Does US 441 still exist within Great Smoky Mtns Nat'l Park?

[hbelkins]

I have been combing through the AASHTO archive, and despite the results of this poll so far, the documents I have found overwhelmingly support the idea that US 441 does not exist within the Park.  I have presented all of this evidence on a new webpage about all of the US routes that have various types of gaps; the US 441 section is about halfway down. 

In a few different letters, AASHO/AASHTO reiterated the fact that they do not have authority to designate a US route along a road that is not under the jurisdiction of one of its member state highway departments.  In the '70s the National Parks Service was pushing to have all numbered highways removed from all Parks.  But obviously since then, certain individual Parks have determined that it is still in their best interest to use US or state numbered routes for navigation.

One of the interesting discoveries was more detail about the reason NPS wanted the 441 designation removed.  Truck traffic was banned through the Park in 1968 (when I-40 opened), but truckers were still going through the Park, and when they were questioned they insisted that, because the road was marked as a US route, it was not actually a Park Road, and therefore NPS did not have the authority to keep commercial traffic out.

Yet US 209 from Bushkill, PA to Milford, PA ban commercial vehicles as it transits the Delaware Water Gap Recreation Area. Signs and the US Route still exist there.

Is there a technical difference between a NRA and a NP?

I think the commercial vehicle ban also applies to that section of TN 73 that runs west of Gatlinburg toward Cades Cove, which is not marked as TN 73 within the park.

Somewhere I have an old film-era photo that shows a sign somewhere near the Gatlinburg visitor's center that indicates "To South 441" pointing to the right and "To North 441/To East 73" pointing to the left that shows TN 73 in the old-style triangle that was used for all Tennessee state routes up until the early 1980s.

The photo actually survived when my attempt to renew the domain for millenniumhwy.net failed and someone bought up the domain.

[usends]

Is there a technical difference between a NRA and a NP?

My understanding is, it doesn't matter what specific kind of federal property it is, the relevant question is: who has authority over the road within the federal property?  If the road is not under the authority of the state highway department, then that puts the road outside of AASHTO's jurisdiction, which means AASHTO does not have the authority to commission or decommission the road as a US route.  So in roadman's example, if US 209 through DWGNRA is maintained by the Feds, and they wanted to decommission US 209 within the boundaries of DWGNRA, they would have that right, regardless whether or not AASHTO and/or PennDOT were on board.

[SEWIGuy]

I have been combing through the AASHTO archive, and despite the results of this poll so far, the documents I have found overwhelmingly support the idea that US 441 does not exist within the Park.  I have presented all of this evidence on a new webpage about all of the US routes that have various types of gaps; the US 441 section is about halfway down. 

In a few different letters, AASHO/AASHTO reiterated the fact that they do not have authority to designate a US route along a road that is not under the jurisdiction of one of its member state highway departments.  In the '70s the National Parks Service was pushing to have all numbered highways removed from all Parks.  But obviously since then, certain individual Parks have determined that it is still in their best interest to use US or state numbered routes for navigation.

One of the interesting discoveries was more detail about the reason NPS wanted the 441 designation removed.  Truck traffic was banned through the Park in 1968 (when I-40 opened), but truckers were still going through the Park, and when they were questioned they insisted that, because the road was marked as a US route, it was not actually a Park Road, and therefore NPS did not have the authority to keep commercial traffic out.

This was very interesting. Thank you. Enjoy your work.

[roadman65]

US 202 in New Jersey north of Morristown is maintained by the counties it transits, yet it's still a US route. Although Bergen County barely signs it and Passaic is no better at trailblazing it, it's still officially a US route.