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Non-Road Boards => Off-Topic => Topic started by: hbelkins on November 22, 2013, 11:43:13 AM

Title: JFK assassination
Post by: hbelkins on November 22, 2013, 11:43:13 AM
Wonder how many here were alive 50 years ago today (11/22/63) when JFK was shot?

I was not yet 2 years old so I have no memory of it, but I knew and worked with Malcolm "Mac" Kilduff, the assistant press secretary who made the announcement that JFK was dead and recorded the swearing-in of LBJ aboard Air Force One with the microphone from a Dictaphone machine.

I've been sharing recollections of Mac on Facebook.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: Henry on November 22, 2013, 12:02:13 PM
I was born in 1970, but I recall all the times my father told me about that day, which he still describes as the worst one of his life, and how he saw Jack Ruby (the man who shot and killed JFK's assassin, Lee Harvey Oswald) as a hero.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: Brandon on November 22, 2013, 12:15:42 PM
As far as I am concerned, it's overdone.  It was 50 years ago, people need to get over it.  It was not anywhere on-par with September 11, 2001 or Pearl Harbor.  I don't see people commemorating 50 years since Lincoln or 50 years since Garfield or McKinley.  Hell, McKinley's 100th (last assassination prior to Kennedy) came and went without so much as a peep.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: jeffandnicole on November 22, 2013, 12:18:46 PM
No one is ever asked where they were when Lincoln was shot.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: agentsteel53 on November 22, 2013, 12:28:27 PM
I don't think even the "never forget!" hysteria of 9/11 are on par with 9/11.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: Brandon on November 22, 2013, 12:44:52 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on November 22, 2013, 12:18:46 PM
No one is ever asked where they were when Lincoln was shot.

Or when Nixon resigned for that matter.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: xcellntbuy on November 22, 2013, 12:57:35 PM
I had just turned age 3, 16 days prior, and yes I do remember the event.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: oscar on November 22, 2013, 01:46:49 PM
I was in an elementary school classroom, when the announcement was made by either the teacher, or the principal over the intercom.

As for whether the commemoration is overdone -- there's the enduring special adulation for the late President (not a universal sentiment -- I thought his less charismatic successor's accomplishments were far more consequential, for good or ill).  But the JFK assassination was also the first of a string of assassinations and attempted assassinations that took almost two decades to peter out, which along with other contributing factors like Vietnam and Watergate made for a particularly ugly period of U.S. history.  And we'll get to do this all over again in another five years, on the 50th anniversaries of the MLK and RFK assassinations. 
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: hbelkins on November 22, 2013, 02:24:00 PM
I remember where I was when I heard about RFK. In my dad's 1967 Chevy Impala, between town and home, listening to WHAS-AM radio break the news.

Also the Nixon resignation. I was in The Mall (now known as Mall St. Matthews) in Louisville when the news broke and it was playing on all the TVs in the window of an electronics store. Heard the resignation speech in a motel room in Louisville that night.

I think Kennedy's abbreviated term as president has been romanticized because he was assassinated. Being a martyr tends to increase public perception of your abilities.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: Brandon on November 22, 2013, 02:30:34 PM
Hell, if people want to romance about abbreviated Presidential terms, there's William Henry Harrison and James Garfield.  One died of pneumonia a month after taking office, and the other was assassinated only a few months after taking office.  Kennedy at least had time to do something (1,000 days).  We'll never know what Harrison or Garfield had in mind.

Pardon me while I roll my eyes at this and the whole conspiracy theory crappola.  :rolleyes:
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: hotdogPi on November 22, 2013, 02:37:32 PM
JFK is on the half dollar now, and they even allowed the half dollar to have Kennedy on the half dollar so soon after his death (normally it's not allowed). Nothing happened with the others (Lincoln didn't get his face on the penny immediately).
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: roadman on November 22, 2013, 02:53:26 PM
Quote from: Brandon on November 22, 2013, 12:15:42 PM
As far as I am concerned, it's overdone.  It was 50 years ago, people need to get over it.  It was not anywhere on-par with September 11, 2001 or Pearl Harbor.  I don't see people commemorating 50 years since Lincoln or 50 years since Garfield or McKinley.  Hell, McKinley's 100th (last assassination prior to Kennedy) came and went without so much as a peep.
Ditto
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: Grzrd on November 22, 2013, 02:57:56 PM
Quote from: roadman on November 22, 2013, 02:53:26 PM
Quote from: Brandon on November 22, 2013, 12:15:42 PM
As far as I am concerned, it's overdone.  It was 50 years ago, people need to get over it.  It was not anywhere on-par with September 11, 2001 or Pearl Harbor.  I don't see people commemorating 50 years since Lincoln or 50 years since Garfield or McKinley.  Hell, McKinley's 100th (last assassination prior to Kennedy) came and went without so much as a peep.
Ditto

Yeah, but McKinley never brokered a deal to allow an interstate to have the same number as a US route in the same state:

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FPRf0Xh7.jpg&hash=d7e5cb07e12122b709bb149024d5957f5aeaa843)
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: hotdogPi on November 22, 2013, 03:02:20 PM
Quote from: Grzrd on November 22, 2013, 02:57:56 PM
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FPRf0Xh7.jpg&hash=d7e5cb07e12122b709bb149024d5957f5aeaa843)

"Do not reproduce". Is this allowed?
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: agentsteel53 on November 22, 2013, 03:20:44 PM
Quote from: Brandon on November 22, 2013, 02:30:34 PM
William Henry Harrison

well, it's common knowledge he was stabbed by Anonymous.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: hbelkins on November 22, 2013, 03:37:09 PM
Quote from: 1 on November 22, 2013, 03:02:20 PM
"Do not reproduce". Is this allowed?

Maybe it was allowed (or not allowed, if you prefer) back in 1963, but I'd think the Freedom of Information Act would certainly preclude such a prohibition now. Of course, this federal publication itself consisted of copies of copyrighted material, so you never know...

(Cue an "about the sky" type mention of an Allowed Cloud in 3, 2,...)
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: Grzrd on November 22, 2013, 03:54:13 PM
I've seen this sign replayed a lot today (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kq1PbgeBoQ4):

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FE4t3dA2.png&hash=98538f8ee8b55551305763b1d7de70b990a5e501)
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: briantroutman on November 22, 2013, 04:09:50 PM
Quote from: oscar on November 22, 2013, 01:46:49 PM
As for whether the commemoration is overdone...the JFK assassination was also the first of a string of assassinations ...with other contributing factors like Vietnam and Watergate made for a particularly ugly period of U.S. history.

Yes, a difficult time. Not like World War II, the Great Depression (1929-41), World War I, the Long Depression (1873-79), the Civil War, the War of 1812, the Revolutionary War...

This anniversary–with the special edition Time/Life keepsake magazines at the supermarket checkout and all of the attendant ceremoniousness–is the spectacle it is because, as a group, baby boomers think their generation, their experiences, and their cultural touchstones are the pivotal moments in the history of the universe.

The baby boom generation includes lots of great people (including probably many on this message board–no offense intended), but as a group, they're impossibly self-fixated. And don't even get me started on my own generation.

Quote from: agentsteel53 on November 22, 2013, 12:28:27 PM
I don't think even the "never forget!" hysteria of 9/11 are on par with 9/11.

And for similar reasons–because New Yorkers believe that their lives, their cultural touchstones....are the most important in the entire universe.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: PHLBOS on November 22, 2013, 04:30:23 PM
The assassination took place nearly 2 years before I was born. 

However, having grown up in Massachusetts and having a mother that lived in Brookline as a child; my family had a lot of JFK assassination-related literature.  It drove my father, who was from Amityville, NY, absolutely nuts. 

A hardcover book called Four Days and a 2-album set of Four Days That Shocked the World being two of them.  Plus some old newspapers (mainly the Boston Herald & the Record American) from that time period.  One page in the movie theater listing included an ad. for the movie It's a Mad Mad Mad Mad World.

in 1998, while visiting a friend in Dallas; I paid a visit to Dealey Plaza.  Much of that area hasn't really changed all that much since Nov. 1963 (at least in 1998).  The BGS' that replaced the old FORT WORTH TURNPIKE BGS' are the exact same size and shape but contains current route information and is more MUTCD compliant.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: NE2 on November 22, 2013, 06:04:35 PM
Quote from: Brandon on November 22, 2013, 12:15:42 PM
I don't see people commemorating 50 years since Lincoln
http://stuffnobodycaresabout.com/2013/11/20/how-the-50th-anniversary-of-president-lincolns-assassination-was-observed/

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fstuffnobodycaresabout.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2013%2F11%2FBurlington-Weekly-Free-Press-1915-4-15.jpg&hash=c8b163ee02f6992c8bd3a84d4c6d3b4b93e0170b)
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: Alps on November 22, 2013, 07:47:14 PM
Quote from: 1 on November 22, 2013, 03:02:20 PM

"Do not reproduce". Is this allowed?
Until you're legal, yes.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: SidS1045 on November 22, 2013, 07:56:27 PM
Quote from: Brandon on November 22, 2013, 12:15:42 PM
As far as I am concerned, it's overdone.  It was 50 years ago, people need to get over it.  It was not anywhere on-par with September 11, 2001 or Pearl Harbor.  I don't see people commemorating 50 years since Lincoln or 50 years since Garfield or McKinley.  Hell, McKinley's 100th (last assassination prior to Kennedy) came and went without so much as a peep.

JFK's assassination still resonates because lots of people who were alive back then are still alive AND because the nation was able to live through it together.  Even in McKinley's time, news often took days to reach newspaper readers.  No radio, no TV, no Internet.  This time, news was virtually instantaneous and unfolded before our eyes, even without Abraham Zapruder's film, which was only made available to the general public decades after that day in Dallas.

It was also important because the American people felt as if they really knew him on an almost intimate level.  He was the first president to master the use of TV and we saw constant images of a young, vital, vigorous man with a gorgeous wife and two children who were almost as photogenic as their parents were.  He was the first president to have won a Pulitzer prize, meaning that he had an intellectual depth too many politicians lack.  But, far from being merely an academic, he was wise enough to be able to stare down the Soviet Union and keep us out of what could have been the final world war, fought with nuclear weapons.  All of this and more explains why his murder was taken personally by so many.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: SidS1045 on November 22, 2013, 08:00:59 PM
Quote from: Henry on November 22, 2013, 12:02:13 PM
I was born in 1970, but I recall all the times my father told me about that day, which he still describes as the worst one of his life, and how he saw Jack Ruby (the man who shot and killed JFK's assassin, Lee Harvey Oswald) as a hero.

Jack Ruby was no hero.  His action insured that we would never know the full story, which is why so many conspiracy theories have sprung up.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: J N Winkler on November 22, 2013, 10:28:09 PM
My take on the fiftieth anniversary of Kennedy's assassination is that in part it is about saying goodbye to the conspiracy theories.  He was born 96 years ago and although his mother died at the age of 104, none of his siblings who died of natural causes did so beyond the age of 88, so it is likely he would be dead by now even if history had taken a different course at Dallas.  Kennedy looked youthful riding in the open car in Dealey Plaza, but in reality was already middle-aged, as were all of the people who might have even a remote interest in conspiring to kill him.  If there was in fact a conspiracy, then all or nearly all of the participants must be dead too.

As Fred Kaplan observed in Slate about a week ago, the Warren Commission was deeply compromised but its conclusions have, by and large, weathered challenge.  There will be conspiracy theorists spinning ideas about the Kennedy assassination long after we are all dead, but I believe this anniversary year will mark the last time they do so as part of the political and cultural mainstream.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: Jardine on November 22, 2013, 10:45:39 PM
I was in 1st grade for JFKs assassination, so while I remember it, and where I was when I found out, it did not have the impact on me that it did my parents.

Biggest jolt in this manner of thing I have experienced was the loss of Space Shuttle Challenger.

Bad as 9/11 and Columbia and the others assassinations, Challenger was for me, by far the worst thing* I've experienced. 





*for a shared national tragedy.  I've had some personal losses of more devastating impact than Challenger.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: roadman65 on November 22, 2013, 10:59:17 PM
I was hearing about that a railroad tower operator that was working in the rail yard next to  Dealy Plaza saw two strange individuals near a picketed fence right around where Kennedy was shot!  The funny thing is that this man died in a car wreck on US 67 someplace where it is now a freeway, but at the time it was a two lane highway.  A news story told us, that his remains were instantly cremated.

The same story also stated that a total of 18 people connected to the Kennedy assassination died mysteriously.  The rail tower man, even though ruled out as a simple accident could have been a situation where he was run off the road by another vehicle.  We do not know.

As far as conspiracy goes, I think it definitely was.  The only thing is why to this day they will not release the culprit who put out the hit as he (or she) must be dead by now.   Even if it were Hoover or LBJ who many suspect, both have died decades ago.

In addition, I think Marilyn Monroe was murdered as well.  Her suicide was fixed that way and most likely the same organization or persons involved in both JFK and RFK that ordered her death.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: jeffandnicole on November 22, 2013, 11:07:43 PM
Quote from: Jardine on November 22, 2013, 10:45:39 PM

Biggest jolt in this manner of thing I have experienced was the loss of Space Shuttle Challenger.


That for me would probably count as my first big 'memory' of something big happening.  Making it a little closer - a teacher in my school at the time had applied to be the teacher going to space, so she was thinking that it could have been her up there...
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: NE2 on November 22, 2013, 11:34:12 PM
oh my god vince foster
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: corco on November 23, 2013, 02:57:09 AM
QuoteMaking it a little closer - a teacher in my school at the time had applied to be the teacher going to space, so she was thinking that it could have been her up there...

An elementary school teacher in my hometown, Barbara Morgan, was actually McAuliffe's backup. She ended up joining NASA later as a normal astronaut and went up in 2007. I never had her as a teacher though I had classmates who did- she had stopped teaching to focus on space by the time I moved to town, but that was pretty exciting. Our local ham radio guy set up something in the school gym so we were able to talk to her. Pretty exciting for a town of 2,000.

We built a new elementary school a couple years ago and named it after her.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: Scott5114 on November 23, 2013, 03:38:09 AM
Quote from: SidS1045 on November 22, 2013, 07:56:27 PM
JFK's assassination still resonates because lots of people who were alive back then are still alive AND because the nation was able to live through it together.  Even in McKinley's time, news often took days to reach newspaper readers.  No radio, no TV, no Internet.  This time, news was virtually instantaneous and unfolded before our eyes, even without Abraham Zapruder's film, which was only made available to the general public decades after that day in Dallas.

Another thing to keep in mind is that McKinley's administration was greatly overshadowed by his successor's, such that by the 50th anniversary of his death, McKinley's time in office was viewed as just a prelude to Roosevelt's. JFK wasn't overshadowed by LBJ like that.

Personally, the first time I had ever heard the name William McKinley, it was as a result of looking up who was on the $500 bill. (I wish they'd bring it back–it would certainly make my job easier–although I would probably replace McKinley with someone else, probably Theodore Roosevelt or Martin Luther King Jr.)
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: bugo on November 23, 2013, 09:02:31 AM
On November 20, a customer spent 17 JFK half dollars.  On November 22, 50 years after his assassination to the day, a customer spent 29 halves.  This equals 46 Kennedy halves.  He was 46 when he was assassinated. Of course I bought the halves.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi167.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fu126%2Fbugo348%2FIMG_20131122_223858_zpsa557a4b2.jpg%3Ft%3D1385214336&hash=c7a71cf7d82fe05bff766ec5350baf20e61db757)

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi167.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fu126%2Fbugo348%2FIMG_20131121_011155_zpsda43aec7.jpg%3Ft%3D1385214362&hash=a87762616ab4336d4bda794042cbb3e7045dc104)
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: SP Cook on November 23, 2013, 11:18:39 AM
The cult of Kennedy was born the day Kennedy died.  It is made, more than anything, by revisionist amateur historians who today are about 60 to 70 that want to believe that, really, Kennedy would not have ordered them to Vietnam like Johnson did, "forcing" them to run away, literally or figurativly.  Had he lived, the 60s would have played out pretty much the same.  To echo his (ghost written) inaugural address, a "new generation, born in this century", was handed a nation a peace with the world and at peace with itself, and they managed to inflict wounds upon it that have still not healed.

The nutty conspiracy theories are just a symptom of that disease.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: hbelkins on November 23, 2013, 12:47:53 PM
My friend and co-worker Mac Kilduff, who made the death announcement, always theorized that Oswald's real target was Connally. Connally had signed Oswald's dishonorable discharge papers and denied his appeal, and Oswald had written Connally threatening letters.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: Brandon on November 23, 2013, 01:13:18 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on November 23, 2013, 12:47:53 PM
My friend and co-worker Mac Kilduff, who made the death announcement, always theorized that Oswald's real target was Connally. Connally had signed Oswald's dishonorable discharge papers and denied his appeal, and Oswald had written Connally threatening letters.

That's plausible, and has precedent in the so-called attempted assassination on FDR.  It is highly suspected by many, particularly around Chicago that Zangara was aiming for Mayor Anton Cermak, not FDR.  I mean, how the hell do you miss a guy that is in a wheelchair?
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: xcellntbuy on November 23, 2013, 01:50:59 PM
Quote from: SidS1045 on November 22, 2013, 07:56:27 PM
Quote from: Brandon on November 22, 2013, 12:15:42 PM
As far as I am concerned, it's overdone.  It was 50 years ago, people need to get over it.  It was not anywhere on-par with September 11, 2001 or Pearl Harbor.  I don't see people commemorating 50 years since Lincoln or 50 years since Garfield or McKinley.  Hell, McKinley's 100th (last assassination prior to Kennedy) came and went without so much as a peep.

JFK's assassination still resonates because lots of people who were alive back then are still alive AND because the nation was able to live through it together.  Even in McKinley's time, news often took days to reach newspaper readers.  No radio, no TV, no Internet.  This time, news was virtually instantaneous and unfolded before our eyes, even without Abraham Zapruder's film, which was only made available to the general public decades after that day in Dallas.

It was also important because the American people felt as if they really knew him on an almost intimate level.  He was the first president to master the use of TV and we saw constant images of a young, vital, vigorous man with a gorgeous wife and two children who were almost as photogenic as their parents were.  He was the first president to have won a Pulitzer prize, meaning that he had an intellectual depth too many politicians lack.  But, far from being merely an academic, he was wise enough to be able to stare down the Soviet Union and keep us out of what could have been the final world war, fought with nuclear weapons.  All of this and more explains why his murder was taken personally by so many.
The quickest form of media communication on September 6, 1901 when William McKinley was shot was the telegraph.  The telephone was much more limited in use.  Marconi's first radio signal from North America to Europe had only occurred in the same year.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: elsmere241 on November 23, 2013, 05:57:30 PM
Quote from: Jardine on November 22, 2013, 10:45:39 PMBad as 9/11 and Columbia and the others assassinations, Challenger was for me, by far the worst thing* I've experienced. 

*for a shared national tragedy.  I've had some personal losses of more devastating impact than Challenger.

Challenger happened the day that was the beginning of the end for my sister's leukemia.  A few days before September 11th was the beginning of the end for the job I had at the time.  Columbia didn't just remind me of Challenger but everything else that happened for me that week.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: oscar on November 23, 2013, 07:00:52 PM
Quote from: bugo on November 23, 2013, 09:02:31 AM
On November 20, a customer spent 17 JFK half dollars.  On November 22, 50 years after his assassination to the day, a customer spent 29 halves.  This equals 46 Kennedy halves.  He was 46 when he was assassinated. Of course I bought the halves.

Any of them silver, to increase your luck?
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: xcellntbuy on November 23, 2013, 07:39:42 PM
Quote from: bugo on November 23, 2013, 09:02:31 AM
On November 20, a customer spent 17 JFK half dollars.  On November 22, 50 years after his assassination to the day, a customer spent 29 halves.  This equals 46 Kennedy halves.  He was 46 when he was assassinated. Of course I bought the halves.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi167.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fu126%2Fbugo348%2FIMG_20131122_223858_zpsa557a4b2.jpg%3Ft%3D1385214336&hash=c7a71cf7d82fe05bff766ec5350baf20e61db757)

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi167.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fu126%2Fbugo348%2FIMG_20131121_011155_zpsda43aec7.jpg%3Ft%3D1385214362&hash=a87762616ab4336d4bda794042cbb3e7045dc104)
Nice!  (Fellow collector here.)
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: bugo on November 23, 2013, 07:49:38 PM
Quote from: oscar on November 23, 2013, 07:00:52 PM
Quote from: bugo on November 23, 2013, 09:02:31 AM
On November 20, a customer spent 17 JFK half dollars.  On November 22, 50 years after his assassination to the day, a customer spent 29 halves.  This equals 46 Kennedy halves.  He was 46 when he was assassinated. Of course I bought the halves.

Any of them silver, to increase your luck?

No, but I did find a silver bicentennial quarter last night.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: SidS1045 on November 23, 2013, 11:40:44 PM
Quote from: Brandon on November 23, 2013, 01:13:18 PM
how the hell do you miss a guy that is in a wheelchair?

FDR rarely, if ever, appeared in public in a wheelchair.  He had leg braces and an assistant (Louis Howe) to lean on.  On that particular day he was, as just about always, standing when he was shot at.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: J N Winkler on November 24, 2013, 12:42:02 AM
One important distinction to be made among the four Presidential assassinations, all of which were by gunshot wound, is that only Kennedy and Lincoln succumbed within 24 hours of the initial attack.  McKinley lived for eight days after being shot (immediate cause of death was gangrene), while Garfield lived for 80 days (immediate cause of death was rupture of the splenic artery).  Of the four, Kennedy lived for the shortest time (by far) after being shot:  first wound probably at 12.29 PM, pronounced dead at 1.00 PM.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: dirtroad66 on November 24, 2013, 01:06:01 AM
I'm not old enough for JFK thing. Was at the lauch of the challenger that day, we knew something didn't look right but did not realize it exploded till we heard on radio like an hour later.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: JMoses24 on November 24, 2013, 01:59:35 AM
I was not alive yet, my mom was barely 6 months old. My dad, on the other hand, was 14... yes my mom married young. I should've asked my dad earlier tonight where he was when JFK was assassinated, but missed the opportunity.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: on_wisconsin on November 24, 2013, 02:37:11 AM
Neither myself nor my parents where alive when JFK died. (I'm in my 20's)
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: elsmere241 on November 24, 2013, 11:35:27 AM
My father was in Pakistan when JFK happened and didn't hear about it until the next day.  OTOH, my grandmother saw Ruby kill Oswald on either live or almost-live television.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: bugo on November 25, 2013, 01:41:17 AM
Quote from: 1 on November 22, 2013, 02:37:32 PM
JFK is on the half dollar now, and they even allowed the half dollar to have Kennedy on the half dollar so soon after his death (normally it's not allowed). Nothing happened with the others (Lincoln didn't get his face on the penny immediately).

Not true.  FDR was put on the dime in 1946 and Eisenhower was put on the dollar in 1971.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: english si on November 25, 2013, 09:39:37 AM
Quote from: J N Winkler on November 22, 2013, 10:28:09 PMKennedy looked youthful riding in the open car in Dealey Plaza, but in reality was already middle-aged
And suffering from a degenerative illness that meant that he was high on the drugs to deal with it when he made decisions on the Cuban Missile Crisis (thankfully the right ones!).

JFK's youth was his brand. It helped him win the election (it's debateable whether he won the popular vote, so close was it), not least thanks to the vigour he appeared to have on the TV debate.

One suspects that, if he wasn't assassinated, he would be remembered as a pretty bad president. He'd have won in '64, but his ill health would have caused issues later in that term. JFK was more aggressive on 'nam than LBJ, so he would have certainly had that to tarnish his name. Plus the veneer of glamour would have come off 'Camelot' and there wouldn't have been this cult of JFK that helps us bury his being a total sleezeball.

Over on this side of the pond, friends of CS Lewis, who died about an hour before, didn't get to hear of his death until after the funeral, as the news was solely focussed on events in Dallas for several days. That's a very rare event to get such blanket coverage, but it was the height of the Cold War, and JFK was leader of the free world (something that is nowhere near as true now) - the President is assassinated, therefore the threat of mutally assured destruction coming into play is high.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: hotdogPi on November 25, 2013, 03:35:19 PM
Quote from: bugo on November 25, 2013, 01:41:17 AM
Quote from: 1 on November 22, 2013, 02:37:32 PM
JFK is on the half dollar now, and they even allowed the half dollar to have Kennedy on the half dollar so soon after his death (normally it's not allowed). Nothing happened with the others (Lincoln didn't get his face on the penny immediately).

Not true.  FDR was put on the dime in 1946 and Eisenhower was put on the dollar in 1971.

This was a response to "Why Kennedy and not Garfield or anyone else". I was only referring to the 4 assassinated people.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: corco on November 25, 2013, 06:28:39 PM
Wait, so presidents that die of natural causes or leave office normally can have their face on coins right after they leave the presidency but it is normally disallowed for assassinated presidents?
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: hotdogPi on November 25, 2013, 06:44:18 PM
Quote from: corco on November 25, 2013, 06:28:39 PM
Wait, so presidents that die of natural causes or leave office normally can have their face on coins right after they leave the presidency but it is normally disallowed for assassinated presidents?

No. The point is that he's one of the important ones because they made an exception for him. (Compared to Garfield).

Note: Even if this doesn't happen, that doesn't automatically mean that person is not one of the important ones.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: Alps on November 25, 2013, 06:51:03 PM
Quote from: 1 on November 25, 2013, 06:44:18 PM
Quote from: corco on November 25, 2013, 06:28:39 PM
Wait, so presidents that die of natural causes or leave office normally can have their face on coins right after they leave the presidency but it is normally disallowed for assassinated presidents?

No. The point is that he's one of the important ones because they made an exception for him. (Compared to Garfield).

Note: Even if this doesn't happen, that doesn't automatically mean that person is not one of the important ones.
... No one really wanted to put Garfield on a coin. Presidential coins didn't begin until Lincoln. Who was assassinated since 1909? JFK. That's it.
In terms of Presidential deaths in general, we've already seen that Ike, JFK, and FDR all made it onto coins right away. Who else has appeared? Jefferson - long dead, still there. Washington - long dead, still there. Franklin - long dead, replaced by JFK.

In other words, you're wrong.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: NE2 on November 25, 2013, 07:02:28 PM
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FHs77Xp6.jpg&hash=5552a74244af67a7c7a79b7130b2d7df8604ff0c)
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: bugo on November 25, 2013, 09:08:43 PM
Garfield and McKinley were mostly forgettable.  The Mint was still putting Liberty on coins when Lincoln was shot.  Kennedy was a larger than life figure and that is why he was put on the half dollar so quickly.

BTW did you hear about the idiot who started a bill to put Ronald Reagan on the dime WHILE HE WAS STILL ALIVE (despite the fact that it is not legal to do so)?

[deleted politics]
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: NE2 on November 25, 2013, 11:32:55 PM
Quote from: bugo on November 25, 2013, 09:08:43 PM
BTW did you hear about the idiot who started a bill to put Ronald Reagan on the dime WHILE HE WAS STILL ALIVE (despite the fact that it is not legal to do so)?
Presumably that bill would amend whatever law makes it illegal to put wingnuts on dimes.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: SP Cook on November 26, 2013, 07:41:07 AM
You all are confusing coins and stamps.

There is no general law about coins.  The law itself dictates who is on a coin, and thus, theoretically, Congress could decide to put anybody or anything on a coin. living or dead, real or imaginary. 

Stamps are covered by a law that delegates who gets on to a commission.  No living person can be on a stamp, presidents get a stamp on their first birthday after their death.  No one else can get a stamp until dead 10 years.  Non-presidents are not supposed to repeat more often than every 25 years.  Presidents can repeat more often.

Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: NE2 on November 26, 2013, 07:47:22 AM
Laws can amend laws, bro.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: roadman on November 26, 2013, 01:02:07 PM
Quote from: NE2 on November 26, 2013, 07:47:22 AM
Laws can amend laws, bro.
"Notwithstanding any general or special law, regulation, or rule to the contrary ..." is the usual way politicians start off any sort of "special privildge" legislation.
Title: Re: JFK assassination
Post by: Scott5114 on November 26, 2013, 02:02:32 PM
Quote from: bugo on November 25, 2013, 09:08:43 PM
Garfield and McKinley were mostly forgettable.

Garfield was, but McKinley has been credited for doing a lot of the work that set the US up to become a twentieth-century superpower. It's just that he was followed by Theodore Roosevelt, so a lot of the time his administration is viewed as a mere preface to TR's.

Besides, who needs to be on a coin when you've got this?
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/be/500_USD_note%3B_series_of_1934%3B_obverse.jpg/1024px-500_USD_note%3B_series_of_1934%3B_obverse.jpg)