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Author Topic: I-69 in TX  (Read 734574 times)

yakra

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2225 on: January 12, 2022, 03:38:24 PM »

East side has a fair bit of development pretty close in to the roadway.
West side looks less constrained in terms of ROW, and there's the ongoing upgrade bwana39 noted. An interchange was recently constructed at TX315.
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Thegeet

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2226 on: January 12, 2022, 07:52:20 PM »

Whiling we're on the subject of future direct ramps

When they do eventually have to make one for Carthage, should they turn to the left side of the loop or the right side of the loop?
Right.
The folks in Carthage would prefer left.....
US 59 is already signed to the right, so it makes sense to continue that.

Yes BUT....
It is a continuous loop. Most of the business in Carthage is on the west loop. TXDOT has been incrementally improving the west loop to freeway. The only seeming impediments to freeway  with frontage roads on the West Loop is the part they have already started upgrading. THe Atlanta District Chief engineer previously was the Panola County TXDOT chief, the powers that be in Carthage have an inroad.
Does that mean they will undo US 59 from the East?
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bwana39

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2227 on: January 12, 2022, 11:11:53 PM »

Whiling we're on the subject of future direct ramps

When they do eventually have to make one for Carthage, should they turn to the left side of the loop or the right side of the loop?
Right.
The folks in Carthage would prefer left.....
US 59 is already signed to the right, so it makes sense to continue that.

Yes BUT....
It is a continuous loop. Most of the business in Carthage is on the west loop. TXDOT has been incrementally improving the west loop to freeway. The only seeming impediments to freeway  with frontage roads on the West Loop is the part they have already started upgrading. THe Atlanta District Chief engineer previously was the Panola County TXDOT chief, the powers that be in Carthage have an inroad.
Does that mean they will undo US 59 from the East?


Probably, maybe, ....time will tell?
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sprjus4

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2228 on: January 13, 2022, 02:25:48 PM »

Public hearing regarding the US-77 bypass around Sinton to interstate standards.

https://www.txdot.gov/inside-txdot/get-involved/about/hearings-meetings/corpus-christi/011322.html

I'd like to see some more progress on a Refugio or Odem bypass over this type of project... US-77 already functions as a 75 mph divided highway with no traffic signals around Sinton. Those areas seem higher priority, yet we just keep getting more rural upgrade projects. Not saying all of US-77 / US-59 should not be freeway between Corpus Christi and Houston eventually... but the rural areas should be last.
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CoolAngrybirdsrio4

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2229 on: January 13, 2022, 02:31:01 PM »

Public hearing regarding the US-77 bypass around Sinton to interstate standards.

https://www.txdot.gov/inside-txdot/get-involved/about/hearings-meetings/corpus-christi/011322.html

I'd like to see some more progress on a Refugio or Odem bypass over this type of project... US-77 already functions as a 75 mph divided highway with no traffic signals around Sinton. Those areas seem higher priority, yet we just keep getting more rural upgrade projects. Not saying all of US-77 / US-59 should not be freeway between Corpus Christi and Houston eventually... but the rural areas should be last.

Interesting about the hearings, but in unrelated (but related to the area) news, a Love's Gas Station with a McDonald's opened on FM 1945:
https://www.google.com/maps/@28.0110534,-97.5305367,3a,15y,289.84h,85.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sfYe2qygc2bvz7IBPIW1dBQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Plus, there's only one intersection they would have to convert plus the frontage lanes. However, I would like to see more progress on the two bypasses you've mentioned as well.
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sprjus4

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2230 on: January 13, 2022, 02:47:30 PM »

Interesting about the hearings, but in unrelated (but related to the area) news, a Love's Gas Station with a McDonald's opened on FM 1945:
https://www.google.com/maps/@28.0110534,-97.5305367,3a,15y,289.84h,85.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sfYe2qygc2bvz7IBPIW1dBQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
That's been open since at least 2018.
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CoolAngrybirdsrio4

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2231 on: January 13, 2022, 02:55:01 PM »

Interesting about the hearings, but in unrelated (but related to the area) news, a Love's Gas Station with a McDonald's opened on FM 1945:
https://www.google.com/maps/@28.0110534,-97.5305367,3a,15y,289.84h,85.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sfYe2qygc2bvz7IBPIW1dBQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
That's been open since at least 2018.

It was a recent opening though. But, bypasses around Odem should've been started alongside the Sinton bypass, since it could bring I-69E (eventually) to Odem and then Sinton, Refugio to Victoria.
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sprjus4

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2232 on: January 13, 2022, 02:57:45 PM »

Woodsboro to Refugio including Refugio Bypass, along with I-37 to Odem including Odem Bypass were two projects that were studied in the past... those two should be accelerated before Sinton, IMO.

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Thegeet

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2233 on: January 13, 2022, 05:49:25 PM »

My guess is that the Sinton bypass is cheaper than the Refugio bypass, since they only need frontage roads and one interchange.
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Bobby5280

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2234 on: January 13, 2022, 08:23:37 PM »

There isn't much that needs to be done in Sinton. Just the extension of frontage roads to cut off some driveways connecting directly to the US-77 main lanes. A bridge over County Road 1196 will be necessary. But it's too close to the exit for TX-188 to get one for itself (not without causing a bunch of weaving conflicts). I guess Sinton would be a piece of "low hanging fruit."

Still it would seem to make more sense for TX DOT to tackle the Odem bypass project as early as anything else. That's the first stop NE of the split with I-37. It's something that can be signed as I-69E as soon as it is completed since it would be connected to I-37.
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Thegeet

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2235 on: January 13, 2022, 08:30:29 PM »

There isn't much that needs to be done in Sinton. Just the extension of frontage roads to cut off some driveways connecting directly to the US-77 main lanes. A bridge over County Road 1196 will be necessary. But it's too close to the exit for TX-188 to get one for itself (not without causing a bunch of weaving conflicts). I guess Sinton would be a piece of "low hanging fruit."

Still it would seem to make more sense for TX DOT to tackle the Odem bypass project as early as anything else. That's the first stop NE of the split with I-37. It's something that can be signed as I-69E as soon as it is completed since it would be connected to I-37.
What if they decided to make the overpass over US 77. I do realize that this practice is being replaced (see US 59 upgrade), but itís still possible. But more than likely, it will be a dual interchange thing like US 59 in Edna. (Well that one has three roads, but still.)
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sprjus4

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2236 on: January 13, 2022, 08:37:53 PM »

Quote
Still it would seem to make more sense for TX DOT to tackle the Odem bypass project as early as anything else. That's the first stop NE of the split with I-37. It's something that can be signed as I-69E as soon as it is completed since it would be connected to I-37.
That, and interstate designations aside altogether, Odem and Refugio are the last towns / slow downs between Corpus Christi and Houston, the rest of the corridor is free-flowing 75 mph divided highway with zero traffic signals. These two gaps need to be filled.

Combined with the under construction Driscoll Bypass and the upcoming Riviera Bypass, there would then be at least a free-flowing highway between Brownsville and north of Houston.
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Bobby5280

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2237 on: January 13, 2022, 11:46:46 PM »

Quote from: Thegeet
What if they decided to make the overpass over US 77.

Are you talking about the intersection in Sinton with County Road 1196? No, I think it would be worse to bridge that over the existing US-77 main lanes. Doing so would disrupt its direct at-grade connections with the businesses alongside existing US-77. The bridge would have to span over the current US-77 main lanes and the flanking frontage roads in order to build in a reasonable incline grade for the bridge approaches. It might possibly cost a little more, but it would be less disruptive for US-77 to leap-frog over CR-1196.
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Thegeet

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2238 on: January 13, 2022, 11:57:51 PM »

Quote from: Thegeet
What if they decided to make the overpass over US 77.

Are you talking about the intersection in Sinton with County Road 1196? No, I think it would be worse to bridge that over the existing US-77 main lanes. Doing so would disrupt its direct at-grade connections with the businesses alongside existing US-77. The bridge would have to span over the current US-77 main lanes and the flanking frontage roads in order to build in a reasonable incline grade for the bridge approaches. It might possibly cost a little more, but it would be less disruptive for US-77 to leap-frog over CR-1196.
Does this mean they will have to tear down what looks like fairly recently paved on and off ramps in order to implement X-ramps?
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jgb191

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2239 on: January 14, 2022, 04:01:11 AM »

I have a feeling the a reroute around Refugio will be the final piece of the I-69E branch.  Refugio is a major stopping town for rest, refueling, dining, etc.  I believe they will get to Woodsboro, Odem, and Riviera before Refugio.  Riviera is also the last stopping town for drivers southbound on US-77 (they won't see anything for almost 60 miles later in Raymondville).  Until the last couple of decades, it used to be that Kingsville was that last stopover until Raymondville (72-mile stretch).  Towns like Ricardo and Woodsboro might not need a bypass around it since it's already four-lanes right through those towns; just need a couple of overpasses in each town. 

As for I-69C, a bypass around Premont would be the only thing left along US-281.  Reroutes around Alice, Falfurrias, and Encino have already been done long ago.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2022, 04:04:31 AM by jgb191 »
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Thegeet

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2240 on: January 14, 2022, 06:14:38 AM »

I have a feeling the a reroute around Refugio will be the final piece of the I-69E branch.  Refugio is a major stopping town for rest, refueling, dining, etc.  I believe they will get to Woodsboro, Odem, and Riviera before Refugio.  Riviera is also the last stopping town for drivers southbound on US-77 (they won't see anything for almost 60 miles later in Raymondville).  Until the last couple of decades, it used to be that Kingsville was that last stopover until Raymondville (72-mile stretch).  Towns like Ricardo and Woodsboro might not need a bypass around it since it's already four-lanes right through those towns; just need a couple of overpasses in each town. 

As for I-69C, a bypass around Premont would be the only thing left along US-281.  Reroutes around Alice, Falfurrias, and Encino have already been done long ago.
Refugio is indeed set for 2031 construction. Therefore, we wonít expect anything except development this decade.
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Bobby5280

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2241 on: January 14, 2022, 11:26:49 AM »

Aside from some projects in the Victoria area it looks like TX DOT is building out I-69 between Houston and Corpus Christi in a fairly linear direction from Houston going farther Southeast.

In the near term I-69 will soon be completed down to the Wharton area. Farther down to El Campo, Louise, Ganado, Edna and Inez the existing US-59 main lanes already have a lot of grade separations and exits. Much of the freeway quality stuff is already Interstate quality. Most of the remaining upgrade work along that stretch will involve building new frontage roads and removing at-grade crossings between towns. That could actually get finished pretty quickly.

Either way, the work in Refugio could indeed end up being the last to do along the Houston-Corpus Christi stretch.

Quote from: Thegeet
Does this mean they will have to tear down what looks like fairly recently paved on and off ramps in order to implement X-ramps?

I don't think TX DOT is going to spend that kind of money there. Grade-separated, braided X ramps would be an extravagance in that location. I think they'll just hop US-77 over CR-1196 and not give it any slip ramps between the frontage roads and US-77 main lanes. The locals will have to take the frontage roads to the TX-188 intersection to get on the US-77 main lanes.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2022, 07:25:40 PM by Bobby5280 »
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Thegeet

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2242 on: January 14, 2022, 04:19:13 PM »

Aside from some projects in the Victoria area it looks like TX DOT is building out I-69 between Houston and Corpus Christi in a fairly linear direction from Houston going farther Southeast.

In the near term I-69 is will soon be completed down to the Wharton area. Farther down to El Campo, Louise, Ganado, Edna and Inez the existing US-59 main lanes already have a lot of grade separations and exits. Much of the freeway quality stuff is already Interstate quality. Most of the remaining upgrade work along that stretch will involve building new frontage roads and removing at-grade crossings between towns. That could actually get finished pretty quickly

Either way, the work in Refugio could indeed end up being the last to do along the Houston-Corpus Christi stretch.

Quote from: Thegeet
Does this mean they will have to tear down what looks like fairly recently paved on and off ramps in order to implement X-ramps?

I don't think TX DOT is going to spend that kind of money there. Grade-separated, braided X ramps would be an extravagance in that location. I think they'll just hop CR-1196 over US-77 and not give it any slip ramps between the frontage roads and US-77 main lanes. The locals will have to take the frontage roads to the TX-188 intersection to get on the US-77 main lanes.
They also need to work on Jackson County stretch. Other than Edna, it needs new frontage roads and interchanges.(And possibly a new rest area) Txdot isnít expected to start studies until the next decade, let alone construction.
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Great Lakes Roads

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2243 on: January 14, 2022, 05:20:34 PM »

Quote from: Thegeet
What if they decided to make the overpass over US 77.

Are you talking about the intersection in Sinton with County Road 1196? No, I think it would be worse to bridge that over the existing US-77 main lanes. Doing so would disrupt its direct at-grade connections with the businesses alongside existing US-77. The bridge would have to span over the current US-77 main lanes and the flanking frontage roads in order to build in a reasonable incline grade for the bridge approaches. It might possibly cost a little more, but it would be less disruptive for US-77 to leap-frog over CR-1196.
Does this mean they will have to tear down what looks like fairly recently paved on and off ramps in order to implement X-ramps?

No, but here are the proposed exits in Sinton once the upgrades are complete.
NB: FM 1945 West/BUSINESS 77, CR 1196, TX 188, US 181, TO US 181/TX 89, BUSINESS 77
SB: BUSINESS 77, TO US 181/TX 89, TX 188/FM 1945

Six exits northbound and three exits southbound.
Three entrance ramps northbound and six entrance ramps southbound.
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yakra

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2244 on: January 14, 2022, 07:12:26 PM »

Refugio is indeed set for 2031 construction. Therefore, we wonít expect anything except development this decade.
Cite? A little Googling around and I came up with 2029.
Nov 2020: https://ftp.txdot.gov/pub/txdot/i69-driven-by-texans/future-i69-tabloids.pdf
Nov 2021: https://apps3.txdot.gov/apps/estip/fileloader.ashx?pg_file_id=3644
Nov 2020: The map on page 2 of https://destinyhosted.com/nuecedocs/2021/CC-REG/20210120_589/13038_Alliance_I69-_Report.pdf lists the Refugio Relief Route as "UTP Funded: 2025 - 2030".
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Thegeet

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2245 on: January 14, 2022, 07:13:26 PM »

Refugio is indeed set for 2031 construction. Therefore, we wonít expect anything except development this decade.
Cite? A little Googling around and I came up with 2029.
Nov 2020: https://ftp.txdot.gov/pub/txdot/i69-driven-by-texans/future-i69-tabloids.pdf
Nov 2021: https://apps3.txdot.gov/apps/estip/fileloader.ashx?pg_file_id=3644
Nov 2020: The map on page 2 of https://destinyhosted.com/nuecedocs/2021/CC-REG/20210120_589/13038_Alliance_I69-_Report.pdf lists the Refugio Relief Route as "UTP Funded: 2025 - 2030".
I was checking the status on the TxDOT project tracker. https://www.txdot.gov/inside-txdot/projects/project-tracker.html
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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2246 on: January 15, 2022, 12:21:30 AM »

There isn't much that needs to be done in Sinton.

While they're coming up with stuff to do in Sinton, they should really consider realigning US-181. The route it takes through town is dumb as hell. It should just stay on the bypass that is currently signed as TX-89.
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TheBox

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2247 on: January 15, 2022, 03:51:02 PM »

Whiling i was trying to compare the traffic count of US-290 and TX-71 (both in between Houston and Austin), i found some Google Maps alternatives that also keep track of highway projects that are W.I.P.

OpenStreetMap - https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=12/27.6324/-97.7471

Mapbox - https://api.mapbox.com/styles/v1/mapbox/streets-v11.html?title=true&access_token=pk.eyJ1IjoibWFwYm94IiwiYSI6ImNpejY4M29iazA2Z2gycXA4N2pmbDZmangifQ.-g_vE53SD2WrJ6tFX7QHmA#9.47/27.6229/-97.7213

the latter even already considers the bypasses of Bishop, Kingsville and soon Driscoll to be I-69E
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Bobby5280

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Re: I-69 in TX
« Reply #2249 on: January 15, 2022, 07:43:49 PM »

The I-69 projects North of Houston appear like they're being handled a bit different than the Houston-Corpus Christi leg. Different detached segments are being built to the North away from progress connected to the Houston segment of I-69. Projects South of Houston appear to be moving in a linear directional fashion from Houston to farther SW.

A decent amount of work has been done in Lufkin with more planned to the South. Perhaps the Diboll bypass was moved up in relation to that work. Once the Diboll bypass is completed it won't take all that much work to fill in the gap between it and the Lufkin portion of I-69.

Meanwhile, the non-freeway gap South of Cleveland is finally being filled in with new freeway main lanes. The segment between Cleveland and Shepherd will be easier to fill. The Shepherd to Livingston segment appears fairly simple; not a lot of properties in the way at all.

Quote from: Scott5114
While they're coming up with stuff to do in Sinton, they should really consider realigning US-181. The route it takes through town is dumb as hell. It should just stay on the bypass that is currently signed as TX-89.

Yeah, US-181 should be signed as a business route going through the middle of Sinton. The regular US-181 route should stay on the TX-89 bypass.
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