I, even though think that WDW and DL are both way too expensive and do not wish to piss away money on what many come to love, they still have interesting rides and attractions. Some, even though are to be secret, its really no secret such as Peppers Ghost effects in the Haunted Mansion and such.
One secret I found out (that is not well hidden lol) is the stretch room in the haunted attractions in both Orlando and Anaheim. In Florida the ceiling gets raised during the quick show, while in California the floor gets lowered to give the room stretching effect. Plus the mantle moves as well at half the speed the floor (or ceiling in WDW) moves to give the proportion needed to keep the mantle in the middle of the wall still in center after the distance between the floor and ceiling becomes greater.
However, the main reason for the concept of the stretch room actually came about because of Disneyland's small size and that it was not an original 1955 attraction, but opened in 1969 some 14 years later. Disney, to keep park guests from seeing the City of Anaheim during their visit, built a berm which is the grade of the circular Disneyland Railroad. When the Haunted attraction was built there was no room inside the berm for the attraction, so it was built outside it. Therefore to get the guests across the railroad grade, they built a tunnel under it, but to get the guests of that particular attraction there they needed a way to get them down 18 feet to accomplish this feat. So rather than use a plain old elevator, they conceived the stretch room with the floor lowering the guests the needed elevation to enter the tunnel (which is disguised as the hall of pictures inside the mansion attraction).
Being the elevator room became a great hit, they duplicated it in WDW, but because they did not need to get guests under grade, they did not need an elevator to do it, so the ceiling gets raised instead. Walt Disney World has all the room it needs to expand and add on if need be, unlike the original park.
I find for myself that discoveries like this are quite fascinating and to me the science end of the attractions are more appealing that the experience of the attractions unlike many people who love the effects. Too bad the Journey into Inner Space was closed to allow for Star Tours as I always wondered how they gave the illusion to the people on the omnimover were shrinking inside a giant microscope as I remember that one vaguely as a youngster back in 1968.
What attractions do many of you find appealing either to ride or the engineering aspect of it?
I do find the Orwellian nature of Lake Buena Vista being incorporated as a City intriguing.
Ive been on Big Thunder Mountain in Disneyland California. Its very fun and I often question how its physically possible for such a ride to exist and be considered safe.
My wife and I enjoyed the MK version of Big Thunder more than Disneyland's, but on the other hand we thought the Disneyland versions of Splash Mountain and Space Mountain were better, and we thought the Seven Dwarves' Mine Train was kind of dull.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 19, 2019, 12:23:52 AM
I do find the Orwellian nature of Lake Buena Vista being incorporated as a City intriguing.
Creeps me the hell out, and it's one of the things I point to whenever people question my reluctance to engage with Disney-owned companies. I don't even think that's the only town in Florida they own, is it?
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 19, 2019, 01:13:00 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 19, 2019, 12:23:52 AM
I do find the Orwellian nature of Lake Buena Vista being incorporated as a City intriguing.
Creeps me the hell out, and it's one of the things I point to whenever people question my reluctance to engage with Disney-owned companies. I don't even think that's the only town in Florida they own, is it?
They also own neighboring Bay Lake, which is actually where all four parks are located even though their mailing addresses are Lake Buena Vista. I also was always a bit creeped out by the whole Epcot thing, and I'm glad it just became a theme park instead of the Disney-owned city of 20k it was originally envisioned as.
I have been watching videos of that stretch room, and the construction of it is remarkable to make the thing work. The walls are telescopic and move at different speeds to give it the stretch effect. The vertical stripes on the wallpaper on the upper walls allows for it to move undetected as having them horizontal or a pattern would show movement to the eyes.
Also the reason why all are to step into the center so you cannot touch the wood paneling on the lower walls as they move up from the floor as the floor moves down. Plus what is even more interesting is the fact that even though the floor and walls are independent of each other the hydraulic cylinder beneath the floor that pulls it down is the driving mechanism of the walls too! The walls move down too with the floor as only the ceiling in Disneyland is stationary. Obviously a torque mechanism allows for the pieces to move at different speeds while all generally moving.
I am guessing at this, but to achieve the effect of the elevator doorway getting taller is that the frame around the door is attached to the walls of the room and are partially hidden beneath the floor when the room is at the upper (ground) floor while the inside elevator doors are long to begin with. When you first board the elevator the door extends upward behind the wall above the doorway. As the floor drops and the walls drop at a slower speed it begins to extend the elevator door frame upward revealing the hidden part of the door slowly until the elevator gets to the basement at which point the whole door is exposed and the walls of the room are completely exposed too giving the whole room a stretched look.
If you think about it being that the room has paneling on the bottom and wallpaper on top that start out at a certain distance in length for both parts, then to have the perfect effect you must extend both in proportion to each other or have an unbalanced effect which would be ineffective. If the mantle (which separates the two wall pieces) is a third of the way up from the floor to the ceiling then it would have to remain that even when extended as well. If the upper part of the wall only expanded the bottom would then stay the same making it look like only the ceiling and upper walls only moved and not looking like the entire room expanded.
I have to say a great mind figured this one out and made a simple elevator ride into such an attraction by using simple means.
Quote from: US 89 on September 19, 2019, 01:17:22 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 19, 2019, 01:13:00 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 19, 2019, 12:23:52 AM
I do find the Orwellian nature of Lake Buena Vista being incorporated as a City intriguing.
Creeps me the hell out, and it's one of the things I point to whenever people question my reluctance to engage with Disney-owned companies. I don't even think that's the only town in Florida they own, is it?
They also own neighboring Bay Lake, which is actually where all four parks are located even though their mailing addresses are Lake Buena Vista. I also was always a bit creeped out by the whole Epcot thing, and I'm glad it just became a theme park instead of the Disney-owned city of 20k it was originally envisioned as.
The whole Midgar/Delta City idea with Epcot is really bizarre. Apparently you would Park your car at a perimeter station and take a monorail to the "core" of the futurist urban living zone. I'm to understand Epcot was to be constructed in such a way that all your needs could be met without leaving.
But that said Florida does have other Parks that somehow are cities; Weeki Wachee comes to mind also out on US 19.
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 19, 2019, 01:13:00 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 19, 2019, 12:23:52 AM
I do find the Orwellian nature of Lake Buena Vista being incorporated as a City intriguing.
Creeps me the hell out, and it's one of the things I point to whenever people question my reluctance to engage with Disney-owned companies. I don't even think that's the only town in Florida they own, is it?
I believe Disney developed the nearby town of Celebration, Florida, but divested themselves of most of their interest and involvement.
I think the aspect of the original EPCOT concept that creeped me out was the idea that city personnel would have access to your living space to make "improvements"–for example, multiple stories about the concept talk about how you might come home from work to find all new appliances in your unit. It made me wonder at what point they'd have started making rules about certain things being contraband–for example, it's not hard to envision them prohibiting consumption of beer or liquor–and then searching your unit for those things in order to confiscate them. I can't help but picturing those video screens in
1984 that allowed the authorities to watch everything people did in their homes.
Oh Walt is probably rolling over in his grave that his dreams never came true.
Celebration BTW is a master planned community, but people own their property and Disney has no jurisdiction over them. Osceola County maintains the services and roads and I believe KUA provides power and water to the development and not RDIC like Bay Lake and Lake Buena Vista.
Yes Disney not only owns ESPN or ABC, but in fact owns two towns incorporated in Florida to make it all creepy.
Disney civics:
The main difference between Disneyland and WDW is that Disneyland is surrounded by town. It is impossible to maintain the illusion if you look in the wrong direction and there are 100s of non-Disney hotels and restaurants across the street. WDW is huge and many, if not most, visitors are semi-trapped on the property for a week, not just going to the parks but staying and eating as well.
Understand that when Disney showed up, Orlando was a poor area of old people trailer parks and agriculture. Disney knew this, and having bought up a huge amount of land in secret, told the state they could have what they wanted, or sell it back to the farmers and move on.
They got what they wanted. Which is 3 political entities.
The main one is the Reedy Creek Improvement District, or RCID. It has, pretty much, the powers of a county, and frees Disney from taxes and regulations. Of roads interest, it builds all the roads inside RCID, which is why they get away with the whimsical non-standard road signage. Its board is made up of 5 senior Disney employees, each of which own 5 acres of swampland. They are the only owners of land in RCID besides Disney itself. They have their own fire and rescue, pay the state and the two counties for police work, do their own health inspections, approve their own construction permits, and so on.
The other two entities are the towns of Bay Lake and Lake Buena Vista. In which much about 30 much lower level Disney employees rent mobile home parking sports from the company (meaning they vote in the town elections, but not for RCID board). These people vote for a town government that gives Disney the powers of a town, and more importantly, keep any other towns from annexing the property.
Celebration is a different story. It is a (mostly failed) upper-middle class housing development. Disney took the property out of the RCID because it did not want to risk losing control of RCID, nor provide services to Celebration. It is nothing more than just another central Florida housing development. It did not do well because it is fairly poorly located for the types of jobs that a person would have to have to afford to live there due to the traffic; had poorly built houses; and really bad hippy-dippy new age schools. Disney no longer owns any part of the place, except for the POTS phone company and the electric utility. (Back in the day when POTS was all there was, Disney had its own phones in its hotels and pay phones in the parks, which were the "Lake Buena Vista Phone Company" seperate from Southern Bell, and long distance to everywhere, including Orlando.)
As to the parks, everybody should go if they have kids at each of the kids' different stages of life. I am past that now, so I doubt I shall ever see it again.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 19, 2019, 12:23:52 AM
I do find the Orwellian nature of Lake Buena Vista being incorporated as a City intriguing.
I had little idea of the story of LBV's origins as a community until I had to work with behind-the-scenes support while setting up telecommunications for a convention.
I had to design and implement voice and data support for 800 execs for one of the Big 3 auto companies for a 4-day strategy meeting in WDW. The planning meetings were at one of the resort hotels. It became evident to me during one of them that the phone company team, the hotel staff, the convention center coordinator and everyone else in the room except me was a WDW employee in one fashion or another. Fun fact: All of them had the standard Disney name badges, even the phone company manager. He filled me in on the Reedy Creek Improvement District history while giving me a tour of WDW's telephone central office (also Disney-owned, LKBNFLXB for those familiar with CLLI codes).
Quote from: 1995hoo on September 19, 2019, 09:54:22 AM
I think the aspect of the original EPCOT concept that creeped me out was the idea that city personnel would have access to your living space to make "improvements"–for example, multiple stories about the concept talk about how you might come home from work to find all new appliances in your unit.
I don't think it ever went past the "idea phase"; Sci-Fi whimsy, lots of media presentation and fanfare, but nothing more. There was Celebration - more trouble than they'd planned for - which is just one big Home Owner's Association. There's been no other types of this kind of Disney development other than more hotels, which affords them more control over people's actions and certainly their wallets.
Disney fanatics (and foes) have a habit of making more out of Walt's visions which never really saw the light of day.
We still wind up at WDW roughly once a year, but I can't stomach more than a (three-day) weekend of it anymore. Sure, I enjoy a Dole Whip, a waltz through the Haunted Mansion, riding the Thunder/Space Mountians, geek out for the Star Tours, and enjoy a nighttime parade with a decent vantage point. Cooling off in the Carousel of Progress is a reminder of our past, and the line is never long. And despite the tackiness of it all, photography is still a lot of fun there.
But the transportation system is overloaded in places, there's lots of attractions which have sadly disappeared, the waiting lines are longer, the rules and regulations are more constrained. It all costs more than ever before, as every experience has become further monetized and options have to be meticulously planned out in advance. Much of this seems like less of a vacation.
The kids are getting older, and are starting to prefer more than just theme parks with their spare time. After many Mondays and Fridays spent waiting on lines and dealing with crowds, I'm less inclined to actually enjoy doing anything more than being at the pool or getting some rest.
Quote from: SP Cook on September 19, 2019, 10:47:38 AM
Understand that when Disney showed up, Orlando was a poor area of old people trailer parks and agriculture. Disney knew this, and having bought up a huge amount of land in secret, told the state they could have what they wanted, or sell it back to the farmers and move on.
They got what they wanted. Which is 3 political entities.
The main one is the Reedy Creek Improvement District, or RCID. It has, pretty much, the powers of a county, and frees Disney from taxes and regulations. Of roads interest, it builds all the roads inside RCID, which is why they get away with the whimsical non-standard road signage. Its board is made up of 5 senior Disney employees, each of which own 5 acres of swampland. They are the only owners of land in RCID besides Disney itself. They have their own fire and rescue, pay the state and the two counties for police work, do their own health inspections, approve their own construction permits, and so on.
This right here is what gives me the heebie-jeebies. Disney has an interest in ensuring their health, building, etc. inspections come out good. And they're the ones doing the inspections. Why, Disney restaurants always get 100% on RCID health department inspections? Obviously
that's on the level!
Quote from: 1995hoo on September 19, 2019, 09:54:22 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 19, 2019, 01:13:00 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 19, 2019, 12:23:52 AM
I do find the Orwellian nature of Lake Buena Vista being incorporated as a City intriguing.
Creeps me the hell out, and it's one of the things I point to whenever people question my reluctance to engage with Disney-owned companies. I don't even think that's the only town in Florida they own, is it?
I believe Disney developed the nearby town of Celebration, Florida, but divested themselves of most of their interest and involvement.
I think the aspect of the original EPCOT concept that creeped me out was the idea that city personnel would have access to your living space to make "improvements"–for example, multiple stories about the concept talk about how you might come home from work to find all new appliances in your unit. It made me wonder at what point they'd have started making rules about certain things being contraband–for example, it's not hard to envision them prohibiting consumption of beer or liquor–and then searching your unit for those things in order to confiscate them. I can't help but picturing those video screens in 1984 that allowed the authorities to watch everything people did in their homes.
I would probably be ok with this if they made it well known that all of this could happen. At that point, it's pretty much like a reality TV show where you expect your life will be monitored and impacted 24/7.
Of course, people don't like reading the fine print. Hell, people don't like reading the big, bold headline. So even if they were ok with it at first, they will probably grow tired of wondering what they will be told to do next...or what would be done for them next.
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 19, 2019, 12:59:57 PM
This right here is what gives me the heebie-jeebies. Disney has an interest in ensuring their health, building, etc. inspections come out good. And they're the ones doing the inspections. Why, Disney restaurants always get 100% on RCID health department inspections? Obviously that's on the level!
One well known issue is whenever there's a significant injury or death at a Disney-owned park in Florida, Disney does their own investigation, not the state. To be fair, in many states, the finding is usually quickly determined to be rider error and the ride will probably reopen in very short time. But that's an independent state authority doing the investigation, and many states are pretty thorough in ride safety.
But when Disney is inspecting Disney? Don't expect much in the way of a public review and finding, and the pre-written summary probably already has the death attributed to the rider. They'll simply fill in the name and date it, and everything will be fine tomorrow.
Quote from: 1995hoo on September 19, 2019, 09:54:22 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 19, 2019, 01:13:00 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 19, 2019, 12:23:52 AM
I do find the Orwellian nature of Lake Buena Vista being incorporated as a City intriguing.
Creeps me the hell out, and it's one of the things I point to whenever people question my reluctance to engage with Disney-owned companies. I don't even think that's the only town in Florida they own, is it?
I believe Disney developed the nearby town of Celebration, Florida, but divested themselves of most of their interest and involvement.
I think the aspect of the original EPCOT concept that creeped me out was the idea that city personnel would have access to your living space to make "improvements"–for example, multiple stories about the concept talk about how you might come home from work to find all new appliances in your unit. It made me wonder at what point they'd have started making rules about certain things being contraband–for example, it's not hard to envision them prohibiting consumption of beer or liquor–and then searching your unit for those things in order to confiscate them. I can't help but picturing those video screens in 1984 that allowed the authorities to watch everything people did in their homes.
What comes around, goes around, I guess. Pullman, Ford, and others did this at the end of the 19th/beginning of the 20th century.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pullman_Company
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Ford (see Five Dollar Day section)
Quote from: Brandon on September 19, 2019, 04:35:45 PMWhat comes around, goes around, I guess. Pullman, Ford, and others did this at the end of the 19th/beginning of the 20th century.
Goes back older than that: model villages (no not [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bekonscot]tiny replicas of towns (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Model_village))[/url] are the ones mostly dating from the early-to-mid 19th century
The oldest model village (New Lanark (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Lanark)) was where Dr Livingstone was born. Saltaire (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saltaire) is additionally a World Heritage Site. But the most famous is Bournville (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bournville) as the name the chocolate company there gave its dark chocolate is the name of the village.
Quote from: SP Cook on September 19, 2019, 10:47:38 AM
Understand that when Disney showed up, Orlando was a poor area of old people trailer parks and agriculture. Disney knew this, and having bought up a huge amount of land in secret, told the state they could have what they wanted, or sell it back to the farmers and move on.
That's another thing that bothered me about Disney World: how the land was obtained in the first place. Essentially Disney created a bunch of random sub-companies to buy up the land in secret, and even the real estate agents negotiating these purchases didn't know who they were working for. In fact, when word of these massive land purchases first got out, the general speculation was that NASA was behind them given Orlando's proximity to the KSC.
Quote from: US 89 on September 20, 2019, 02:17:00 PM
Quote from: SP Cook on September 19, 2019, 10:47:38 AM
Understand that when Disney showed up, Orlando was a poor area of old people trailer parks and agriculture. Disney knew this, and having bought up a huge amount of land in secret, told the state they could have what they wanted, or sell it back to the farmers and move on.
That's another thing that bothered me about Disney World: how the land was obtained in the first place. Essentially Disney created a bunch of random sub-companies to buy up the land in secret, and even the real estate agents negotiating these purchases didn't know who they were working for. In fact, when word of these massive land purchases first got out, the general speculation was that NASA was behind them given Orlando's proximity to the KSC.
Who cares? It was mostly fallow, unpopulated swampland to begin with. The story goes that if anyone found out, they'd probably pay much more for the land. If there really were several dummy corporations vying for nearby land, then they should have tried to make them bid for it...after all, "competitors" existed. So, thinking about it after the fact, Disney could have had their plan backfire. But there wasn't much there at the time, so I'm sure they made it up selling parcels to every hotel, restaurant, and gift shop proprietor over the next decade.
Nowadays, there would be a little more concern over wetland-destruction impact and stormwater discharge.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on September 19, 2019, 01:11:48 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on September 19, 2019, 09:54:22 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 19, 2019, 01:13:00 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on September 19, 2019, 12:23:52 AM
I do find the Orwellian nature of Lake Buena Vista being incorporated as a City intriguing.
Creeps me the hell out, and it's one of the things I point to whenever people question my reluctance to engage with Disney-owned companies. I don't even think that's the only town in Florida they own, is it?
I believe Disney developed the nearby town of Celebration, Florida, but divested themselves of most of their interest and involvement.
I think the aspect of the original EPCOT concept that creeped me out was the idea that city personnel would have access to your living space to make "improvements"–for example, multiple stories about the concept talk about how you might come home from work to find all new appliances in your unit. It made me wonder at what point they'd have started making rules about certain things being contraband–for example, it's not hard to envision them prohibiting consumption of beer or liquor–and then searching your unit for those things in order to confiscate them. I can't help but picturing those video screens in 1984 that allowed the authorities to watch everything people did in their homes.
I would probably be ok with this if they made it well known that all of this could happen. At that point, it's pretty much like a reality TV show where you expect your life will be monitored and impacted 24/7.
....
Sure, I agree with that. I didn't mean to imply I was creeped out by it because I viewed it as some sinister thing they were going to spring on unsuspecting people. Rather, I find it creepy for the reasons I stated and those reasons would have been sufficient for me to decline to move there had the city become a reality and had I had the opportunity to live in it.
Quote from: US 89 on September 20, 2019, 02:17:00 PM
Quote from: SP Cook on September 19, 2019, 10:47:38 AM
Understand that when Disney showed up, Orlando was a poor area of old people trailer parks and agriculture. Disney knew this, and having bought up a huge amount of land in secret, told the state they could have what they wanted, or sell it back to the farmers and move on.
That's another thing that bothered me about Disney World: how the land was obtained in the first place. Essentially Disney created a bunch of random sub-companies to buy up the land in secret, and even the real estate agents negotiating these purchases didn't know who they were working for. In fact, when word of these massive land purchases first got out, the general speculation was that NASA was behind them given Orlando's proximity to the KSC.
Trying to conceal your identity when buying up land is hardly unique to Disney. Charles Ebbets did the same thing when he bought up the land in Flatbush (in an area then known as "Pigtown" that he found ideal because nine trolley lines converged there) to build the Brooklyn Dodgers' ballpark that came to bear his name.
Quote from: formulanone on September 20, 2019, 02:21:52 PM
Quote from: US 89 on September 20, 2019, 02:17:00 PM
Quote from: SP Cook on September 19, 2019, 10:47:38 AM
Understand that when Disney showed up, Orlando was a poor area of old people trailer parks and agriculture. Disney knew this, and having bought up a huge amount of land in secret, told the state they could have what they wanted, or sell it back to the farmers and move on.
That's another thing that bothered me about Disney World: how the land was obtained in the first place. Essentially Disney created a bunch of random sub-companies to buy up the land in secret, and even the real estate agents negotiating these purchases didn't know who they were working for. In fact, when word of these massive land purchases first got out, the general speculation was that NASA was behind them given Orlando's proximity to the KSC.
Who cares? It was mostly fallow, unpopulated swampland to begin with.
The previous owners of that land cared.
Would you care if someone came to buy your land, only to find out later the company may have been willing to pay 5 times as much?
Quote from: jeffandnicole on September 21, 2019, 06:17:32 AM
Quote from: formulanone on September 20, 2019, 02:21:52 PM
Quote from: US 89 on September 20, 2019, 02:17:00 PM
Quote from: SP Cook on September 19, 2019, 10:47:38 AM
Understand that when Disney showed up, Orlando was a poor area of old people trailer parks and agriculture. Disney knew this, and having bought up a huge amount of land in secret, told the state they could have what they wanted, or sell it back to the farmers and move on.
That's another thing that bothered me about Disney World: how the land was obtained in the first place. Essentially Disney created a bunch of random sub-companies to buy up the land in secret, and even the real estate agents negotiating these purchases didn't know who they were working for. In fact, when word of these massive land purchases first got out, the general speculation was that NASA was behind them given Orlando's proximity to the KSC.
Who cares? It was mostly fallow, unpopulated swampland to begin with.
The previous owners of that land cared.
Would you care if someone came to buy your land, only to find out later the company may have been willing to pay 5 times as much?
I'm sure people in Vineland cared a lot, Disney essentially drove that community into ghost town status. A lot of people really also advocated for protection of the Green Swamp much like the Everglades.
What is more interesting is that the two entities that Disney's Reedy Creek Improvement District run, Bay Lake and Lake Buena Vista are both chartered with the state as actually incorporated towns. So after all this they (the Disney Company) run two town in the State of Florida.
Also 45 square miles of land is a big feat for any company to accomplish. Although Disney himself envisioned it for something else at the time, it was not planned to be a vacation city, but what the models show on the defunct peoplemover ride in Disneyland and the still operating counterpart in Disney World. It was to be the real Experimental Prototype City of Tomorrow that Walt himself dreamed about building before he died of lung cancer. Then nephew Roy did a bad job of honoring his uncle post death and then ABC's former Program Director Mr. Michael Eisner ruined it further and used 9/11 to lay off people so he could still collect billions from stock options where even if he kept many workers (or cast members) to stay on he would have still been a billionare but less of one.
Bottom line it was never developed as it should have and the city we all hoped to see will never be built.
The RCID is like some weird apocalyptic one-world government. The District legally has to operate as an incoporated municipality but there's only a handful of private land plots and the owners of those plots just happen to be board of supervisors' members. It's members are high-ranking Disney employees. And while WDW is private property, the District, because it is a municipality, is not. Which means the major roads that connect the parks together are public roads.
Never been to a Disney park, never will. Why go to Disney when Cedar Point is closer and has more thrilling rides?
Oh, and Cedar Point has Pink's Hot Dogs. Now those I could eat for my last meal, not some overpriced EPCOT crap.
Quote from: RobbieL2415 on September 22, 2019, 11:40:43 AM
The RCID is like some weird apocalyptic one-world government. The District legally has to operate as an incoporated municipality but there's only a handful of private land plots and the owners of those plots just happen to be board of supervisors' members. It's members are high-ranking Disney employees. And while WDW is private property, the District, because it is a municipality, is not. Which means the major roads that connect the parks together are public roads.
Except World Drive north of The Contemporary Resort is private.
Quote from: roadman65 on September 21, 2019, 10:43:21 AMthe city we all hoped to see
We hoped to see Walt Disney's idea of Tomorrowland utopia?
Trailer parks in swamps would be less hellish to live in!
Quote from: jeffandnicole on September 21, 2019, 06:17:32 AM
Quote from: formulanone on September 20, 2019, 02:21:52 PM
Quote from: US 89 on September 20, 2019, 02:17:00 PM
Quote from: SP Cook on September 19, 2019, 10:47:38 AM
Understand that when Disney showed up, Orlando was a poor area of old people trailer parks and agriculture. Disney knew this, and having bought up a huge amount of land in secret, told the state they could have what they wanted, or sell it back to the farmers and move on.
That's another thing that bothered me about Disney World: how the land was obtained in the first place. Essentially Disney created a bunch of random sub-companies to buy up the land in secret, and even the real estate agents negotiating these purchases didn't know who they were working for. In fact, when word of these massive land purchases first got out, the general speculation was that NASA was behind them given Orlando's proximity to the KSC.
Who cares? It was mostly fallow, unpopulated swampland to begin with.
The previous owners of that land cared.
Would you care if someone came to buy your land, only to find out later the company may have been willing to pay 5 times as much?
Considering that there are many failed land deals in Florida's past and present - to the point of it being a bit of a continuing joke - I think they probably figured "well, there's one born every minute" to the prospective buyers, and gladly (and unwittingly) walked off.
Hindsight is always something-something.
I've been to Walt Disney World once, and I went to see the One Man's Dream exhibit in Disney Hollywood Studios. Walt's presentation of EPCOT on The Wonderful World of Disney was the last thing he filmed for the series, and the exhibit had the map he displayed on the show, or a reproduction of it. Near the northwest corner of the map was a Disneyland copy "Theme Park" right where The Magic Kingdom was soon to be built. It shows up in the show too, so it's not something they added for the exhibit. Until then I thought construction of a Disneyland copy was a quick money-grab to do after Walt died, but here I saw that it was part of his original plans.
I've been a huge Disney fan most of my life. Not so much the movies (except Pixar, although they were separate entities the first eleven years of my life).
* I've been to Disney World five times: once in my mother's womb (1995), and then in 2002, 2009, 2018, and 2019.
* I've been to Disneyland at least 30 times, probably more (most recently last September, and again this December).
These visits were made easy for several reasons: I have access to standby tickets through Alaska Airlines (and have my entire life); the vast majority of my family elders (parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles) are all pretty hardcore Disney fans, and have been visiting with and without children since the early 70s (meaning the motivation to visit is strong); plus, my father and step-mother now have a ton of Disney Vacation Club points, so they visit Disney parks at least three times a year, sometimes more, as an obligation (which they are, obviously, happy to follow through with).
When I was younger, Disney was fascinating to me because of the thrill of the rides. It wasn't Magic Mountain, but it's very fun, and well-themed for children. I always had a blast, and many of my favorite memories as a child have taken place at Disney parks (usually Disneyland).
As I've grown older, my interest in the parks has drifted away from the thrill of the rides, and more into the intricacies of their operation: the aforementioned Haunted Mansion (stretching room, Hatbox Ghost, stretching door, etc); the Tower of Terror (very complex operation compared to other drop-tower rides); Space Mountain (cramming everything inside a building and then using two computers to somehow run a ridiculous number of trains at once); Expedition Everest (Disco Yeti!); I could go on for a long time (especially with the opening of Galaxy's Edge).
There's also the un-built side of Disney that I find fascinating: how Epcot is a shell of the original plan; how the German Epcot pavilion has room for a ride but one never opened; the dragon references at Animal Kingdom; etc.
Disney's Imagineers have really created some spectacular attractions; even if not from a thrilling point of view, their construction, operation, and attention to detail is unmatched by any other amusement park. I don't care how many roller coasters Cedar Point opens...they are fun, of course, but not "interesting" unless you're a roller coaster enthusiast; the rides eventually get boring and get replaced. Not so much at Disney parks. Many of their best attractions (Space Mountain, Matterhorn, Big Thunder) are fairly old by traditional measures. But they remain interesting because of the attention to detail that Disney pays. There are exceptions to this: the original California Adventure had many terrible rides, but those are generally exceptions, rather than the rule.
Quote from: jakeroot on September 22, 2019, 07:20:06 PM
As I've grown older, my interest in the parks has drifted away from the thrill of the rides, and more into the intricacies of their operation: ...
Space Mountain (cramming everything inside a building and then using two computers to somehow run a ridiculous number of trains at once);
Riding Space Mountain with all the lights on gives you a real appreciation for the design - just how compact and how little clearance there is - much more thrilling/scary than the regular ride for me.
I actually think innovation at Disney -- at least in the Magic Kingdom and Disneyland -- is stifled by tradition. People go there and expect the same old rides, so Disney cannot innovate like Six Flags and Cedar Fair in some regards -- except, of course, they just build yet another park... :D
I loved Disney when I was a kid, but found it a little dull last time I was there. And now, since they own a lot of "universes," I sympathize with the memes that compare Disney to Thanos, wielding such rights dictatorially. My view of them has quite jaded over the years.
Quote from: DTComposer on September 22, 2019, 07:59:18 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on September 22, 2019, 07:20:06 PM
As I've grown older, my interest in the parks has drifted away from the thrill of the rides, and more into the intricacies of their operation: ...
Space Mountain (cramming everything inside a building and then using two computers to somehow run a ridiculous number of trains at once);
Riding Space Mountain with all the lights on gives you a real appreciation for the design - just how compact and how little clearance there is - much more thrilling/scary than the regular ride for me.
I have lived for such a moment, but have yet to experience it! I'm guessing you've done it? To be honest, I'd like to see it with the lights on, while stopped (necessitating a breakdown), so I can truly appreciate how compact it truly is. Having seen the pictures with the lights on, and being able to see little bits of the track thanks to security lights, definitely adds another level of fear while riding, though!
Quote from: Rothman on September 22, 2019, 09:46:01 PM
I actually think innovation at Disney -- at least in the Magic Kingdom and Disneyland -- is stifled by tradition. People go there and expect the same old rides, so Disney cannot innovate like Six Flags and Cedar Fair in some regards -- except, of course, they just build yet another park... :D
What kind of innovation at Six Flags or Cedar Fair are you thinking of? They both build more intense coasters every time I turn around, which sometimes replace another coaster that had been fairly unique when it itself was constructed, but if that's not your thing, both places are pretty boring, honestly. What makes Disney interesting, at least to me, is that it's not
necessarily about thrill: it's about attention to detail; the theme; animatronics; story-telling. It's not even really comparable to Six Flags/Cedar Fair, now that I think about it. There are elements of those "super" theme parks (California Screamin', Expedition Everest), but Disney is less about throwing you around, and more about having fun with the family through various themes and elements that don't necessarily entail high g-forces.
Quote from: Rothman on September 22, 2019, 09:46:01 PM
I loved Disney when I was a kid, but found it a little dull last time I was there. And now, since they own a lot of "universes," I sympathize with the memes that compare Disney to Thanos, wielding such rights dictatorially. My view of them has quite jaded over the years.
I agree with at least the last half of your statement. They seem to be buying up just about every company. This lends well to the Disney Parks, which were struggling financially until lately (thanks to things like the 9/11 attacks, and the flops that were California Adventure and Euro Disney (at least initially)), although it makes Disney look like this crazed juggernaut that's out to either buy or destroy all competing mediums. Which they sort of are, at this point!
Don't forget, they own the entire ABC network too (including ABC News!).
Quote from: Rothman on September 22, 2019, 09:46:01 PM
I actually think innovation at Disney -- at least in the Magic Kingdom and Disneyland -- is stifled by tradition. People go there and expect the same old rides, so Disney cannot innovate like Six Flags and Cedar Fair in some regards -- except, of course, they just build yet another park... :D
I loved Disney when I was a kid, but found it a little dull last time I was there. And now, since they own a lot of "universes," I sympathize with the memes that compare Disney to Thanos, wielding such rights dictatorially. My view of them has quite jaded over the years.
Disney closed the Peoplemover in Disneyland in 1994 because Eisner thought the ride outlived its use. Yes they build new parks, but they still trade off on new stuff like Six Flags does as well. Remember Mr. Toad's Wild Ride in Orlando got taken out for a new adventure, Journey Into Inner Space got traded out for Star Tours, and do not forget Cracker Country in Anaheim (a new themed land along with Star Wars Land)!
Disney does change out rides too and some popular as was Mr. Toad.
IMHO, comparing Disney, particularly the Florida version, to your local regional amusement park is apples to oranges. Your local park is probably very nice, particularly the ones run by the two big chains, Cedar Fair and Six Flags, but WDW is a national, actually continental, level draw. It is another level of thing.
Disney is "stifled by tradition" , and that is a good thing. Disney has never been about massive thril rides, and, while it has several, that is not the primary focus.
I never got to visit Disney World growing up, primarily because my parents didn't want to go there and wouldn't take us. I finally visited in 2011 (when I was 38). The rides were a lot more sedate than I think I had expected after growing up visiting Kings Dominion. I found the crowd control and the cleanliness to be really interesting, especially the crowd control compared with Kings Dominion. I enjoyed riding Splash Mountain because it's probably about the only way Disney acknowledges Song of the South these days. The Contemporary Resort was nice and it was interesting to see how well-designed the rooms were in terms of being large rooms (by today's standards) that utilized the space really well.
I think I found EPCOT more interesting than the Magic Kingdom even though the Test Track broke down right before I got to ride it (and then I didn't get back later that day because we needed to leave to drive up to Jacksonville), but I suppose to some degree that's probably what you'd expect for an adult versus a kid. If I'd been a kid, I'd have enjoyed the Magic Kingdom more, but no doubt part of it has to do with having grown up with more exciting rides than the Magic Kingdom offers.
Quote from: SP Cook on September 23, 2019, 09:52:42 AMWDW is a national, actually continental, level draw
Global - most of my grade school class went there (Euro Disney was still a bit too new, and so didn't cut the mustard) as a big treat holiday - I remember having three years only having one week somewhere within 100 miles of home (rather than going to France for two weeks) in order to save up to go to WDW.
And my brother is currently there as a big treat 30th birthday present to himself (and while he wants to do Universal, Sea World and Busch Gardens, and would have got Cape Canaveral in if he could, it's specifically Disney he's gone to - though I know he'd enjoy the other stuff more). For some reason (despite it requiring mum to veto 7 year old him and 11 year old me refusing to go on the ride when we went there in '97), he's been on
Its A Small World - that hellish dystopia celebrating diversity that only goes skin deep as they all parrot the same ideological line over and over in a really annoying way like they have no taste or personality or anything. Now my brother hates tradition and really hates tweeness, so he was probably inoculating himself for the day against further such stuff by giving himself a worst-case-scenario as it was the first thing he did.
Quote from: 1995hoo on September 23, 2019, 02:18:48 PMI enjoyed riding Splash Mountain because it's probably about the only way Disney acknowledges Song of the South these days.
That's your takeaway from Splash Mountain - it was good because it references a non-PC film?
I enjoyed riding Splash Mountain as, other than Space Mountain and Big Thunder Mountain Railroad, it's the only big ride in the Magic Kingdom - and it's a good one (struggling to remember back 22 years to other ones - IASW for its horror, and the one where they blow air at you and shake your seat in the dark like a vicious alien is in the room with you is all I remember).
The
Song of the South theming adds little, other than critter animatronics to make the experience more annoying (which is the Magic Kingdom tradition!) and take about 11 minutes to do 2600'. Loggers' Leap (RIP) at Thorpe Park was a better log flume, even though it was far cheaper-looking, because it cared more about substance than style - 2' higher drop (though half the top speed due to putting an airtime bump on the big drop) and only taking about 3 minutes to do 1709' as it knows what a log flume is about is a big drop and getting you wet, not floating around for a long time.
QuoteI think I found EPCOT more interesting than the Magic Kingdom even though the Test Track broke down right before I got to ride it
EPCOT was the park I preferred. I think we did two full days there, which we didn't manage in the Magic Kingdom - I guess we could have ridden the better rides more than once, but really we got sick of the Magic Kingdom. Some stuff was great, other stuff was fine in small doses, but quite a lot was boring, and you couldn't get away with a small dose as the Disney is poured down your throat there.
Anyway, back to EPCOT - a bit too much walking, not a fan of the UK just being a 'pub', and a small garden with certain characters, and that's it. But the big disappointment was that they'd been advertising Test Track quite a bit on the TV while I was there and got me hyped and I couldn't go on it (it didn't have a soft opening until December '98, and I was there in the summer '97) - it looked better than it.
MGM Studios (now Disney's Hollywood Studios) was good - the shows were fun. Universal did it better I think (both LA and Orlando iterations), but MGM was more enjoyable than Magic Kingdom and the Tower of Terror was my favourite ride at Disney. Islands of Adventure (OK, I did that aged 17, not 11) is the Orlando area park I enjoyed the most though perhaps as it cared more about the rides than the theming.
Went to Disneyland once, when I was in LA in 1984. Had a fun time, but view it as a "Been there, done that" type experience. And I have no desire to go to WDW/Epcot in Florida.
Quote from: english si on September 24, 2019, 12:32:25 PM
Quote from: SP Cook on September 23, 2019, 09:52:42 AMWDW is a national, actually continental, For some reason (despite it requiring mum to veto 7 year old him and 11 year old me refusing to go on the ride when we went there in '97), he's been on Its A Small World - that hellish dystopia celebrating diversity that only goes skin deep as they all parrot the same ideological line over and over in a really annoying way like they have no taste or personality or anything. Now my brother hates tradition and really hates tweeness, so he was probably inoculating himself for the day against further such stuff by giving himself a worst-case-scenario as it was the first thing he did.
It's worse than that. It was developed for the 1964 New York World's Fair, for their theme of "Peace Through Understanding." So during the run-up to the Vietnam War, this was what was supposed to create world harmony. Eh. And yet I've fallen under its spell. It might be better appreciated as vintage Disney rather than any real attempt at creating world peace.
I heard that the Carousel Of Progress and Its A Small World were attractions at the 64 Fair where Flushing Meadows Park is now located near Citi Field in NY.
I remember that carousel in Anaheim as it was a theatre that had five auditoriums and after each show the theatre would move around the stage from one show to the other. At the end the last auditorium would have a speedramp where the stage is and take people up one level to a model of Disney's planned Experimental Prototype City of Tomorrow. Now since it got moved to Disney World it has five shows as the speedwalk to the second level is not present there like it was in California.
Also to note Disney is the only place to not use moving stairs as the speedwalk is a conveyor type of lift that never really took off. I did here though the original Erie PATH Station in Jersey City, NJ used one to take people from the subway to the above ground station that Erie abandoned once they merged with Delaware Lackawana to form Erie-Lackawana Railway and made Hoboken their main terminal. However that I think was concurrent with Disneyland in the late 50's and early 60's so that was Goodyear's only other known use for the Speedwalk that I know of. Too bad it is a great escalator as you can take a wheelchair and stroller on no problem.
Quote from: roadman65 on October 03, 2019, 10:57:53 PM
I heard that the Carousel Of Progress and Its A Small World were attractions at the 64 Fair where Flushing Meadows Park is now located near Citi Field in NY.
I remember that carousel in Anaheim as it was a theatre that had five auditoriums and after each show the theatre would move around the stage from one show to the other. At the end the last auditorium would have a speedramp where the stage is and take people up one level to a model of Disney's planned Experimental Prototype City of Tomorrow. Now since it got moved to Disney World it has five shows as the speedwalk to the second level is not present there like it was in California.
The Epcot model is still in the upper level of a structure in Disney World's Magic Kingdom, maybe above Carousel of Progress, but it can only be seen very briefly from the Tomorowland Transit Authority Peoplemover. They really should move the model to One Man's Journey so you can see it longer.
Quote
Also to note Disney is the only place to not use moving stairs as the speedwalk is a conveyor type of lift that never really took off. I did here though the original Erie PATH Station in Jersey City, NJ used one to take people from the subway to the above ground station that Erie abandoned once they merged with Delaware Lackawana to form Erie-Lackawana Railway and made Hoboken their main terminal. However that I think was concurrent with Disneyland in the late 50's and early 60's so that was Goodyear's only other known use for the Speedwalk that I know of. Too bad it is a great escalator as you can take a wheelchair and stroller on no problem.
There were also Speedways in Downtown Tacoma (Escalades) and the Washington State Ferry Terminal in Seattle. The fact that they persist at Disney is perfect for the "future that never was" theming they tried to use to avoid the future always catching up with them.
Flat moving sidewalks persist at airports. Just the other day I saw a Speedway at the Metrotown Real Canadian Super Store (https://goo.gl/maps/YJNSkpM3Fb1MARpd6) near Vancouver, for moving shopping carts down to the parking garage. When the customer places the cart on the ramp, the wheels lock so it won't roll down the ramp.
Quote from: ErmineNotyours on October 12, 2019, 09:05:22 PM
Just the other day I saw a Speedway at the Metrotown Real Canadian Super Store (https://goo.gl/maps/YJNSkpM3Fb1MARpd6) near Vancouver, for moving shopping carts down to the parking garage. When the customer places the cart on the ramp, the wheels lock so it won't roll down the ramp.
IKEA stores also have such escalators.
Quote from: Big John on October 12, 2019, 09:26:54 PM
Quote from: ErmineNotyours on October 12, 2019, 09:05:22 PM
Just the other day I saw a Speedway at the Metrotown Real Canadian Super Store (https://goo.gl/maps/YJNSkpM3Fb1MARpd6) near Vancouver, for moving shopping carts down to the parking garage. When the customer places the cart on the ramp, the wheels lock so it won't roll down the ramp.
IKEA stores also have such escalators.
And the Walmart in Crossgates Commons near Albany, NY.
Quote from: ErmineNotyours on October 12, 2019, 09:05:22 PM
There were also Speedways in Downtown Tacoma (Escalades) and the Washington State Ferry Terminal in Seattle.
There's very little evidence of these left, apart from a few
boarded up sections of stairs (https://goo.gl/maps/CM91RBtzoTnqRUPe8) (which I
believe replaced the moving walkways). There's also
this article (https://tacomahistory.live/2016/02/04/the-maul/) by local historic Michael Sullivan. Wish I could find more info about these, but they seem to have been taken out about as quickly as they went in, thanks to poor maintenance and a persistent smell of piss (apparently).
Quote from: Big John on October 12, 2019, 09:26:54 PM
Quote from: ErmineNotyours on October 12, 2019, 09:05:22 PM
Just the other day I saw a Speedway at the Metrotown Real Canadian Super Store (https://goo.gl/maps/YJNSkpM3Fb1MARpd6) near Vancouver, for moving shopping carts down to the parking garage. When the customer places the cart on the ramp, the wheels lock so it won't roll down the ramp.
IKEA stores also have such escalators.
All two floor supermarkets in the UK that I've been to do (though there's not that many).
Oddly, not all multi-floor IKEAs in the UK do. Wembley is an older design, and you don't get the carts until you get down to the lower floor.
IKEA Southampton has around 10, having a crampt site which means many floors.
Quote from: english si on October 13, 2019, 04:02:43 AM
Oddly, not all multi-floor IKEAs in the UK do. Wembley is an older design, and you don't get the carts until you get down to the lower floor.
The new IKEA here in Seattle has the carts/trolleys on the lower floor as well (with regular escalators to go up, stairs to come down). Would you normally attribute this to an older design standard? Not sure how new IKEAs in the UK are configured.
The Target near us at Springfield Mall has a special escalator for the carts located between the regular escalators for people. (There's also an elevator nearby for people who can't use escalators, such as wheelchair users.) I've never seen one of the sort shown in ErmineNotyours's photo. The one at Target has a steeper slope than that one appears to have. You push your cart through a little gate and the thing has what are sort of like metal teeth to hold the cart in place on the way down. It also holds the cart basket level.
There used to be a two-level Harris Teeter in Fairfax City in which the pharmacy was upstairs. That store simply had an elevator for taking the carts upstairs. I believe the one in Arlington near Ballston has/had the same general layout (not sure if it's still the case as I haven't been there in a long time).
Either design is better than what I regularly see on the Metro–people taking strollers on the regular escalators and bending over to hold them steady. A year or two ago a wheelchair user attempted to ride up an escalator using his arms to hold the wheelchair in place. He lost his grip near the top, the wheelchair flipped over backwards and crashed down the escalator, and he died. Apparently he had pressed the button for the elevator but got mad that it didn't come within ten seconds.
Quote from: 1995hoo on October 13, 2019, 08:57:05 AM
There used to be a two-level Harris Teeter in Fairfax City in which the pharmacy was upstairs. That store simply had an elevator for taking the carts upstairs. I believe the one in Arlington near Ballston has/had the same general layout (not sure if it's still the case as I haven't been there in a long time).
I shop at both of Arlington's bi-level Harris Teeters (another, near Crystal City, is one-level). The general layout is the same, with a big elevator with room for two or three shopping carts plus shoppers.
The Wal-Mart in Tysons Corner at least used to have a shopping cart escalator like Target's, this one to bring shopping carts to parking on the upper level. I say "used to have" because it's been out of service for many weeks, though I did use it once a long time ago. Elevators are also available.
Quote from: jakeroot on October 13, 2019, 05:08:45 AMThe new IKEA here in Seattle has the carts/trolleys on the lower floor as well (with regular escalators to go up, stairs to come down). Would you normally attribute this to an older design standard? Not sure how new IKEAs in the UK are configured.
Maybe it's not an old design standard (in the sense of outdated), but an old one in the sense of how they always used to do things.
eg Southampton is an urban layout (though not quite as vertical as 7-floor Coventry. 'Urban' IKEAs with a smaller footprint are only found in the UK and Hong Kong, AFAICS. Though I'm sure there's more countries that have urban locations that are merely 'planning studio' or 'order and collection point' rather than a full store) and so everything is on its own floor! There's no initial interior escalator up as the entrance is on floor 4 and exit on floor 2 - with moving ramps on the outside (under cover) between car park structure and store structure to move both people and trolleys.
*or 'show off the big stuff', 'little stuff', 'big stuff in boxes' if you don't know their terms.
BTW, this escalator discussion reminds me that the aquarium in Baltimore used to have (and may still have–I haven't visited it in over 20 years due to the ticket prices) "flat escalators" across the open central area connecting the different levels. Essentially, they were like the moving walkways you often see at airports that use standard escalator-style "steps" and handrails but are a flat layout rather than "moving stairs," but unlike the airport type these had a noticeable, though very gentle, slope to them in order to convey people between different levels. I remember my mom said she hated those "flat escalators," but I don't know why. I do recall my brother and I thought they were neat, probably because they were different from the type we'd see at the shopping mall or the museums downtown.
Quote from: 1995hoo on October 13, 2019, 03:07:43 PM
BTW, this escalator discussion reminds me that the aquarium in Baltimore used to have (and may still have–I haven't visited it in over 20 years due to the ticket prices) "flat escalators" across the open central area connecting the different levels. Essentially, they were like the moving walkways you often see at airports that use standard escalator-style "steps" and handrails but are a flat layout rather than "moving stairs," but unlike the airport type these had a noticeable, though very gentle, slope to them in order to convey people between different levels. I remember my mom said she hated those "flat escalators," but I don't know why. I do recall my brother and I thought they were neat, probably because they were different from the type we'd see at the shopping mall or the museums downtown.
The IKEA in Conshohocken (suburban Philadelphia–adjacent to IKEA's North American headquarters) has such an inclined conveyor connecting the checkout on the ground level with the underground parking garage below. In fact, the carts' rubber wheels are specially grooved to interlock with the grooves on the conveyor treads and prevent the carts from rolling.
Quote from: 1995hoo on October 13, 2019, 03:07:43 PM
BTW, this escalator discussion reminds me that the aquarium in Baltimore used to have (and may still have–I haven't visited it in over 20 years due to the ticket prices) "flat escalators" across the open central area connecting the different levels. Essentially, they were like the moving walkways you often see at airports that use standard escalator-style "steps" and handrails but are a flat layout rather than "moving stairs," but unlike the airport type these had a noticeable, though very gentle, slope to them in order to convey people between different levels. I remember my mom said she hated those "flat escalators," but I don't know why. I do recall my brother and I thought they were neat, probably because they were different from the type we'd see at the shopping mall or the museums downtown.
The only place I've ever seen this was in Disney World, where you used these "inclined moving walkways" to get up to the Tomorrowland transit ride. Pretty sure there was also one in the exit from Space Mountain.
Quote from: ErmineNotyours on October 12, 2019, 09:05:22 PM
Quote from: roadman65 on October 03, 2019, 10:57:53 PM
I heard that the Carousel Of Progress and Its A Small World were attractions at the 64 Fair where Flushing Meadows Park is now located near Citi Field in NY.
I remember that carousel in Anaheim as it was a theatre that had five auditoriums and after each show the theatre would move around the stage from one show to the other. At the end the last auditorium would have a speedramp where the stage is and take people up one level to a model of Disney's planned Experimental Prototype City of Tomorrow. Now since it got moved to Disney World it has five shows as the speedwalk to the second level is not present there like it was in California.
The Epcot model is still in the upper level of a structure in Disney World's Magic Kingdom, maybe above Carousel of Progress, but it can only be seen very briefly from the Tomorowland Transit Authority Peoplemover. They really should move the model to One Man's Journey so you can see it longer.
Quote
Also to note Disney is the only place to not use moving stairs as the speedwalk is a conveyor type of lift that never really took off. I did here though the original Erie PATH Station in Jersey City, NJ used one to take people from the subway to the above ground station that Erie abandoned once they merged with Delaware Lackawana to form Erie-Lackawana Railway and made Hoboken their main terminal. However that I think was concurrent with Disneyland in the late 50's and early 60's so that was Goodyear's only other known use for the Speedwalk that I know of. Too bad it is a great escalator as you can take a wheelchair and stroller on no problem.
There were also Speedways in Downtown Tacoma (Escalades) and the Washington State Ferry Terminal in Seattle. The fact that they persist at Disney is perfect for the "future that never was" theming they tried to use to avoid the future always catching up with them.
Flat moving sidewalks persist at airports. Just the other day I saw a Speedway at the Metrotown Real Canadian Super Store (https://goo.gl/maps/YJNSkpM3Fb1MARpd6) near Vancouver, for moving shopping carts down to the parking garage. When the customer places the cart on the ramp, the wheels lock so it won't roll down the ramp.
Orlando International Airport uses escalator stairs for flat moving sidewalks. You would figure the belt is more better as less moving parts and can be maintained easier.
Quote from: roadman65 on October 13, 2019, 07:36:12 PMOrlando International Airport uses escalator stairs for flat moving sidewalks. You would figure the belt is more better as less moving parts and can be maintained easier.
2 reasons:
1) interchangeability of parts with stepped escalators
2) easier to replace a broken step than a broken bit of a continuous belt (which would have to be the whole thing).