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Atlanta

Started by Chris, January 28, 2009, 10:42:52 AM

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architect77

Quote from: Tomahawkin on April 07, 2021, 08:20:24 PM
Found out yesterday that work will began on replacing both the Covington HWY and Glenwood Rd. Bridges late this year. Both replacements will take 2-3 years and are the beginning stages of the 285 East express lane project in Dekalb county which IIRC will not be completed til 2028. That is too long of a construction project to just add 1 added lane in both directions on 285, IMO. Plus there will not be any express lane flyover ramps. The only ramps will only be limited to about 2-3 interchanges at bridges that GDOT plans to have ramps added...

I went to that open house meeting a couple of years ago. I think that I-285 East will have a lot of rebuilding of the general purpose lanes as they try to fit everything in the existing right of way. It's not just an adding of an express lane beside the existing roadway.

I say that because I remember seeing them planning for one general purpose lane to be 11' wide rather than 12' and I was like, no, don't do that for a rebuild that's gotta serve the next 50 years. Do it right and find or buy the extra space for the correct width.

I-85' used to have 5 wide luxurious lanes in Gwinnett until they painted the HOV lane into existence. 2 inner right lanes are now 11' wide and it's no longer pleasant to drive on I-85 because of that.


Tomahawkin

@architect77

Can they please add overhead lighting to 285? 285 has to be the busiest interstate in the country with little overhead lighting?

Finrod

Georgia desperately needs something that goes east-west north of Atlanta, besides I-285.  No matter whether it's called the Outer Perimeter or something else at another latitude, some kind of expressway between I-75 and I-85 needs to happen, and traffic is only going to get worse until then.
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architect77

Quote from: Finrod on April 09, 2021, 05:08:16 PM
Georgia desperately needs something that goes east-west north of Atlanta, besides I-285.  No matter whether it's called the Outer Perimeter or something else at another latitude, some kind of expressway between I-75 and I-85 needs to happen, and traffic is only going to get worse until then.

I'm sure I've posted this before but this is after lunch, weekday, Summer, basically at the time of least traffic on a typical day, and on the other side trucks sit in queue for 5-10 miles waiting to transition from I-85 Southbound to I-285 Westbound.

I can't believe the leaders of this state can live with this. Sadly I bet most Americans don't even realize that this chokepoint is because multiple state's traffic have no other way to get across Georgia. They just likely attribute it to big city congestion and brush it aside.

But its due to a very real inadequacy.

IMG_0324 by Stephen Edwards, on Flickr

Tomahawkin

@architect77

its the same way from 285 SB to 85 NB. Even on weekends that 3 lane flyover ramp is full with trucks, backups can start beyond P.I.B. That flyover is heavily stressed and I always wonder how the hell does it continuously hold that weight and stress without failing? i avoid that interchange like the plague

architect77

Quote from: Finrod on April 05, 2021, 04:08:56 AM
Quote from: architect77 on April 05, 2021, 12:04:36 AM
These convoluted interchanges wouldn't cost a billion each if another smaller freeway was offering connectivity and redundancy.

Tell it to the Atlanta mayor that nixed the idea of extending 400 south of I-85 with a tunnel ten years ago or so.

Well, that tunnel was part of another "too little too late" analysis done by an out of state consulting firm hired to assess Atlanta's mobility problems.

The tunnel wasn't a good idea nor all that realistic. Who would want to drive in a dark 9 mile tunnel in beautiful, sunny Atlanta? Unless it was an efficient almost duplicate of the downtown connector that didn't involve a lot of extra maneuvering to rejoin 75/85 then I doubt if enough traffic would be going to its end points to justify the cost or efforts.

Then in Atlanta you must think about if it would become a refuge for homeless people like overpasses downtown have become. Lots of liability issues for the city and state would be part of any tunnel idea.

An 18 wheeler knocked down an overhead gantry on the East wall of I-285 yesterday. I saw the photo on Dekalb Police website.
I wonder if this is the reason the overhead signs are made from many horizontal slats rather the big sheets of metal. All but the bottom slat had fallen off the gantry and I guess it's less weight potentially falling and injuring someone.

Tomahawkin

 I work in that area, literally 1/2 mile from that crash, near Emory Decatur hospital. Traffic was off the chain everywhere in the area, there is no excuse for many of the roads to just have 2 lanes and no designed MARTA bus stops where its not in the center of the road, impeding traffic and making it dangerous for pedrestrians. This is a citywide issue, especially in Midtown and has been for decades

Finrod

Quote from: architect77 on April 13, 2021, 03:54:04 PM
The tunnel wasn't a good idea nor all that realistic. Who would want to drive in a dark 9 mile tunnel in beautiful, sunny Atlanta? Unless it was an efficient almost duplicate of the downtown connector that didn't involve a lot of extra maneuvering to rejoin 75/85 then I doubt if enough traffic would be going to its end points to justify the cost or efforts.

I'm guessing you've never been on I-85 South approaching the Connector and seen the messageboard signs quoting more than 30 minutes to get to I-20.

The tunnel would be the hard part.  The easy part would be continuing the expressway to I-675 at I-285, like the original Atlanta freeway design had.  Then people from the south side could get to Buckhead and the Perimeter area without getting on either the Perimeter or the Connector, and vise-versa.
Internet member since 1987.

Hate speech is a nonsense concept; the truth is hate speech to those that hate the truth.

People who use their free speech to try to silence others' free speech are dangerous fools.

architect77

Quote from: Finrod on April 14, 2021, 07:08:44 AM
Quote from: architect77 on April 13, 2021, 03:54:04 PM
The tunnel wasn't a good idea nor all that realistic. Who would want to drive in a dark 9 mile tunnel in beautiful, sunny Atlanta? Unless it was an efficient almost duplicate of the downtown connector that didn't involve a lot of extra maneuvering to rejoin 75/85 then I doubt if enough traffic would be going to its end points to justify the cost or efforts.

I'm guessing you've never been on I-85 South approaching the Connector and seen the messageboard signs quoting more than 30 minutes to get to I-20.

The tunnel would be the hard part.  The easy part would be continuing the expressway to I-675 at I-285, like the original Atlanta freeway design had.  Then people from the south side could get to Buckhead and the Perimeter area without getting on either the Perimeter or the Connector, and vise-versa.

Yeah you're right. In terms of another option that parallels the connector, it would be very helpful.

I hope they eventually close about half of the exits downtown because that would reduce so much lane changing which grinds the whole interstate to a halt everyday.

Tomahawkin

Totally will Co-Sign, on closing some of the exits. IMO, the biggest problem on 75/85 southbound is the exit ramps to both IH 20 (east and west). That ramps starts backing up at 230 in the afternoons and is constantly backed up on weekends..

architect77

Quote from: Tomahawkin on April 23, 2021, 08:02:43 PM
Totally will Co-Sign, on closing some of the exits. IMO, the biggest problem on 75/85 southbound is the exit ramps to both IH 20 (east and west). That ramps starts backing up at 230 in the afternoons and is constantly backed up on weekends..

Another thing is that the connector Southbound is quite curvy almost to an unsafe extent at fast speeds.

Now for mw, I love it and it makes Atlanta traffic seem like a fast-paced big city when it's flowing well.

But on the weekends when all the out-of-staters drive in, it looks like bumper cars because they aren't used to our highways and do drive well at high speeds and are always trying to change lanes.

On Saturday I saw 2 accidents on the local streets happen in real time. It's always people for out of state.

Tomahawkin

Was in Alpharetta on Friday. Add Milton Parkway and Haynes Bridge road to the interchanges on 400 that need either a DDI or a major makeover with the toll lanes that are coming. I got reminded why I didn't move there 10 years ago. That traffic is on Par with 285 and Roswell Road in Sandy Springs. Oy!!!

roadman65

This is really weird.



Traveling I-20 west before Wesley Chapel Road you see the first guide for I-285.

Then drive past Wesley Chapel Road and you see this.


Both are 2 miles out from I-285 and both are westbound. 


Someone does not know math very well.
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

Tomahawkin

per the ajc. the 400/285 should be 80 percent complete by years end. it took long enough. i honestly think the 635 below grade toll lane project in Dallas took less time to build and is more efficient when you combine it with the hi-five interchange

JoeP2

Quote from: Tomahawkin on June 08, 2021, 07:20:26 PM
per the ajc. the 400/285 should be 80 percent complete by years end. it took long enough. i honestly think the 635 below grade toll lane project in Dallas took less time to build and is more efficient when you combine it with the hi-five interchange

Yeah, I worked in Dunwoody for years and had to deal with back ups trying to get on 285 West from Ashford Dunwoody because people already on 285 back up trying to get on 400 north.

Glad that change is happening even if I won't have that commute anymore.

Tomahawkin

I avoid Ashford Dunwoody like the plague, I don't think the interchange improvement will do much until both the 400 and 285 express lanes are built

Tom958

Quote from: Tomahawkin on June 08, 2021, 07:20:26 PM
per the ajc. the 400/285 should be 80 percent complete by years end. it took long enough. i honestly think the 635 below grade toll lane project in Dallas took less time to build and is more efficient when you combine it with the hi-five interchange

There's no way in hell that'll happen. They'll be doing great to get to that point by the end of 2022. Why do they tell people this crap?

Tom958

So, yesterday I was on GDOT's metro Atlanta Facebook page. They'd posted about an upcoming lane closure on 285 to address this rather alarming situation. I was at work, but it was late in the day and no one else had posted, so I posted something about my dislike for those LEFT tabs that are unfortunately mandated by the MUTCD. Someone replied-- a guy who designs signage for another DOT-- posted his disagreement with me, I posted back, mentioning how the APL's at that interchange were... non MUTCD-compliant. We had a nice little conversation going, which I wished to continue when I finished my drive home from work. However, when I arrived home and checked Facebook, my apparently-offensive post was gone, as well as my new pal's reply. Shortly thereafter, GDOT deleted the whole post. 

ran4sh

That's part of why I allow Facebook to email me all the notifications it can, including replies to comments and that sort of thing. I've had issues where FB and/or the group or the person creating the post decides to delete it, so it's nice to be able to go through my emails and see what was said.
Control cities CAN be off the route! Control cities make NO sense if signs end before the city is reached!

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Tom958

Quote from: ran4sh on June 15, 2021, 12:42:40 AM
That's part of why I allow Facebook to email me all the notifications it can, including replies to comments and that sort of thing. I've had issues where FB and/or the group or the person creating the post decides to delete it, so it's nice to be able to go through my emails and see what was said.

That's beside the point. the point is that GDOT's PR people should learn to engage reasonably with the public rather than, in this case, deleting the whole conversation. Wouldn't it have been wonderful if they'd replied, "Yes, we realize that those signs aren't what they should be. However, since the interchange will be reconfigured in the next few years, the decision has been made to leave them as-is." There. Was that so hard?

architect77

Quote from: Tom958 on June 11, 2021, 06:49:22 PM
So, yesterday I was on GDOT's metro Atlanta Facebook page. They'd posted about an upcoming lane closure on 285 to address this rather alarming situation. I was at work, but it was late in the day and no one else had posted, so I posted something about my dislike for those LEFT tabs that are unfortunately mandated by the MUTCD. Someone replied-- a guy who designs signage for another DOT-- posted his disagreement with me, I posted back, mentioning how the APL's at that interchange were... non MUTCD-compliant. We had a nice little conversation going, which I wished to continue when I finished my drive home from work. However, when I arrived home and checked Facebook, my apparently-offensive post was gone, as well as my new pal's reply. Shortly thereafter, GDOT deleted the whole post. 

I applaud you for having GDOT's attention at all. They don't have systems in place do cover basic maintenance, aND if I'm wrong, they should be called out for deliberate discrimination by avoising basic maintenance in Black and Hispanic areas of the Atlanta metro.

I saw on GMA one morning an interview withe the GDOT employee who was putting the clever pandemic messages on the freeway message boards.

I emailed her at GDOT and requested she do an anti-littering campaign. A couple of months later, I see on the message boards, "Keep the roads clear, We don't litter Here".

It was exactly the tone I wanted, to invoke a sense of pride in where we live and that litter was making a poor reflection on citizens as well as the city.

I just did a 900 mile round trip to Wilmington, Raleigh Charlotte and back to Atlanta.

The new section of I-85 North is fine except the all concrete median has a continuous line of trash and debris for miles going Northbound.

GDOT pairs litter pickup with mowing, but the medians of i-75 and I-85 need much more frequent cleanup.

As for NC, they have a lot of maintenance needs across the state with many damaged signs etc. There are few sections of I-85 that remain 4 lanes, about 40 miles between Durham and the VA State line, about !5 at the SC State line, and only an 8 mile stretch between Durham and the merging of I-40/ I-85 duplex.

That 30-40 mile duplex through Burlington to Greensboro took almost a whopping 10 years to build in the 90s because of being an active highway during construction.

What was most impressive was the stretch South of Greensboro through Charlotte which is now 8 lanes of all concrete pavement and it's just I-85 not a duplex of two interstates. That redeemed NCDOT in my eyes.

I-95 is for out of state traffic and of lesser importance for NC residents but now is finally being rebuilt with several sections totaling I guess around 60 miles or so being widened to 8 lanes.

architect77

Quote from: Tom958 on June 11, 2021, 06:49:22 PM
So, yesterday I was on GDOT's metro Atlanta Facebook page. They'd posted about an upcoming lane closure on 285 to address this rather alarming situation. I was at work, but it was late in the day and no one else had posted, so I posted something about my dislike for those LEFT tabs that are unfortunately mandated by the MUTCD. Someone replied-- a guy who designs signage for another DOT-- posted his disagreement with me, I posted back, mentioning how the APL's at that interchange were... non MUTCD-compliant. We had a nice little conversation going, which I wished to continue when I finished my drive home from work. However, when I arrived home and checked Facebook, my apparently-offensive post was gone, as well as my new pal's reply. Shortly thereafter, GDOT deleted the whole post. 

The issue of the left tabs is all part of a bigger issue of using the size and shape of overheads to convey information without words and the importance of upcoming exits.

GDOT has never grasped that notion and did the opposite by wanting to use one tall and narrow sign size for all  exits which requires more time to understand and process the info.

One of the worst examples is this at I-75 Northbound at I-285. All of the signs are the same size, and there is no hierarchy of importance of the exits, and also the text sizes are multiple sizes and letter spacing is inconsistent.

I swear I believe our big airport precludes Atlantans and GDOT decision makers from driving through other parts of the country and they are literally oblivious to how much better other states can build and maintain highways. Such a shame.

At the bottom is US401 overheads just north of Raleigh at the interchange of its Outerloop which is bout 60% complete and when finished will have a toll for over half of the ~65 mile loop.

I wish Georgia would have overheads on non-interstate highways and especially at interstate junctions (if they would cantilever and not lean in one direction or the other).


3 by Stephen Edwards, on Flickr

540 by Stephen Edwards, on Flickr

Tomahawkin

The New exit at 285 and 400/Glenridge road that just opened is FUBAR! Traffic still backs up to the main lanes of 285, causing instant slowdowns and even accidents on a Sunday. This new interchange is going to be a band aid on a bullet wound. The temporary improvements aren't doing much to ease Traffic there. The New interchange is underbuilt. Should have made it like the High 5 stack in Dallas

ukfan758

#623
I really hope that sometime in the future they expand the I-75 express lanes so that each direction has their own instead of this reversible mess, especially on the south end. 75 through McDonough and Locust Grove is an absolute disaster going northbound during the afternoon/evening hours, even on weekends. Those lanes should also be expanded to south of Locust Grove, preferably to around the LG Griffin Rd overpass.

Tomahawkin

No Argument here. I hate the the Southside express lanes only operate in 1 direction. Especially on weekends when both directions can be seriously conjested because of the Traffic to and from Florida. I couldn't have imagined what the traffic was like down there for the race. I used to stay in that area and on weekends, I would not leave the house if it was a race weekend...



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