Massachusetts milepost exit numbering conversion contract

[bob7374]

MassDOT has released the plans for the western and central exit renumbering contract and posted additional files on the contract bid page including, like the second contract, a drawings and sketches file listing the old and new exit numbers, and a special provisions document which, in this case, details the dual mile markers on I-290, quoting:
"Work under this item involves the installation of enhanced reference location signs (MA-D10-4a)
and intermediate reference location signs (MA-D10-2b) along I-290 to continue the I-395 mile-markers. The mile-markers along I-290 will have dual references, including the existing reference markers along side the proposed I-395 reference markers." The document then lists of the numbers for the markers, needless to say, they did not decide to change the numbers so that I-290  exits used that route's mileage, this is on page 41/48.

A preliminary look at the other exit lists shows no changes from the previously posted lists, but I will look at them more closely and post any changes seen on my exit list pages. The winning bidder is still to be announced on July 7.  Here's the bid page:
https://www.commbuys.com/bso/external/bidDetail.sdo?docId=BD-20-1030-0H100-0H002-51627&external=true&parentUrl=bid

[roadman]

Bids for the District 4-District 5-District 6 exit renumbering contract (Project 610699/Contract 111369) were opened earlier today.  RoadSafe Traffic systems is the apparent low bidder at $998,880.  Northeast Traffic Control was second lowest bidder at $1,285,291.60, and Liddell Brothers had the highest bid at $1,407,080.00.

[bob7374]

Bids for the District 4-District 5-District 6 exit renumbering contract (Project 610699/Contract 111369) were opened earlier today.  RoadSafe Traffic systems is the apparent low bidder at $998,880.  Northeast Traffic Control was second lowest bidder at $1,285,291.60, and Liddell Brothers had the highest bid at $1,407,080.00.

I would assume RoadSafe will get the contract unless something changes, especially since they had the only bid that was below the MassDOT estimate of $1,046,735. Would it be best if 1 firm won all 3 contracts, or would having at least 2 firms with winning bids help in getting the entire project finished as fast as possible?

[Ben114]

Found a few recent changes to the exit numbers.

- I-90 exit 107 (old 11A) now 106
- I-90 exit 128 (old 17) now 127
- MA 25 exit 1 (was un-numbered in detail sheets) has regained the number

The exit lists on the project website have changed from being PDF files to being webpages.

[jp the roadgeek]

Found a few recent changes to the exit numbers.

- I-90 exit 107 (old 11A) now 106
- I-90 exit 128 (old 17) now 127
- MA 25 exit 1 (was un-numbered in detail sheets) has regained the number

The exit lists on the project website have changed from being PDF files to being webpages.

Was I-90 Exit 41 (old 3) a change?  I had it as 40.

[bob7374]

Found a few recent changes to the exit numbers.

- I-90 exit 107 (old 11A) now 106
- I-90 exit 128 (old 17) now 127
- MA 25 exit 1 (was un-numbered in detail sheets) has regained the number

The exit lists on the project website have changed from being PDF files to being webpages.

Was I-90 Exit 41 (old 3) a change?  I had it as 40.

The proposed number for the US 202/MA 10 exit AFAIK has always been 41, though it probably should be 40 since it is at MM 40.4. Never new why they had changed the I-495 exit to 107 since it is at MM 106.2. The Newton/Watertown exit is at MM 127.6, did they round it down to avoid any confusion with the I-95 (128) exit? I'll update my exit lists with the new information and look through the new website lists to see if there are any other changes I can spot.

[Ben114]

Found a few recent changes to the exit numbers.

- I-90 exit 107 (old 11A) now 106
- I-90 exit 128 (old 17) now 127
- MA 25 exit 1 (was un-numbered in detail sheets) has regained the number

The exit lists on the project website have changed from being PDF files to being webpages.

Was I-90 Exit 41 (old 3) a change?  I had it as 40.

The proposed number for the US 202/MA 10 exit AFAIK has always been 41, though it probably should be 40 since it is at MM 40.4. Never new why they had changed the I-495 exit to 107 since it is at MM 106.2. The Newton/Watertown exit is at MM 127.6, did they round it down to avoid any confusion with the I-95 (128) exit? I'll update my exit lists with the new information and look through the new website lists to see if there are any other changes I can spot.

Took a look at Street View, and found the following:

Newton / Watertown EB exit ramp is closest to MP 127.4, WB ramp is a bit west of MP 128.

US 202 / MA 10 EB exit ramp is closest to MP 40.4, WB closest to MP 40.6. This is a case where the interchange is equidistant from both mileposts. It should be 40 only because of the "next exit 30 miles" sign WB (and EB in Lee).

[DJ Particle]

Funny thing I noticed....  the MA-14 exit for MA-3...

Under the original numbering system, it was Exit 33
In the 1976 renumbering, it was Exit 11
In the 2020 renumbering, it will be Exit 22

That exit can't help but be a multiple of 11!   

[roadman]

Plans and detail documents for the third exit renumbering contract covering I-90/Massachusetts Turnpike have been posted to the CommBuys site.  They can be found at https://www.commbuys.com/bso/external/bidDetail.sdo?docId=BD-20-1030-0H100-0H002-52079&external=true&parentUrl=bid

[PHLBOS]

It confirms that MassDOT has changed its original intention of numbering the I-90 and MA 30 exits on I-95/128 in northbound order which would have been backward, to a more logical Exit 24 is now 39A and Exit 25 will be 39B.

Unless the latest listing was an oversight/typo, I submitted another comment to MassDOT regarding such; and, this time, recited that the I-90 & MA 30 ramp set-up along I-95 is similar to what exists along I-84 in CT for the I-691 & CT 322 interchanges.  ConnDOT's approach to I-84's Exits 27 & 28 (Future (?) Exits 40A & 40B) was/is the right call.

As previously stated, the current/original plan is basically carrying over the same error that was made nearly 33 years ago when I-95 received its current sequential numbers (the southbound ramp order was held rather than the northbound ramp order).  Such only made sense when the interchange numbers increased southbound as it did with the old/former 128 numbers.

A supplemental sign in the southbound direction reading
NEXT EXIT 39A
SECOND EXIT 39B
would alleviate the one-time oddity.  I submitted that suggestion in my comment to MassDOT as well.

[roadman]

Bids were opened on Tuesday for the Districts 1, 2, and 3 - plus all of MA 2 and I-495, exit renumbering contract (Project 610646).  Liddell Brothers was the apparent low bidder at $986,313.00.  Northeast Traffic Control was the second lowest bidder at $1,007,891.38, and RoadSafe Traffic Systems had the highest bid at $1,204,155.00.

[ProfBrad]

Is late summer (August?) still the target date for sign replacements to begin?

[bob7374]

Is late summer (August?) still the target date for sign replacements to begin?

The winning bidder for the last renumbering contract for the Mass Pike is to be announced today. Assuming things are still on schedule, I guess when the project will start depends on the definition of 'late summer.' MassDOT's calendar considers June-August as summer, so late summer could mean late August. However, since the term late summer has been used in public notices, it could be what the public considers to be late summer, September, perhaps after Labor Day. The other two contracts have not received their notices to proceed as of today, July 21.

[bob7374]

Liddell Bros. appears to be the lowest bidder for the last renumbering contract for the Mass Pike (610700).

DISTRICT 1 - DISTRICT 2 - DISTRICT 3 - DISTRICT 6 - 610700 - 111439 - Conversion of
Interstate and Freeway Exit Signs to Milepost-Based Numbering on the
Massachusetts Turnpike (I-90) - 6% MWBE
OFFICE ESTIMATE: $378,000.00

Liddell Brothers Inc 600 Industrial Drive, Halifax, MA 02338 $150,588.80
Roadsafe Traffic Systems Inc 55 Bodwell Street, Avon, MA, 02322 $316,100.00
Northeast Traffic Control 8 Scobee Circle, Plymouth, MA 02362 $362,620.80
K5 Corporation 9 Rockview Way, Rockland, MA 02370 $727,400.00

How can Liddell under bid everyone else by more than 150K?
Here are the bid tabulations, I've bolded the items where there are large differences between the MassDOT and Liddell estimates, it appears Liddell says they can save a lot of money using their temporary traffic management devices:
                                                                                            Office Estimate                       Liddell Bros. Inc.
Item     # Quantity  Units        Description                                Unit Price         Amount           Unit Price          Amount
748.     1.000         LS            MOBILIZATION                          $11,000.00     $11,000.00      $8,000.00        $8,000.00
832.12 1,540.000   F        REFLECTIVE SIGN OVERLAY         $5.00             $7,700.00         $44.00           $67,760.00
832.4   810.000    SF       OLD EXIT X SIGN - ALUM PANEL (TYPE A)$12.00 $9,720.00      $45.00            $36,450.00
848.1   10.000       EA            SIGN SUP (N/GUIDE)+RTE MKR   $250.00       $2,500.00          $300.00          $3,000.00
848.2   90.000       EA            BRACKETS FOR SIGN MOUNTING $80.00         $7,200.00          $150.00          $13,500.00
852.     800.000      SF           SIGNING FOR TRAFFIC MGMT      $20.00         $16,000.00         $0.01             $8.00
853.403 1,080.0 DAY       TRUCK MOUNTED ATTENUATOR   $125.00      $135,000.00        $1.00             $1,080.00
853.8    540.000     DAY        TEMP ILLUM FOR WORK ZONE   $25.00       $13,500.00         $1.00             $540.00
856.     1,080.000   DAY        ARROW BOARD                         $10.00       $10,800.00         $1.00             $1,080.00
856.12 6,120.000   DAY        PORT. CHANGEABLE MSG SIGN $20.00        $122,400.00       $1.00             $6,120.00
874.2   20.000       EA            TRAF SIGN REMOVED + RESET   $110.00        $2,200.00           $125.00         $2,500.00
899.1   1.000         LS            MASSDOT SIGN INVENT UPDATE $20,000.00   $20,000.00         $10,000.00     $10,000.00
                                                                                                  Total :    $378,000.00                   Total : $150,588.80

[SectorZ]

Liddell Bros. appears to be the lowest bidder for the last renumbering contract for the Mass Pike (610700).

DISTRICT 1 - DISTRICT 2 - DISTRICT 3 - DISTRICT 6 - 610700 - 111439 - Conversion of
Interstate and Freeway Exit Signs to Milepost-Based Numbering on the
Massachusetts Turnpike (I-90) - 6% MWBE
OFFICE ESTIMATE: $378,000.00

Liddell Brothers Inc 600 Industrial Drive, Halifax, MA 02338 $150,588.80
Roadsafe Traffic Systems Inc 55 Bodwell Street, Avon, MA, 02322 $316,100.00
Northeast Traffic Control 8 Scobee Circle, Plymouth, MA 02362 $362,620.80
K5 Corporation 9 Rockview Way, Rockland, MA 02370 $727,400.00

How can Liddell under bid everyone else by more than 150K?
Here are the bid tabulations, I've bolded the items where there are large differences between the MassDOT and Liddell estimates, it appears Liddell says they can save a lot of money using their temporary traffic management devices:
                                                                                            Office Estimate                       Liddell Bros. Inc.
Item     # Quantity  Units        Description                                Unit Price         Amount           Unit Price          Amount
748.     1.000         LS            MOBILIZATION                          $11,000.00     $11,000.00      $8,000.00        $8,000.00
832.12 1,540.000   F        REFLECTIVE SIGN OVERLAY         $5.00             $7,700.00         $44.00           $67,760.00
832.4   810.000    SF       OLD EXIT X SIGN - ALUM PANEL (TYPE A)$12.00 $9,720.00      $45.00            $36,450.00
848.1   10.000       EA            SIGN SUP (N/GUIDE)+RTE MKR   $250.00       $2,500.00          $300.00          $3,000.00
848.2   90.000       EA            BRACKETS FOR SIGN MOUNTING $80.00         $7,200.00          $150.00          $13,500.00
852.     800.000      SF           SIGNING FOR TRAFFIC MGMT      $20.00         $16,000.00         $0.01             $8.00
853.403 1,080.0 DAY       TRUCK MOUNTED ATTENUATOR   $125.00      $135,000.00        $1.00             $1,080.00
853.8    540.000     DAY        TEMP ILLUM FOR WORK ZONE   $25.00       $13,500.00         $1.00             $540.00
856.     1,080.000   DAY        ARROW BOARD                         $10.00       $10,800.00         $1.00             $1,080.00
856.12 6,120.000   DAY        PORT. CHANGEABLE MSG SIGN $20.00        $122,400.00       $1.00             $6,120.00
874.2   20.000       EA            TRAF SIGN REMOVED + RESET   $110.00        $2,200.00           $125.00         $2,500.00
899.1   1.000         LS            MASSDOT SIGN INVENT UPDATE $20,000.00   $20,000.00         $10,000.00     $10,000.00
                                                                                                  Total :    $378,000.00                   Total : $150,588.80

The crazy thing is a truck-mounted attenuator 15 years ago cost $10,000. Don't know why the state thinks $135,000 is a legit price. Maybe assuming 10 cost $135,000 now, but it's not like everyone of these companies doesn't have a crap load in their possession already. They only need to be replaced after impacts, and hence why I know their value from years of auto claim adjusting. The huge drop in their bid doesn't surprise me one bit.

[Rothman]

Liddell Bros. appears to be the lowest bidder for the last renumbering contract for the Mass Pike (610700).

DISTRICT 1 - DISTRICT 2 - DISTRICT 3 - DISTRICT 6 - 610700 - 111439 - Conversion of
Interstate and Freeway Exit Signs to Milepost-Based Numbering on the
Massachusetts Turnpike (I-90) - 6% MWBE
OFFICE ESTIMATE: $378,000.00

Liddell Brothers Inc 600 Industrial Drive, Halifax, MA 02338 $150,588.80
Roadsafe Traffic Systems Inc 55 Bodwell Street, Avon, MA, 02322 $316,100.00
Northeast Traffic Control 8 Scobee Circle, Plymouth, MA 02362 $362,620.80
K5 Corporation 9 Rockview Way, Rockland, MA 02370 $727,400.00

How can Liddell under bid everyone else by more than 150K?
Here are the bid tabulations, I've bolded the items where there are large differences between the MassDOT and Liddell estimates, it appears Liddell says they can save a lot of money using their temporary traffic management devices:
                                                                                            Office Estimate                       Liddell Bros. Inc.
Item     # Quantity  Units        Description                                Unit Price         Amount           Unit Price          Amount
748.     1.000         LS            MOBILIZATION                          $11,000.00     $11,000.00      $8,000.00        $8,000.00
832.12 1,540.000   F        REFLECTIVE SIGN OVERLAY         $5.00             $7,700.00         $44.00           $67,760.00
832.4   810.000    SF       OLD EXIT X SIGN - ALUM PANEL (TYPE A)$12.00 $9,720.00      $45.00            $36,450.00
848.1   10.000       EA            SIGN SUP (N/GUIDE)+RTE MKR   $250.00       $2,500.00          $300.00          $3,000.00
848.2   90.000       EA            BRACKETS FOR SIGN MOUNTING $80.00         $7,200.00          $150.00          $13,500.00
852.     800.000      SF           SIGNING FOR TRAFFIC MGMT      $20.00         $16,000.00         $0.01             $8.00
853.403 1,080.0 DAY       TRUCK MOUNTED ATTENUATOR   $125.00      $135,000.00        $1.00             $1,080.00
853.8    540.000     DAY        TEMP ILLUM FOR WORK ZONE   $25.00       $13,500.00         $1.00             $540.00
856.     1,080.000   DAY        ARROW BOARD                         $10.00       $10,800.00         $1.00             $1,080.00
856.12 6,120.000   DAY        PORT. CHANGEABLE MSG SIGN $20.00        $122,400.00       $1.00             $6,120.00
874.2   20.000       EA            TRAF SIGN REMOVED + RESET   $110.00        $2,200.00           $125.00         $2,500.00
899.1   1.000         LS            MASSDOT SIGN INVENT UPDATE $20,000.00   $20,000.00         $10,000.00     $10,000.00
                                                                                                  Total :    $378,000.00                   Total : $150,588.80

The crazy thing is a truck-mounted attenuator 15 years ago cost $10,000. Don't know why the state thinks $135,000 is a legit price. Maybe assuming 10 cost $135,000 now, but it's not like everyone of these companies doesn't have a crap load in their possession already. They only need to be replaced after impacts, and hence why I know their value from years of auto claim adjusting. The huge drop in their bid doesn't surprise me one bit.

Maybe they're buying the truck with it.

[roadman]

Liddell Bros. appears to be the lowest bidder for the last renumbering contract for the Mass Pike (610700).

DISTRICT 1 - DISTRICT 2 - DISTRICT 3 - DISTRICT 6 - 610700 - 111439 - Conversion of
Interstate and Freeway Exit Signs to Milepost-Based Numbering on the
Massachusetts Turnpike (I-90) - 6% MWBE
OFFICE ESTIMATE: $378,000.00

Liddell Brothers Inc 600 Industrial Drive, Halifax, MA 02338 $150,588.80
Roadsafe Traffic Systems Inc 55 Bodwell Street, Avon, MA, 02322 $316,100.00
Northeast Traffic Control 8 Scobee Circle, Plymouth, MA 02362 $362,620.80
K5 Corporation 9 Rockview Way, Rockland, MA 02370 $727,400.00

How can Liddell under bid everyone else by more than 150K?
Here are the bid tabulations, I've bolded the items where there are large differences between the MassDOT and Liddell estimates, it appears Liddell says they can save a lot of money using their temporary traffic management devices:
                                                                                            Office Estimate                       Liddell Bros. Inc.
Item     # Quantity  Units        Description                                Unit Price         Amount           Unit Price          Amount
748.     1.000         LS            MOBILIZATION                          $11,000.00     $11,000.00      $8,000.00        $8,000.00
832.12 1,540.000   F        REFLECTIVE SIGN OVERLAY         $5.00             $7,700.00         $44.00           $67,760.00
832.4   810.000    SF       OLD EXIT X SIGN - ALUM PANEL (TYPE A)$12.00 $9,720.00      $45.00            $36,450.00
848.1   10.000       EA            SIGN SUP (N/GUIDE)+RTE MKR   $250.00       $2,500.00          $300.00          $3,000.00
848.2   90.000       EA            BRACKETS FOR SIGN MOUNTING $80.00         $7,200.00          $150.00          $13,500.00
852.     800.000      SF           SIGNING FOR TRAFFIC MGMT      $20.00         $16,000.00         $0.01             $8.00
853.403 1,080.0 DAY       TRUCK MOUNTED ATTENUATOR   $125.00      $135,000.00        $1.00             $1,080.00
853.8    540.000     DAY        TEMP ILLUM FOR WORK ZONE   $25.00       $13,500.00         $1.00             $540.00
856.     1,080.000   DAY        ARROW BOARD                         $10.00       $10,800.00         $1.00             $1,080.00
856.12 6,120.000   DAY        PORT. CHANGEABLE MSG SIGN $20.00        $122,400.00       $1.00             $6,120.00
874.2   20.000       EA            TRAF SIGN REMOVED + RESET   $110.00        $2,200.00           $125.00         $2,500.00
899.1   1.000         LS            MASSDOT SIGN INVENT UPDATE $20,000.00   $20,000.00         $10,000.00     $10,000.00
                                                                                                  Total :    $378,000.00                   Total : $150,588.80

The crazy thing is a truck-mounted attenuator 15 years ago cost $10,000. Don't know why the state thinks $135,000 is a legit price. Maybe assuming 10 cost $135,000 now, but it's not like everyone of these companies doesn't have a crap load in their possession already. They only need to be replaced after impacts, and hence why I know their value from years of auto claim adjusting. The huge drop in their bid doesn't surprise me one bit.

One clarification.  The $135,000 amount in the office estimate is for the full duration of the contract, not per day (the per day estimate is $125).  And the payment is per DAY, regardless of the amount of attenuators that are needed during each day.  Some work setups may need only one attenuator, others may need three.

[Ben114]

One clarification.  The $135,000 amount in the office estimate is for the full duration of the contract, not per day (the per day estimate is $125).  And the payment is per DAY, regardless of the amount of attenuators that are needed during each day.  Some work setups may need only one attenuator, others may need three.

That clarifies things. I was wondering why it said 6,120 portable VMSes. Nobody has a use for that many.

[roadman]

One clarification.  The $135,000 amount in the office estimate is for the full duration of the contract, not per day (the per day estimate is $125).  And the payment is per DAY, regardless of the amount of attenuators that are needed during each day.  Some work setups may need only one attenuator, others may need three.

That clarifies things. I was wondering why it said 6,120 portable VMSes. Nobody has a use for that many.

One other thing.  As noted in the project specifications, the quantities for the traffic control items are based on the assumption that the Contractor will have three crews working at the same time.  This is why the quantities are higher than the contract duration.

[kramie13]

I noticed today a sign replacement on I-495 north in Norton.  A green "NEXT EXIT 12"  sign has been replaced with a yellow "NO EXIT 11"  sign.  It seems rather wasteful considering the exit numbers will be changing soon.

[SectorZ]

I noticed today a sign replacement on I-495 north in Norton.  A green "NEXT EXIT 12"  sign has been replaced with a yellow "NO EXIT 11"  sign.  It seems rather wasteful considering the exit numbers will be changing soon.

Knowing the state when they change the numbers someone will handwrite "^ FORMER" into the "NO EXIT 11" sign.

Or they could move it to a freeway with no exit 11 after the change just to screw with people.

[kramie13]

I noticed today a sign replacement on I-495 north in Norton.  A green "NEXT EXIT 12"  sign has been replaced with a yellow "NO EXIT 11"  sign.  It seems rather wasteful considering the exit numbers will be changing soon.

Well this is interesting.  Today, I noticed that an identical "NO EXIT 11" sign also exists in the exact same spot on I-495 in the southbound direction.  But there IS an exit 11 going south, and it's 1.5 miles after said exit number.

What a waste of our tax dollars!

[jp the roadgeek]

I noticed today a sign replacement on I-495 north in Norton.  A green "NEXT EXIT 12"  sign has been replaced with a yellow "NO EXIT 11"  sign.  It seems rather wasteful considering the exit numbers will be changing soon.

Knowing the state when they change the numbers someone will handwrite "^ FORMER" into the "NO EXIT 11" sign.

Or they could move it to a freeway with no exit 11 after the change just to screw with people.

Could donate it to CTDOT for I-91 South, since they're dragging their a$$es on converting highways.

[abqtraveler]

I-91 is supposed to be the first highway to be converted to mile-based exit numbers starting this summer. Has there been any announcement as to when that conversion will be starting, or has anyone been up I-91 recently to confirm whether or not MassDOT has started the exit conversion?

[bob7374]

None of the renumbering contracts have gotten their Notice to Proceed as of yet. The MassDOT exit renumbering website still says the project will start in late summer though it looks now like the project won't start until at least some time later in September. You will probably see reports in the media before the project does start.