Two questions...

[Special K]

Why the hate for Clearview Highway font?

Why the hard-on for cat eyes?

[Alps]

A lot of us just find Clearview ugly. It was a half-assed attempt to improve upon FHWA series, but in reality, they only tested it against Series E-Modified. A simple switch to Series E, or Georgia's Series D mixed-case, could have potentially solved all of their visibility problems without creating a new font. Clearview isn't even good in most applications - only positive-contrast letters. Finally, when you see Clearview, you know the sign's not old, and so I have no interest in it.

Cat eyes are a clear sign that the sign is old. Since so few signs are left that have them (or even the button copy reflectors in plastic), that makes them treasured items.

[NE2]

Maybe 50 years from now we'll be seeking out Clearview as rare signs from a failed experiment

[on_wisconsin]

Why the hate for Clearview Highway font?
Why the hard-on for cat eyes?

I have been wondering that since the first time I visited this site. Also may I add to your list: The extreme, sometimes overboard, nostalgia for a time when the majority of users on this forum were not even born yet or were very very young.

[Takumi]

A lot of us just find Clearview ugly. It was a half-assed attempt to improve upon FHWA series, but in reality, they only tested it against Series E-Modified. A simple switch to Series E, or Georgia's Series D mixed-case, could have potentially solved all of their visibility problems without creating a new font. Clearview isn't even good in most applications - only positive-contrast letters. Finally, when you see Clearview, you know the sign's not old, and so I have no interest in it.

I'll also add that most DOT's do a poor job with it, which adds to the ugliness factor, and many of the signs that are replaced with Clearview, at least in my experience, had nothing wrong with them.

[Brian556]

I don't personally hate clearview. I think most of the signs with it in Texas look pretty good. The only issue that I have with it is that the lowercase "l" is taller than the uppercase letters.

I am not one of those who automatically dislikes anything new. I am okay with new ways of doing things, they make things more interesting. Imagine how boring the world would be if nothing ever changed.

[on_wisconsin]

I am not one of those who automatically dislikes anything new. I am okay with new ways of doing things, they make things more interesting. Imagine how boring the world would be if nothing ever changed.

+1
Amen to that amigo! 

[Scott5114]

Why do coin collectors value old coins over newer ones?

[agentsteel53]

I am not one of those who automatically dislikes anything new. I am okay with new ways of doing things, they make things more interesting. Imagine how boring the world would be if nothing ever changed.

except that new things, in the realm of highway signage, tend towards conformity and plain old ugliness. 

your state, Texas, before 1969 had some of the most innovative signage in the country.  for example, the shields with arrows in them?  no one else was trying that!

after 1969, Texas has demonstrated alarmingly precise conformity to what the federal MUTCD prescribes - and the latest in federal signage practice has been garish.  the 1970 specification of route markers (they've been around for forty years now?  no wonder they're so common!) are by far the most aesthetically displeasing in the history of standardized route shields - especially the US route marker. 

[bugo]

Why the hate for Clearview Highway font?

Because it's ugly, and it's hard for my aging eyes to read at night.  I like for the uppercase letters to be much taller than the lowercase letters.
Post Merge: July 12, 2012, 11:18:49 AM

Maybe 50 years from now we'll be seeking out Clearview as rare signs from a failed experiment

We can only hope.
Post Merge: July 12, 2012, 11:18:52 AM

Why the hate for Clearview Highway font?
Why the hard-on for cat eyes?

I have been wondering that since the first time I visited this site. Also may I add to your list: The extreme, sometimes overboard, nostalgia for a time when the majority of users on this forum were not even born yet or were very very young.

What's wrong with liking old things?  Do you dislike truss bridges because they're old?  Old things are cool because 1) they're old and 2) because they don't make them that way anymore.

DUDE, STOP TRIPLE POSTING

[hbelkins]

I don't hate Clearview. It was different at first, when I saw pictures of it and when I saw it in the field for the first time, but I'm getting used to it. I also don't mind the "off-label" use of positive contrast Clearview. Now it jumps out at me only when it's used on a sign that replaces an older one, or when I see it somewhere that I'm not used to seeing it. I was used to seeing it in Kentucky, Michigan and Pennsylvania, but was surprised to see it in West Virginia. New installations (like the Natcher and Pennyrile Parkway extensions) don't even really faze me.

As for old signs, they have character. I'm old enough (50) to remember several cutouts that survived in Kentucky well into my life. At the time I remember wondering why those old relics were still in use. Now I remember their uniqueness. It's rare anymore to find any of the first-generation signs that replaced the cutouts, as reflective sheeting came into use in Kentucky in the mid to late 70s (along with those God-awful wide US and state route markers). Virginia used the "Maximum Safe Speed" legend on advisory speed signs. And then there were the Florida colored US markers.

A 1950s-era Kentucky cutout route marker wouldn't have much functionality and should be replaced for legibility reasons, but it'd sure be nice to find out out there somewhere.

[agentsteel53]

this 60 is gone?

[hbelkins]

I think that is still there, but I always considered that to be a special case. I will be back in Frankfort next week and will try to remember to go downtown and check it out.

[Alps]

this 60 is gone?

You're freaking kidding me. I've been into Frankfort once and just past it 5 days ago. Why am I only finding out about this now?

[agentsteel53]

wait, Steve, you did or did not see it?  your post is ambiguous.

[hbelkins]

http://www.millenniumhwy.net/oldsigns/ky/index.html

I took this picture in 1999:


It's posted on Bridge Street in downtown Frankfort near the old "Singing Bridge."

[1995hoo]

Why the hate for Clearview Highway font?

Because it's ugly, and it's hard for my aging eyes to read at night.  I like for the uppercase letters to be much taller than the lowercase letters.

....

The text I've highlighted in boldface suggests that you should LOVE certain poorly-executed uses of Clearview, such as these monstrosities near the Pentagon:




It's funny, my eyes find Clearview easier to read, both at night and during the day. But I do agree with Steve that Georgia's modified Series D produces some good-looking signs, and it also fits the point others have made about being something different. (However, I can think of at least two signs near my house where Series D is mixed with other FHWA fonts and it winds up being ugly.)

[mtantillo]

Clearview, the way FHWA insists it be implemented, is a royal pain to implement.  They are very specific with wanting the lowercase loop height to be 84% of the uppercase letter height.  This requires some manual manipulation in the software that we typically use for designing signs, as the copyrighted proportion has a lowercase loop height of approximately 81.4% of the uppercase letter height when you just type out the legend in the software. 

[DaBigE]

Clearview, the way FHWA insists it be implemented, is a royal pain to implement.  They are very specific with wanting the lowercase loop height to be 84% of the uppercase letter height.  This requires some manual manipulation in the software that we typically use for designing signs, as the copyrighted proportion has a lowercase loop height of approximately 81.4% of the uppercase letter height when you just type out the legend in the software.

If your numbers are correct, I wonder if the FHWA rules aren't just a typo/misplaced decimal.

[6a]

Why the hard-on for cat eyes?

C'mon, son...they don't make 'em like this anymore

[national highway 1]

Wow, that's definitely an awesome sign. Was it meant to be used at night (night contrast)?

[ctsignguy]

Why the hard-on for cat eyes?

Because, in many respects, cat-eyed signs are cooler than current stuff....especially at night!



And we like other old stuff you will hardly ever see on the roads any more.....

[Dr Frankenstein]

Why the hate for Clearview Highway font?
Why the hard-on for cat eyes?

I have been wondering that since the first time I visited this site. Also may I add to your list: The extreme, sometimes overboard, nostalgia for a time when the majority of users on this forum were not even born yet or were very very young.

Because it's out of the ordinary (I mean, what we usually see nowadays), we weren't there to see it, and remnants of these times are getting rarer by the year. You can't just not react when you discover something rare.

Consequently, I'll usually have a positive reaction to old signage, especially because I live in Canada where signs don't last as long due to the rough weather.

I wasn't there when the OAQ (former freeway agency) existed, so finding remnants of that era is exciting, and even moreso when I find something near a road I travel a lot. I wasn't there when the highway renumbering occured in Québec, so I get excited when I find an old shield from before that (we even had a stop specifically for one of those during the Montreal road meet; unfortunately it has disappeared since.). And it's always fun looking at archive photos; especially of signage, in my case. Blue highway signs and triangular autoroute shields and km-posts are being taken down at a steady pace. It's memorabilia from before I could drive (or even talk, let alone breathe) and their increasing rarity makes me like these things even though most of that stuff is in a terrible shape nowadays (try reading the old km-posts or the blue freeway signage at night).

I tend to react differently depending to where I am. 20+ year old freeway signage is rare in Ontario, so I'll definitely shoot it even if it's not that old. I won't react all that much when I see button copy in, say, California or New York City. But then, there is the only button copy sign known to currently exist in Québec, which I discovered earlier this summer (but without my camera) and made a 6-hour roundtrip just to take a photo of it.

TL;DR: Cat eyes are getting rare, hence the excitement when finding them.

Regarding Clearview, most people hate it because they think it's ugly. I like it, and I even use it on some of my designs. No, I don't only like old stuff, I always want to go on the new stretches of road soon after they open. Sometimes even just for new signage (like the A-20 exit renumbering south of Montreal).

[agentsteel53]

I wasn't there when the highway renumbering occured in Québec, so I get excited when I find an old shield from before that (we even had a stop specifically for one of those during the Montreal road meet; unfortunately it has disappeared since.).

are there any known examples?  even the ones used as the backs of other signs?

Blue highway signs and triangular autoroute shields and km-posts are being taken down at a steady pace.

I know of several blue signs in Quebec, but only one triangle shield left. any others?

there is the only button copy sign known to currently exist in Québec, which I discovered earlier this summer (but without my camera) and made a 6-hour roundtrip just to take a photo of it.

is it that letter "U" being used as a divider marker?  or is there another one?

[Dr Frankenstein]

I wasn't there when the highway renumbering occured in Québec, so I get excited when I find an old shield from before that (we even had a stop specifically for one of those during the Montreal road meet; unfortunately it has disappeared since.).

are there any known examples?  even the ones used as the backs of other signs?

It was a good-condition Route 29 sign back on a 132 shield on Boulevard Pie-XII (secret 60990) in a JCT assembly that got taken down since it was on the direct path of the Hwy 530 exension.

Blue highway signs and triangular autoroute shields and km-posts are being taken down at a steady pace.

I know of several blue signs in Quebec, but only one triangle shield left. any others?

Two in LaSalle, one of which is the one you know. There used to be a red one in Magog on Hwy 141 as recently as August 2009 which prompted Steve to prepare a photo trip until I found it was replaced by a standard Hwy 10 shield.

there is the only button copy sign known to currently exist in Québec, which I discovered earlier this summer (but without my camera) and made a 6-hour roundtrip just to take a photo of it.

is it that letter "U" being used as a divider marker?  or is there another one?

Yes, on Rue Einstein in Québec, along Hwy 40, in front of the SAQ store. I'll post a photo when I get back home.