New Jersey

[Alps]

Actually was curious about the 202 thing. Why is it county maintained north of 53? Just so the state can get it off its books and not pay for the upkeep? Just a curiosity thing as most state highways aren't maintained by non-state agencies except it seems in various cities.

202 was a takeover of county roads. NJDOT has assumed upkeep of various short sections - through the I-80 interchange, for example. They had intended to construct a Lincoln Park bypass along the route of the Morris Canal that would likely have become state maintained and could have led to the entire stretch from I-287 to NJ 23 being taken over, but that never progressed beyond planning (and a boring program that is how I learned of it). My argument has been to route US 202 up to US 46, call the whole southern half US 146, call the whole part west of the Hudson NY 35, and then actually start it somewhere east of there (as far as Springfield MA even).

[roadman65]

NJ 28 in Plainfield is not NJDOT and all numbered routes in Trenton (other than US 1) are not in the state system.

29 and 129 in Trenton are NJDOT.

Forgot about those. Oops!  Anyway, Trenton does a terrible job of signing US 206 and NJ 33 in its city.  I have not been on NJ 31 south of I-295, so I can't say how good or bad Trenton signs it.

For US 202 you can find somewhat adequate signage in Morris County for the road, but no reassurance shields.  If any just a couple, but I doubt it.  Passaic County does sign US 202 somewhat including the cutout at Hamburg Turnpike.  Mountain View does not sign the left turn southbound onto Boonton Turnpike though.  Bergen, from GSV, has a lot to be desired as south of the NJ State Line you get a post intersection SOUTH US 202 shield to the right, but no shield after the turn or at the state line to prepare for the turn.  No shields on the ramps from Route 17 to denote cardinal directions and in Oakland there is a turn that 202 makes that is unsigned completely.

One good thing though, you can find some old 2 digit width shields for US 202 in Wayne and Lincoln Park still in use.  However, in 1988 when I clinched those parts, I found them to not reflect anymore at night so your headlights won't reflect off of them.

[roadman65]

Actually was curious about the 202 thing. Why is it county maintained north of 53? Just so the state can get it off its books and not pay for the upkeep? Just a curiosity thing as most state highways aren't maintained by non-state agencies except it seems in various cities.

The state did add mileage signs though on US 202 south of the NJ Transit and Metro North Mainline.  Even though its not their road they list 18 miles to Lincoln Park, 30 miles to Morristown, and 55 miles to Somerville.   Even on US 202 south of Lincoln Park there was one, but last check of GSV the sign supports are still there but the sign itself was gone which listed Morristown as 18 and then Somerville and Lambertville following.

So they have somewhat of control over it to erect those signs there.

[Alps]

NJ 28 in Plainfield is not NJDOT and all numbered routes in Trenton (other than US 1) are not in the state system.

29 and 129 in Trenton are NJDOT.

Forgot about those. Oops!  Anyway, Trenton does a terrible job of signing US 206 and NJ 33 in its city.  I have not been on NJ 31 south of I-295, so I can't say how good or bad Trenton signs it.

For US 202 you can find somewhat adequate signage in Morris County for the road, but no reassurance shields.  If any just a couple, but I doubt it.  Passaic County does sign US 202 somewhat including the cutout at Hamburg Turnpike.  Mountain View does not sign the left turn southbound onto Boonton Turnpike though.  Bergen, from GSV, has a lot to be desired as south of the NJ State Line you get a post intersection SOUTH US 202 shield to the right, but no shield after the turn or at the state line to prepare for the turn.  No shields on the ramps from Route 17 to denote cardinal directions and in Oakland there is a turn that 202 makes that is unsigned completely.

One good thing though, you can find some old 2 digit width shields for US 202 in Wayne and Lincoln Park still in use.  However, in 1988 when I clinched those parts, I found them to not reflect anymore at night so your headlights won't reflect off of them.

Morris County has plenty of reassurance shields. Source: I live here, you don't.

[famartin]

Actually was curious about the 202 thing. Why is it county maintained north of 53? Just so the state can get it off its books and not pay for the upkeep? Just a curiosity thing as most state highways aren't maintained by non-state agencies except it seems in various cities.

The state did add mileage signs though on US 202 south of the NJ Transit and Metro North Mainline.  Even though its not their road they list 18 miles to Lincoln Park, 30 miles to Morristown, and 55 miles to Somerville.   Even on US 202 south of Lincoln Park there was one, but last check of GSV the sign supports are still there but the sign itself was gone which listed Morristown as 18 and then Somerville and Lambertville following.

So they have somewhat of control over it to erect those signs there.

Are you sure the county didn't add those mileage signs? 

For a second I thought you meant the new mileposts they installed a couple years ago on all state-maintained highways, which was going to be news to me since I just drove it last summer for the second time PA to NY and the county sections had none.  Which is honestly something the state should rectify.

[famartin]

NJ 28 in Plainfield is not NJDOT and all numbered routes in Trenton (other than US 1) are not in the state system.

29 and 129 in Trenton are NJDOT.

Forgot about those. Oops!  Anyway, Trenton does a terrible job of signing US 206 and NJ 33 in its city.  I have not been on NJ 31 south of I-295, so I can't say how good or bad Trenton signs it.

For US 202 you can find somewhat adequate signage in Morris County for the road, but no reassurance shields.  If any just a couple, but I doubt it.  Passaic County does sign US 202 somewhat including the cutout at Hamburg Turnpike.  Mountain View does not sign the left turn southbound onto Boonton Turnpike though.  Bergen, from GSV, has a lot to be desired as south of the NJ State Line you get a post intersection SOUTH US 202 shield to the right, but no shield after the turn or at the state line to prepare for the turn.  No shields on the ramps from Route 17 to denote cardinal directions and in Oakland there is a turn that 202 makes that is unsigned completely.

One good thing though, you can find some old 2 digit width shields for US 202 in Wayne and Lincoln Park still in use.  However, in 1988 when I clinched those parts, I found them to not reflect anymore at night so your headlights won't reflect off of them.

31 is not signed much south of the Ewing/Trenton line. There's one or two northbound reassurance signs, and one or two directional signs from 206, but that's it.

As far as 202 not having reassurance signs in Morris County... there are some. The signs here listed as being in Boonton, Lincoln Park, Parsippany are generally the county sections. Could there be a few more?  Sure.
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:U.S._Route_202_in_Morris_County,_New_Jersey

Also I did take pics in Passaic and Bergen...
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:U.S._Route_202_in_Passaic_County,_New_Jersey
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:U.S._Route_202_in_Bergen_County,_New_Jersey

[Alps]

Actually was curious about the 202 thing. Why is it county maintained north of 53? Just so the state can get it off its books and not pay for the upkeep? Just a curiosity thing as most state highways aren't maintained by non-state agencies except it seems in various cities.

The state did add mileage signs though on US 202 south of the NJ Transit and Metro North Mainline.  Even though its not their road they list 18 miles to Lincoln Park, 30 miles to Morristown, and 55 miles to Somerville.   Even on US 202 south of Lincoln Park there was one, but last check of GSV the sign supports are still there but the sign itself was gone which listed Morristown as 18 and then Somerville and Lambertville following.

So they have somewhat of control over it to erect those signs there.

Are you sure the county didn't add those mileage signs? 

For a second I thought you meant the new mileposts they installed a couple years ago on all state-maintained highways, which was going to be news to me since I just drove it last summer for the second time PA to NY and the county sections had none.  Which is honestly something the state should rectify.

Those signs may actually be in another brief state section due to the transit center.

[roadman65]

https://goo.gl/maps/wQ4Kn4Nkkg8WHWMp8
Must be from the same breed to sign I-195. The TO NJ 72 and TO NJ 37 is not that important this far out. Also what about I-295?

[famartin]

https://goo.gl/maps/wQ4Kn4Nkkg8WHWMp8
Must be from the same breed to sign I-195. The TO NJ 72 and TO NJ 37 is not that important this far out. Also what about I-295?

Both roads take you to 295, so not really necessary to differentiate.

[roadman65]

https://goo.gl/maps/wQ4Kn4Nkkg8WHWMp8
Must be from the same breed to sign I-195. The TO NJ 72 and TO NJ 37 is not that important this far out. Also what about I-295?

Both roads take you to 295, so not really necessary to differentiate.

https://goo.gl/maps/zYJoFUC7YkpSdUY46

Than this one ignoring the I-78 concurrency with US 22 East.  Exit 3 is signed no direction. 

At least construction workers removed the NJ 173 shield so the detour could be followed.

[famartin]

https://goo.gl/maps/wQ4Kn4Nkkg8WHWMp8
Must be from the same breed to sign I-195. The TO NJ 72 and TO NJ 37 is not that important this far out. Also what about I-295?

Both roads take you to 295, so not really necessary to differentiate.

https://goo.gl/maps/zYJoFUC7YkpSdUY46

Than this one ignoring the I-78 concurrency with US 22 East.  Exit 3 is signed no direction. 

At least construction workers removed the NJ 173 shield so the detour could be followed.

Its back now. This was taken 7/13/2020.


I'm not entirely sure, but the signs may be controlled by DRJTBC since the maintenance on this section is listed as being them (not NJDOT), so that might have something to do with it.

[roadman65]

Also the ramps from US 22 East and NJ 173 both use New York and all signs were put up at same time.

[jmacswimmer]

Also the ramps from US 22 East and NJ 173 both use New York and all signs were put up at same time.

This I find interesting since the same thing happens in both directions at the I-287 interchange...EB uses Newark (but New York from I-287), and WB uses Phillipsburg (but Easton from I-287).

Now that I'm typing this, I realized I-287 SB does it too...it has Perth Amboy as the control, but both ramps from I-78 use Somerville.  At least NB is consistent with Morristown!

[roadman65]

It wasn't always like that.  I-287 used Newark and Clinton.  Though Phillipsburg was still on I-78 W Bound though.  I-287 had no control cities either way.  However, US 22 was always signed New York with I-78 being Newark.

Yes that exchange is very inconsistent.   NJ is on spot replacing and do not look at updates or check around.  The same for the ramp to I-287 south from US 202 & 206 at Bedminster using Somerville and Princeton as SB Control city, but at the split for Exit 17 for US 202 & 206 again it features Flemington with Somerville and not consistent with the previous.  After all I-287 is the bypass for US 202 & 206 for Pluckemin and Bridgewater.  So that is why NJDOT assigned Princeton there, but when changes to I-287 signs were made to former Exit 13 (now 17) they switched out Princeton there for Flemington, but forgot about the sign on the ramp in Bedminster.

[odditude]

https://goo.gl/maps/wQ4Kn4Nkkg8WHWMp8
Must be from the same breed to sign I-195. The TO NJ 72 and TO NJ 37 is not that important this far out. Also what about I-295?

for the record, here's the previous version of this assembly.

the "TO 37 / 72" would make a lot more sense if the destinations included Toms River or LBI (or even the no-longer-accepted "Shore Pts") - but in a bubble, it's totally nonsensical to me.

[jeffandnicole]

This was a bit interesting...with the US 322 widening project between I-295 & US 130 nearing completion, NJDOT issued a press release last weekend for a traffic shift, moving the WB lane from the future EB roadway to the WB roadway.  https://www.state.nj.us/transportation/uploads/comm/news/details/comm_np_20210408_150632_Rt322wbtrafficshifttomorrowasroadwaywideningprojectadvancesinGloucesterCounty.pdf

What is most interesting about this, is that it's the first time NJDOT has referenced this project anywhere. It's never been mentioned on their website, in the TIP, on any advanced project listing. It wasn't even put out to bid by NJDOT. The construction has encountered several phases and at least one other traffic shift, and none of them received a press release as well.

Work has started on another US 322 project just east of here, widening 322 at another intersection in preparation for another warehouse development. Similar to the above, no announcement from NJDOT has been made about that project either.

[Alps]

This was a bit interesting...with the US 322 widening project between I-295 & US 130 nearing completion, NJDOT issued a press release last weekend for a traffic shift, moving the WB lane from the future EB roadway to the WB roadway.  https://www.state.nj.us/transportation/uploads/comm/news/details/comm_np_20210408_150632_Rt322wbtrafficshifttomorrowasroadwaywideningprojectadvancesinGloucesterCounty.pdf

What is most interesting about this, is that it's the first time NJDOT has referenced this project anywhere. It's never been mentioned on their website, in the TIP, on any advanced project listing. It wasn't even put out to bid by NJDOT. The construction has encountered several phases and at least one other traffic shift, and none of them received a press release as well.

Work has started on another US 322 project just east of here, widening 322 at another intersection in preparation for another warehouse development. Similar to the above, no announcement from NJDOT has been made about that project either.

It's being done by a developer, so was probably written into their permit and thus not something biddable as the developer would then be doing it themselves.

[jeffandnicole]

This was a bit interesting...with the US 322 widening project between I-295 & US 130 nearing completion, NJDOT issued a press release last weekend for a traffic shift, moving the WB lane from the future EB roadway to the WB roadway.  https://www.state.nj.us/transportation/uploads/comm/news/details/comm_np_20210408_150632_Rt322wbtrafficshifttomorrowasroadwaywideningprojectadvancesinGloucesterCounty.pdf

What is most interesting about this, is that it's the first time NJDOT has referenced this project anywhere. It's never been mentioned on their website, in the TIP, on any advanced project listing. It wasn't even put out to bid by NJDOT. The construction has encountered several phases and at least one other traffic shift, and none of them received a press release as well.

Work has started on another US 322 project just east of here, widening 322 at another intersection in preparation for another warehouse development. Similar to the above, no announcement from NJDOT has been made about that project either.

It's being done by a developer, so was probably written into their permit and thus not something biddable as the developer would then be doing it themselves.

At least the contractor being used is a very prominent fixture on highway projects in the state.

[roadman65]

Hopefully they add new signs to the I-295 interchange with control cities like they have at the US 130 interchange.  Even if Del. Mem. Br. is used SB for 295 it would be something.   

[famartin]

I imagine this project is a small benefit to the DRPA, since it will encourage more usage of the Commodore Barry Bridge.

[jeffandnicole]

Hopefully they add new signs to the I-295 interchange with control cities like they have at the US 130 interchange.  Even if Del. Mem. Br. is used SB for 295 it would be something.   

So far, no evidence new overhead signage will be added on 322 at the 295/322 Interchange. 

Hopefully signage leading out of the new warehouse park will direct drivers to 295 South via 322 East, and 295 North via 322 West (to 130 South).

The missing moves at the 295/322 Interchange were no doubt omitted when 295 was built as those movements would be served by the 295-130-322 corridor.  Not only did they have room at the time, the wetlands and river area just off the ramp from 295 North to 322 East appears to be manmade looking at historicaerieals.com as a part of the original 295 construction.  With the growth in the Logan Twp/Swedesboro area, this interchange is a bit underpowered (especially with the morning rush hour traffic from 295 to 322). Combined with the traffic using 295's Exit 10 (Center Square Road), this general area could use some significant improvements, including adding the missing moves.  The only saving grace for Swedesboro/Logan traffic to/from the Commodore Barry Bridge is that traffic can use 322-130-High Hill Road (CR 662) as a decent alternate.

I imagine this project is a small benefit to the DRPA, since it will encourage more usage of the Commodore Barry Bridge.

During peak times (rush hours), the CBB is approaching congested conditions.  While they don't often use the zipper barrier to provide 3 lanes, it certainly does help.  On Friday afternoons with shore traffic, 3 lanes into NJ is provided, and there's still some congestion. 

During non-peak travel periods, the bridge is usually free-flowing.  The bridge needs quite a bit of work though - the patches of rust and paint look awful, and the concrete decking doesn't look much better.  I have a feeling this bridge is going to need a lot of work in the relatively near future.  For a while, the CBB was $5 and the Del Mem Bridge was $4, so if there was a reasonable drive that could use either bridge, the DMB would've saved $1.  As the DMB is now $5 as well ($4.75 EZ Pass), there's no real money savings to use the DMB.

[NJRoadfan]

On the topic of South Jersey, US-40 could use some intersection upgrades in Salem County. Dedicated left turn lanes at traffic lights would be a nice improvement.

[TheGrassGuy]

It wasn't always like that.  I-287 used Newark and Clinton.  Though Phillipsburg was still on I-78 W Bound though.  I-287 had no control cities either way.  However, US 22 was always signed New York with I-78 being Newark.

Yes that exchange is very inconsistent.   NJ is on spot replacing and do not look at updates or check around.  The same for the ramp to I-287 south from US 202 & 206 at Bedminster using Somerville and Princeton as SB Control city, but at the split for Exit 17 for US 202 & 206 again it features Flemington with Somerville and not consistent with the previous.  After all I-287 is the bypass for US 202 & 206 for Pluckemin and Bridgewater.  So that is why NJDOT assigned Princeton there, but when changes to I-287 signs were made to former Exit 13 (now 17) they switched out Princeton there for Flemington, but forgot about the sign on the ramp in Bedminster.

Speaking of which, are there any pictures of the old signs?

[Mapmikey]

Took a ride around the southern half of NJ yesterday.

In addition to some brand new US 48 shields on US 40 WB, the best things I found were some really old destination signs like this - https://goo.gl/maps/uZFD5jz4TC9QwEgH8

How common is this style of sign today?  I found 4 examples at 3 intersections SE of Salem.  Didn't notice them anywhere else...

Also found even older signs like this -  https://goo.gl/maps/nUZ4dBRZ6FMneLr18

[Mr. Matté]

Speaking of NJDOT, I happened to walk through the print room of my work and saw this ALTA survey (not done by my company) around everyone's favorite abandoned section of US 322. What really caught my eye is that the portion of 324 with the houses says it's under [Logan] township jurisdiction (ref. plan 7 being the jurisdictional map for US 130) and the "Road Closed" part and Springer Road intersection being private land now. The SLDs still say it's NJDOT jurisdiction and of course the milemarkers that were put up not too long ago (at least I'm assuming that all of them are still up and not taken down by anyone). The state's online parcel search still basically has it as public ROW unless there's a lag on the parcel data there.

Following up on this, apparently there was a bill in the State Legislature back in late 2017 and was passed in the Assembly & Senate by January 18, 2018 that would have dedesignated 32 but since it was the end of that session, it probably expired before the start of the next session. In any case, NJDOT did drive the whole road per their video log later in 2018. I only bring it up now since I clinched it today (on a road bike(!) and my tires somehow survived) but it seems like since at least August 2019 when Roadwaywiz did it as a part of the Chester Virtual Meet, the road is much better cleared of the brush that line the road. There were some equipment and fresh access points near the end so maybe there was some activity going on for river dredging or the 230 kV power line crossing.