Tolls proposed for Cottonwood Canyons

[Plutonic Panda]

That is stupid. It is cheap way for the state to price out the poorer and working class population so they can pat themselves on the back. The tolls aren't about maintaining the road, that is already being done with taxes folks already pay. It is about pricing people out to reduce traffic congestion and that is a horrible practice, IMO.

[The Ghostbuster]

Is the US 40/189 a suitable corridor for a toll road? Although I've never been to Utah, I would think tolling should be implemented in places with more traffic, such as along Interstates 15 and 80.

[Rothman]

Is the US 40/189 a suitable corridor for a toll road? Although I've never been to Utah, I would think tolling should be implemented in places with more traffic, such as along Interstates 15 and 80.

No.

[US 89]

That is stupid. It is cheap way for the state to price out the poorer and working class population so they can pat themselves on the back. The tolls aren't about maintaining the road, that is already being done with taxes folks already pay. It is about pricing people out to reduce traffic congestion and that is a horrible practice, IMO.

It should be noted that in winter, most people driving up that canyon are about to drop a bunch of money on a ski pass or hotel up there. Otherwise, I fully agree with this - it's a state highway that goes through a national forest; those are public resources that everybody should be able to enjoy. I also don't like it because people actually live up the Cottonwoods. No way would I want to retire to Alta if I have to pay a toll every time I get groceries.

Is the US 40/189 a suitable corridor for a toll road? Although I've never been to Utah, I would think tolling should be implemented in places with more traffic, such as along Interstates 15 and 80.

Tolling would most certainly not be appropriate for these corridors. Not to mention I-15 and 80 would lose federal funding in that case.

[Rover_0]

No buts about it–tolling the Cottonwood Canyons is overkill, and it's ultimately just another source of income to the state. If I had my way, I would like to see this put to a public vote.

[Plutonic Panda]

How likely is it that this passes? Utah didn't strike me as a toll friendly state. Does the state have tolls apart from express lanes?

[US 89]

How likely is it that this passes? Utah didn't strike me as a toll friendly state. Does the state have tolls apart from express lanes?

Two non-HOT toll roads currently exist in the state: the Adams Avenue Parkway and the causeway to Antelope Island. Adams Avenue is privately owned and maintained; the Antelope Island Causeway is maintained by Davis County, but most people don't notice as the toll is lumped in with the state park entrance fee. If this winds up happening, it will make SR 210 the first state-run toll road.

[US 89]

As reported by KSL this week: UDOT proposes 3 options to ease Little Cottonwood Canyon traffic

The first alternative is an enhanced bus service that would run 24 UTA buses as frequently as every five minutes, driving directly to each of the resorts.

The second idea is enhanced bus service in a dedicated shoulder lane.

“In the summer we could use it for pedestrians and for bicyclists,” Gleason said.

The most ambitious idea is a 35-person gondola that would take skiers and snowboarders from the mouth of Little Cottonwood Canyon all the way to Snowbird and Alta, carrying 1,000 people an hour. It would be the longest gondola in the world: around eight miles long.

“It’s exciting. It’s daunting,” said Gleason. “A lot of people will have an opinion about it, and that’s what this whole process is about.”

If either of the busing alternatives is selected, UDOT would build several snow sheds to protect the road and the people driving on it.

“A snow shed is a concrete structure that is built over the road,” Gleason said. “It functions as a garage or a roof over the road so that if an avalanche happens the cars can pass underneath. ”

Mobility hubs, which are essentially large parking lots, would be built on Wasatch Boulevard to enable people to park and access each of those alternatives.

UDOT also plans to widen and improve Wasatch Boulevard, improve trailhead parking and eliminate some roadside parking.

SR 210 is one of the most avalanche-prone highways in the country, so snow sheds would be a welcome addition. No word so far on whether tolls would still be considered with any of the alternatives.

[Plutonic Panda]

Oh man part of me really hopes they build the gondola. I am happy to see gondolas taking a more serious role in transportation. They can fill a good niche.

[Rothman]

I thought the bus system worked well last I went skiing up there.

[US 89]

I thought the bus system worked well last I went skiing up there.

Clearly you haven't skied up there for a while. UTA does have a ski bus system, but not many people use it because it doesn't save any time or money over driving yourself up. Buses don't do much good if they have to sit in the same traffic as the cars do - and that traffic has gotten pretty bad within the past five years or so. Especially if there's been fresh snow in the past couple days, driving up either canyon on a weekend can be brutal. Add in a snowstorm and traffic can back up all the way onto I-215 at exit 6.

[SSR_317]

...

Sure Nevada has better interstates; there's only two of 'em.

...

Try three (I-11, I-15 & I-80). And I-580 is now of a significant length to count it like a 2di as well.

[Plutonic Panda]

Update on this project:

COTTONWOOD HEIGHTS, Utah — In the winter weeks ahead, traffic in Little Cottonwood Canyon will surge as skiers and snowboarders head to the resorts.

Looking for long-term solutions, officials with the Utah Department of Transportation now have two new transportation ideas to consider as a result of public feedback during the summer.

Both options would dramatically change transportation in the canyon.

- https://ksltv.com/449448/udot-considering-gondola-cog-railroad-to-reduce-little-cottonwood-canyon-traffic/

[roadfro]

...
Sure Nevada has better interstates; there's only two of 'em.
...

Try three (I-11, I-15 & I-80). And I-580 is now of a significant length to count it like a 2di as well.

But it was only two mainline interstates when the original comment was written...

[Plutonic Panda]

Of course we have pushback against any proposed improvements. The solution from the hikers is to encourage mass transit use with no road widening or gondola. It's worth noting any road widening would specifically be for busses.

https://www.abc4.com/news/local-news/utah-climbers-push-back-on-new-ideas-put-forth-for-little-cottonwood-canyon/

[Plutonic Panda]

Looks like UDOT is going with the Gondola which makes me very happy. I wish we would see more of these in the states: https://unofficialnetworks.com/2022/09/01/little-cottonwood-canyon-gondola-chosen/

[Rothman]

Looks like UDOT is going with the Gondola which makes me very happy. I wish we would see more of these in the states: https://unofficialnetworks.com/2022/09/01/little-cottonwood-canyon-gondola-chosen/

This is actually a travesty that will ruin the scenery, especially the classic view coming out of the canyon.

There had been a vote that came out against the gondola, so the proposal going forward is being construed as going against the public's wishes.

And then there's the whole issue of the financial burden resting upon the taxpayers rather than the resorts...

[Plutonic Panda]

Meh, I go there all the time and I don't think it'll ruin the scenery. Sure it'll add a manmade structure but that's about it it'll still be fairly low profile. The public doesn't always think in its best interests.

[Rothman]

Pfft.  I've also gone up the canyons frequently.  Took this photo earlier this year.

The idea of a gondola, with its cables and pylons, ruining this view and the canyon sickens me.  It's sacrificing the year-round attraction of the canyons for increasing capacity and profits of the ski resorts at the expense of taxpayers.  This isn't a project that is in the public's interest.  It is purely in the private interest.

[Plutonic Panda]

I think it'll still look good. There are hundreds of canyons like this you can go to that won't have gondolas.

[Rothman]

I think it'll still look good. There are hundreds of canyons like this you can go to that won't have gondolas.

You are wrong.

[Plutonic Panda]

I think it'll still look good. There are hundreds of canyons like this you can go to that won't have gondolas.

You are wrong.

I'm driving to Zion for the weekend I'll respond to this nonsense when I get to the hotel.

[Jim]

Here's what I posted on Twitter in response to a post about the gondola plan:

Speaking as a skier who has been fortunate to have the chance to ski in Utah a few times (would like to be able to go more!), I'm thinking I'd find a gondola ride up and back much more pleasant than a drive or a bus ride up and back, especially on a busy day or in snowy weather.

I mean this as a standalone statement, acknowledging that such a gondola would affects views, might have insufficient capacity, might move parking/traffic problem elsewhere, that someone has to pay to build/maintain/operate, etc.  Just that if I had the two options available to me, I would see myself choosing the gondola ride.

[Rothman]

Here's what I posted on Twitter in response to a post about the gondola plan:

Speaking as a skier who has been fortunate to have the chance to ski in Utah a few times (would like to be able to go more!), I'm thinking I'd find a gondola ride up and back much more pleasant than a drive or a bus ride up and back, especially on a busy day or in snowy weather.

I mean this as a standalone statement, acknowledging that such a gondola would affects views, might have insufficient capacity, might move parking/traffic problem elsewhere, that someone has to pay to build/maintain/operate, etc.  Just that if I had the two options available to me, I would see myself choosing the gondola ride.

"Don't hate me for my opinion!"

[Rothman]

I think it'll still look good. There are hundreds of canyons like this you can go to that won't have gondolas.

You are wrong.

I'm driving to Zion for the weekend I'll respond to this nonsense when I get to the hotel.

No matter your location, you'll still be wrong.