minocqua) is getting realignment work, basically shifting the highway west slightly and leveling it out. I didn't remember this being a horribly sub-standard stretch of road, but it does appear it would have ROW for passing lanes. WisDOT's Projects and Studies page doesn't mention this at all.

- Michigan starting putting in passing lanes on 2-lane highways in earnest in the '90s. Wisconsin hadn't really warmed up to them until very recently - the ones on many highways (Hwy 26 between Waupun and Oshkosh, for example) were too infrequent and too short to do much good.

Bravo, then, to the planners that took notes from Michigan and installed multiple 2 mile long passing lanes on US-141 between Iron Mountain and the beginning of the expressway segment just north of Hwy 64. Even with iffy weather and lots of semis jockeying for position with brodozers and their snowmobile trailers, US-141 moved beautifully. I'm sure eventually WisDOT will find it worthwhile to 4-lane US-141 north beyond Wausaukee, but the passing lanes bought them probably a decade or two before it becomes necessary.

- US-41/141 traffic south of Abrams was pretty heavy this afternoon, in part because lackluster snow pushed all the snowmobilers north into the U.P. this winter.

- I-41 through Green Bay is a beast. Janesville should only hope the work on I-39/90 turns out as well.

- WisDOT is delusional if they honestly think people are shying away from Hwy 26 through Rosendale because of a couple sign changes on I-41 and US-151. The traffic is *definitely* there to justify a 4-laning. Are there bigger priorities? Sure. But it wouldn't have killed them to lengthen the ridiculously short passing lanes north of Rosendale during the last round of upgrades.

[GeekJedi]

WisDOT is delusional if they honestly think people are shying away from Hwy 26 through Rosendale because of a couple sign changes on I-41 and US-151. The traffic is *definitely* there to justify a 4-laning. Are there bigger priorities? Sure. But it wouldn't have killed them to lengthen the ridiculously short passing lanes north of Rosendale during the last round of upgrades.

I think the renaming will eventually work. What you're seeing (I'm sure) are people who have taken that route forever. 151->41 is 8 miles longer and is two minutes slower, but I'm guessing by the time you factor in Rosendale on 26 and faster-than-70 speeds on 41, it's probably the same or slightly faster. I think there's simply an ROW issue along 26, and it makes little sense to dump a ton of money into what is a slightly shorter cutoff route when they have a nicely improved facility already in place.

[mgk920]

WisDOT is delusional if they honestly think people are shying away from Hwy 26 through Rosendale because of a couple sign changes on I-41 and US-151. The traffic is *definitely* there to justify a 4-laning. Are there bigger priorities? Sure. But it wouldn't have killed them to lengthen the ridiculously short passing lanes north of Rosendale during the last round of upgrades.

I think the renaming will eventually work. What you're seeing (I'm sure) are people who have taken that route forever. 151->41 is 8 miles longer and is two minutes slower, but I'm guessing by the time you factor in Rosendale on 26 and faster-than-70 speeds on 41, it's probably the same or slightly faster. I think there's simply an ROW issue along 26, and it makes little sense to dump a ton of money into what is a slightly shorter cutoff route when they have a nicely improved facility already in place.

I'm wondering, too, if Oshkosh has plans for significant additional development in that area (the I-41/WI 26 interchange and the Planeview truck stop are in the city), which, with added signalized intersections, will slow up that WI 26 routing all the more.

Mike

[Mrt90]

2017 Wisconsin Official Highway Map is out--both on-line and paper copies.  My paper copy came today.  As expected, there are very few updates from the (secret) 2016 version:

1) The expressway extension of STH 16/26 north of Watertown
2) The incorporation of the villages of Fox Crossing in Winnebago County and Windsor in Dane County

Unfortunately, the Madison Beltline and US 151 NE of I-39 are still erroneously shown as a non-freeway divided highway again, and the incorporation of Somers and Salem Lakes, both in Kenosha County were missed as they have no population listed in the index or are missing in the Kenosha inset. 

I think this is one of the most confusing and uninspired covers to be used on a Wisconsin OHM.  While the photo is at a very beautiful place (Wyalusing), the image is mostly of rock and is very muddy.  One has to look hard to figure out that this pamphlet is actually a highway map of Wisconsin.

- Going over these, 'Fox Crossing' is a two-faced kind of place, the part west of Little Lake Butte des Morts (the I-41/US 10/WI 441 Bridgeview interchange is in it) is a solid, 'Ashwaubenon-like' geographic entity that, although it needs a LOT of public works and planning work (believe me, a local, it does!), is needed to properly serve its area.  The part east of Little Lake Butte des Morts is a true municipal mess and the best reason of all as to why the State of Wisconsin badly needs top to bottom local government reform.  Just check a closely detailed map of that part of Winnebago County (the part north of Lake Winnebago and east of the Fox River/Little Lake Buttes des Morts) to see why.

- 'Windsor' - Someone explain to me the border between them and the Village of De Forest.  The two should merge.

- 'Salem Lakes' is a merger between the existing Village of Silver Lake and Salem Township.  It's not shown because it hasn't taken effect yet.  It becomes official this Tuesday (2017-02-14).  There is a boundary agreement between Salem Township and the Village of Paddock Lake, which Salem Township surrounds about 90 percent of, that guarantees that Paddock Lake will receive significant amounts of territory from Salem regardless of the township's corporate status.  See: http://www.townofsalem.net/vertical/sites/%7BFD43A93D-1DA7-4F52-8644-C09DA66C3401%7D/uploads/Salem-Paddock_Lake_Boundary_Agreement_and_Growth_Area.pdf for details and a map.

- 'Somers' is the result of a boundary agreement between the City of Kenosha and the township, allowing the city to annex numerous shreds and remnants of the township to logically square off its border while allowing the rest of the township to incorporate.  See: http://www.somers.org/sites/default/files/SomersNewVilTownMap2016_0.pdf for a detailed map.  The incorporation took effect on 2016-01-01.

Interesting stuff.

Mike

I believe that the boundary agreement between the City of Kenosha and the Town of Somers has been in effect for many years.  I thought I heard that the reason Somers wanted to incorporate was to protect themselves from annexation by the Village of Mount Pleasant in Racine County? Of course, the first thing the Village of Somers does is try to grab land west of I-94 from the Town of Paris, which would have cut off west of I-94 expansion by the City of Kenosha in the northern part of the county.  The Town of Somers has also delayed repairs on a road that is now entirely in the Town of Somers because they know it will eventually be in the City of Kenosha: 27th is one of the main east-west roads connecting the far north side of Kenosha to the Bradford High School/Bullen Middle School area so it is pretty heavily used but it is essentially a narrow, 2 lane, rural type road in need of repair.  I think they just recently came to some kind of agreement to split the cost of 27th Street repairs.

Salem Lakes is kind of an odd situation.  Silver Lake is a Village that no longer wants to be a Village, and Salem wanted to incorporate as a Village.  So the two merge as Salem Lakes so that Salem doesn't have to go through the incorporation process.  But the main "town-like/urban" area of Salem Lakes is Silver Lake.