Virginia

[Thing 342]

Looks like funding has been identified for widening I-64 on the Peninsula between MM234 and MM205:

"˜It is a giant step.' Virginia budget deal would boost funds to widen I-64 between Williamsburg and Richmond

https://www.pilotonline.com/news/transportation/dp-nw-i64-20220531-npu322fok5bk5phdvyui26vsim-story.html

The budget deal before legislators includes far more than either House of Delegates or state Senate budget writers proposed earlier this year to widen Interstate 64 between Richmond and Williamsburg.

The budget deal finalized last week sets $310 million – and hints at even more down the road – for a project that should speed traffic through the Peninsula and cut the driving time from Norfolk to the state capital.

The idea is to draw down federal and regional authorities' money for what's expected to be a $750 million project to add a third lane in each direction between Bottoms Bridge, at mile marker 205, and the northern interchange with Route 199, at mile marker 234.

"This gets us started; it is a giant step,"  said state Sen. Monty Mason, D-Williamsburg.

"It's what we've talked about all the time, keeping the momentum on this project ... We want to get this done now, rather than wait for about 10 years – you know what happens to the cost of things if you wait,"  he said.

Formally, the deal sets $210 million for the project for fiscal year 2022, which ends June 30, and another $110 million to be spent in fiscal year 2024.

If revenues hold up, the idea is that the state would eventually kick in another $150 million, which is the likely maximum of any federal infrastructure dollars for the project, Mason said.

Also possibly in the mix are funds from the new Central Virginia Transportation Authority, which uses regional sales, gasoline and diesel tax surcharges to accelerate projects around the Richmond area. The authority has a request from New Kent to commit $397 million to widen I-64 in that county – that is, from mile 205 to mile 223.

The original fiscal 2022 spending plan, proposed by outgoing Gov. Ralph Northam and accepted by the state Senate, said the work on I-64 between Bottoms Bridge and 199 for that year would be financed by any funds left over from the Hampton Roads high occupancy toll lane project.

Basically, a surplus hoped for from the Hampton Roads Transportation Accountability Commission's funds, which come from this region's gas tax surcharge didn't materialize because of rising interest rates. That surcharge has financed a major part of the expansion of the HRBT as well as the HOT lanes on I-64.

The governor's budget for fiscal years 2023 and 2024 did not set any specific amount for I-64 widening.

The House budget writers amended these budget proposals to set $30 million for the work in fiscal 2022 and $20 million over the next two years.

The state Senate, however, proposed spending $190 million in the budget for fiscal years 2023 and 2024 for I-64 widening between Route 199 and the New Kent County line – that is, to mile marker 223, not quite as far as Bottoms Bridge.

Mason said VDOT has told him the higher funding means it could get out a request for proposals for design and construction of the widening out sometime this year. That would put the work for the whole 29 miles between Bottoms Bridge and Route 199 on a fast track, he said.

[sprjus4]

That is great news. Hopefully they can get ground broken on Segment 4 - extending between Route 199 and the James City County / New Kent County line - by next year, and get the whole 29 miles done by the end of the decade.

It's sorely needed.

[bluecountry]

That is great news. Hopefully they can get ground broken on Segment 4 - extending between Route 199 and the James City County / New Kent County line - by next year, and get the whole 29 miles done by the end of the decade.

It's sorely needed.

Really?  Not just in beach season?

[sprjus4]

Traffic is the worst during peak weekends, but from driving that stretch of I-64 numerous times all times of year, the traffic is heavy on any given day. Often to the point it's moving at or below 70 mph with inconsistent speeds.

The 6 lane segments on the other hand move 75-80+ mph, vehicles more spaced out, much more free flow. And even during peak periods, rarely congested.

[bluecountry]

Traffic is the worst during peak weekends, but from driving that stretch of I-64 numerous times all times of year, the traffic is heavy on any given day. Often to the point it's moving at or below 70 mph with inconsistent speeds.

The 6 lane segments on the other hand move 75-80+ mph, vehicles more spaced out, much more free flow. And even during peak periods, rarely congested.

I mean, if it's moving 55 mph that is free flowing and hardly pressing...

[sprjus4]

^ Much like your arguments for the NJTP... clearly it's not being bought.

And again, drive it during peak times. It's stop and go. Not "free-flowing" .

[Alps]

Traffic is the worst during peak weekends, but from driving that stretch of I-64 numerous times all times of year, the traffic is heavy on any given day. Often to the point it's moving at or below 70 mph with inconsistent speeds.

The 6 lane segments on the other hand move 75-80+ mph, vehicles more spaced out, much more free flow. And even during peak periods, rarely congested.

I mean, if it's moving 55 mph that is free flowing and hardly pressing...

wrong, read about level of service

[VTGoose]

Traffic is the worst during peak weekends, but from driving that stretch of I-64 numerous times all times of year, the traffic is heavy on any given day. Often to the point it's moving at or below 70 mph with inconsistent speeds.

The 6 lane segments on the other hand move 75-80+ mph, vehicles more spaced out, much more free flow. And even during peak periods, rarely congested.

I mean, if it's moving 55 mph that is free flowing and hardly pressing...

It's been a number of years since I've been on I-64 between Richmond and Va. Beach (mainly on a Friday night traveling to a weekend soccer tournament), but it sounds like not much has changed. I was more stressed on that section than at any time on I-81. There wasn't a good mix of traffic -- the right lane moved at a speed under the limit and the left lane moved at a speed well over the limit. If one moved to the right lane to get rid of a tailgater, you had to drop from 70 to 50 real quick to fit into the hole you found. You were stuck poking along until there was a sufficient opening in the left lane to move back to avoid the slow movers. Throw in the random driver in the left lane who managed to find a large hole so they could drive at 55 to get around the cars doing 50 and the left lane quickly stacked up. Yo-yo travel is anything but "free flowing" on that two-lane section.

Bruce in Blacksburg

[kernals12]

How horrible. This widening is just going to induce more people to see Colonial Williamsburg and learn about Norfolk's rich naval history and lead to more commerce at the port.

/s

[J N Winkler]

I haven't been back to Virginia in over 20 years, but at one point I had one-year free admission to Colonial Williamsburg and milked it hard over summer weekend day trips from the DC area.  I-64 between Richmond and Hampton Roads was bad even back then.  Although US 17 and US 301 offer a continuous four lanes from Hampton Roads to just east of DC, they don't form a suitable alternative to the I-95/I-64 itinerary because the four-lane section of US 17 in Virginia is built to rural arterial (not true expressway) standards and so is stoplight-infested.

[WillWeaverRVA]

Looks like funding has been identified for widening I-64 on the Peninsula between MM234 and MM205:

"˜It is a giant step.' Virginia budget deal would boost funds to widen I-64 between Williamsburg and Richmond

https://www.pilotonline.com/news/transportation/dp-nw-i64-20220531-npu322fok5bk5phdvyui26vsim-story.html

The budget deal before legislators includes far more than either House of Delegates or state Senate budget writers proposed earlier this year to widen Interstate 64 between Richmond and Williamsburg.

The budget deal finalized last week sets $310 million – and hints at even more down the road – for a project that should speed traffic through the Peninsula and cut the driving time from Norfolk to the state capital.

The idea is to draw down federal and regional authorities' money for what's expected to be a $750 million project to add a third lane in each direction between Bottoms Bridge, at mile marker 205, and the northern interchange with Route 199, at mile marker 234.

"This gets us started; it is a giant step,"  said state Sen. Monty Mason, D-Williamsburg.

"It's what we've talked about all the time, keeping the momentum on this project ... We want to get this done now, rather than wait for about 10 years – you know what happens to the cost of things if you wait,"  he said.

Formally, the deal sets $210 million for the project for fiscal year 2022, which ends June 30, and another $110 million to be spent in fiscal year 2024.

If revenues hold up, the idea is that the state would eventually kick in another $150 million, which is the likely maximum of any federal infrastructure dollars for the project, Mason said.

Also possibly in the mix are funds from the new Central Virginia Transportation Authority, which uses regional sales, gasoline and diesel tax surcharges to accelerate projects around the Richmond area. The authority has a request from New Kent to commit $397 million to widen I-64 in that county – that is, from mile 205 to mile 223.

The original fiscal 2022 spending plan, proposed by outgoing Gov. Ralph Northam and accepted by the state Senate, said the work on I-64 between Bottoms Bridge and 199 for that year would be financed by any funds left over from the Hampton Roads high occupancy toll lane project.

Basically, a surplus hoped for from the Hampton Roads Transportation Accountability Commission's funds, which come from this region's gas tax surcharge didn't materialize because of rising interest rates. That surcharge has financed a major part of the expansion of the HRBT as well as the HOT lanes on I-64.

The governor's budget for fiscal years 2023 and 2024 did not set any specific amount for I-64 widening.

The House budget writers amended these budget proposals to set $30 million for the work in fiscal 2022 and $20 million over the next two years.

The state Senate, however, proposed spending $190 million in the budget for fiscal years 2023 and 2024 for I-64 widening between Route 199 and the New Kent County line – that is, to mile marker 223, not quite as far as Bottoms Bridge.

Mason said VDOT has told him the higher funding means it could get out a request for proposals for design and construction of the widening out sometime this year. That would put the work for the whole 29 miles between Bottoms Bridge and Route 199 on a fast track, he said.

The budget passed the General Assembly today and is likely to be signed by the governor, so that will be a huge help.

[bluecountry]

^ Much like your arguments for the NJTP... clearly it's not being bought.

And again, drive it during peak times. It's stop and go. Not "free-flowing" .

No, my point on the NJTP is right, it doesn't need widened south of exit 3, as it is always free flowing (65+) aside from a few times.

Now, 64 in VA IS bad but my question, how bad is it really outside of summer beach season?

[Takumi]

^ Much like your arguments for the NJTP... clearly it's not being bought.

And again, drive it during peak times. It's stop and go. Not "free-flowing" .

No, my point on the NJTP is right, it doesn't need widened south of exit 3, as it is always free flowing (65+) aside from a few times.

Now, 64 in VA IS bad but my question, how bad is it really outside of summer beach season?

Still pretty bad even in the middle of the winter during the week.

[sprjus4]

^ Much like your arguments for the NJTP... clearly it's not being bought.

And again, drive it during peak times. It's stop and go. Not "free-flowing" .

No, my point on the NJTP is right, it doesn't need widened south of exit 3, as it is always free flowing (65+) aside from a few times.

My point still stands - your argument isn't being bought. The section is being widened to 6 lanes.

The same applies for I-64.

Now, 64 in VA IS bad but my question, how bad is it really outside of summer beach season?

Pretty bad, as answered above. I suppose you aren't interested to entertain this, however, because if it's moving above 0 mph, in your mind, it's adequate.

[Thing 342]

Now, 64 in VA IS bad but my question, how bad is it really outside of summer beach season?

This study from 2011 should answer your questions.
https://www.virginiadot.org/projects/resources/hampton_roads/64_deis/Traffic_and_Transportation_Technical_Memorandum_10-23-12.pdf

TLDR: MM205-234 rated LOS E during the summer weekend peak, LOS B/C during non-summer weekday peak. The widened segment (MM234-255) rated LOS E during the summer weekend peak and LOS D during the non-summer weekday peak.

[sprjus4]

^ To clarify, the LOS on the widened segment was pre widening. Traffic conditions have moved from heavily congested to virtually never congested, always free flow.

[bluecountry]

^ Much like your arguments for the NJTP... clearly it's not being bought.

And again, drive it during peak times. It's stop and go. Not "free-flowing" .

No, my point on the NJTP is right, it doesn't need widened south of exit 3, as it is always free flowing (65+) aside from a few times.

My point still stands - your argument isn't being bought. The section is being widened to 6 lanes.

The same applies for I-64.

Now, 64 in VA IS bad but my question, how bad is it really outside of summer beach season?

Pretty bad, as answered above. I suppose you aren't interested to entertain this, however, because if it's moving above 0 mph, in your mind, it's adequate.

No actually free flowing is when google  maps shows green.  And the NJTP south of exit 3 is almost always that both on google and when I drive, but what do I know.

[VTGoose]

No actually free flowing is when google  maps shows green.

So Google is now the arbiter of traffic? Don't let this get out too far or lots of state DOTs will be laying off engineers left and right, keeping one person to monitor the Google map colors.

[bluecountry]

No actually free flowing is when google  maps shows green.

So Google is now the arbiter of traffic? Don't let this get out too far or lots of state DOTs will be laying off engineers left and right, keeping one person to monitor the Google map colors.

Google maps and my own observations firsthand.

[Rothman]

No actually free flowing is when google  maps shows green.

So Google is now the arbiter of traffic? Don't let this get out too far or lots of state DOTs will be laying off engineers left and right, keeping one person to monitor the Google map colors.

That's...that's not how traffic studies work...

[bluecountry]

No actually free flowing is when google  maps shows green.

So Google is now the arbiter of traffic? Don't let this get out too far or lots of state DOTs will be laying off engineers left and right, keeping one person to monitor the Google map colors.

That's...that's not how traffic studies work...

I'm sure any TS would show the LOS to be fine.

Show me the LOS for the NJTP south of exit 3 and compare it to the LOS of the 95/295 split in DE or the I-95 LOS in Harford County, MD and you will see why I say this is not a priority.

[sprjus4]

You're in the wrong thread to talk about the New Jersey Turnpike... and I don't think this repetitive argument is needed there either to be honest... you're beating a dead horse.

[bluecountry]

You know what pisses me off about the I-64 widening from 205 to Williamsburg?
That I-64 will now be 3 lanes each way, the same as I-95 from I-295 to Lorton!
This is insane!!!!!

[sprjus4]

You know what pisses me off about the I-64 widening from 205 to Williamsburg?
That I-64 will now be 3 lanes each way, the same as I-95 from I-295 to Lorton!
This is insane!!!!!

Is there an issue with that?

I-95 is overcapacity with 6 lanes and has the warrants for 8 lanes.

I-64 is overcapacity with 4 lanes and has the warrants for 6 lanes.

[J N Winkler]

Because LOS is measured over a 15-minute period, on almost any freeway you can see LOS A at 4 AM.  (California I-405 may be slightly worse--LOS B, perhaps?)  Thus, traffic provision tends to be decided using LOS at some generally accepted threshold, such as the 30th highest hour in the year.  With 24 summer weekend days per year and I-64 between Richmond and Hampton Roads not coming close to operating at LOS B (the common target for design hour volume on rural facilities during the era of first Interstate construction) in any of them as far back as the mid-1990's, I'd say the widening was long overdue.  The question in my mind is actually whether eight or more lanes would be necessary to carry the DHV at LOS B or better.