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Regional Boards => Great Lakes and Ohio Valley => Topic started by: Grzrd on February 24, 2015, 01:55:55 PM

Title: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Grzrd on February 24, 2015, 01:55:55 PM
Quote from: Grzrd on May 31, 2014, 11:59:41 PM
KYTC has posted the Audubon, Natcher and US 60  Report on its website:
http://transportation.ky.gov/Planning/Pages/Project-Details.aspx?Project=I-69,%20I-66/I-65%20Spurs%20and%20US%2060%20Connection%20Strategic%20Planning%20Corridor%20Study
(above quote from KYTC to Study Interstate Upgrades For Audubon and Natcher Parkways (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=4040.msg303180#msg303180) thread)

This article (//http://) reports that the "first step" has been taken in upgrading the Natcher Parkway to an I-65 Spur:

Quote
A recent meeting in Frankfort between area political leaders and the Kentucky Transportation Cabinet was "an important first step" in getting the William H. Natcher Parkway upgraded to an interstate spur from Interstate 65 in Bowling Green to Owensboro, state Sen. Joe Bowen said Monday.
"It was the initial step we needed to take to get this underway," the Owensboro Republican said. "We want to get some momentum going, so it will be far enough along that it can't be stopped" by future Frankfort administrations.
There is still no timeline for starting work on the project, however, Bowen said ....
When Palmer Engineering of Winchester released a report in May that looked at what it would take to elevate the Audubon and Natcher parkways and sections of U.S. 60 and U.S. 231 in Owensboro to federal interstate standards, it concluded that raising the Natcher Parkway and a part of the former U.S. 60 bypass to interstate standards would cost up to $148 million.
But Bowen said officials now believe the work on the Natcher could be done for $65 million "on the top end."
He said, "We're hoping for variances from the federal government that would bring the cost even lower. It's a lot better now than a lot of interstates in the Northeast. We hope they take into account that it's largely a rural highway."

Another article (http://www.bgdailynews.com/news/upgrade-could-lift-status-of-parkway/article_e8f17d99-5818-556b-aa74-41c74030ed55.html) reports that it could possibly be included in the Kentucky road plan in a few years:

Quote
"We strongly support the upgrading of the Natcher Parkway to interstate standards, in order to be utilized as a spur of I-65, to Owensboro,"  Warren County Judge-Executive Mike Buchanon said in a text message. Buchanon sent a letter Feb. 12 to Kentucky Transportation Cabinet Secretary Mike Hancock supporting the project.
"This designation will have a very positive benefit, as it will create interest among site selectors and generate economic activity that will benefit this region,"  Buchanon wrote to Hancock. "Once the construction projects are defined to meet the federal standards, they can be included in the road plan over the next few years."

Here is a snip of a table from the Executive Summary of the above-linked study posted by KYTC which summarizes cost estimates (page 9/23 of pdf; page 7 of document):

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2Fi5yVveC.png&hash=ec440c19743c5c243ade6067e47ce11dc1b4b9d6)

I don't believe I-66 was mentioned in either article.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: aboges26 on February 27, 2015, 01:42:08 AM
Have there been any Interstate designations officially talked for this corridor to become?  (Other than being a portion of I-66)
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: bassoon1986 on February 27, 2015, 10:21:59 AM
So, it isn't a plan for the Natcher and Audubon to be considered one corridor number like an I-X65 or I-X69? Or are one or both of those being considered as part of something longer?
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: roadman65 on February 27, 2015, 10:42:19 AM
I think leaving the parkways with an I-x69 or I-x65 would be an excellent idea whether I-66 ever gets built or not.  It does connect two interstate systems and should really be one for now or forever depending on I-66's status. 

Even the WP should really get one as well.  Though not planned as one, it should also have one as its eastern terminus is with I-65 near Elizabethtown.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Henry on February 27, 2015, 10:47:31 AM
Owensboro may just become another Jonesboro, with two Interstate spurs being planned to go there!
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: roadman65 on February 27, 2015, 10:50:25 AM
Quote from: Henry on February 27, 2015, 10:47:31 AM
Owensboro may just become another Jonesboro, with two Interstate spurs being planned to go there!
Better than Myrtle Beach, SC with two 2 digits going there, with one of them coming from a roundabout way lol!
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: codyg1985 on February 27, 2015, 04:50:28 PM
Other than upgrading the interchanges that used to be locations of toll booths (where there are all loop ramps), I think the money would be better spent elsewhere in the state.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Grzrd on August 10, 2015, 09:45:47 PM
The Owensboro-Daviess County 2015-2040 Metropolitan Transportation Plan ("MTP") (http://www.gradd.com/files/MTP_DOC_8-2015.pdf) has been posted and upgrading the Natcher Parkway to interstate standards from US 60 in Owensboro to the Western Kentucky Parkway is the top fiscally restrained priority after completion of the projects in the current KYTC Highway Plan, with the upgrade tentatively planned for 2021 (p. 60-97 of pdf; p. 54 of document):

Quote
The Highway Element of the 2040 Metropolitan Transportation Plan is summarized in the tables on the following pages. Table1 represents the projects that are expected to be constructed between 2015 — 2020. These projects are currently scheduled in the Kentucky Transportation Cabinet Highway Plan. These projects listed in Table 1 are depicted just as they are in the KYTC Highway Plan. Therefore, some years may not have projects listed. However, it is expected that it will take the first six (6) years (2015 — 2020) to complete the projects in the current KYTC Highway Plan. Table2 shows that projects the Owensboro — Daviess County MPO has recommended for the financially constrained portion of the MTP. Some projects were either moved up or down in the5-year priority grouping basedon available funding as determined by the financial analysis and year of expenditure dollar amounts.

Here is a snip from Table 2 (p. 62/97 of pdf: p. 56 of document):

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FW6ildvR.jpg&hash=e04ffecc1d837578c828ac9776107bd7789e7c8a)

edit

This August 4 article (http://www.tristatehomepage.com/story/d/story/daviess-county-transportation-plan-unveiled/43455/j4Y4Xt6MsU2U9MuaTG6cCg) reports on the plan being made public, that the Natcher interste upgrade tops the list, and that there will be a public meeting about the plan in Owensboro on August 20.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: The Ghostbuster on August 11, 2015, 07:07:56 PM
I only have one word in my comment on this: Meh!
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: iBallasticwolf2 on August 11, 2015, 07:15:49 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on August 11, 2015, 07:07:56 PM
I only have one word in my comment on this: Meh!
Agreed. I don't think the Natcher Parkway needs to be an I-65 spur. Especially since if the Audobon Parkway goes through with being converted to an I-69 spur Owensboro will have an interstate that almost touches the city limits.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Brandon on August 12, 2015, 01:11:15 PM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on August 11, 2015, 07:15:49 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on August 11, 2015, 07:07:56 PM
I only have one word in my comment on this: Meh!
Agreed. I don't think the Natcher Parkway needs to be an I-65 spur. Especially since if the Audobon Parkway goes through with being converted to an I-69 spur Owensboro will have an interstate that almost touches the city limits.

Why not just move US-231 onto it, download the old road to the counties where possible, and call it a day?
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: iBallasticwolf2 on August 12, 2015, 01:16:38 PM
Quote from: Brandon on August 12, 2015, 01:11:15 PM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on August 11, 2015, 07:15:49 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on August 11, 2015, 07:07:56 PM
I only have one word in my comment on this: Meh!
Agreed. I don't think the Natcher Parkway needs to be an I-65 spur. Especially since if the Audobon Parkway goes through with being converted to an I-69 spur Owensboro will have an interstate that almost touches the city limits.

Why not just move US-231 onto it, download the old road to the counties where possible, and call it a day?
I think that is a good idea. Just move existing routes onto the parkways when possible. It can be done with other parkways if need be. It's a good idea.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: The Ghostbuster on August 12, 2015, 04:17:06 PM
On second thought, since US 231 parallels the Natcher Parkway, I say go for it!
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: codyg1985 on August 13, 2015, 07:25:12 AM
Playing devil's advocate: If we use the same logic here, then should we just move all US routes to their parallel interstates and turn those US routes over to the local jurisdictions? Whether the parkways have an interstate designation or not, they still have their own designation.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: MikeTheActuary on August 13, 2015, 10:24:52 AM
Quote from: codyg1985 on August 13, 2015, 07:25:12 AM
Playing devil's advocate: If we use the same logic here, then should we just move all US routes to their parallel interstates and turn those US routes over to the local jurisdictions?

Does the color and shape of the shield actually matter any more when it comes to federal highway funding?

There are plenty of examples where paralleling/legacy US routes are not considered part of the National Highway System presumably due to the redundancy (and plenty of examples of state routes that are part of the system).  I was under the impression that NHS status had (in theory) some influence over eligibility for some forms of federal funding.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: hbelkins on August 13, 2015, 12:04:18 PM
Quote from: codyg1985 on August 13, 2015, 07:25:12 AM
Playing devil's advocate: If we use the same logic here, then should we just move all US routes to their parallel interstates and turn those US routes over to the local jurisdictions? Whether the parkways have an interstate designation or not, they still have their own designation.

I've long been in favor of putting a regular route number on the parkways instead of keeping the route number designations in the secret 9000 series. They can still be named roads, and can still have those God-awful generic route markers, but there's really no reason KY 80 shouldn't be on the Hal Rogers and Cumberland Parkways. And the parallel routes probably wouldn't be turned over to the counties. They'd just get renumbered as state routes. As heavily traveled as a lot of the parallel routes are now, the counties wouldn't have the financial resources to adequately maintain them. And they would not necessarily become 3000-series numbers, either. Apparently there are some lower number available. KY 978 is, I know. KY 227 got rerouted over it in Owen County.

Back in the 1980s, Kentucky couldn't decide what to do with the Mountain Parkway's route number designation after the tolls were removed. It was originally designated as an unsigned extension of KY 114. Then, the designation got changed to KY 402, which was also never signed with one exception. When Exit 33 was rebuilt to tear down the toll booths and eliminate the old toll-booth cloverleaf, the contractor put up KY 402 signage on the parkway and the intersecting route, KY 11. Those signs stayed up for a few months before they got changed out in favor of the old-style circular blue and green Mountain Parkway markers. I never got photos of the KY 402 signs, but I sure wish I had. That's why sometimes you will still see maps designating the route as KY 402. They eventually settled on KY 9000 for the original four-lane section and KY 9009 for the original undivided portion. Who knows if it will change again once the four-laning is complete?

My opinion -- put US 460 on the route from Prestonsburg to Winchester and put KY 40 -- the original designation -- on the road from Salyersville to Frankfort.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Stephane Dumas on August 13, 2015, 04:44:06 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on August 13, 2015, 12:04:18 PM
I never got photos of the KY 402 signs, but I sure wish I had. That's why sometimes you will still see maps designating the route as KY 402. They eventually settled on KY 9000 for the original four-lane section and KY 9009 for the original undivided portion. Who knows if it will change again once the four-laning is complete?


Michael Summa, who had collections of vintage road signs photos or someone else who had taken a photo during that era might have a vintage photo of KY-402 sign.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Rothman on August 13, 2015, 05:37:16 PM
Quote from: MikeTheActuary on August 13, 2015, 10:24:52 AM
Quote from: codyg1985 on August 13, 2015, 07:25:12 AM
Playing devil's advocate: If we use the same logic here, then should we just move all US routes to their parallel interstates and turn those US routes over to the local jurisdictions?

Does the color and shape of the shield actually matter any more when it comes to federal highway funding?

There are plenty of examples where paralleling/legacy US routes are not considered part of the National Highway System presumably due to the redundancy (and plenty of examples of state routes that are part of the system).  I was under the impression that NHS status had (in theory) some influence over eligibility for some forms of federal funding.

True, NHS status does cause a state to use National Highway Performance Program funds  rather than STP funds on them.

At least in New York, a lot of the parallel routes to interstates are on the NHS (e.g., US 20).
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: triplemultiplex on August 16, 2015, 01:25:17 PM
Any route number would be more useful to the public.  My observation has been that the Parkway logos are indiscernible gibberish at the same distance where any other numbered road marker (I, US, KY) is crystal clear.

Also, there is no reason why the parkways can't keep their names after their 'promotion'.  The I-69 portions all have signage referring to the parkway name as "former".  That struck me as silly.  It can be both.  We are used to freeways having both names and numbers in America; even in rural places.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: tidecat on August 16, 2015, 05:14:24 PM
Kentucky ought to renumber the parkways interstate style, even if the interstate designation is years or decades away:

Mountain Parkway - KY 564 (we'll save 164 and 364 for use elsewhere in the state, and 264 is of course taken).
Natcher Parkway - KY 165
Audubon Parkway - KY 369
Cumberland Parkway - KY 365
Bluegrass Parkway - KY 565

The Purchase Parkway is of course being consumed by I-69, although if the small part north of I-24 remains it could be given another number.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: hbelkins on August 16, 2015, 07:44:47 PM
Quote from: tidecat on August 16, 2015, 05:14:24 PM
The Purchase Parkway is of course being consumed by I-69, although if the small part north of I-24 remains it could be given another number.

That small part will definitely remain, and full access from I-24 will be retained. One of the original proposals called for one of the movements from I-24 to that section to be eliminated (don't remember if it was EB or WB) but a large public outcry to keep it resulted in that outcome. I didn't see what the big deal was, since there's a US 62 exit about a mile from the Purchase Parkway exit.

I suspect the remaining stub will become an extension of the four-digit route it ties into at US 62 (KY 1526?).
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: andy3175 on August 16, 2015, 09:45:42 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on August 16, 2015, 01:25:17 PM
Any route number would be more useful to the public.  My observation has been that the Parkway logos are indiscernible gibberish at the same distance where any other numbered road marker (I, US, KY) is crystal clear.

Also, there is no reason why the parkways can't keep their names after their 'promotion'.  The I-69 portions all have signage referring to the parkway name as "former".  That struck me as silly.  It can be both.  We are used to freeways having both names and numbers in America; even in rural places.

Quote from: tidecat on August 16, 2015, 05:14:24 PM
Kentucky ought to renumber the parkways interstate style, even if the interstate designation is years or decades away:

Mountain Parkway - KY 564 (we'll save 164 and 364 for use elsewhere in the state, and 264 is of course taken).
Natcher Parkway - KY 165
Audubon Parkway - KY 369
Cumberland Parkway - KY 365
Bluegrass Parkway - KY 565

The Purchase Parkway is of course being consumed by I-69, although if the small part north of I-24 remains it could be given another number.

For what it's worth, I agree with and endorse both of these approaches. Give the parkways a route number, allow them to have their parkway name retained, and whenever it is time to transition them to Interstate status due to improved standards, then sign them at that time.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: iBallasticwolf2 on August 16, 2015, 09:50:00 PM
Quote from: andy3175 on August 16, 2015, 09:45:42 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on August 16, 2015, 01:25:17 PM
Any route number would be more useful to the public.  My observation has been that the Parkway logos are indiscernible gibberish at the same distance where any other numbered road marker (I, US, KY) is crystal clear.

Also, there is no reason why the parkways can't keep their names after their 'promotion'.  The I-69 portions all have signage referring to the parkway name as "former".  That struck me as silly.  It can be both.  We are used to freeways having both names and numbers in America; even in rural places.

Quote from: tidecat on August 16, 2015, 05:14:24 PM
Kentucky ought to renumber the parkways interstate style, even if the interstate designation is years or decades away:

Mountain Parkway - KY 564 (we'll save 164 and 364 for use elsewhere in the state, and 264 is of course taken).
Natcher Parkway - KY 165
Audubon Parkway - KY 369
Cumberland Parkway - KY 365
Bluegrass Parkway - KY 565

The Purchase Parkway is of course being consumed by I-69, although if the small part north of I-24 remains it could be given another number.

For what it's worth, I agree with and endorse both of these approaches. Give the parkways a route number, allow them to have their parkway name retained, and whenever it is time to transition them to Interstate status due to improved standards, then sign them at that time.
Some Kentuckians would throw a fit at tide's idea. They might think that KYDOT is wanting to upgrade the road to interstate standards at that moment resulting in "environmental damage" to their area and "urban sprawl" to their rural areas.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Grzrd on October 26, 2015, 04:49:20 PM
The Natcher Parkway may be Congressionally designated as an I-65 Spur in the relatively near future.  Section 1405 of the proposed STRR Act from the House of Representatives (https://www.congress.gov/114/bills/hr3763/BILLS-114hr3763ih.pdf) would amend Section 119(a) of the SAFETEA-LU Technical Corrections Act (http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/PLAW-110publ244/html/PLAW-110publ244.htm) to include the I-65 spur designation between Bowling Green and Owensboro.  Section 119(a) currently reads as follows:

Quote
SEC. 119. FUTURE INTERSTATE DESIGNATION.

    (a) In General.--Subject to subsection (b), the Secretary of Transportation shall designate, as a future Interstate Route 69 Spur, the Audubon Parkway and, as a future Interstate Route 66 Spur, the Natcher Parkway in Owensboro, Kentucky. Any segment of such routes shall become part of the Interstate System (as defined in section 101 of title 23, United States Code) at such time as the Secretary determines that the segment--
            (1) meets the Interstate System design standards approved by the Secretary under section 109(b) of title 23, United States Code; and
            (2) connects to an existing Interstate System segment.

The proposed Section 1405 STRR amendment would amend the above as follows (p.196/558 of pdf; p. 196 of document):

Quote
(d) FUTURE INTERSTATE DESIGNATION.–Section 119(a) of the SAFETEA—LU Technical Corrections Act of 2008 is amended by striking "˜"˜and, as a future Interstate Route 66 Spur, the Natcher Parkway in Owensboro, Kentucky'' and inserting "˜"˜between Henderson, Kentucky, and Owensboro, Kentucky, and, as a future Interstate Route 65 and 66 Spur, the William H. Natcher Parkway between Bowling Green, Kentucky, and Owensboro, Kentucky''.

It's interesting that the I-65 spur designation would be added to the I-66 spur designation, instead of having the I-65 spur designation replace the I-66 spur designation.  I guess they want to keep the I-66 dream alive.

Would this constitute the longest 3di/3di overlap in the interstate system?
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: thefro on October 27, 2015, 08:23:34 AM
I-66 in Kentucky isn't going away as long as Hal Rogers chairs the Appropriations Committee.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: english si on October 27, 2015, 09:51:19 AM
Quote from: Grzrd on October 26, 2015, 04:49:20 PMWould this constitute the longest 3di/3di overlap in the interstate system?
Given there is only one (and a future one with 785/840 at Greensboro?) - 271 and 480 in Cleveland, then absolutely it will.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: tidecat on December 04, 2015, 12:33:36 AM
Natcher Parkway included in this bill:

http://www.14news.com/story/30665057/ky-lawmakers-move-forward-with-road-improvement-bill
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: andy3175 on December 06, 2015, 11:43:08 PM
Quote from: tidecat on December 04, 2015, 12:33:36 AM
Natcher Parkway included in this bill:

http://www.14news.com/story/30665057/ky-lawmakers-move-forward-with-road-improvement-bill

Indeed ... here's a copy of the bill, which was signed into law by the president on Friday:

http://transportation.house.gov/uploadedfiles/fastact_xml.pdf

See Section 1416(d) regarding the I-65/66 Spur:

Quote(d) FUTURE INTERSTATE DESIGNATION.–Section 119(a) of the SAFETEA—LU Technical Corrections Act of 2008 (122 Stat. 1608) is amended by striking "˜"˜and, as a future Interstate Route 66 Spur, the Natcher Parkway in Owensboro, Kentucky'' and inserting "˜"˜between Henderson, Kentucky, and Owensboro, Kentucky, and, as a future Interstate Route 65 and 66 Spur, the William H. Natcher Parkway between Bowling Green, Kentucky, and Owensboro, Kentucky''.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Grzrd on January 28, 2016, 12:58:27 PM
The Projects List of the 2016 Recommended Highway Plan (p. 30/119 of pdf) (http://transportation.ky.gov/Program-Management/Documents/2016RecommendedProjectListing.pdf) indicates that "I-565" is the preferred designation for the I-65 Spur, with construction scheduled for 2018 and 2020:

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FYVx6U5U.png&hash=e4726f04f729a9fc5b56589ce7a32720cf6d52b2)




Quote from: Grzrd on October 26, 2015, 04:49:20 PM
It's interesting that the I-65 spur designation would be added to the I-66 spur designation, instead of having the I-65 spur designation replace the I-66 spur designation.  I guess they want to keep the I-66 dream alive.
Quote from: andy3175 on December 06, 2015, 11:43:08 PM
... here's a copy of the bill, which was signed into law by the president on Friday:
http://transportation.house.gov/uploadedfiles/fastact_xml.pdf
See Section 1416(d) regarding the I-65/66 Spur:
Quote(d) FUTURE INTERSTATE DESIGNATION.–Section 119(a) of the SAFETEA—LU Technical Corrections Act of 2008 (122 Stat. 1608) is amended by striking "˜"˜and, as a future Interstate Route 66 Spur, the Natcher Parkway in Owensboro, Kentucky'' and inserting "˜"˜between Henderson, Kentucky, and Owensboro, Kentucky, and, as a future Interstate Route 65 and 66 Spur, the William H. Natcher Parkway between Bowling Green, Kentucky, and Owensboro, Kentucky''.

However, as far as I can tell, there is no indication of a "secret" preferred I-x66 spur designation, too .....................
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: The Ghostbuster on January 28, 2016, 04:27:08 PM
Interstate 565? I would have prefered the Interstate 165 designation for the William Natcher Parkway.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: wdcrft63 on February 03, 2016, 02:06:09 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on January 28, 2016, 04:27:08 PM
Interstate 565? I would have prefered the Interstate 165 designation for the William Natcher Parkway.

I agree. I-165 would fit with I-265 at Louisville. I-565 doesn't fit with anything.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Revive 755 on February 03, 2016, 09:14:32 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on January 28, 2016, 04:27:08 PM
Interstate 565? I would have prefered the Interstate 165 designation for the William Natcher Parkway.

I would go with I-365 over I-565.  If Kentucky is one of those states that doesn't want to use I-1xx, starting with an I-365 would still allow a decent numerical sequence for any future numbers for the Cumberland and Blue Grass Parkways and still have one odd I-x65 available for future use.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: The Ghostbuster on February 04, 2016, 06:44:13 PM
How about we flip a coin? Heads the designation becomes Interstate 165. Tails the designation becomes Interstate 365. Who wants to do the coin toss?
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: tdindy88 on February 04, 2016, 06:58:13 PM
What is this, the Iowa Caucus?
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: dvferyance on June 17, 2016, 05:33:20 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on February 03, 2016, 09:14:32 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on January 28, 2016, 04:27:08 PM
Interstate 565? I would have prefered the Interstate 165 designation for the William Natcher Parkway.

I would go with I-365 over I-565.  If Kentucky is one of those states that doesn't want to use I-1xx, starting with an I-365 would still allow a decent numerical sequence for any future numbers for the Cumberland and Blue Grass Parkways and still have one odd I-x65 available for future use.
I agree I-365 makes the most sense. Avoid duplication in other states when possible. I like the fact that I-294 is in Chicago I-494 and 694 is in the twin cities and I-894 is in Milwaukee and nothing is repeated when it doesn't have to be.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: sparker on June 17, 2016, 05:51:59 PM
I'm just surprised that the Owensboro folks didn't lobby for a 2di number (I-63, anyone?) for the Natcher/Audubon combination -- seeing as how they pushed like hell a year or so ago for I-67 for the Natcher/231 combination corridor. 
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: paulthemapguy on June 17, 2016, 06:22:31 PM
It might be a good place for an I-61 or I-63, for the single reason that I don't know where the hell else they could place those numbers without coming too close to the US Highway with the same number.  Most ideas for I-61 or I-63 would probably put them too close to US61 or US63.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: billtm on June 18, 2016, 09:49:40 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on June 17, 2016, 06:22:31 PM
It might be a good place for an I-61 or I-63, for the single reason that I don't know where the hell else they could place those numbers without coming too close to the US Highway with the same number.  Most ideas for I-61 or I-63 would probably put them too close to US61 or US63.

Yet I-41 still exists... :pan:
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: LM117 on June 18, 2016, 11:16:39 AM
Quote from: sparker on June 17, 2016, 05:51:59 PM
I'm just surprised that the Owensboro folks didn't lobby for a 2di number (I-63, anyone?) for the Natcher/Audubon combination -- seeing as how they pushed like hell a year or so ago for I-67 for the Natcher/231 combination corridor.

Hell, the mayor of Owensboro, Ron Payne, tried to get I-69 re-routed to go through Owensboro by following the Audobon Parkway from Henderson, US-60 around Owensboro and then up US-231 into Indiana, leaving Evansville completely out of the equation. Of course, the dumbass tried this AFTER Indiana had already built I-69 from Evansville to Crane at that point. Naturally, the response from KYTC and everyone else with a functioning brain was basically "fuck off". Ron Payne met with Evansville's mayor, Lloyd Winnecke, in Evansville where Winnecke proceeded to open up a can of verbal whoop-ass on him. Payne left Evansville and went back to Owensboro looking like a jackass. He dropped the I-69 Owensboro re-route idea not long after that. I-67 became Plan B. That didn't seem to pan out, so now Plan C is a 3-di, which is what Payne should've focused on to start with if he wanted interstate access to Owensboro. The idea of I-69 being re-routed through Owensboro was completely stupid and I don't think I-67 is necessary. An I-x65 from I-65 along the Natcher and an I-x69 from I-69 in Henderson along the Audobon, with both ending at US-60 will work just fine.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: sparker on June 18, 2016, 02:57:48 PM
It seems more logical that the massive & overwhelming Nashville to Evansville traffic would utilize I-24 to the Pennyrile and then north to I-69 rather than use a routing involving the Natcher/Audubon corridor; now that it looks like the southerly portion of the Pennyrile will eventually become I-169, that traffic will have an all-Interstate corridor to traverse.  Mr. Payne and his ilk will just have to get used to the fact that his city isn't on the direct route to & from any major metro areas.  Maybe they can devote their time & effort into building a museum to the last operating consumer vacuum-tube plant to have operated in the U.S. (GE's Owensboro facility, which shuttered in 1986!).
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: GreenLanternCorps on July 01, 2016, 12:09:02 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on February 03, 2016, 09:14:32 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on January 28, 2016, 04:27:08 PM
Interstate 565? I would have prefered the Interstate 165 designation for the William Natcher Parkway.

I would go with I-365 over I-565.  If Kentucky is one of those states that doesn't want to use I-1xx, starting with an I-365 would still allow a decent numerical sequence for any future numbers for the Cumberland and Blue Grass Parkways and still have one odd I-x65 available for future use.

With I-369 the most likely number for the Audubon Parkway, going with I-565 on the Natcher makes sense.   Both roads might wind up meeting at Owensboro and 369 and 365 on signage could prove confusing.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: tidecat on July 01, 2016, 06:54:19 PM
I doubt it would happen, but if Kentucky wanted to make all of the Gene Snyder Freeway an interstate, the part west of I-65 could be I-165. The Martha Layne Collins Bluegrass Parkway could be I-365, and then the William H. Natcher Parkway could become I-565 - the spurs would actually be in numerical sequence from north to south.  I know that omits the Louie B. Nunn Cumberland Parkway, but I have a feeling that will connect to I-75 at some point and be signed as either I-X75 or a two-digit even number.

The only downside is KY 565 is located southeast of Greensburg - I could see that being changed to a KY XX61 or KY XX55 designation.  KY 365 is between Owensboro and Paducah on US 60 (makes me wonder if it's an old routing of US 60), so that would be less of an issue with I-365 traversing the bluegrass.  KY 165 in the northeastern part of the state really shouldn't be an issue either.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on July 09, 2016, 07:08:39 PM
Quote from: tidecat on July 01, 2016, 06:54:19 PM
I doubt it would happen, but if Kentucky wanted to make all of the Gene Snyder Freeway an interstate, the part west of I-65 could be I-165. The Martha Layne Collins Bluegrass Parkway could be I-365, and then the William H. Natcher Parkway could become I-565 - the spurs would actually be in numerical sequence from north to south.  I know that omits the Louie B. Nunn Cumberland Parkway, but I have a feeling that will connect to I-75 at some point and be signed as either I-X75 or a two-digit even number.

The only downside is KY 565 is located southeast of Greensburg - I could see that being changed to a KY XX61 or KY XX55 designation.  KY 365 is between Owensboro and Paducah on US 60 (makes me wonder if it's an old routing of US 60), so that would be less of an issue with I-365 traversing the bluegrass.  KY 165 in the northeastern part of the state really shouldn't be an issue either.

Even though the part of the Gene Snyder west of I-65 is technically a spur and not a loop, I would have to think if they ever decided to make it an interstate they'd just call it 265 for simplicity's sake.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: wdcrft63 on July 11, 2016, 04:55:36 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 09, 2016, 07:08:39 PM
Quote from: tidecat on July 01, 2016, 06:54:19 PM
I doubt it would happen, but if Kentucky wanted to make all of the Gene Snyder Freeway an interstate, the part west of I-65 could be I-165. The Martha Layne Collins Bluegrass Parkway could be I-365, and then the William H. Natcher Parkway could become I-565 - the spurs would actually be in numerical sequence from north to south.  I know that omits the Louie B. Nunn Cumberland Parkway, but I have a feeling that will connect to I-75 at some point and be signed as either I-X75 or a two-digit even number.

The only downside is KY 565 is located southeast of Greensburg - I could see that being changed to a KY XX61 or KY XX55 designation.  KY 365 is between Owensboro and Paducah on US 60 (makes me wonder if it's an old routing of US 60), so that would be less of an issue with I-365 traversing the bluegrass.  KY 165 in the northeastern part of the state really shouldn't be an issue either.

Even though the part of the Gene Snyder west of I-65 is technically a spur and not a loop, I would have to think if they ever decided to make it an interstate they'd just call it 265 for simplicity's sake.

Obviously Kentucky wants to convert all or nearly all of its parkway system to interstate highways. I'm OK with that. Why not get everybody in one room and pick all the numbers once and for all, instead of agonizing over the thing one piece at a time? Let's have a plan!
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Avalanchez71 on July 11, 2016, 05:34:38 PM
Quote from: tidecat on July 01, 2016, 06:54:19 PM
I doubt it would happen, but if Kentucky wanted to make all of the Gene Snyder Freeway an interstate, the part or KY XX55 designation.  KY 365 is between Owensboro and Paducah on US 60 (makes me wonder if it's an old routing of US 60), so that would be less of an issue with I-365 traversing the bluegrass.  KY 165 in the northeastern part of the state really shouldn't be an issue either.
west of I-65 could be I-165. The Martha Layne Collins Bluegrass Parkway could be I-365, and then the William H. Natcher Parkway could become I-565 - the spurs would actually be in numerical sequence from north to south.  I know that omits the Louie B. Nunn Cumberland Parkway, but I have a feeling that will connect to I-75 at some point and be signed as either I-X75 or a two-digit even number.

The only downside is KY 565 is located southeast of Greensburg - I could see that being changed to a KY XX61

They could pull a NC and ask for I-42 (W) (Cumberland Pkwy), I-46 (Moutain Pkwy then Blue Grass then Western Kentucky Pkwy), I-67 (Green River Pkwy), I-63 (Audobon Pkwy), I-53 (Purchase Pkwy)
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: sparker on July 12, 2016, 05:18:17 AM
Since the Purchase is already part of I-69, I doubt a "I-53" designation would be applied there.  As far as the rest of the Parkway numberings go, I don't think the Mountain would, for the time being, be considered for 2di I-status; its east end doesn't come close to connecting to another Interstate (maybe x64 would be more appropriate, once upgrades have taken place).  I'll defer to more localized posters for info regarding the various parkways' compliance to I-standards.   
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: 2trailertrucker on July 12, 2016, 06:15:59 AM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 11, 2016, 05:34:38 PM
Quote from: tidecat on July 01, 2016, 06:54:19 PM
I doubt it would happen, but if Kentucky wanted to make all of the Gene Snyder Freeway an interstate, the part or KY XX55 designation.  KY 365 is between Owensboro and Paducah on US 60 (makes me wonder if it's an old routing of US 60), so that would be less of an issue with I-365 traversing the bluegrass.  KY 165 in the northeastern part of the state really shouldn't be an issue either.
west of I-65 could be I-165. The Martha Layne Collins Bluegrass Parkway could be I-365, and then the William H. Natcher Parkway could become I-565 - the spurs would actually be in numerical sequence north to south.  I know that omits the Louie B. Nunn Cumberland Parkway, but I have a feeling that will connect to I-75 at some point and be signed as either I-X75 or a two-digit even number.

The only downside is KY 565 is located southeast of Greensburg - I could see that being changed to a KY XX61

They could pull a NC and ask for I-42 (W) (Cumberland Pkwy), I-46 (Moutain Pkwy then Blue Grass then Western Kentucky Pkwy), I-67 (Green River Pkwy), I-63 (Audobon Pkwy), I-53 (Purchase Pkwy)

Kentucky could be a trailblazer here. They could label the highways, for example, Martha Layne Collins Interstate 63. They can plead that this would cause less confusion for Bluegrass drivers! After all, the politicians are the ones that get things done.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Avalanchez71 on July 12, 2016, 11:19:47 AM
Quote from: sparker on July 12, 2016, 05:18:17 AM
Since the Purchase is already part of I-69, I doubt a "I-53" designation would be applied there.  As far as the rest of the Parkway numberings go, I don't think the Mountain would, for the time being, be considered for 2di I-status; its east end doesn't come close to connecting to another Interstate (maybe x64 would be more appropriate, once upgrades have taken place).  I'll defer to more localized posters for info regarding the various parkways' compliance to I-standards.   
My response was tongue-in-cheek.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Life in Paradise on July 12, 2016, 11:40:50 AM
I don't know why someone in Kentucky hasn't suggested to run I-71 down I-65 from Louisville to the Western KY Parkway and then run it down to I-69 with the option of sending it down the southern Pennyrile to I-24 at Hopkinsville if they wanted to keep that a 2d rather than an X24 spur.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Avalanchez71 on July 12, 2016, 12:27:59 PM
You could actually route it over I-265 to get rid of some of the concurrancy. The problem is you would have a road to everywhere that went nowhere first.  Why drive from Nashville to Cinncinnati via Hopkinsvile?
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: jnewkirk77 on August 26, 2016, 05:10:55 PM
The "Future I-65 Spur" signs are going up.

http://kentucky.gov/Pages/Activity-stream.aspx?n=KentuckyGovernor&prId=153
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Avalanchez71 on August 26, 2016, 05:13:47 PM
So will this get approved by FHWA as SPUR I-65 like I-69 was approved as I-69, I-69C, and I-69E?
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Captain Jack on August 26, 2016, 06:16:17 PM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on August 26, 2016, 05:10:55 PM
The "Future I-65 Spur" signs are going up.

http://kentucky.gov/Pages/Activity-stream.aspx?n=KentuckyGovernor&prId=153

Is the Audubon still on track to become I-369?
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: sparker on August 26, 2016, 06:40:40 PM
Chances are this is just a "placeholder" future designation -- with the emphasis on the "future" aspect of the signage.  I'm guessing that the final number has yet to be determined (I'd bet on "365").  It's like a NFL team trading for a "player to be named later"!
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: wdcrft63 on August 26, 2016, 06:43:48 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on August 26, 2016, 05:13:47 PM
So will this get approved by FHWA as SPUR I-65 like I-69 was approved as I-69, I-69C, and I-69E?
AASHTO will have to be heard from on the proper number for this new interstate route. (North Carolina's experience recent ly is that AASHTO won't necessarily approve the number the state requests!) Does anyone know if Kentucky will file a request for a number at the next AASHTO meeting in November?
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: jnewkirk77 on August 26, 2016, 11:56:22 PM
Quote from: Captain Jack on August 26, 2016, 06:16:17 PM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on August 26, 2016, 05:10:55 PM
The "Future I-65 Spur" signs are going up.

http://kentucky.gov/Pages/Activity-stream.aspx?n=KentuckyGovernor&prId=153

Is the Audubon still on track to become I-369?

The Audubon has been designated as a future I-69 spur for several years. Whether or not it's going to be 369, I'm not sure. That was the number that our chamber of commerce folks threw out there, as I recall.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: ATLRedSoxFan on August 27, 2016, 02:32:34 AM
Seems like I read the Natcher Parkway is supposed to be designated as I-565 and the Audobon will be I-369.,Only because that pesky stub in Evansville  and whether or not they were going to tag that as I-169.., But that could have changed. It's been years since I lived in Owensboro, but it kind of makes sense. Like I said, that could have changed.Seems like I read on the board that Indiana  is not even sure the stub will be signed or secret desiganation.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: jnewkirk77 on August 27, 2016, 09:15:10 AM
Quote from: ATLRedSoxFan on August 27, 2016, 02:32:34 AM
Seems like I read the Natcher Parkway is supposed to be designated as I-565 and the Audobon will be I-369.,Only because that pesky stub in Evansville  and whether or not they were going to tag that as I-169.., But that could have changed. It's been years since I lived in Owensboro, but it kind of makes sense. Like I said, that could have changed.Seems like I read on the board that Indiana  is not even sure the stub will be signed or secret desiganation.

I have a feeling - just a gut feeling - that 169 will be used in Kentucky for the remaining section of the Pennyrile Parkway from I-24 near Hopkinsville to the WK/I-69 junction.  I also have a feeling that INDOT, once they're done jacking around with repaving 41, will do what they've done elsewhere in the state and loop 41 around over I-69 and I-64, turning what's now 41 over to Evansville and Vanderburgh County. It's a hunch, but look at Ft. Wayne, Lafayette and Indy (just to name a few), and it makes sense, even if it doesn't really make sense.

(EDIT: I've been thinking this would be what happens ever since they changed Business 41/Fares Avenue to "Old Business 41." Sort of makes me think the Evansville/Vanderburgh Co. folks might intend to refer to the current highway as Business 41. I would.)
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Captain Jack on August 27, 2016, 10:27:03 AM
I am surprised it hasn't happened as of yet as well. My one guess is that for whatever reason, the current US 41 through Evansville never received another name, such as "Blah Blah Parkway or Whoever Highway".  That road is so ingrained as Highway 41, that it would take generations to quit calling it that.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Life in Paradise on August 27, 2016, 11:25:25 AM
They might move US 41 over, but I'm guessing that that may not happen until the I-69 bridge is completed (which under favorable circumstances would be about 10 years).  I could see the City of Evansville fighting this tooth and nail due to the decaying road base especially under the area north of Pigeon Creek.  That concrete base out of town is well over 50 to 60 years old and has to be crumbling under layers of blacktop and heavy truck traffic.

On a similar vein, I'm surprised that Indiana has not moved some of the local roads (such as SR 62) over to i-69 and then multiplexed the Lloyd Expressway to drop about 5 miles from their maintenance  list.  They have been dropping state routes through towns all through the state.  At some time I expect there to be some push back unless there was some sort of deal that the local municipalities would receive some additional funds for the transfer.  I think it stinks for those unfamiliar with the areas and trying to find their way around (and not relying on GPS).
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: ATLRedSoxFan on August 27, 2016, 03:42:52 PM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on August 27, 2016, 09:15:10 AM
Quote from: ATLRedSoxFan on August 27, 2016, 02:32:34 AM
Seems like I read the Natcher Parkway is supposed to be designated as I-565 and the Audobon will be I-369.,Only because that pesky stub in Evansville  and whether or not they were going to tag that as I-169.., But that could have changed. It's been years since I lived in Owensboro, but it kind of makes sense. Like I said, that could have changed.Seems like I read on the board that Indiana  is not even sure the stub will be signed or secret desiganation.

I have a feeling - just a gut feeling - that 169 will be used in Kentucky for the remaining section of the Pennyrile Parkway from I-24 near Hopkinsville to the WK/I-69 junction.  I also have a feeling that INDOT, once they're done jacking around with repaving 41, will do what they've done elsewhere in the state and loop 41 around over I-69 and I-64, turning what's now 41 over to Evansville and Vanderburgh County. It's a hunch, but look at Ft. Wayne, Lafayette and Indy (just to name a few), and it makes sense, even if it doesn't really make sense.

(EDIT: I've been thinking this would be what happens ever since they changed Business 41/Fares Avenue to "Old Business 41." Sort of makes me think the Evansville/Vanderburgh Co. folks might intend to refer to the current highway as Business 41. I would.)
Totally makes sense. But let's not forget, Kentucky is a total pain in the ass to Indiana.Kentucky will get the bridge built with Indiana kicking in a few bucks and sheepishly saying"I helped". 41 will be 41 in one form or another.I-69 will be it's own animal.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: JMoses24 on August 29, 2016, 12:40:43 AM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on July 12, 2016, 11:40:50 AM
I don't know why someone in Kentucky hasn't suggested to run I-71 down I-65 from Louisville to the Western KY Parkway and then run it down to I-69 with the option of sending it down the southern Pennyrile to I-24 at Hopkinsville if they wanted to keep that a 2d rather than an X24 spur.
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 12, 2016, 12:27:59 PM
You could actually route it over I-265 to get rid of some of the concurrancy. The problem is you would have a road to everywhere that went nowhere first.  Why drive from Nashville to Cinncinnati via Hopkinsvile?

That's a route that looks something like this:

https://goo.gl/maps/4MjEu29w4KT2 (https://goo.gl/maps/4MjEu29w4KT2)

I wouldn't have a problem with I-71 ending at I-69, if that's what would result from I-71 being routed down the Pennyrile. And of course, this would result in the grid being violated TWICE by I-71 (WEST of 65 in Kentucky, EAST of 75 on the Ohio side).

Of course, if you DID route I-71 down the Pennyrile, then it would be marked as "Nashville Alternate Route via I-24" as far north as the I-65/71 split... not that it'd be much better with over one hour difference between just going down 65 and a "new I-71".
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: sparker on August 29, 2016, 01:30:34 AM
Quote from: JMoses24 on August 29, 2016, 12:40:43 AM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on July 12, 2016, 11:40:50 AM
I don't know why someone in Kentucky hasn't suggested to run I-71 down I-65 from Louisville to the Western KY Parkway and then run it down to I-69 with the option of sending it down the southern Pennyrile to I-24 at Hopkinsville if they wanted to keep that a 2d rather than an X24 spur.
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 12, 2016, 12:27:59 PM
You could actually route it over I-265 to get rid of some of the concurrancy. The problem is you would have a road to everywhere that went nowhere first.  Why drive from Nashville to Cinncinnati via Hopkinsvile?

That's a route that looks something like this:

https://goo.gl/maps/4MjEu29w4KT2 (https://goo.gl/maps/4MjEu29w4KT2)

I wouldn't have a problem with I-71 ending at I-69, if that's what would result from I-71 being routed down the Pennyrile. And of course, this would result in the grid being violated TWICE by I-71 (WEST of 65 in Kentucky, EAST of 75 on the Ohio side).

Of course, if you DID route I-71 down the Pennyrile, then it would be marked as "Nashville Alternate Route via I-24" as far north as the I-65/71 split... not that it'd be much better with over one hour difference between just going down 65 and a "new I-71".
If one were to give up on the idea that the Bluegrass parkway will ever connect to an Interstate at its east end, then the idea of multiplexing I-71 down I-65 to Elizabethtown (by whatever Louisville-area means that KYDOT selects) and then over the WKY to I-69 isn't a half-bad notion.  But I'd end I-71 there; rather than gratuitously turn it south (by another set of costly flyover ramps, no doubt) onto the Pennyrile, let the southern Pennyrile be a 3di (x24,x69).  If ever I-69 becomes the major interregional/international arterial its most ardent backers project, then the extended I-71 would be a very logical "branch" for traffic bound to Ohio and NE points beyond.   
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: aboges26 on September 26, 2016, 12:15:04 AM
Quote from: sparker on August 29, 2016, 01:30:34 AM
Quote from: JMoses24 on August 29, 2016, 12:40:43 AM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on July 12, 2016, 11:40:50 AM
I don't know why someone in Kentucky hasn't suggested to run I-71 down I-65 from Louisville to the Western KY Parkway and then run it down to I-69 with the option of sending it down the southern Pennyrile to I-24 at Hopkinsville if they wanted to keep that a 2d rather than an X24 spur.
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 12, 2016, 12:27:59 PM
You could actually route it over I-265 to get rid of some of the concurrancy. The problem is you would have a road to everywhere that went nowhere first.  Why drive from Nashville to Cinncinnati via Hopkinsvile?

That's a route that looks something like this:

https://goo.gl/maps/4MjEu29w4KT2 (https://goo.gl/maps/4MjEu29w4KT2)

I wouldn't have a problem with I-71 ending at I-69, if that's what would result from I-71 being routed down the Pennyrile. And of course, this would result in the grid being violated TWICE by I-71 (WEST of 65 in Kentucky, EAST of 75 on the Ohio side).

Of course, if you DID route I-71 down the Pennyrile, then it would be marked as "Nashville Alternate Route via I-24" as far north as the I-65/71 split... not that it'd be much better with over one hour difference between just going down 65 and a "new I-71".
If one were to give up on the idea that the Bluegrass parkway will ever connect to an Interstate at its east end, then the idea of multiplexing I-71 down I-65 to Elizabethtown (by whatever Louisville-area means that KYDOT selects) and then over the WKY to I-69 isn't a half-bad notion.  But I'd end I-71 there; rather than gratuitously turn it south (by another set of costly flyover ramps, no doubt) onto the Pennyrile, let the southern Pennyrile be a 3di (x24,x69).  If ever I-69 becomes the major interregional/international arterial its most ardent backers project, then the extended I-71 would be a very logical "branch" for traffic bound to Ohio and NE points beyond.

I was surprised to notice how nicely an extended I-71 would parallel I-81  :clap:
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: The Ghostbuster on September 26, 2016, 04:35:47 PM
I think Interstate 71's existing terminus is fine the way it is. I know I'm going fictional, but I'd give number the reminder of the Western Kentucky Parkway Interstate 2-4-6 or 869. What do the rest of you think?
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: amroad17 on September 26, 2016, 09:59:55 PM
Why not just keep it the WK Parkway?  The road is fine as is.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: paulthemapguy on September 27, 2016, 03:45:35 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on September 26, 2016, 04:35:47 PM
I think Interstate 71's existing terminus is fine the way it is. I know I'm going fictional, but I'd give number the reminder of the Western Kentucky Parkway Interstate 2-4-6 or 869. What do the rest of you think?

I've played around with the ideas of the number 56 or 48.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Avalanchez71 on September 27, 2016, 03:58:05 PM
US 231 ALT
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: dvferyance on October 07, 2016, 05:58:17 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on September 26, 2016, 04:35:47 PM
I think Interstate 71's existing terminus is fine the way it is. I know I'm going fictional, but I'd give number the reminder of the Western Kentucky Parkway Interstate 2-4-6 or 869. What do the rest of you think?
I-56 would make the most sense to me. In fact I think it was the one Kentucky Parkway that could have gotten an interstate upgrade many years ago because it's the only one that ends at an interstate on both sides.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: The Ghostbuster on October 10, 2016, 04:33:43 PM
The Interstate 56 designation might work ... in Fictional Highways.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: wdcrft63 on October 26, 2016, 05:08:49 PM
Quote from: wdcrft63 on August 26, 2016, 06:43:48 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on August 26, 2016, 05:13:47 PM
So will this get approved by FHWA as SPUR I-65 like I-69 was approved as I-69, I-69C, and I-69E?
AASHTO will have to be heard from on the proper number for this new interstate route. (North Carolina's experience recent ly is that AASHTO won't necessarily approve the number the state requests!) Does anyone know if Kentucky will file a request for a number at the next AASHTO meeting in November?
Kentucky did not submit any request for the I-65 spur to the November meeting. North Carolina did submit a request for an interstate designation (I-587) for US 264 from Zebulon (east of Raleigh) to Greenville. This request was denied, possibly indicating a new level of resistance by AASHTO to requests of this kind. Kentucky needs to take a careful look at this before putting in a request.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: mvak36 on October 26, 2016, 05:44:38 PM
Quote from: wdcrft63 on October 26, 2016, 05:08:49 PM
Quote from: wdcrft63 on August 26, 2016, 06:43:48 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on August 26, 2016, 05:13:47 PM
So will this get approved by FHWA as SPUR I-65 like I-69 was approved as I-69, I-69C, and I-69E?
AASHTO will have to be heard from on the proper number for this new interstate route. (North Carolina's experience recent ly is that AASHTO won't necessarily approve the number the state requests!) Does anyone know if Kentucky will file a request for a number at the next AASHTO meeting in November?
Kentucky did not submit any request for the I-65 spur to the November meeting. North Carolina did submit a request for an interstate designation (I-587) for US 264 from Zebulon (east of Raleigh) to Greenville. This request was denied, possibly indicating a new level of resistance by AASHTO to requests of this kind. Kentucky needs to take a careful look at this before putting in a request.

Did they already have their meeting? Where are you finding this info? Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: LM117 on October 26, 2016, 09:29:19 PM
Quote from: mvak36 on October 26, 2016, 05:44:38 PM
Quote from: wdcrft63 on October 26, 2016, 05:08:49 PM
Quote from: wdcrft63 on August 26, 2016, 06:43:48 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on August 26, 2016, 05:13:47 PM
So will this get approved by FHWA as SPUR I-65 like I-69 was approved as I-69, I-69C, and I-69E?
AASHTO will have to be heard from on the proper number for this new interstate route. (North Carolina's experience recent ly is that AASHTO won't necessarily approve the number the state requests!) Does anyone know if Kentucky will file a request for a number at the next AASHTO meeting in November?
Kentucky did not submit any request for the I-65 spur to the November meeting. North Carolina did submit a request for an interstate designation (I-587) for US 264 from Zebulon (east of Raleigh) to Greenville. This request was denied, possibly indicating a new level of resistance by AASHTO to requests of this kind. Kentucky needs to take a careful look at this before putting in a request.

Did they already have their meeting? Where are you finding this info? Thanks in advance.

Page 48: http://highways.transportation.org/Documents/2016%20AM%20Boston%2c%20MA%20Mtg%20Materials/AM%202016%20Binder/SCOH%20Meeting%20Materials%20AM2016.pdf (http://highways.transportation.org/Documents/2016%20AM%20Boston%2c%20MA%20Mtg%20Materials/AM%202016%20Binder/SCOH%20Meeting%20Materials%20AM2016.pdf)

AASHTO's numbering committee met this month. AASHTO will still have their main meeting in November.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: hbelkins on October 26, 2016, 11:00:36 PM
Quote from: wdcrft63 on October 26, 2016, 05:08:49 PM
Kentucky did not submit any request for the I-65 spur to the November meeting. North Carolina did submit a request for an interstate designation (I-587) for US 264 from Zebulon (east of Raleigh) to Greenville. This request was denied, possibly indicating a new level of resistance by AASHTO to requests of this kind. Kentucky needs to take a careful look at this before putting in a request.

I'm getting the feeling that this designation will be written into law by Congress. And I don't think it will be Spur I-65, given its length, but an x65 instead.

And why should Kentucky take a careful look before putting in a request? Putting in a request doesn't cost anything.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: LM117 on October 26, 2016, 11:14:43 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on October 26, 2016, 11:00:36 PMAnd why should Kentucky take a careful look before putting in a request? Putting in a request doesn't cost anything.

Not to mention that AASHTO's reasons for rejecting Future I-587 in NC are total BS. Take a look at their reasons on page 47 in the link I posted above if you want a good laugh. There's a good chance FHWA will overrule AASHTO there and will probably do the same here, should Kentucky submit a request to AASHTO and get denied.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: english si on October 27, 2016, 05:53:21 AM
Perhaps KY saw who the delegates on USRN this time were and decided not to bother with future interstate designations as they knew that those people were clueless?

Next time the delegates will be different, so I-587 in NC, and the Natcher Pkwy designation might be approved.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: hbelkins on October 27, 2016, 09:20:50 PM
I think one of the main reasons NC's I-587 was denied was because so much of the road is not up to standards, as others more familiar with the route have noted.

As with the I-69 designation, there will probably have to be some sort of plan and schedule in place to upgrade the Natcher (and Audubon) before an approval will be granted.

Keep in mind that unless there is significant federal funding available, it will probably be awhile before any upgrades are done if they rely on state funds. Kentucky has called a halt to all state-funded projects until the Road Fund achieves a cash balance of $50 million, then already-scheduled projects are going to be re-prioritized.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Grzrd on November 04, 2016, 10:43:14 AM
This article (http://www.kentuckynewera.com/news/ap/article_80768a3a-9fd5-11e6-abda-439f051e90bc.html) reports that Kentucky officials are sending moral support to construction of I-67/MidState Corridor (prior discussion here (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=5513.msg120454#msg120454)) but they are concentrating their efforts on the upgrade to the i-65 Spur:

Quote
Owensboro-Daviess County officials say they still support the effort to turn U.S. 231 in southern Indiana into an interstate highway known as the MidState Corridor, which would link the William H. Natcher Bridge westward to I-69. But they say the future of that project now lies completely with Indiana.
Daviess County Judge-Executive Al Mattingly said he attended a meeting of the MidState Corridor development group on Oct. 10, along with Candance Brake, president of the Greater Owensboro Chamber of Commerce, and Rep. Suzanne Miles.
"They gave a report on what has happened and we gave a report on the I-65 spur and how we accomplished that," Mattingly said.
While no funding has been appropriated for the MidState Corridor, initially referred to as I-67, and its approximately 30 miles of new road construction, Kentucky has approved funding for interstate-level upgrades to the William H. Natcher Parkway from Bowling Green to Owensboro, Mattingly said.
"We've got a plan in Kentucky," Mattingly said. "They (Indiana backers of the MidState Corridor) are still talking about which side (of Huntingburg and Jasper) it will go. "
The MidState Corridor remains important to fulfilling the ultimate goal of an interstate highway from I-65 at Bowling Green to I-69, Mattingly said.
"It's a work in progress," Mattingly said. "Everybody is working for that ultimate goal. It's always been the goal to turn 231 into an interstate. ... We've taken the path that Indiana is working on the Indiana side and Kentucky is working on the Kentucky side."
Mattingly said his Indiana counterparts on the MidState Corridor group were pleased with the "Future Interstate 65 Spur" signs that went up on the Natcher Parkway in late August.
Owensboro Mayor Ron Payne
, also a member of the MidState Corridor group, did not attend the group's most recent meeting. But he said he remains interested in the project because of its potential impact on Owensboro and believes it will eventually happen.
"To my understanding, it is in the Indiana road plan and it is a matter of Indiana funding it," Payne said. "I've backed away because there is not much more we can do. We have indicated the significance of the road. It may not be called I-67, but it's going to happen." ....
In Indiana, the blue ribbon panel said, the state would need to build 29.6 miles of new four-lane road south from Petersburg in northern Pike County and upgrade 25.8 miles of U.S. 231 to the Natcher Bridge.

edit

The article also mentions that "Future I-65 Spur" signs were put up along the Natcher Parkway in late August.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: codyg1985 on November 04, 2016, 10:57:26 AM
Ugh. Just build a four-lane US 231 between I-64 and I-69 instead of making it a freeway. Then, if a freeway is warranted, then the upgrades will be easy from there.
Title: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: GreenLanternCorps on November 02, 2017, 03:48:35 PM
With the Natcher being designated a Future I-165.  I thought we needed a thread for it.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: GreenLanternCorps on November 02, 2017, 03:52:53 PM
I think that some construction has been started to upgrade the Natcher to interstate standards has already started.  But I am not sure where.  I am pretty sure that a good chunk of the freeway is already at interstate standards and there are only a few interchanges that need to be upgraded to get the road signed as I-165.

Will look for details if I get a chance (unless somebody beats me to it.)   :-D
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on November 02, 2017, 09:37:52 PM
Earlier this year there was a pavement rehab project underway just south of the WK Parkway, but I don't know of any other major construction on the Natcher.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: rickmastfan67 on November 02, 2017, 11:19:27 PM
Already did.  https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=14873.0

Will merge the threads later.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Captain Jack on November 03, 2017, 12:44:09 AM
Ran it today from Owensboro to Bowling Green. There is construction going on between the Beaver Dam interchange and the WK. Looks like they are working primarily in the median, with some surface work as well.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: GreenLanternCorps on November 03, 2017, 07:46:09 AM
Quote from: rickmastfan67 on November 02, 2017, 11:19:27 PM
Already did.  https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=14873.0

Will merge the threads later.

My apologies, did not see that thread.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: paulthemapguy on November 03, 2017, 11:44:10 PM
I wish it was I-365, just to eliminate duplicity, even if the other 165 is a good 500 miles away.  It makes sense as an odd x65 though.  Definitely one of the better numbering decisions AASHTO has made lately.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on November 06, 2017, 09:41:27 PM
Quote from: Captain Jack on November 03, 2017, 12:44:09 AM
Ran it today from Owensboro to Bowling Green. There is construction going on between the Beaver Dam interchange and the WK. Looks like they are working primarily in the median, with some surface work as well.

Work is about finished - they did a diamond-grinding job through there and as of Friday, the crews were taking out the median crossovers.  It'll bring my Owensboro-Bowling Green commutes back up to normal speed.
Title: Re: Natcher Parkway Upgrade to I-65 Spur
Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on February 13, 2018, 02:26:30 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on January 28, 2016, 04:27:08 PM
Interstate 565? I would have prefered the Interstate 165 designation for the William Natcher Parkway.
Congratulations. Your wish has been granted. They swapped I-565 for I-165.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: dvferyance on March 23, 2018, 01:07:23 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on November 03, 2017, 11:44:10 PM
I wish it was I-365, just to eliminate duplicity, even if the other 165 is a good 500 miles away.  It makes sense as an odd x65 though.  Definitely one of the better numbering decisions AASHTO has made lately.
Wasn't it going to be I-565? Now it's I-165 so it's good bet that next it will be I-365.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on March 23, 2018, 05:00:07 PM
Quote from: dvferyance on March 23, 2018, 01:07:23 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on November 03, 2017, 11:44:10 PM
I wish it was I-365, just to eliminate duplicity, even if the other 165 is a good 500 miles away.  It makes sense as an odd x65 though.  Definitely one of the better numbering decisions AASHTO has made lately.
Wasn't it going to be I-565? Now it's I-165 so it's good bet that next it will be I-365.

Unless someone with a degree of clout from Owensboro emulates Ron Payne, the former mayor, and pushes to get the Natcher (and the Audubon, for good measure) a 2di like 61 or 63.  Wouldn't put it past that crowd -- and I'm certain that with a bit of whining and/or cajoling they could get a Congressperson or two to "run with the ball" regarding such an effort.   
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Life in Paradise on March 24, 2018, 02:10:53 PM
Quote from: sparker on March 23, 2018, 05:00:07 PM
Quote from: dvferyance on March 23, 2018, 01:07:23 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on November 03, 2017, 11:44:10 PM
I wish it was I-365, just to eliminate duplicity, even if the other 165 is a good 500 miles away.  It makes sense as an odd x65 though.  Definitely one of the better numbering decisions AASHTO has made lately.
Wasn't it going to be I-565? Now it's I-165 so it's good bet that next it will be I-365.

Unless someone with a degree of clout from Owensboro emulates Ron Payne, the former mayor, and pushes to get the Natcher (and the Audubon, for good measure) a 2di like 61 or 63.  Wouldn't put it past that crowd -- and I'm certain that with a bit of whining and/or cajoling they could get a Congressperson or two to "run with the ball" regarding such an effort.   
If Kentucky were North Carolina or Texas, it would already have a 2-d assigned.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on March 24, 2018, 03:00:29 PM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on March 24, 2018, 02:10:53 PM
Quote from: sparker on March 23, 2018, 05:00:07 PM
Quote from: dvferyance on March 23, 2018, 01:07:23 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on November 03, 2017, 11:44:10 PM
I wish it was I-365, just to eliminate duplicity, even if the other 165 is a good 500 miles away.  It makes sense as an odd x65 though.  Definitely one of the better numbering decisions AASHTO has made lately.
Wasn't it going to be I-565? Now it's I-165 so it's good bet that next it will be I-365.

Unless someone with a degree of clout from Owensboro emulates Ron Payne, the former mayor, and pushes to get the Natcher (and the Audubon, for good measure) a 2di like 61 or 63.  Wouldn't put it past that crowd -- and I'm certain that with a bit of whining and/or cajoling they could get a Congressperson or two to "run with the ball" regarding such an effort.   
If Kentucky were North Carolina or Texas, it would already have a 2-d assigned.

Quite true -- but in NC and TX, the state DOT's tend to get behind such actions early on in the process; KYDOT doesn't seem to follow that leadership pattern, particularly in regards to designations -- or maybe since they've already got I-169 assigned to the southern Pennyrile, I-165 was considered appropriate for the Natcher.  In any case, there's a bit of work to do before any Interstate shields are deployed.   
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: seicer on March 24, 2018, 04:47:35 PM
Well, for one, there isn't much of a reason. The parkways have existed for decades before and the only reason they are being upgraded is that federal dollars can be assigned to projects that are needed: interchange reconstructions to remove the last vestiges of the toll plazas, for instance. Businesses that weren't enticed to locate along what is otherwise an interstate-grade highway won't locate just because it now has a shield.

In other states, the interstates are replacing two- and four-lane highways that are of not interstate-grade.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on April 07, 2018, 09:54:15 PM
2018's construction season looks like we're going to see revamped ramps at the Natcher and WKP. Work began recently on the NW-quadrant ramps (SB to WB and WB to SB) and it does appear that there will be a bit longer acceleration lane going SB to WB.  I think that was one of the things they had to do to the Pennyrile interchanges when they converted it to I-69.

Also, I've seen recently some survey work at the KY 69 interchange, so hopefully that gets converted from toll booth cloverleaf to diamond soon ...
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on September 06, 2018, 01:19:14 AM
Work has pretty well ramped up along the Natcher from south of Hartford to US 60. Modifications are being made to meet Interstate standards, and it appears the signs for I-165 will go up possibly as soon as next month:

https://www.owensborotimes.com/news/2018/09/modified-agreement-speeds-up-daviess-countys-i-165-spur-project/

So, at long last, Owensboro will have its Interstate ... just one with a 55 speed limit and 9-foot width limit through the end of next June. Still, it's progress!
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Interstate 69 Fan on March 06, 2019, 11:06:54 PM
Say hello to I-165!

]https://www.wbko.com/content/news/Natcher-Parkway-officially-changing-to-I-165-506778581.html] (https://www.wbko.com/content/news/Natcher-Parkway-officially-changing-to-I-165-506778581.html)
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: ctkatz on March 07, 2019, 03:34:45 AM
have they updated those old tollbooth exits yet? satellite images on google maps says no, but then again satellite images don't show the lincoln or lewis and clark bridges either on google earth.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: tdindy88 on March 07, 2019, 03:37:54 AM
Did I read that they are changing the exit numbers again? Weren't they just changed?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: 2trailertrucker on March 07, 2019, 05:30:17 AM
 Not all of the Natcher is being converted to I-165:

Drivers should look for new exit numbers at 11 interchanges. A section of the Natcher Parkway from the I-65 interchange to U.S. 231 Scottsville Road will not be a part of the I-165 designation due to federal guidelines. It will remain numbered as KY 9007. The Plano Road interchange will be renumbered to Exit 0.

From the WBKO link
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: mvak36 on March 07, 2019, 09:27:58 AM
Quote from: 2trailertrucker on March 07, 2019, 05:30:17 AM
Not all of the Natcher is being converted to I-165:

Drivers should look for new exit numbers at 11 interchanges. A section of the Natcher Parkway from the I-65 interchange to U.S. 231 Scottsville Road will not be a part of the I-165 designation due to federal guidelines. It will remain numbered as KY 9007. The Plano Road interchange will be renumbered to Exit 0.

From the WBKO link

That section looks like it's just east of I-65. If I had to guess, that's because it doesn't end at a road that's a part of the NHS.

Are they planning on upgrading the cloverleaf interchanges soon?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: tdindy88 on March 07, 2019, 09:49:14 AM
I just hope that they aren't changing the exit numbers back to what they original were. The northern end of what is now I-165 was Exit 70 at the Owensboro Bypass. Then it got changed to Exit 72. If it becomes Exit 70 again....

Making exit signs in Kentucky must be a lucrative business with this, along with all the renumbering on the other Kentucky parkways to the west.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on March 07, 2019, 11:18:41 AM
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 07, 2019, 09:49:14 AM
I just hope that they aren't changing the exit numbers back to what they original were. The northern end of what is now I-165 was Exit 70 at the Owensboro Bypass. Then it got changed to Exit 72. If it becomes Exit 70 again....

Making exit signs in Kentucky must be a lucrative business with this, along with all the renumbering on the other Kentucky parkways to the west.

My counterpart in Bowling Green tells me the exit numbers may not be the same as they were before, but I don't know why they wouldn't be.

I'm guessing that US 231 (Scottsville Road) IS on the NHS, but I don't know why the interstate designation doesn't extend to there.

Saw some pictures posted today of the first signage changes (on I-65 approaching the exit) and KY 9007 is being signed for the Natcher Parkway extension. This is now Kentucky's highest-numbered posted highway (previously a number of 6000-series frontage roads would have competed for that honor).

Interesting to note that they're using greenout for the route markers. Kentucky typically uses demountable copy and route markers, so I don't know why they chose to use greenout.

The toll booth cloverleafs have not yet been reconfigured. I guess they're signing it now because Congress dictated that it be signed. Sen. Rand Paul pushed this, probably because he lives in Bowling Green.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: rickmastfan67 on March 07, 2019, 10:07:04 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 07, 2019, 11:18:41 AM
Saw some pictures posted today of the first signage changes (on I-65 approaching the exit) and KY 9007 is being signed for the Natcher Parkway extension. This is now Kentucky's highest-numbered posted highway (previously a number of 6000-series frontage roads would have competed for that honor).

Here's a picture that I spotted on WBKO's website.
https://www.wbko.com/content/news/Crews-work-to-change-William-H-Natcher-signage-to-I-165-506830131.html
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on March 07, 2019, 11:55:03 PM
Supposedly Plano Rd (KY 622) is changing to Exit 0, so I have a feeling we're gonna split the difference between the original and current exit numbers. I-65 would be exits 1A and 1B, and US 60/231 would be 71A and 71B ... that is, if it goes as I think it's going.

UPDATE: District 3 posted the new exit numbers ... I was close.

1A/1B - I-65
3 - US 31W (Nashville Rd.)
5 - US 68/KY 80 (Russellville Rd.)
7 - US 231 (Morgantown Rd.)
26 - US 231/KY 79 (S. Main St.)
27 - KY 70 (Veterans Way)
33 - US 231 (Beaver Dam Rd.)
41A/41B - WK Parkway
47 - KY 69
70A/70B - US 60/231 (Wendell H. Ford Expwy.)


I'm OK with the greenouts, but why not at least center them???
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: GreenLanternCorps on March 08, 2019, 09:03:31 AM
Quote from: Interstate 69 Fan on March 06, 2019, 11:06:54 PM
Say hello to I-165!

]https://www.wbko.com/content/news/Natcher-Parkway-officially-changing-to-I-165-506778581.html] (https://www.wbko.com/content/news/Natcher-Parkway-officially-changing-to-I-165-506778581.html)

I'm kind of disappointed that they didn't call it the "first addition to the interstate system since 1992", like they kept doing for I-11 when it opened...
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on March 08, 2019, 11:21:39 AM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on March 07, 2019, 11:55:03 PM
Supposedly Plano Rd (KY 622) is changing to Exit 0, so I have a feeling we're gonna split the difference between the original and current exit numbers. I-65 would be exits 1A and 1B, and US 60/231 would be 71A and 71B ... that is, if it goes as I think it's going.

UPDATE: District 3 posted the new exit numbers ... I was close.

1A/1B - I-65
3 - US 31W (Nashville Rd.)
5 - US 68/KY 80 (Russellville Rd.)
7 - US 231 (Morgantown Rd.)
26 - US 231/KY 79 (S. Main St.)
27 - KY 70 (Veterans Way)
33 - US 231 (Beaver Dam Rd.)
41A/41B - WK Parkway
47 - KY 69
70A/70B - US 60/231 (Wendell H. Ford Expwy.)


I'm OK with the greenouts, but why not at least center them???

Most of those exit numbers are the same as what they were before the extension to US 231 was built. I think the US 31W, US 231 north of Morgantown, and KY 69 are one different than what they were before.

I also understand that the greenout signs are temporary, and that totally new signage is going to be installed. You can see the bases for the support posts for the new signs behind that one example that's been pictured on I-65. That's probably not a bad idea, as the signage along the parkway has been there for quite some time and probably doesn't meet modern reflectivity standards.

Now, maybe they'll add KY 80 to the US 68 exit signage.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on March 08, 2019, 12:23:46 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 08, 2019, 11:21:39 AM

Most of those exit numbers are the same as what they were before the extension to US 231 was built. I think the US 31W, US 231 north of Morgantown, and KY https://www.aaroads.com/forum/Themes/Button_Copy/images/bbc/table.gif69 are one different than what they were before.

I also understand that the greenout signs are temporary, and that totally new signage is going to be installed. You can see the bases for the support posts for the new signs behind that one example that's been pictured on I-65. That's probably not a bad idea, as the signage along the parkway has been there for quite some time and probably doesn't meet modern reflectivity standards.

Now, maybe they'll add KY 80 to the US 68 exit signage.

Yes. Going strictly from memory, US 231 at the old toll plaza was 34, and KY 69 was 48.  I want to say US 31W was 4, but I'm not 100% sure on that.  They won't have to change one sign NB just before US 60/231 ... it never got changed from 70 to 72.  Oops.

A lot of the signs are getting pretty rough.  It'll be nice to see 'em replaced.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: The Ghostbuster on March 08, 2019, 04:01:41 PM
Now that Interstate 165 has been officially designated, will the William Natcher Parkway name be decommissioned, like the Pennyrile Parkway name was done away with when it officially became part of Interstates 69 and 169?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on March 08, 2019, 04:28:44 PM
Some speculation:  now that Natcher's I-165, Pennyrile's a combo of I-69 & I-169, and the west end of WKY is also I-69 -- how long will it be before KY boosters push an Interstate designation for at least the remainder of the WKY if not the whole ball of wax, including the (former) Bluegrass toward Lexington?  I can see some reticence regarding the Bluegrass, seeing as how no realistic plan for connecting its east end to either I-64 or I-75 has gotten terribly far -- but the WKY, being a direct feed into I-69 (and eventually a commercial-traffic Nashville "avoider"), seems like one of the closest things to a "slam-dunk" as far as speculative Interstate corridors are concerned.   
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on March 08, 2019, 09:29:32 PM
Quote from: sparker on March 08, 2019, 04:28:44 PM
Some speculation:  now that Natcher's I-165, Pennyrile's a combo of I-69 & I-169, and the west end of WKY is also I-69 -- how long will it be before KY boosters push an Interstate designation for at least the remainder of the WKY if not the whole ball of wax, including the (former) Bluegrass toward Lexington?  I can see some reticence regarding the Bluegrass, seeing as how no realistic plan for connecting its east end to either I-64 or I-75 has gotten terribly far -- but the WKY, being a direct feed into I-69 (and eventually a commercial-traffic Nashville "avoider"), seems like one of the closest things to a "slam-dunk" as far as speculative Interstate corridors are concerned.   

Kentucky really isn't like North Carolina, so unless someone in the federal delegation pushes the issue, it probably won't happen.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on March 09, 2019, 05:07:22 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 08, 2019, 09:29:32 PM
Quote from: sparker on March 08, 2019, 04:28:44 PM
Some speculation:  now that Natcher's I-165, Pennyrile's a combo of I-69 & I-169, and the west end of WKY is also I-69 -- how long will it be before KY boosters push an Interstate designation for at least the remainder of the WKY if not the whole ball of wax, including the (former) Bluegrass toward Lexington?  I can see some reticence regarding the Bluegrass, seeing as how no realistic plan for connecting its east end to either I-64 or I-75 has gotten terribly far -- but the WKY, being a direct feed into I-69 (and eventually a commercial-traffic Nashville "avoider"), seems like one of the closest things to a "slam-dunk" as far as speculative Interstate corridors are concerned.   

Kentucky really isn't like North Carolina, so unless someone in the federal delegation pushes the issue, it probably won't happen.

That's probably correct; it'll likely take a push from a KY Congressional critter to get something like an I-designation for WKY off the ground.  The one thing I can see mitigating against that happening is that there just aren't many large towns along WKY -- or Bluegrass, for that matter -- that would instigate such a push (unlike the various Owensboro officials who have stirred a similar pot from time to time).  It would have to come from someone who looks at a map and decides the designation is a good idea -- and can connect with the right people to promote such a thing. 
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: wdcrft63 on March 09, 2019, 07:30:21 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 08, 2019, 09:29:32 PM
Quote from: sparker on March 08, 2019, 04:28:44 PM
Some speculation:  now that Natcher's I-165, Pennyrile's a combo of I-69 & I-169, and the west end of WKY is also I-69 -- how long will it be before KY boosters push an Interstate designation for at least the remainder of the WKY if not the whole ball of wax, including the (former) Bluegrass toward Lexington?  I can see some reticence regarding the Bluegrass, seeing as how no realistic plan for connecting its east end to either I-64 or I-75 has gotten terribly far -- but the WKY, being a direct feed into I-69 (and eventually a commercial-traffic Nashville "avoider"), seems like one of the closest things to a "slam-dunk" as far as speculative Interstate corridors are concerned.   

Kentucky really isn't like North Carolina, so unless someone in the federal delegation pushes the issue, it probably won't happen.
It's also true that in North Carolina the impetus for interstate expansion has come initially from localities. The difference is that North Carolina really has a lot of medium size cities that can become interested in having an interstate connection. Kentucky doesn't have so many.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on March 10, 2019, 01:18:50 AM
The WK could easily be an extension of I-71. It lines up nicely if you look at it on a map.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on March 10, 2019, 01:45:06 AM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on March 10, 2019, 01:18:50 AM
The WK could easily be an extension of I-71. It lines up nicely if you look at it on a map.

Actually, that's not a half-bad idea; a short multiplex down I-65 wouldn't be totally unreasonable.  But eventually some sort of direct connection/flyover from the EB WKY to NB I-65 would need to be constructed -- along with the usual elimination of the "bowtie" former tollbooth ramps along WKY's length.  Nevertheless, it'll still need some political impetus and follow-up moxie for such a designation change to happen -- much less programming the upgrades. 
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on March 10, 2019, 01:26:31 PM
Quote from: sparker on March 10, 2019, 01:45:06 AM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on March 10, 2019, 01:18:50 AM
The WK could easily be an extension of I-71. It lines up nicely if you look at it on a map.

Actually, that's not a half-bad idea; a short multiplex down I-65 wouldn't be totally unreasonable.  But eventually some sort of direct connection/flyover from the EB WKY to NB I-65 would need to be constructed -- along with the usual elimination of the "bowtie" former tollbooth ramps along WKY's length.  Nevertheless, it'll still need some political impetus and follow-up moxie for such a designation change to happen -- much less programming the upgrades.

There's only one of those left now, at US 431/KY 70 at Central City.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: The Ghostbuster on March 13, 2019, 01:46:23 PM
I would number the rest of the Western Kentucky Parkway Interstate 269, but I suppose numbering it as an extension of Interstate 71 is not a bad idea either.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: mvak36 on March 14, 2019, 12:22:26 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 07, 2019, 11:18:41 AM

I'm guessing that US 231 (Scottsville Road) IS on the NHS, but I don't know why the interstate designation doesn't extend to there.


The only other thing I can think of is that it had to start at I-65 since it's a spur off of it. But there are plenty of examples where that's not the case, like I-355 in Illinois.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on March 14, 2019, 12:48:14 AM
^^^^^^^^
I-355's an odd duck -- it not only crosses its parent, but terminates at two other Interstates: I-80 at the south end and I-290 at the north.  By all rights it should be I-455 -- but what's done is done, and it's been around for 30+ years as it is, so it's unlikely to ever change (particularly in Chicagoland!).  :-/

Getting back to I-165: I wonder which poster will get the first reassurance shield pix?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on March 14, 2019, 11:19:26 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on March 14, 2019, 12:22:26 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 07, 2019, 11:18:41 AM

I'm guessing that US 231 (Scottsville Road) IS on the NHS, but I don't know why the interstate designation doesn't extend to there.


The only other thing I can think of is that it had to start at I-65 since it's a spur off of it. But there are plenty of examples where that's not the case, like I-355 in Illinois.

Former I-181 is the one that comes to my mind.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: bandit957 on March 14, 2019, 11:20:38 AM
When will this be shown in the official shapefiles?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: ilpt4u on March 14, 2019, 02:42:01 PM
Quote from: sparker on March 14, 2019, 12:48:14 AM
^^^^^^^^
I-355's an odd duck -- it not only crosses its parent, but terminates at two other Interstates: I-80 at the south end and I-290 at the north.  By all rights it should be I-455 -- but what's done is done, and it's been around for 30+ years as it is, so it's unlikely to ever change (particularly in Chicagoland!).  :-/
At one point, I-455 was considered for the former North-South Tollway, to the point maps were printed with the 455 designation
(https://www.interstate-guide.com/images355/i-455_il_map.jpg)
Souced from https://www.interstate-guide.com/i-355_il.html

Also, when it first opened, the route endpoints were I-55 and I-290. The Southern Extension to I-80 came later.

Maybe someday, the Northern Corridor Extension to IL 120 can occur, and number the whole corridor 355

Regarding I-165, any chance KYTC and INDOT work to extend the designation, along US 231 to at least I-64? That stretch is already high quality, mostly limited access divided highway.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on March 14, 2019, 04:54:13 PM
231 between I-64 and the Ohio River is a four lane divided highway, but nowhere near limited access.  There are a lot of intersections, and Indiana has no interest in spending that kind of money on a road that is that lightly traveled.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on March 14, 2019, 05:43:00 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on March 14, 2019, 02:42:01 PM
Regarding I-165, any chance KYTC and INDOT work to extend the designation, along US 231 to at least I-64? That stretch is already high quality, mostly limited access divided highway.

That would be a not-bad idea; but chances are that despite any upgrades in KY (such as upgrades of the Natcher/US 60 interchange and replacing the north/east US 231/60 intersection with an interchange) the issue will be INDOT and their fiscal situation.  Maybe after section 6 of the I-69 extension is done, something like this could be revisited in IN -- but for the time being anything involving IN might be dicey at best.  A more likely scenario is some sort of extension westward over US 60 and segueing over to the Audubon Parkway, terminating at I-69 at Henderson.  Keeps the whole corridor in one jurisdiction -- and at one time the I-369 designation was considered for the Audubon.  But if either an Audubon or US 231 extension were to gain serious consideration, I wouldn't be surprised to see the Owensboro mayoral office (regardless of occupant; they all have seemed to be infected with Interstate fever!) suggest a designation change to a 2di (maybe I-63?).
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: ilpt4u on March 14, 2019, 05:57:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 14, 2019, 04:54:13 PM
231 between I-64 and the Ohio River is a four lane divided highway, but nowhere near limited access.  There are a lot of intersections, and Indiana has no interest in spending that kind of money on a road that is that lightly traveled.
I've driven it - not a whole lot of intersections. I don't recall many lights at all. And not much in the ways of driveways either.

It is certainly not fully access controlled, but access is limited/controlled to a point

Plenty of ROW and land for frontage roads and grade separations, if an Interstate upgrade were ever to pass.

I confess, this would be years down the road. Not saying put Shields up tomorrow
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on March 15, 2019, 12:00:49 AM
Quote from: ilpt4u on March 14, 2019, 05:57:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 14, 2019, 04:54:13 PM
231 between I-64 and the Ohio River is a four lane divided highway, but nowhere near limited access.  There are a lot of intersections, and Indiana has no interest in spending that kind of money on a road that is that lightly traveled.
I've driven it - not a whole lot of intersections. I don't recall many lights at all. And not much in the ways of driveways either.

It is certainly not fully access controlled, but access is limited/controlled to a point

Plenty of ROW and land for frontage roads and grade separations, if an Interstate upgrade were ever to pass.

I confess, this would be years down the road. Not saying put Shields up tomorrow

By my count, there are 10 at-grade intersections and 3 interchanges.

And I'm working to get a shield shot ... they aren't far enough north yet for my route to take me past one. Hopefully they get north of the WKP soon!
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on March 15, 2019, 08:27:44 PM
If no one gets a picture by the time of the Memphis meet, and if I go, I will be able to get one. I'll definitely be on the route between I-65 and US 68 either going to Memphis, or coming home.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on March 19, 2019, 03:21:19 PM
(https://scontent-ort2-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/55557207_1263857420446536_1896901061084446720_n.jpg?_nc_cat=102&_nc_ht=scontent-ort2-2.xx&oh=6855b51814c5f29cf56444430594aea2&oe=5D0D5550)

From the KYTC District 3 page.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on March 19, 2019, 09:33:29 PM
Mile markers have been changed out northbound as far north as Kentucky 69.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: The Ghostbuster on March 20, 2019, 03:11:58 PM
Does anyone think the Audubon Parkway is the next Kentucky Parkway that will join the Interstate System (possibly as Interstate 369)?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on March 20, 2019, 03:14:20 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on March 20, 2019, 03:11:58 PM
Does anyone think the Audubon Parkway is the next Kentucky Parkway that will join the Interstate System (possibly as Interstate 369)?

The "Future I-69 Spur" signs were actually removed from the Audubon a few years ago. And it doesn't actually connect to I-69 yet. I-69 ends at US 41 (formerly KY 425) just south of the Audubon.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Stephane Dumas on March 20, 2019, 04:49:09 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 19, 2019, 03:21:19 PM
From the KYTC District 3 page.

Let's see who between Google Maps/Bing Maps/Open StreetMap/Mapquest will mention I-165 first? ;)
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on March 20, 2019, 07:44:47 PM
Quote from: Stephane Dumas on March 20, 2019, 04:49:09 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 19, 2019, 03:21:19 PM
From the KYTC District 3 page.

Let's see who between Google Maps/Bing Maps/Open StreetMap/Mapquest will mention I-165 first? ;)

Google keeps mislabeling the portion of the Pennyrile Parkway south of I-69 as I-169, despite repeated requests by KYTC to correct the error.

Don't believe everything you see on Google. They incorrectly list a rest area phone number as the direct line to my desk, and again, repeated requests to correct the error go unheeded.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Roadsguy on March 20, 2019, 07:57:28 PM
Quote from: mvak36 on March 07, 2019, 09:27:58 AM
Quote from: 2trailertrucker on March 07, 2019, 05:30:17 AM
Not all of the Natcher is being converted to I-165:

Drivers should look for new exit numbers at 11 interchanges. A section of the Natcher Parkway from the I-65 interchange to U.S. 231 Scottsville Road will not be a part of the I-165 designation due to federal guidelines. It will remain numbered as KY 9007. The Plano Road interchange will be renumbered to Exit 0.

From the WBKO link

That section looks like it's just east of I-65. If I had to guess, that's because it doesn't end at a road that's a part of the NHS.

That part of US 231 is part of the NHS, though, according to the FHWA map (http://hepgis.fhwa.dot.gov/fhwagis/#).
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: GreenLanternCorps on March 20, 2019, 09:48:46 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 20, 2019, 07:44:47 PM
Quote from: Stephane Dumas on March 20, 2019, 04:49:09 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 19, 2019, 03:21:19 PM
From the KYTC District 3 page.

Let's see who between Google Maps/Bing Maps/Open StreetMap/Mapquest will mention I-165 first? ;)

Google keeps mislabeling the portion of the Pennyrile Parkway south of I-69 as I-169, despite repeated requests by KYTC to correct the error.

Don't believe everything you see on Google. They incorrectly list a rest area phone number as the direct line to my desk, and again, repeated requests to correct the error go unheeded.

As does Wikipedia, they also have I-169 even though it is not signed yet. (Though they note it is unsigned.)
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Roadsguy on March 20, 2019, 11:41:47 PM
Quote from: GreenLanternCorps on March 20, 2019, 09:48:46 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 20, 2019, 07:44:47 PM
Quote from: Stephane Dumas on March 20, 2019, 04:49:09 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 19, 2019, 03:21:19 PM
From the KYTC District 3 page.

Let's see who between Google Maps/Bing Maps/Open StreetMap/Mapquest will mention I-165 first? ;)

Google keeps mislabeling the portion of the Pennyrile Parkway south of I-69 as I-169, despite repeated requests by KYTC to correct the error.

Don't believe everything you see on Google. They incorrectly list a rest area phone number as the direct line to my desk, and again, repeated requests to correct the error go unheeded.

As does Wikipedia, they also have I-169 even though it is not signed yet. (Though they note it is unsigned.)

Though I do notice Google currently doesn't have any I-169 shields on the Pennyrile Parkway. If you go to report a problem and select the entire road, Interstate 169 isn't even an option. It seems they finally listened.

Meanwhile, OSM shows both I-169 and I-165 along their entire lengths.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Hot Rod Hootenanny on March 21, 2019, 10:49:12 AM
Any day now on I-169, right?
(Taken 2 months ago)
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7921/46318460815_0d15de7e50_z.jpg)
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on March 21, 2019, 12:06:29 PM
Quote from: Roadsguy on March 20, 2019, 11:41:47 PM
Quote from: GreenLanternCorps on March 20, 2019, 09:48:46 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 20, 2019, 07:44:47 PM
Quote from: Stephane Dumas on March 20, 2019, 04:49:09 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 19, 2019, 03:21:19 PM
From the KYTC District 3 page.

Let's see who between Google Maps/Bing Maps/Open StreetMap/Mapquest will mention I-165 first? ;)

Google keeps mislabeling the portion of the Pennyrile Parkway south of I-69 as I-169, despite repeated requests by KYTC to correct the error.

Don't believe everything you see on Google. They incorrectly list a rest area phone number as the direct line to my desk, and again, repeated requests to correct the error go unheeded.

As does Wikipedia, they also have I-169 even though it is not signed yet. (Though they note it is unsigned.)

Though I do notice Google currently doesn't have any I-169 shields on the Pennyrile Parkway. If you go to report a problem and select the entire road, Interstate 169 isn't even an option. It seems they finally listened.

Meanwhile, OSM shows both I-169 and I-165 along their entire lengths.

Rand McNally's 2019 US road atlas also shows I-169 on the Pennyrile.  The error's gone mainstream! :pan:
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on March 21, 2019, 11:31:36 PM
So much for the thing being done in 2 weeks ... they still don't have all the mile markers done, and no other signs have been installed or modified from the WKP north.  Hope these guys aren't getting paid by the hour!
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: roadman65 on March 22, 2019, 12:06:32 AM
So this means that I-66 is dead in KY?  Being the part from I-65 to the WP (Western Kentucky Pky) was to be part of that proposal and now I-165 is applied (and approved by the feds) I guess it really is dead now.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on March 22, 2019, 01:44:57 AM
Quote from: roadman65 on March 22, 2019, 12:06:32 AM
So this means that I-66 is dead in KY?  Being the part from I-65 to the WP (Western Kentucky Pky) was to be part of that proposal and now I-165 is applied (and approved by the feds) I guess it really is dead now.

Maybe.......maybe not.  It's interesting that the only legal definition for I-66's KY route specified that it would serve Russellville, Hopkinsville, and Benton -- three locations that would be bypassed by a Natcher/WKY routing.  It's more than likely that the parkway-based I-66 alternative was prompted by the I-69 precedent that placed that route on the parkways rather than on a more straightline alignment between Henderson and the Purchase Parkway.   At this time it doesn't seem as if any move is afoot to engage in any development along the US 68/KY 80 corridor except for the Somerset bypass and spot improvements to the Hal Rogers segment.  Besides the Natcher upgrade work, KY has the 6-laning of I-65 to complete before significant new projects can or should be considered.  I'd consider I-66 dormant rather than irreparably dead.   
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Revive 755 on March 22, 2019, 06:19:47 PM
Since there's a project building stubs at the KY 80/KY 413 interchange with "future SNB I-66" on the map (see Page 37/96 of https://www.transportation.gov/sites/dot.gov/files/docs/policy-initiatives/327856/build-2018-fact-sheets.pdf (https://www.transportation.gov/sites/dot.gov/files/docs/policy-initiatives/327856/build-2018-fact-sheets.pdf)), I think I-66 is best classified as 'mostly dormant'.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: The Ghostbuster on March 25, 2019, 02:02:21 PM
If Interstate 66 ever sees the light of day in Kentucky, I'd probably die of shock.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on March 28, 2019, 01:30:08 PM
We're getting closer. The exits are all renumbered from the WKP north, and the BGSes at the WKP have their new shields. Gov. Bevin and company announced earlier in the week that the new permanent signage should be up by early June.

As much as I like the new designation, I'll just be happy when they finish the construction work they started last fall!  Do we have a timeline on the interchange rebuilds yet?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: WKDAVE on April 01, 2019, 04:59:05 PM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on March 28, 2019, 01:30:08 PM
We're getting closer. The exits are all renumbered from the WKP north, and the BGSes at the WKP have their new shields. Gov. Bevin and company announced earlier in the week that the new permanent signage should be up by early June.

As much as I like the new designation, I'll just be happy when they finish the construction work they started last fall!  Do we have a timeline on the interchange rebuilds yet?

State Budget Plan has 2021 when they will start construction on replacing all 3 toll booth interchanges.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: The Ghostbuster on April 02, 2019, 03:45:01 PM
Shouldn't they have upgraded the toll booth interchanges before putting up the Interstate shields? That is how I would have done it.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on April 02, 2019, 04:11:46 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on April 02, 2019, 03:45:01 PM
Shouldn't they have upgraded the toll booth interchanges before putting up the Interstate shields? That is how I would have done it.

Probably some local pressure (likely from Owensboro) to get the road signed a.s.a.p.  Squeaky wheel and all that!
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on April 02, 2019, 10:11:12 PM
Quote from: sparker on April 02, 2019, 04:11:46 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on April 02, 2019, 03:45:01 PM
Shouldn't they have upgraded the toll booth interchanges before putting up the Interstate shields? That is how I would have done it.

Probably some local pressure (likely from Owensboro) to get the road signed a.s.a.p.  Squeaky wheel and all that!

Rep. Brett Guthrie and Sen. Rand Paul were both very much in favor of this. Wouldn't be surprised if they influenced FHWA's decision to go ahead and sign it as an interstate.

If Breezewood can be allowed to exist on the system, then a toll booth cloverleaf is hardly anything to get worked up over, especially considering that the relatively low traffic volumes at those exits pretty much negates any issues with the weaving involved.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on April 04, 2019, 01:41:32 AM
Quote from: WKDAVE on April 01, 2019, 04:59:05 PM
State Budget Plan has 2021 when they will start construction on replacing all 3 toll booth interchanges.

Thanks!
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on April 04, 2019, 01:45:50 AM
Quote from: sparker on April 02, 2019, 04:11:46 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on April 02, 2019, 03:45:01 PM
Shouldn't they have upgraded the toll booth interchanges before putting up the Interstate shields? That is how I would have done it.

Probably some local pressure (likely from Owensboro) to get the road signed a.s.a.p.  Squeaky wheel and all that!

Bowling Green has more clout than Owensboro - and it shows, since more of their signage work has been done than has been up this way.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: The Ghostbuster on April 08, 2019, 03:46:46 PM
Google Maps still shows the whole route as KY 9007. Interstate 169 isn't marked on the southern portion of the Pennyrile either.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on April 08, 2019, 07:58:32 PM
Quote from: sparker on March 08, 2019, 04:28:44 PM
Some speculation:  now that Natcher's I-165, Pennyrile's a combo of I-69 & I-169, and the west end of WKY is also I-69 -- how long will it be before KY boosters push an Interstate designation for at least the remainder of the WKY if not the whole ball of wax, including the (former) Bluegrass toward Lexington?  I can see some reticence regarding the Bluegrass, seeing as how no realistic plan for connecting its east end to either I-64 or I-75 has gotten terribly far -- but the WKY, being a direct feed into I-69 (and eventually a commercial-traffic Nashville "avoider"), seems like one of the closest things to a "slam-dunk" as far as speculative Interstate corridors are concerned.   

Well, that certainly didn't take long!  Looks like KY political critters are getting infected by Interstate fever!  (and check out the thread addressing such in this region).   I guess they're close enough to NC to catch the spores, viruses, or whatever.  It'll be interesting to see how this all plays out -- or how many limited-access parkways will be left standing on their own w/o I-status a few years down the line. 
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: MNHighwayMan on April 08, 2019, 09:20:11 PM
Quote from: sparker on April 08, 2019, 07:58:32 PM
I guess they're close enough to NC to catch the spores, viruses, or whatever.

Mind parasite.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on April 09, 2019, 02:39:56 AM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on April 08, 2019, 03:46:46 PM
Google Maps still shows the whole route as KY 9007. Interstate 169 isn't marked on the southern portion of the Pennyrile either.

Just ordered a 2020 Rand McNally atlas; should get here sometime after 4/15.  Then we'll see if the I-169 shield that was applied to the southern Pennyrile in the 2019 edition is still shown.  Not like McNally to jump the gun; that's basically S.O.P. for Google and other open-form mapping services. 
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: GreenLanternCorps on April 12, 2019, 09:02:46 AM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on April 08, 2019, 03:46:46 PM
Google Maps still shows the whole route as KY 9007. Interstate 169 isn't marked on the southern portion of the Pennyrile either.

Google maps now has I-165 marked from Bowling Green to Owensboro.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: The Ghostbuster on April 12, 2019, 05:20:39 PM
So they have. Good for them!
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: dvferyance on April 12, 2019, 05:33:14 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 14, 2019, 11:19:26 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on March 14, 2019, 12:22:26 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 07, 2019, 11:18:41 AM

I'm guessing that US 231 (Scottsville Road) IS on the NHS, but I don't know why the interstate designation doesn't extend to there.


The only other thing I can think of is that it had to start at I-65 since it's a spur off of it. But there are plenty of examples where that's not the case, like I-355 in Illinois.

Former I-181 is the one that comes to my mind.
I-516
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Verlanka on April 14, 2019, 09:09:54 AM
Quote from: dvferyance on April 12, 2019, 05:33:14 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 14, 2019, 11:19:26 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on March 14, 2019, 12:22:26 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 07, 2019, 11:18:41 AM

I'm guessing that US 231 (Scottsville Road) IS on the NHS, but I don't know why the interstate designation doesn't extend to there.


The only other thing I can think of is that it had to start at I-65 since it's a spur off of it. But there are plenty of examples where that's not the case, like I-355 in Illinois.

Former I-181 is the one that comes to my mind.
I-516

How about I-287?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on April 14, 2019, 12:16:05 PM
Quote from: Verlanka on April 14, 2019, 09:09:54 AM
Quote from: dvferyance on April 12, 2019, 05:33:14 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 14, 2019, 11:19:26 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on March 14, 2019, 12:22:26 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on March 07, 2019, 11:18:41 AM

I'm guessing that US 231 (Scottsville Road) IS on the NHS, but I don't know why the interstate designation doesn't extend to there.


The only other thing I can think of is that it had to start at I-65 since it's a spur off of it. But there are plenty of examples where that's not the case, like I-355 in Illinois.

Former I-181 is the one that comes to my mind.
I-516

How about I-287?

There are a few examples of even 3di's (non-full-beltway) that don't terminate at a parent.  In CA, there's I-605, TX has I-635, PA's I-476.  In NY, I-287 was originally supposed to end at I-87 when that route extended up the east side of the Hudson River to I-84; the portion across Westchester County was originally to be I-487.  But that was changed in the late '60's, with the I-487 designation replaced by an extension of I-287.  But then NYC metro is full of 3di's that don't meet their parent routes because of multiple route truncations over the years (I-495, all the x78's).
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Life in Paradise on April 14, 2019, 07:59:09 PM
Even though I-165 is now listed for the Green River/Natcher Parkway between Bowling Green and Owensboro, I-165 is only actually signed just for the first few miles around Bowling Green.  I went through there yesterday, and there are quite a few signs that will need to go up.  They have also appeared to locate almost all of the orange and white barrels in Kentucky so that they could put them around all of the guardrails that they were replacing.  I have never, ever seen so many barrels in a 70 mile stretch.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on April 15, 2019, 01:42:29 AM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on April 14, 2019, 07:59:09 PM
Even though I-165 is now listed for the Green River/Natcher Parkway between Bowling Green and Owensboro, I-165 is only actually signed just for the first few miles around Bowling Green.  I went through there yesterday, and there are quite a few signs that will need to go up.  They have also appeared to locate almost all of the orange and white barrels in Kentucky so that they could put them around all of the guardrails that they were replacing.  I have never, ever seen so many barrels in a 70 mile stretch.

The replacement process seems to have bogged down. It took them two weeks just to put all the greenouts up, and even then, they missed a couple at US 60. At the rate they're going, we might see the old tollbooth interchanges rebuilt first!  :crazy:
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: The Ghostbuster on April 17, 2019, 01:29:04 PM
Well, we can't expect new highway designations to be fully signposted overnight, can we?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on April 17, 2019, 11:42:23 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on April 17, 2019, 01:29:04 PM
Well, we can't expect new highway designations to be fully signposted overnight, can we?

No, but when they said they'd have at least the temporary signage done in 2 weeks, that should have been doable.

I saw my first I-165 reassurance sign earlier tonight, posted just north of the Hartford exit. It had to have been put up today, because it wasn't there last night.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on April 18, 2019, 02:12:38 PM
I don't know which contractor is doing that job, but at least one signage contractor in Kentucky is also in the guardrail installation business. They may have had a contract that had a completion date upcoming that required the attention of their crews.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on April 18, 2019, 11:24:23 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on April 18, 2019, 02:12:38 PM
I don't know which contractor is doing that job, but at least one signage contractor in Kentucky is also in the guardrail installation business. They may have had a contract that had a completion date upcoming that required the attention of their crews.

Could well have been the guys doing the guardrail work that's being done as part of the modifications in Ohio and Daviess counties. I don't know for sure, because they're off the job before I drive through every night. It looks like they're replacing almost all the rails in both counties.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Avalanchez71 on May 25, 2019, 01:14:02 AM
Quote from: sparker on March 22, 2019, 01:44:57 AM
Quote from: roadman65 on March 22, 2019, 12:06:32 AM
So this means that I-66 is dead in KY?  Being the part from I-65 to the WP (Western Kentucky Pky) was to be part of that proposal and now I-165 is applied (and approved by the feds) I guess it really is dead now.

Maybe.......maybe not.  It's interesting that the only legal definition for I-66's KY route specified that it would serve Russellville, Hopkinsville, and Benton -- three locations that would be bypassed by a Natcher/WKY routing.  It's more than likely that the parkway-based I-66 alternative was prompted by the I-69 precedent that placed that route on the parkways rather than on a more straightline alignment between Henderson and the Purchase Parkway.   At this time it doesn't seem as if any move is afoot to engage in any development along the US 68/KY 80 corridor except for the Somerset bypass and spot improvements to the Hal Rogers segment.  Besides the Natcher upgrade work, KY has the 6-laning of I-65 to complete before significant new projects can or should be considered.  I'd consider I-66 dormant rather than irreparably dead.   
North Carolina was successful in getting I-496 renumbered as I-87.  Then there was I-181 that is now I-26 in Tennessee.  I know there are other examples out there.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on May 26, 2019, 05:34:23 AM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on May 25, 2019, 01:14:02 AM
Quote from: sparker on March 22, 2019, 01:44:57 AM
Quote from: roadman65 on March 22, 2019, 12:06:32 AM
So this means that I-66 is dead in KY?  Being the part from I-65 to the WP (Western Kentucky Pky) was to be part of that proposal and now I-165 is applied (and approved by the feds) I guess it really is dead now.

Maybe.......maybe not.  It's interesting that the only legal definition for I-66's KY route specified that it would serve Russellville, Hopkinsville, and Benton -- three locations that would be bypassed by a Natcher/WKY routing.  It's more than likely that the parkway-based I-66 alternative was prompted by the I-69 precedent that placed that route on the parkways rather than on a more straightline alignment between Henderson and the Purchase Parkway.   At this time it doesn't seem as if any move is afoot to engage in any development along the US 68/KY 80 corridor except for the Somerset bypass and spot improvements to the Hal Rogers segment.  Besides the Natcher upgrade work, KY has the 6-laning of I-65 to complete before significant new projects can or should be considered.  I'd consider I-66 dormant rather than irreparably dead.   
North Carolina was successful in getting I-496 renumbered as I-87.  Then there was I-181 that is now I-26 in Tennessee.  I know there are other examples out there.

I'm just surprised that the mayor's office in Owensboro (which seems to attract publicity hounds!) didn't lobby their local congressfolks for a 2di/trunk number for the Natcher -- or even a combination including that parkway plus the Audubon and US 60 as a connector between the two -- something like I-61 or I-63.  Since they put a lot of effort into their abortive "I-67" proposal a few years back, something like that would have been right up their alley, so to speak! 
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on May 26, 2019, 07:53:39 PM
Quote from: sparker on May 26, 2019, 05:34:23 AM
I'm just surprised that the mayor's office in Owensboro (which seems to attract publicity hounds!) didn't lobby their local congressfolks for a 2di/trunk number for the Natcher -- or even a combination including that parkway plus the Audubon and US 60 as a connector between the two -- something like I-61 or I-63.  Since they put a lot of effort into their abortive "I-67" proposal a few years back, something like that would have been right up their alley, so to speak!

Shhhhh ... don't provoke them. I-165 is just fine with us.  :cool:

Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on May 27, 2019, 12:08:32 AM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on May 26, 2019, 07:53:39 PM
Quote from: sparker on May 26, 2019, 05:34:23 AM
I'm just surprised that the mayor's office in Owensboro (which seems to attract publicity hounds!) didn't lobby their local congressfolks for a 2di/trunk number for the Natcher -- or even a combination including that parkway plus the Audubon and US 60 as a connector between the two -- something like I-61 or I-63.  Since they put a lot of effort into their abortive "I-67" proposal a few years back, something like that would have been right up their alley, so to speak!

Shhhhh ... don't provoke them. I-165 is just fine with us.  :cool:



I wouldn't worry about that -- it's not like they read this forum (or else they probably would have gotten the idea prior to designating I-165!).   Unless the idea would have been dangled right in front of their faces, they probably wouldn't have come up with such on their own -- some politicos become blinded by grandiose plans (like an I-67 up to Bloomington) that in reality have zero chances of implementation, simply because plans such as that that require multi-jurisdictional cooperation rarely can get their "ducks in a row".  So they tend to ignore or fail to recognize something that might be doable (like an all-KY 2di route) -- an example of not considering the practical in favor of the extravagant.  Their loss -- they'll just have to live with what was decided in their absence!
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on May 27, 2019, 02:43:36 PM
Quote from: sparker on May 27, 2019, 12:08:32 AM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on May 26, 2019, 07:53:39 PM
Quote from: sparker on May 26, 2019, 05:34:23 AM
I'm just surprised that the mayor's office in Owensboro (which seems to attract publicity hounds!) didn't lobby their local congressfolks for a 2di/trunk number for the Natcher -- or even a combination including that parkway plus the Audubon and US 60 as a connector between the two -- something like I-61 or I-63.  Since they put a lot of effort into their abortive "I-67" proposal a few years back, something like that would have been right up their alley, so to speak!

Shhhhh ... don't provoke them. I-165 is just fine with us.  :cool:



I wouldn't worry about that -- it's not like they read this forum (or else they probably would have gotten the idea prior to designating I-165!).   Unless the idea would have been dangled right in front of their faces, they probably wouldn't have come up with such on their own -- some politicos become blinded by grandiose plans (like an I-67 up to Bloomington) that in reality have zero chances of implementation, simply because plans such as that that require multi-jurisdictional cooperation rarely can get their "ducks in a row".  So they tend to ignore or fail to recognize something that might be doable (like an all-KY 2di route) -- an example of not considering the practical in favor of the extravagant.  Their loss -- they'll just have to live with what was decided in their absence!

I-165 was basically the idea of Sen. Rand Paul, who's from Bowling Green. If the city fathers in Owensboro are like their fellow local officials all across Kentucky, they are in frequent contact with the federal delegation. And the current state administration in Frankfort is doing more outreach to local governments than has been done in several years. The Owensboro leaders probably knew about I-165 long before the rest of the public did.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on May 28, 2019, 02:01:19 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 27, 2019, 02:43:36 PM
Quote from: sparker on May 27, 2019, 12:08:32 AM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on May 26, 2019, 07:53:39 PM
Quote from: sparker on May 26, 2019, 05:34:23 AM
I'm just surprised that the mayor's office in Owensboro (which seems to attract publicity hounds!) didn't lobby their local congressfolks for a 2di/trunk number for the Natcher -- or even a combination including that parkway plus the Audubon and US 60 as a connector between the two -- something like I-61 or I-63.  Since they put a lot of effort into their abortive "I-67" proposal a few years back, something like that would have been right up their alley, so to speak!

Shhhhh ... don't provoke them. I-165 is just fine with us.  :cool:



I wouldn't worry about that -- it's not like they read this forum (or else they probably would have gotten the idea prior to designating I-165!).   Unless the idea would have been dangled right in front of their faces, they probably wouldn't have come up with such on their own -- some politicos become blinded by grandiose plans (like an I-67 up to Bloomington) that in reality have zero chances of implementation, simply because plans such as that that require multi-jurisdictional cooperation rarely can get their "ducks in a row".  So they tend to ignore or fail to recognize something that might be doable (like an all-KY 2di route) -- an example of not considering the practical in favor of the extravagant.  Their loss -- they'll just have to live with what was decided in their absence!

I-165 was basically the idea of Sen. Rand Paul, who's from Bowling Green. If the city fathers in Owensboro are like their fellow local officials all across Kentucky, they are in frequent contact with the federal delegation. And the current state administration in Frankfort is doing more outreach to local governments than has been done in several years. The Owensboro leaders probably knew about I-165 long before the rest of the public did.

Well now -- maybe the Owensboro mayor's office has finally kicked their "jonesing" for a 2di for their city, and are accepting the current designation selection.  But I wonder if the idea of similarly designating the Audubon and connectors -- an idea that seems to have been back-burnered or even discarded this decade -- will ever be revived?  -- it seems to be an obvious extension of I-165 or even a x69 (apparently it was suggested as I-369 in the '00's) -- with the requisite modifications, of course. 
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on May 28, 2019, 02:40:26 PM
Quote from: sparker on May 28, 2019, 02:01:19 AM
Well now -- maybe the Owensboro mayor's office has finally kicked their "jonesing" for a 2di for their city, and are accepting the current designation selection.  But I wonder if the idea of similarly designating the Audubon and connectors -- an idea that seems to have been back-burnered or even discarded this decade -- will ever be revived?  -- it seems to be an obvious extension of I-165 or even a x69 (apparently it was suggested as I-369 in the '00's) -- with the requisite modifications, of course.

The "Future I-69 Spur" signs have been long-gone from the Audubon for some time now, and I never was able to find out why they were removed.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: LM117 on May 28, 2019, 03:23:52 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 28, 2019, 02:40:26 PM
Quote from: sparker on May 28, 2019, 02:01:19 AM
Well now -- maybe the Owensboro mayor's office has finally kicked their "jonesing" for a 2di for their city, and are accepting the current designation selection.  But I wonder if the idea of similarly designating the Audubon and connectors -- an idea that seems to have been back-burnered or even discarded this decade -- will ever be revived?  -- it seems to be an obvious extension of I-165 or even a x69 (apparently it was suggested as I-369 in the '00's) -- with the requisite modifications, of course.

The "Future I-69 Spur" signs have been long-gone from the Audubon for some time now, and I never was able to find out why they were removed.

Could be an oversight. The Future I-785 signs here in Danville on US-29 were taken down a few years ago, but VDOT put them back up fairly recently after the city council pestered them about it. Funny thing is that the city had no clue the signs were taken down until a resident pointed it out to them.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: WKDAVE on May 29, 2019, 02:52:22 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 28, 2019, 02:40:26 PM
Quote from: sparker on May 28, 2019, 02:01:19 AM
Well now -- maybe the Owensboro mayor's office has finally kicked their "jonesing" for a 2di for their city, and are accepting the current designation selection.  But I wonder if the idea of similarly designating the Audubon and connectors -- an idea that seems to have been back-burnered or even discarded this decade -- will ever be revived?  -- it seems to be an obvious extension of I-165 or even a x69 (apparently it was suggested as I-369 in the '00's) -- with the requisite modifications, of course.

The "Future I-69 Spur" signs have been long-gone from the Audubon for some time now, and I never was able to find out why they were removed.


Regarding couple of issues...
Audubon I-69 Spur....problem is that a spur must connect to existing Interstate. Even though it is less than 1 mile from I-69 it can't become spur until it touches it. Request was made to extend I-69 up to end of old Pennyrile/Zion Road exit but that has been initially denied as it is "part" of bridge crossing plan. If that ever changes then Audubon spur will be front burner again.

2 Digit I using Audubon/US 60/Natcher....idea was looked at as part of I-65/I-69 Spurs study by state (Palmer Study 2014). To upgrade the 7 miles of US 60 to Interstate standards, including "continuity," was estimated to cost between $50-$70 million.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on May 29, 2019, 04:15:47 PM
Quote from: WKDAVE on May 29, 2019, 02:52:22 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 28, 2019, 02:40:26 PM
Quote from: sparker on May 28, 2019, 02:01:19 AM
Well now -- maybe the Owensboro mayor's office has finally kicked their "jonesing" for a 2di for their city, and are accepting the current designation selection.  But I wonder if the idea of similarly designating the Audubon and connectors -- an idea that seems to have been back-burnered or even discarded this decade -- will ever be revived?  -- it seems to be an obvious extension of I-165 or even a x69 (apparently it was suggested as I-369 in the '00's) -- with the requisite modifications, of course.

The "Future I-69 Spur" signs have been long-gone from the Audubon for some time now, and I never was able to find out why they were removed.


Regarding couple of issues...
Audubon I-69 Spur....problem is that a spur must connect to existing Interstate. Even though it is less than 1 mile from I-69 it can't become spur until it touches it. Request was made to extend I-69 up to end of old Pennyrile/Zion Road exit but that has been initially denied as it is "part" of bridge crossing plan. If that ever changes then Audubon spur will be front burner again.

2 Digit I using Audubon/US 60/Natcher....idea was looked at as part of I-65/I-69 Spurs study by state (Palmer Study 2014). To upgrade the 7 miles of US 60 to Interstate standards, including "continuity," was estimated to cost between $50-$70 million.

The fact that "continuity" is an issue isn't surprising, seeing that both Natcher and Audubon trumpet interchanges with US 60 are oriented in the wrong direction; a NB/WB continuous route would have to take both loops.  That upgrade in itself would probably account for much of the expenditures if the through-route concept were to become reality. 
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Captain Jack on May 29, 2019, 07:37:57 PM
Northbound I-165 (Natcher) to westbound US 60 needs to be rebuilt regardless. That bank is NASCAR level, without the high speed, low gravity cars.

I too am surprised the Owensboro mayor didn't push the 2-di Natcher-Audubon plan. Not only did the heavily push the ridiculous I-67 idea, they went as far as pimping a re-route of an already under construction I-69 over the 231 bridge. Not to mention the genius actually went to the Evansville mayor's office to get his support of this re-routing away from Evansville.

While both of these were complete lunacy, the 2-di Natcher-Audubon idea actually seems pretty logical.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: LM117 on May 29, 2019, 07:51:35 PM
Quote from: Captain Jack on May 29, 2019, 07:37:57 PM
I too am surprised the Owensboro mayor didn't push the 2-di Natcher-Audubon plan. Not only did the heavily push the ridiculous I-67 idea, they went as far as pimping a re-route of an already under construction I-69 over the 231 bridge. Not to mention the genius actually went to the Evansville mayor's office to get his support of this re-routing away from Evansville.

Ron Payne got his ass chewed out in that meeting, IIRC.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on May 30, 2019, 03:04:24 AM
And he didn't run for re-election after that ... I think he'd have lost, and not by a small margin.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on June 11, 2019, 10:41:06 PM
On our way back from the Smokies this afternoon, I noted that the new permanent signage is going up pretty quickly, starting, of course, at Bowling Green and moving northward. KYTC is apparently staying with Clearview (YUCK!), but oh well.

One thing I don't much care for: KY 80 is omitted from the Russellville Road exit signs.  It needs to be signed, IMHO.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on June 12, 2019, 04:24:38 PM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on June 11, 2019, 10:41:06 PM
On our way back from the Smokies this afternoon, I noted that the new permanent signage is going up pretty quickly, starting, of course, at Bowling Green and moving northward. KYTC is apparently staying with Clearview (YUCK!), but oh well.

One thing I don't much care for: KY 80 is omitted from the Russellville Road exit signs.  It needs to be signed, IMHO.

KY 80 has not been posted at that exit since I can remember. Not sure why that's the case, especially since the KY 80 corridor (and attendant parkways) has been touted as a fast, modern way across the state's southern tier.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: The Ghostbuster on June 12, 2019, 04:26:05 PM
Does anyone have any updates on the designating a portion of the Western Kentucky Parkway as Interstate 369?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on June 12, 2019, 06:35:57 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on June 12, 2019, 04:26:05 PM
Does anyone have any updates on the designating a portion of the Western Kentucky Parkway as Interstate 369?

As discussed previously, the Audubon intersects the northern Pennyrile/US 41 extension north of the present official end of the designated I-69; without that direct connection, a spur on the Audubon won't happen (from local reports, the "future I-369" signage present some years back is gone).  Once the Ohio River bridge and its approaches have been finalized, at some point that northernmost Pennyrile segment will get an official designation and the Audubon, with the normal modifications done to KY parkways, might again be proposed for Interstate status, with a number TBD; there's always the possibility that with upgrades to the US 60 Owensboro bypass/connector, the whole thing might actually be I-165. 
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: mvak36 on June 12, 2019, 09:15:58 PM
Quote from: sparker on June 12, 2019, 06:35:57 PM

As discussed previously, the Audubon intersects the northern Pennyrile/US 41 extension north of the present official end of the designated I-69; without that direct connection, a spur on the Audubon won't happen (from local reports, the "future I-369" signage present some years back is gone).  Once the Ohio River bridge and its approaches have been finalized, at some point that northernmost Pennyrile segment will get an official designation and the Audubon, with the normal modifications done to KY parkways, might again be proposed for Interstate status, with a number TBD; there's always the possibility that with upgrades to the US 60 Owensboro bypass/connector, the whole thing might actually be I-165.

I thought that the Audubon already has a direct connection to I-69. From the DEIS (https://i69ohiorivercrossing.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/07_Chapter_03_Alternatives.pdf), it looks like that will stay the same.

Quote from: The Ghostbuster on June 12, 2019, 04:26:05 PM
Does anyone have any updates on the designating a portion of the Western Kentucky Parkway as Interstate 369?
I haven't heard anything since they introduced legislation back in April. Here's the thread (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=24820.0) for that.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: sparker on June 13, 2019, 01:55:19 AM
Quote from: mvak36 on June 12, 2019, 09:15:58 PM
I thought that the Audubon already has a direct connection to I-69. From the DEIS (https://i69ohiorivercrossing.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/07_Chapter_03_Alternatives.pdf), it looks like that will stay the same.

The Audubon does have a direct trumpet-type interchange with US 41, but the actual I-69 designation stops south of there, pending an exact location of the approach to the pending Ohio River bridge -- one of the options actually diverged NB from the present US 41 alignment (the extension north of I-69) and crossed the Audubon east of the current interchange.  While it is true that the most likely bridge/approach alignment doesn't follow that routing but continues along the existing facility until north of the Audubon interchange, where it veers to the northeast, that option has yet to be formally selected -- so I-69 still technically ends south of where the southernmost connection point would have been made.  Thus any Interstate designation for the Audubon is premature.   
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on June 13, 2019, 10:23:20 AM
Quote from: sparker on June 12, 2019, 06:35:57 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on June 12, 2019, 04:26:05 PM
Does anyone have any updates on the designating a portion of the Western Kentucky Parkway as Interstate 369?

As discussed previously, the Audubon intersects the northern Pennyrile/US 41 extension north of the present official end of the designated I-69; without that direct connection, a spur on the Audubon won't happen (from local reports, the "future I-369" signage present some years back is gone).  Once the Ohio River bridge and its approaches have been finalized, at some point that northernmost Pennyrile segment will get an official designation and the Audubon, with the normal modifications done to KY parkways, might again be proposed for Interstate status, with a number TBD; there's always the possibility that with upgrades to the US 60 Owensboro bypass/connector, the whole thing might actually be I-165.

The northernmost stretch of the old Pennyrile has been US 41 for a while now. What was 41 (the older 2-lane portion north of KY 425) is now KY 2084.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Life in Paradise on June 14, 2019, 02:44:19 PM
I-165 signs are now all the way from Bowling Green to Owensboro.  They are indicated on the Owensboro Bypass (US 60) that the road south to Bowling Green is now I-165.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on June 15, 2019, 10:11:30 PM
Quote from: Life in Paradise on June 14, 2019, 02:44:19 PM
I-165 signs are now all the way from Bowling Green to Owensboro.  They are indicated on the Owensboro Bypass (US 60) that the road south to Bowling Green is now I-165.

They're still not quite done. Just for one example, there are no reassurance signs at the Daviess/Ohio and Ohio/Butler county lines in either direction (as there are at the Butler/Warren line), nor any at all southbound, until you get to the 231-Morgantown/Cromwell exit. The permanent signs are still going up, and they're making progress.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Stephane Dumas on August 18, 2019, 10:38:17 PM
Time to bump this thread by mentionning then Google Streetview did an update and the recent Streetview (April 2019) show the BGS with I-165. https://goo.gl/maps/7S2j36oekZdZaMCo7
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: amroad17 on August 18, 2019, 10:54:28 PM
^ Yes, and complete with the "unsigned" designation of the Green River, sorry, William Natcher Parkway.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on September 08, 2019, 03:56:29 AM
As of Saturday afternoon, about half of the barrels along the 25-mile work zone from south of Hartford to Owensboro have been removed, along with the remaining 55-MPH speed limit signs.  The next time we see any work along here should be when the project to replace the KY 69 interchange gets going, but as far as I know that's not been scheduled yet.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on October 30, 2020, 10:02:34 PM
Construction starting on the reconfiguration of the toll booth cloverleaf at US 231 near Bowling Green.

Press release here (https://lnks.gd/2/MZ_L5t).
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: ilpt4u on October 30, 2020, 10:35:13 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on October 30, 2020, 10:02:34 PM
Construction starting on the reconfiguration of the toll booth cloverleaf at US 231 near Bowling Green.

Press release here (https://lnks.gd/2/MZ_L5t).
Dumb question: Looking at this Bowtie, and the configuration of that style interchange in general...Why not just conver it to a Folded Diamond, keep two of the loops and build 2 Diamond ramps?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: I-55 on October 31, 2020, 12:47:46 AM
Quote from: ilpt4u on October 30, 2020, 10:35:13 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on October 30, 2020, 10:02:34 PM
Construction starting on the reconfiguration of the toll booth cloverleaf at US 231 near Bowling Green.

Press release here (https://lnks.gd/2/MZ_L5t).
Dumb question: Looking at this Bowtie, and the configuration of that style interchange in general...Why not just convert it to a Folded Diamond, keep two of the loops and build 2 Diamond ramps?

My guess would be that they didn't want such tight turns on the exit ramps.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Revive 755 on October 31, 2020, 11:56:05 AM
^ While I haven't seen a map showing the new diamond configuration, my guess is additional ROW requirements.  While the loops look smaller than some of the other cloverleafs in Kentucky, they don't seem exceptional tight.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on October 31, 2020, 07:19:28 PM
Most of those loops were signed, IIRC, for 25 mph. But remember that you were either accelerating from a full stop, or coming to a full stop, to pay toll.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: SignGeniusPTOE on April 26, 2022, 03:38:37 PM
It's amazing how KY gets so many little interstate routes such as I-165 that connects little cities like Owensboro and Bowling Green, but Indiana has deathtrap US 30 connecting Fort Wayne and Chicago.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 26, 2022, 03:40:38 PM
Quote from: SignGeniusPTOE on April 26, 2022, 03:38:37 PM
It's amazing how KY gets so many little interstate routes such as I-165 that connects little cities like Owensboro and Bowling Green, but Indiana has deathtrap US 30 connecting Fort Wayne and Chicago.

Kentucky built them as tolled parkways. They only got designated as interstates after they were paid off and the tolls went away. You willing to pay tolls for a US 30 freeway?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: I-55 on April 26, 2022, 03:43:32 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on April 26, 2022, 03:40:38 PM
Quote from: SignGeniusPTOE on April 26, 2022, 03:38:37 PM
It's amazing how KY gets so many little interstate routes such as I-165 that connects little cities like Owensboro and Bowling Green, but Indiana has deathtrap US 30 connecting Fort Wayne and Chicago.

Kentucky built them as tolled parkways. They only got designated as interstates after they were paid off and the tolls went away. You willing to pay tolls for a US 30 freeway?

Honestly I'll take tolls and access control over seeing friends get killed.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: NWI_Irish96 on April 26, 2022, 03:54:57 PM
Quote from: I-55 on April 26, 2022, 03:43:32 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on April 26, 2022, 03:40:38 PM
Quote from: SignGeniusPTOE on April 26, 2022, 03:38:37 PM
It's amazing how KY gets so many little interstate routes such as I-165 that connects little cities like Owensboro and Bowling Green, but Indiana has deathtrap US 30 connecting Fort Wayne and Chicago.

Kentucky built them as tolled parkways. They only got designated as interstates after they were paid off and the tolls went away. You willing to pay tolls for a US 30 freeway?

Honestly I'll take tolls and access control over seeing friends get killed.

I would too, but I wonder how many more people get killed on US 6 if US 30 were to get tolled.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on April 27, 2022, 01:10:38 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on April 26, 2022, 03:40:38 PM
Quote from: SignGeniusPTOE on April 26, 2022, 03:38:37 PM
It's amazing how KY gets so many little interstate routes such as I-165 that connects little cities like Owensboro and Bowling Green, but Indiana has deathtrap US 30 connecting Fort Wayne and Chicago.

Kentucky built them as tolled parkways. They only got designated as interstates after they were paid off and the tolls went away. You willing to pay tolls for a US 30 freeway?

Kentucky also built them as limited-access freeways that were/are very close to interstate standards. They were not built as surface routes with at-grade intersections. Converting the Kentucky parkways to interstates involves some minor construction projects and putting up signs. Converting US 30 to a full freeway would be very expensive.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on April 29, 2022, 07:57:25 PM
Construction on the Bowling Green US 231 interchange (Exit 7) wrapped up recently. The Morgantown 231 (Exit 33) and Hartford KY 69 (Exit 47) interchanges are both currently in progress. Morgantown's about half done, with Hartford about 1/4 of the way.  I think the completion date is either late October or early November.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on April 29, 2022, 09:27:13 PM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on April 29, 2022, 07:57:25 PM
Construction on the Bowling Green US 231 interchange (Exit 7) wrapped up recently. The Morgantown 231 (Exit 33) and Hartford KY 69 (Exit 47) interchanges are both currently in progress. Morgantown's about half done, with Hartford about 1/4 of the way.  I think the completion date is either late October or early November.

Once those two "former toll booths" interchanges get done, the corridor will be fully up to interstate standards.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: westerninterloper on April 29, 2022, 10:27:56 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on April 27, 2022, 01:10:38 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on April 26, 2022, 03:40:38 PM
Quote from: SignGeniusPTOE on April 26, 2022, 03:38:37 PM
It's amazing how KY gets so many little interstate routes such as I-165 that connects little cities like Owensboro and Bowling Green, but Indiana has deathtrap US 30 connecting Fort Wayne and Chicago.

Kentucky built them as tolled parkways. They only got designated as interstates after they were paid off and the tolls went away. You willing to pay tolls for a US 30 freeway?

Kentucky also built them as limited-access freeways that were/are very close to interstate standards. They were not built as surface routes with at-grade intersections. Converting the Kentucky parkways to interstates involves some minor construction projects and putting up signs. Converting US 30 to a full freeway would be very expensive.

Indiana could look to its own US 31 between IND and SB for converting to an interstate. Yes, it's expensive, yes it takes at least 20 years, but it can be done. I would imagine Indiana, as well as Ohio, don't want US 30 to be a freeway because of shunpiking the Turnpike and Toll Road between Pittsburgh and Chicago.

Fixed quote. (http://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=4000.0) - rmf67
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: jnewkirk77 on May 02, 2022, 01:39:55 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on April 29, 2022, 09:27:13 PM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on April 29, 2022, 07:57:25 PM
Construction on the Bowling Green US 231 interchange (Exit 7) wrapped up recently. The Morgantown 231 (Exit 33) and Hartford KY 69 (Exit 50) interchanges are both currently in progress. Morgantown's about half done, with Hartford about 1/4 of the way.  I think the completion date is either late October or early November.

Once those two "former toll booths" interchanges get done, the corridor will be fully up to interstate standards.

Exit 47 is correct, by the way. I noted during my drive through on Friday that the new off-ramp northbound, once finished, will begin just north of the 47 mile marker.  It was Exit 50 before the I-165 designation was applied, but that's been changed and the signage already reflects it.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: Great Lakes Roads on May 02, 2022, 03:51:01 AM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on May 02, 2022, 01:39:55 AM
Quote from: Great Lakes Roads on April 29, 2022, 09:27:13 PM
Quote from: jnewkirk77 on April 29, 2022, 07:57:25 PM
Construction on the Bowling Green US 231 interchange (Exit 7) wrapped up recently. The Morgantown 231 (Exit 33) and Hartford KY 69 (Exit 47) interchanges are both currently in progress. Morgantown's about half done, with Hartford about 1/4 of the way.  I think the completion date is either late October or early November.

Once those two "former toll booths" interchanges get done, the corridor will be fully up to interstate standards.

Exit 47 is correct, by the way. I noted during my drive through on Friday that the new off-ramp northbound, once finished, will begin just north of the 47 mile marker.  It was Exit 50 before the I-165 designation was applied, but that's been changed and the signage already reflects it.

I kinda overlooked on the exit numbers via Google Maps before double-checking, so silly me!  :pan:
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on May 02, 2022, 10:25:36 AM
They backed up the exit numbers by three when the road was renumbered from KY 900x to I-165, because the interstate is shorter than the old parkway when the extension to US 231 is factored in. Not sure why they didn't keep the exit numbers the way I-265 continues the exit numbers for KY 841.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: seicer on May 02, 2022, 01:21:59 PM
I guess it's all a moot point once the Natcher Parkway is extended to form a loop around Bowling Green (and connect to KY 3145): https://transportation.ky.gov/Planning/Planning%20Studies%20and%20Reports/Proposed%20Interstate%2066%20-%20Appendix_A.pdf

Something I wasn't aware of!
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: I-55 on May 02, 2022, 01:27:31 PM
Quote from: seicer on May 02, 2022, 01:21:59 PM
I guess it's all a moot point once the Natcher Parkway is extended to form a loop around Bowling Green (and connect to KY 3145): https://transportation.ky.gov/Planning/Planning%20Studies%20and%20Reports/Proposed%20Interstate%2066%20-%20Appendix_A.pdf

Something I wasn't aware of!

How long has this been dead? The whole I-66 ship has sailed has it not?
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: seicer on May 02, 2022, 02:49:08 PM
No - construction is progressing on the new I-66/KY 461 interchange east of Somerset, with the next segment between US 27 and KY 461 to follow. Final alternative selection for the alignment between KY 461 and London is progressing, along with upgrades to the Hal Rogers Parkway to the east. There are also upgrades planned for the Cumberland Parkway to upgrade it fully to interstate standards.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on May 03, 2022, 03:28:22 PM
Quote from: seicer on May 02, 2022, 02:49:08 PM
No - construction is progressing on the new I-66/KY 461 interchange east of Somerset, with the next segment between US 27 and KY 461 to follow. Final alternative selection for the alignment between KY 461 and London is progressing, along with upgrades to the Hal Rogers Parkway to the east. There are also upgrades planned for the Cumberland Parkway to upgrade it fully to interstate standards.

The KY 80/KY 461 interchange, when completed will make the through movement staying on a straight line from London to Russell Springs, bypassing Somerset to the north. I honestly don't look for anything else to be done between Somerset and London. The existing KY 80 is adequate for traffic and there is too much opposition from environmentalists over a new Rockcastle River crossing. And an upgrade between London and Hazard would be hugely expensive. This stuff exists on paper, but I don't think it will ever come to reality.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: The Ghostbuster on May 03, 2022, 04:19:53 PM
The western Interstate 66 proposal was canceled on August 6, 2015. Last I heard (with Wikipedia being my source), the entire Louie B. Nunn Cumberland Parkway was proposed to become Interstate 365.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: seicer on May 03, 2022, 08:28:06 PM
From what it looks like on some of those alternatives presented, it would utilize the central KY 80 corridor because of those major environmental drawbacks from either using a northern or southern alignment which would be on all new terrain. I thought that it would have been much simpler to just use KY 80 between Somerset and London, but the amount of right-of-way that would need to be purchased - and all of the properties that would need to be razed, was very, very high. And that's not even including the interchange that would be required at I-75.

@Ghostbuster: Funny that you posted that. I was curious, too, and found this: https://www.somerset-kentucky.com/news/i-66-on-the-road-to-nowhere-rep-for-rogers-says-no-evidence-project-has/article_6d1d77e6-f366-11e8-9ed2-67d33dab2801.html

""I can find NO evidence I-66 has been cancelled," responded Danielle Smoot, communications director for Congressman Hal Rogers. It was Rogers' efforts and influence that channeled the I-66 corridor along the Cumberland Parkway and then north of Somerset to London. Signs designating Cumberland Parkway as the future route of I-66 are still posted.

"That's your answer right there." commented Joe Gossett, branch manager for project development at the Highway Department's District 8, referring to Smoot's comments based on an inquiry from the Commonwealth Journal. The question about viability of the I-66 project arose after statements on the Internet, specifically Wikipedia, the Internet's free encyclopedia. Said Wikipedia: "The Kentucky Transportation Cabinet completed its feasibility study in 2005 and concluded that building I-66 was too costly and of little traffic benefit with high potential environmental impact and cancelled the project in (Kentucky)."

"Not so," said Amber Hale, public information officer for Kentucky Department of Highways' District 8. "I-66 has not been cancelled. The route is still on Highway Department maps; it's something for the future; it's a matter of money.""

--

I found KY 80 shields to be kind of sparse when I drove the highway the other night but found the massive "KY 80 HAL ROGERS PARKWAY" signs to be... overkill. I didn't realize Rogers had pretty much proclaimed that the former Daniel Boone Parkway would be extended west to Somerset to tie into the Cumberland Parkway.
Title: Re: I-165 Kentucky (William H. Natcher Green River Parkway)
Post by: hbelkins on May 04, 2022, 12:29:16 PM
Quote from: seicer on May 03, 2022, 08:28:06 PM
I found KY 80 shields to be kind of sparse when I drove the highway the other night but found the massive "KY 80 HAL ROGERS PARKWAY" signs to be... overkill. I didn't realize Rogers had pretty much proclaimed that the former Daniel Boone Parkway would be extended west to Somerset to tie into the Cumberland Parkway.

Those have been up for awhile, but it wasn't Rogers' doing. It was either Gov. Steve Beshear or Gov. Bevin who ordered that. Or it may have been the legislature. I don't remember the details. But just as Rogers had nothing to do with renaming the Daniel Boone Parkway, he had nothing to do with the extension of the named route to Somerset.

It's one of the few roads in Kentucky named after two separate people. Kentucky usually won't name a road if it's already named after someone else, but the Russell Dyche Memorial Highway signs are still up.