Best way to sign for low clearance on expressways/freeways?

Started by Mergingtraffic, April 16, 2018, 02:44:01 PM

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Mergingtraffic

With an accident in Metro NYC where a charter bus crashed into a low clearance bridge on a parkway...what's the best way to sign for this?



Common phrases used are:
"NO Trucks"
"Passenger Cars Only"
"No Commercial Vehicles"

Should they add "Low overpasses" to it to give some kind of reason?
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index

Perhaps a large, gantry-mounted warning sign stating that any overheight truck must exit? Warning signs prior to it, as well, such as "ALL TRUCKS EXIT IN x MILES, so that truckers have time to prepare to exit. If it's particularly hazardous, add beacons or something.
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wxfree

I've seen at least one place (I seem to think I remember another) where lights will flash warning that a truck must take a certain upcoming exit, but only when a truck over a certain height is detected.  The sign says something like "Trucks take XX exit when flashing."  I don't know what technology is used, and I don't remember exactly where it is.  It's somewhere in Texas on I-30.  The obvious weakness is the risk of equipment failure, but this is supplemental to a regular sign showing the height limit, so it's an enhancement over the minimum need.
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NoGoodNamesAvailable

Quote from: wxfree on April 16, 2018, 04:25:57 PM
I've seen at least one place (I seem to think I remember another) where lights will flash warning that a truck must take a certain upcoming exit, but only when a truck over a certain height is detected.  The sign says something like "Trucks take XX exit when flashing."  I don't know what technology is used, and I don't remember exactly where it is.  It's somewhere in Texas on I-30.  The obvious weakness is the risk of equipment failure, but this is supplemental to a regular sign showing the height limit, so it's an enhancement over the minimum need.

This still doesn't work. The Hutchinson River Parkway in NYC has a similar electronic sign system before the Westchester Av bridge in addition to every other possible static truck prohibition sign (trucks are banned on the road entirely), and trucks still constantly hit the bridge. Some drivers are completely ignorant to all signs around them; they just don't read. You can't fix that.

kkt

Suspend a rubber ball from the overhead sign.  If a vehicle hits the rubber ball, it lights up a "YOUR VEHICLE IS OVERHEIGHT, TAKE NEXT EXIT" sign which is followed by directions to an alternate route.

Jardine

Are they allowed to actually lie on a BGS?

Post a very low weight limit like 4000 pounds.

:-D

kkt

If they're too dense to see a limited height sign, they're too dense to see a weight limit sign.

Big John

Quote from: kkt on April 16, 2018, 06:11:43 PM
Suspend a rubber ball from the overhead sign.  If a vehicle hits the rubber ball, it lights up a "YOUR VEHICLE IS OVERHEIGHT, TAKE NEXT EXIT" sign which is followed by directions to an alternate route.

I have seen electric eyes used to do that.

Big John

Quote from: NoGoodNamesAvailable on April 16, 2018, 05:20:31 PM
Quote from: wxfree on April 16, 2018, 04:25:57 PM
I've seen at least one place (I seem to think I remember another) where lights will flash warning that a truck must take a certain upcoming exit, but only when a truck over a certain height is detected.  The sign says something like "Trucks take XX exit when flashing."  I don't know what technology is used, and I don't remember exactly where it is.  It's somewhere in Texas on I-30.  The obvious weakness is the risk of equipment failure, but this is supplemental to a regular sign showing the height limit, so it's an enhancement over the minimum need.

This still doesn't work. The Hutchinson River Parkway in NYC has a similar electronic sign system before the Westchester Av bridge in addition to every other possible static truck prohibition sign (trucks are banned on the road entirely), and trucks still constantly hit the bridge. Some drivers are completely ignorant to all signs around them; they just don't read. You can't fix that.
Likely their GPS told them to take that route.

NoGoodNamesAvailable

Quote from: Jardine on April 16, 2018, 06:56:44 PM
Are they allowed to actually lie on a BGS?

Post a very low weight limit like 4000 pounds.

:-D

NY does this with clearances. "Legal clearance" (the posted clearance) is always, at minimum, a foot lower than the actual height of the bridge. Truckers know this and the effect is that standard clearance signs are completely meaningless.

The BQE, for example, has several posted 12'-2" clearance signs and tells trucks over 12'-2" to detour on Atlantic Avenue (because apparently NYC wants more truck traffic on local streets with pedestrians), but a 13'6" trailer can actually just squeak through the length of the expressway. This has necessitated the installation of "ACTUAL CLEARANCE" signs for bridges under 13'-6", which indeed display the actual clearance.

On the Hutchinson River Parkway where I was describing the sign, the road prior to Westchester Av, Tremont Av, has an actual clearance of around 14', but is signed for 10'-6". So when truckers see the next 10'-2" sign, they figure they still have room, but the actual clearance for that bridge is around 12'.

Believe me, it's not a desirable situation. Trucks quickly become aware of agencies that lowball clearances.

jeffandnicole

Everything that everyone will suggest is already in use.   It may stop some trucks, but it won't stop them all.


txstateends

The I-635 exit for MacArthur Blvd. in Irving, TX is set up for overheight trucks.  Yellow flashing lights with BYSes tell the overheighters to exit and take the service road.  Instead of redoing the MacArthur bridge higher over I-635, or having a lower road surface on I-635, they'd rather spend the $$$$ on a bunch of signs.
\/ \/ click for a bigger image \/ \/

UCFKnights

I don't understand why they don't use chains with a beam hanging at the height designed to make some noise on the signs warning about height restrictions, like you see at some parking garages and fast food lines. I don't hear about people running into them quite as much

txstateends

Here's a similar one I remembered in Frisco, TX.  I thought it was an interesting way for those over the height clearance to have some advance warning.  (InstantStreetView)



The overpass in the distance is for a section of a BNSF railroad.  I don't know how well this works to keep overheighters from impacting the railroad bridge, but I don't usually hear about this one on the news--it's usually a bridge on one of the freeways that gets hit, then gets spotlighted on the traffic reports.
\/ \/ click for a bigger image \/ \/

SidS1045


Another way to do it:  A curtain of water with a STOP sign projected on it, directly in front of the driver.  (The Sydney Harbour Tunnel in Australia.)

http://www.truckinginfo.com/blog/on-the-road/story/2013/05/aussies-deploy-water-wall-tunnel-warning-technology.aspx
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US 89

Quote from: txstateends on April 18, 2018, 06:54:05 AM
Here's a similar one I remembered in Frisco, TX.  I thought it was an interesting way for those over the height clearance to have some advance warning.  (InstantStreetView)



The overpass in the distance is for a section of a BNSF railroad.  I don't know how well this works to keep overheighters from impacting the railroad bridge, but I don't usually hear about this one on the news--it's usually a bridge on one of the freeways that gets hit, then gets spotlighted on the traffic reports.

I've never understood warnings like this. Why provide a height warning if you've already committed to going under the low-clearance bridge and can't turn around? That applies to parking garages, drive-thru lanes, airport pickup lanes, and the like as well.

NoGoodNamesAvailable

Quote from: txstateends on April 18, 2018, 06:54:05 AM


I find it really hard to believe that there are enough 18'-1" high trucks on the road to have warranted this installation.

Big John

^^ Especially when the standard minimum clearance for new bridges is 16'  to 16'6"

SSOWorld

Every bridge on a Texas highway gets those - I've seen some for bridges 20' high.
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Revive 755

Here's a large overhead advance low clearance signn that used to exist on EB US 40 in St. Louis for the McKnight Road overpass prior to the great rebuild:  Streetview.

Jet380


SidS1045

"A nation of sheep will beget a government of wolves." - Edward R. Murrow

mapman1071

Quote from: NoGoodNamesAvailable on April 16, 2018, 09:22:53 PM
Quote from: Jardine on April 16, 2018, 06:56:44 PM
Are they allowed to actually lie on a BGS?

Post a very low weight limit like 4000 pounds.

:-D

NY does this with clearances. "Legal clearance" (the posted clearance) is always, at minimum, a foot lower than the actual height of the bridge. Truckers know this and the effect is that standard clearance signs are completely meaningless.

The BQE, for example, has several posted 12'-2" clearance signs and tells trucks over 12'-2" to detour on Atlantic Avenue (because apparently NYC wants more truck traffic on local streets with pedestrians), but a 13'6" trailer can actually just squeak through the length of the expressway. This has necessitated the installation of "ACTUAL CLEARANCE" signs for bridges under 13'-6", which indeed display the actual clearance.

On the Hutchinson River Parkway where I was describing the sign, the road prior to Westchester Av, Tremont Av, has an actual clearance of around 14', but is signed for 10'-6". So when truckers see the next 10'-2" sign, they figure they still have room, but the actual clearance for that bridge is around 12'.

Believe me, it's not a desirable situation. Trucks quickly become aware of agencies that lowball clearances.

In New York City & New York State The Law is NO Trucks or Commercial Vehicles on Parkways due to Low Clearance and Tight Curves Including Ocean Parkway In Brooklyn, Bronx and Pelham Parkway & Mosholu Parkway in The Bronx.

CtrlAltDel

My favorite is the rather blunt:



I couldn't tell you how effective it is, though.
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