Southern Ohio: SR 823 / Portsmouth Bypass

Started by seicer, June 17, 2013, 02:14:41 PM

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sparker

Quote from: Buck87 on December 22, 2018, 12:00:29 AM
They've posted one final plane flyover video, which was taken 2 days before the bypass opened to traffic. It's currently on the ppg website's front page:

https://www.pgg823.com

VS988

Quote from: JustMePatrick on December 22, 2018, 12:50:38 AM
My video taken on Friday December, 21 2018.

https://youtu.be/6LEkcJopX3M

Video is running 2x original speed. With text exit description as you are approaching.

SM-N950U

Thanks, both of you, for supplying such fine videos.  Too bad the weather didn't cooperate a little better for Patrick's drive-through for more color contrast -- but hey, it's December in Ohio!   


Buck87

Thanks Patrick. Nice to be able to see all the signage. There were a couple small ones I couldn't quite make out, but I think they must have been township limit signs.

I look forward to the northbound video.

hbelkins

Wonder how long before the speed Nazis at OHP are running radar on it?


Government would be tolerable if not for politicians and bureaucrats.

seicer

There were none yesterday on my first drive on it. 17 miles of very light traffic. Even at 70 MPH, I was passed by just 5 vehicles and I only passed by 3 vehicles. Out of curiosity, I did drive out on the old road over Rosemont Hill (the unofficial bypass) and traffic was nearly deserted unlike in years past.

Hot Rod Hootenanny

It's not a video, just me photographing while driving...













The feds won't like ODOT leaving only one through lane for I-73/74.  :sombrero:
Please, don't sue Alex & Andy over what I wrote above

seicer

I don't see a good way of widening the south or north ends to two through lanes in each direction because of the topography. The south end is on a steep grade and any modification would require substantial earth cuts and a completely reworked interchange. The north end is a trumpet interchange with one-lane ramps over railroad tracks.

Beltway

Nice highway, but why such a narrow median?  With the cost of that 42-inch high constant slope concrete median barrier, they probably could have acquired 20 more feet of right-of-way, given the rural area.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

JustMePatrick

Quote from: Beltway on December 27, 2018, 09:06:01 PM
Nice highway, but why such a narrow median?  With the cost of that 42-inch high constant slope concrete median barrier, they probably could have acquired 20 more feet of right-of-way, given the rural area.
Given the amount of blasting it took to cut through those hills I couldn't imagine the additional cost that would have added to just add an additional 20 feet. With the up down of the road with the terrain if the roads aren't properly treated before a winter event there will be problems.

SM-N950U


Beltway

Quote from: JustMePatrick on December 27, 2018, 09:21:29 PM
Quote from: Beltway on December 27, 2018, 09:06:01 PM
Nice highway, but why such a narrow median?  With the cost of that 42-inch high constant slope concrete median barrier, they probably could have acquired 20 more feet of right-of-way, given the rural area.
Given the amount of blasting it took to cut through those hills I couldn't imagine the additional cost that would have added to just add an additional 20 feet. With the up down of the road with the terrain if the roads aren't properly treated before a winter event there will be problems.

Modern blasting explosives are much less expensive than older designs.

"Bulk explosives range from simple ANFO (ammonium nitrate + fuel oil) to straight emulsions and include a wide variety of ANFO/emulsion blends - each with unique performance/cost characteristics."

Drill, place charges, fire.  From there normal excavation techniques (scraper pans, frontend loaders, dump trucks) are utilized to move the soil and rocks to where they need to be moved.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

seicer

Even still, the 17-mile bypass is one of the most expensive rural highways Ohio has constructed and was built with of cost constraints. As the state couldn't afford the project, it was let to the state's first private-public partnership which incurs higher costs for the state in the long term with the potential trade-off of economic development.

The route's cost was higher because of the mountainous route that was selected, versus the other options that were routed through farmland. There are significant grades and very deep cuts, much more than I would have expected. It's similar to the Knobs of southern Kentucky or the Shawnee region of Ohio - very steep hillsides and deep valleys. The median, while narrow, is nothing out of the ordinary for mountain highways - 4' left shoulders, 12' right shoulders.

Beltway

Plenty of mountain highways have medians of 40 to 60 feet, sometimes wider.

As a private-public partnership, is this highway tolled?
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

Buck87

Quote from: Beltway on December 27, 2018, 10:59:29 PM
As a private-public partnership, is this highway tolled?

No, it's not tolled.

triplemultiplex

Some nice roadside geology on display with all those rock cuts.
Late Devonian to Carboniferous age sedimentary layers.

The high overpass in the middle of that one cut is pretty cool.
"That's just like... your opinion, man."

PiedmontHwys

All I have to say for the Portsmouth Bypass project is.......

Thank goodness it was finished before the New Year came rolling in! Typically I am someone who doesn't care about public-private partnerships, and would not dare to consider it, with examples of the I-69 project in Bloomington, and the I-77 toll mess right here in NC screwing up, but what I have to say is this: The P3 in the Portsmouth Bypass project, was done right, no complicated history whatsoever!

So therefore, the Portsmouth Bypass is an example of a public-private partnership, done right! Take notes, INDOT and NCDOT, learn from the 823 P3, and do better.

This has been my opinion. Now back to the Bypass.
Hoping and waiting for the day the Winston-Salem Northern Beltway gets finished on time.

JustMePatrick

Quote from: triplemultiplex on January 01, 2019, 01:00:37 PM
Some nice roadside geology on display with all those rock cuts.
Late Devonian to Carboniferous age sedimentary layers.

The high overpass in the middle of that one cut is pretty cool.

I found a link to this study that was done during construction by geologists.  Rather fascinating.  I was surprised by own son's reaction when he saw the rock layers.  I really couldn't as I had to focus on driving, lol.

http://geosurvey.ohiodnr.gov/extra-news-archives/2018-articles/portsmouth-seismites

qguy

Quote from: JustMePatrick on January 03, 2019, 01:07:55 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on January 01, 2019, 01:00:37 PM
Some nice roadside geology on display with all those rock cuts.
Late Devonian to Carboniferous age sedimentary layers.

The high overpass in the middle of that one cut is pretty cool.
I found a link to this study that was done during construction by geologists.  Rather fascinating.  I was surprised by own son's reaction when he saw the rock layers.  I really couldn't as I had to focus on driving, lol.

http://geosurvey.ohiodnr.gov/extra-news-archives/2018-articles/portsmouth-seismites

"...Cowbell member of the Borden formation..."

Sounds like a satire.  :-D

Beltway

#266
Quote from: PiedmontHwys on January 01, 2019, 03:02:21 PM
So therefore, the Portsmouth Bypass is an example of a public-private partnership, done right! Take notes, INDOT and NCDOT, learn from the 823 P3, and do better.

There are no tolls.  Was there any private capital included in the funding for the project?  Rhetorical question because without tolls there wouldn't be a mechanism for the private investors to recoup their investment.

A public-private partnership in this case is really only a master-contracting process whereby the constructors propose to the state to build an entire highway thereby bypassing the traditional competitive bid process.  While there can be major economic efficiencies in this process for a very large highway project, it is a P3 in name only.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

qguy

Quote from: Beltway on January 03, 2019, 10:03:02 PM
Quote from: PiedmontHwys on January 01, 2019, 03:02:21 PM
So therefore, the Portsmouth Bypass is an example of a public-private partnership, done right! Take notes, INDOT and NCDOT, learn from the 823 P3, and do better.
There are no tolls.  Was there any private capital included in the funding for the project?  Rhetorical question because without tolls there wouldn't be a mechanism for the private investors to recoup their investment.

A public-private partnership in this case is really only a master-contracting process whereby the constructors propose to the state to build an entire highway thereby bypassing the traditional competitive bid process.  While there can be major economic efficiencies in this process for a very large highway project, it is a P3 in name only.

That's a good point. Would it be more accurate to call it a design-build contract?

seicer

From https://www.transportation.gov/tifia/financed-projects/portsmouth-bypass:

"The Portsmouth Bypass is a $634 million, 16-mile, four-lane, limited-access highway around the City of Portsmouth in Scioto County in South Central Ohio. The project will also provide a largely access controlled alternative to I-77 and I-75 for motorists making trips between southern Ohio and the Columbus region, saving over 70 miles on some trips. The project is being delivered as an availability payment design-build-finance-operate-maintain (DBFOM) concession. The term of the concession is expected to extend for 35 years.

The project is the first availability payment P3 concession in Ohio.  According to the project, public benefits include: correcting deficiencies in the existing system, improving regional mobility, enhancing the region's competitive advantage for businesses, and decreasing crash rates.  Designated as State Route 823, the project will improve regional mobility to provide travel time savings of up to 16 minutes per trip compared to the current route. Given the rural nature of the County, this project and subsequent development could also have a material impact on the County's high unemployment rates.  The State estimates the financial structure, including the TIFIA loan, accelerates delivery of the project and benefits by 8 years."

Funding:

"Appalachian Development Highway System Funds: $97M
Other Federal & State Funds: $28M
Private Activity Bonds (PABs): $227M
PABs Premium: $24M
TIFIA Loan: $209.3M
Equity: $49M"


Beltway

Quote from: seicer on January 04, 2019, 08:19:41 AM
Funding:
"Appalachian Development Highway System Funds: $97M
Other Federal & State Funds: $28M
Private Activity Bonds (PABs): $227M
PABs Premium: $24M
TIFIA Loan: $209.3M
Equity: $49M"

Those are all public sector funding mechanisms, the naming of the PABs notwithstanding.  There are no tolls on the highway to service the debt, so it will come out of governmental appropriations.

A "design-build-finance-operate-maintain (DBFOM) concession" is merely a master contract that covers the entire life cycle of the new highway, and calling it a "concession" blurs the lines about financing.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

hbelkins

Quote from: seicer on January 04, 2019, 08:19:41 AM
The project will also provide a largely access controlled alternative to I-77 and I-75 for motorists making trips between southern Ohio and the Columbus region, saving over 70 miles on some trips.

Not sure I get how this is going to be an alternate to I-77 or I-75 for anyone in this region. No one in Huntington/Ashland/Ironton/Portsmouth is going to go to Cincinnati to hit I-75, or Charleston to hit I-77, to go to Columbus. You're going to use US 23. Now, I can see drivers in the Teas Valley area using US 52, the new bypass, and US 23 instead of US 35 until the four-laning is done in West Virginia.

I already use US 23 if I'm heading to the Columbus area. I'd much rather use KY 7, I-64, KY 67, and US 23, as opposed to going west to Lexington and then having to deal with Cincinnati traffic. And that includes taking existing US 23 through downtown Portsmouth. Now, unless I needed to stop in Portsmouth, I'd probably cross the river at the Greenup Dam and use the new route.


Government would be tolerable if not for politicians and bureaucrats.

SP Cook

Quote from: seicer on January 04, 2019, 08:19:41 AM


The project will also provide a largely access controlled alternative to I-77 and I-75 for motorists making trips between southern Ohio and the Columbus region...

Huh? 

I cannot think of any part of "southern Ohio" (which is undefined) for which either I-75 or I-77 would be a logical road to take on a trip to Columbus.  Before or after this project.

Buck87

Quote from: SP Cook on January 04, 2019, 03:43:12 PM
Quote from: seicer on January 04, 2019, 08:19:41 AM
The project will also provide a largely access controlled alternative to I-77 and I-75 for motorists making trips between southern Ohio and the Columbus region...
Huh? 
I cannot think of any part of "southern Ohio" (which is undefined) for which either I-75 or I-77 would be a logical road to take on a trip to Columbus.  Before or after this project.

Yeah, and the parts of Southern Ohio that would actually use 823 as part of their route to Columbus (Lawrence County and Eastern Scioto County) would make the absolute least sense for using 75 or 77. Whoever wrote that either didn't do much map research or isn't very good at logic.

The Ghostbuster

SR-823 is marked on Google Maps, even if it doesn't show up on the terrain physically.

Buck87

Quote from: The Ghostbuster on January 04, 2019, 05:09:40 PM
SR-823 is marked on Google Maps, even if it doesn't show up on the terrain physically.

Though for whatever reason it's still not labelled as 823 on the map, or even in directions. Just did a test for the directions and it just says things like "Keep right", "Keep Left" or "Continue Straight" without any road name reference.



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