New Jersey

[famartin]

Drove on 280 for the first time in a while today. It looks like they're doing some bridge work in spot places west of Pleasant Valley Way all the way out to 80. Looks like this will include new overhead structures at Exits 6 and 5A-B. Which means they're finally replacing the overhead structure that came down at 5B (if you look at the GSV, you can see the posts, but the truss has been gone for I think 10ish years?). Will also be curious if the new signs use the same interesting pullthru that they installed at Eisenhower Pkwy when that was replaced two years ago. WB uses Parsippany and includes a "to 80" shield, and the EB uses Kearney as a control city (which makes zero sense to me since Newark is more important and 280 passes through the heart of it) with 95/Turnpike shields.

Then this one westbound in West Orange leaves a blank space.
https://goo.gl/maps/f8ouUb9BLkBAsqi99

That's a pretty old sign. I'm sure it won't look like that whenever they get around to replacing it.

[storm2k]

The Rt 206 Doctors Way to Valley Rd project has officially kicked off.

Good to see these projects moving forward, even though I'd love to see 4 lane divided from the Somerville Circle to Princeton or maybe further to 95.

You of course mean 295 

Not going to happen so long as Montgomery and Princeton have anything to say about it.

I know it's a pipe dream, but it would fit the patterns. Same way that 202 should be 4 lane freeway from Doylestown to 287 in Bridgewater but will never happen either.

[roadman65]

I still wonder why West Orange is signed on CR 577 south? If Downtown West Orange was that way it would make sense, but it isn't. Everything on CR 577 on both sides of I-280 is West Orange including the modern strip malls.

[TheGrassGuy]

What'll happen to old US 206 after the bypass is finished?

[famartin]

What'll happen to old US 206 after the bypass is finished?

I've been told it'll be transferred to local control. Not sure if that means county or municipal.

[roadman65]

What'll happen to old US 206 after the bypass is finished?

I've been told it'll be transferred to local control. Not sure if that means county or municipal.

Long time coming for it to be widened. Too bad the rest of Route 31 can't be widened as it's needed. Ditto for US 9 from Manahawkin to Lakewood where US 9 is overflowing in busy Ocean County.

[Alps]

What'll happen to old US 206 after the bypass is finished?

I've been told it'll be transferred to local control. Not sure if that means county or municipal.

Local = municipal.

[famartin]

What'll happen to old US 206 after the bypass is finished?

I've been told it'll be transferred to local control. Not sure if that means county or municipal.

Local = municipal.

Sorry, was applying a non-NJ mindset to it (in much of America, there is no municipal, so local=county)

[TheGrassGuy]

What'll happen to old US 206 after the bypass is finished?

I've been told it'll be transferred to local control. Not sure if that means county or municipal.

Local = municipal.

Sorry, was applying a non-NJ mindset to it (in much of America, there is no municipal, so local=county)

Not in NJ, I think?

[famartin]

What'll happen to old US 206 after the bypass is finished?

I've been told it'll be transferred to local control. Not sure if that means county or municipal.

Local = municipal.

Sorry, was applying a non-NJ mindset to it (in much of America, there is no municipal, so local=county)

Not in NJ, I think?

Haven't lived in NJ in almost 18 years, but a frequent visitor.

[storm2k]

What'll happen to old US 206 after the bypass is finished?

I've been told it'll be transferred to local control. Not sure if that means county or municipal.

Local = municipal.

Sorry, was applying a non-NJ mindset to it (in much of America, there is no municipal, so local=county)

Not in NJ, I think?

Nope, in NJ you have both county maintained roads (get the pentagon shields) and municipal maintained roads. Old 206 will revert to Hillsborough, though I won't be surprised if future money allocations for municipal grants for maintenance go up a bit for them to account for their need to maintain the road, because it will still be an important road for Hillsborough's "Main Street" development goals.

[roadman65]

https://goo.gl/maps/WqmLMqDcxttXS2m1A
Really. Denville is the next city?  Obviously someone forgot about Dover in between.

[storm2k]

https://goo.gl/maps/WqmLMqDcxttXS2m1A
Really. Denville is the next city?  Obviously someone forgot about Dover in between.

Honestly, none of those really make sense. Dover, Parsippany, and Wayne rate more.

[famartin]

https://goo.gl/maps/WqmLMqDcxttXS2m1A
Really. Denville is the next city?  Obviously someone forgot about Dover in between.

Honestly, none of those really make sense. Dover, Parsippany, and Wayne rate more.

How about Passaic? 

NJ has the odd situation where every municipality is legally equal and home rule is strong. Thus with limited annexations throughout history (and none at all in a long time), none of its cities and towns could ever become "large" like in other states. Otherwise, the city of Newark would probably include the Oranges, Irvington, Belleville and maybe Kearny/Harrison/Elizabeth. Trenton would include Ewing, Lawrence and Hamilton, Atlantic City would include the entire island and possibly parts of the mainland, and Camden would be all of northern Camden County.

[Rothman]

Debates over control cities should be kept out of these main threads.  These threads should be for history, plans or ongoing/upcoming projects.

[roadman65]

https://goo.gl/maps/WqmLMqDcxttXS2m1A
Really. Denville is the next city?  Obviously someone forgot about Dover in between.

Honestly, none of those really make sense. Dover, Parsippany, and Wayne rate more.

How about Passaic? 

NJ has the odd situation where every municipality is legally equal and home rule is strong. Thus with limited annexations throughout history (and none at all in a long time), none of its cities and towns could ever become "large" like in other states. Otherwise, the city of Newark would probably include the Oranges, Irvington, Belleville and maybe Kearny/Harrison/Elizabeth. Trenton would include Ewing, Lawrence and Hamilton, Atlantic City would include the entire island and possibly parts of the mainland, and Camden would be all of northern Camden County.

But Dover the route goes through its business district proper. Denville it bypasses and has a small district. I am not saying it shouldn't be used, but after Dover though. Signs should list the next city followed by one or two main controls. 

They do get it right in Denville using Clifton and New York as New York is it's endpoint is there on the GWB, however Clifton too is one of many others they can use, but was chosen as it's where Route 3 branches off and at one point before the population explosion it stood out like Clinton did on Route 22 before Branchburg and Readington exploded west of Somerville. Now it makes sense more to use Allentown on I-78 over Clinton since that is the next city of major interest and being the core of the larger Lehigh Valley Region.

South Florida runs into the same situation on both I-95 and US 1 as from Jupiter to Homestead is all incorporated cities and no open county areas in between.  However West Palm and Miami are stand outs among them to be used on I -95.

[famartin]

https://goo.gl/maps/WqmLMqDcxttXS2m1A
Really. Denville is the next city?  Obviously someone forgot about Dover in between.

Honestly, none of those really make sense. Dover, Parsippany, and Wayne rate more.

How about Passaic? 

NJ has the odd situation where every municipality is legally equal and home rule is strong. Thus with limited annexations throughout history (and none at all in a long time), none of its cities and towns could ever become "large" like in other states. Otherwise, the city of Newark would probably include the Oranges, Irvington, Belleville and maybe Kearny/Harrison/Elizabeth. Trenton would include Ewing, Lawrence and Hamilton, Atlantic City would include the entire island and possibly parts of the mainland, and Camden would be all of northern Camden County.

But Dover the route goes through its business district proper. Denville it bypasses and has a small district. I am not saying it shouldn't be used, but after Dover though. Signs should list the next city followed by one or two main controls. 

They do get it right in Denville using Clifton and New York as New York is it's endpoint is there on the GWB, however Clifton too is one of many others they can use, but was chosen as it's where Route 3 branches off and at one point before the population explosion it stood out like Clinton did on Route 22 before Branchburg and Readington exploded west of Somerville. Now it makes sense more to use Allentown on I-78 over Clinton since that is the next city of major interest and being the core of the larger Lehigh Valley Region.

South Florida runs into the same situation on both I-95 and US 1 as from Jupiter to Homestead is all incorporated cities and no open county areas in between.  However West Palm and Miami are stand outs among them to be used on I -95.

There should be some sort of rationale behind what cities to use. I-95/I-80 being major through routes, the major cities should only be used. US1/US46 being relegated to service roads, they should have much more local destinations listed. Perhaps either some sort of average "time" to the destinations, or just cities that one is most likely to use the route to reach.  That suggests that using New York on 46 in Denville isn't a great idea since most people will jump onto 80 at the first opportunity (though I did drive 46 end-to-end last year, just for fun and photography).

[Alps]

Debates over control cities should be kept out of these main threads.  These threads should be for history, plans or ongoing/upcoming projects.

Hi, moderator here. If you want more specific discussion, create a more specific thread. Otherwise, anything on topic to NJ is fair game!

[Rothman]

Debates over control cities should be kept out of these main threads.  These threads should be for history, plans or ongoing/upcoming projects.

Hi, moderator here. If you want more specific discussion, create a more specific thread. Otherwise, anything on topic to NJ is fair game!

Yeah, them's the current rules. 

The problem is that all this speculation about control cities -- not based on any current plans -- is really diluting the usefulness of the threads.  It's really fictional territory.

[storm2k]

Drove down 206 through Hillsborough to see the latest with the bypass and the widening. Prep work is already well underway for the Valley Rd to Doctors Way project. Decent amount of tree clearing and grading underway already. Bypass is still closed but the work looks pretty much done. The timeline to open it was supposed to be this spring, so hopefully we'll see it open soon.

One interesting thing I saw was at the southern end of the bypass, at the traffic light, the ramp onto the bypass has "Freeway Entrance" signs, which I don't recall seeing pretty much anywhere in New Jersey. Thought that was interesting:

[TheGrassGuy]

Drove down 206 through Hillsborough to see the latest with the bypass and the widening. Prep work is already well underway for the Valley Rd to Doctors Way project. Decent amount of tree clearing and grading underway already. Bypass is still closed but the work looks pretty much done. The timeline to open it was supposed to be this spring, so hopefully we'll see it open soon.

One interesting thing I saw was at the southern end of the bypass, at the traffic light, the ramp onto the bypass has "Freeway Entrance" signs, which I don't recall seeing pretty much anywhere in New Jersey. Thought that was interesting:

"Freeway"

[famartin]

Woah, yeah never seen that in NJ before. Of course such a rare thing would not quite be used appropriately 

[Alps]

Drove down 206 through Hillsborough to see the latest with the bypass and the widening. Prep work is already well underway for the Valley Rd to Doctors Way project. Decent amount of tree clearing and grading underway already. Bypass is still closed but the work looks pretty much done. The timeline to open it was supposed to be this spring, so hopefully we'll see it open soon.

One interesting thing I saw was at the southern end of the bypass, at the traffic light, the ramp onto the bypass has "Freeway Entrance" signs, which I don't recall seeing pretty much anywhere in New Jersey. Thought that was interesting:

Very interesting, since it's NOT A FREEWAY. Not there the last time I drove past, which really wasn't all that long ago. I haven't seen an opening date yet.

[bzakharin]

Doubly odd because the term "freeway" has no traction in NJ, and entrance signs are for toll roads. The only reference to freeways in NJ signage I remember seeing is "freeway ends" at the southern terminus of NJ 55. https://www.google.com/maps/@39.3445694,-74.9969318,3a,75y,160.63h,93.01t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sVhYg25SrWHzxoCHYqsRohw!2e0!5s20180801T000000!7i13312!8i6656

[famartin]

Doubly odd because the term "freeway" has no traction in NJ, and entrance signs are for toll roads. The only reference to freeways in NJ signage I remember seeing is "freeway ends" at the southern terminus of NJ 55. https://www.google.com/maps/@39.3445694,-74.9969318,3a,75y,160.63h,93.01t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sVhYg25SrWHzxoCHYqsRohw!2e0!5s20180801T000000!7i13312!8i6656

There are others...
Route 15
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.056281,-74.6402725,3a,75y,329.48h,90.59t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sye2x_14s_QXUmn_twXDyHg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Route 18
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.1812819,-74.0736598,3a,75y,172.11h,78.62t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCe-q61Q-I4VyB5hvrYKBVg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192