North Carolina

[LM117]

Google Maps doesn't mark Interstate 587 on its maps yet, but I did find something interesting just south of Exit 49 (NC 58). In the middle of what seems to be vacant land, there is something called "The Campus at 587": https://www.google.com/maps/@35.672606,-77.8508316,1878m/data=!3m1!1e3. Is this a real place, and is it in any way related to the fact that the US 264 freeway will soon become Interstate 587?

It's a business park owned by Wilson County.  They just recently awarded an infrastructure improvement project (sewage/wastewater) for the property this past October.  The name is after 587 but I believe Wilson County has had this land for some time.

https://www.wilsonedc.com/Images/wilsonedc/site/brochures/Flyer_Wilson_TheCampusat587.pdf

Yep. IIRC, the park was gonna have a different name (I forget the name) before I-587 was put on the books. The name change was very recent.

Funny thing is that when Greenville first started it's push to get US-264 turned into an interstate, Wilson (city & county) was indifferent to the idea since they were satisfied with just I-95 & I-795, but now that FHWA has given the thumbs up to I-587, it looks like Wilson's tune is changing pretty quick.

[fillup420]

There have been 2 sets of mainline bridges reconstructed on I-40 in Burke County in recent years.  Does anyone know if the were built in a manner to allow easy expansion to 6 lanes?

Drove over the eastbound one on wednesday. Work was recently completed. I did not notice any obvious extra space for an additional lane, but its a really short bridge, so I may have missed something. Are there plans for 6-lane expansion in that area? Its very rural, so I would be surprised if that happened.

[cowboy_wilhelm]

There have been 2 sets of mainline bridges reconstructed on I-40 in Burke County in recent years.  Does anyone know if the were built in a manner to allow easy expansion to 6 lanes?

Drove over the eastbound one on wednesday. Work was recently completed. I did not notice any obvious extra space for an additional lane, but its a really short bridge, so I may have missed something. Are there plans for 6-lane expansion in that area? Its very rural, so I would be surprised if that happened.

A project to widen that stretch of I-40 was in the last round of prioritization (and maybe earlier), but did not make it into the draft 2020 STIP. I can't find a feasibility study either. Any potential widening would probably be a decade away at the earliest.

https://connect.ncdot.gov/projects/planning/Prioritization%20Data/Z%20-%20Archives%20(P5.0,%20P4.0,%20P3.0,%20P2.0,%20P1.0)/Prioritization%205.0/P5.0%20Final%20SPOT%20On!ine%204-Page%20Project%20Reports/Division13/H172232.PDF

Traffic volumes are fairly high on I-40 between U.S. 64 in Morganton and U.S. 321 in Hickory, ranging from 49,500 to 53,500 AADT in 2019. The portions of I-95 currently or about to be widened to eight lanes has volumes between 56,000 and 64,500 in Lumberton; 50,500 - 52,000 between Lumberton and Fayetteville; and 56,500 - 65,000 from north of Fayetteville to I-40. Last I checked, Robeson County isn't exactly a sprawling metropolis, but the volumes on I-95 warrant expansion.

[sprjus4]

^

I-95 is different in the sense of I-40 of having high peak weekend volumes. That also has to be considered. It's the major north-south highway between the Northeast and Florida.

As far as I'm aware, there's not much in the way of recurring congestion on I-40. I-95, on the other hand, sees frequent congestion, particularly in the area between I-40 and I-74, during peak weekends and travel periods.

[Mapmikey]

There have been 2 sets of mainline bridges reconstructed on I-40 in Burke County in recent years.  Does anyone know if the were built in a manner to allow easy expansion to 6 lanes?

Drove over the eastbound one on wednesday. Work was recently completed. I did not notice any obvious extra space for an additional lane, but its a really short bridge, so I may have missed something. Are there plans for 6-lane expansion in that area? Its very rural, so I would be surprised if that happened.

Definitely not widened for future expansion:
https://goo.gl/maps/DBXPLCU6vpyj1u2DA

[tolbs17]

There have been 2 sets of mainline bridges reconstructed on I-40 in Burke County in recent years.  Does anyone know if the were built in a manner to allow easy expansion to 6 lanes?

Drove over the eastbound one on wednesday. Work was recently completed. I did not notice any obvious extra space for an additional lane, but its a really short bridge, so I may have missed something. Are there plans for 6-lane expansion in that area? Its very rural, so I would be surprised if that happened.

Definitely not widened for future expansion:
https://goo.gl/maps/DBXPLCU6vpyj1u2DA

unless they have to widen it when construction actually starts

[ARMOURERERIC]

I was thinking more along the line of were the twin bridges designed such that the additional lanes could easily be added in the median gap.

There is a lot of $$ flight out of Hickory, Newton, Conover to Morganton causing more commuting.  Plus Marion is growing with couples who split their commute with one working in Charlotte, the other in Asheville.  Morganton has become a hot spot due to a very active and robust downtown night life.

[architect77]

Just giving everybody a heads up to the ones have not been in that area...

Or, maybe.. I should only post about that if the signs have ACTUALLY been replaced instead of just giving updates?

That would at least be something noteworthy, yes. Or at least provide some context. Are the faded signs dated from when the various sections of I-540 originally opened? Speculate and maybe someone could confirm.

Otherwise it would be like me posting "The overheads on I-4 east at SR 39/39A are fading badly and probably will be replaced during the next resurfacing project through Plant City." That's true, but its inane. I.e. "so, what?"

Ah. At least east of US-1... As of December 22 2021, they have not been fixed/replaced.

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.873711,-78.5668159,3a,15y,287.64h,94.52t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sC-wIuA4R8ENrFxARrJAwyw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.7963165,-78.5153332,3a,19.7y,186.71h,98.14t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s27Z1QYO0UAOSE_X7PaE8dw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

this is not I-540, but this is also pretty bad as well - https://www.google.com/maps/@35.8114376,-78.6106559,3a,72.5y,92.1h,87.52t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sTzrlIAY8QDv6dLOGSlGTWw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Here's some good news for you...

Signage plans are released from US 70 and US 1 in northern Raleigh along I-540.

https://xfer.services.ncdot.gov/dsplan/2022%20Highway%20Letting/01-18-22/Plans%20and%20Proposals/WAKE_47954.3.1_I-5999_C204656/Standard%20PDF%20Files/

That's good news. I wish Georgia would outsource this type of work. Instead metro Atlanta must endure this:

6 by Stephen Edwards, on Flickr

285 by Stephen Edwards, on Flickr

[Mapmikey]

I was thinking more along the line of were the twin bridges designed such that the additional lanes could easily be added in the median gap.

Satellite view suggests yes they have prepped the area between the bridges to add within the median.  I can't believe it would've been that expensive on such a short bridge to go ahead and build the full width bridge for 6 lanes.

[cowboy_wilhelm]

^

I-95 is different in the sense of I-40 of having high peak weekend volumes. That also has to be considered. It's the major north-south highway between the Northeast and Florida.

As far as I'm aware, there's not much in the way of recurring congestion on I-40. I-95, on the other hand, sees frequent congestion, particularly in the area between I-40 and I-74, during peak weekends and travel periods.

And no one goes to the mountains for the weekend....

No, it's not to I-95 levels. The point was that it doesn't matter if an area is "rural" or not if there are high volumes on the highway that warrant improvements. It is mostly "nuisance" congestion on this stretch of I-40 at this point in that you cannot easily change lanes or pass, but are still traveling at or near the speed limit. Up the number of trucks and/or overall volume and you'll get some recurring congestion.

[Dirt Roads]

^

I-95 is different in the sense of I-40 of having high peak weekend volumes. That also has to be considered. It's the major north-south highway between the Northeast and Florida.

As far as I'm aware, there's not much in the way of recurring congestion on I-40. I-95, on the other hand, sees frequent congestion, particularly in the area between I-40 and I-74, during peak weekends and travel periods.

And no one goes to the mountains for the weekend....

No, it's not to I-95 levels. The point was that it doesn't matter if an area is "rural" or not if there are high volumes on the highway that warrant improvements. It is mostly "nuisance" congestion on this stretch of I-40 at this point in that you cannot easily change lanes or pass, but are still traveling at or near the speed limit. Up the number of trucks and/or overall volume and you'll get some recurring congestion.

Actually, I'm pretty sure that I-40 peak weekend traffic (going to the mountains in the Fall) is worse than I-95 peak weekend traffic (probably Spring Break, but Thanksgiving might be worse).  It's just that there's only a few sections of I-40 that get tested.  The worst is probably the four-lane section US-15/501 to the I-85 split near Hillsborough.  That gets hit with hour-long backups westbound all evening on Fridays and eastbound starting late on Sunday afternoons.  Amazingly, the Death Valley section of I-40 through Greensboro seems to get hit hard as well (even though the southern part of the Greensboro Urban Loop is only slightly longer and never congested).  But west of Winston-Salem, a significant portion of the Fall weekend traffic takes US-421 to Boone, which reduces the traffic on I-40 heading to Asheville.

Thank goodness that the I-85/I-40 multiplex from Hillsborough -to- Greensboro is eight lanes.  During the Fall weekends, traffic along The Spine is the heaviest you will ever see on this stretch but still mostly free-flowing.  Whenever we have braved a trip west during the Fall, the traffic coming back on Sunday afternoon or Sunday evening is wall-to-wall.  Fortunately, we get off the Interstate before everything jams up a few miles before Exit 261 to stay on I-40.  (But sometimes, we make the mistake of going out to eat in Durham on Sunday evening and forgetting about the I-40 traffic jam).

[Dirt Roads]

With respect to Thanksgiving traffic, I-40 still gets heavy traffic but it doesn't seem as bad as I-95, I-85 or even worse, I-77.  Plus, I-85 traffic gets jammed in both directions for Thanksgiving.

[sprjus4]

Actually, I'm pretty sure that I-40 peak weekend traffic (going to the mountains in the Fall) is worse than I-95 peak weekend traffic (probably Spring Break, but Thanksgiving might be worse).  It's just that there's only a few sections of I-40 that get tested.  The worst is probably the four-lane section US-15/501 to the I-85 split near Hillsborough.  That gets hit with hour-long backups westbound all evening on Fridays and eastbound starting late on Sunday afternoons.  Amazingly, the Death Valley section of I-40 through Greensboro seems to get hit hard as well (even though the southern part of the Greensboro Urban Loop is only slightly longer and never congested).  But west of Winston-Salem, a significant portion of the Fall weekend traffic takes US-421 to Boone, which reduces the traffic on I-40 heading to Asheville.

My comment was in reference to the segment of I-40 west of Statesville / Hickory and comparison to I-95, not any segments of I-40 east of there.

I'm aware I-40 has worse spots further east that are higher priority.

[tolbs17]

Or how about this - widen I-40 from 4 to 6 lanes from Waynesville ALL THE WAY to Winston-Salem.

And in Asheville, some parts might need 8 lanes, such as near the I-240 beltway.

[sprjus4]

Or how about this - widen I-40 from 4 to 6 lanes from Waynesville ALL THE WAY to Winston-Salem.

Could be a long range goal, but there's certainly higher priorities in the state.

For example, the entire length of I-95. Completing I-26 near Asheville and other needed widenings along that route. And others.

[tolbs17]

Second line: Are there any official plans or documents rather than some random roadgeek saying that US-264 will be moved back onto its original alignment without providing a news article or a link to it?

I reached out to NCDOT a few weeks ago in regards of I-587 and what might happen to US 264. I got a response today that they are indeed planning to submit a rerouting to US 264 and a elimination of US 264 ALT in the AASHTO Fall Meeting. They were even kind enough to share the draft files they plan to use in the upcoming meeting.

In the requests, they will relocate US 264 along existing US 264 Alt from Exit 51 south through Saratoga and Farmville, then in Greenville it will connect onto NC 11 Bypass north, a total of 26.43 miles relocation; that section of US 264 Alt will be eliminated.

The timeline after that depends on other factors, but they hope to have I-587 and US 264 signage done in 2022.

With that being done, it looks like it will be this proposal. Was not expecting it going that overboard but it's fine.

And with that being done, the existing US-264 ALT will FOR SURE be converted into a business route.

[roadman65]

Second line: Are there any official plans or documents rather than some random roadgeek saying that US-264 will be moved back onto its original alignment without providing a news article or a link to it?

I reached out to NCDOT a few weeks ago in regards of I-587 and what might happen to US 264. I got a response today that they are indeed planning to submit a rerouting to US 264 and a elimination of US 264 ALT in the AASHTO Fall Meeting. They were even kind enough to share the draft files they plan to use in the upcoming meeting.

In the requests, they will relocate US 264 along existing US 264 Alt from Exit 51 south through Saratoga and Farmville, then in Greenville it will connect onto NC 11 Bypass north, a total of 26.43 miles relocation; that section of US 264 Alt will be eliminated.

The timeline after that depends on other factors, but they hope to have I-587 and US 264 signage done in 2022.

With that being done, it looks like it will be this proposal. Was not expecting it going that overboard but it's fine.

And with that being done, the existing US-264 ALT will FOR SURE be converted into a business route.

IMO, US 264 needs to go as it is another one state route that is not per current federal policies regarding designations.  Plus its overlap to Raleigh with its parent route is so redundant.  It ends at I-440 where US 64 continues.  Plus with I-587 someday coming, it will be mostly overlapped with that future interstate.

[tolbs17]

Second line: Are there any official plans or documents rather than some random roadgeek saying that US-264 will be moved back onto its original alignment without providing a news article or a link to it?

I reached out to NCDOT a few weeks ago in regards of I-587 and what might happen to US 264. I got a response today that they are indeed planning to submit a rerouting to US 264 and a elimination of US 264 ALT in the AASHTO Fall Meeting. They were even kind enough to share the draft files they plan to use in the upcoming meeting.

In the requests, they will relocate US 264 along existing US 264 Alt from Exit 51 south through Saratoga and Farmville, then in Greenville it will connect onto NC 11 Bypass north, a total of 26.43 miles relocation; that section of US 264 Alt will be eliminated.

The timeline after that depends on other factors, but they hope to have I-587 and US 264 signage done in 2022.

With that being done, it looks like it will be this proposal. Was not expecting it going that overboard but it's fine.

And with that being done, the existing US-264 ALT will FOR SURE be converted into a business route.

IMO, US 264 needs to go as it is another one state route that is not per current federal policies regarding designations.  Plus its overlap to Raleigh with its parent route is so redundant.  It ends at I-440 where US 64 continues.  Plus with I-587 someday coming, it will be mostly overlapped with that future interstate.

I guess from Zebulon to Sims could be renumbered to a state highway route or something.

Sprjus4 did mention about wanting it truncated between Greenville to Manns Harbor.

And if they want to move US-264 back on its original alignment then I would like to see the same happen for US64 when I-87 gets operational.

It does feel weird of how US-264 was extended from Zebulon to Raleigh (even though some signage does not show US-264 Example here), probably due to political reasons.

I agree having 2 US highways on the same highway feels overkill. I-87, US-64, US-264.

I wish they would move US-64 back on its original alignment along New Bern Ave since we are almost having all interstates on highways in the capital area, but probably won't happen until I-87 gets extended to Rockingham (and if it will get extended).

[cowboy_wilhelm]

There have been 2 sets of mainline bridges reconstructed on I-40 in Burke County in recent years.  Does anyone know if the were built in a manner to allow easy expansion to 6 lanes?

Back to this, "easy" is relative, but it's doable. A good example of where this is currently occurring is nearby on I-40 at the I-77 interchange in Statesville. The two I-40 bridges over the ramp east of I-77 are being expanded from 2 lanes to 3 lanes (4 westbound?) as part of the second round of interchange revisions. They are actually going out instead of towards the median, which can be seen in the public meeting map and in Google Street View from December 2021. They were just built in 2015.

They can be compared from below in Street View.

2019
2021

[kendallhart808]

Second line: Are there any official plans or documents rather than some random roadgeek saying that US-264 will be moved back onto its original alignment without providing a news article or a link to it?

I reached out to NCDOT a few weeks ago in regards of I-587 and what might happen to US 264. I got a response today that they are indeed planning to submit a rerouting to US 264 and a elimination of US 264 ALT in the AASHTO Fall Meeting. They were even kind enough to share the draft files they plan to use in the upcoming meeting.

In the requests, they will relocate US 264 along existing US 264 Alt from Exit 51 south through Saratoga and Farmville, then in Greenville it will connect onto NC 11 Bypass north, a total of 26.43 miles relocation; that section of US 264 Alt will be eliminated.

The timeline after that depends on other factors, but they hope to have I-587 and US 264 signage done in 2022.

With that being done, it looks like it will be this proposal. Was not expecting it going that overboard but it's fine.

And with that being done, the existing US-264 ALT will FOR SURE be converted into a business route.

IMO, US 264 needs to go as it is another one state route that is not per current federal policies regarding designations.  Plus its overlap to Raleigh with its parent route is so redundant.  It ends at I-440 where US 64 continues.  Plus with I-587 someday coming, it will be mostly overlapped with that future interstate.

I guess from Zebulon to Sims could be renumbered to a state highway route or something.

Sprjus4 did mention about wanting it truncated between Greenville to Manns Harbor.

And if they want to move US-264 back on its original alignment then I would like to see the same happen for US64 when I-87 gets operational.

It does feel weird of how US-264 was extended from Zebulon to Raleigh (even though some signage does not show US-264 Example here), probably due to political reasons.

I agree having 2 US highways on the same highway feels overkill. I-87, US-64, US-264.

I wish they would move US-64 back on its original alignment along New Bern Ave since we are almost having all interstates on highways in the capital area, but probably won't happen until I-87 gets extended to Rockingham (and if it will get extended).

I definitely think both US 64 and US 264 should go back on their original routings once the Interstates are complete. It just makes more sense than having long concurrencies and long alternate or business routes.

For 264, I don't necessarily want to see it truncated but I agree it's usefulness east of Greenville is gonna be limited. I highly doubt NCDOT would go for it now but there used to be an N.C. 264 which started in Zebulon and ran along NC 96 and NC 98 to Durham. That would be an interesting and rather useful extension as a Triangle bypass. But as someone from Wake Forest, I think the "98"  number would need to stay because it's so entrenched.

[tolbs17]

Is it just me or does it look like this bridge will collapse? These are really REALLY in deficient condition and I feel like they could collapse because of the condition they are in (I think they were rehabbed before), but I feel like they could collapse because of the rough condition, or at least have a weight limit on them.

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.7840259,-78.7006862,3a,31.1y,157.86h,94.85t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1shZ-Fog9IKFe0l_PC8_Xohw!2e0!5s20210801T000000!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DhZ-Fog9IKFe0l_PC8_Xohw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D119.00216%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192

[Dirt Roads]

Is it just me or does it look like this bridge will collapse? These are really REALLY in deficient condition and I feel like they could collapse because of the condition they are in (I think they were rehabbed before), but I feel like they could collapse because of the rough condition, or at least have a weight limit on them.

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.7840259,-78.7006862,3a,31.1y,157.86h,94.85t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1shZ-Fog9IKFe0l_PC8_Xohw!2e0!5s20210801T000000!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DhZ-Fog9IKFe0l_PC8_Xohw%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D119.00216%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192

Never fear, the bridge won't collapse.  It's got plenty of tapered fill beneath the abutment, albeit that some has been eroded away.  On the other hand, I wouldn't want to be crawling around on the concrete pad atop that tapered fill.  By the way, this section of I-440 is currently undergoing a major widening project that will certainly address this issue (and may have already; I'm tending to avoid that section of Raleigh these days due to construction congestion).

[Mapmikey]

Although not in NC, this is a bridge I often wonder about in terms of what does a failing pier really looked like to a trained eye (which is not me)...

https://goo.gl/maps/4ETRz2ZTj1avNrZP6

This bridge is getting ready to be replaced as part of the Express Lanes extensino but it has been like this a long time...

[tolbs17]

Speaking of bridges, NCDOT will repair this Mozingo Rd bridge over US-264 after a truck driver hit it. I think it was sometime in October 2020 is when it happened.

https://connect.ncdot.gov/letting/Pages/Letting-Details.aspx?let_type=2&let_date=2022-01-26%2000:00:00

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.6081035,-77.4824065,3a,32.2y,270.36h,97.26t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1sQX7T6ewCSisqSKkGCWRUOQ!2e0!5s20211201T000000!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DQX7T6ewCSisqSKkGCWRUOQ%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D115.47526%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192

[NJRoadfan]

That bridge isn't even bad. There were a few bridges in New York (of course) that had supplemental cross bracing added under the piers because they were in such sad shape.