Indirect control cities

[SP Cook]

In downtown Boston, the on ramps for the Mass Pike read "I-90 New York".  Not only does I-90 not go to New York, getting on the Turnpike is not even necessarially the best route to I-95, which does.

Kentucky is insistant on using "Ashland" as the last control city on I-64, and WV (which used to use "Lexington") followed suit in a resigning project in the early 90s.  Ashland is at least a 5 mile detour off I-64.  Huntington - Lexington would be appropriate.

On I-70 as one heads west is to most confusing sign I can think of.   It read "I-68, Alternate (it used to say "New") Route to Ohio and the West".  First, of course, I-68 goes not where near Ohio.  It ends not 100 miles from that sign in Morgantown, WV, where a motorist would have to go north on I-79 back to I-70 in Washington PA, which (leaving out the toll issues) would be stupid; or south on 79 to US 50, rejoining I-70 in Columbus, which is not a bad alternate, but certainly not shorter.  Second, "the West" ?????  What is "the West" to the Maryland DOT?  Indiana?  When I think of "the West" I think  Wyoming.  Third, why does Maryland care?  I-68 (nee ARC Corridor E) was something of a boondoggle, paralleling the long existing I-70 not 40 miles south of it, through an unpopulated mountain area, but Maryland is trying to drum up traffic on it or something?

[vdeane]

In downtown Boston, the on ramps for the Mass Pike read "I-90 New York".  Not only does I-90 not go to New York, getting on the Turnpike is not even necessarially the best route to I-95, which does.

Do they mean New York City or New York State?  If they mean the state, the signs are perfectly accurate.

[agentsteel53]

I think MA means the state.  They do like to sign states as controls.  495 northbound (clockwise) has "N.H.-Maine" as its control city.

[Jim]

I think MA means the state.  They do like to sign states as controls.  495 northbound (clockwise) has "N.H.-Maine" as its control city.

Plus, at the I-84 exit on the Mass Pike, they specifically spell out "New York City":

[bugo]

Here are some examples in Oklahoma.  These photos have been posted here before.

[SSOWorld]

I think MA means the state.  They do like to sign states as controls.  495 northbound (clockwise) has "N.H.-Maine" as its control city.

Plus, at the I-84 exit on the Mass Pike, they specifically spell out "New York City":

and yet I-84 never reaches NYC. You'd have a choice of routes: I-91 to the Merritt or I-95, One of the NY Parkways (Taconic, Saw Mill River, etc) into the Bronx, or the Thruway.

I-5 in Seattle from I-90:  Vancouver B.C. - (they forgot via BC 99)

[yakra]

-The Everett Turnpike in New Hampshire lists Concord as a northbound control city, but you'd have to take I-93 to get to Concord.

At that point I-93 is routed on the Everett Turnpike, which terminates in Concord.
Similar to the Maine Turnpike transitioning seamlessly into free I-95 in Augusta.

-I-89 at its south end at I-93 list NH Seacoast as a northbound I-93 city and I-393 has Portsmouth as an eastbound control city, but you'd have to take I-393 to US 4 to the Spaulding Turnpike to get to the Seacoast and Portsmouth.

And here, I-393 and the Spaulding Turnpike are part of US4. So in fact you'd follow one route number, US4, all the way to Portsmouth.

[yakra]

I-84 to New York City, as has been mentioned -- and to Boston in the other direction.
Oh, and I like how CT15 goes to N Y City as well!

[Ian]

-The Everett Turnpike in New Hampshire lists Concord as a northbound control city, but you'd have to take I-93 to get to Concord.

At that point I-93 is routed on the Everett Turnpike, which terminates in Concord.
Similar to the Maine Turnpike transitioning seamlessly into free I-95 in Augusta.

-I-89 at its south end at I-93 list NH Seacoast as a northbound I-93 city and I-393 has Portsmouth as an eastbound control city, but you'd have to take I-393 to US 4 to the Spaulding Turnpike to get to the Seacoast and Portsmouth.

And here, I-393 and the Spaulding Turnpike are part of US4. So in fact you'd follow one route number, US4, all the way to Portsmouth.

D'oh! I forgot that I-393 and US 4 as well as I-93 and the Everett are multiplexed.

[Alps]

I-84 to New York City, as has been mentioned -- and to Boston in the other direction.
Oh, and I like how CT15 goes to N Y City as well!

It does - same road becomes the Hutch, which makes it all the way to the Bronx and, via the Whitestone Bridge, Queens.  Can hardly blame NY for assigning a different route number, can'tcha?

[yakra]

I-84 to New York City, as has been mentioned -- and to Boston in the other direction.
Oh, and I like how CT15 goes to N Y City as well!

It does - same road becomes the Hutch, which makes it all the way to the Bronx and, via the Whitestone Bridge, Queens.  Can hardly blame NY for assigning a different route number, can'tcha?

my turn now:

[US71]

[bugo]

Two of I-40's control cities in Arkansas are Little Rock and Ft Smith.  I-40 goes through neither city.

[Scott5114]

Save time? As opposed to what, taking SH-66 the whole way? OTA, ladies and gentlemen.

[Landshark]

Here is an example in Aberdeen, WA.  US-12 does not pass through Olympia, however US-12 drops off the mainline which becomes SR-8 and later US-101 to Olympia.

[TheStranger]

Saw one in Sonoma today:

Route 12 east signed for "San Francisco" and "Petaluma" at the town square -
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Sonoma,+CA&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Sonoma,+California&ll=38.291962,-122.458353&spn=0.001122,0.001725&z=19&layer=c&cbll=38.291976,-122.458493&panoid=trZz5692xGKl4kk0AiGugw&cbp=12,121.31,,2,2.25

To get to Petaluma, one would need to take 12 east, 121 south (briefly), and 116 west, while to get to San Francisco, one has to take 121 south (37 south prior to 1964), 37 west, and then 101 south.

121 south is signed for San Francisco (as opposed to the closer Sears Point or Novato) as well as a result:

[TheStranger]

Another California example just came to mind:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/raymondyue/5014428403/


This sign for Route 92 east at Foster City Boulevard has Stockton as a control city...to get to Stockton from here, one would have to take the following:

92 east to Hayward
880 north to 238
238 east to 580
580 east to 205
205 east to 5 north

[Michael in Philly]

Two of I-40's control cities in Arkansas are Little Rock and Ft Smith.  I-40 goes through neither city.

Well, it goes close enough, doesn't it?  Through suburbs?  If you're in Memphis, I think "Little Rock" is a reasonable descriptor of where 40 west goes.  (And probably matches what most people are doing.)  American control-city practices are pretty weird and inconsistent.  In France, for example, if you're heading toward Paris, even if the road you're on will end 200 km out of Paris and dump you onto another road to continue that direction, you'll get "Paris" among a generous list of destinations.  (The criticism I'd have there is that they often give too many destinations to read.)

[huskeroadgeek]

Two of I-40's control cities in Arkansas are Little Rock and Ft Smith.  I-40 goes through neither city.

Well, it goes close enough, doesn't it?  Through suburbs?  If you're in Memphis, I think "Little Rock" is a reasonable descriptor of where 40 west goes.  (And probably matches what most people are doing.)  American control-city practices are pretty weird and inconsistent.  In France, for example, if you're heading toward Paris, even if the road you're on will end 200 km out of Paris and dump you onto another road to continue that direction, you'll get "Paris" among a generous list of destinations.  (The criticism I'd have there is that they often give too many destinations to read.)

For the French example you gave, it isn't that much different than many examples in the US. It's like Memphis being signed on I-57 in Illinois despite the fact it ends long before it reaches Memphis. Or New York being signed on I-80 even though I-80 ends just before it reaches New York. I guess I don't see that American control city practices are that weird and inconsistent.

[Kacie Jane]

In downtown Boston, the on ramps for the Mass Pike read "I-90 New York".  Not only does I-90 not go to New York, getting on the Turnpike is not even necessarially the best route to I-95, which does.

Do they mean New York City or New York State?  If they mean the state, the signs are perfectly accurate.

I actually think it means the city.  While I-95 is the highway that actually connects Boston and New York, I think the consensus is that the best route is I-90 to I-84 to ???? (depending on exactly where in NYC you want to go).  I'm pretty sure that a sign in Boston that says "I-90 New York" is trying to direct people along this route.

I-84 to New York City, as has been mentioned -- and to Boston in the other direction.
Oh, and I like how CT15 goes to N Y City as well!

It does - same road becomes the Hutch, which makes it all the way to the Bronx and, via the Whitestone Bridge, Queens.  Can hardly blame NY for assigning a different route number, can'tcha?

my turn now:

I-5 in Seattle from I-90:  Vancouver B.C. - (they forgot via BC 99)

Same logic applies to I-5/Vancouver as to the Merritt/NYC.  It's the same highway, different number.  I think that's a slightly different animal than most of the other examples here.

[agentsteel53]

have we mentioned I-40 in Flagstaff being signed for Los Angeles?  Shades of old US-66...

[TheStranger]

have we mentioned I-40 in Flagstaff being signed for Los Angeles?  Shades of old US-66...

Likewise,

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Stockton,+CA&sll=34.18692,-118.176799&sspn=0.009816,0.016823&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Stockton,+San+Joaquin,+California&ll=37.951896,-121.291884&spn=0,0.008411&z=17&layer=c&cbll=37.950088,-121.290888&panoid=zZyI__wS3_WRGNHQne3T9g&cbp=12,265.18,,0,7.87

I-5 south in Stockton signed for San Francisco - shades of old US 50!

[english si]

We have this quite a bit in the UK

For instance, this sign has two - neither road reaches there control destinations. The A404 does go to London, though it's not signed that way (as it's longer and a nasty drive through urban area for most of it).

http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=51.663945,-0.604334&spn=0,0.01929&z=16&layer=c&cbll=51.663933,-0.604153&panoid=r-yDBRGE5FTT5N5Euywk7Q&cbp=12,56.75,,0,-7.61

SCOTLAND on the M6 is quite a funny indirect control city - it ends just 0.2 miles short of the border. Many motorways have destinations you can't get to on just that road signed as control destinations.

[Michael in Philly]

Two of I-40's control cities in Arkansas are Little Rock and Ft Smith.  I-40 goes through neither city.

Well, it goes close enough, doesn't it?  Through suburbs?  If you're in Memphis, I think "Little Rock" is a reasonable descriptor of where 40 west goes.  (And probably matches what most people are doing.)  American control-city practices are pretty weird and inconsistent.  In France, for example, if you're heading toward Paris, even if the road you're on will end 200 km out of Paris and dump you onto another road to continue that direction, you'll get "Paris" among a generous list of destinations.  (The criticism I'd have there is that they often give too many destinations to read.)

For the French example you gave, it isn't that much different than many examples in the US. It's like Memphis being signed on I-57 in Illinois despite the fact it ends long before it reaches Memphis. Or New York being signed on I-80 even though I-80 ends just before it reaches New York. I guess I don't see that American control cit"y practices are that weird and inconsistent.

New Jersey will choose small, in-state points rather than larger cities out of state (For I-78 west, from Newark, it used to be...drum roll..."Clinton."  Now it's Phillipsburg or "Easton Pa")  In Pennsylvania, you don't in fact see New York" for I-80 east, but a succession of fairly small in-state places.  Hence my use of the word "weird."  Maryland gives "New York" for I-95 north, then you cross into Delaware and "New York" disappears in favor of "Wilmington, Philadelphia."  Hence my use of the word "inconsistent."  And how 'bout "Philadelphia, New York"?  Philadelphia's actually quite a large city....

I'm aware that Illinois (and lots of non-East-Coast states) goes to the other extreme.  Hence, again, "inconsistency."  If we could get into the habit of showing two or three destinations for every direction on an Interstate, perhaps a small but local place, and a major city or two that are farther down....

A French example:  http://franceautoroutes.free.fr/photospoint.php?route=a6&pos=69  (top photo)

This would be about here, if the link works right (computer's giving me trouble), heading southeast.  Zoom out to see where the cities are.... http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ie=UTF8&ll=47.037608,4.85424&spn=0.052295,0.109692&z=13

EDIT:  Check out the same interchange from the other direction, although this borders on being an example of "too much"  http://franceautoroutes.free.fr/photospoint.php?route=a6&pos=70 (bottom photo)  Lille in particular is about 400 miles from there, using a sequence of about 4 different numbered "autoroutes" (A31, A5, A26, A1 is the best route I can think of from that point.  On reflection, I think the reason they've got Lille - the largest city in northern France, north of Paris - on that sign is to say "for Lille (and thus the north), go this way rather than through the Paris area.")

[shadyjay]

In downtown Boston, the on ramps for the Mass Pike read "I-90 New York".  Not only does I-90 not go to New York, getting on the Turnpike is not even necessarially the best route to I-95, which does.

That sign that says I-90 WEST/NEW YORK I think is more the exception than the norm.  The new control city posted along I-93 for I-90 is "WORCESTER". 

But I think the biggest indirect control city in that area is I-95 / BOSTON.  I-95 NB motorists have to switch to I-93 NB in Dedham, while I-95 SB motorists switch to US 1 in Peabody.