In many locations across a few states, I've noticed new "YOUR SPEED" installations that do not display speeds in excess of the posted limit, as has otherwise been the norm. For example, I have encountered several work zone and neighborhood speed signs that display numbers up to the speed limit and then the words "SLOW DOWN" in place of the digits over the limit. Just recently, driving across I-80 in Pennsylvania, I noticed that all of the VMSes not otherwise in use now display "SPEED LIMIT 65 - YOUR SPEED..." and if over 65, it says ">65 - SLOW DOWN"
Has anyone else noticed this? Is this a trend? Any ideas on why?
I once heard some conjecture that a portable "YOUR SPEED" sign was taken out of a work zone because some people treated it like the high score screen on an arcade game–trying to rack up the biggest number. I don't know if that's just an urban legend, though.
Once I saw, with a speed limit 30:
0-34: Normal.
35-39: Number flashing.
40-44: "SLOW" in red.
45-49: Blue lights alternating as if they were police car lights.
I assume that 44/45 was the cutoff for the blue lights, but I'm not sure.
Just recently saw one of these that said "slow down" in North Texas. Believe it was on I-35E. It doesn't make sense to use these on high-volume 3 lane freeways, because there are so many vehicles passing by it at once.
Quote from: briantroutman on October 09, 2013, 03:00:53 PM
I once heard some conjecture that a portable "YOUR SPEED" sign was taken out of a work zone because some people treated it like the high score screen on an arcade game–trying to rack up the biggest number. I don't know if that's just an urban legend, though.
You mean it's not a game to see how fast you can get it to go, or if you can make it flash? They have them in Illinois (at an underposted 45 mph as usual), and I like to make them flash for the heck of it.
Quote from: 1 on October 09, 2013, 03:29:51 PM
Once I saw, with a speed limit 30:
0-34: Normal.
35-39: Number flashing.
40-44: "SLOW" in red.
45-49: Blue lights alternating as if they were police car lights.
I assume that 44/45 was the cutoff for the blue lights, but I'm not sure.
I'm surprised that's even legal. If it is impersonating a police vehicle, usually it is not allowed under most laws.
Quote from: Brandon on October 09, 2013, 05:49:52 PMIf it is impersonating a police vehicle, usually it is not allowed under most laws.
would the YOUR SPEED portable sign count as a police vehicle itself?
if so, it is a shit loophole, but a loophole indeed.
There are some around here that flash so many different things (strobe-like light, four corners, 'Slow'...etc.) and at such a rapid rate, I'm surprised no one's had a seizure yet.
Quote from: 1 on October 09, 2013, 03:29:51 PM
...45-49: Blue lights alternating as if they were police car lights.
I saw a similar one in Madison just the other week, except it's tolerance was much lower and started the red & blue much closer to the posted speed. It kinda freaked me out at first, until I realized a) it was only a trailer and b) the red & blue were reversed from their statutory positions.
Quote from: briantroutman on October 09, 2013, 03:00:53 PM
In many locations across a few states, I've noticed new "YOUR SPEED" installations that do not display speeds in excess of the posted limit, as has otherwise been the norm. For example, I have encountered several work zone and neighborhood speed signs that display numbers up to the speed limit and then the words "SLOW DOWN" in place of the digits over the limit. Just recently, driving across I-80 in Pennsylvania, I noticed that all of the VMSes not otherwise in use now display "SPEED LIMIT 65 - YOUR SPEED..." and if over 65, it says ">65 - SLOW DOWN"
Has anyone else noticed this? Is this a trend? Any ideas on why?
I once heard some conjecture that a portable "YOUR SPEED" sign was taken out of a work zone because some people treated it like the high score screen on an arcade gametrying to rack up the biggest number. I don't know if that's just an urban legend, though.
Don't know if it's a trend per se, rather than just a technological advancement. Capabilities have changed quite a bit in the last few years.
My town has a policy of placing their PD's speed trailer in a spot for two weeks. The first week the display is turned off and it just records the speeds of the passing vehicles as part of a speed survey. The second week the display is then turned on as well usually with a squad or two sitting just a bit further down the street.
I think the answer to the original question is present in one of the responses - a lot of people like to see what speed they can hit. Some people try to hit the exact limit, others try to do as fast as they can, or exactly 42, 69 (teehee), etc. I'm guilty of that. By taking away numbers above the speed limit, that reduces the number of people speeding just for its own sake.
Quote from: Steve on October 09, 2013, 10:17:05 PM
I think the answer to the original question is present in one of the responses - a lot of people like to see what speed they can hit. Some people try to hit the exact limit, others try to do as fast as they can, or exactly 42, 69 (teehee), etc. I'm guilty of that. By taking away numbers above the speed limit, that reduces the number of people speeding just for its own sake.
I won't admit to ever having hit 70+ in a 25 zone when I was in my teens and I saw one of those things....
One of those was posted in my neighborhood last month (rightly so....people regularly hit 45+ in the 25 zone while straddling the double yellow line to cut the curves). It flashed a big red "SLOW DOWN" for anything above 30 mph. I usually set my cruise control at 30 regardless of whether that thing is here and it infuriates some of the speeders (which is why I use the cruise control, so I don't speed up!).
Ours around here are all trailers. They flash your speed with amber LEDs unless you are speeding which results in your speed flashing red.
There is one permanent installation here that is a blank sign if you're going the speed limit or less bit flashes "Speed Limit 45" if you're going over.
Quote from: Brandon on October 09, 2013, 05:49:52 PM
You mean it's not a game to see how fast you can get it to go, or if you can make it flash? They have them in Illinois (at an underposted 45 mph as usual), and I like to make them flash for the heck of it.
In the 1970s, NHDOT installed a couple of these signs on Interstate 93. One was mounted over the road on I-93 northbound just north of Exit 2 in Salem/Pelham and was a 4 section amber wig-wag with a static sign that read (IIRC) "YOU ARE SPEEDING WHEN FLASHING". The other sign was mounted over the road on I-93 northbound just south of Exit 19 in Tilton, and was a more tradtional "YOUR SPEED IS" sign, but with a three digit display instead of the
standard more normal two digit one.
The story goes that NH State Police ordered the Tilton sign removed after about a year because of the number of drivers who would intentionally speed up to see if they could get the sign to register 100 or better on the display. The Salem/Pelham sign fared much better, as it wasn't removed until just after the repeal of NMSL on "rural" interstates.
Along I-95 in Maine there used to be structure-mounted signs that would light up
SPEED OVER 55 TOO FAST during the 55-mph maximum speed limit era.
As far as the portable
YOUR SPEED signs are concerned, one time there was one posted on a through-sidestreet and a few of us were tossing a football on the street when there was no traffic. A few times the sign would register the speed of the
football. The speed limit for the road in question was 25 mph. There were several throws that were clocked
above the posted 25 limit LOL.
Quote from: 1 on October 09, 2013, 03:29:51 PMBlue lights alternating as if they were police car lights.
I, for one, have never seen that at all.
In many instances, I just see my speed flashing fast with no change in color.
One has to wonder whether or not those fast flashing numbers can potentially cause seizures (and end up in a car crash). That could be
one reason why those signs may have been turned off. One lawsuit is all it takes.
Quote from: roadman on October 10, 2013, 12:44:21 PM
The story goes that NH State Police ordered the Tilton sign removed after about a year because of the number of drivers who would intentionally speed up to see if they could get the sign to register 100 or better on the display. The Salem/Pelham sign fared much better, as it wasn't removed until just after the repeal of NMSL on "rural" interstates.
I punched up an "06" once on US-101 in California.
There are some 3-digit YOUR SPEED signs out there:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F3.bp.blogspot.com%2F-HrnX_P5xGog%2FTd08DH6Tb_I%2FAAAAAAAAHhM%2FDC0aPBjs6EY%2Fs1600%2Fyourspeed.jpg&hash=bd85a40e379f5cc8e8b06d67a904b86a3994a11d)
How did you get such a clear picture while going 167? :bigass:
Judging from the angle, this was snapped just before you reduced it to scrap metal.
I've always wondered what the origin of that 167 sign was. my guess is a malfunction, and a member of the press went out and shot a photo. there may not have even been a moving car anywhere near the detector.
I once saw a temperature display outside of a bank read 152... these sorts of things happen.
That is a vane display, so I'm guessing for whatever reason it didn't reset to blank or zero. Vane displays will keep displaying whatever the last thing they had up when their power is cut, so that may well be what happened.
if the power surged before it cut, then it may have scrambled the insides, and we may be lucky that it displayed 167, as opposed to something completely implausible like 835.
Quote from: agentsteel53 on October 10, 2013, 03:59:37 PM
if the power surged before it cut, then it may have scrambled the insides, and we may be lucky that it displayed 167, as opposed to something completely implausible like 835.
Which was also a common fault with the first "flip disc" VMS boards of the 1980s. When the power failed, either the "last set" message or complete jibberish would often be displayed instead of the sign going mostly blank (I say 'mostly blank" because I've never seen a "flip disk" VMS that went totally blank when "off" - there were always one or two elements that got hung up).
Quote from: agentsteel53 on October 10, 2013, 03:08:12 PM
I've always wondered what the origin of that 167 sign was. my guess is a malfunction, and a member of the press went out and shot a photo. there may not have even been a moving car anywhere near the detector.
I once saw a temperature display outside of a bank read 152... these sorts of things happen.
The Belgians can confirm "these sorts of things happen." (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3613715.stm)
Quote from: agentsteel53 on October 10, 2013, 03:08:12 PM
I've always wondered what the origin of that 167 sign was. my guess is a malfunction, and a member of the press went out and shot a photo. there may not have even been a moving car anywhere near the detector.
I once saw a temperature display outside of a bank read 152... these sorts of things happen.
A bit off topic, but the local/state weather channel in my area can get hilarious with this sometimes. Oftentimes, for some reason for Mobridge way more than other places, it will read something unrealistic like 326 inches of rain, and sometimes you'll have one town on a 70 degree day that reads 0 (or even -0).
Quote from: Steve on October 09, 2013, 10:17:05 PM
By taking away numbers above the speed limit, that reduces the number of people speeding just for its own sake.
I understand the logic, but my problem with that approach is that (and I'm broadly generalizing here)
everyone speeds–the question is just how much. If a YOUR SPEED sign in a 40 MPH zone gives the same flashing "SLOW DOWN" to Grandma going 41 as it does to the otherwise sane driver who doesn't realize he's crept up to 60, the effectiveness of the installation is totally lost.
It would be similar if there was a "REDUCE CALORIES - YOU ARE OVERWEIGHT" sign at a Sizzler buffet. It would be flashing non-stop–and everyone would ignore it.
I guess I could see the utility of those, but every car I've ever owned has included a built-in speedometer.
They provide hours of fun on a bike.
Quote from: kurumi on October 11, 2013, 08:02:23 PM
I guess I could see the utility of those, but every car I've ever owned has included a built-in speedometer.
Even so, they allow you to check how close your speedometer is to the actual speed. Most analog ones read 3-5 mph faster than one is actually going, while digital, in my experience, is spot on.
Quote from: vdeane on October 12, 2013, 09:34:58 AM
Quote from: kurumi on October 11, 2013, 08:02:23 PM
I guess I could see the utility of those, but every car I've ever owned has included a built-in speedometer.
Even so, they allow you to check how close your speedometer is to the actual speed.
I wouldn't consider any of these signs accurate enough to check my speedometer against.
ODOT has flashing blue lights on their pickup trucks.
Bell Labs Princess rotary dial phone
Quote from: deathtopumpkins on October 13, 2013, 01:07:07 AM
I wouldn't consider any of these signs accurate enough to check my speedometer against.
And we have a winner. You answered the OP's question.
Changing a numerical score to some preachy message keeps the general public from knowing how grossly inaccurate radar is, and why it should be per se inadmissible in all courts.
Quote from: PHLBOS on October 10, 2013, 01:39:42 PM
There are some 3-digit YOUR SPEED signs out there:
Common (and necessary) in Canada. What I found amusing this summer is that, quite often, the sign that was affixed above it was a U.S.-standard sign that would say something like "SPEED LIMIT 80" instead of "MAXIMUM 80 km/h." I suspect the same machines are sold in both countries with a simple mi/km configuration option.
Also: I chuckle uncomfortably when I see a Photoshop where someone has added a "HIGH SCORE" indicator below these things. The kids at Failblog made a hand-printed one a couple of years ago:
(https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/4332491776/hAC2C6F5C/)
Quote from: Kniwt on October 13, 2013, 02:48:31 PM
(https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/4332491776/hAC2C6F5C/)
So after they get past, they get out of the car and write it down on the paper? Wouldn't that just nullify the extra speed from speeding?
As far as these portable installations go. I was once told by a cop that these YOUR SPEED IS devices are where old unreliable speed guns go to die -- which is probably why, with the exception of the portable trailers and the larger interstate installations, those small, pole-mounted installations don't last much longer than a year or two before they are taken down.
I've always wanted to have one of those portable speed meters on my street for a few days. I'd use it like a baseball speed pitch meter!! :bigass:
Quote from: thenetwork on October 13, 2013, 08:07:09 PM
I was once told by a cop that these YOUR SPEED IS devices are where old unreliable speed guns go to die -- which is probably why, with the exception of the portable trailers and the larger interstate installations, those small, pole-mounted installations don't last much longer than a year or two before they are taken down.
So, these aren't actually used to assist cops in catching speeders, then, are they? If they're this unreliable, I fail to see the point of their existence at all. :-/
They're PR devices aimed at slowing people down.
But what if, perchance, somebody was doing the speed limit and ran by a broken indicator that told them they were going a few mph over/under and made them think their speedometer was broken? That might cause confusion.
Quote from: vdeane on October 13, 2013, 09:27:22 PM
They're PR devices aimed at slowing people down.
I went by one not too long ago with a cop watching from the next side street. I wonder if he was shooting radar separately (since the sign would throw off its own pulse, lulling drivers into a false sense of security) or watching some indicator on the sign itself.
I immediately thought of this thread while driving back to Sioux Falls from Minneapolis today. I drove by three "YOUR SPEED" signs, and the problem can't be that they don't work in rain because one of them gave me the correct speed. The first one I drove by in Mankato told me I was going 70 when I was going 55, and the second one I drove by outside of Mankato was flashing between 11 and 12 while I drove past at 60. If I wasn't driving in such horrible weather conditions I'd probably have laughed my ass off.
Quote from: Steve on October 13, 2013, 10:53:16 PM
Quote from: vdeane on October 13, 2013, 09:27:22 PM
They're PR devices aimed at slowing people down.
I went by one not too long ago with a cop watching from the next side street. I wonder if he was shooting radar separately (since the sign would throw off its own pulse, lulling drivers into a false sense of security) or watching some indicator on the sign itself.
Probably the latter. I've seen multiple cops on a highway. A second cop not too far ahead to catch confident drivers thinking there wouldn't be a cop after a trap.
These signs are generally "For your amusement only". No one should ever get a ticket based solely on that sign. A cop can be nearby running his own radar, but that would be separate from the sign.
Could someone be speeding past the sign (especially in a residental neighborhood) and get called in by nearby residents? Quite possibly. But even then, the driver would be cited for excessive speed, careless/reckless driving or the like, and the witnesses would have to demostrate that the driver was truly driving as such (or the driver would have to admit to it).
Quote from: jeffandnicole on October 15, 2013, 08:24:12 AMCould someone be speeding past the sign (especially in a residental neighborhood) and get called in by nearby residents? Quite possibly. But even then, the driver would be cited for excessive speed, careless/reckless driving or the like, and the witnesses would have to demostrate that the driver was truly driving as such (or the driver would have to admit to it).
It's much more involved than that. Without a police office as the complaining witness, the citizen would become the complaining witness (effectively, a "citizen's arrest") and would be held to the same judicial burden of proof as a police officer. IOW, the citizen would have to prove that his/her speed measurement device had been properly calibrated at the time of the alleged violation, that it accurately measured the alleged violator's speed and was not subject to the myraid ways that vehicle radar can show an inaccurate speed.
Since I sincerely doubt that those "Your Speed Is..." radar installations are ever calibrated to the standard the courts demand, they could not be used to prove someone was speeding.
Quote from: PHLBOS on October 10, 2013, 01:39:42 PM
There are some 3-digit YOUR SPEED signs out there:
Probably for those countries that use metric. ;)
Quote from: SidS1045 on October 15, 2013, 10:34:03 AM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on October 15, 2013, 08:24:12 AMCould someone be speeding past the sign (especially in a residental neighborhood) and get called in by nearby residents? Quite possibly. But even then, the driver would be cited for excessive speed, careless/reckless driving or the like, and the witnesses would have to demostrate that the driver was truly driving as such (or the driver would have to admit to it).
It's much more involved than that. Without a police office as the complaining witness, the citizen would become the complaining witness (effectively, a "citizen's arrest") and would be held to the same judicial burden of proof as a police officer. IOW, the citizen would have to prove that his/her speed measurement device had been properly calibrated at the time of the alleged violation, that it accurately measured the alleged violator's speed and was not subject to the myraid ways that vehicle radar can show an inaccurate speed.
Since I sincerely doubt that those "Your Speed Is..." radar installations are ever calibrated to the standard the courts demand, they could not be used to prove someone was speeding.
Isn't that the "and the witnesses would have to demostrate that the driver was truly driving as such" that I said?
Quote from: Kniwt on October 13, 2013, 02:48:31 PM
Common (and necessary) in Canada. What I found amusing this summer is that, quite often, the sign that was affixed above it was a U.S.-standard sign that would say something like "SPEED LIMIT 80" instead of "MAXIMUM 80 km/h." I suspect the same machines are sold in both countries with a simple mi/km configuration option.
I would really like to see some photos of these. do you have speed limits above 85? 80 and 85 are found in the US readily, but a 90, or even a 100, would be a very very interesting thing to see.
Quote from: agentsteel53 on October 15, 2013, 12:55:45 PM
I would really like to see some photos of these. do you have speed limits above 85? 80 and 85 are found in the US readily, but a 90, or even a 100, would be a very very interesting thing to see.
The ones I saw in Canada (at least, the only ones that I bothered to remember) were portable ones within work zones, so the "speed limit" / "maximum" was always lower than 100. Sorry, didn't grab any pics, but there were many on TC 1 on Vancouver Island through the various work zones.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on October 15, 2013, 12:44:02 PM
Isn't that the "and the witnesses would have to demostrate that the driver was truly driving as such" that I said?
Courts take judicial notice of police radar *only* when the radar is shown to have been correctly calibrated at the time of the alleged violation and not subject to the known ways that it can give a false reading.
IOW, it's not enough to say "he was driving at XX MPH." All elements of the violation must be proven, and that includes proper verification that the radar was giving an accurate reading.