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Author Topic: Virginia  (Read 1371229 times)

LM117

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3000 on: April 24, 2018, 07:04:41 AM »

I see the traffic counts for the Central Blvd/Piney Forest Road corridor in Danville appear to be the highest overall in the city. No surprise there. Piney Forest Rd between Central Blvd and VA-41 is a nightmare. I dread every time I have to drive that stretch. It’s usually a parking lot except for real early mornings and during the night. The suicide lane from hell is the worst part.
For a city no bigger than it is, Danville has terrible traffic.

Do you think that completing the outer loop (building the northwest quadrant) would help those conditions?

It might. It would help divert thru traffic headed to US-58 West from points north of Danville and vice-versa by keeping US-29 Business/US-58 Business from being used as a shortcut.

But even at that, I’d wager that finishing the loop would have minimal impact on US-29 Business. Much of the issue there is local traffic, not thru traffic. Piney Forest Road is just too built up and I really don’t see how any improvements could be made on that road without having a big impact on businesses.

All that said, I would certainly support finishing the last leg of the bypass, yes. Even if the benefit is minimal, any relief would be a great welcome at this point.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2018, 07:07:10 AM by LM117 »
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Beltway

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3001 on: April 24, 2018, 07:16:30 AM »

Do you think that completing the outer loop (building the northwest quadrant) would help those conditions?
It might. It would help divert thru traffic headed to US-58 West from points north of Danville and vice-versa by keeping US-29 Business/US-58 Business from being used as a shortcut.
But even at that, I’d wager that finishing the loop would have minimal impact on US-29 Business. Much of the issue there is local traffic, not thru traffic. Piney Forest Road is just too built up and I really don’t see how any improvements could be made on that road without having a big impact on businesses.
All that said, I would certainly support finishing the last leg of the bypass, yes. Even if the benefit is minimal, any relief would be a great welcome at this point.

Business US-29 and Business US-58 were the main routes and were 4-lane arterials before the bypass was built.  Do you think they need 6 lanes?
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froggie

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3002 on: April 24, 2018, 11:02:24 AM »

^ 2017 traffic volume data plus my own experiences would say no.  The busiest part of BUS-29 is borderline but is already limited-access...across the river and up past Piedmont Dr.  Maybe at the top of the hill but that would also be very expensive due to the adjacent businesses.

It should also be noted that BUS-29 already has auxiliary lanes across the river (between VA 86 and BUS-58).
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LM117

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3003 on: April 24, 2018, 12:21:14 PM »

^ 2017 traffic volume data plus my own experiences would say no.  The busiest part of BUS-29 is borderline but is already limited-access...across the river and up past Piedmont Dr.  Maybe at the top of the hill but that would also be very expensive due to the adjacent businesses.

It should also be noted that BUS-29 already has auxiliary lanes across the river (between VA 86 and BUS-58).

The parking lot problem area is the stretch between the Central Blvd/Piney Forest Rd split and VA-41. If the development along the road had been more controlled, the current setup might be more adequate, and if not, a barrier that would require U-turns might have been more feasible. However, as you mentioned, the clutter of businesses prevents any improvements from happening, so that ship has sailed.

As for US-58 Business, I agree that it doesn’t need widening. It can get congested in the downtown area, but much of it is divided by a median, so it’s nowhere near as dangerous as the aforementioned stretch of US-29 Business.
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Beltway

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3004 on: April 26, 2018, 09:43:46 PM »

http://www.fredericksburg.com/news/transportation/vdot-holds-public-meeting-on-u-s-plans/article_06c2eb33-f009-549d-a7a9-9cf51a293ba8.html
VDOT holds public meeting on U.S. 301 plans
April 25, 2018
The Free Lance–Star

Quote from: The Free Lance–Star
There are 37 intersections and 81 crossovers along State Route 207 and U.S. 301 in King George and Caroline counties.   VDOT has studied all of them and made recommendations to remove or reconfigure most of them. 

The recommendations come as the result of a study of the corridor by VDOT, the George Washington Regional Commission, the Department of Defense and affected localities which began in February of 2017.

The recommendations are meant to preserve and enhance the capacity and safety of the 42-mile stretch that runs from U.S. 1 in Caroline to the Harry W. Nice Bridge in King George, which is known as an arterial road.

"Virginia's arterials have become 'main streets' for local growth," said Paul Prideaux, a senior manager at Michael Baker, the engineering consulting firm that assisted VDOT in the study.  "But with lots of driveways, signals, crosswalks and turns, if they're not well-managed, they become nightmares.  Future planning will reduce the need to retrofit."

The U.S. 301 corridor was selected for the study because it is a key link between Interstate 95 and major urban areas such as Washington, Baltimore and points north.

Traffic volume on the corridor ranges from 8,000 average daily vehicles in the Carmel Church area in Caroline to 26,000 around Dahlgren in King George.

With the widening of the Harry Nice Bridge over the Potomac from two to four lanes—which is being handled by Maryland and will see "shovels in the ground" in 2020—those volumes are expected to double by 2040, Prideaux said.

See the URL for the rest of the article.
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RoadPelican

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3005 on: April 27, 2018, 12:05:37 PM »

http://www.fredericksburg.com/news/transportation/vdot-holds-public-meeting-on-u-s-plans/article_06c2eb33-f009-549d-a7a9-9cf51a293ba8.html
VDOT holds public meeting on U.S. 301 plans
April 25, 2018
The Free Lance–Star

Quote from: The Free Lance–Star
There are 37 intersections and 81 crossovers along State Route 207 and U.S. 301 in King George and Caroline counties.   VDOT has studied all of them and made recommendations to remove or reconfigure most of them. 

The recommendations come as the result of a study of the corridor by VDOT, the George Washington Regional Commission, the Department of Defense and affected localities which began in February of 2017.

The recommendations are meant to preserve and enhance the capacity and safety of the 42-mile stretch that runs from U.S. 1 in Caroline to the Harry W. Nice Bridge in King George, which is known as an arterial road.

"Virginia's arterials have become 'main streets' for local growth," said Paul Prideaux, a senior manager at Michael Baker, the engineering consulting firm that assisted VDOT in the study.  "But with lots of driveways, signals, crosswalks and turns, if they're not well-managed, they become nightmares.  Future planning will reduce the need to retrofit."

The U.S. 301 corridor was selected for the study because it is a key link between Interstate 95 and major urban areas such as Washington, Baltimore and points north.

Traffic volume on the corridor ranges from 8,000 average daily vehicles in the Carmel Church area in Caroline to 26,000 around Dahlgren in King George.

With the widening of the Harry Nice Bridge over the Potomac from two to four lanes—which is being handled by Maryland and will see "shovels in the ground" in 2020—those volumes are expected to double by 2040, Prideaux said.

See the URL for the rest of the article.

I have traveled US 301 many times and the stretch from the Potomac River to I-95 has always been pretty rural and mostly 55-60 MPH Speed Limit.  It's great to read that Virginia wants to keep it that way.  Maryland has poorly managed access control on their portion of US 301, when/If the Waldorf Bypass gets built that will help, but drivers would still have to go thru many traffic lights in LaPlata and Bowie until they can get on the US 50 freeway.
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hbelkins

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3006 on: April 27, 2018, 01:14:31 PM »

301's a cluster in southern Maryland, but I'd still rather drive it than I-95 between Fredericksburg and DC or Baltimore.
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cpzilliacus

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3007 on: April 27, 2018, 01:54:47 PM »

301's a cluster in southern Maryland, but I'd still rather drive it than I-95 between Fredericksburg and DC or Baltimore.

I agree.  Only exception is if there is a serious crash on the Gov. Harry W. Nice Memorial Bridge over the lower Potomac River, which can bring traffic to a stop for an hour or hours. 

Unfortunately, those seem to happen all too often, due the narrow two lane undivided 1930's design of that crossing.

In the coming decade, MDTA will be constructing a new four-lane divided crossing, which will match up with U.S. 301 on both sides.
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Beltway

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3008 on: April 27, 2018, 03:38:52 PM »

301's a cluster in southern Maryland, but I'd still rather drive it than I-95 between Fredericksburg and DC or Baltimore.
I agree.  Only exception is if there is a serious crash on the Gov. Harry W. Nice Memorial Bridge over the lower Potomac River, which can bring traffic to a stop for an hour or hours. 
Unfortunately, those seem to happen all too often, due the narrow two lane undivided 1930's design of that crossing.

Not me.  US-301 in southern Maryland has over 50 signals, and unless I-95 has a serious traffic incident, I-95 will beat US-301 hands down, like 30-40% less travel time.
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1995hoo

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3009 on: April 27, 2018, 03:46:24 PM »

Our neighborhood just got new bike lanes courtesy of VDOT. Looks like residents are respecting it about as well as I thought they would (as in, not very well). It’d make more sense to put the parking between the thru lane and the bike lane, but that’s not how they do it here in residential areas. There’s not really much reason for this particular set of bike lanes anyway other than the psychological effect of making the road feel narrower to slow traffic (which is fine with me, people go 45+ on this street despite the 25-mph speed limit). Another nearby street was given “sharrows” instead.

I’m sure someone in our neighborhood would say there’s no sign prohibiting parking, but it doesn’t need one because the bike lane symbol itself prohibits parking, as far as I know.



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abefroman329

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3010 on: April 27, 2018, 04:01:05 PM »

To me the solid white line indicates it's a shoulder and not a parking lane.
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1995hoo

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Virginia
« Reply #3011 on: April 27, 2018, 04:41:06 PM »

To me the solid white line indicates it's a shoulder and not a parking lane.
Except there’s a bike lane symbol. It’s a little small in the pictures I posted before (it’s next to the taper), but there are several of them and it’s very clear what it is. This picture is of the area just behind the SUV. Note the symbols on both sides of the road (the SUV was on the far side relative to where I was standing).

The reason it shifts like that is that nobody parks on the far side of the street beyond this point. So in this picture, you can park on the side where I was standing but not on the other side.

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—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

D-Dey65

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3012 on: April 27, 2018, 09:13:57 PM »

This is the first reference I have seen regarding the Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel project to parallel the Chesapeake Channel Tunnel, the northern tunnel.

The Thimble Shoal Channel Parallel Tunnel is now under construction.

http://www.cbbt.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/2013GovRpt.pdf

"The Thimble Shoal Channel depth of 67 feet, with 3 feet of safety factor rating or “over dredge” to allow for a net 70 feet of clearance with 10 feet of tunnel cover.  Correspondingly, Chesapeake Channel Tunnel will be scoped at a depth of 55 feet with 3 feet of over dredge, even though the existing channel is only maintained at 45 feet."

The Thimble Shoal Channel is deeper as it serves the Hampton Roads area commercial shipping and the largest warships in the world.

This is the first time I have seen an official statement that a parallel tunnel is planned at Chesapeake Channel.  Not a bridge.

"Thimble Tunnel would be completed first by 2025, and thereafter there will be an approximate 30-year period before Chesapeake Channel Tunnel is completed."

Hopefully funding will be found to build the Parallel Chesapeake Channel Tunnel by the end of the 2020s.
I'm still sad the gift shop and restaurant won't be replaced.

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3013 on: April 28, 2018, 09:56:39 AM »

^ Wasn't worth the $200M extra cost, despite the novelty of the location.
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3014 on: April 28, 2018, 12:19:59 PM »

^ Wasn't worth the $200M extra cost, despite the novelty of the location.
Was there a study done of the economics? That seems like such a high cost to rebuild a building with parking lot - they must have had to extend the entire island to do it?

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3015 on: April 28, 2018, 02:47:42 PM »

^ Wasn't worth the $200M extra cost, despite the novelty of the location.
Was there a study done of the economics? That seems like such a high cost to rebuild a building with parking lot - they must have had to extend the entire island to do it?

They could build it on a platform built on pilings, but I suspect that such a structure would not survive a major storm.  As it is the islands have massive armor stone to protect from erosion.
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froggie

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3016 on: April 28, 2018, 02:55:47 PM »

^ Wasn't worth the $200M extra cost, despite the novelty of the location.
Was there a study done of the economics? That seems like such a high cost to rebuild a building with parking lot - they must have had to extend the entire island to do it?

Yes, the extra cost was due to having to expand the island.
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3017 on: April 30, 2018, 05:34:13 AM »

Washington Post op-ed: Robbing highways for Metro funding is a bad idea

Quote
Virginia recently approved a bill to provide new permanent funding of $154 million per year for Metro. This will be combined with comparable increases in funding from the District and Maryland. This strikes some as a good thing, but it isn’t, because this increased spending on mass transit takes money away from highways.

Quote
About two-thirds of Virginia’s new funding commitment — more than $100 million — comes at the expense of improvements to roads and highways in Northern Virginia, which are chronically gridlocked. One hundred million dollars is more than one quarter of all fiscal 2019 revenue of the Northern Virginia Transportation Authority, the primary agency responsible for improving roads in the region.

Quote
There are good reasons most people rely on their automobiles rather than transit for the majority of their trips, including commuting. The D.C. area, as with most modern urban areas, is becoming more and more decentralized, with most jobs located outside the urban center. Public transit works well for transporting people from city neighborhoods and inner-ring suburbs to jobs in the District, but it’s not a cost-effective way to transport people to many jobs located in the suburbs, especially when they commute from one suburb to another.
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1995hoo

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3018 on: May 03, 2018, 11:19:49 AM »

Nice photo comparison.

?s=21
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Beltway

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3019 on: May 03, 2018, 01:04:34 PM »

Why is VA-2 overlapped on US-301 all the way between Bowling Green and Richmond?

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3020 on: May 03, 2018, 08:05:18 PM »

That is a lovely picture.

Here is a pic approaching the intersection from the same direction in Feb 1956


And an April 1957 pic of the same intersection from US 301 SB.  This pic shows that signage was already replaced 5 years in (though US 301 and VA 2 did split here prior to this)


Both of these photos are from the Virginia Highways Bulletin.

The lame answer to why there is the 301-2 overlap is that VA 2 was there first.  I assume it was to give Richmond to Fredericksburg a single route number (as an alternate to US 1), though with I-95 that reason went away in the 1960s.
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Beltway

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3021 on: May 03, 2018, 08:24:22 PM »

The lame answer to why there is the 301-2 overlap is that VA 2 was there first.  I assume it was to give Richmond to Fredericksburg a single route number (as an alternate to US 1), though with I-95 that reason went away in the 1960s.

IOW, a logical decision that was made maybe as far back as the 1930s and nobody has yet made a decision to change/modify it.  Such as the decision to truncate/eliminate the US-211 overlap of US-29 between Gainesville and D.C.

I guess someone could say, "Who cares?"  It's not really harming anything.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2018, 08:28:14 PM by Beltway »
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1995hoo

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3022 on: May 04, 2018, 02:36:17 PM »

On I-395 this morning, one of the electronic signs said "May the 4th Be With You—Drive Safely." I was rather surprised to see anything remotely humorous on a VDOT sign (and I was pleased they used the correct "safely" rather than the incorrect "safe" that's popular these days).
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—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3023 on: May 04, 2018, 10:10:03 PM »

I was rather surprised to see anything remotely humorous on a VDOT sign

I remember the Burma Shave signs on I-66 promoting carpooling -- something like:

Form a carpool
One car takes many
Carry them back
To old Virginny

This was before "Carry Me Back to Old Virginny" was demoted to "state song emeritus".

The Dulles Airport Access Road has more recently had (and may still have) Burma Shave-style warnings, for non-airport traffic illegally using the free access road to beat the tolls on parallel VA 267. But they're not VDOT's doing, and also rather humorless.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2018, 10:17:38 PM by oscar »
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #3024 on: May 08, 2018, 10:39:05 AM »

Bowing to overwhelming community opposition, the Chesterfield County Economic Development Authority withdrew its controversial "Mega Site" plan, which would have involved rezoning a large tract of land off Branders Bridge Road (south of VA 10) in the southern portion of the county for commercial and industrial use.

This also kills (for now) the equally controversial East-West Freeway, which has that name even though the most recent version of that plan isn't a freeway but a 2-lane connector road between US 1 and Branders Bridge Road near where the Mega Site was planned. There was a meeting for public comment scheduled for yesterday, but it was canceled when the Mega Site proposal was withdrawn.

The county's comprehensive thoroughfare plan includes the East-West Freeway as part of an outer connector road linking to an extended Powhite Parkway at US 360 near Skinquarter, which is something that would actually be useful but is just as unlikely to happen due to community opposition. There are plans to revise the thoroughfare plan and I wouldn't be shocked if both were eliminated when the plan is redone.
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