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Author Topic: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom  (Read 187164 times)

kurumi

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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1250 on: October 13, 2021, 11:13:52 PM »

when traveling from west to east, as far as TV and radio call signals go, you have already crossed the Mississippi River into WXXX territory when you reach New Orleans by 76 miles.  To that fact, traveling even further east of New Orleans, because of the Florida Parishes, you leave Louisiana into Mississippi by crossing the Pearl River.
Actually, WXXX is a lot further from New Orleans than that, but in the wrong direction...  :bigass:

I've been as far west as KYW and as far east as WTAW
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1251 on: October 13, 2021, 11:51:45 PM »

when traveling from west to east, as far as TV and radio call signals go, you have already crossed the Mississippi River into WXXX territory when you reach New Orleans by 76 miles.  To that fact, traveling even further east of New Orleans, because of the Florida Parishes, you leave Louisiana into Mississippi by crossing the Pearl River.
Actually, WXXX is a lot further from New Orleans than that, but in the wrong direction...  :bigass:

I've been as far west as KYW and as far east as WTAW

KYW is in Philly. You say you're in CA, so you've been further west than that.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1252 on: October 14, 2021, 12:38:53 AM »

when traveling from west to east, as far as TV and radio call signals go, you have already crossed the Mississippi River into WXXX territory when you reach New Orleans by 76 miles.  To that fact, traveling even further east of New Orleans, because of the Florida Parishes, you leave Louisiana into Mississippi by crossing the Pearl River.
Actually, WXXX is a lot further from New Orleans than that, but in the wrong direction...  :bigass:

I've been as far west as KYW and as far east as WTAW

KYW is in Philly. You say you're in CA, so you've been further west than that.

I think the joke is that KYW is farther east than you'd expect and that WTAW is farther west.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1253 on: October 14, 2021, 10:17:42 AM »

when traveling from west to east, as far as TV and radio call signals go, you have already crossed the Mississippi River into WXXX territory when you reach New Orleans by 76 miles.  To that fact, traveling even further east of New Orleans, because of the Florida Parishes, you leave Louisiana into Mississippi by crossing the Pearl River.
Actually, WXXX is a lot further from New Orleans than that, but in the wrong direction...  :bigass:

I've been as far west as KYW and as far east as WTAW

KYW is in Philly. You say you're in CA, so you've been further west than that.

I think the joke is that KYW is farther east than you'd expect and that WTAW is farther west.

WOAI
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1254 on: October 14, 2021, 11:19:46 AM »

For those of you who are on social media, I'd recommend following the Amazing Maps and Terrible Maps accounts on Facebook and Twitter. They're probably run by the same person, as one will often retweet/share the other's content.

One I saw the other day was interesting. The entire continent of South America lies east of Michigan.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1255 on: October 14, 2021, 10:36:42 PM »


Baltimore is not in Baltimore County.


When looking up transportation maps in Georgia, I found to great confusion that Macon is not in Macon County.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1256 on: October 15, 2021, 12:51:18 PM »


Baltimore is not in Baltimore County.


When looking up transportation maps in Georgia, I found to great confusion that Macon is not in Macon County.

And Richmond, Virginia isn't in Richmond County.

But Baltimore isn't in Baltimore County because it's an independent city that is surrounded by Baltimore County.
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ethanhopkin14

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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1257 on: October 15, 2021, 01:33:44 PM »


Baltimore is not in Baltimore County.


When looking up transportation maps in Georgia, I found to great confusion that Macon is not in Macon County.

And Richmond, Virginia isn't in Richmond County.

But Baltimore isn't in Baltimore County because it's an independent city that is surrounded by Baltimore County.

Yeah, that's the point.  In Texas there numerous cities that are not in their namesake counties, but it's a naming issue which is a different case.  The Baltimore thing is one of the few instances that I can think of where the namesake county is just outside the city because the city was basically carved out of the county.  Different than a consolidated city/county like St. Louis and Denver. 
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1258 on: October 15, 2021, 02:03:44 PM »


Baltimore is not in Baltimore County.


When looking up transportation maps in Georgia, I found to great confusion that Macon is not in Macon County.

And Richmond, Virginia isn't in Richmond County.

But Baltimore isn't in Baltimore County because it's an independent city that is surrounded by Baltimore County.

Yeah, that's the point.  In Texas there numerous cities that are not in their namesake counties, but it's a naming issue which is a different case.  The Baltimore thing is one of the few instances that I can think of where the namesake county is just outside the city because the city was basically carved out of the county.  Different than a consolidated city/county like St. Louis and Denver.

Fairfax and Roanoke are other examples of this in Virginia.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1259 on: October 15, 2021, 03:46:23 PM »


Baltimore is not in Baltimore County.


When looking up transportation maps in Georgia, I found to great confusion that Macon is not in Macon County.

And Richmond, Virginia isn't in Richmond County.

But Baltimore isn't in Baltimore County because it's an independent city that is surrounded by Baltimore County.

Yeah, that's the point.  In Texas there numerous cities that are not in their namesake counties, but it's a naming issue which is a different case.  The Baltimore thing is one of the few instances that I can think of where the namesake county is just outside the city because the city was basically carved out of the county.  Different than a consolidated city/county like St. Louis and Denver.

Fairfax and Roanoke are other examples of this in Virginia.

Yes I knew about them, but wasn't sure if it was limited to just them so I said one of the few. 

Also, there is no such town as Arlington, VA.  It is an area in Arlington County, VA.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1260 on: October 15, 2021, 04:04:08 PM »


Baltimore is not in Baltimore County.


When looking up transportation maps in Georgia, I found to great confusion that Macon is not in Macon County.

And Richmond, Virginia isn't in Richmond County.

But Baltimore isn't in Baltimore County because it's an independent city that is surrounded by Baltimore County.

Yeah, that's the point.  In Texas there numerous cities that are not in their namesake counties, but it's a naming issue which is a different case.  The Baltimore thing is one of the few instances that I can think of where the namesake county is just outside the city because the city was basically carved out of the county.  Different than a consolidated city/county like St. Louis and Denver.

Fairfax and Roanoke are other examples of this in Virginia.

Yes I knew about them, but wasn't sure if it was limited to just them so I said one of the few. 

Also, there is no such town as Arlington, VA.  It is an area in Arlington County, VA.

Arlington is perfect for this thread. When you first move to the DC area, you think that Arlington, VA MUST be a city. It's not, everyone in Arlington County has an "Arlington, VA" mailing address.
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TXtoNJ

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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1261 on: October 15, 2021, 04:26:45 PM »


Baltimore is not in Baltimore County.


When looking up transportation maps in Georgia, I found to great confusion that Macon is not in Macon County.

And Richmond, Virginia isn't in Richmond County.

But Baltimore isn't in Baltimore County because it's an independent city that is surrounded by Baltimore County.

Yeah, that's the point.  In Texas there numerous cities that are not in their namesake counties, but it's a naming issue which is a different case.  The Baltimore thing is one of the few instances that I can think of where the namesake county is just outside the city because the city was basically carved out of the county.  Different than a consolidated city/county like St. Louis and Denver.

Fairfax and Roanoke are other examples of this in Virginia.

Yes I knew about them, but wasn't sure if it was limited to just them so I said one of the few. 

Also, there is no such town as Arlington, VA.  It is an area in Arlington County, VA.

Arlington is perfect for this thread. When you first move to the DC area, you think that Arlington, VA MUST be a city. It's not, everyone in Arlington County has an "Arlington, VA" mailing address.

Makes sense, since Arlington was once just a plantation within Alexandria County, DC.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1262 on: October 16, 2021, 12:30:26 AM »


Baltimore is not in Baltimore County.


When looking up transportation maps in Georgia, I found to great confusion that Macon is not in Macon County.

And Richmond, Virginia isn't in Richmond County.

But Baltimore isn't in Baltimore County because it's an independent city that is surrounded by Baltimore County.

Yeah, that's the point.  In Texas there numerous cities that are not in their namesake counties, but it's a naming issue which is a different case.  The Baltimore thing is one of the few instances that I can think of where the namesake county is just outside the city because the city was basically carved out of the county.  Different than a consolidated city/county like St. Louis and Denver.

St Louis is exactly the same thing as Baltimore. In 1877 the city of St Louis seceded from St Louis County to become an independent city.

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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1263 on: October 17, 2021, 10:16:47 AM »


Baltimore is not in Baltimore County.


When looking up transportation maps in Georgia, I found to great confusion that Macon is not in Macon County.

And Richmond, Virginia isn't in Richmond County.

But Baltimore isn't in Baltimore County because it's an independent city that is surrounded by Baltimore County.

Yeah, that's the point.  In Texas there numerous cities that are not in their namesake counties, but it's a naming issue which is a different case.  The Baltimore thing is one of the few instances that I can think of where the namesake county is just outside the city because the city was basically carved out of the county.  Different than a consolidated city/county like St. Louis and Denver.

St Louis is exactly the same thing as Baltimore. In 1877 the city of St Louis seceded from St Louis County to become an independent city.
Denver has two independent cities (Denver and Broomfield, the latter becoming independent in 2001), but none seceded from a county of the same name.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1264 on: October 17, 2021, 10:47:33 AM »


Baltimore is not in Baltimore County.


When looking up transportation maps in Georgia, I found to great confusion that Macon is not in Macon County.

And Richmond, Virginia isn't in Richmond County.

But Baltimore isn't in Baltimore County because it's an independent city that is surrounded by Baltimore County.

Yeah, that's the point.  In Texas there numerous cities that are not in their namesake counties, but it's a naming issue which is a different case.  The Baltimore thing is one of the few instances that I can think of where the namesake county is just outside the city because the city was basically carved out of the county.  Different than a consolidated city/county like St. Louis and Denver.

Fairfax and Roanoke are other examples of this in Virginia.

Also Norfolk was created this way, as was the former City of Bedford.

The weird one is the short-lived City of Nanesmond.   When Nanesmond County consolidated to an independent city, it took the county name as the city name.  But not long after the City of Nanesmond was renamed the City of Suffolk.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1265 on: October 17, 2021, 01:07:01 PM »

Denver has two independent cities (Denver and Broomfield, the latter becoming independent in 2001), but none seceded from a county of the same name.

Which makes them consolidated city-counties, not independent cities.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1266 on: October 17, 2021, 04:59:22 PM »

Denver has two independent cities (Denver and Broomfield, the latter becoming independent in 2001), but none seceded from a county of the same name.

Which makes them consolidated city-counties, not independent cities.

Denver and Broomfield are weird though because while they're technically consolidated city-counties, they exist because the city seceded from pre-existing counties to form their own counties. San Francisco and maybe a couple more also fit that category. That's different from a lot of other consolidated city-counties, which mostly seem to exist because a pre-existing county and a pre-existing city within that county merged their governments together. But in all of those cases a county still legally exists, which is what distinguishes them from independent cities that legally are not part of any county.

Only three independent cities exist in the US outside of Virginia: they are Baltimore, St Louis, and Carson City. It looks like Carson City used to be a consolidated city-county until Ormsby County, which the city had been consolidated with, was itself dissolved.

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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1267 on: October 17, 2021, 05:16:03 PM »

Denver has two independent cities (Denver and Broomfield, the latter becoming independent in 2001), but none seceded from a county of the same name.

Which makes them consolidated city-counties, not independent cities.

Denver and Broomfield are weird though because while they're technically consolidated city-counties, they exist because the city seceded from pre-existing counties to form their own counties. San Francisco and maybe a couple more also fit that category. That's different from a lot of other consolidated city-counties, which mostly seem to exist because a pre-existing county and a pre-existing city within that county merged their governments together. But in all of those cases a county still legally exists, which is what distinguishes them from independent cities that legally are not part of any county.

Only three independent cities exist in the US outside of Virginia: they are Baltimore, St Louis, and Carson City. It looks like Carson City used to be a consolidated city-county until Ormsby County, which the city had been consolidated with, was itself dissolved.

Yes, it's more accurate to say they're neither independent cities, nor consolidated city-counties. Examples of the latter would be places like Indianapolis/Marion County, Nashville/Davidson County and Athens/Clarke County. Places like Denver, San Francisco and Philadelphia might be better described as "coterminous city-counties".

The dividing line can be blurry, however. In which category would NYC fall, for example?
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1268 on: October 17, 2021, 05:38:40 PM »

Alaska has over 5x the amount of coastline as Florida does.

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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1269 on: October 18, 2021, 10:48:54 AM »

Keeping with the topic of consolidated city-counties, it always strikes me as odd that Butte, MT is consolidated with Silver Bow County. There's no obvious reason for them to be consolidated, as Butte's urbanized area doesn't stretch throughout.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1270 on: October 18, 2021, 01:19:29 PM »

Keeping with the topic of consolidated city-counties, it always strikes me as odd that Butte, MT is consolidated with Silver Bow County. There's no obvious reason for them to be consolidated, as Butte's urbanized area doesn't stretch throughout.

In most of these types of city-county consolidations (or in the case of Virginia, collapse of an independent city status), the city experiences a significant decline in population, economy and/or tax base such that the city cannot afford to provide sufficient police and emergency services.  In many states, the counties are obligated by law to provide to such services. 

Looks like in the case of Butte, the city economically suffered from the closure of the underground copper mines during the 1950s and 1960s.  The concept of consolidating Butte into Silver Bow County had been attempted several times previously, once resulting in a famous court case where the Montana Supreme Court approved such an arrangement in 1924.  It failed then and also in 1931.  More recently, it failed in 1961 but finally achieved consolidation in 1977.  I wonder if Montana doesn't require counties to provide emergency services when a city can no longer afford them.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1271 on: October 18, 2021, 09:45:53 PM »

In most of these types of city-county consolidations (or in the case of Virginia, collapse of an independent city status), the city experiences a significant decline in population, economy and/or tax base such that the city cannot afford to provide sufficient police and emergency services.  In many states, the counties are obligated by law to provide to such services. 

That's strange; I always assumed it was the opposite (i.e. city does well enough that there's no need for the county any longer). There's discussions about folding Oklahoma County into Oklahoma City every so often because so much of Oklahoma County is in the limits of either OKC or one of its suburbs that maintaining the county government is perceived as being a waste of money.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1272 on: October 18, 2021, 09:52:49 PM »

Reminds me of the numerous times St Louis City and County attempted to consolidate, and failed...
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1273 on: October 18, 2021, 10:05:58 PM »

A while ago there was also a proposal to consolidate the City of Syracuse and Onondaga County.
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Re: This is true? - Geographic oddities that defy conventional wisdom
« Reply #1274 on: October 18, 2021, 10:49:03 PM »

A while ago there was also a proposal to consolidate the City of Syracuse and Onondaga County.
Transportation management-wise, OCDOT and the City are quite different.  Probably wouldn't have ended well.
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