Interstate 87 (NC-VA)

[LM117]

Google Maps is smoking weed again. US-64 between I-440 and I-95 is labled as I-87. They also took it a step further and have I-87 concurrent with I-40, ending at the I-440/US-1 interchange in Cary.

[amroad17]

Apparently, Google Maps either can see into the future or this is a future map brought back to our time. 

[fillup420]

I bet NC state officials submitted to Google that I-87 and I-587 be labeled. Everyone uses GPS nowadays, and it will cause folks to start calling the roads by their interstate number. Eventually the new numbers will become mainstream, and they won't even have to officially designate them.

[Roadrunner75]

I bet NC state officials AARoads forum users submitted to Google that I-87 and I-587 be labeled.

Fixed.  Not specific to these particular roads, but I always find it funny when I read on here something like "Hey look!  They labeled new roads on Google Maps", as if it wasn't somebody from this very forum who had something to do with getting it changed - especially in advance of it being official.

[fillup420]

Fixed.  Not specific to these particular roads, but I always find it funny when I read on here something like "Hey look!  They labeled new roads on Google Maps", as if it wasn't somebody from this very forum who had something to do with getting it changed - especially in advance of it being official.

True, I didn't even think of it being anyone on here haha

[vdeane]

I would think someone from here would wait for it to be officially designated, instead of just "future".

[sparker]

Fixed.  Not specific to these particular roads, but I always find it funny when I read on here something like "Hey look!  They labeled new roads on Google Maps", as if it wasn't somebody from this very forum who had something to do with getting it changed - especially in advance of it being official.

True, I didn't even think of it being anyone on here haha

I would think someone from here would wait for it to be officially designated, instead of just "future".

There are a few "wishful thinkers" among the posters here; maybe this is just a playful prank to see how many of us actually notice the Google "designation" and comment on it.  Pretty silly & pointless in any case.  More telling will be to see how long the designation stays up until someone edits it out!

[english si]

I would think someone from here would wait for it to be officially designated, instead of just "future".

Aren't there future signs? Due to that a regular driver might say "this is I-87".

[Mapmikey]

I would think someone from here would wait for it to be officially designated, instead of just "future".

Aren't there future signs? Due to that a regular driver might say "this is I-87".

I drove I-495 between I-440 and I-540 on Thursday.  I-495 fully posted.  No I-87 signage of any kind.

I-87 Future corridor signs exist on US 17 in the Elizabeth City area...not sure if they have gone up anywhere on US 64 east of I-95 or not...

[LM117]

I drove I-495 between I-440 and I-540 on Thursday.  I-495 fully posted.  No I-87 signage of any kind.

I-495 was just recently decommissioned by AASHTO last month, so it might be a while before I-87 replaces I-495. NCDOT will probably do it sometime this summer.

I-87 Future corridor signs exist on US 17 in the Elizabeth City area...not sure if they have gone up anywhere on US 64 east of I-95 or not...

They have.

https://m.facebook.com/groups/300176946738649?view=permalink&id=1314095395346794&refid=18&_ft_=qid.6433047010773380868%3Amf_story_key.1314095395346794%3Atop_level_post_id.1314095395346794%3Atl_objid.1314095395346794&__tn__=%2As

[Jordanes]

I-87 Future corridor signs exist on US 17 in the Elizabeth City area...not sure if they have gone up anywhere on US 64 east of I-95 or not...

They are also posted on the bypass around Edenton.

[Henry]

As I said, unless they figure out a way to connect this to New York, there will be three badly botched interstates in the Tar Heel State: I-87, I-74 and I-73. Well, other than the fact that I-73 is completely east of I-77 (and I-75 for that matter), I'm not bothered by it.

[LM117]

The cost of upgrading the Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel to interstate standards and the extremely environmentally sensitive region known as the Eastern Shore of VA, along with it's notoriously hardcore NIMBY residents (especially those in Northampton County), guarantees that I-87 will never go beyond Norfolk, and that's assuming VA even builds their part of I-87 (which I doubt).

[froggie]

^ What LM117 said.  And on that same note, the prevalent lowlands/wetlands along the Dismal Swamp Canal corridor will make upgrading US 17 between E-City and Dominion Blvd very challenging, expensive, and likely not to happen.  It should also be noted that the major bridges along US 17 between Williamston and E-City are *NOT* Interstate standard and would also be very expensive to upgrade.  Also a lot of wetlands in the Roanoke River valley between Williamston and Windsor.

For these reasons, I don't see I-87 even going past Williamston, let alone Norfolk.

[iBallasticwolf2]

Is I-87 in Virginia supposed to use the VA 168 Chesapeake Expressway or an upgraded US 17? Because it would seem that using VA 168 would require a lot less construction than using US 17.

[froggie]

It would actually require a lot more as you'd have to find a way to get a new alignment route from US 17 to NC/VA 168.

[Beltway]

^ What LM117 said.  And on that same note, the prevalent lowlands/wetlands along the Dismal Swamp Canal corridor will make upgrading US 17 between E-City and Dominion Blvd very challenging, expensive, and likely not to happen.  It should also be noted that the major bridges along US 17 between Williamston and E-City are *NOT* Interstate standard and would also be very expensive to upgrade.  Also a lot of wetlands in the Roanoke River valley between Williamston and Windsor.

For these reasons, I don't see I-87 even going past Williamston, let alone Norfolk.

I am opposed to this I-87, there is about 100 miles of US-17 between Williamston and Dominion Blvd., and the vast majority of the route would need to be on new location, and in addition to numerous environmentally sensitive areas, we're looking at $30 million or more per mile for rural Interstate construction.  So $3 billion or more, and that doesn't include the costs of upgrades from Williamston to Raleigh.

The existing US-64 and US-17 highway is already a decent 4-lane divided interregional highway that serves the corridor well.  There is nothing in that corridor that would warrant an Interstate highway other than the endpoints (R-D and H.R.), and the route is 25 miles longer than the current I-95 and US-58 routing, so this I-87 really isn't workable to connect the end points either.

As I have mentioned in other posts there are already some upgrades in planning on US-58.

Very bad idea this I-87, IMHO.

[english si]

It would actually require a lot more as you'd have to find a way to get a new alignment route from US 17 to NC/VA 168.

A lot less construction in VA though!

[froggie]

Depends on how they routed such an alignment.

[plain]

In Virginia the US 17 corridor would definitely be the preferred alignment if they really insist on building this stupid thing.

Agreed with LM117 and froggie on their points.

Really I'm starting to think this is all just an attempt by NC to get federal funding to rehabilitate US 64...

[froggie]

It's not.  Because Future Interstate designation does not give access to any additional pots of Federal funding.  If anything, given Federal law (mostly) and FHWA policy (a little), what this will do is force NCDOT to spend Federal funding on US 64 that they now won't have for other corridors, because it comes from their normal Federal highway funding allotment.

[LM117]

It's not.  Because Future Interstate designation does not give access to any additional pots of Federal funding.  If anything, given Federal law (mostly) and FHWA policy (a little), what this will do is force NCDOT to spend Federal funding on US 64 that they now won't have for other corridors, because it comes from their normal Federal highway funding allotment.

To add to this, the real reason I-87 was heavily pushed is to give eastern NC an interstate connection to the Port of Virgina. Despite the official spin regarding the idea of linking Raleigh and Norfolk, it was done to benefit eastern NC. I-87's routing makes this blatantly obvious. As I've mentioned before, it's already spawned I-587, which serves Wilson & Greenville, and there's still the push to turn the NC-11/US-13 corridor between Kinston and Bethel into an interstate, the idea being to link the Global Transpark and Greenville to Hampton Roads.

Of all the future interstates in eastern NC, I-42 and I-795's extension to I-40 should be top priority IMO. Nearly half of I-87's corridor is already a freeway and the entire length of Future I-587 is a freeway. Meanwhile, US-70 carries a good deal of truck traffic as well as regional & tourist traffic and the parts of US-70 that have not yet been upgraded or bypassed have a lot of safety issues. US-117 has also seen an increase in trucks lately, especially since the Enviva wood pellet manufacturing plant opened near I-40 at Exit 355. US-117 doesn't have as many safety issues as US-70, but it can get pretty congested between the Mar-Mac area of Goldsboro and I-795, which would be bypassed by I-795's extension. The current bridges over the Neuse River tend to get flooded out easily and having the new alignment section of I-795 provide a second crossing of Neuse River would be ideal and help prevent the southern half of Wayne County from being cutoff every time there's a flood.

[The Ghostbuster]

If Interstate 87 does not go beyond Williamston, then it really should have been given an even second digit. Or maybe it could have just stayed US 64.

[sparker]

If Interstate 87 does not go beyond Williamston, then it really should have been given an even second digit. Or maybe it could have just stayed US 64.

The blame for this can be squarely laid at two sets of feet: NCDOT, which opted for the odd number to begin with in order to avoid duplication with state routes in the general vicinity (a tactic shot down by AASHTO and FHWA in short order), and AASHTO/FHWA, for buying into the "odd number" rationale -- but almost inexplicably changed the number from the NCDOT-sought "89" down to "87".  IMHO, it should have been an even-numbered route to begin with, as the overall latitudinal (E-W) "stretch" is somewhat longer than that of the longitudinal (N-S) one.  Any unused even number from 46 to 62 that didn't have in-state US route conflicts would have worked fine (pulling at least 50 and 52 out of the mix).  To me, snagging a number that's already in use elsewhere is like a person looking for a spouse who limits their prospect pool to those who are already married ("hey, at least they've got experience!). 

[The Nature Boy]

I suspect that NCDOT sought an odd number because of the possibility of extending I-87 down US 1 towards Rockingham at some point in the future.