Traffic signal

[mrsman]

I seem to constantly keep finding odd things about Spokane, WA.

Before the flashing yellow arrow, the city used 4-section bi-modal left turn signals for lagging lefts, but doghouses for leading lefts.

Example: left turn from northbound Monroe to westbound Broadway: https://goo.gl/pFSWEN (no oncoming left permitted)
Another: left turns from North Foothills towards either direction of US-2: https://goo.gl/WjeKcs (no oncoming lefts as US-2 is split one-way).

Regular left: https://goo.gl/wZ5jqJ (doghouses even for mast signals, oddly).

Not odd.  A common signaling pattern before more recent versions of MUTCD prohibited it.

The lagging lefts prohibit opposing left turns and prevent yellow trap.  The lagging lefts terminate at the same time as the through singal in that direction.  The warning yellow arrow is not needed, since it would be shown at the exact same time as the yellow orb.  So only 4 light bulbs are needed here.  There are many lagging lefts that are still signalled in this manner and are pefectly safe.  See: 

Los Angeles, CA

https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0521948,-118.2433945,3a,75y,101.53h,80.04t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sweLIbHaUEeeEuvH-Tyax4Q!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo2.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DweLIbHaUEeeEuvH-Tyax4Q%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D341.26422%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656

Queens, NY (but recently updated with yellow arrows, although not necessary IMO)

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.7562726,-73.8789245,3a,75y,81.54h,78.62t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s5K-W-WxtGb1G6exwMiau1w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Washington , DC

https://www.google.com/maps/@38.9013666,-77.0319598,3a,75y,344.35h,88.42t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sOmhnN3gmTEZDWswTZIfgQQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656




The leading left terminates before the through green terminates.  It needs the yellow arrow so there are 5 light bulbs on the doghouse.

[jakeroot]

I seem to constantly keep finding odd things about Spokane, WA.

Before the flashing yellow arrow, the city used 4-section bi-modal left turn signals for lagging lefts, but doghouses for leading lefts.

Not odd.  A common signaling pattern before more recent versions of MUTCD prohibited it.

The lagging lefts prohibit opposing left turns and prevent yellow trap.  The lagging lefts terminate at the same time as the through singal in that direction.  The warning yellow arrow is not needed, since it would be shown at the exact same time as the yellow orb.  So only 4 light bulbs are needed here.  There are many lagging lefts that are still signalled in this manner and are pefectly safe.  See: 
...
The leading left terminates before the through green terminates.  It needs the yellow arrow so there are 5 light bulbs on the doghouse.

I realize this now. I wasn't seeing a pattern before, but only recognized it for the first time at those Spokane signals. Of course, where I'm from on the west side of Washington State, 4-section bi-modal signals are used all the time for regular leading lefts. I had seen 4-section left-turn signals in areas known for 5-section signals before, but I assumed they were one-off clearance-related installations. I see now that the several I've seen in CA are actually for lagging lefts that need only one yellow phase.

[jakeroot]

Is this look common anywhere? It's not here, but Federal Way, WA has a one-off older signal where the visors are black, but the body is yellow: https://goo.gl/tC36yD

This is common in Delaware

Not really in Delaware... the entire front of their signals is black, not just the visors. However, they are common in North Carolina, particularly in the Charlotte and Winston-Salem areas.

Delaware and Maryland share that look. Definitely a lot of examples like mine above in NC. I checked Street View and they are indeed quite common.

I've seen a fair amount of this in the Atlanta area.

Do you know of any that you can link to? I found a ton of signals in ATL with black fronts and yellow backs via Street View, but none where only the visors were black (as in my example).

[jakeroot]

Encountered this the other day, and it was one of the weirdest things I've seen. Unfortunately wasn't around long enough to see how the phasing worked.

https://goo.gl/maps/DdGQ42LWyzy

God that signal looks extremely confusing, I don't understand how a red arrow and a green arrow can be lit simotanuesly while directing ongoing traffic.

It's not unprecedented. I've seen something similar in Illinois.

Three examples in WA where exclusive arrows are used with option lanes:

1) Westbound E Broadway @ I-90, Spokane (#2 lane must wait for green to proceed straight from that lane)
2) Southbound 101 @ Boone St, Aberdeen (#2 lane must wait for green orb to proceed straight from that lane)
3) Westbound James St @ I-5, Seattle (Lagging FYA is used at this location, so it works far better (no red arrow phase except at end))

#3 is the only acceptable use of such a setup, in my opinion. None are like US-89's example, which looks to be a continuous green-T like my second example. If option lanes are to be used at double turn locations, permissive movements really should be allowed. As most of these are T-intersections, that shouldn't necessarily be dangerous.

Although not quite precise allegory, it's reminiscent of this signal in Vancouver that has been posted on this board before:

https://www.google.com/maps/@49.2485002,-123.0723746,3a,75y,295.44h,89.11t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s9hf3laXcqpMAs_n3FMnC2w!2e0!5s20150801T000000!7i16384!8i8192

The idea is that the thru lanes are continuous green, but the left turn is protected only.  And the central lane is an option lane to go either direction, but turning left only if there is a green arrow.  Unless the green arrow is a dominant phase, you will find most traffic going straight will end up in the right lane so that they can take advantage of the continuous green.

For simplicity, I would put a six-bulb doghouse* in the central lane and a three phase signal over the right lane.  The red straight and yellow straight do not need to come on, but it would be simpler to denote straight thru on green with a protected left turn.

And ideally, as jakeroot noted, this should be a protected-permitted left signal.  But it's hard, because there are only 3 lanes available and there seems to be enough traffic for the left turn to warrant 2 lanes and for the through traffic to warrant 2 lanes, so you're stuck with a middle option lane.  And in most states this requires a protected only left turn.

* Don't know what else to call a signal like this:

RA  R
YA  Y
GA  G
in one casing.  The G will be a green straight arrow instead of an orb.

Combination arrow/orb signals are very common in Australia, where more than one overhead signal on a mast arm is unusual (if not unheard of -- I don't know of any). I think it would be a great toolset for American traffic engineers, as it would allow shorter mast arms that still had plenty of capability. I would like to see version for a FYA, though.

Before the street was closed off, the northbound frontage road of I-44 in Downtown St Louis at Pine Street had a double left with an option lane with protected phasing. This was required due to the lack of storage room between that intersection and the southbound frontage road (Memorial Drive). The far left lane had a standard protected left signal, the middle lane a doghouse, and the other lanes a standard 3-orb through signal: https://goo.gl/DorfEf  --  an Intelight ESB signal was used for all displays, with the idea that, if drivers couldn't see the option lane signal, they might not get angry at drivers waiting to turn from that lane.

[US 89]

I've seen a fair amount of this in the Atlanta area.

Do you know of any that you can link to? I found a ton of signals in ATL with black fronts and yellow backs via Street View, but none where only the visors were black (as in my example).

I assume you're talking about stuff like this?

https://goo.gl/maps/sLbKKJdPGN62
https://goo.gl/maps/bfQCAk8UjCn
https://goo.gl/maps/SqzBBAwhtWo

[jakeroot]

I've seen a fair amount of this in the Atlanta area.

Do you know of any that you can link to? I found a ton of signals in ATL with black fronts and yellow backs via Street View, but none where only the visors were black (as in my example).

I assume you're talking about stuff like this?

https://goo.gl/maps/sLbKKJdPGN62
https://goo.gl/maps/bfQCAk8UjCn
https://goo.gl/maps/SqzBBAwhtWo

No no, not quite that (but it's close). Notice in my photo only the curved sections above/around the traffic lights (the visors) are black, but the entire assembly is otherwise yellow. In those Atlanta signals, the entire front face of the signal is black, including the flat sections of the signal housing surrounding the lights.

[bcroadguy]

Is this look common anywhere? It's not here, but Federal Way, WA has a one-off older signal where the visors are black, but the body is yellow: https://goo.gl/tC36yD

It's standard in Halifax, NS:
https://www.google.ca/maps/@44.6474052,-63.6075978,3a,40.8y,288.62h,96.8t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s4elQI5kTNIg42x5Vs3PVGQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

[kphoger]

It's standard in Halifax, NS:
https://www.google.ca/maps/@44.6474052,-63.6075978,3a,40.8y,288.62h,96.8t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s4elQI5kTNIg42x5Vs3PVGQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

"Outbound"?  Is that a normal plaque?

[DrSmith]

Within Halifax on the city streets, inbound/outbound are used to make reference to the end/beginning in the city center area. Outside of there, traditional cardinal directions are used

[jakeroot]

This temp signal in Alderton, WA (SR 162 (Orting Hwy) @ 96 St E) has a side-by-side style doghouse for the left turn signal, but it's being used in protected only mode. Where the arrow would normally be, the lenses are instead wrapped in black plastic.

If it were me, rather than jury-rigging a second overhead signal, I'd have just used a doghouse with the extra signal on the side, but whatever. Not my call.

As it relates to the above photo, things are in MD/DE/GA style with an all-black front and yellow back. Temp signals here are always an odd color scheme. Last one I saw had a completely yellow non-reflective backplate.

For the record, a truck hit old the signal: https://www.thenewstribune.com/news/local/article214721030.html

[traffic light guy]

I think a doghouse would be too heavy to fit on that temporary signal pole

[traffic light guy]

Here's something odd I've noticed about the doghouses in Levittown, the boxes for the arrow sections are mounted upside-down. Why is that, could it be possible that these signals were meant to be vertically standing five section signals, but at last minute, they were rearranged into a doghouse:
8" Eagle (w/louvers) and a 12" Eagle Flatback Doghouse by thesignalman, on Flickr

TCT with an Eagle flatback doghouse (rear-view) by thesignalman, on Flickr

The upside-down Eagle logos are evidence that the arrow sections were mounted upside-down. However, the arrows were installed in the normal configuration. I also think that the bottom doghouse was originally hanging, although the bracket looks just as old as the signal itself.

[MNHighwayMan]

I think a doghouse would be too heavy to fit on that temporary signal pole

Did you miss the part where there's already five sections up there, but two are covered?

[traffic light guy]

I think a doghouse would be too heavy to fit on that temporary signal pole

Did you miss the part where there's already five sections up there, but two are covered?

I did get that part. I'm saying, mounting a signal that way will be easier to mount, as opposed to a regular doghouse.

[jakeroot]

I think a doghouse would be too heavy to fit on that temporary signal pole

Did you miss the part where there's already five sections up there, but two are covered?

I did get that part. I'm saying, mounting a signal that way will be easier to mount, as opposed to a regular doghouse.

If weight or mounting style was a concern, I doubt they would have mounted two extra housings for no reason.

Me thinks the temp signal came from a setup where the signal was being used in pro/per mode, but WSDOT wanted it run in protected only. So they swapped the lenses and called it good. And apparently they added another signal on the upper corner.

[busman_49]

Here's something odd I've noticed about the doghouses in Levittown, the boxes for the arrow sections are mounted upside-down. Why is that, could it be possible that these signals were meant to be vertically standinfg five section signals, but at last minute, they were rearranged into a doghouse:
<SNIP>

They are mounted that way to make it easier to open the doors of the signal for bulb replacement & maintenance.  Otherwise the visors of the sections next to them would be in the way, and it would be very difficult to get to the bulb.

[traffic light guy]

Here's something odd I've noticed about the doghouses in Levittown, the boxes for the arrow sections are mounted upside-down. Why is that, could it be possible that these signals were meant to be vertically standinfg five section signals, but at last minute, they were rearranged into a doghouse:
<SNIP>

They are mounted that way to make it easier to open the doors of the signal for bulb replacement & maintenance.  Otherwise the visors of the sections next to them would be in the way, and it would be very difficult to get to the bulb.

Why on those, and not modern doghouses

[roadman65]

https://goo.gl/maps/wqDhXacsQYN2
For New York a span wire signal is not unusual, but in New York City it is.  Usually the city uses double guy mast arms and for subways overhead they usually just mount the heads to the girders.

Anyway, I thought I would share this not cause of its practice but as I think its cool the way its structured.  It soon will be gone when the Sheridan Expressway becomes an at grade boulevard, though so its life is near its end.

[Amtrakprod]

Does the US not use distinct transit signals? This is something that has not been standardized in Europe, but most countries have their own variant of transit signals so that regular drivers won't be confused in a situation such as this.

The only symbolic traffic signal I've seen in Seattle for rubber-tired buses instead of street cars or light rail is here.

What about these weird boxes that light up when the train is crossing
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.1410753,-75.116411,3a,75y,337.11h,97.31t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sNDtKRatydBkq9-BBwCXiqg!2e0!5s20171101T000000!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en&authuser=0

That's known as a blank out sign. It's to make sure traffic will not back up in that direction.

[freebrickproductions]

Here's something odd I've noticed about the doghouses in Levittown, the boxes for the arrow sections are mounted upside-down. Why is that, could it be possible that these signals were meant to be vertically standinfg five section signals, but at last minute, they were rearranged into a doghouse:
<SNIP>

They are mounted that way to make it easier to open the doors of the signal for bulb replacement & maintenance.  Otherwise the visors of the sections next to them would be in the way, and it would be very difficult to get to the bulb.

Why on those, and not modern doghouses

They do it all the time on modern doghouses around here.

[jakeroot]

What kind of signal mast/arm setup is this called? Visibly one of Spokane, WA's oldest setups (note text-only ped signals -- signals are Eagle Flatbacks): https://goo.gl/3C1sGa

[traffic light guy]

Those arec called guy wires

LG-M327

[jakeroot]

Those arec called guy wires

Thank you. Extremely rare in Washington, but I think they're common in some areas of the northeast?

[NoGoodNamesAvailable]

Those arec called guy wires

Thank you. Extremely rare in Washington, but I think they're common in some areas of the northeast?

Nearly all assemblies in NYC. Can't recall seeing them elsewhere.

[SignBridge]

Older signals in the City of Los Angeles.