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Oregon

Started by Hurricane Rex, December 12, 2017, 06:15:33 PM

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Alps

Quote from: Rothman on December 20, 2020, 11:58:49 PM
On a tangent, NY has an obsolete state highway naming convention that is still used in design documents so contractors can look up really old plans if need be.  Sounds like Oregon's.  The old names are broken up by segment in NYSDOT's GIS system.  So, it's sort of a pain for the developers to go through and deal with it, but it would be a lot worse without GIS.
I'm interested in this tangent. I had no idea NY used anything but its 4-digit tags.


Rothman

Quote from: Alps on December 21, 2020, 12:48:19 AM
Quote from: Rothman on December 20, 2020, 11:58:49 PM
On a tangent, NY has an obsolete state highway naming convention that is still used in design documents so contractors can look up really old plans if need be.  Sounds like Oregon's.  The old names are broken up by segment in NYSDOT's GIS system.  So, it's sort of a pain for the developers to go through and deal with it, but it would be a lot worse without GIS.
I'm interested in this tangent. I had no idea NY used anything but its 4-digit tags.
The four digit tags are usually associated with actual names.  I am sure there are a few that have "N/A" now in the system, but most do have highway names.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

Dougtone

Take the scenic drive along OR 38 from the Oregon Coast to I-5 south of Eugene, Oregon.

https://www.gribblenation.org/2020/12/oregon-state-route-38.html

JasonOfORoads

#303
Quote from: Dougtone on December 22, 2020, 10:23:49 PM
Take the scenic drive along OR 38 from the Oregon Coast to I-5 south of Eugene, Oregon.

https://www.gribblenation.org/2020/12/oregon-state-route-38.html

According to the most recent version of the "Descriptions of US and OR Routes" (July 2008), OR-38 is actually only signed to Drain, with OR-99 signed east to I-5:

Quote from: ODOT on July 11, 2008, 03:00:00 AM
OR38 - Over the Umpqua Highway from its junction with the Oregon Coast Highway, US101, in Reedsport, easterly via Scottsburg and Elkton to its junction with the Drain-Yoncalla Highway, OR99, in Drain.

...

OR99 - (snip) Thence southerly over the Pacific Highway (common with I-5) to its junction with the Umpqua Highway at Anlauf; thence southwesterly over the Umpqua Highway to its junction with the Drain-Yoncalla Highway in Drain; thence southerly over the Drain-Yoncalla Highway to its junction with the Pacific Highway, I-5, at the Yoncalla Interchange; thence southerly over the Pacific Highway (common with I-5) to its junction with the Oakland-Shady Highway near Oakland; (snip)

Note that there is no "(common with OR38)" among the bolded portion. It used to be, but apparently wasn't supposed to be and was removed from OR-99's route description on 3/17/1992 by the Oregon Transportation Commission:

Quote from: OTC on March 17, 1992, 11:30:00 AM
5) Revisions to the Oregon route system as follows:

(snip)
2. The change for ORE99 is an error which needs to drop the reference "(common with ORE38)" in the Drain area on the Umpqua Highway, as ORE38 does not cover the same roadway.
(snip)

The route descriptions document hasn't been updated since 2008, and is starting to show its age. However, the Umpqua Highway straightline chart was updated this year, and it too still only shows OR-99 on the segment between Drain and I-5. Given how de-emphasized OR-99 is in Douglas County now, OR-38 probably should officially be officially extended eastwards, especially since signs for 38 are already up on that corridor.

(It's also possible that it has become an extension of OR-38 in the past 12 years and the straightline charts haven't caught up/I haven't read of the extension in the OTC minutes yet.)
Borderline addicted to roadgeeking since ~1989.

Dougtone

Setting course for the Bridge of the Gods that crosses the Columbia River between Cascade Locks, Oregon and Stevenson, Washington. The Bridge of the Gods was built in 1926 and is 1,858 feet long, along with being one of a handful of tolled river crossings along the Columbia River. The bridge's name beckons to a geologic event that took place in the same area of the Columbia River Gorge as well as the lore that helps explain the creation of the Bridge of the Gods. This feels more like an Oregon bridge to me.

https://www.gribblenation.org/2021/01/bridge-of-gods-over-columbia-river.html

Dougtone

Built in 1929 and spanning across the Marys River just a few miles away from US 20, the Harris Covered Bridge is located in the community of Harris in Benton County, Oregon.

https://www.gribblenation.org/2021/01/harris-covered-bridge-benton-county.html

Bruce

A modest 1966 proposal for Portland's freeway network, as seen in the Oregonian:


compdude787

Wow, that was quite an ambitious proposal! I never knew some of those freeways were even proposed.

OCGuy81

I'd love to show this to portlanders nowadays! They'd lose their shit. Even a proposed extra lane (much needed) in the Rose Quarter is met with fierce opposition. The city won't rest until Interstates 5 and 84 are bikes and buses only.

Bruce

Was browsing through the old AASHO documents archive and found a 1958 numbering proposal from Oregon.

Introducing, I-5A and I-5B...



Luckily, the AASHO didn't accidentally approve these suffixes and instead we got I-105 thru I-505. I-82 was also switched to I-80N around the same time, and later became I-84 in 1980.

Bickendan

It would have been marginally better than the 69W-C-E mess, but not by much.

stevashe

They should have stuck with 82, though...

sparker

Quote from: stevashe on April 03, 2021, 01:41:26 AM
They should have stuck with 82, though...

Then what's now I-82, actually added to the network in the final original system draft at the beginning of 1958, would likely have been the first iteration of either I-86 or I-88 rather that waiting for the 1968 batch of additions to utilize those numbers. 

Bruce

A "new" sign on 5th Avenue at I-405, as reported in The Oregonian in 1966:



And the same location today on GSV: https://goo.gl/maps/3afY5P1LavRZXHUC8


OCGuy81

Quote from: Bruce on April 05, 2021, 03:11:49 AM
A "new" sign on 5th Avenue at I-405, as reported in The Oregonian in 1966:



And the same location today on GSV: https://goo.gl/maps/3afY5P1LavRZXHUC8



Ahhhh typical ODOT.  They seem to have an aversion to using "TO" on their signs.  One could think this ramp puts you on I-84...

They do the same too coming along I-5NB into Portland.  You're led to believe 26 is routed along 405 at the Marquam Bridge.  They don't like using "TO".

Bickendan

Technically that ramp does put you on 84, as it directly becomes I-84/US 30's center lane.

Bruce

#316
I recently finished writing up the history of I-405 on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_405_(Oregon)

I'll be delving into the more complicated history of I-205 while I still have access to the Multnomah Library's online newspapers.

Fixed up the URL. -Bick

nexus73

A nice long article about a nice short freeway sums it up!  Thank you Bruce for an outstanding wiki.

Rick
US 101 is THE backbone of the Pacific coast from Bandon OR to Willits CA.  Industry, tourism and local traffic would be gone or severely crippled without it being in functioning condition in BOTH states.

JasonOfORoads

Quote from: Bruce on May 09, 2021, 03:30:43 AM
I recently finished writing up the history of I-405 on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_405_(Oregon)

I'll be delving into the more complicated history of I-205 while I still have access to the Multnomah Library's online newspapers.

I skimmed the write-up and it's phenomenal. Very well-researched and full of solid dates.

I did find one thing that needs to be added. I managed to acquire the July 1968 I-80N Study through interlibrary loan. The study covers two routings: The Mt. Hood Freeway (which was the one eventually chosen) and the Rose City Freeway (called the "Northeast Freeway" in the study). I haven't really dove into looking at it, but I do know that the thought was that one of the two routes was going to be 80N. I remember the ramp placement at the Rose City Freeway/205 interchange being such that 80N through traffic would seamlessly pass through without lane changes. I think the Mt. Hood Freeway/205 interchange was a stack by comparison. I'll have to post more info later.

Also, IIRC according to the 1955 OSHD Technical Report No. 55-5, the Clay-Market routing included a bridge that would've crossed the river instead of the Marquam Bridge. It would've directly continued east as the Mt. Hood Freeway, with the East Side Freeway branching off of it. I don't remember if the Foothills route was even an option at the time.
Borderline addicted to roadgeeking since ~1989.

Bruce

Quote from: JasonOfORoads on May 13, 2021, 05:14:02 PM
Quote from: Bruce on May 09, 2021, 03:30:43 AM
I recently finished writing up the history of I-405 on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_405_(Oregon)

I'll be delving into the more complicated history of I-205 while I still have access to the Multnomah Library's online newspapers.

I skimmed the write-up and it's phenomenal. Very well-researched and full of solid dates.

I did find one thing that needs to be added. I managed to acquire the July 1968 I-80N Study through interlibrary loan. The study covers two routings: The Mt. Hood Freeway (which was the one eventually chosen) and the Rose City Freeway (called the "Northeast Freeway" in the study). I haven't really dove into looking at it, but I do know that the thought was that one of the two routes was going to be 80N. I remember the ramp placement at the Rose City Freeway/205 interchange being such that 80N through traffic would seamlessly pass through without lane changes. I think the Mt. Hood Freeway/205 interchange was a stack by comparison. I'll have to post more info later.

Also, IIRC according to the 1955 OSHD Technical Report No. 55-5, the Clay-Market routing included a bridge that would've crossed the river instead of the Marquam Bridge. It would've directly continued east as the Mt. Hood Freeway, with the East Side Freeway branching off of it. I don't remember if the Foothills route was even an option at the time.

Thanks! I'll go look into the 1955 report, as I don't think there was a second bridge mentioned in the newspaper articles I found from that time.

I do remember reading that I-80N was to follow the Mt. Hood Freeway alignment, but that might have been at a later point.

xonhulu

#320
Since I was posting some OR 127 shields in the Cornelius Pass Highway thread tonight, I thought I'd share some other photos of recently-signed Oregon state routes.  Sorry in advance for the long-ish post.

Delta Highway in Eugene/ OR 132:




There was also a shield on SB Delta Highway up by Belt Line Hwy, but I couldn't photograph it safely.

Up by Dayton, here's the sole Lafayette Highway/OR 154 shield in the field:


Down in Coos Bay, this one's been posted for a few years now and was reported on here, but I don't remember seeing any posted photos on the forum, so here's the junction signage for the Coos River Highway/OR 241 from NB US 101:




There's complimentary signage on SB 101, but I wasn't able to get pictures of those.

Over by Milton-Freewater, these have been signed for several years now, but again, I don't remember seeing any mention of them on the forum, so here are OR 332 and OR 339:

Sunnyside-Umapine Highway/OR 332's eastern endpoint as seen from NB OR 11:


And from SB OR 11:


332's western endpoint at Stateline Rd west of Umapine:




Freewater Highway/OR 339's northern endpoint on Stateline Rd:


And 339's southern terminus in Milton-Freewater:




The last time I checked last fall, the nearby routes OR 334 and 335 are still completely unsigned.

Finally, there's a good chance ODOT is about to sign the Jefferson Highway/OR 164.  Last week, I saw OR 99E shields had been installed along the route, so I emailed ODOT to ask why the correct designation OR 164 wasn't used, and I got this reply:

"You are correct that Jefferson Highway is Oregon Route 164 and will be signed as such in the near future. The sign crews were addressing a few different highways and there was a misunderstanding about what signing. The request asked for OR 99E route signing at the I-5 ramps to show OR 99E is also on I-5 as well as route signing on Jefferson Highway. The mix up was the part that Jefferson Highway should have OR 164 route signing. I spoke with the District sign crew today and they will change the signs out once they have ordered and received the correct signs."

So maybe soon we'll see some OR 164 shields? Given ODOT's usual "efficiency," I don't think I'll be holding my breath . . .


Bickendan

Although I personally wouldn't mind if 99E were signed along ORH 164, to give it another deviation from I-5...
But good, seeing OR 164 actually signed will be nice.

xonhulu

I also had mixed feelings, as the Jefferson Highway was US 99E at one time, so seeing it restored as 99E was a little cool.

When I saw the new signs, I also wondered if they actually wanted the highway signed as BUS 99E.  That would've made some sense.

But I could see a scenario where someone looking to take 99E in Albany getting confused, exiting at the North Jefferson exit, and following it through Jefferson, just to rejoin I-5 again by Millersburg.  So it's probably best if OR 164 is treated and signed as a separate entity.

Bickendan

Then again, would it be any different from 99 peeling away from I-5 or 30 with I-84?

xonhulu

That's a good point. 

The only slight difference is that when those routes veer off the interstate, they invariably return again fairly quickly, while once 99E leaves I-5 in Albany, it's gone for a fairly extended distance, until 99 returns in Eugene.  So maybe they don't consider 99E to be a companion route to I-5; they're just considered two separate highways that happen to have an extended duplex..

But ODOT goes to great pains in many of 99's & 30's off-freeway loops to have graphic map signs on the interstates showing that the route just loops off and returns, so they could have easily done the same here.

The main difference might be historical.  US 99E was re-routed onto the more direct bypass of Jefferson (more-or-less modern I-5's route) in 1945, well before I-5 was planned.  So by the time I-5 was built on that alignment, the Jefferson Highway had not been 99E for some time.  That might be why ODOT never returned 99E to that loop.

I'd have to think if there were any examples where 99 or 30 got moved onto more direct routings in pre-interstate times, then were returned to their original alignments after I-5/84 took over the newer ones.  I wouldn't count the various relocations of US 99 onto the completed-but-discontinuous sections of I-5 in the 50's - 60's, as those were always intended to be temporary.



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