AARoads Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Author Topic: Will St Louis get another football team?  (Read 2385 times)

dvferyance

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 893
  • Location: New Berlin WI
  • Last Login: May 25, 2018, 05:04:16 PM
Will St Louis get another football team?
« on: June 02, 2016, 10:24:50 PM »

As of lately the NFL just loves recycling old markets like Baltimore, Cleveland, Houston and now LA. So do they do it again with St Louis? The Rams draw big crowds when they were the greatest show on turf. So it's not like the NFL can't ever work in St Louis.
Logged

Alex

  • Webmaster
  • *
  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 4738
  • Location: Tampa, FL
  • Last Login: Today at 08:15:53 AM
    • AARoads
Re: Will St Louis get another football team?
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2016, 10:54:40 PM »

As of lately the NFL just loves recycling old markets like Baltimore, Cleveland, Houston and now LA. So do they do it again with St Louis? The Rams draw big crowds when they were the greatest show on turf. So it's not like the NFL can't ever work in St Louis.

"Lately" was last in 1999 with the Texans. Just read an article on NFL Expansion last week, and it is doubtful a city like St. Louis or any other smaller market will be able to land a new team due to the insanely high franchise fees that might be imposed.

Max Rockatansky

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 6484
  • Location: Route 9, Sector 26
  • Last Login: Today at 11:07:11 AM
Re: Will St Louis get another football team?
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2016, 11:02:32 PM »

It can be argued with the constant worry of a 7-9 or 8-8 division winner that there is too many teams already and too much watered down talent.  I'd say it's more of a reason not to stick possibly three times in L.A....it's not like any of them have yet stayed for good...  Hell I'm sure St Louis will be on the short list for relocation the next time a city refuses to build a stadium.

dvferyance

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 893
  • Location: New Berlin WI
  • Last Login: May 25, 2018, 05:04:16 PM
Re: Will St Louis get another football team?
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2016, 11:04:20 PM »

As of lately the NFL just loves recycling old markets like Baltimore, Cleveland, Houston and now LA. So do they do it again with St Louis? The Rams draw big crowds when they were the greatest show on turf. So it's not like the NFL can't ever work in St Louis.

"Lately" was last in 1999 with the Texans. Just read an article on NFL Expansion last week, and it is doubtful a city like St. Louis or any other smaller market will be able to land a new team due to the insanely high franchise fees that might be imposed.
Since when is St Louis a small market? I believe it's metro population is in the top 20. If the NFL were to expand again where would it go then? LA has a team now who's left that's bigger who doesn't have one?
Logged

US 41

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 1758
  • Age: 21
  • Location: Terre Haute, IN
  • Last Login: May 11, 2018, 10:46:32 PM
Re: Will St Louis get another football team?
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2016, 11:31:22 PM »

As of lately the NFL just loves recycling old markets like Baltimore, Cleveland, Houston and now LA. So do they do it again with St Louis? The Rams draw big crowds when they were the greatest show on turf. So it's not like the NFL can't ever work in St Louis.

"Lately" was last in 1999 with the Texans. Just read an article on NFL Expansion last week, and it is doubtful a city like St. Louis or any other smaller market will be able to land a new team due to the insanely high franchise fees that might be imposed.
Since when is St Louis a small market? I believe it's metro population is in the top 20. If the NFL were to expand again where would it go then? LA has a team now who's left that's bigger who doesn't have one?

Columbus, Ohio, is definitely big enough, but it might be too close to Cleveland and Cincinnati.
Logged
Places I've drove in North America

USA (27)= AL, AZ, AR, CO, DE, GA, IL, IN, KS, KY, LA, MD, MI, MS, MO, NM, NY, NC, OH, OK, PA, TN, TX, UT, VA, WV, WI
Canada (2)= ON, QC
Mexico (6)= CH, CO, DG, NL, SI, TM

Alex

  • Webmaster
  • *
  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 4738
  • Location: Tampa, FL
  • Last Login: Today at 08:15:53 AM
    • AARoads
Re: Will St Louis get another football team?
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2016, 11:43:04 PM »

As of lately the NFL just loves recycling old markets like Baltimore, Cleveland, Houston and now LA. So do they do it again with St Louis? The Rams draw big crowds when they were the greatest show on turf. So it's not like the NFL can't ever work in St Louis.

"Lately" was last in 1999 with the Texans. Just read an article on NFL Expansion last week, and it is doubtful a city like St. Louis or any other smaller market will be able to land a new team due to the insanely high franchise fees that might be imposed.
Since when is St Louis a small market? I believe it's metro population is in the top 20. If the NFL were to expand again where would it go then? LA has a team now who's left that's bigger who doesn't have one?

Well you got me thinking more on that, so I did some searching. It appears to be rooted upon the TV market share. Here's an article from 2013 that ranks St. Louis at 21st in TV markets with a pro sports team.

Quote
Not surprisingly, as the market size increases, the number of pro teams in that city increases, culminating with the New York area, which is home to nine pro sports teams. However, we also see a number of cities both well-above, and well-below the curve suggesting they either have too many or too few sports teams.

Orlando, with a market size of 1.5 million, is the largest city with just one pro sports team and is larger than 13 cities that have more than one team. At the other end of the spectrum, Pittsburgh, St. Louis, and Cleveland all have three pro sports teams despite a market sizes that are all below 1.5 million.

Kroenke's application for relocation, which was approved 30-2 by the NFL ownership, more or less referenced it as a small market. Not that I am agreeing with the move or any of what it cited, but I think it helps reduce the chances of St. Louis ever getting an NFL franchise again.

http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2016/01/06/rams-owner-stan-kroenke-rips-st-louis-market-as-he-seeks-move/

Quote
The Rams raised doubts that the St. Louis market, which also has baseball’s Cardinals and hockey’s Blues, can even support an NFL team moving forward. Peacock disagreed, noting that markets like Pittsburgh have a smaller corporate base than St. Louis but no one questions their ability to support three teams.

The application cited two NFL-commissioned studies of the Los Angeles, San Diego, Oakland and St. Louis markets. It says one study characterized the California markets as vibrant and growing, but said St. Louis “lags, and will continue to lag, far behind in the economic drivers that are necessary for sustained success of an NFL franchise.”

Another projected St. Louis to be 26th in growth among NFL markets.

Those studies “demonstrate that Los Angeles is a strong market with great opportunity, while St. Louis is a market that will in all likelihood be unable to sustain three professional sports teams,” the application said.

I generally dislike franchise relocations and would rather see leagues expand to cities previously abandoned. But going forward, Roger Goodell is more interested in adding a franchise in London than anywhere stateside.

DandyDan

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 769
  • Age: 45
  • Location: Mason City Iowa
  • Last Login: Today at 01:55:43 AM
Re: Will St Louis get another football team?
« Reply #6 on: June 03, 2016, 06:55:13 AM »

I'm sure with the right stadium, owner and marketing plan, St. Louis could be a successful NFL market.  However, that is one of the few markets where the #1 team is the baseball team.  You'll see that with the Boston market once they decide to get rid of Belichick and Brady.  Frankly, I have a hard time thinking of another NFL team which isn't the favorite team in its market.
Logged
CHICAGO CUBS 2016 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS!!!!!

Thing 342

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 1166
  • you should really just relax

  • Age: 20
  • Location: NRV / HR, VA
  • Last Login: May 25, 2018, 07:30:15 AM
    • Thing 342's Road Photos
Re: Will St Louis get another football team?
« Reply #7 on: June 03, 2016, 07:38:32 AM »

I'm sure with the right stadium, owner and marketing plan, St. Louis could be a successful NFL market.  However, that is one of the few markets where the #1 team is the baseball team.  You'll see that with the Boston market once they decide to get rid of Belichick and Brady.  Frankly, I have a hard time thinking of another NFL team which isn't the favorite team in its market.
I would argue that the Braves were more popular than the Falcons for most of the 90s and early aughts.
Logged
Github: https://github.com/Thing342
Road Photos: http://wesj.org/roads/
Note: Insulting people is not a great way to get them to agree with you.

Max Rockatansky

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 6484
  • Location: Route 9, Sector 26
  • Last Login: Today at 11:07:11 AM
Re: Will St Louis get another football team?
« Reply #8 on: June 03, 2016, 09:03:21 AM »

I'm sure with the right stadium, owner and marketing plan, St. Louis could be a successful NFL market.  However, that is one of the few markets where the #1 team is the baseball team.  You'll see that with the Boston market once they decide to get rid of Belichick and Brady.  Frankly, I have a hard time thinking of another NFL team which isn't the favorite team in its market.
I would argue that the Braves were more popular than the Falcons for most of the 90s and early aughts.

What about NYC with the Yankees and Chicago with the Cubs?  It's not that football is unpopular in those markets but they aren't as popular as the baseball teams.  Hell you could argue that the hockey team is the biggest deal in Detroit or the basket team is in cities like L.A. or Phoenix.  Football isn't always going to be number one in a city just because it is nation wide.

jeffandnicole

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 8512
  • Age: 43
  • Location: South Jersey
  • Last Login: Today at 11:10:16 AM
Re: Will St Louis get another football team?
« Reply #9 on: June 03, 2016, 09:14:06 AM »

Generally, it depends on who's winning.  The baseball Cardinals are the 2nd most World Championship-winning franchise.  The Rams haven't been in the Superbowl in years.

Logged

dvferyance

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 893
  • Location: New Berlin WI
  • Last Login: May 25, 2018, 05:04:16 PM
Re: Will St Louis get another football team?
« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2016, 01:05:20 PM »

Generally, it depends on who's winning.  The baseball Cardinals are the 2nd most World Championship-winning franchise.  The Rams haven't been in the Superbowl in years.
They never even won one while in LA. Time will tell but I don't believe LA makes a good NFL market. We saw 2 teams leave there in one year. I highly doubt Columbus OH will ever have an NFL team. Columbus is a college sports town with Ohio state and Ohio already has 2 NFL teams as is. St Louis metro population ranks 19th not 26th as previously stated. I would say that's a fairly big market. Kronke only moved the team because of his ego and Godell just wanted a team in LA. If a new team was added in London yet another one would have to be added to keep an even number of teams.
Logged

SP Cook

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 1579
  • Last Login: May 26, 2018, 02:03:03 PM
Re: Will St Louis get another football team?
« Reply #11 on: June 03, 2016, 02:19:58 PM »

The way the NFL shares TV money means that a team can "work" anywhere. 

The unspoken NFL blackmail is that if a city with divert tax $$ from actual useful things like roads, schools, and hospitals and build a football stadium, it will get a team and the Super Bowl ONCE.  Some cities are smart enough to say no.

As to the baseball-football thing, certainly not only are the Reds far more popular than the Bengals in metro Cincinnati, the "Reds Country" regional footprint goes very much farther out.   
Logged

ET21

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 1726
  • Age: 26
  • Location: Chicagoland, USA
  • Last Login: May 25, 2018, 04:59:49 PM
Re: Will St Louis get another football team?
« Reply #12 on: June 03, 2016, 09:37:36 PM »

I'm sure with the right stadium, owner and marketing plan, St. Louis could be a successful NFL market.  However, that is one of the few markets where the #1 team is the baseball team.  You'll see that with the Boston market once they decide to get rid of Belichick and Brady.  Frankly, I have a hard time thinking of another NFL team which isn't the favorite team in its market.
I would argue that the Braves were more popular than the Falcons for most of the 90s and early aughts.

What about NYC with the Yankees and Chicago with the Cubs?  It's not that football is unpopular in those markets but they aren't as popular as the baseball teams.  Hell you could argue that the hockey team is the biggest deal in Detroit or the basket team is in cities like L.A. or Phoenix.  Football isn't always going to be number one in a city just because it is nation wide.

Blackhawks are the hottest ticket. But due to their early dropout this year, both baseball teams (White Sox and Cubs) have seen good ratings thanks to their hot starts. It depends on the time of year. Come September, it'll be the Bears and Cubs
Logged
The local weatherman, trust me I can be 99.9% right!
"Show where your going, without forgetting where your from"

Clinched:
IL: I-88, I-180, I-190, I-290, I-294, I-355, IL-390
IN: I-80, I-94
SD: I-190
WI: I-90, I-94
MI: I-94, I-196
MN: I-90

 


Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.