__________ is/are overrated.

[CtrlAltDel]

But "much greater" is still quite relative.

Yes, this is how greater than and less than always work. 

[kphoger]

But "much greater" is still quite relative.

Yes, this is how greater than and less than always work. 

Yeah, well, uh, ... uh, ... FINE!

[kphoger]

Dairy Queen's

Speaking of which...

Milkshakes so thick you can't even use a straw:  yeah, those are overrated.

[Scott5114]

Natural gas.

There was a political brouhaha a few years back where a bunch of people were convinced Biden was going to take away their natural gas appliances. I didn't get it then because I lived in a house that was all electric and I was happy enough with everything, so I didn't see the big deal even if he did do that. Which he unfortunately didn't.

I say that because my new house is gas for everything and I kind of hate it. The stove is...well, I guess it's nice that you have full heat immediately. But I like to let things cook for a long time on low heat, and with my stove it's really hard to set the knob low enough that I get low heat but not so low that the flame goes out. The warm-up period of the electric ranges I've cooked on before never bothered me because I could just kind of add ingredients to a pot of water while waiting for it to boil, and it wasn't a huge deal.

But the gas dryer has to be the single worst appliance at actually doing its job that I have ever owned. It takes some real effort to have something not be dry in the Mojave Desert and yet this dryer effortlessly manages it. It makes no sense; some garments come out perfectly dry while others (not even bulky ones, but things like T-shirts) come out damp. I always make sure to run the thing for 2½ hours (it defaults to 20 minutes!) and still get damp clothes. I never had that happen once with my electric dryer (which is fortunately in storage at the moment, but we don't have the space in the house yet for the other stuff that's in front of it so we haven't gotten it out yet).

The only gas appliance I'm actually impressed by is the hot tub heater, which does an admirable job. I guess I have no complaints about the actual house heater, but it's not like it gets super cold here so if it was garbage I probably wouldn't notice.

[kphoger]

The stove is...well, I guess it's nice that you have full heat immediately. But I like to let things cook for a long time on low heat, and with my stove it's really hard to set the knob low enough that I get low heat but not so low that the flame goes out.

That's the biggest disadvantage of a gas stove:  there's no real "low".

But the gas dryer has to be the single worst appliance at actually doing its job that I have ever owned. It takes some real effort to have something not be dry in the Mojave Desert and yet this dryer effortlessly manages it. It makes no sense; some garments come out perfectly dry while others (not even bulky ones, but things like T-shirts) come out damp. I always make sure to run the thing for 2½ hours (it defaults to 20 minutes!) and still get damp clothes. I never had that happen once with my electric dryer (which is fortunately in storage at the moment, but we don't have the space in the house yet for the other stuff that's in front of it so we haven't gotten it out yet).

So, it's a dryer you hadn't had any experience with before?  It sounds like a dryer problem to me, not a fuel source problem.

[JayhawkCO]

The stove is...well, I guess it's nice that you have full heat immediately. But I like to let things cook for a long time on low heat, and with my stove it's really hard to set the knob low enough that I get low heat but not so low that the flame goes out.

That's the biggest disadvantage of a gas stove:  there's no real "low".

Get a simmer ring for it.

[Scott5114]

So, it's a dryer you hadn't had any experience with before?  It sounds like a dryer problem to me, not a fuel source problem.

I mean, maybe there's something wrong with it? I don't know. It's new enough I wouldn't expect it to need maintenance, but it's also new enough that it could have been designed to do a terrible job on purpose like so many new consumer products seem to be. (Another minor black mark against it is that it has those weird buttons that are actually touchscreens with no screen behind them. I didn't pick it out, it came with the house.) I've been using it for three months at this point, so if it's an operator error problem I would think I would have figured that out by now, but...

Here's the kind of hilarious thing, though. I went ahead and put on the wet T-shirt I pulled out of it that irritated me enough to post in this thread. It was dry in about fifteen minutes. I have half a mind to just get a clothes drying rack and have the desert dry my clothes for free!

[GaryV]

Maybe the dryer exhaust is clogged?

A friend of ours with a gas dryer had an interesting story with her exhaust. She was having respiratory problems, and thought it was long-covid. Turns out the wonderful people she paid to put new siding on her house covered over the vent outlet. She was breathing the fumes. So it turns out that at least in non-vented situations, gas appliances can be dangerous.

[kphoger]

We just started shopping for a used washing machine.  So far, the best options appear to be 30-year-old Whirlpool machines with knobs instead of buttons.  Newer fancier machines, from what I've read and heard, simply won't last as long.

[JayhawkCO]

We just started shopping for a used washing machine.  So far, the best options appear to be 30-year-old Whirlpool machines with knobs instead of buttons.  Newer fancier machines, from what I've read and heard, simply won't last as long.

I've replaced two washers in my lifetime. Never a dryer, and it's probably early 90's.

[kphoger]

We just started shopping for a used washing machine.  So far, the best options appear to be 30-year-old Whirlpool machines with knobs instead of buttons.  Newer fancier machines, from what I've read and heard, simply won't last as long.

I've replaced two washers in my lifetime. Never a dryer, and it's probably early 90's.

In 2009, my mother-in-law gave us a washer and dryer that she had in storage.  My wife remembers using them when she was a kid, and she was born in 1982.  The dryer was toast, so we got a new dryer then.  But we've been using the same washer.  The agitator stopped working a year or two ago, and the bolt is so rusted inside that it would need to be drilled out—and doing so risks drilling too far down and ruining the whole thing.  So we've just been doing without the agitator.  But now a seal has started leaking, and water drips down into the barrel when we're not using the machine, so we've had to keep the cold water supply knob turned off in between loads.  It's time.  But yeah, that sucker is old.

[JayhawkCO]

We just started shopping for a used washing machine.  So far, the best options appear to be 30-year-old Whirlpool machines with knobs instead of buttons.  Newer fancier machines, from what I've read and heard, simply won't last as long.

I've replaced two washers in my lifetime. Never a dryer, and it's probably early 90's.

In 2009, my mother-in-law gave us a washer and dryer that she had in storage.  My wife remembers using them when she was a kid, and she was born in 1982.  The dryer was toast, so we got a new dryer then.  But we've been using the same washer.  The agitator stopped working a year or two ago, and the bolt is so rusted inside that it would need to be drilled out—and doing so risks drilling too far down and ruining the whole thing.  So we've just been doing without the agitator.  But now a seal has started leaking, and water drips down into the barrel when we're not using the machine, so we've had to keep the cold water supply knob turned off in between loads.  It's time.  But yeah, that sucker is old.

My last washer died a week after we took our son home from the hospital (for the first time). I had someone come and look at it, but he told me it would be $600 to fix, so I bought a new one for $800. So far, so good with regards to quality and durability. We did switch from a top-loader to a front-loader as the tech said, in general, they have way fewer issues.

[1995hoo]

I've lived in my house since 2001 and have replaced the washer three times, which feels like a lot to me. The first time, in 2002, came because my father had been over and was concerned that the one that conveyed with the house had cheap rubber water supply hoses, so he got me some of the braided steel ones. But after he took the old ones off, we found the new ones didn't quite fit into the opening where the hoses attached to the machine, and then we couldn't quite get the old hoses back on and one of them sprung a leak. So I got a Kenmore front-loader. I was very happy with it for ten or eleven years until the ball bearings failed. Sounded like an earthquake downstairs. The repair estimate was $580 and we were able to get a new Samsung top-loader (with no agitator) for $80 more, so that was a no-brainer. The Samsung then had a safety recall that resulted in a repair that more securely attached the top of the machine to the body. Downside of that: It became virtually impossible to remove the top of the machine, so when the suspension rods failed this winter, it became impossible to repair it. Replacing the rods would have been an easy job if the top of the machine could have been removed. But with failed suspension rods, the machine struggled to complete the spin cycle. On the Saturday of Washington's Birthday weekend, it took it over two and a half hours to wash a load of towels because it kept going off-balance. So the next day we went appliance shopping and last week we took delivery of a new GE top-loader (with no agitator). All's well so far, although my wife complained that it seems noisier than the old one. I don't much care about that because usually we aren't downstairs when the machine is running. I am also quite happy with the feature where it sends a push notification to my iPhone (and thus to my Apple Watch) five minutes before the wash is done, again when it finishes, and then half an hour later if I fail to unload the machine.

I would prefer a front-loader, but that design just doesn't work as well in our house unless we leave the door to the laundry closet open. While we did that when we had the old front-loader, back then we didn't have a curious cat who likes to explore things.

So replacing the washer three times in 24 years seems like a lot to me. My mother replaced her washer last year after having it since sometime in the early 1990s. She got a Speed Queen. Everything I've read says they're by far the best for reliability, but the one I would have gotten would have been $2200 and we didn't want to spend that much (and it was a front-loader). On the other hand, I wonder to what extent buying a less expensive one might be a false economy if it doesn't last as long and you wind up spending that much anyway.

[kphoger]

She got a Speed Queen. Everything I've read says they're by far the best for reliability,

One of the used appliance salesladies we spoke to told us that, besides 25-year-old Whirlpool or Maytag machines, Speed Queen is right up there.

[1995hoo]

She got a Speed Queen. Everything I've read says they're by far the best for reliability,

One of the used appliance salesladies we spoke to told us that, besides 25-year-old Whirlpool or Maytag machines, Speed Queen is right up there.

I forgot to mention: When I took delivery of the new machine last week, the workmen said they get more returns of LG and Samsung machines than any other brand and that they almost never get returns of Speed Queen and GE. It was interesting to hear that from the delivery personnel because they're not trying to sell you something.

My wife had been interested in the idea of an LG front-loader with the "Sidekick" pedestal that contains a smaller washer allowing you to a second smaller load of wash at the same time. But I pointed out to her that the Sidekick wouldn't work well (if at all) in our space because of the design of the laundry closet. The main room has carpeting and I doubt the Sidekick drawer could open because of the small "lip" at the front of the closet due to the carpeting.

[kkt]

A good gas stove can be made to simmer, but not all gas stoves are good,

When I moved into this house, there was an electric stove already there so I figured I would live with it for a while.  It was much better than past electric stoves I've used!  Burners don't heat up quite as fast as gas, but much faster than previous electrics I've used.  And there was a continuous heat adjustments, while lots of electric stoves have off plus 4 or 5 settings none of which seemed to be quite right for simmering.  Stove was put in probably about 2008.

[kphoger]

My wife had been interested in the idea of an LG front-loader with the "Sidekick" pedestal that contains a smaller washer allowing you to a second smaller load of wash at the same time. But I pointed out to her that the Sidekick wouldn't work well (if at all) in our space because of the design of the laundry closet. The main room has carpeting and I doubt the Sidekick drawer could open because of the small "lip" at the front of the closet due to the carpeting.

The more things combined into one machine, the more likely it is to become toast when anything goes awry.  Remember VCR/DVD combo machines...

[JayhawkCO]

She got a Speed Queen. Everything I've read says they're by far the best for reliability,

One of the used appliance salesladies we spoke to told us that, besides 25-year-old Whirlpool or Maytag machines, Speed Queen is right up there.

I forgot to mention: When I took delivery of the new machine last week, the workmen said they get more returns of LG and Samsung machines than any other brand and that they almost never get returns of Speed Queen and GE. It was interesting to hear that from the delivery personnel because they're not trying to sell you something.

I was told Frigidaire when I needed to replace my dishwasher, in a similar vein.

[1995hoo]

The more things combined into one machine, the more likely it is to become toast when anything goes awry.  Remember VCR/DVD combo machines...

I have one of those downstairs, although it isn't connected at the moment. Never had any problems with it.

[kphoger]

I have one of those downstairs, although it isn't connected at the moment. Never had any problems with it.

Depending on what goes wrong with it, once it stops working, you're out both a VCR and a DVD player.

Kind of like those TV/VCR combos:  if the TV part goes out, then suddenly you're out a VCR too.

[JayhawkCO]

I have one of those downstairs, although it isn't connected at the moment. Never had any problems with it.

Depending on what goes wrong with it, once it stops working, you're out both a VCR and a DVD player.

Kind of like those TV/VCR combos:  if the TV part goes out, then suddenly you're out a VCR too.

I don't think I've owned a physical media player for about 5 years now. I used to have a laptop with a CD drive that also had an HDMI port, but that computer crapped out in 2020. I was also given a DVD for Christmas, that I can't do anything with.

[1995hoo]

I have one of those downstairs, although it isn't connected at the moment. Never had any problems with it.

Depending on what goes wrong with it, once it stops working, you're out both a VCR and a DVD player.

Kind of like those TV/VCR combos:  if the TV part goes out, then suddenly you're out a VCR too.

That's true, although I've never been overly concerned because we have at least six other DVD or Blu-ray players and at least one other VCR (the latter has not gotten any use in a fairly long time, and if I were to use it, the most likely reason would be if I wanted to watch the original versions of the original Star Wars Trilogy prior to the 1997 revisions). Not all of those DVD players are in service for that purpose, of course. One is in my home office to function as a CD/SACD player, for example.

[Rothman]

The more things combined into one machine, the more likely it is to become toast when anything goes awry.  Remember VCR/DVD combo machines...

I have one of those downstairs, although it isn't connected at the moment. Never had any problems with it.

Have one that's connected.  Never had any problems with it.

[vdeane]

Gas stoves also have the benefit that turning down the heat turns down the heat immediately, and not at some unpredictable future time.  The flame can also be adjusted to the size of the pot/pan, so you can use any burner for anything, rather than having to use whichever one is designated for a given size.  But you do have to use the fan whenever it's on, because gas needs to be ventilated.

Maybe the dryer exhaust is clogged?

Definitely something to check.  The dryer in my apartment is a similar one with "touchscreen but not a touchscreen" buttons (although it's probably electric), and it's the only one I've ever used with two filters.  There's the usual filter, and then there's a second one that catches finer lint that's supposed to be cleaned every five loads.  I can definitely notice a difference between the load before it's cleaned and the load after, and if I'm doing loads with more lint than usual, I'll clean it early.

[Scott5114]

But you do have to use the fan whenever it's on, because gas needs to be ventilated.

lol what fan

Nevada building codes apparently don't require vent hoods to actually ventilate to anywhere! Both of the buildings I've lived in here just have the vent hood vent to...above the microwave. Not really all that useful.

On the other hand, the laundry room apparently requires a fan vent to outside, since that's something both of the buildings I've lived in here have had. But bathrooms don't require those, as long as you have a window you can open. And the garage has to have (passive) ventilation as well, to keep people from killing themselves with car exhaust after a night at the casino didn't go as planned.

All of this is different than what I consider to be "normal", which is what we had in Oklahoma: the hood vent in the kitchen vented to outside, bathrooms had to have fan vents to outside whether or not they had a window, and no vent was needed in the laundry room or the garage. (Okay, I like the garage ventilation requirement, since our house is 0% neurotypical.)

State laws are weird!