I was recently in Virginia and noticed the three-digit US routes (e.g. US-250), have square shields instead of the rectangular shields as is usual in other states. I didn't have a camera with me, so I didn't take pictures, but I thought it looked kind of unusual. Is this common in any other states, and what are y'all's opinions of not-as-wide 3-digit shields?
VA does usually use 3-digit sized US route shields, though often they do use a 2-digit shield for a multitude of different reasons...
Texas always puts two digit interstates in 3-digit shields and 3-digit interstates in 2-digit shields. I have no idea why.
edit: I meant "always" in a descriptive way, not in the universally-applied-to-all-signs way.
Example:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm4.static.flickr.com%2F3336%2F3564881038_30aee72701.jpg%3Fv%3D0&hash=ba5fadfd5fbb1030a66ac636cec382037b4c6b27)
Many older shield assemblies in North Carolina use the 2-du width shields for 3-dus. There are enough around that it appears it was a standard.
U.S. 158 - http://www.southeastroads.com/north_carolina100/us-158_eb_after_sandy_hook_rd.jpg (http://www.southeastroads.com/north_carolina100/us-158_eb_after_sandy_hook_rd.jpg)
U.S. 221 - http://www.southeastroads.com/north_carolina020/us-021_221_sb_app_split_01.jpg (http://www.southeastroads.com/north_carolina020/us-021_221_sb_app_split_01.jpg)
U.S. 311 - http://www.southeastroads.com/north_carolina300/us-311_sb_end.jpg (http://www.southeastroads.com/north_carolina300/us-311_sb_end.jpg)
U.S. 321 - http://www.southeastroads.com/north_carolina220/us-221_321_sb_after_blue_ridge_pkwy.jpg (http://www.southeastroads.com/north_carolina220/us-221_321_sb_after_blue_ridge_pkwy.jpg)
I like them.
the old standard (16x16 cutout) was one size for all numbers ... states started going gradually to the wider styles early on: Massachusetts had a 17x16 US-202 as early as 1931. With the advent of the simpler shields (no state name, just US) in the early 50s, some states went to the wider style ... California introduced the 28x24 wide shield in 1956, for example. A lot of states were followed slowly, and some have not adopted it yet ... for example, 90% of three-digit shields in Mississippi, and 97% in Iowa, are narrow.
Personally, I like the square ones because they're an older standard.
For once, Tennessee is consistent. When they do bother to put up a sign, they do always use a wide sign for 3 digit US routes and square one for 2 digit routes. (Since I haven't been on every road in the state, I can't say there aren't exceptions.)
Now, TN state routes use the same size signs whether they are 1, 2 or 3 digits. I assume that's because of the state logo at the bottom.
Now, TN secondary highway signs do vary in width for 2 and 3 digits.
Iowa follows the same as MN for US routes. for state highways it's always in the 2d sign format (whether on guide or alone). Wisconsin is the exact opposite. US 3d's are always the 2d shape, while state highway shields are 3d if that is the case
Anyone see Interstate 3d route signs on 2d shields? I find that very odd. IA uses that on side roads (and sometimes on the mainlines) as does IL. :-/
the first interstate shield spec from 1956 allowed for 18x18, 21x18, and 24x24 shields ... but no 30x24 size, oddly. In fact, the 18x18 and 21x18 were just about interchangeable. I have seen plenty of examples of one and two-digit numbers in the 21x18 format, as well as some 22 1/2 by 18 shields (!) as well.
Here is a 21x18 in Connecticut:
www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=CT19580952t100950.jpg&search=95&view=1 (//www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=CT19580952t100950.jpg&search=95&view=1)
and an 18x18:
www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=CT19580841t100840.jpg&search=84&view=1 (//www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=CT19580841t100840.jpg&search=84&view=1)
and a three-digit 18x18:
www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=DE19612952t102950.jpg&view=1 (//www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=DE19612952t102950.jpg&view=1)
The first revision (1961 spec) offered 24x24 and 36x36, forbidding any shield smaller than 24. Some states kept the 21x18 size around, though well into the present day.
California was the first state to offer a larger wide shield - 30x24 in 1962. Their MUTCD to this day (the 1971 I-shield revision) specifies 21x18, 24x24, 30x24, 36x36, and 45x36 shields.
Here are 36x36 and 24x24 shields. Without a size reference, the 18x18, 24x24, and 36x36 shields cannot be told apart, as they are just scaled versions of the same design.
www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=CT19610861t100860.jpg&search=86&view=1 (//www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=CT19610861t100860.jpg&search=86&view=1)
The federal spec of 1972 adopted the 30x24 and 45x36 size, well after most states had started installing them anyway.
here are 24x24 and 30x24 shields side by side:
www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=IA19726802t106800.jpg&view=11 (//www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=IA19726802t106800.jpg&view=11)
The 1979 federal spec allowed for the larger numbers (10" high instead of 8" on a 24" high shield), with the state name in place, but many states had gone with it earlier - the Pennsylvania 1966 MUTCD shows the larger numbers. Shield sizes were 24x24, 30x24, 36x36, and 45x36.
This is a 30x24 shield here:
www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=NE19794801t104800.jpg&view=1 (//www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=NE19794801t104800.jpg&view=1)
The 1983 federal spec omitted the state name (boo!) but kept the sizes. Then again, many states had omitted them well before that ... Maryland's first generation of interstate shields were 18x18 with 7 1/2" numbers and no state name, for example, so a scaled down '83 spec.
www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=MD19590831t100830.jpg&view=1 (//www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=MD19590831t100830.jpg&view=1)
here is a more standard 1983 spec shield - 24 inch shield, 10" numbers:
www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=MT19830901t100900.jpg&view=1 (//www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=MT19830901t100900.jpg&view=1)
The 1988 federal spec increased the numbers to 12" on a 24" blank, with no state names. This spec had been around for a while, though - California's first-generation shields (1957) were this style, actually ... no state name, super large numbers. They can still be seen but only on old porcelain green signs, both in CA and Nevada. The ones on poles are all long gone. By 1960, California was using the standard federal spec of the time for the stand-alone shields, but has never put the state name on the green sign shields.
here is a late 1950s California shield for sale at a swap meet:
www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=CA19580802t100800.jpg&search=80&view=1 (//www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=CA19580802t100800.jpg&search=80&view=1)
here is 1979 and 1988 spec shields next to each other:
www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=NE19796801t106800.jpg&view=1 (//www.aaroads.com/shields/show.php?image=NE19796801t106800.jpg&view=1)
And that's a rough and somewhat disorganized history of the interstate shield.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm4.static.flickr.com%2F3270%2F3068902787_bf3714853f.jpg&hash=5fbf58e3a676bd53c1ab98753d8d5eef79f90001)
Trailblazer in Greenland, AR
narrow, no state name, large numbers. those happen. There's some for 610 in Texas, but that makes more sense since a digit 1 isn't as wide as others. The 540 is ... definitely squeezed.
Quote from: froggie on May 25, 2009, 08:59:12 PM
Square shields for 3-digit routes is an exception in Virginia...the norm, as DTP mentioned, is a 3-digit sized shield.
In Minnesota, the standard is for 3-digit-sized shields on guide signage, but square shields for standalone signs.
Charlottesville must be an exception, then. I didn't see a single wide 3-digit shield there.
Visibility be damned, I prefer the 8" numbers on the 24" shields (and state names, please.) There's just something nicely retro about it. Anyway.
With the exception of standalones on freeways (state and US) or those visible after exiting interchanges (state only), 99.9% of state and US highway standalones in Louisiana are 2-digit squares, even for 3-or-more digit highways. BGS's for 3dus routes are inconsistent, though.
Louisiana 3di's are shielded inconsistently. Along any of the x10's, for example, both 2di and 3di shields for the same route number can be found at different places along the route. There appears to be no rhyme or reason at a glance, as some of either style appear brand new, while some of both styles are older than dirt.
i have one example of 3-di route on a 2-di I-shield...
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi166.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fu102%2Fctsignguy%2Fi-680neb.jpg&hash=0614636625d0d35c8c8e67164f64bcb318fbf2f4)
Quote from: austrini on May 25, 2009, 07:32:13 PM
Texas always puts two digit interstates in 3-digit shields and 3-digit interstates in 2-digit shields. I have no idea why.
That used to be the standard in Texas until some time after 2003. Up until that year, control of guide sign design (including Interstate shields) was done through standard plan sheets which were included with every TxDOT project which had signing content. These plan sheets covered warning, regulatory, and guide signs (including markers) and the markers sheets included a directive stipulating that three-digit shields were to be used for two-digit routes (and vice versa) on guide signs.
In 2003 TxDOT got rid of these standard plan sheets and instructed designers to use "Typical Sign Requirements" sheets instead, which do not have sign designs, but do instruct the contractors to use
Standard Highway Sign Designs for Texas for sign fabrication.
SHSD was itself reissued (first major revision since 1981) in 2004, and has been updated on a more or less annual basis since then. I think it was in the 2005 or 2006 update that TxDOT finally got rid of the unusual provisions for guide sign Interstate shields. TxDOT's Interstate route marker design is now a straight copy of the equivalent in the federal
SHS. (TxDOT also got rid of its distinctive Business US shield design, which had "BUSINESS" above the route digits and the letter suffix below. The current design still has the route suffix in the shield, but uses the "BUSINESS" tab.)
Not all TxDOT consultants have picked up on the change and are still producing plans with wide shields for two-digit routes, narrow shields for three-digit. But there have been plenty of contracts in the last few years with the shields used normally (i.e., as in the rest of the US).
Another unusual thing TxDOT does on some interchange sequence signs is to make the Interstate shields larger than US and state route shields on the same line of legend. This does not occur on all such signs, however.
I noted a lot of 2di width shields for 3di routes in Norfolk, VA when I regularly visited the city. A couple of examples:
I-264/464 - https://www.aaroads.com/mid-atlantic/virginia999/city_hall_av_eb_at_st_pauls_bl.jpg (https://www.aaroads.com/mid-atlantic/virginia999/city_hall_av_eb_at_st_pauls_bl.jpg)
I-564 - https://www.aaroads.com/mid-atlantic/virginia200/us-460_wb_at_i-564_eb.jpg (https://www.aaroads.com/mid-atlantic/virginia200/us-460_wb_at_i-564_eb.jpg)
Quote from: AARoads on May 26, 2009, 12:12:25 PM
I noted a lot of 2di width shields for 3di routes in Norfolk, VA when I regularly visited the city. A couple of examples:
I-264/464 - https://www.aaroads.com/mid-atlantic/virginia999/city_hall_av_eb_at_st_pauls_bl.jpg (https://www.aaroads.com/mid-atlantic/virginia999/city_hall_av_eb_at_st_pauls_bl.jpg)
I-564 - https://www.aaroads.com/mid-atlantic/virginia200/us-460_wb_at_i-564_eb.jpg (https://www.aaroads.com/mid-atlantic/virginia200/us-460_wb_at_i-564_eb.jpg)
I've just recognized that most of the "TO I-264" shields in Va Beach are the same way but I haven't been there in over a year(even though I was in Norfolk back in March.)
Quote from: austrini on May 25, 2009, 07:32:13 PM
Texas always puts two digit interstates in 3-digit shields and 3-digit interstates in 2-digit shields. I have no idea why.
edit: I meant "always" in a descriptive way, not in the universally-applied-to-all-signs way.
Arkansas has done that a time or two as well, but it's rare.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm3.static.flickr.com%2F2036%2F2249721016_7efc9f8786.jpg&hash=feae58f4bf4df7556befaeb81ccfcfc518b55760)
California does as well, on I-15 between the Nevada state line and Cajon Pass. 45x36 shields with super-large number 15... I think 16 inches high instead of the 15 inches that the spec proscribes.
That's the only place I've seen it - that one stretch of highway. Must've been a particular contractor that had the batch made up.
The shield gallery appears not to have a photo, alas.
Utah loves placing 3-digit numbers on 2-digit US Route shields. Very rarely will you see a 3-digit US shield in Utah. The state used to do the same with 3-digit interstates until around the mid-1990s, where they started placing the only 3-digit interstate (I-215) on a wide shield.
The norm for US route shields in Utah
https://www.aaroads.com/west/utah191/us-191_nb_at_i-070_wb.jpg (https://www.aaroads.com/west/utah191/us-191_nb_at_i-070_wb.jpg)
Old-style I-215 shield
https://www.aaroads.com/west/utah215/i-215_ol_exit_001_02.jpg (https://www.aaroads.com/west/utah215/i-215_ol_exit_001_02.jpg)
And what they look like now (actually a BGS but they are exactly like current reassurance shields)
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:LegacyParkwaySTerminus.jpg (http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:LegacyParkwaySTerminus.jpg)
Quote from: CL on May 26, 2009, 11:09:52 PM
Utah loves placing 3-digit numbers on 2-digit US Route shields. Very rarely will you see a 3-digit US shield in Utah. The state used to do the same with 3-digit interstates until around the mid-1990s, where they started placing the only 3-digit interstate (I-215) on a wide shield.
The norm for US route shields in Utah
https://www.aaroads.com/west/utah191/us-191_nb_at_i-070_wb.jpg (https://www.aaroads.com/west/utah191/us-191_nb_at_i-070_wb.jpg)
Sounds like Louisiana for the most part. Missouri was that way, too, until a few years ago. If you see one in Arkansas, it's probably an error.
In Maple Grove, MN there's a 3di I-94 shield. I-94 is duplexed with I-694 at this point, so it is easy to figure that there was a miscommunication between what route shield was needed: an I-694 shield was made but an I-94 shield was what was needed. As far as I know this is the only mix-up of its type in the state.
3 digit US routes that follow freeway alignments often get 3dus shields. US 212 and US 169 both have 3dus shields on their freeway alignments, but on the non-freeway portions they have 2-digit width shields.
Massachusetts has the tendency to use oversized 3di's for Interstate 95 throughout the main line: http://www.northeastroads.com/massachusetts050/i-095_nb_exit_002a_03.jpg (http://www.northeastroads.com/massachusetts050/i-095_nb_exit_002a_03.jpg)
urgh, with no state name ... New Hampshire had the same idea around 1968, and some of those shields survive to the present day.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.artistjake.com%2Flj%2Fw35170.jpg&hash=7888844ff666934d68257c7d0bf63a1b739404b3)
note the old-style (white square with outline design) NH-33 shield. This is for sure an old gantry; but they definitely do not obey old specifications.