Which exit tab design does your state use, and do you have a favorite/preferred option?
My favorite type is this one that's large in size with a thicker border between the main panel and tab, rounded corners at an angle less than the main display. States that I have seen use this are Ohio, Missouri and Minnesota, with examples from all three below. Let me know if there are any other states that uses this style. Ohio also have a version with Clearview digits in early installations of this exit tab style, before switching back to Highway Gothic. This looks like a more recent design, as all three states used smaller exit tabs in the past not that long ago.
Ohio:
(https://i.imgur.com/9MZeX5f.png)
Missouri:
(https://i.imgur.com/Ol3Fo3F.png)
Minnesota:
(https://i.imgur.com/zQ2R4oM.png)
My second favorite is what Michigan, Wisconsin and sometimes Indiana uses, with sharp corners connecting to the main panel. Michigan's version is in Clearview, while Indiana and Wisconsin uses Highway Gothic.
Michigan:
(https://i.imgur.com/WAsFymZ.png)
Wisconsin:
(https://i.imgur.com/NG7u7VX.png)
Indiana:
(https://i.imgur.com/XLeOXKZ.png)
For the centered and full-length categories, I prefer Washington's for both types. Imo centered exit numbers work best on a full length tab.
(https://i.imgur.com/B4YHO17.png)
I like the ones in New Jersey, Virginia, and Maryland where they are attached to the sign and not off.
I'm pretty sure NCDOT likes to have them cut off because incase they want to put new exit numbers without having to replace the whole sign.
https://www.google.com/maps/@36.1438128,-79.7350731,3a,37y,220.75h,102.41t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sBX4HNaTHkpBF8WALPlU1VA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
I like the oval ones though. They look nicer looking compared to the other states which hey are square. North Carolina has a few square ones (Typically at older freeways not overhead) with most to all being removed. Like this (https://www.google.com/maps/@35.9917951,-77.8736115,3a,75y,226.83h,91.99t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1seJ0UQJtXadluUubVm5rn9w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en) one. It will prolly get removed too and will probably just say Raleigh and Rocky Mount in the future.
I prefer Highway Gothic over Clearview btw.
My favorite option is to make the exit number as big and prominent as possible.
This: https://goo.gl/maps/AkKbGPjBkNMB6nR48 is way better than this: https://goo.gl/maps/1vY94Peg2ThqeKSQ9 , for reasons having nothing to do with Clearview.
Not bothering with the superfluous EXIT legend.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.asphaltplanet.ca%2FON%2Fhwy_401_images%2F401_dv_33_east_Jun11.jpg&hash=ec4397a94ff10fce5feb822441fd73578c68562c)
In their demountable-copy days, Kansas used to use a style that had a thin border on all sides but the bottom.
(https://i.imgur.com/Utva59U.jpg)
Oklahoma has always had the exit tab have its own border, much like the Ohio examples.
In California, the exit tabs are inset in the main sign.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7f/California_exit_number_example.jpg)
Here's IDOT, still using full-length tabs even on newer installations like this one on the Kennedy inbound.
(https://i.imgur.com/NsCbiPK.png)
Edit: Forgot to mention that IDOT used smaller, centered exit tabs on older signs outside of Chicagoland. Only D1 has always used the full-length tabs.
And here's ISTHA, who only actively started using exit numbers within the last decade, and unfortunately still doesn't post tabs on all the signs. There's are fairly vanilla tabs which I like more than IDOT's or even WisDOT's.
(https://i.imgur.com/QuvoE7n.png)
Finally, what may be the biggest (and in my opinion, ugliest) exit tab from IDOT.
(https://i.imgur.com/PY3Qbve.png)
All these screenshots are ripped from Street View.
A couple other design characteristics that I think are unique to Michigan:
(1) On newer signs for left exits, the LEFT is a separate tab above the exit number tab (not integrated in the exit number tab), and both tabs have the same width. This puts the LEFT off-center in its tab, but I actually like the look.
(2) On cantilevers and gantries, a full-width exit tab is used to increase the sign height if the sign otherwise wouldn't cover the front face of the structure. It's an aesthetic thing.
Here's an example of both on one gantry in Southfield:
(https://i.imgur.com/kbDb46d.jpg)
Quote from: stridentweasel on March 27, 2021, 12:41:35 AM
My favorite option is to make the exit number as big and prominent as possible.
This: https://goo.gl/maps/AkKbGPjBkNMB6nR48 is way better than this: https://goo.gl/maps/1vY94Peg2ThqeKSQ9 , for reasons having nothing to do with Clearview.
I found some older signs exit tabs, and a lot of them are much smaller than what I had in the OP. Like this is Ohio's older style: a small square exit tab above the main panel.
(https://i.imgur.com/nrBci9u.png)
And this was Indiana's old default exit tab style, with rounded corners at the same angle as the main panel. Looks like your bad Kansas example, which I both dislike
(https://i.imgur.com/zKcQoUU.png)
Did the 2009 MUTCD require exit tabs to be larger, since all of the larger exit tab installations I've seen came a couple of years after it, and the smaller sized ones were before it?
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 27, 2021, 10:53:51 AM
Did the 2009 MUTCD require exit tabs to be larger, since all of the larger exit tab installations I've seen came a couple of years after it, and the smaller sized ones were before it?
If I had to guess, I'd say yes. If you see the examples in the latest edition, they feature a lot more green space, particularly on the sides of the text. North Carolina's newer exit tabs are essentially 2009 vanilla.
Quote from: tolbs17 on March 27, 2021, 12:38:59 AM
I like the ones in New Jersey, Virginia, and Maryland where they are attached to the sign and not off.
I'm pretty sure NCDOT likes to have them cut off because incase they want to put new exit numbers without having to replace the whole sign.
https://www.google.com/maps/@36.1438128,-79.7350731,3a,37y,220.75h,102.41t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sBX4HNaTHkpBF8WALPlU1VA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
I like the oval ones though. They look nicer looking compared to the other states which hey are square. North Carolina has a few square ones (Typically at older freeways not overhead) with most to all being removed. Like this (https://www.google.com/maps/@35.9917951,-77.8736115,3a,75y,226.83h,91.99t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1seJ0UQJtXadluUubVm5rn9w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en) one. It will prolly get removed too and will probably just say Raleigh and Rocky Mount in the future.
I prefer Highway Gothic over Clearview btw.
From what I see, Virginia have exit tabs both attached and separate from the main panel. They mostly use square corners. Though that's what the MUTCD uses in their example diagrams.
Though I dislike Maryland's, for the main reason of the large spacing between the word 'EXIT' and the exit number.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on March 27, 2021, 10:17:10 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/PY3Qbve.png)
Slightly wider even is this:
(https://i.imgur.com/uOqaAIi.png)
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on March 27, 2021, 11:05:46 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on March 27, 2021, 10:17:10 AM
[img snipped]
Slightly wider even is this:
[img snipped]
IDOT needs to learn from Washington (https://www.google.com/maps/@47.6466697,-122.3228364,3a,71.2y,178.59h,116.24t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1smStL7umeQUF-Pb7cgokfbw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) for Left Exit plaques with a full length exit tab.
The reason that exit tabs are larger today than they were in the past, in most/all states, is because of MUTCD standards. About 2 decades ago the standard was 24 inches, but at that time the standard was increased to 30 inches which it is today. (And it wasn't done as part of an overall MUTCD revision either, I think it was done shortly after the 2003 MUTCD)
And I disagree with centered legend on full length tabs. They're aligned to one side for a reason.
I like the NC and FL style of exit tab, the sign corners are rounded and the tab is actually separated. For tabs that are not separate from the main sign, I like designs which omit the bottom border of the tab and don't round the corner where the main sign and tab meet, such as AZ.
The CA design was an interesting solution to add exit numbers to existing signs, but it's been almost 2 decades now, there should be sign standards that allow for actual tabs.
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 27, 2021, 11:27:50 PM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on March 27, 2021, 11:05:46 PM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on March 27, 2021, 10:17:10 AM
[img snipped]
Slightly wider even is this:
[img snipped]
IDOT needs to learn from Washington (https://www.google.com/maps/@47.6466697,-122.3228364,3a,71.2y,178.59h,116.24t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1smStL7umeQUF-Pb7cgokfbw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) for Left Exit plaques with a full length exit tab.
Both of them are noncompliant with the FHWA, considering that the FHWA disapproves of California doing a similar thing to avoid a "tab".
Quote from: JoePCool14 on March 27, 2021, 10:17:10 AM
Here's IDOT, still using full-length tabs even on newer installations like this one on the Kennedy inbound.
(https://i.imgur.com/NsCbiPK.png)
Edit: Forgot to mention that IDOT used smaller, centered exit tabs on older signs outside of Chicagoland. Only D1 has always used the full-length tabs.
I really like the look of IDOT's older centered tabs, though they do the full length tabs well, at least all the way down I-55 to St. Louis.
Quote from: ran4sh on March 27, 2021, 11:30:41 PM
The reason that exit tabs are larger today than they were in the past, in most/all states, is because of MUTCD standards. About 2 decades ago the standard was 24 inches, but at that time the standard was increased to 30 inches which it is today. (And it wasn't done as part of an overall MUTCD revision either, I think it was done shortly after the 2003 MUTCD)
And I disagree with centered legend on full length tabs. They're aligned to one side for a reason.
I like the NC and FL style of exit tab, the sign corners are rounded and the tab is actually separated. For tabs that are not separate from the main sign, I like designs which omit the bottom border of the tab and don't round the corner where the main sign and tab meet, such as AZ.
The CA design was an interesting solution to add exit numbers to existing signs, but it's been almost 2 decades now, there should be sign standards that allow for actual tabs.
For the 24'' to 30'' increase, is that the vertical length of the exit tabs, or the horizontal? I assume is vertical based on the context of the thread, but I don't know how large BGS signs really are as I only see them overhead or on the side in a vehicle, so they may look smaller to me than they actually are.
I just took a look at Arizona's exit tabs, and they look similar to my examples above of Indiana and Wisconsin's. So agree with you on that for good looking exit tabs.
Quote from: wanderer2575 link=topquote author=wanderer2575 link=topic=28889.msg2589066#msg2589066 date=1616856739]
A couple other design characteristics that I think are unique to Michigan:
(1) On newer signs for left exits, the LEFT is a separate tab above the exit number tab (not integrated in the exit number tab), and both tabs have the same width. This puts the LEFT off-center in its tab, but I actually like the look.
Massachusetts does the same thing.
For left exit tabs, I actually prefer the 'LEFT' tab or banner off center from the 'EXIT' word below it. I see it centered most of the time, but that creates a large blank space left of the 'EXIT' word compared to a right side exit tab, which is a minor annoyance for me.
Or if centering is that important, a smaller 'LEFT' plaque could be used. There will still be a larger green space on the left of the word 'EXIT' compared to one without the 'LEFT' plaque, but it's less noticeable. Compare the two examples between Minnesota and Ohio (both use the same exit tab design as stated in the op) below. I prefer the former.
(https://i.imgur.com/8DYJTAK.png)
(https://i.imgur.com/Ket1thc.png)
Quote from: cbeach40 on March 27, 2021, 12:50:45 AM
Not bothering with the superfluous EXIT legend.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.asphaltplanet.ca%2FON%2Fhwy_401_images%2F401_dv_33_east_Jun11.jpg&hash=ec4397a94ff10fce5feb822441fd73578c68562c)
I believe Ontario advanced signs like these only have an "EXIT" square when the lanes are going to exit. In this case, you can see that they made a new lane for the exit, and thus there would be no need for the "EXIT" square.
Quote from: andrepoiy on March 29, 2021, 08:34:16 PM
Quote from: cbeach40 on March 27, 2021, 12:50:45 AM
Not bothering with the superfluous EXIT legend.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.asphaltplanet.ca%2FON%2Fhwy_401_images%2F401_dv_33_east_Jun11.jpg&hash=ec4397a94ff10fce5feb822441fd73578c68562c)
I believe Ontario advanced signs like these only have an "EXIT" square when the lanes are going to exit. In this case, you can see that they made a new lane for the exit, and thus there would be no need for the "EXIT" square.
Didn't Ontario removed the 'EXIT' word to satisfy the French speakers in the province?
Also, I'm not sure how common this is state wide, but I took a look at 401 in Toronto, and half of the BGS (or is it called a BBS because it's blue?) either don't have an exit tab, or have a Caltrans style exit tab. Specifically the final overhead (normally non-APL) sign before the ramp split. However, the exit gore signs are consistent with including the exit number.
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 30, 2021, 06:26:17 PM
Quote from: andrepoiy on March 29, 2021, 08:34:16 PM
Quote from: cbeach40 on March 27, 2021, 12:50:45 AM
Not bothering with the superfluous EXIT legend.
*Image redacted since it takes up too much space*
I believe Ontario advanced signs like these only have an "EXIT" square when the lanes are going to exit. In this case, you can see that they made a new lane for the exit, and thus there would be no need for the "EXIT" square.
Didn't Ontario removed the 'EXIT' word to satisfy the French speakers in the province?
Also, I'm not sure how common this is state wide, but I took a look at 401 in Toronto, and half of the BGS (or is it called a BBS because it's blue?) either don't have an exit tab, or have a Caltrans style exit tab. Specifically the final overhead (normally non-APL) sign before the ramp split. However, the exit gore signs are consistent with including the exit number.
No, bilingual "exit boxes" have "EXIT/SORTIE" on them.
Ontario's "final" exit signs are almost always pull-through signs with a yellow tab with arrows pointing down.
(https://i.imgur.com/GARAId5.png)
Californians:
(https://i.imgur.com/0eDzkvY.png)
Quote from: andrepoiy on March 30, 2021, 11:43:52 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 30, 2021, 06:26:17 PM
Quote from: andrepoiy on March 29, 2021, 08:34:16 PM
Quote from: cbeach40 on March 27, 2021, 12:50:45 AM
Not bothering with the superfluous EXIT legend.
*Image redacted since it takes up too much space*
I believe Ontario advanced signs like these only have an "EXIT" square when the lanes are going to exit. In this case, you can see that they made a new lane for the exit, and thus there would be no need for the "EXIT" square.
Didn't Ontario removed the 'EXIT' word to satisfy the French speakers in the province?
Also, I'm not sure how common this is state wide, but I took a look at 401 in Toronto, and half of the BGS (or is it called a BBS because it's blue?) either don't have an exit tab, or have a Caltrans style exit tab. Specifically the final overhead (normally non-APL) sign before the ramp split. However, the exit gore signs are consistent with including the exit number.
No, bilingual "exit boxes" have "EXIT/SORTIE" on them.
Ontario's "final" exit signs are almost always pull-through signs with a yellow tab with arrows pointing down.
(https://i.imgur.com/GARAId5.png)
I believe he was talking about stuff like this (https://www.google.com/maps/@44.6085473,-75.6890859,3a,34.5y,252.16h,88.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s6V_Vj30czLRKOEwow9zj-w!2e0!7i3328!8i1664).
What are some states that still use centered exit tabs as opposed to right-aligned ones? I remember seeing a lot of exit signs with centered tabs on I-35 in southern Minnesota - I'm not sure if that state still uses them for new installations.
Georgia has a mixture of center and right oriented tabs at the moment, with the newer ones being the right oriented (with a change in font).
Quote from: KCRoadFan on March 31, 2021, 11:19:53 PM
What are some states that still use centered exit tabs as opposed to right-aligned ones? I remember seeing a lot of exit signs with centered tabs on I-35 in southern Minnesota - I'm not sure if that state still uses them for new installations.
Washington is the most notable one I can think of. Most others switched to right-aligned ones already.
Quote from: ozarkman417 on March 31, 2021, 11:25:25 PM
Georgia has a mixture of center and right oriented tabs at the moment, with the newer ones being the right oriented (with a change in font).
Georgia's centered "tabs" are the full width of the sign. A Georgia BGS from before 2009 looks somewhat different from one since then:
* Old signs had the full-width exit "tab" with the text centered, new signs have the MUTCD-standard right/left-aligned tab
* Old signs had 20-inch Series C or D legend (as opposed to the standard 16-inch E-modified), new signs use E-modified but are still 20-inch height text
* Old signs, in advance of an exit, had the legend "Exit X mile(s)" for both numbered and unnumbered exits, new signs use the standard legend "X mile(s)" omitting the word "Exit" if the exit is numbered.
(And it is still standard in Georgia to have signs on the same overhead gantry be the same height, but there are plenty of newer installations that have not followed that rule, in addition to single sign replacements that don't.)
Quote from: ran4sh on April 01, 2021, 12:00:04 AM
Georgia's centered "tabs" are the full width of the sign. A Georgia BGS from before 2009 looks somewhat different from one since then:
* Old signs had the full-width exit "tab" with the text centered, new signs have the MUTCD-standard right/left-aligned tab
* Old signs had 20-inch Series C or D legend (as opposed to the standard 16-inch E-modified), new signs use E-modified but are still 20-inch height text
* Old signs, in advance of an exit, had the legend "Exit X mile(s)" for both numbered and unnumbered exits, new signs use the standard legend "X mile(s)" omitting the word "Exit" if the exit is numbered.
So, if I'm following correctly, the sign on the left below is in the older style and the one on the right is in the newer?
(https://i.imgur.com/zzTGnBP.png)
I have to admit that I'm torn about the older Georgia signs. Part of me has never liked the style, but part of me does. The signs, affixed to a single pole, with a single tab, and narrow writing vaguely remind me of a Roman vexillum.
I honestly think the new single-pole concept looks bad with the vanilla exit tab and no gantry lighting. The old way it looked much better. Georgia should just switch to standard breakaway posts.
Well, keep in mind–because the example screenshots don't provide much context–that those are the height of a standard gantry. So it's kind of GDOT's way of having an overhead sign on the cheap.
I found one of those Georgia style tall post mounted signs in Ohio (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.992464,-82.9849655,3a,75y,343.22h,93.31t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1syuPnA-z8it2Jd-xGBCUfzQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192). It actually didn't look too bad to me without the centered exit tab and lighting.
Speaking of centered exit tabs, here's an Ohio example with the newest design (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9439052,-83.0124041,3a,75y,312.7h,94.88t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sRn-WVSitrqkrXYAATgHiEg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192).
Also unrelated to the thread, but I thought diagrammatic BGS signage was discontinued a long time ago. I found a fairly new one in Ohio based on the style of the exit tab. (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0940265,-82.9862877,3a,75y,354.49h,95.6t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sODHuQdGTisv1RmkRNm-frw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) I don't really see the benefit of them over an APL though.
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 04, 2021, 10:45:13 PM
Speaking of centered exit tabs, here's an Ohio example with the newest design (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9439052,-83.0124041,3a,75y,312.7h,94.88t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sRn-WVSitrqkrXYAATgHiEg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192).
The rare example where a centered tab actually makes sense–it's not a left or right exit, but a center one!
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 04, 2021, 10:45:13 PM
Also unrelated to the thread, but I thought diagrammatic BGS signage was discontinued a long time ago. I found a fairly new one in Ohio based on the style of the exit tab. (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0940265,-82.9862877,3a,75y,354.49h,95.6t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sODHuQdGTisv1RmkRNm-frw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) I don't really see the benefit of them over an APL though.
It's proposed to be eliminated in the MUTCD 11e (2021?), but it's still in there as of the 2009 edition.
The benefit of them is to give a fuller picture of a complex interchange with left-side ramps, multiple consecutive option-lane ramps, etc. A right-side split with an option lane is simple enough that an APL can do the job just fine.
Anyone else ever see an exit tab design like this one (https://goo.gl/maps/nEHcPwvtM9DJ6YX6A)?
Quote from: interstatefan990 on April 06, 2021, 05:43:26 PM
Anyone else ever see an exit tab design like this one (https://goo.gl/maps/nEHcPwvtM9DJ6YX6A)?
An exit tab on the gore sign? That's pretty common in older Missouri installs (like the one you linked). Texas uses them too, not sure about other states. Missouri switched from that to the vertical exit got signs (with the exit number between the 'EXIT' and the arrow), and the standard MUTCD exit gore signs for single or double digit exit numbers. One of the most recent installations of the separate exit number tab on the gore signs I can think of is on Phase 1 of MO 364 (exits 12-20), in 2003.
Quote from: interstatefan990 on April 06, 2021, 05:43:26 PM
Anyone else ever see an exit tab design like this one (https://goo.gl/maps/nEHcPwvtM9DJ6YX6A)?
That's the MUTCD standard for how to add exit numbers to gore signs that don't have them. Although some states use that style as their regular standard instead of the MUTCD design. For example, it was common to see Georgia's exit gore signs in that format if the exit number was 3 or 4 digits/characters (a 4 character exit would be a 3 digit number with A/B).
For exit gore signs, which layout is generally preferred by people here, the standard horizontal layout or the stacked vertical layout?
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 06, 2021, 08:46:55 PM
For exit gore signs, which layout is generally preferred by people here, the standard horizontal layout or the stacked vertical layout?
Either layout is fine as long as it's done well. It's good for DOTs to have a decent-looking vertical layout for the times when there's not enough room for the wide version.
Here's what I'd call a decent looking vertical layout, done by a contractor for IDOT. Though they probably could've gone with a standard width one here.
https://goo.gl/maps/Zt4SdzdqfpZq6m6a6
Quote from: JoePCool14 on April 06, 2021, 10:10:53 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 06, 2021, 08:46:55 PM
For exit gore signs, which layout is generally preferred by people here, the standard horizontal layout or the stacked vertical layout?
Either layout is fine as long as it's done well. It's good for DOTs to have a decent-looking vertical layout for the times when there's not enough room for the wide version.
Here's what I'd call a decent looking vertical layout, done by a contractor for IDOT. Though they probably could've gone with a standard width one here.
https://goo.gl/maps/Zt4SdzdqfpZq6m6a6
Here's one of the vertical ones in Columbus that looks decent, comparable to the Illinois one you posted, at I-270 exit 33 (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.080281,-82.9076136,3a,24.5y,164.85h,89.23t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sWXcIq1ZiESZh-45ax-1AqA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192). I picked this one specifically because of the jersey barrier exit gore, which because of its width, is when vertical signs are the most useful. Unlike the rest of Ohio, the Columbus area generally uses the vertical style exit gore signs opposed to the box style the rest of the state mainly uses. Also interesting is that for gore signs not on a jersey barrier, a U-shaped pole (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0647189,-82.996393,3a,28.9y,341.56h,91.34t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1smbQlNt7o7JhJhFmAClmZVw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) is used, which I don't see that often outside of Columbus.
Washington (https://www.google.com/maps/@47.6405989,-122.3223843,3a,36.7y,333.91h,88.24t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sLM_bYbxn5AdPs7QHJmi0Zw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) also mainly uses vertical exit gore signs for two and more digits, and I like the smaller size of theirs for some reason, especially when compared to Missouri and Minnesota's large sized vertical ones.
Wisconsin usually has the 2 line normal sized
EXIT
111 /^
But has this undersized sign atop a jersey barrier: https://goo.gl/maps/B9EfazdH8URXoJGf8
Just changed the thread title now that it looks like we're including gore signage here too.
Quote from: Big John on April 06, 2021, 10:37:22 PM
Wisconsin usually has the 2 line normal sized
EXIT
111 /^
But has this undersized sign atop a jersey barrier: https://goo.gl/maps/B9EfazdH8URXoJGf8
It looks like the shoulders are wide enough to fit '168B-C' in a single line, but if not, they could pull this MoDOT approach by eliminating the dash between the letters (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.7505761,-90.4457493,3a,26.3y,98.67h,93.5t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s--Wc1ad1Fu0KUpdzte3FNg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656) :)
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 06, 2021, 10:48:36 PM
Just changed the thread title now that it looks like we're including gore signage here too.
Quote from: Big John on April 06, 2021, 10:37:22 PM
Wisconsin usually has the 2 line normal sized
EXIT
111 /^
But has this undersized sign atop a jersey barrier: https://goo.gl/maps/B9EfazdH8URXoJGf8
It looks like the shoulders are wide enough to fit '168B-C' in a single line, but if not, they could pull this MoDOT approach by eliminating the dash between the letters (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.7505761,-90.4457493,3a,26.3y,98.67h,93.5t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s--Wc1ad1Fu0KUpdzte3FNg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656) :)
They need a wider sign pane and there is room for it.
As mentioned before, Washington State uses inset exit tabs with centered legends. As far as I know, we are the only state still using centered exit legends. I'm kind of indifferent on the matter. The signs are very clean, to be sure, but it doesn't always work (APLs, diagrammatic signs). So there's a mix of designs across the state.
My personal favorite was Oregon, which used a nearly-squared exit tab slightly raised above the center of the sign (example here (https://goo.gl/maps/jGahX71yLqLcJoMEA)). I still quite like their modern equivalent, which is the same design but justified left/right accordingly, but it's not as pleasing to me at least. Among non-rounded-corner states, it would still be my favorite, even today, with extra points being awarded for the nearly-square design (as opposed to PA with their excessively-round exit tabs).
Among left/right justified exit tabs, probably North Carolina or Florida, as they also used raised exit tabs but they also cut off the excess paneling. New York gets an honorable mention for also aligning the exit tab with the rounding of the main panel, but loses some points for not raising the exit tab.
Eh, IMO the raised tabs look sloppy (I assume you mean like this (https://www.google.com/maps/@35.8338401,-78.3088005,3a,49y,99.18h,91.31t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sYTSKpsisPp1L30P9A3dPyg!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DYTSKpsisPp1L30P9A3dPyg%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D110.01243%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656)).
Quote from: vdeane on April 07, 2021, 12:47:14 PM
Eh, IMO the raised tabs look sloppy (I assume you mean like this (https://www.google.com/maps/@35.8338401,-78.3088005,3a,49y,99.18h,91.31t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sYTSKpsisPp1L30P9A3dPyg!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DYTSKpsisPp1L30P9A3dPyg%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D110.01243%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656)).
Yeah, exactly. Admittedly, I think it looks better when the sign is a bit wider. But to each their own.
Looking at states with rounded corners (NC, FL, formerly VA) the practice was always to raise the exit tabs. Oregon was unique in using non-rounded signs with raised exit tabs.
I've always been a fan of the 1970s practice of NYSDOT for exit gore signs. The gore sign was two lines, but with the word "exit" centered over the number, not in the center of the sign. I found the layout less crowded.
Quote from: jakeroot on April 07, 2021, 01:34:01 PM
Looking at states with rounded corners (NC, FL, formerly VA) the practice was always to raise the exit tabs. Oregon was unique in using non-rounded signs with raised exit tabs.
I'm not sure if you would consider my Minnesota/Missouri/Ohio examples in the op as rounded or not, but they have rounded corners with a smaller radius than the main panel (comparison to Pennsylvania (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.1884853,-80.2429413,3a,75y,278.56h,99.39t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sVjLB3vhzcapuaUPcXCzaTA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192), with exit tabs at same radius as main panel), and are connected to the main panel (you can see a bit of green space on the right side between the rounded corners of the main panel and exit tab).
For me, I prefer that (MN/MO/OH) approach over raising the tabs, as I think it's as part of the BGS as the rest of the sign. Though I also don't really like California's integrated exit tabs either.
Quote from: jakeroot on April 07, 2021, 01:11:23 AM
As mentioned before, Washington State uses inset exit tabs with centered legends. As far as I know, we are the only state still using centered exit legends. I'm kind of indifferent on the matter. The signs are very clean, to be sure, but it doesn't always work (APLs, diagrammatic signs). So there's a mix of designs across the state.
If Washington were to switch to a smaller exit tab for situations like diagrammatic and APL's, I could see them go the Michigan/Wisconsin approach (examples in the op). Similar to the full length ones they use, but smaller in size. Also my second favorite exit tab design.
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 07, 2021, 05:44:07 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on April 07, 2021, 01:34:01 PM
Looking at states with rounded corners (NC, FL, formerly VA) the practice was always to raise the exit tabs. Oregon was unique in using non-rounded signs with raised exit tabs.
I'm not sure if you would consider my Minnesota/Missouri/Ohio examples in the op as rounded or not, but they have rounded corners with a smaller radius than the main panel (comparison to Pennsylvania (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.1884853,-80.2429413,3a,75y,278.56h,99.39t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sVjLB3vhzcapuaUPcXCzaTA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192), with exit tabs at same radius as main panel), and are connected to the main panel (you can see a bit of green space on the right side between the rounded corners of the main panel and exit tab).
For me, I prefer that (MN/MO/OH) approach over raising the tabs, as I think it's as part of the BGS as the rest of the sign. Though I also don't really like California's integrated exit tabs either.
When I say rounded, I mean the physical sign had the edges beyond the white border cut off, so the sign was genuinely round. See
this sign in Florida (https://goo.gl/maps/9jyc4YbHbjrtP8zq6) for an example, or
this sign in North Carolina (https://goo.gl/maps/dFGwFxgGW4cAggXQ8).
Curiously, in doing research for this post, I realized that Florida does
not always raise the exit tabs above the main sign panel, despite using round corners. Most examples of exit signage around MCO Airport, for instance, do not use raised exit tabs, whereas most signs in the Miami area do have raised exit tabs.
Quote from: jakeroot on April 07, 2021, 01:34:01 PM
Looking at states with rounded corners (NC, FL, formerly VA) the practice was always to raise the exit tabs. Oregon was unique in using non-rounded signs with raised exit tabs.
I don't think NY has ever raised the exit tabs and they've had rounded corners since the early 1970s. In fact, NY cuts off the bottom border of the exit panel and when they started doing left or right justified exit tabs, inset them in the width of the radius of the main sign panel.
Quote from: machias on April 07, 2021, 07:57:24 PM
I don't think NY has ever raised the exit tabs and they've had rounded corners since the early 1970s.
It's not the standard, but for some reason it seems to happen sometimes with Thruway signs these days.
https://nysroads.com/photos.php?route=i90&state=NY&file=101_8907.JPG
https://nysroads.com/photos.php?route=i90&state=NY&file=101_7761.JPG
Quote from: machias on April 07, 2021, 07:57:24 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on April 07, 2021, 01:34:01 PM
Looking at states with rounded corners (NC, FL, formerly VA) the practice was always to raise the exit tabs. Oregon was unique in using non-rounded signs with raised exit tabs.
I don't think NY has ever raised the exit tabs and they've had rounded corners since the early 1970s. In fact, NY cuts off the bottom border of the exit panel and when they started doing left or right justified exit tabs, inset them in the width of the radius of the main sign panel.
I was specifically excluding NY from that list because I recognize their unique practice of using a three-sided exit tab slightly off-set from the edge. My list (NC, FL, VA) was referencing those states that use the standard exit tab design.
North Carolina has a couple of these but they are not common. https://www.google.com/maps/@35.6873756,-77.9667921,3a,40.4y,145.77h,105.62t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCvmjurGCLEWugmtEuM7N_A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e1
Quote from: tolbs17 on April 08, 2021, 05:01:06 PM
North Carolina has a couple of these but they are not common. https://www.google.com/maps/@35.6873756,-77.9667921,3a,40.4y,145.77h,105.62t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCvmjurGCLEWugmtEuM7N_A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e1
Northbound I-5 in Vancouver, WA (https://goo.gl/maps/pNeTAm5mPzM1oUi18) has signs identical to this: fully rounded corners, inset exit tab, centered legend. As far as I knew, there were no others like this around the country, as none of the other states that use incremental panels like Washington also used inset exit tabs. So this is very cool!!
Quote from: jakeroot on April 08, 2021, 05:06:14 PM
Quote from: tolbs17 on April 08, 2021, 05:01:06 PM
North Carolina has a couple of these but they are not common. https://www.google.com/maps/@35.6873756,-77.9667921,3a,40.4y,145.77h,105.62t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCvmjurGCLEWugmtEuM7N_A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e1
Northbound I-5 in Vancouver, WA (https://goo.gl/maps/pNeTAm5mPzM1oUi18) has signs identical to this: fully rounded corners, inset exit tab, centered legend. As far as I knew, there were no others like this around the country, as none of the other states that use incremental panels like Washington also used inset exit tabs. So this is very cool!!
The other one is here, and that's all I can find.
https://www.google.com/maps/@35.4346736,-78.065127,3a,36.8y,138.17h,92.69t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sg2mqSXNQVuWQBzOuMaT3bg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e1
This opened in late 2015.
I've been playing with the sign maker site for a bit (which uses the same exit tab style as Wisconsin/Michigan/Indiana for the edge option), and the more I look at it, the more I seem to prefer it over the Ohio/Missouri/Minnesota one. It connects with the main display so well to me, especially on the right side. Also, my opinion here still stands:
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 07, 2021, 05:44:07 PM
If Washington were to switch to a smaller exit tab for situations like diagrammatic and APL's, I could see them go the Michigan/Wisconsin approach (examples in the op). Similar to the full length ones they use, but smaller in size. Also my second favorite exit tab design.
Current full length exit tab:
(https://i.imgur.com/Vxynfcn.png)
Right sided exit tab (note the limitations on the site preventing a top right pointing exit only arrow):
(https://i.imgur.com/16mlb6E.png)
Right sided exit tab (Fictional WA 520 exit numbers from this thread (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=28310.msg2572948#msg2572948))
(https://i.imgur.com/Tia6ygZ.png)
New topic: I'm not sure how common this is, but what are some examples of exit gore signs that are not in the gore? I think they occur the most when the gore is not wide enough for a gore sign, but the more common solution to that is to use a narrower gore sign (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.6087556,-90.4513852,3a,21.6y,186.94h,90.5t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s3w_e9Y019sUdr9pmE_l__g!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) or eliminate the gore sign completely (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.2671459,-84.3555217,3a,31.2y,47.44h,86.04t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sbi4ZM1x5QBIa0VfgNTBViw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192), instead of placing the gore sign on the side of the road instead. One example I found: I-70 exit 222B (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.7997335,-90.6205121,3a,15.7y,111.98h,91.3t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sLGVpjA36nyJL3Pi1z3WS6Q!2e0!7i16384!8i8192).
This sign is fat from the gore point: https://goo.gl/maps/TShgXt7zRAfs4TEv7
Quote from: Big John on April 18, 2021, 01:38:10 PM
This sign is fat from the gore point: https://goo.gl/maps/TShgXt7zRAfs4TEv7
That's pretty unusual. At the actual gore point, there's an Exit 168 B—C sign, since the ramp splits after the gore point. Then Exit 168B departs, and the sign you linked is where exit 168C curves away from the mainline.
California does that these days (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0373947,-118.3053776,3a,48.1y,269.96h,86.68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sehkSy5SKs4FgSobZO6Hygw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192).
NY 17 exit 111 (https://www.google.com/maps/@41.6068637,-74.5653632,3a,49.3y,141.87h,86.1t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sDHEKbpKSBj3yad1Nef9U0g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656)
The Thruway had a couple overhead gore signs (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.7928445,-74.0167086,3a,75y,179.14h,89.95t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sWWq1vgchJHrrMrY22AiIQQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656); one was eliminated after some ramp work. The NJ Turnpike used to use them everywhere (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.3459521,-74.475431,3a,75y,10.85h,96.28t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sqyL9Z0Cf6hfEVrL7ibs6rg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192).
Quote from: vdeane on April 18, 2021, 08:44:56 PM
California does that these days (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0373947,-118.3053776,3a,48.1y,269.96h,86.68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sehkSy5SKs4FgSobZO6Hygw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192).
Kind of wondering if they had a reason to move it back that far. The gore isn't even that narrow, and there was a previous, though smaller, gore sign at the front of it. Even though the new sign is the larger federal standard, I don't think that it needed to be moved back about 300 feet.
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 18, 2021, 08:53:52 PM
Quote from: vdeane on April 18, 2021, 08:44:56 PM
California does that these days (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0373947,-118.3053776,3a,48.1y,269.96h,86.68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sehkSy5SKs4FgSobZO6Hygw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192).
Kind of wondering if they had a reason to move it back that far. The gore isn't even that narrow, and there was a previous, though smaller, gore sign at the front of it. Even though the new sign is the larger federal standard, I don't think that it needed to be moved back about 300 feet.
There's a whole thread about it (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=23237.0) in Pacific Southwest. Short story is Caltrans worker safety regs interacting oddly with federal MUTCD gore sign dimensions and Caltrans gore point designs caused weird shit to happen.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 18, 2021, 09:01:44 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 18, 2021, 08:53:52 PM
Quote from: vdeane on April 18, 2021, 08:44:56 PM
California does that these days (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0373947,-118.3053776,3a,48.1y,269.96h,86.68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sehkSy5SKs4FgSobZO6Hygw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192).
Kind of wondering if they had a reason to move it back that far. The gore isn't even that narrow, and there was a previous, though smaller, gore sign at the front of it. Even though the new sign is the larger federal standard, I don't think that it needed to be moved back about 300 feet.
There's a whole thread about it (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=23237.0) in Pacific Southwest. Short story is Caltrans worker safety regs interacting oddly with federal MUTCD gore sign dimensions and Caltrans gore point designs caused weird shit to happen.
The scene in many cars driving on a CA freeway:
A - driver, B -passenger
A: Which exit should I take?
B: Exit 15
A: OK
A few minutes later...
B: There's a sign for exit 15
A: You mean it's the next exit?
B: No it's the exit we just passed
A:Why didn't you tell me that we were getting close to our exit before we passed it? Now I have to go the next exit and turn back around.
B: I would have told you, but the sign for the exit came up after we had already passed the offramp.
A: How could that be possible?
B: This is La-La-Land. Anything is possible.
:-D
Quote from: Big John on April 18, 2021, 01:38:10 PM
This sign is fat from the gore point: https://goo.gl/maps/TShgXt7zRAfs4TEv7
The arrow on that one is also rather fat.
If you look back at the StreetView, the sign was actually replaced at some point, so I guess the placement was intentional.
CalTrans style gore signs appear elsewhere too: https://goo.gl/maps/G5jG1SNwmX4tm5xC8
Of course misplaced or missing gore signs are usually a non-issue, but brain dead CalTrans still can't figure out how to put an exit tab on a sign. A bunch of exits don't even have gore signs in NJ, but guide signing is close enough to the off ramp that it isn't really needed.
Quote from: NJRoadfan on April 19, 2021, 10:52:14 AM
CalTrans style gore signs appear elsewhere too: https://goo.gl/maps/G5jG1SNwmX4tm5xC8
Vertical gore signs aren't exclusively to Caltrans; a lot of other states use them extensively too. Caltrans just use a smaller size, which is the case with the horizontal one too. The image you sent is a standard vertical gore sign's size.
This will take a bit and is currently WIP, but here's a compilation of common exit tab types I found. All of them are one of the most recent designs for each state. Here's generally the three things I look for to find the most recent exit tabs:
- No sign lighting
- 30'' tab height opposed to the old 24'' height
- Angled arrows inside the yellow 'EXIT ONLY' section
Attached exit tabs, rounded corners, own bottom border:
- Minnesota (https://www.google.com/maps/@44.8623221,-93.2300294,3a,61y,262.28h,104.65t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1siJ_sFyhos_g-jRe01hHbNA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Missouri (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.778956,-90.5151558,3a,26.2y,137.73h,98.02t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sgcrHjrDe2pHZ0e2szkvFYg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Nevada (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.5018003,-119.7823507,3a,35.4y,39.46h,104.44t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sJYgWQgWZ7HaEAXp2um1CgQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Ohio (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.036507,-82.9028957,3a,22.2y,27.26h,101.21t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1snzOP7_xDR2ei8yB2i0hOdQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Pennsylvania (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.1068762,-74.8947079,3a,30.3y,35.49h,106.22t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sg_2BDqEtT8FPiGaEoRmiWw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
Attached exit tabs, square corners, own bottom border:
- Colorado (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.7766656,-104.8788111,3a,15y,96.05h,103.24t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sDyZQNaaJDvvxyDuoLqKcHA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Illinois (ISTHA) (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.0632493,-88.0730037,3a,49y,279.49h,102.33t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sn1s628fhvW4garhUv9Utuw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?shorturl=1)
- Virginia (Clearview digits) (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.9248581,-77.2150882,3a,31.4y,204.43h,101.39t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1scVytCtTBklQe2KHVh4JBuQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
Attached exit tabs, square bottom corners and rounded top corners, share bottom border with main panel:
- Arizona (https://www.google.com/maps/@33.458866,-111.9920658,3a,15y,117.99h,98.76t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sd83fvu3kFZYR6Jc6QLi44Q!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Idaho (https://www.google.com/maps/@43.5893461,-116.27216,3a,30.3y,309.9h,99.55t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sikZbpYrYAafOYKeav1HWcw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Indiana (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9197143,-86.1057516,3a,75y,291.27h,98.45t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s2vyySZ50S_cPmy3-qSlMmA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Maryland (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.127015,-77.2026659,3a,60.7y,148.09h,101.84t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sIziuLTyZCBlZXQrUSAC1yg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Massachusetts (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.4121115,-71.2576618,3a,75y,0.17h,97.44t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sBj2Hdq_KxLS-P93lC30gXw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Michigan (Clearview digits) (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.6514576,-83.2383957,3a,22y,8.05h,96.72t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sqn3QLWlwZdMeuVbKPm0--w!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Tennessee (https://www.google.com/maps/@36.2090807,-86.7762201,3a,23.9y,194.72h,101.82t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sWfzxwoyJCvvDr59NXGZz_g!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Utah (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.4984998,-111.8909177,3a,18y,3.09h,98.74t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sLEgtse0Z3kbC_lgfsn0nJA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Wisconsin (https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0412602,-87.9252667,3a,27.4y,185.45h,107.58t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1shigLpwx8wbyB6TLxGcVS5g!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
Full length attached exit tabs, square bottom corners and round top corners, share bottom border with main panel:
- Illinois (IDOT) (https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9374981,-87.7041857,3a,84y,299.31h,95.77t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1syicQLzvuaXjboYAEZkB2Yg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- Washington (Centered) (https://www.google.com/maps/@47.6081977,-122.187647,3a,53.4y,321.96h,102.68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sjbnIT6VmrJoQJJ6lJy2xOw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
Detached exit tabs, round corners:
-
Detached exit tabs, square corners:
- Florida (https://www.google.com/maps/@28.4044365,-81.4802379,3a,63.4y,32.67h,103.14t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sEArQZjE7zYTBMXD2Un_6sA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
- North Carolina (https://www.google.com/maps/@36.123919,-79.9034716,3a,64y,224.19h,102.65t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s6u6kZxxGMzPQsN2yS9GdGw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656)
- Oregon (https://www.google.com/maps/@45.3791245,-122.753556,3a,28.1y,13.15h,94.74t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s2tyhgUA4RwATFBk9JdJBEA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
If someone can help fill out one or more of the remaining states, that would be helpful.
Quote from: KCRoadFan on March 31, 2021, 11:19:53 PM
What are some states that still use centered exit tabs as opposed to right-aligned ones? I remember seeing a lot of exit signs with centered tabs on I-35 in southern Minnesota - I'm not sure if that state still uses them for new installations.
Responding late, but I've been told MnDOT no longer uses center-justified exit tabs. If you still saw some along I-35, they were most likely signs that have not come up for replacement yet.
New York and South Carolina have exit tabs that, by SkyPesos' classification, could be a category "Attached exit tabs, square bottom corners and rounded top corners, share bottom border with main panel, tab offset from the edge of the main panel (with a rounded border corner on the main panel):"
- New York (Sign actually has rounded corners) https://goo.gl/maps/pM8qrmS5SdQ1jMzu5
- South Carolina (Sign corners are not round and extend outside border) https://goo.gl/maps/QgpG5B48YsQzn6Zf8
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 20, 2021, 02:54:31 PM
This will take a bit and is currently WIP, but here's a compilation of common exit tab types I found.
Here's an example you can use for Illinois (IDOT):
https://goo.gl/maps/3K8mXZJVau1xwSJH9
And here's an example you can use for ISTHA:
https://goo.gl/maps/gkVNjG7R9LYGraZ58
Just to put in my two cents on this topic, I DESPISE full-length exit tabs!!! Their use should be PROHIBITED by the MUTCD, in my no-so-humble opinion.
Quote from: SSR_317 on April 28, 2021, 03:31:22 PM
Just to put in my two cents on this topic, I DESPISE full-length exit tabs!!! Their use should be PROHIBITED by the MUTCD, in my no-so-humble opinion.
Why such a strong opinion on them?
Quote from: NJRoadfan on April 19, 2021, 10:52:14 AM
Of course misplaced or missing gore signs are usually a non-issue, but brain dead CalTrans still can't figure out how to put an exit tab on a sign.
They actually just figured it out, according to new standard plans that someone posted on here recently. The fix needed to allow exit tabs and follow Caltrans's weird wind loading requirements? Adding gusset plates like other states' standard gantries have had for decades.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on April 28, 2021, 03:56:20 PM
Quote from: SSR_317 on April 28, 2021, 03:31:22 PM
Just to put in my two cents on this topic, I DESPISE full-length exit tabs!!! Their use should be PROHIBITED by the MUTCD, in my no-so-humble opinion.
Why such a strong opinion on them?
I'm sure he's convinced that of drivers rely solely on the right or left justification of exit tabs to determine their exit side.
In reality, most drivers know that most exits are on the right unless told otherwise.
In reality, drivers just follow the arrow.
Quote from: kphoger on April 28, 2021, 06:45:48 PM
In reality, drivers just follow the arrow.
Absolutely. Of course there is the whole issue of determining lane choice before an exit (where there are no arrows, except at APLs). But that is usually clear by the horizontal placement of the sign: off to the left? Probably a left exit. Off to the right? Likely a right exit.
There's a lot of ways to tell which exit is a left one:
- Placement of an exit tab
- The side the number is on for a full length non-centered
- The 'LEFT' banner introduced in 2009
- Placement of the whole sign
- Arrow(s)
- A lot of drivers drive with a GPS through unfamiliar areas nowadays anyways.
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 28, 2021, 06:50:21 PM
- A lot of drivers drive with a GPS through unfamiliar areas nowadays anyways.
Don't those often not alert you to a left-side exit until you're nearly at the gore point?
Quote from: kphoger on April 29, 2021, 12:43:25 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 28, 2021, 06:50:21 PM
- A lot of drivers drive with a GPS through unfamiliar areas nowadays anyways.
Don't those often not alert you to a left-side exit until you're nearly at the gore point?
I recall seeing either a left arrow, or "use the left lane to ..."
Quote from: jakeroot on April 29, 2021, 12:52:33 PM
Quote from: kphoger on April 29, 2021, 12:43:25 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 28, 2021, 06:50:21 PM
- A lot of drivers drive with a GPS through unfamiliar areas nowadays anyways.
Don't those often not alert you to a left-side exit until you're nearly at the gore point?
I recall seeing either a left arrow, or "use the left lane to ..."
I just did a dummy search on google maps to a nearby place that uses a left exit. For the visuals, there are 2 left pointing arrows next to the exit number, and the APL display for the exit shows the exit lanes. I think the voice also says "use the left X lanes..."
(https://i.imgur.com/9pmqTjv.jpg)
Cool, thanks. I've never used such a device, so I was curious.
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 30, 2021, 06:26:17 PM
Didn't Ontario removed the 'EXIT' word to satisfy the French speakers in the province?
Also, I'm not sure how common this is state wide, but I took a look at 401 in Toronto, and half of the BGS (or is it called a BBS because it's blue?) either don't have an exit tab, or have a Caltrans style exit tab. Specifically the final overhead (normally non-APL) sign before the ramp split. However, the exit gore signs are consistent with including the exit number.
On the tabs yes, it was removed about thirty or so years ago for bilingualism and for a cleaner design.
Advance signs get an exit tab, exit signs do not. I have mixed feelings on that, there's pros and cons to it.
Quote from: cbeach40 on April 30, 2021, 11:29:30 AM
Quote from: SkyPesos on March 30, 2021, 06:26:17 PM
Didn't Ontario removed the 'EXIT' word to satisfy the French speakers in the province?
Also, I'm not sure how common this is state wide, but I took a look at 401 in Toronto, and half of the BGS (or is it called a BBS because it's blue?) either don't have an exit tab, or have a Caltrans style exit tab. Specifically the final overhead (normally non-APL) sign before the ramp split. However, the exit gore signs are consistent with including the exit number.
On the tabs yes, it was removed about thirty or so years ago for bilingualism and for a cleaner design.
Advance signs get an exit tab, exit signs do not. I have mixed feelings on that, there's pros and cons to it.
I think for the actual exit, having at least the gore sign may be sufficient. But I'm so used to seeing the exit tab overhead at the exit that I hardly ever use that gore sign anyways. Maybe it's more heavily utilized in Ontario. Haven't driven east of Alberta so I couldn't say personally.
What exactly is the pro to omitting the exit tab at the exit, beyond the marginal savings from not having to manufacture and mount it? Seems to me like it's just an inconsistency (and annoying, too, especially when taking photos and the advance sign didn't come out; in most places, you then have a second chance down the road, but not in Ontario!).
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 28, 2021, 06:50:21 PM
There's a lot of ways to tell which exit is a left one:
- Placement of an exit tab
- The side the number is on for a full length non-centered
- The 'LEFT' banner introduced in 2009
- Placement of the whole sign
- Arrow(s)
- A lot of drivers drive with a GPS through unfamiliar areas nowadays anyways.
There are a few states such as CA, NV, that sometimes place one of the advance signs on the left even if the exit is on the right. And in NJ on the NJ Turnpike, under their old signage standards, in the dual-dual section, it was considered sufficient to place one advance sign in the median between the car-only and the car-truck lanes, and that sign applied to both roadways. (Even though the exit would be to the right from each roadway)
I'd say that exit numbers aren't really taken seriously by Ontario, at least in the Toronto area.
Highway 427 has no exit numbers (despite the southern portion of it being the third busiest in North America) and is only getting them after the new extension opens very soon.
Highway 409 also has no exit numbers (although it's short enough).
Although not by the province, both the Gardiner and DVP also had no exit numbers until recently.
There are also some exits that do not get an advanced sign, and therefore there is no signed exit number until the gore.
One example: Highway 401 Eastbound to Highway 400, in the Express, it lacks an advanced sign and instead uses a pull-through sign where an advanced sign would usually be. For some reason, they did put an exit number on the Collector exit.
(https://i.imgur.com/BSdu2gy.png)
From the westbound exit (collectors only, there is no express exit), they don't have a exit number on any sign except the gore sign.
(https://i.imgur.com/jGFgrhQ.png)
Another example: On northbound 400, the Steeles Avenue exit also lacks the traditional advanced sign that show the lanes, and instead gets this 500m sign. No exit number until the gore.
(https://i.imgur.com/1JtrWHF.png)
Here's one which I believe should NOT have an exit sign. The reason is that this exit leads to a short collector carriageway that services two interchanges (Highway 7, exit 29, and Langstaff Road, exit 31). However, the sign that indicates this exit is only exit 29.
(https://i.imgur.com/lDuSxwv.png)
Another missing exit number, southbound 404.
(https://i.imgur.com/xsIukx3.png)
So that basically makes Ontario the Caltrans of the North then, right?
Quote from: JoePCool14 on May 01, 2021, 08:20:39 AM
So that basically makes Ontario the Caltrans of the North then, right?
I guess so, except that it's more inconsistency rather than outright not signing them
No, inconsistency is pretty much Caltrans. We have exit numbers, but not everywhere, and not consistently.
Quote from: ran4sh on April 30, 2021, 08:08:56 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on April 28, 2021, 06:50:21 PM
There's a lot of ways to tell which exit is a left one:
- Placement of an exit tab
- The side the number is on for a full length non-centered
- The 'LEFT' banner introduced in 2009
- Placement of the whole sign
- Arrow(s)
- A lot of drivers drive with a GPS through unfamiliar areas nowadays anyways.
There are a few states such as CA, NV, that sometimes place one of the advance signs on the left even if the exit is on the right. And in NJ on the NJ Turnpike, under their old signage standards, in the dual-dual section, it was considered sufficient to place one advance sign in the median between the car-only and the car-truck lanes, and that sign applied to both roadways. (Even though the exit would be to the right from each roadway)
California places advance guide signs on the left more frequently that probably ideal...typically, it tends to be in order to make use of an existing sign structure for the opposing direction (even if the sign placement would put it *over* the opposing lanes).
But there's only two instances of this in Nevada that I'm aware of, both in Las Vegas. The first, I-515/US 95 NB approaching Boulder Hwy (https://goo.gl/maps/x4v3H6iDwEupNM4u8), has been around for decades and I can't really explain why it was done that way. The second, US 95 NB approaching Summerlin Pkwy & Rainbow Blvd (https://goo.gl/maps/ys2AzR7XY78JPg1v9) dates to the widening of US 95 about 15 years ago, and is likely because there is a retaining wall on the right side of the roadway and an exit ramp right adjacent, making it easier engineering to place this sign in the median. Any other advance exit sign posted on the left side is for a left-hand HOV exit.
Quote from: roadfro on May 01, 2021, 06:14:41 PM
California places advance guide signs on the left more frequently that probably ideal...typically, it tends to be in order to make use of an existing sign structure for the opposing direction (even if the sign placement would put it *over* the opposing lanes).
Kansas tends to reserve this kind of sign placement for next-three-exit menus, which works well, in my opinion.
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 01, 2021, 06:39:53 PM
Quote from: roadfro on May 01, 2021, 06:14:41 PM
California places advance guide signs on the left more frequently that probably ideal...typically, it tends to be in order to make use of an existing sign structure for the opposing direction (even if the sign placement would put it *over* the opposing lanes).
Kansas tends to reserve this kind of sign placement for next-three-exit menus, which works well, in my opinion.
Missouri does too, at least in the St Louis area. Not sure about the rest of the state. I like the next 3 exits sign, kind of wish they use those more in Ohio and other places.
Quote from: Scott5114 on May 01, 2021, 06:39:53 PM
Quote from: roadfro on May 01, 2021, 06:14:41 PM
California places advance guide signs on the left more frequently that probably ideal...typically, it tends to be in order to make use of an existing sign structure for the opposing direction (even if the sign placement would put it *over* the opposing lanes).
Kansas tends to reserve this kind of sign placement for next-three-exit menus, which works well, in my opinion.
It's more common to see the interchange sequence signs ("next three exits" signs) on the left in California, but there are the sporadic advance guide signs on the left too. It's also not incredibly uncommon to see interchange sequence posted overhead on the *right* in California...
Quote from: jakeroot on April 28, 2021, 06:47:32 PM
Quote from: kphoger on April 28, 2021, 06:45:48 PM
In reality, drivers just follow the arrow.
Absolutely. Of course there is the whole issue of determining lane choice before an exit (where there are no arrows, except at APLs). But that is usually clear by the horizontal placement of the sign: off to the left? Probably a left exit. Off to the right? Likely a right exit.
...unless you've decided that your two VMSs must be right justified leaving the only room to place your right side exit sign over the left shoulder (https://goo.gl/maps/2GomrpscbppLWZTT9)! At least they included "right" in the action message :-D
Quote from: jakeroot on April 07, 2021, 01:11:23 AM
As mentioned before, Washington State uses inset exit tabs with centered legends. As far as I know, we are the only state still using centered exit legends. I'm kind of indifferent on the matter. The signs are very clean, to be sure, but it doesn't always work (APLs, diagrammatic signs).
It should be noted however, that the whole state does not use the full width tabs any more, WSDOT Southwest Region has switched to standard right aligned tabs, which I do not prefer, but can tolerate. What I'm not okay with is that they also started using numberless exit gore signs with tabs above at the same time, which are very ugly imo. :banghead: (And also likely not MUTCD compliant.)
As for APLs, I think a design similar to this would work just fine: https://goo.gl/maps/RqkDWRBRWuXVmQ2q9
Quote from: stevashe on May 12, 2021, 01:58:28 PM
As for APLs, I think a design similar to this would work just fine: https://goo.gl/maps/RqkDWRBRWuXVmQ2q9
The horizontal length for that sign is a bit too short for my liking. If you're in either lane from the center, it looks like there's two arrows pointing at one lane.
Quote from: SkyPesos on May 12, 2021, 10:05:46 PM
Quote from: stevashe on May 12, 2021, 01:58:28 PM
As for APLs, I think a design similar to this would work just fine: https://goo.gl/maps/RqkDWRBRWuXVmQ2q9
The horizontal length for that sign is a bit too short for my liking. If you're in either lane from the center, it looks like there's two arrows pointing at one lane.
I was referring to the design of the exit tab only, not the rest of the sign. I might draw up a proper APL version to better demonstrate the idea when I have time.
Here's my mock-up of an APL with a WSDOT style "Full Width" exit tab using the Exit 164 sign linked above.
(https://i.imgur.com/nPSapbL.png)
Here's one in New Jersey. However, the ones on the parkway and turnpike are not the same as these. So it appears they use the same types of signs that Ohio uses.
https://www.google.com/maps/@39.8644413,-75.1007709,3a,64.2y,364.67h,94.54t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sJluGa1yzoCAw_dkuEPkuIA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DJluGa1yzoCAw_dkuEPkuIA%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D158.55573%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192
Quote from: tolbs17 on January 15, 2022, 08:21:33 PM
Here's one in New Jersey. However, the ones on the parkway and turnpike are not the same as these. So it appears they use the same types of signs that Ohio uses.
https://www.google.com/maps/@39.8644413,-75.1007709,3a,64.2y,364.67h,94.54t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sJluGa1yzoCAw_dkuEPkuIA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DJluGa1yzoCAw_dkuEPkuIA%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D158.55573%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192
Too much spacing between the left/right edges and the letters/numbers to be the same type as OH/MN/MO's exit tabs.
Quote from: SkyPesos on January 15, 2022, 08:43:09 PM
Quote from: tolbs17 on January 15, 2022, 08:21:33 PM
Here's one in New Jersey. However, the ones on the parkway and turnpike are not the same as these. So it appears they use the same types of signs that Ohio uses.
https://www.google.com/maps/@39.8644413,-75.1007709,3a,64.2y,364.67h,94.54t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sJluGa1yzoCAw_dkuEPkuIA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DJluGa1yzoCAw_dkuEPkuIA%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D158.55573%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192
Too much spacing between the left/right edges and the letters/numbers to be the same type as Ohio's exit tabs.
Ah I see so where does it fall under?
____________________________________
Now looking at North Carolina's exit tabs, these are rare and unique and uglier compared to what most signs are. The letters EXIT and numbers are spaced out... But these signs will be replaced when the highway gets rehabbed.
https://www.google.com/maps/@35.8685648,-78.5557226,3a,28.7y,317.7h,103.49t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s-cdcP0H-ffK2nuucECKz1g!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
Speaking of Exit tabs, how come LOGO service signs or park and ride BGSs don't use exit tabs on average. I know some states do but most do not?
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51096973527_28b7c59ea0_k.jpg)[/url]
Probably because businesses don't want to pay for the exit tab.
Quote from: ran4sh on April 21, 2021, 12:42:48 AM
New York and South Carolina have exit tabs that, by SkyPesos' classification, could be a category "Attached exit tabs, square bottom corners and rounded top corners, share bottom border with main panel, tab offset from the edge of the main panel (with a rounded border corner on the main panel):"
- New York (Sign actually has rounded corners) https://goo.gl/maps/pM8qrmS5SdQ1jMzu5
- South Carolina (Sign corners are not round and extend outside border) https://goo.gl/maps/QgpG5B48YsQzn6Zf8
Both are kind of ugly imo but it's whatever. Offset exit tabs are okay. Don't know what the advantage of using them is! But if I say that one of them is better, I guess I'll give it to SC.
NCDOT did try using rounded exit tabs like this, but found them to be ugly and childish, so they went back to the square type of exit tabs. Btw that was practiced in the early 2010s.
Charlotte, North Carolina
https://maps.app.goo.gl/UTNzKAq5RtkErzmu7