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Regional Boards => Midwest - Great Lakes => Topic started by: roadman65 on December 14, 2021, 08:09:53 AM

Title: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: roadman65 on December 14, 2021, 08:09:53 AM
Was wondering if M3 and M19 in the Detroit area ever been the historic alignment of US 25?

I would think it is, but what looks say don't always mean and the fact M3 is not assigned to the M19 part of Gratiot Road also raises the question as well.
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: Flint1979 on December 14, 2021, 08:16:02 AM
Was wondering if M3 and M19 in the Detroit area ever been the historic alignment of US 25?

I would think it is, but what looks say don't always mean and the fact M3 is not assigned to the M19 part of Gratiot Road also raises the question as well.
Yes it was. M-19 was was extended south on Gratiot between Richmond and New Haven and then to I-94 when US-25 was shifted to the freeway. M-3 came into existence when US-25 was truncated at Cincinnati. Also M-85 which is Fort Street was also a part of US-25.
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: Ryctor2018 on December 14, 2021, 01:28:21 PM
http://www.michiganhighways.org/listings/HistoricUS-025.html
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: jOnstar1979 on December 15, 2021, 12:15:20 AM
I am always looking for pictures of Gratiot or I-94 in Macomb & St. Clair County in the late 60's early 70's showing US-25. I had a great screenshot from a video I found online, but my portable hard drive stopped working and I lost it. If I find it again... I will post it here. It was a shot of a US-25 overhead sign and next exit 5 miles when 94 was still being built.
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: CoolAngrybirdsrio4 on December 15, 2021, 02:43:33 AM
Yes, indicating from the fact it ended at Port Austin at some point.
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: Henry on December 15, 2021, 10:21:23 AM
And, in addition, US 25 remained a surface road until its decommissioning, which is the complete opposite of how other US routes in the state were rerouted onto their Interstate equivalents. Only from Woodhaven to downtown Detroit and from Chesterfield Township to Port Huron did it ever follow a freeway alignment (totaling about 48 miles), which are today's I-75 and I-94.
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: KCRoadFan on December 15, 2021, 10:00:28 PM
It makes sense that it would have been - looking on the map, you can see that Gratiot Road eventually links up to M-25 in Port Huron, and the source of that number seems rather obvious.

I suppose it follows, then, that US 25 used to end in Bay City, like M-25 does now. Is that right?
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: bulldog1979 on December 16, 2021, 12:16:35 AM
It makes sense that it would have been - looking on the map, you can see that Gratiot Road eventually links up to M-25 in Port Huron, and the source of that number seems rather obvious.

I suppose it follows, then, that US 25 used to end in Bay City, like M-25 does now. Is that right?

Nope, US 25 ended at Port Austin at its northernmost extent. The rest of the way to Bay City was M-25.

Michigan has had a tradition of a state highway continuation of US Highways. In 1926, M-24 and US 24 connected at Pontiac. At the same time, US 131 terminated outside Fife Lake, and M-131 continued northward through Petoskey. When US 25 was extended from Port Huron to Port Austin in 1933 over part of M-29, the rest of M-29 to Bay City was redesignated M-25.
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: NE2 on December 17, 2021, 12:51:21 PM
Grayshit?
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: 23skidoo on December 17, 2021, 01:02:40 PM
Grayshit?

GRASH-it, rhymes with "crash it". As many an east side father warned his son when he took the family car to go "cruising": Don't crash it on Gratiot!
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: Henry on December 17, 2021, 01:37:50 PM
Grayshit?

GRASH-it, rhymes with "crash it". As many an east side father warned his son when he took the family car to go "cruising": Don't crash it on Gratiot!

I always thought it was either "gray-she-oh" or "grash-ee-oh", and also that the name was French, since I took it in high school. Detroit itself is a French word, and it is not pronounced the same way as the English version; instead, it's called "Day-traw", like the number 3 is trois ("traw").
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: 7/8 on December 17, 2021, 01:45:47 PM
Grayshit?

GRASH-it, rhymes with "crash it". As many an east side father warned his son when he took the family car to go "cruising": Don't crash it on Gratiot!

His joke might also be referencing the Michigan/US Great Lakes accent, where the short a sound (ex: "cat") sounds similar to the long a sound (ex: "say") of other accents. This a good read for those interested in phonetics: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inland_Northern_American_English#Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inland_Northern_American_English#Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift)
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: GaryV on December 17, 2021, 02:31:11 PM
Yes, Michiganders fail miserably trying to pronounce French names.  One article I read a few years back noted that the local pronunciation of Gratiot couldn't even be printed in the newspaper.

(Not that some other areas are any better - Illinois certainly isn't pronounced the way the French would say it.)

We do a little closer when pronouncing German, e.g. Schoenherr.
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: skluth on December 17, 2021, 04:29:03 PM
There's a street in St Louis also called Gratiot. Locals call it Gray'-show, though they butcher many other French names like Gravois (last syllable rhymes with boys) and Cuivre (pronounced quiver). They're equal opportunity pronunciation butchers though as Goethe (named after the German author) is pronounced go-thee (soft th).
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: Flint1979 on December 17, 2021, 05:03:53 PM
There's a street in St Louis also called Gratiot. Locals call it Gray'-show, though they butcher many other French names like Gravois (last syllable rhymes with boys) and Cuivre (pronounced quiver). They're equal opportunity pronunciation butchers though as Goethe (named after the German author) is pronounced go-thee (soft th).
Well in Michigan, Gratiot is pronounced Gra-shit.
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: tchafe1978 on December 20, 2021, 01:34:58 PM
There is a small town in Southern Wisconsin in Lafayette Countt spelled and said the same way. Methinks it's the French who were wrong all along here, with their fancy-schmancy pronounciations.
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: Flint1979 on December 20, 2021, 03:42:44 PM
There is a small town in Southern Wisconsin in Lafayette Countt spelled and said the same way. Methinks it's the French who were wrong all along here, with their fancy-schmancy pronounciations.
I went through there earlier in the year when I was county clinching the rest of NW Illinois and Southern Wisconsin.
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: jOnstar1979 on February 05, 2022, 11:49:29 PM
(https://i.pinimg.com/564x/64/78/3a/64783a7ac67b061e116c06a7906abcc2.jpg)

Found this one doing a search in google.
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: Flint1979 on February 06, 2022, 09:09:54 AM
(https://i.pinimg.com/564x/64/78/3a/64783a7ac67b061e116c06a7906abcc2.jpg)

Found this one doing a search in google.
I remember when they had the freeway names on the signs. I wish they still did.
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: cwf1701 on February 08, 2022, 06:14:56 PM
here's one of Gratiot as US-25. sorry about the writing, this was someone's high school yearbook (from East Detroit High School): https://archive.org/details/eastdetroiter1964/page/n3/mode/2up
Title: Re: Was Gratiot Road ever US 25?
Post by: bessertc on February 10, 2022, 07:14:48 AM
Quote
I remember when they had the freeway names on the signs. I wish they still did.

Interestingly, here in the Grand Rapids area, they still do (courtesy GSV):
(http://www.michiganhighways.org/etc/GRFordFrwy01.png)
(http://www.michiganhighways.org/etc/GRFordFrwy03.png)
(http://www.michiganhighways.org/etc/GRFordFrwy02.png)