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Started by Alex, February 04, 2010, 10:38:53 AM

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PHLBOS

Quote from: kphoger on March 05, 2019, 03:21:32 PMSo, from what I'm understanding now, there is no way in either NJ or PA to tell if a vehicle has current registration.  I know Pennsylvania, when that state stopped issuing stickers, said there's no need for stickers anymore, since everything is in the database.  So why do all those other states continue to issue them?
Guess on my part; when they say database, such only involves PennDOT & vehicles registered in PA.  Other states may not have as elaborate of a database.

It's worth noting that PA & NJ aren't the only states that don't/no longer use plate stickers.  NY hasn't used them in decades if ever.  I believe there's a few other states that don't use plate stickers either.
GPS does NOT equal GOD


kphoger

Quote from: PHLBOS on March 06, 2019, 02:21:34 PM
Quote from: kphoger on March 05, 2019, 03:21:32 PMSo, from what I'm understanding now, there is no way in either NJ or PA to tell if a vehicle has current registration.  I know Pennsylvania, when that state stopped issuing stickers, said there's no need for stickers anymore, since everything is in the database.  So why do all those other states continue to issue them?
Guess on my part; when they say database, such only involves PennDOT & vehicles registered in PA.  Other states may not have as elaborate of a database.

It's worth noting that PA & NJ aren't the only states that don't/no longer use plate stickers.  NY hasn't used them in decades if ever.  I believe there's a few other states that don't use plate stickers either.

All other states I've found that don't use plate stickers use windshield registration stickers instead.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

J N Winkler

Quote from: kphoger on March 06, 2019, 02:43:52 PMAll other states I've found that don't use plate stickers use windshield registration stickers instead.

The trend is against using visible markings on the vehicle to indicate current registration and instead relying on ANPR and live connections to the vehicle registration database.  In Britain, for example, DVLA eliminated tax discs a few years ago--police forces now rely on ANPR to check that a vehicle on the public highway has current VED.
"It is necessary to spend a hundred lire now to save a thousand lire later."--Piero Puricelli, explaining the need for a first-class road system to Benito Mussolini

PHLBOS

Quote from: kphoger on March 06, 2019, 02:43:52 PMAll other states I've found that don't use plate stickers use windshield registration stickers instead.
Are you sure those windshield stickers aren't just inspection stickers?  It might vary depending on which state.
GPS does NOT equal GOD

kphoger

Quote from: PHLBOS on March 06, 2019, 03:52:49 PM
Quote from: kphoger on March 06, 2019, 02:43:52 PMAll other states I've found that don't use plate stickers use windshield registration stickers instead.
Are you sure those windshield stickers aren't just inspection stickers?  It might vary depending on which state.

Not 100% sure, but I did a cursory search for all 50 states plus DC.  Pennsylvania and New Jersey were the only odd ones out.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

vdeane

Quote from: PHLBOS on March 06, 2019, 03:52:49 PM
Quote from: kphoger on March 06, 2019, 02:43:52 PMAll other states I've found that don't use plate stickers use windshield registration stickers instead.
Are you sure those windshield stickers aren't just inspection stickers?  It might vary depending on which state.
At least in NY, we have both windshield inspections stickers and windshield registration stickers (except for government vehicles, which have only inspection).
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

MikeTheActuary

Quote from: kphoger on March 06, 2019, 02:43:52 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on March 06, 2019, 02:21:34 PM
It's worth noting that PA & NJ aren't the only states that don't/no longer use plate stickers.  NY hasn't used them in decades if ever.  I believe there's a few other states that don't use plate stickers either.
All other states I've found that don't use plate stickers use windshield registration stickers instead.

Connecticut switched from plate stickers to windshield stickers in 2006 because of partial plate thefts.

Connecticut then abolished the windshield stickers in 2010.

kphoger

Quote from: MikeTheActuary on March 06, 2019, 11:16:36 PM

Quote from: kphoger on March 06, 2019, 02:43:52 PM

Quote from: PHLBOS on March 06, 2019, 02:21:34 PM
It's worth noting that PA & NJ aren't the only states that don't/no longer use plate stickers.  NY hasn't used them in decades if ever.  I believe there's a few other states that don't use plate stickers either.

All other states I've found that don't use plate stickers use windshield registration stickers instead.

Connecticut switched from plate stickers to windshield stickers in 2006 because of partial plate thefts.

Connecticut then abolished the windshield stickers in 2010.

Ah, thank you.  Yes, if a state switched to windshield registration stickers and later abandoned those as well, then I didn't have a simple way of finding that out.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

PHLBOS

Quote from: MikeTheActuary on March 06, 2019, 11:16:36 PMConnecticut switched from plate stickers to windshield stickers in 2006 because of partial plate thefts.
Such was one of the reasons that ultimately lead to PA abolishing their plate stickers.  Many plates, mostly in the Philly area, were getting clipped at the corner where the registration sticker's located.
GPS does NOT equal GOD

billpa

Quote from: PHLBOS on March 07, 2019, 02:09:25 PM
Quote from: MikeTheActuary on March 06, 2019, 11:16:36 PMConnecticut switched from plate stickers to windshield stickers in 2006 because of partial plate thefts.
Such was one of the reasons that ultimately lead to PA abolishing their plate stickers.  Many plates, mostly in the Philly area, were getting clipped at the corner where the registration sticker's located.
I seem to remember cars in Philadelphia county having reg stickers on the windshield, or somewhere else on the car a few years ago....I think it was down to the theft issue they were dealing with at the time.

Pixel 2


PHLBOS

Quote from: billpa on March 07, 2019, 04:22:59 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on March 07, 2019, 02:09:25 PM
Quote from: MikeTheActuary on March 06, 2019, 11:16:36 PMConnecticut switched from plate stickers to windshield stickers in 2006 because of partial plate thefts.
Such was one of the reasons that ultimately lead to PA abolishing their plate stickers.  Many plates, mostly in the Philly area, were getting clipped at the corner where the registration sticker's located.
I seem to remember cars in Philadelphia county having reg stickers on the windshield, or somewhere else on the car a few years ago....I think it was down to the theft issue they were dealing with at the time.
You're thinking of the short-lived yellow Post-It like stickers placed on the rear windows.  Such was done on an experimental/trail basis only for vehicles registered in Philadelphia (where the majority of the plate clippings were occurring).  It was dropped because the adhesive didn't last too long (the sticker would fall off) and it encouraged vehicular and/or traffic-stop profiling.
GPS does NOT equal GOD

vdeane

I imagine the profiling issue would go away had it rolled out statewide.  The adhesive issue seems like the bigger problem, though not unsolvable had they wanted to go that way.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

Scott5114

Quote from: PHLBOS on March 07, 2019, 02:09:25 PM
Quote from: MikeTheActuary on March 06, 2019, 11:16:36 PMConnecticut switched from plate stickers to windshield stickers in 2006 because of partial plate thefts.
Such was one of the reasons that ultimately lead to PA abolishing their plate stickers.  Many plates, mostly in the Philly area, were getting clipped at the corner where the registration sticker's located.

Missouri was having this issue as well, and their solution was to locate the sticker in a well in the center of the plate, between the two halves of the plate number. So it looks something like "A55[sticker]RGY".

Oklahoma's apparent solution to this is to just not bother to ticket anyone with expired plates, so there's no need to steal the stickers.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

PHLBOS

Quote from: vdeane on March 07, 2019, 07:34:25 PMI imagine the profiling issue would go away had it rolled out statewide.  The adhesive issue seems like the bigger problem, though not unsolvable had they wanted to go that way.
Given the overall size of PA, choosing one county (Philadelphia in this case) to experiment with a new item seemed to be the right & prudent choice.  The reason it was chosen over the other PA counties for the experiment was obvious; the majority of the plate clippings were occurring in Philly.  Had there been no issues, be it profiling or the adhesiveness of the Post-It stickers; the new stickers would've then been implemented statewide.
GPS does NOT equal GOD

SP Cook

IMHO, all of these "plate clipping" and simple plate theft stories seem to be a sort of mass panic.  Since even the most backward jurisdictions can read plates electronically and relate them back to a data base in real time, there really is no reason to do so.

vdeane

Quote from: PHLBOS on March 08, 2019, 10:29:24 AM
Quote from: vdeane on March 07, 2019, 07:34:25 PMI imagine the profiling issue would go away had it rolled out statewide.  The adhesive issue seems like the bigger problem, though not unsolvable had they wanted to go that way.
Given the overall size of PA, choosing one county (Philadelphia in this case) to experiment with a new item seemed to be the right & prudent choice.  The reason it was chosen over the other PA counties for the experiment was obvious; the majority of the plate clippings were occurring in Philly.  Had there been no issues, be it profiling or the adhesiveness of the Post-It stickers; the new stickers would've then been implemented statewide.
My point is that, had it gone past the experiment stage and rolled out statewide, the profiling issue would have vanished into oblivion.  And, after all, it's not like the adhesive issue can't be fixed.  No sticker at all is certainly easier, though.  I wish NY would join CT, QC, and PA in getting rid of them.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

PHLBOS

#1041
Quote from: vdeane on March 08, 2019, 12:43:19 PMMy point is that, had it gone past the experiment stage and rolled out statewide, the profiling issue would have vanished into oblivion.
Since then, more and more new vehicles now feature dark-tinted rear-windows so such stickers would not be able to be seen/readable from a distance.

Quote from: vdeane on March 08, 2019, 12:43:19 PMI wish NY would join CT, QC, and PA in getting rid of them.
I'm assuming you're referring to window/windshield stickers.  I've never seen a NY plate with stickers on them.
GPS does NOT equal GOD

vdeane

Yes, the windshield stickers.  They can be a bit of a pain the change.

Fun fact: NY government plates actually have stickers on them, but all they do is show the county the vehicle is from, and they're the same color scheme as the rest of the plate, so they're not really noticeable as stickers unless you get really close (or happen to see a plate lacking one).
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

1995hoo

#1043
The new issue of Car and Driver that came yesterday has a one-page piece about the Rplate digital plates. A couple of the features they mention are interesting enough in concept–for example, having it synced up to mobile parking payment systems like ParkMobile so the plate will display that you've paid for parking until a specific time. To me that's not worth either $499 or $799 for the plate (the latter version includes upgraded telematics that let you–and Big Brother–track the vehicle online) plus another $99 a year to keep the plate online.

As the article notes (third set of brackets in original): "... [Neville] Boston [Reviver Auto's CEO] says owners will control whether the Rplate shares their data. 'If it's something you want as a functionality, we support it with our current model,' he says. 'You can absolutely turn [data transmission] off. It's controlled by the user. The owners of the plate own their data.' If that sounds familiar, reference Facebook's terms of service circa 2018–nominal ownership often isn't enough to prevent companies from sharing data."




Regarding windshield stickers, in DC they've combined registration, safety inspection, and residential parking permit all onto the one sticker. When they first did this, discontinuing the license plate stickers, DC parking enforcement started giving people tickets for having expired plates, so the city issued supplemental stickers that said "See Window Sticker."

Virginia doesn't couple safety inspection and registration. Our inspection sticker was moved last year from the bottom center of the windshield to the bottom left. This year they changed the sticker to a smaller size and a different color. Definitely less noticeable when you're driving (as a longtime resident, I noticed the new decal immediately when I first saw one). Only certain counties and cities are required to have emissions inspection. That is tied to registration but has no sticker–the result gets sent to the DMV electronically and then you can register the vehicle. There is now an on-road emissions inspection where you drive past these green boxes on the side of the road and it captures your plate; you then get a letter in the mail saying you passed and you can renew online. I did that last year. Costs the same as the conventional inspection except it doesn't require a trip to the gas station or other mechanic. (My safety inspection expires in May and my emissions expires in July. This is because I got the safety inspection done early when I was having the car serviced and I figured just get it done so as to spare myself another stop to have it done later.)
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commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

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7/8

https://www.thestar.com/amp/politics/provincial/2019/04/09/a-place-to-grow-will-be-ontarios-new-licence-plate-slogan.html

Ontario's passenger vehicle plates are changing to "A Place to Grow" and commercial vehicles are changing to "Open for Business" (Doug Ford's slogan that he added to the border signs - here's an example at the Rainbow Bridge in Niagara Falls).


Ontario is also considering ditching front plates (currently there are only 4 provinces with front plates).

jakeroot

Open for business? As opposed to what, a centralized fascist government that controls the means of production ("get lost")?

Dumb slogan. Used by various US states as well. I hate them all.

SP Cook

I agree.  Both WV (which has probably the most anti-job creator government outside of California in North America) and Virginia (which is rapidly trying to catch up to its daughter state) have tried the slogan recently.  It is sill and preachy.  And just not true.  If you have to say it, it is cause you ain't it.

You also see county line signs that proclaim the county a "Certifed Business Location" all over.  Also meaningless.  As I understand it, this is a PCed up version of the 1970s era "Certified Business Relocation Jurisdicton" which in turn was derived from earlier signs inviting northern businessmen driving to Florida to "Move your factory here" and which emphisized a pliant local gentry.

Ian

Quote from: jakeroot on April 09, 2019, 10:38:28 PM
Open for business? As opposed to what, a centralized fascist government that controls the means of production ("get lost")?

Dumb slogan. Used by various US states as well. I hate them all.

Yeah, the old one was waaaaaay better. Same sign, same location...

UMaine graduate, former PennDOT employee, new SoCal resident.
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renegade

Quote from: jakeroot on April 09, 2019, 10:38:28 PM
Open for business? As opposed to what, a centralized fascist government that controls the means of production ("get lost")?

Dumb slogan. Used by various US states as well. I hate them all.
"Open for Business" will only show up on a relatively small number of vehicles.  Passenger cars, which make up the vast majority of plates issued, will say "A Place to Grow."

Some people in Ontario seem to be bent out of shape about that.  I don't think it's a bad slogan.  A website URL, like we have in Michigan, would be worse.
Don’t ask me how I know.  Just understand that I do.

signalman

Quote from: renegade on April 10, 2019, 01:05:28 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on April 09, 2019, 10:38:28 PM
Open for business? As opposed to what, a centralized fascist government that controls the means of production ("get lost")?

Dumb slogan. Used by various US states as well. I hate them all.
"Open for Business" will only show up on a relatively small number of vehicles.  Passenger cars, which make up the vast majority of plates issued, will say "A Place to Grow."

Some people in Ontario seem to be bent out of shape about that.  I don't think it's a bad slogan.  A website URL, like we have in Michigan, would be worse.
The "open for business" slogan implies that the state/province cares more about business than its citizens.



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