3M PV Traffic Signals

[jon daly]

Seeing this thread encouraged me to dive deeper and I found a relatively dormant wiki on this topic. I'm not sure if there's any interest from signal fans here to contribute to this but here's the link:


https://highwaydivides.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page

[US 89]

There were several 3M’s in the Salt Lake City area, but almost all of them have been replaced by the new McCains. Only ones left I know of are at E St/500 East and South Temple, 500 West and a railroad spur between 500 and 600 South, and one left-turn signal on the Jordan Gateway in South Jordan

[mrsman]

Yeah, all the 3Ms in Illinois are steadily being replaced by McCains as well.  Look no further than US30 in Joliet (but also go ahead and look further if you want to find more lol)

Check out this six-way intersection at US30, Raynor, and Black Road:  https://goo.gl/maps/aG9TrSrMSeA2

The corner of US30 and Ingalls Ave is interesting because each mast arm employs half-usage of 3Ms, alongside regular IDOT signals.  Google also happened to catch this light during a yellow phase so you can see a yellow composite LED alongside a yellow 3M indication:  https://goo.gl/maps/HXjy395d8QB2

And further up the road, at Caton Farm Rd, you can see some post-mounted (or mast-mounted) McCains, installed either 2016 or 2017 (I forget).  This intersection had no PV signals at all until the last couple years--then IDOT decided they wanted to use them.  https://goo.gl/maps/xbUxmAhsCSk

Here's a nice side-view of a 3M, that was once used for the left arrow at US34 and North Aurora Road going eastbound.  If you click around, you'll see that this signal head was replaced in the last couple years with a normal signal, as IDOT no longer recognized the need for only partial visibility.  https://goo.gl/maps/HxCU3Asap9y

The delays at the Raynor/Black/US 30 intersection must be insane.  Not only are there 3 different streets coming together, but each street also has protected left turn arrows.  I wonder how long the cycle is at that corner.

[jakeroot]

Yeah, all the 3Ms in Illinois are steadily being replaced by McCains as well.  Look no further than US30 in Joliet (but also go ahead and look further if you want to find more lol)

Check out this six-way intersection at US30, Raynor, and Black Road:  https://goo.gl/maps/aG9TrSrMSeA2

The delays at the Raynor/Black/US 30 intersection must be insane.  Not only are there 3 different streets coming together, but each street also has protected left turn arrows.  I wonder how long the cycle is at that corner.

It must be insane. A similar intersection here in WA would have limited left turn options, to reduce the number of phases (with left-turning traffic using nearby streets to complete the maneuver).

I think that intersection has the most amount of 3M signals that I have ever seen in one place.

[traffic light guy]

3Ms are still relitvely common in the eastern U.S., don't know much about the south, and the hillbilly states

[jakeroot]

3Ms are still relitvely common in the eastern U.S., don't know much about the south, and the hillbilly states

Pretty common in WA. Disappeared for a while when that Intelight thing was around for a couple years, but a few have shown up since. They were standard for left turn heads for a while.

[basilicon89]

Intelight moved much of their production of their signal head to China and as typical of Chinese made components, the quality suffered after about 2011.

Final assembly and circuit boards were made at Intelight's Tucson Arizona facility but housings, lenses and hardware were molded out of their China joint venture and they leaked like crazy. Because of the nature of Intelight's signal the electronics inside are exposed so leaking housings usually was the cause of most of the failures

The signal was discontinued in 2015 so that Intelight could focus on controllers, advanced transporation system hardware and software, and connected vehicle technology. The signal head had almost no profit margin and wasn't worth redesigning for such a niche market. One 3-light Intelight signal head cost $2,300 which is on par with 3M and McCain's optically programmable signal heads.

There is a small chance that the Intelight signal head be made by someone else, there was interest in the patents. Also, Intelight has mentioned to me that if they did revisit the concept it would be in a package similar to a conventional traffic signal LED module mountable in any conventional signal housing

-Nick

[freebrickproductions]

Also, Intelight has mentioned to me that if they did revisit the concept it would be in a package similar to a conventional traffic signal LED module mountable in any conventional signal housing

They should probably try that, especially if it would cost about as much (or less) than standard LEDs in conventional heads + louvers. Not to mention it'd make retrofitting an install that needed the PV abilities easier.

[jakeroot]

Thanks for the write-up, Nick! Some good info, there. Not totally sure I agree that Chinese-made is automatically poor quality, though.

Also, Intelight has mentioned to me that if they did revisit the concept it would be in a package similar to a conventional traffic signal LED module mountable in any conventional signal housing

They should probably try that, especially if it would cost about as much (or less) than standard LEDs in conventional heads + louvers. Not to mention it'd make retrofitting an install that needed the PV abilities easier.

The Intelights definitely had a unique look to them that I will miss, should the technology ever make its way to a more traditional signal housing. Nevertheless, the technology is too impressive to die, IMO, so whatever gets the tech back out and running is good with me.

[freebrickproductions]

Not totally sure I agree that Chinese-made is automatically poor quality, though.

Well, the later Intelights did have issues with water leakage and pre-mature "deaths", especially compared to the older ones. Wouldn't be surprised if the plastic just wasn't able to survive the voyage across the Pacific as well as they had hoped.

Also, Intelight has mentioned to me that if they did revisit the concept it would be in a package similar to a conventional traffic signal LED module mountable in any conventional signal housing

They should probably try that, especially if it would cost about as much (or less) than standard LEDs in conventional heads + louvers. Not to mention it'd make retrofitting an install that needed the PV abilities easier.

The Intelights definitely had a unique look to them that I will miss, should the technology ever make its way to a more traditional signal housing. Nevertheless, the technology is too impressive to die, IMO, so whatever gets the tech back out and running is good with me.

I have to agree on both counts. PV technology (especially LED PV technology) shouldn't be allowed to stagnate or die. Currently, PV signals have stagnated as the only one left on the market is a reverse-engineered 3M made by McCain, with the only other PV options being extra long visors and/or louvers in the visors...

[jakeroot]

Not totally sure I agree that Chinese-made is automatically poor quality, though.

Well, the later Intelights did have issues with water leakage and pre-mature "deaths", especially compared to the older ones. Wouldn't be surprised if the plastic just wasn't able to survive the voyage across the Pacific as well as they had hoped.

Yikes. That's no good. Signals that were, at the earliest, made in 2011 should not already be dying.

One of the Intelights in my area might have been affected by the leaking. This one, an FYA, is visible from a wider number of angles than one might expect from a PV signal. Either it was never programmed, or the leaking caused the appropriate electronics to malfunction. Weirdly, the post-mounted signal, to it's left, has no PV features, despite being visible to more vehicles than the overhead signal...starting to think they might have just never programmed it. I do know that the FYA is not visible from all angles, but the viewable angle is wider than I'd expect. Could be that was how it was programmed. Where's the shrug emoji....

[CJResotko]

Here are some setups of 3M PV signals in Michigan:
Ann Arbor:
Main Street at Ann Arbor-Saline Road

Washtenaw Avenue at Huron Pkwy

Packard Street at State Street (the way the intersection was kinda made sense to have 3M's)

To be honest, I never really understood why ann arbor put 3M PV signals in the places they did most of the time. There used to be a few setups of these along Fuller Road, just north of U of M, but now they're gone.

Tecumseh:
Occidental Highway at Russell Road

Lansing: Cedar Street at Edgewodd Blvd

https://youtu.be/uW4irf46QMk
The ones in this video are at the Pennsylvania Avenue-Business I-96 intersection