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Started by mgk920, October 10, 2024, 11:22:25 AM

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mgk920

With the recent major storms in the southeastern USA, how are the major venues (NFL Buccaneers home field, NASCAR-Daytona, etc) doing?  Other thoughts on the overall subject?

Mike


gonealookin

#1
We'll have to see how much damage there is to Tropicana Field in St. Petersburg.

From an MLB.com article:

QuoteAccording to the Rays' media guide, the Trop "features the world's largest cable-supported domed roof," which is "made of six acres of translucent, Teflon-coated fiberglass and supports itself with 180 miles of cables connected by struts." The tilted roof was built to withstand winds up to 115 mph, according to the club. Potential water damage could be a concern, as the Trop does not have a drainage system for the field.

The Rays and the county are committed to building a new ballpark on the same property adjacent to existing Tropicana Field.  Construction is supposed to start this winter with completion scheduled prior to the start of the 2028 baseball season.

So how much money would you spend to repair a building that's going to be torn down after three more baseball seasons anyway?  It sounds expensive just to replace that fiberglass roof, but if there's no damage other than the shredding of the fabric it might be worth it.  If there's any further structural damage to the building I would think repairs would be cost-prohibitive.

The A's are scheduled to share a minor-league ballpark with a AAA team for the next three years, so if it's just too dang expensive to repair Tropicana Field, there's a possibility.  Edit to add:  There are a number of major league spring training ballparks in the immediate Tampa Bay area, and while the stifling heat and humidity plus all the rain delays would be a pain, Florida State League minor league teams have played there for decades and the Marlins played outdoors for about 20 seasons, so depending on the estimates to repair Tropicana Field maybe that's the answer that doesn't require the Rays to leave the area.

NWI_Irish96

Quote from: gonealookin on October 10, 2024, 01:02:02 PMWe'll have to see how much damage there is to Tropicana Field in St. Petersburg.

From an MLB.com article:

QuoteAccording to the Rays' media guide, the Trop "features the world's largest cable-supported domed roof," which is "made of six acres of translucent, Teflon-coated fiberglass and supports itself with 180 miles of cables connected by struts." The tilted roof was built to withstand winds up to 115 mph, according to the club. Potential water damage could be a concern, as the Trop does not have a drainage system for the field.

The Rays and the county are committed to building a new ballpark on the same property adjacent to existing Tropicana Field.  Construction is supposed to start this winter with completion scheduled prior to the start of the 2028 baseball season.

So how much money would you spend to repair a building that's going to be torn down after three more baseball seasons anyway?  It sounds expensive just to replace that fiberglass roof, but if there's no damage other than the shredding of the fabric it might be worth it.  If there's any further structural damage to the building I would think repairs would be cost-prohibitive.

The A's are scheduled to share a minor-league ballpark with a AAA team for the next three years, so if it's just too dang expensive to repair Tropicana Field, there's a possibility.  Edit to add:  There are a number of major league spring training ballparks in the immediate Tampa Bay area, and while the stifling heat and humidity plus all the rain delays would be a pain, Florida State League minor league teams have played there for decades and the Marlins played outdoors for about 20 seasons, so depending on the estimates to repair Tropicana Field maybe that's the answer that doesn't require the Rays to leave the area.

Yankees ST site in Tampa has the highest capacity at 11,000. Tampa hods ST in Port Charlotte but their stadium only seats 7,000. Maybe adding some temporary capacity to one of these places would be cheaper than repairing the Trop.

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epzik8

Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on October 10, 2024, 02:37:52 PM
Quote from: gonealookin on October 10, 2024, 01:02:02 PMWe'll have to see how much damage there is to Tropicana Field in St. Petersburg.

From an MLB.com article:

QuoteAccording to the Rays' media guide, the Trop "features the world's largest cable-supported domed roof," which is "made of six acres of translucent, Teflon-coated fiberglass and supports itself with 180 miles of cables connected by struts." The tilted roof was built to withstand winds up to 115 mph, according to the club. Potential water damage could be a concern, as the Trop does not have a drainage system for the field.

The Rays and the county are committed to building a new ballpark on the same property adjacent to existing Tropicana Field.  Construction is supposed to start this winter with completion scheduled prior to the start of the 2028 baseball season.

So how much money would you spend to repair a building that's going to be torn down after three more baseball seasons anyway?  It sounds expensive just to replace that fiberglass roof, but if there's no damage other than the shredding of the fabric it might be worth it.  If there's any further structural damage to the building I would think repairs would be cost-prohibitive.

The A's are scheduled to share a minor-league ballpark with a AAA team for the next three years, so if it's just too dang expensive to repair Tropicana Field, there's a possibility.  Edit to add:  There are a number of major league spring training ballparks in the immediate Tampa Bay area, and while the stifling heat and humidity plus all the rain delays would be a pain, Florida State League minor league teams have played there for decades and the Marlins played outdoors for about 20 seasons, so depending on the estimates to repair Tropicana Field maybe that's the answer that doesn't require the Rays to leave the area.

Yankees ST site in Tampa has the highest capacity at 11,000. Tampa hods ST in Port Charlotte but their stadium only seats 7,000. Maybe adding some temporary capacity to one of these places would be cheaper than repairing the Trop.



Port Charlotte would be convenient for my dad and stepmom who live right over in Englewood. Probably a far-fetched possibility in real life though.
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gonealookin

Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on October 10, 2024, 02:37:52 PMYankees ST site in Tampa has the highest capacity at 11,000. Tampa hods ST in Port Charlotte but their stadium only seats 7,000. Maybe adding some temporary capacity to one of these places would be cheaper than repairing the Trop.

I'd agree that Steinbrenner Field in Tampa is the most obvious choice.  It's literally right across the street from the Tampa Bay Bucs' football stadium.  The issue is that the Tampa Tarpons of the Florida State League use Steinbrenner Field as their home park during the summer.  The Tarpons could possibly be paid to relocate to some other local ballpark for the next 3 seasons.  As to both the Tarpons and the Rays playing there, for one thing schedules have already been released for 2025 and there would have to be some major adjustments to eliminate conflicts.  Plus in the case of Sacramento, for the A's and the River Cats to both play in that ballpark, they are having to replace the natural grass field with artificial turf because they don't think natural grass could hold up with games being played on it basically every single day for 6 months.

thspfc

Tropicana Field being totaled would be the best thing to happen to the sport of baseball since Shohei was born.

gonealookin

Quote from: thspfc on October 10, 2024, 11:26:42 PMTropicana Field being totaled would be the best thing to happen to the sport of baseball since Shohei was born.

You've been driving an AMC Pacer all these years, and somehow it has 180,000 miles on it.

You were really hoping to hit 200,000 miles but the thing has been leaking oil, leaking transmission fluid.  You've tried to fix it with duct tape and what not, but it hasn't gone well.  And last night you smashed it into the wall in the parking garage.

Maybe it's finally time to suck it up and buy that shiny new Kia Soul you've had your eyes on for so long.

hobsini2

Quote from: thspfc on October 10, 2024, 11:26:42 PMTropicana Field being totaled would be the best thing to happen to the sport of baseball since Shohei was born.
It is completely sereal to me how bad the Trop looks considering I was in that ballpark on July 31st.
I knew it. I'm surrounded by assholes. Keep firing, assholes! - Dark Helmet (Spaceballs)

SectorZ

Quote from: gonealookin on October 11, 2024, 02:24:51 AM
Quote from: thspfc on October 10, 2024, 11:26:42 PMTropicana Field being totaled would be the best thing to happen to the sport of baseball since Shohei was born.

You've been driving an AMC Pacer all these years, and somehow it has 180,000 miles on it.

You were really hoping to hit 200,000 miles but the thing has been leaking oil, leaking transmission fluid.  You've tried to fix it with duct tape and what not, but it hasn't gone well.  And last night you smashed it into the wall in the parking garage.

Maybe it's finally time to suck it up and buy that shiny new Kia Soul you've had your eyes on for so long.

Good comparison, outside of that the Kia Soul is on layaway and taking delivery in 2028.

formulanone

Quote from: SectorZ on October 11, 2024, 02:44:35 PM
Quote from: gonealookin on October 11, 2024, 02:24:51 AM
Quote from: thspfc on October 10, 2024, 11:26:42 PMTropicana Field being totaled would be the best thing to happen to the sport of baseball since Shohei was born.

You've been driving an AMC Pacer all these years, and somehow it has 180,000 miles on it.

You were really hoping to hit 200,000 miles but the thing has been leaking oil, leaking transmission fluid.  You've tried to fix it with duct tape and what not, but it hasn't gone well.  And last night you smashed it into the wall in the parking garage.

Maybe it's finally time to suck it up and buy that shiny new Kia Soul you've had your eyes on for so long.

Good comparison, outside of that the Kia Soul is on layaway and taking delivery in 2028.
Also, someone else will pay for the Soul, so they won't have to sell theirs...

Henry

Quote from: thspfc on October 10, 2024, 11:26:42 PMTropicana Field being totaled would be the best thing to happen to the sport of baseball since Shohei was born.
Funny thing, I thought the Metrodome looked awful during that blizzard from many years back from which its roof caved in, but the Trop now looks even worse. Considering that the new ballpark will be built next to it soon, it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world to move into a minor-league stadium, like the A's are in Sacramento.
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jeffandnicole

Quote from: hobsini2 on October 11, 2024, 01:19:04 PM
Quote from: thspfc on October 10, 2024, 11:26:42 PMTropicana Field being totaled would be the best thing to happen to the sport of baseball since Shohei was born.
It is completely sereal to me how bad the Trop looks considering I was in that ballpark on July 31st.


I think the damage was mostly confined to the roof.  Once they take away the strips of roof hanging from the rafters, it would probably look like a regular ballpark.  They could probably play ball next week if they had to there.

Big John

Quote from: jeffandnicole on October 11, 2024, 11:08:50 PM
Quote from: hobsini2 on October 11, 2024, 01:19:04 PM
Quote from: thspfc on October 10, 2024, 11:26:42 PMTropicana Field being totaled would be the best thing to happen to the sport of baseball since Shohei was born.
It is completely sereal to me how bad the Trop looks considering I was in that ballpark on July 31st.


I think the damage was mostly confined to the roof.  Once they take away the strips of roof hanging from the rafters, it would probably look like a regular ballpark.  They could probably play ball next week if they had to there.
I believe it has no drainage system as it was designed as an indoor stadium.

mgk920

Am I correct in assuming that the Grapefruit league will be operating normally this coming late winter?

Mike

SP Cook

- I have no idea what is involved with repairing such a roof, but clearly this is not an off-the-shelf item.  Having a roof up and running by Opening Day 25 seems impossible.

- The place was designed as an indoor stadium.  Just removing the roof and using it as an outdoor stadium won't work.  No drainage, etc.

- The most logical thing would be to either use one of the spring training parks, the largest being the Yankees which is actually in Tampa.  Most have a number of auxiliary fields around them and can easily accommodate temporary bleachers and such to get to 20 or 25 K seats.  Another possibility is the Braves old spring training site inside Disney World, which is still there unused, thus no worries about what to do with a displaced minor league team and integrated into the Disney traffic system, whereas many spring training venues are designed for the 2 to 5 K that might go to a game on a weekend, and are not positioned well for larger crowds in terms of parking and road networks.

- They have to fix the roof.  You cannot play 4 years in a minor league park, and the reason they have a roof in the first place is the number of rain outs would be unacceptable anywhere in that region.  None of the spring training parks have roofs, and you cannot have that many rain out for four long years.


dvferyance

Quote from: gonealookin on October 10, 2024, 01:02:02 PMWe'll have to see how much damage there is to Tropicana Field in St. Petersburg.

From an MLB.com article:

QuoteAccording to the Rays' media guide, the Trop "features the world's largest cable-supported domed roof," which is "made of six acres of translucent, Teflon-coated fiberglass and supports itself with 180 miles of cables connected by struts." The tilted roof was built to withstand winds up to 115 mph, according to the club. Potential water damage could be a concern, as the Trop does not have a drainage system for the field.

The Rays and the county are committed to building a new ballpark on the same property adjacent to existing Tropicana Field.  Construction is supposed to start this winter with completion scheduled prior to the start of the 2028 baseball season.

So how much money would you spend to repair a building that's going to be torn down after three more baseball seasons anyway?  It sounds expensive just to replace that fiberglass roof, but if there's no damage other than the shredding of the fabric it might be worth it.  If there's any further structural damage to the building I would think repairs would be cost-prohibitive.

The A's are scheduled to share a minor-league ballpark with a AAA team for the next three years, so if it's just too dang expensive to repair Tropicana Field, there's a possibility.  Edit to add:  There are a number of major league spring training ballparks in the immediate Tampa Bay area, and while the stifling heat and humidity plus all the rain delays would be a pain, Florida State League minor league teams have played there for decades and the Marlins played outdoors for about 20 seasons, so depending on the estimates to repair Tropicana Field maybe that's the answer that doesn't require the Rays to leave the area.
They still replaced the roof on the Metrodome after the 2010 collapse even though it only had 3 seasons left. I don't know who contributed to the cost of it.

gonealookin

Quote from: mgk920 on October 12, 2024, 10:43:12 AMAm I correct in assuming that the Grapefruit league will be operating normally this coming late winter?

Mike

I haven't seen any reports of significant damage to any of the spring training facilities.  Fences and awnings down, that sort of stuff, sure.  With Ian, the Rays' spring training facilities in Port Charlotte were damaged severely enough that they couldn't use it the following spring, but this time there doesn't appear to be anything like that.  A few Twitter reports:

https://twitter.com/TBTimes_Rays/status/1844913592422068672

https://twitter.com/BrendanKutyNJ/status/1844450729765052437

https://twitter.com/AlexJStumpf/status/1844460100586700899

SEWIGuy

Quote from: Henry on October 11, 2024, 10:26:22 PM
Quote from: thspfc on October 10, 2024, 11:26:42 PMTropicana Field being totaled would be the best thing to happen to the sport of baseball since Shohei was born.
Funny thing, I thought the Metrodome looked awful during that blizzard from many years back from which its roof caved in, but the Trop now looks even worse. Considering that the new ballpark will be built next to it soon, it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world to move into a minor-league stadium, like the A's are in Sacramento.

The As playing in Sacramento is a terrible idea.  Should not double down on that unless it's an extremely short term solution.

gonealookin

The Trop is owned by the City of St. Petersburg.  Insurance should cover a significant part of the cost of replacing that roof.  Then you have to ask, how much public money would be required to cover the rest?  Disaster relief funds will be available but there are going to be all sorts of other demands on that money.

Then the city has to look at how much tax revenue is lost if the Rays were to play elsewhere until the new ballpark is completed, and what the impact would be on local businesses that rely on Rays games to generate a lot of their business.

Replacing the roof even for only the three seasons (or maybe less if the work couldn't be finished by the opening of the 2025 baseball season) is the ideal solution but it's not obvious that it's the right decision for the local taxpayers.

I do think the right decision for the Rays' fans would be to keep them in the Tampa Bay metro area rather than shipping them off to some AAA ballpark elsewhere (the Rays' own AAA affiliate plays in Durham, NC).  The constant rain delays would be a real pain in the butt which they would just have to deal with.

ZLoth

Quote from: mgk920 on October 10, 2024, 11:22:25 AMWith the recent major storms in the southeastern USA, how are the major venues (NFL Buccaneers home field, NASCAR-Daytona, etc) doing?  Other thoughts on the overall subject?

Back in 2005 and Hurricane Katrina, the New Orleans Superdome was used as a "refuge of last resort", and was rendered unusable for the 2005 NFL season. The Saints' scheduled 2005 home opener against the New York Giants was moved to Giants Stadium. The remainder of their 2005 home games were split between the Alamodome in San Antonio, Texas, and LSU's Tiger Stadium in Baton Rouge, and the Superdome was back in use by the 2006 season.


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mgk920

Eight now I am leaning towards seeing the Rays repairing the roof at Tropicana Field so they don't have the constant rainouts that they otherwise would have to endure in their home central Florida area.  I also cannot envision them playing several seasons of home games in a Minor League ballpark in a far removed metro area.

Mike

Road Hog

As long as there's no other structural damage, repairing the roof is a huge job but a fairly straightforward one.

I'm more worried about interior water damage. Things inside the stadium like upholstered seats aren't meant for the outdoors, and I worry that mold could get in under the turf if there's no drainage. So it's more than just the roof.

SEWIGuy

Quote from: ZLoth on October 13, 2024, 07:23:42 AM
Quote from: mgk920 on October 10, 2024, 11:22:25 AMWith the recent major storms in the southeastern USA, how are the major venues (NFL Buccaneers home field, NASCAR-Daytona, etc) doing?  Other thoughts on the overall subject?

Back in 2005 and Hurricane Katrina, the New Orleans Superdome was used as a "refuge of last resort", and was rendered unusable for the 2005 NFL season. The Saints' scheduled 2005 home opener against the New York Giants was moved to Giants Stadium. The remainder of their 2005 home games were split between the Alamodome in San Antonio, Texas, and LSU's Tiger Stadium in Baton Rouge, and the Superdome was back in use by the 2006 season.



It's relatively easy to relocate an NFL football team. There are compatible stadiums all over the place. Not so with baseball.

hobsini2

Quote from: SP Cook on October 12, 2024, 11:21:51 AM- I have no idea what is involved with repairing such a roof, but clearly this is not an off-the-shelf item.  Having a roof up and running by Opening Day 25 seems impossible.

- The place was designed as an indoor stadium.  Just removing the roof and using it as an outdoor stadium won't work.  No drainage, etc.

- The most logical thing would be to either use one of the spring training parks, the largest being the Yankees which is actually in Tampa.  Most have a number of auxiliary fields around them and can easily accommodate temporary bleachers and such to get to 20 or 25 K seats.  Another possibility is the Braves old spring training site inside Disney World, which is still there unused, thus no worries about what to do with a displaced minor league team and integrated into the Disney traffic system, whereas many spring training venues are designed for the 2 to 5 K that might go to a game on a weekend, and are not positioned well for larger crowds in terms of parking and road networks.

- They have to fix the roof.  You cannot play 4 years in a minor league park, and the reason they have a roof in the first place is the number of rain outs would be unacceptable anywhere in that region.  None of the spring training parks have roofs, and you cannot have that many rain out for four long years.


The Superdome was fixed in about 3 months. The Metrodome was fixed in 2 months. So timewise, it is possible. The question is with the Rays wanting a new ballpark, would they invest in a new roof for a park they may only be in for a few more seasons?
I knew it. I'm surrounded by assholes. Keep firing, assholes! - Dark Helmet (Spaceballs)



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