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Toll Roads vs. Free Roads Poll and Discussion

Started by US 41, December 21, 2014, 03:54:11 PM

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If a free highway parallels a toll highway (ex: I-44 and OK 66) do you pay the tolls or drive on the free roads?

I drive toll roads
37 (59.7%)
I'm cheap and I take the old highways
25 (40.3%)

Total Members Voted: 62

Darkchylde

#25
When I had a more fuel-efficient vehicle, I used to shunpike the Causeway, down near New Orleans.

Now, for those who aren't familiar with the area, while the Causeway is a straight shot from the middle of the Northshore to Metairie, which is practically right next door to the city. Using I-12 and I-10 from a similar point adds about 25 miles or so to the trip, depending on where you need to go in the city. Taking I-12 to I-55 is even longer. Toll's only $3 for a 24 mile bridge, which is a bargain compared to places like NYC or most other places with toll roads or bridges.

So, going 25-30 miles out of the way to shunpike a $3 toll. Yeah. If I'd shunpike that, then I'd definitely shunpike the Kansas Turnpike or a potentially-tolled I-70 in MO. I've probably already spent my entire fuel budget for the month putting gas in the tank, and the Explorer I drive now is thirsty. I don't have the extra money to pay tolls. Simple as that.


jeffandnicole

Quote from: Zzonkmiles on December 23, 2014, 02:53:55 PM
Plus, when driving on an unfamiliar toll road out of state, you might be stuck with paying a $1.75 toll with a $20 bill much to the chagrin of the tool booth attendant.

The only time I cared about a $20 for a small toll amount is when the person pulls up to the toll lane, wastes time trying to find the $1.75, and whips out a $20 instead.  If the person pulled out the $20 approaching the toll plaza, it would've saved them, me, and everyone sitting in line behind them time.  Otherwise, a $20 isn't a big deal.

Now, pull out a $100 for a $1.75 toll, and you're probably going to have enough $1's to feed vending machines for the next month.

Quote from: oscar on December 23, 2014, 04:56:36 PM
What Brandon said is not true for every toll road.  But people allergic to toll roads shouldn't casually whip out the "we already paid for this" excuse where it doesn't apply.  There are plenty of other excuses available, use them instead.

Another good one is when the motorist is pissed because they had to sit in congestion on the roadway.  In that case, the motorist should pay more, because they spent more time on the road.  For some reason, that reasoning never went over well with the motorists.

jeffandnicole

Quote from: Darkchylde on December 24, 2014, 08:19:33 AM
So, going 25-30 miles out of the way to shunpike a $3 toll. Yeah. If I'd shunpike that, then I'd definitely shunpike the Kansas Turnpike or a potentially-tolled I-70 in MO. I don't have the extra money to pay tolls. Simple as that.

How fuel efficient was your vehicle?  If gas is $3 a gallon, and you get about 50 mpg on your vehicle, you're still spending at least $1.50 to avoid a $3 toll.  If your mpg is less, you're spending more in gas.

At some point, the economics of the situation would say just pay the damn toll.

Darkchylde

Quote from: jeffandnicole on December 24, 2014, 08:25:45 AM
Quote from: Darkchylde on December 24, 2014, 08:19:33 AM
So, going 25-30 miles out of the way to shunpike a $3 toll. Yeah. If I'd shunpike that, then I'd definitely shunpike the Kansas Turnpike or a potentially-tolled I-70 in MO. I don't have the extra money to pay tolls. Simple as that.

How fuel efficient was your vehicle?  If gas is $3 a gallon, and you get about 50 mpg on your vehicle, you're still spending at least $1.50 to avoid a $3 toll.  If your mpg is less, you're spending more in gas.

At some point, the economics of the situation would say just pay the damn toll.
The Sentra got about 32mpg. I'd already have spent all I had filling the tank.

Don't misunderstand. I don't shunpike because I hate toll roads. I do it because I HAVE NO MONEY.

mrsman

For me, it really depends on how much time I have and what the options are:

On a trip from DC to Pittsburgh, I had once done a nice drive along US 22 instead of the Penn Turnpike.  I saved tolls and it was a beautiful drive during fall with a lot of color in the leaves.  But most of the time that I go there, I take the Turnpike.

I live close to the ICC, but never used it except during the free trial periods when it first opened.  For the times that I drive, the side streets and/or Beltway are not that bad.

I've used VA-7 instead of the Dulles Toll Road to get to Sterling, VA on a Sunday.  Slower, but traffic moved pretty well.

Most of my trips to NYC, I now go the long way through York and Allentown (sometimes passing through Harrisburg, sometimes Lancaster and Reading), primarily to avoid tolls.  I usually set up plenty of time for this trip and find that going the long way is quicker than using I-95 with shunpikes.  I definitelly pay the Hudson River tolls.  Before the I-95 bridge was raised so high, I usually only shunpiked the DE crossing and used I-295 instead of the southern turnpike.

I don't go often enough to consider the Hatem Bridge plans, I don't think.

So as a general rule to avoid a short toll section, I'd use surface streets.  To avoid a long toll section, I'd only consider it if the toll were expensive and/or there is a reasonable freeway alternative (like NJ I-295).

oscar

#30
Quote from: mrsman on December 24, 2014, 07:55:19 AM
Quote from: mtantillo on December 22, 2014, 05:19:24 PM
However....if there are locations where a short detour will significantly eat into the cost of the tolls, I'll take the detour. For example, detouring around the Newark tolls on I-95 makes sense...about 5 minutes invested to save $4. Detouring around the Tydings Bridge in Maryland, about 8 minutes of additional travel time to save $8 (requires purchase of Hatem unlimited plan on a Maryland-issued E-ZPass).

Is it in fact cheaper to buy the Hatem unlimited plan and pay a monthly maintenance fee to MD, then to pay the toll on I-95?  I guess it depends on how often you go.

If you can go with a no-monthly fee E-ZPass like Virginia's, that shifts the balance against using switching to Maryland E-ZPass to access the Hatem plan.  Unless you're a frequent user of Maryland toll roads and bridges (at least three toll charges per month), the monthly fee for Maryland E-ZPass is $1.50.  You'd have to save three additional Tydings bridge tolls a year to offset that cost, in addition to the saved bridge tolls needed to pay for the Hatem plan.

I just stick with the Virginia E-ZPass to simplify my life, even if that means passing up discounts on some out-of-state toll facilities.  My only other accounts (SunPass for my car, TxTag for my truck) are to deal with states that don't (yet) accept E-ZPass at all. 
my Hot Springs and Highways pages, with links to my roads sites:
http://www.alaskaroads.com/home.html

jeffandnicole

Quote from: Darkchylde on December 24, 2014, 08:28:06 AM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on December 24, 2014, 08:25:45 AM
Quote from: Darkchylde on December 24, 2014, 08:19:33 AM
So, going 25-30 miles out of the way to shunpike a $3 toll. Yeah. If I'd shunpike that, then I'd definitely shunpike the Kansas Turnpike or a potentially-tolled I-70 in MO. I don't have the extra money to pay tolls. Simple as that.

How fuel efficient was your vehicle?  If gas is $3 a gallon, and you get about 50 mpg on your vehicle, you're still spending at least $1.50 to avoid a $3 toll.  If your mpg is less, you're spending more in gas.

At some point, the economics of the situation would say just pay the damn toll.
The Sentra got about 32mpg. I'd already have spent all I had filling the tank.

Don't misunderstand. I don't shunpike because I hate toll roads. I do it because I HAVE NO MONEY.

So if the toll is $3, and gas is $3, and you drove 30 miles to avoid a $3 toll, you just paid for it anyway with a gallon of gas.

If gas was closer to $4 a gallon, you paid *more* to avoid the toll.

I mean, ok, if you don't have $3 on you right then and there to pay the toll, you may not have a choice.  But to spend more in gas than it would be to pay the toll only costs you more in the long run!

kkt

I'd generally take the toll way if it would save me a noticeable amount of time.
But here there aren't that many tolled roads where there's a reasonable free option.  For the 520 bridge, there's I-90 but it's too far to really consider as a shunpike.  The Valley Freeway has HOT lanes but you can see when the main lines are busy, which is generally commute hours not weekend drives to Mt. Rainier like I do.

cpzilliacus

#33
Quote from: oscar on December 23, 2014, 04:56:36 PM
What Brandon said is not true for every toll road.  But people allergic to toll roads shouldn't casually whip out the "we already paid for this" excuse where it doesn't apply.  There are plenty of other excuses available, use them instead.

I agree.  Many toll roads did use tax dollars (in some cases, such as the original part of the Pennsylvania Turnpike, the federal government loaned the money for construction, and were paid back by the toll revenues).

But in other cases, tax dollars were (and are) used to get a road built (all of the planning and preliminary work, along with the preparation of the EIS documents, were taxpayer-funded).

As for changing a "free" road to a toll road, I do not have a problem with that, if the politicians do not wish to increase the motor fuel tax rates to fund very large-scale reconstruction work. 

IMO, the classic example on the East Coast is probably I-95 across North Carolina (we can talk about the Cross-Bronx Expressway later).  Much of that road needs to be reconstructed from the ground up and widened, along with many substandard and dangerous interchanges that need to be torn-out and rebuilt, along with several bridges that are too low. Tolling could easily fund all that, though some of the nice people living near the corridor (along with the elected officials that represent them) absolutely do not want tolls, nor do they want increased motor fuel taxes under any circumstances.  Go figure.

The only thing that was "paid for" with taxes that is still relevant is the real estate on which the road was built.  Much of the rest of what was paid for with federal and state taxes is at the end of its usable life, which means a new road is needed.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

sbeaver44

I too am on the "it depends" side.  Most of the time it is a time-value decision, but if there is a more interesting route that plays a factor as well.  I actually will reverse-shunpike I-83 through Harrisburg and often am willing to pay the $1.04 toll to use I-76 and I-283 around it.  (Last AADTs I recall are 125K for the I-83 bridge and 19K for the I-76 bridge)  But, I find between Breezewood and Donegal that US 30 and PA 31 are more interesting* (at the cost of only 20 minutes or so) than the Turnpike and as a bonus I save $6 on tolls. 

If traveling through Ohio and Indiana, I might use Ohio 2, US 24, and US 30 as alternates because again, the time difference isn't much in the grand scheme of things, Ohio 2 is more interesting to me, and I save a bunch on tolls.  Plus, for some weird reason, I really like US 24 between Toledo and Fort Wayne.  That said, I will pay for the Ohio Turnpike and Indiana Toll Road over taking I-70 to Indianapolis and I-65 up to Gary any day.  Holy cow is that a boring drive.

*US 30 is definitely interesting east of Breezewood as well, but since it starts going south it is no longer a practical alternative to the Turnpike there.  I'd have to pick it up in Gettysburg or Chambersburg at which point I've added significant time and distance to the trip.

One advantage of toll roads are the rest areas (usually), especially the recently renovated ones in Pennsylvania and Ohio.  I appreciate not having to exit and re-enter just to find a bathroom.

Takumi

Quote from: jeffandnicole on December 24, 2014, 08:21:13 AM
Now, pull out a $100 for a $1.75 toll, and you're probably going to have enough $1's to feed vending machines for the next month.
At least one toll road here (VA 76) has signage noting that bills larger than $20 are not accepted at all.
Quote from: Rothman on July 15, 2021, 07:52:59 AM
Olive Garden must be stopped.  I must stop them.

Don't @ me. Seriously.

jp the roadgeek

I tend to avoid them as much as possible.  When going to Boston, I'll use the Pike, but I might take US 20 if I'm going to Worcester or MA 49 to MA 9.  If I'm going to Albany, I shunpike it as much as I can by going through Litchfield County and either getting on the Pike at Exit 2 or on the Berkshire Thruway at B3 and getting off at B1.  I'll go up to the Tappan Zee or even the Newburgh-Beacon to cross the Hudson, plus I've gone to the Scudders Falls to cross the Delaware to get to Philly.  I'll use the GSP down to Iselin, then take NJ 27 to CR 529, then US 1, and either stay on 1 to 95 or take US 130 to US 206 then back around the Bordentown truck stops to I-295.  I take the DE 896/4/279 bypass, and I've even gone up to the Conowingo Bridge on US 1 then took MD/DE 273 back to Newark.
Interstates I've clinched: 97, 290 (MA), 291 (CT), 291 (MA), 293, 295 (DE-NJ-PA), 295 (RI-MA), 384, 391, 395 (CT-MA), 395 (MD), 495 (DE), 610 (LA), 684, 691, 695 (MD), 695 (NY), 795 (MD)

KG909

I haven't used a toll in a long time because there are hardly in in Southern California. Though I have in Mexico and I can say they're worth it there. Does anyone know how much it would cost to use the FL Turnpike from SR 60 and 70 all the way to I-75?
~Fuccboi

US 41

   Even though I try to avoid toll roads here in the US, I do plan on using toll roads most of the way across Mexico, when I find time to go. The thing about Mexican toll roads though is the benefits you receive from using them. If you break down you can get towed for free to a mechanic, they will pay for damages to your car if the road caused them, most have gas stations on them (like here), and the Green Angels speak English. Here in the US you don't really get those added benefits from driving on the toll roads. You just sort of pay money and your on your own. BTW to drive from Nvo. Laredo - Mazatlan is going to cost $106 in tolls ($212 total).
Visited States and Provinces:
USA (48)= All of Lower 48
Canada (5)= NB, NS, ON, PEI, QC
Mexico (9)= BCN, BCS, CHIH, COAH, DGO, NL, SON, SIN, TAM

US 41

Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 12:51:45 PM
I haven't used a toll in a long time because there are hardly in in Southern California. Though I have in Mexico and I can say they're worth it there. Does anyone know how much it would cost to use the FL Turnpike from SR 60 and 70 all the way to I-75?

$12 according to the toll calculator on the Florida Turnpike's website.
Visited States and Provinces:
USA (48)= All of Lower 48
Canada (5)= NB, NS, ON, PEI, QC
Mexico (9)= BCN, BCS, CHIH, COAH, DGO, NL, SON, SIN, TAM

KG909

Quote from: US 41 on December 24, 2014, 12:59:22 PM
   Even though I try to avoid toll roads here in the US, I do plan on using toll roads most of the way across Mexico, when I find time to go. The thing about Mexican toll roads though is the benefits you receive from using them. If you break down you can get towed for free to a mechanic, they will pay for damages to your car if the road caused them, most have gas stations on them (like here), and the Green Angels speak English. Here in the US you don't really get those added benefits from driving on the toll roads. You just sort of pay money and your on your own. BTW to drive from Nvo. Laredo - Mazatlan is going to cost $106 in tolls ($212 total).
Toll roads are in better condition and the one I used , MX1, was scenic, so it was a win win. Oh yes I used the calculator and got $12 too, so I'm thinking it's glitched and was hoping someone would know.
~Fuccboi

NE2

Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 01:16:31 PM
Oh yes I used the calculator and got $12 too, so I'm thinking it's glitched and was hoping someone would know.
Why do you think it's glitched? Expecting a higher toll? The whole 300+ mile road is only $25 (which is about half the toll per mile of Laredo-Mazatlan).
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".

US 41

Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2014, 02:11:44 PM
Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 01:16:31 PM
Oh yes I used the calculator and got $12 too, so I'm thinking it's glitched and was hoping someone would know.
Why do you think it's glitched? Expecting a higher toll? The whole 300+ mile road is only $25 (which is about half the toll per mile of Laredo-Mazatlan).

I'll agree with NE2. $12 should be about right. If Mexican Toll Roads are the only toll roads you have used in a while you might be used to the higher toll prices, since their toll roads are a lot more expensive to drive on than most of ours.
Visited States and Provinces:
USA (48)= All of Lower 48
Canada (5)= NB, NS, ON, PEI, QC
Mexico (9)= BCN, BCS, CHIH, COAH, DGO, NL, SON, SIN, TAM

KG909

Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2014, 02:11:44 PM
Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 01:16:31 PM
Oh yes I used the calculator and got $12 too, so I'm thinking it's glitched and was hoping someone would know.
Why do you think it's glitched? Expecting a higher toll? The whole 300+ mile road is only $25 (which is about half the toll per mile of Laredo-Mazatlan).
Really? I expected it to be like $95-110. Never used an American toll so I had no idea of the prices.
~Fuccboi

US 41

#44
Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 02:24:23 PM
Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2014, 02:11:44 PM
Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 01:16:31 PM
Oh yes I used the calculator and got $12 too, so I'm thinking it's glitched and was hoping someone would know.
Why do you think it's glitched? Expecting a higher toll? The whole 300+ mile road is only $25 (which is about half the toll per mile of Laredo-Mazatlan).
Really? I expected it to be like $95-110. Never used an American toll so I had no idea of the prices.

There is no way it is even close to being that expensive. I think to drive from Chicago to Philadelphia it is only about $35 total in tolls.
Visited States and Provinces:
USA (48)= All of Lower 48
Canada (5)= NB, NS, ON, PEI, QC
Mexico (9)= BCN, BCS, CHIH, COAH, DGO, NL, SON, SIN, TAM

KG909

Quote from: US 41 on December 24, 2014, 02:27:11 PM
Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 02:24:23 PM
Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2014, 02:11:44 PM
Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 01:16:31 PM
Oh yes I used the calculator and got $12 too, so I'm thinking it's glitched and was hoping someone would know.
Why do you think it's glitched? Expecting a higher toll? The whole 300+ mile road is only $25 (which is about half the toll per mile of Laredo-Mazatlan).
Really? I expected it to be like $95-110. Never used an American toll so I had no idea of the prices.

There is no way it is that expensive. I think to drive from Chicago to Philadelphia it is somewhere between $30-$40 total in tolls.
Now I feel dumb lol. Mexican tolls are definitely way more expensive then. I think we spent like $15-30 on a trip thats an hour or two. Though I'm not sure if it reopened but if it did it'll probably be more expensive due to repairs.
~Fuccboi

US 41

Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 02:30:58 PM
Quote from: US 41 on December 24, 2014, 02:27:11 PM
Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 02:24:23 PM
Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2014, 02:11:44 PM
Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 01:16:31 PM
Oh yes I used the calculator and got $12 too, so I'm thinking it's glitched and was hoping someone would know.
Why do you think it's glitched? Expecting a higher toll? The whole 300+ mile road is only $25 (which is about half the toll per mile of Laredo-Mazatlan).
Really? I expected it to be like $95-110. Never used an American toll so I had no idea of the prices.

There is no way it is that expensive. I think to drive from Chicago to Philadelphia it is somewhere between $30-$40 total in tolls.
Now I feel dumb lol. Mexican tolls are definitely way more expensive then. I think we spent like $15-30 on a trip thats an hour or two. Though I'm not sure if it reopened but if it did it'll probably be more expensive due to repairs.

Mexico's SCT has a website that calculates tolls. Here's the link for it.

http://aplicaciones4.sct.gob.mx/sibuac_internet/ControllerUI?action=cmdEscogeRuta
Visited States and Provinces:
USA (48)= All of Lower 48
Canada (5)= NB, NS, ON, PEI, QC
Mexico (9)= BCN, BCS, CHIH, COAH, DGO, NL, SON, SIN, TAM

KG909

Quote from: US 41 on December 24, 2014, 02:34:42 PM
Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 02:30:58 PM
Quote from: US 41 on December 24, 2014, 02:27:11 PM
Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 02:24:23 PM
Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2014, 02:11:44 PM
Quote from: KG909 on December 24, 2014, 01:16:31 PM
Oh yes I used the calculator and got $12 too, so I'm thinking it's glitched and was hoping someone would know.
Why do you think it's glitched? Expecting a higher toll? The whole 300+ mile road is only $25 (which is about half the toll per mile of Laredo-Mazatlan).
Really? I expected it to be like $95-110. Never used an American toll so I had no idea of the prices.

There is no way it is that expensive. I think to drive from Chicago to Philadelphia it is somewhere between $30-$40 total in tolls.
Now I feel dumb lol. Mexican tolls are definitely way more expensive then. I think we spent like $15-30 on a trip thats an hour or two. Though I'm not sure if it reopened but if it did it'll probably be more expensive due to repairs.

Mexico's SCT has a website that calculates tolls. Here's the link for it.

http://aplicaciones4.sct.gob.mx/sibuac_internet/ControllerUI?action=cmdEscogeRuta
Hmm it said the trip was $6 but I'm remembering like $5 at every booth. It was when I was 10, so a lot is forgotten.
~Fuccboi

hotdogPi

$1 US = $14 Mexico

You all seem to be forgetting that.
Clinched, minus I-93 (I'm missing a few miles and my file is incorrect)

Traveled, plus US 13, 44, and 50, and several state routes

I will be in Burlington VT for the eclipse.

US 41

Quote from: 1 on December 24, 2014, 03:52:09 PM
$1 US = $14 Mexico

You all seem to be forgetting that.

We both converted ours into USD from MXN Pesos.
Visited States and Provinces:
USA (48)= All of Lower 48
Canada (5)= NB, NS, ON, PEI, QC
Mexico (9)= BCN, BCS, CHIH, COAH, DGO, NL, SON, SIN, TAM



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