Practices unusual for your state

[kphoger]

To me I find it a bit odd.  If you are going to post a sign about a road danger, the sign should be in the language that most of the drivers understand.  And while in most of the US. English is sufficient, around the border they will post signs in Spanish (or French near parts of the Canadian border) so that foreign nationals driving in can understand the sign.

I would think that the Montreal area, and the roads leading to Montreal from Ontraio or New York, would have enough English-only tourists that it would probably make sense to have warning signs be signed in English as well.  Even if not required, it is probably a good idea.  And if a French-only law prohibits it, then the law should provide an exception for signs that provide a safety message.

It's not just foreign nationals who speak another language.  For example, looking at the map below, why shouldn't road signs in the Houston area (30—40% Spanish speaking) be bilingual?

Or, for that matter, why should street signs in Laredo be posted in English at all?

[mrsman]

To me I find it a bit odd.  If you are going to post a sign about a road danger, the sign should be in the language that most of the drivers understand.  And while in most of the US. English is sufficient, around the border they will post signs in Spanish (or French near parts of the Canadian border) so that foreign nationals driving in can understand the sign.

I would think that the Montreal area, and the roads leading to Montreal from Ontraio or New York, would have enough English-only tourists that it would probably make sense to have warning signs be signed in English as well.  Even if not required, it is probably a good idea.  And if a French-only law prohibits it, then the law should provide an exception for signs that provide a safety message.

It's not just foreign nationals who speak another language.  For example, looking at the map below, why shouldn't road signs in the Houston area (30—40% Spanish speaking) be bilingual?

Or, for that matter, why should street signs in Laredo be posted in English at all?

I am not sure if the map is necessarily getting to the point.

It seems like the map is telling you areas that are heavily Spanish speaking.  But it doesn't speak to whether those folks do not themselves speak English.

I could imagine that large parts of TX are bilingual, as opposed to Spanish-only.

[kphoger]

I could imagine that large parts of TX are bilingual, as opposed to Spanish-only.

Quite likely.

But let's take Webb County specifically (Laredo).  Here is the 2000 census data for residents over age five:

8.1% – English only
44.2% – Spanish, speak English less than very well

That's nearly half the population (44.4% total) who aren't fluent in English.

[kphoger]

For what it's worth, Harris County (Houston) had 15.2% reporting "Spanish, speak English less than very well".

[andrepoiy]

I would think that the Montreal area, and the roads leading to Montreal from Ontraio or New York, would have enough English-only tourists that it would probably make sense to have warning signs be signed in English as well.  Even if not required, it is probably a good idea.  And if a French-only law prohibits it, then the law should provide an exception for signs that provide a safety message.

In Quebec, there are some signs that are in English at the border, one of them includes "Radar detectors prohibited".

However, pictograms are generally used.

I found this article where somebody lobbied for bilingual signs, and they got pictograms instead:
https://globalnews.ca/news/4441278/quebec-replace-french-highway-signs-pictograms/

[J N Winkler]

The stylized fact is that bilingual signs tend to be less about accommodating speakers of a given language who may be in a minority locally (say, English speakers in Mexico or Québec) and more about navigating to a political settlement where speakers of a given language do not feel that a competing language is expanding its base of speakers at their expense.

French speakers in Québec have traditionally felt embattled since the empirical observation, dating back to the 1970's, is that children are more likely to learn English than French unless the latter is clearly established as the regional default.  This is why bilingualism is actively discouraged in the province, despite being formerly the norm in Montréal and other areas with large numbers of native English speakers that also attract English-speaking tourists.  It is also why portions of Ontario that formerly had monolingual English signs are now signed bilingually--it is part of reassuring the franco-ontarien population that it is viable to use French in a majority English-speaking province.

As for accommodating English-speaking foreign visitors to Québec, the official line from MTQ is that this is done through the permanent signs relying on symbols.  Indeed, any permanent signs you see with word messages only are specifically disallowed (the standard example is "Lentement" on a yellow diamond, occasionally seen in the wild but not to be found anywhere in the MTQ's sign catalogue).  There is also an expectation that tourists arriving from abroad will do some research into word messages they might encounter on temporary signs or supplementary plates before they travel, just as they currently do before going to countries like Germany where the road system generally does not provide bilingual accommodation to English speakers.  ("Anlieger frei," anyone?)

Another example is Wales, which has had bilingual signs since the mid-1960's.  It has never been seriously argued that Welsh speakers couldn't cope with English-only signs.  However, before bilingual signing was introduced, the Welsh speaker base was shrinking and new English-only signs were often vandalized.  With bilingual signs (and official support for bilingualism in other spheres of public life), Welsh is no longer in decline and sign vandalism is essentially negligible.

[ethanhopkin14]

To me I find it a bit odd.  If you are going to post a sign about a road danger, the sign should be in the language that most of the drivers understand.  And while in most of the US. English is sufficient, around the border they will post signs in Spanish (or French near parts of the Canadian border) so that foreign nationals driving in can understand the sign.

I would think that the Montreal area, and the roads leading to Montreal from Ontraio or New York, would have enough English-only tourists that it would probably make sense to have warning signs be signed in English as well.  Even if not required, it is probably a good idea.  And if a French-only law prohibits it, then the law should provide an exception for signs that provide a safety message.

It's not just foreign nationals who speak another language.  For example, looking at the map below, why shouldn't road signs in the Houston area (30—40% Spanish speaking) be bilingual?

Or, for that matter, why should street signs in Laredo be posted in English at all?

The Streets of Laredo?

[kphoger]

The Streets of Laredo?

[bwana39]

To me I find it a bit odd.  If you are going to post a sign about a road danger, the sign should be in the language that most of the drivers understand.  And while in most of the US. English is sufficient, around the border they will post signs in Spanish (or French near parts of the Canadian border) so that foreign nationals driving in can understand the sign.

I would think that the Montreal area, and the roads leading to Montreal from Ontraio or New York, would have enough English-only tourists that it would probably make sense to have warning signs be signed in English as well.  Even if not required, it is probably a good idea.  And if a French-only law prohibits it, then the law should provide an exception for signs that provide a safety message.

It's not just foreign nationals who speak another language.  For example, looking at the map below, why shouldn't road signs in the Houston area (30—40% Spanish speaking) be bilingual?

Or, for that matter, why should street signs in Laredo be posted in English at all?

The Streets of Laredo?

I had a young woman working for me part time. She was a college student 20 more or less. She was from Mission (TX), she LOOKED Hispanic. Her surname was Hispanic. She spoke not a word of Spanish. Her blond blue eyed boyfriend was fluent. He said it wasn't just an act. Lucy spoke NO Spanish.   So I think your generalization is a little extreme.

[bwana39]

Route markers painted/applied to the pavement is something Georgia never did until about 8 years ago. Georgia still doesn't use them regularly (compared to e.g. TX, OH, NC), and I don't think I've seen them outside the Atlanta area.

In Texas they aren't used much outside of the Atlanta -sized cities.

[Mr Kite]

The UK's not big on cloverleaf interchanges. Or mast arm traffic signals.

[fillup420]

North Carolina seems to have an adversion to dedicated passing lanes on 2-lane highways. The only times I have seen passing lanes used regularly is in the mountains, and even still they are used conservatively. Down east, I have driven many 2-lane NC state highways, and i have yet to find a passing lane anywhere.

[Mapmikey]

North Carolina seems to have an adversion to dedicated passing lanes on 2-lane highways. The only times I have seen passing lanes used regularly is in the mountains, and even still they are used conservatively. Down east, I have driven many 2-lane NC state highways, and i have yet to find a passing lane anywhere.

US 17 used to have these between Wilmington and Jacksonville until the early 80s.

Don't recall any on any other routes I was familiar with back then.

[ran4sh]

North Carolina seems to have an adversion to dedicated passing lanes on 2-lane highways. The only times I have seen passing lanes used regularly is in the mountains, and even still they are used conservatively. Down east, I have driven many 2-lane NC state highways, and i have yet to find a passing lane anywhere.

I think it's not so much an aversion as it is that most of NC's major roads are already 4 lane. I.e. a road that is 2-lane with occasional passing lane in a different state, would instead be 4-lane in NC.

[Revive 755]

Not my state but anyways . . .

Trombone mast arm with a 5-section tower in Missouri.  Whats odder is that there used to be a doghouse instead of the tower.  It looks like the trombone design may have been to replace the previous, more standard mast arm, but Streetview makes it look like MoDOT is not replacing the trombone arm.

There's also another, newer trombone mast arm on MO 141 near Fenton.

[freebrickproductions]

Not my state but anyways . . .

Trombone mast arm with a 5-section tower in Missouri.  Whats odder is that there used to be a doghouse instead of the tower.  It looks like the trombone design may have been to replace the previous, more standard mast arm, but Streetview makes it look like MoDOT is not replacing the trombone arm.

There's also another, newer trombone mast arm on MO 141 near Fenton.

Slight quibble, those are truss arms, not trombone arms.

Here in Alabama, a practice unusual to this state would definitely be a full cloverleaf (none exist anymore, AFAIK), another would be the use of inline-5 signals instead of doghouses.

[Road Hog]

My observation is the second generation of immigrants is fully bilingual and the third generation mostly loses that and becomes fluent only in the local language. Maybe in a few places like South Texas, that gets attenuated somewhat because of the huge Latin population.

But I was told by a South Texan I used to work with that there was huge peer pressure in school to speak English only. As in "you'll get your ass kicked if you spoke Spanish."

[mrsman]

My observation is the second generation of immigrants is fully bilingual and the third generation mostly loses that and becomes fluent only in the local language. Maybe in a few places like South Texas, that gets attenuated somewhat because of the huge Latin population.

But I was told by a South Texan I used to work with that there was huge peer pressure in school to speak English only. As in "you'll get your ass kicked if you spoke Spanish."

From my own experiences, I would qualify that it is generally true if both parents speak the same foreign language.  Both of my father's parents were immigrants, from different countries that speak different languages.  My grandmother did not know my grandfather's language and vice versa.  They spoke broken English to each other, that eventually got better with time.  My father, a second generation, only spoke English and did not know either of his parents' native languages.

My mother is also an immigrant and her native language is different from the other two.  My father never spoke it.  I do speak my mother's language to a degree, but admittedly not very well.  If my father also spoke it, my skill in that language would be far better.

I am envious of most educated continental Europeans who seem to know how to speak at minimum three languages very well.

[vdeane]

I am envious of most educated continental Europeans who seem to know how to speak at minimum three languages very well.

I feel similarly with respect to bilingual French Canadians.  It's amazing to think that many people can speak so many languages, when I haven't even managed to master one other than English.