So...I was out driving some highways in northern Idaho today as I push to finish clinching the system soon. I learned that Idaho does indeed have unpaved segments of state highway- I thought their whole system was paved, but evidently SH-64 has a few miles of gravel as it heads down the grade from Nezperce to Kamiah and then the southern segment of SH-7 south of US 12, up the grade from Orofino towards Nezperce is also dirt.
Anyway, on Highway 7 I noticed something that I don't think could happen more than a handful of other times around the country. The southern segment of SH-7 heads south from US 12 through Clearwater County as a dirt road, up a massive grade, and then turns into a county road at the Lewis County line. What's odd is that pavement begins at the Lewis County line, so the road actually improves substantially in its condition as it's passed to a lesser maintainer.
Not the best picture, but you can kind of see how pavement begins after the county line (note the odd END SH-7 sign- Idaho is normally insanely good about signing their highways, but this one seems to be the exception. I'm pretty sure it's the only such exception in the entire state- there's no clue you're on SH-7 when you're on the segment south of US 12 besides mileposts, ITD spec signage, and then this sign):
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.corcohighways.org%2Fid7a.jpg&hash=04edd43b5b3bab3f99200555ca9c8d048470ee23)
Heading the other way, there's no SH-7 reassurance marker, but that's an ITD type speed limit sign and there are mileposts and it's listed in the state route log:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.corcohighways.org%2Fid7b.jpg&hash=8be388b9abff68d56fa9ba91508e4052d76fb151)
What makes this slightly more (less?) interesting is that the Lewis County portion of the road was at one point also SH-7, and that highway went through Nezperce and down to Grangeville, but was decommissioned I believe in the 70s. A portion of it was recommissioned as SH-162, but only a short bit south of Nezperce.
Anyway, there's certainly dozens upon dozens upon dozens of instances of paved state highways ending at dirt county roads, but are there any other instances of dirt state highways ending at paved county roads?
Idaho has gravel roads with a speed limit of 50? NJ has divided highways with speed limits of 45.
Montana has dirt roads with speed limits of 70!
Don't worry though- I think more often than not Idaho underposts speed limits for out west. Where there's traffic and twistyness, Idaho has been getting skiddish lately about speed limits.
There might be a few cases where an unpaved state highway becomes a paved road at a state line. For that matter, how many unpaved state highways are there? (primary only in NC-SC-VA-WV) Even out west there can't be too many.
Montana is a smorgasbord of unpaved state highways- a huge chunk of secondaries don't have pavement, and even at least one primary (38) is totally unpaved. I think NM has a bunch of dirt ones too. Wyoming is totally paved.
Other states I know of:
WA- the end of SR 165
AZ- parts of 288, 366, i know I'm missing at least one more that isn't coming to me off the top of my head
UT- a few, namely the Moki Dugway
ID- I'm 97% sure it's only that part of SH 7 and SH 64
NE- there's two highways whose numbers I don't know off the top of my head
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
Montana is a smorgasbord of unpaved state highways- a huge chunk of secondaries don't have pavement
Are these actually state highways, or state-signed county highways? I know when the secondaries were first created they were all county maintained, and (AFAIK) the state took over each one as it improved it.
California, for the record, has none that are open to traffic (SR 173 is closed).
Yes- state signed county highways. Even 38, which is a primary highway, is county-maintained. I don't know that MDT directly deals with unpaved roadways, and I know that's a sore point between the Montana Association of Counties and MDT.
Leads to some weird things though- I don't have a picture handy but on the Ovando-Helmville Road like a block south of Ovando, MT, there's a random S-271 reassurance shield despite S-271 not being anywhere near there.
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
I'm pretty sure SD 20 from the Montana state line to Camp Crook is the only section of state highway in the state that is still unpaved, but I could be wrong.
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:27:08 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
I'm pretty sure SD 20 from the Montana state line to Camp Crook is the only section of state highway in the state that is still unpaved, but I could be wrong.
Interesting- I don't know the system that well, so that's definitely possible. I gotta say, I was over there recently and I was quite surprised by the signage treatment- most states tend to not sign the unpaved parts as well, but then there's South Dakota with full reassurance shield and welcome signage, just like a regular state highway.
(headed northbound along the state line)
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.corcohighways.org%2Fsd201.jpg&hash=82fbd8ffb7a3eb93a77a22450b63514bd4268e42)
(as it turns east)
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.corcohighways.org%2Fsd202.jpg&hash=4e08389dbd93f4c87373af2fa98422bfc721fe47)
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:31:42 PM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:27:08 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
I'm pretty sure SD 20 from the Montana state line to Camp Crook is the only section of state highway in the state that is still unpaved, but I could be wrong.
Interesting- I don't know the system that well, so that's definitely possible. I gotta say, I was over there recently and I was quite surprised by the signage treatment- most states tend to not sign the unpaved parts as well, but then there's South Dakota with full reassurance shield and welcome signage, just like a regular state highway.
Yeah, it's odd that we'd do that with SD 20 because we tend to not add enough signage on a lot of our other highways.
Connecticut I know for a fact has no unpaved state highways. As far as I'm aware, Rhode Island and Massachusetts don't, either. Vermont does have a few, though.
New York I don't think does, but I could be wrong. Pennsylvania I'm going to assume must have some unpaved quadrant route somewhere just because there are so many of them of so little significance.
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:19:47 PM
Leads to some weird things though- I don't have a picture handy but on the Ovando-Helmville Road like a block south of Ovando, MT, there's a random S-271 reassurance shield despite S-271 not being anywhere near there.
That used to be part of S-272 (which continued southeast from Helmville to Avon via MT 141) until 1976, but it doesn't seem to have ever been S-271 (which instead went north from Helmville on MT 141).
http://archive.org/stream/montanafederalai1975mont#page/122/mode/1up
http://archive.org/stream/montanafederalai1976mont#page/124/mode/2up
(Yes, MT 141 was numbered because it was P-41.)
Ovando-Helmville was part of the 1930s MT 31: http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/topo/250k/txu-pclmaps-topo-us-butte-1947.jpg
Yeah- speaking of that, there is actually a text "Highway 272" trailblazer pointing towards 141 up Three Mile Road north of Avon, approximately right here
http://goo.gl/maps/CER5i
I've got all these pictures on my work computer because I inventoried the entire county's road signage this summer- I need to snag them. There's a couple embossed signs floating around too.
Quote from: Duke87 on January 19, 2014, 11:48:48 PM
Connecticut I know for a fact has no unpaved state highways. As far as I'm aware, Rhode Island and Massachusetts don't, either. Vermont does have a few, though.
New York I don't think does, but I could be wrong. Pennsylvania I'm going to assume must have some unpaved quadrant route somewhere just because there are so many of them of so little significance.
I've never come across anything in RI, MA, NY, or PA. PA really paves every little road.
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:36:52 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:31:42 PM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:27:08 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
I'm pretty sure SD 20 from the Montana state line to Camp Crook is the only section of state highway in the state that is still unpaved, but I could be wrong.
Interesting- I don't know the system that well, so that's definitely possible. I gotta say, I was over there recently and I was quite surprised by the signage treatment- most states tend to not sign the unpaved parts as well, but then there's South Dakota with full reassurance shield and welcome signage, just like a regular state highway.
Yeah, it's odd that we'd do that with SD 20 because we tend to not add enough signage on a lot of our other highways.
What about SD 53? I think it's unpaved from just south of I-90 to just north of SD 44.
(and why does it even exist?)
Quote from: SD Mapman on January 20, 2014, 12:44:22 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:36:52 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:31:42 PM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:27:08 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
I'm pretty sure SD 20 from the Montana state line to Camp Crook is the only section of state highway in the state that is still unpaved, but I could be wrong.
Interesting- I don't know the system that well, so that's definitely possible. I gotta say, I was over there recently and I was quite surprised by the signage treatment- most states tend to not sign the unpaved parts as well, but then there's South Dakota with full reassurance shield and welcome signage, just like a regular state highway.
Yeah, it's odd that we'd do that with SD 20 because we tend to not add enough signage on a lot of our other highways.
What about SD 53? I think it's unpaved from just south of I-90 to just north of SD 44.
(and why does it even exist?)
I said I could be wrong, and I guess I was. Although I agree that highway doesn't look like it serves much of a purpose.
There's a good chunk of KY 199 in Pike County that's gravel.
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 12:50:08 AM
Quote from: SD Mapman on January 20, 2014, 12:44:22 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:36:52 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:31:42 PM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:27:08 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
I'm pretty sure SD 20 from the Montana state line to Camp Crook is the only section of state highway in the state that is still unpaved, but I could be wrong.
Interesting- I don't know the system that well, so that's definitely possible. I gotta say, I was over there recently and I was quite surprised by the signage treatment- most states tend to not sign the unpaved parts as well, but then there's South Dakota with full reassurance shield and welcome signage, just like a regular state highway.
Yeah, it's odd that we'd do that with SD 20 because we tend to not add enough signage on a lot of our other highways.
What about SD 53? I think it's unpaved from just south of I-90 to just north of SD 44.
(and why does it even exist?)
I said I could be wrong, and I guess I was. Although I agree that highway doesn't look like it serves much of a purpose.
A lot of 1804/1806 are also unpaved.
Quote from: hbelkins on January 20, 2014, 01:08:27 AM
There's a good chunk of KY 199 in Pike County that's gravel.
Holy crap. The Goog doesn't even show the road, but it's on the aerial and signed where it meets KY 632 (http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=37.493537,-82.250412&spn=0.013807,0.028346&t=m&z=16&layer=c&cbll=37.493427,-82.249711&panoid=-OSQUtPcR0Igsg2TboNpzQ&cbp=12,306.32,,0,1.65).
Apparently KY 1679 (Little Shepherd Trail) was recently paved.
Quote from: Steve on January 20, 2014, 12:27:12 AM
Quote from: Duke87 on January 19, 2014, 11:48:48 PM
Pennsylvania I'm going to assume must have some unpaved quadrant route somewhere just because there are so many of them of so little significance.
I've never come across anything in RI, MA, NY, or PA. PA really paves every little road.
The state maintained mileage of gravel roads is dwindling, but there are still some unpaved SRs in PA. One that comes to mind is a section of White Deer Pike (http://bit.ly/1dmFkVP) (SR 1010) near the notoriously deserted "Mile Run" exit on I-80. But as I said, the unpaved mileage is dwindling: The unpaved portion was nearly twice as long a decade ago.
You can find more on the official PennDOT statewide map (in PDF here (http://bit.ly/1bcNpg1)). The vast majority of roads shown on the map are SRs, and lines in light gray indicate unpaved sections. You can then check the corresponding Type 10 county map to verify that the road is an SR and find out the number.
I'm not aware of any primary routes (1 through 999) that still have any unpaved sections, though.
Quote from: Molandfreak on January 20, 2014, 01:13:36 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 12:50:08 AM
Quote from: SD Mapman on January 20, 2014, 12:44:22 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:36:52 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:31:42 PM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:27:08 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
I'm pretty sure SD 20 from the Montana state line to Camp Crook is the only section of state highway in the state that is still unpaved, but I could be wrong.
Interesting- I don't know the system that well, so that's definitely possible. I gotta say, I was over there recently and I was quite surprised by the signage treatment- most states tend to not sign the unpaved parts as well, but then there's South Dakota with full reassurance shield and welcome signage, just like a regular state highway.
Yeah, it's odd that we'd do that with SD 20 because we tend to not add enough signage on a lot of our other highways.
What about SD 53? I think it's unpaved from just south of I-90 to just north of SD 44.
(and why does it even exist?)
I said I could be wrong, and I guess I was. Although I agree that highway doesn't look like it serves much of a purpose.
A lot of 1804/1806 are also unpaved.
Personally I think those two are nothing more than glorified river walks and serve no purpose as state highways (nobody would use them to travel from Point A to Point B; there are almost no cities along either route), but they are technically state highways and I did forget about them so, yeah. It's only a few miles of 1804, but I guess I was really wrong. :banghead:
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 01:56:09 AM
Quote from: Molandfreak on January 20, 2014, 01:13:36 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 12:50:08 AM
Quote from: SD Mapman on January 20, 2014, 12:44:22 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:36:52 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:31:42 PM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:27:08 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
I'm pretty sure SD 20 from the Montana state line to Camp Crook is the only section of state highway in the state that is still unpaved, but I could be wrong.
Interesting- I don't know the system that well, so that's definitely possible. I gotta say, I was over there recently and I was quite surprised by the signage treatment- most states tend to not sign the unpaved parts as well, but then there's South Dakota with full reassurance shield and welcome signage, just like a regular state highway.
Yeah, it's odd that we'd do that with SD 20 because we tend to not add enough signage on a lot of our other highways.
What about SD 53? I think it's unpaved from just south of I-90 to just north of SD 44.
(and why does it even exist?)
I said I could be wrong, and I guess I was. Although I agree that highway doesn't look like it serves much of a purpose.
A lot of 1804/1806 are also unpaved.
Personally I think those two are nothing more than glorified river walks and serve no purpose as state highways (nobody would use them to travel from Point A to Point B; there are almost no cities along either route), but they are technically state highways and I did forget about them so, yeah. It's only a few miles of 1804, but I guess I was really wrong. :banghead:
Oh I totally agree with you; I just wanted to point it out.
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
Montana is a smorgasbord of unpaved state highways- a huge chunk of secondaries don't have pavement, and even at least one primary (38) is totally unpaved. I think NM has a bunch of dirt ones too. Wyoming is totally paved.
Other states I know of:
WA- the end of SR 165
AZ- parts of 288, 366, i know I'm missing at least one more that isn't coming to me off the top of my head
UT- a few, namely the Moki Dugway
ID- I'm 97% sure it's only that part of SH 7 and SH 64
NE- there's two highways whose numbers I don't know off the top of my head
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
Nebraska's unpaved state roads are N-67 between N-2 and US-34 in Otoe and Cass Counties, N-65 going south from Pawnee City to the Kansas border, the easternmost segment of N-18, which ends at US-283, and the S67C spur, which goes west from the gravel portion of N-65 and bizarrely exists as state highway.
Quote from: Molandfreak on January 20, 2014, 02:15:48 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 01:56:09 AM
Quote from: Molandfreak on January 20, 2014, 01:13:36 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 12:50:08 AM
Quote from: SD Mapman on January 20, 2014, 12:44:22 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:36:52 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:31:42 PM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:27:08 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
I'm pretty sure SD 20 from the Montana state line to Camp Crook is the only section of state highway in the state that is still unpaved, but I could be wrong.
Interesting- I don't know the system that well, so that's definitely possible. I gotta say, I was over there recently and I was quite surprised by the signage treatment- most states tend to not sign the unpaved parts as well, but then there's South Dakota with full reassurance shield and welcome signage, just like a regular state highway.
Yeah, it's odd that we'd do that with SD 20 because we tend to not add enough signage on a lot of our other highways.
What about SD 53? I think it's unpaved from just south of I-90 to just north of SD 44.
(and why does it even exist?)
I said I could be wrong, and I guess I was. Although I agree that highway doesn't look like it serves much of a purpose.
A lot of 1804/1806 are also unpaved.
Personally I think those two are nothing more than glorified river walks and serve no purpose as state highways (nobody would use them to travel from Point A to Point B; there are almost no cities along either route), but they are technically state highways and I did forget about them so, yeah. It's only a few miles of 1804, but I guess I was really wrong. :banghead:
Oh I totally agree with you; I just wanted to point it out.
Hmmm, that makes sense... where exactly is that on 1804? (never driven the "river-walks" all the way)
I think their only purpose is to serve recreation areas. (If you want evidence on their poor quality, my avatar is on 1806 north of Fort Pierre)
Quote from: SD Mapman on January 20, 2014, 01:05:07 PM
Quote from: Molandfreak on January 20, 2014, 02:15:48 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 01:56:09 AM
Quote from: Molandfreak on January 20, 2014, 01:13:36 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 12:50:08 AM
Quote from: SD Mapman on January 20, 2014, 12:44:22 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:36:52 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:31:42 PM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 19, 2014, 11:27:08 PM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
I'm pretty sure SD 20 from the Montana state line to Camp Crook is the only section of state highway in the state that is still unpaved, but I could be wrong.
Interesting- I don't know the system that well, so that's definitely possible. I gotta say, I was over there recently and I was quite surprised by the signage treatment- most states tend to not sign the unpaved parts as well, but then there's South Dakota with full reassurance shield and welcome signage, just like a regular state highway.
Yeah, it's odd that we'd do that with SD 20 because we tend to not add enough signage on a lot of our other highways.
What about SD 53? I think it's unpaved from just south of I-90 to just north of SD 44.
(and why does it even exist?)
I said I could be wrong, and I guess I was. Although I agree that highway doesn't look like it serves much of a purpose.
A lot of 1804/1806 are also unpaved.
Personally I think those two are nothing more than glorified river walks and serve no purpose as state highways (nobody would use them to travel from Point A to Point B; there are almost no cities along either route), but they are technically state highways and I did forget about them so, yeah. It's only a few miles of 1804, but I guess I was really wrong. :banghead:
Oh I totally agree with you; I just wanted to point it out.
Hmmm, that makes sense... where exactly is that on 1804? (never driven the "river-walks" all the way)
I think their only purpose is to serve recreation areas. (If you want evidence on their poor quality, my avatar is on 1806 north of Fort Pierre)
Right here (https://maps.google.com/?ll=45.073884,-100.220375&spn=0.029822,0.169086&t=m&z=13&layer=c&cbll=45.071945,-100.225697&cbp=11,0,,0,0&photoid=po-7167435) according to Google Maps. After an intersection with some random backroad, 1804 loses pavement, and there's a "Minimum maintenance, travel at your own risk" sign. Although there's no indication in that picture that the road north of that intersection is still signed as SD 1804, the pavement condition logs say it is (I was inclined to check because GMaps is often dead wrong).
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 01:27:31 PM
Although there's no indication in that picture that the road north of that intersection is still signed as SD 1804, the pavement condition logs say it is
What do the pavement condition logs say about the pavement condition? :bigass:
http://legis.sd.gov/statutes/DisplayStatute.aspx?Type=Statute&Statute=31-4-14.5
QuoteThe Transportation Commission may designate, by rules promulgated pursuant to chapter 1-26, a segment of the state trunk highway system as a minimum maintenance road if the commission determines that the segment is used only occasionally or intermittently for passenger or commercial travel. The commission shall publish a list of the state highway segments proposed to be designated as minimum maintenance segments each year and provide an opportunity for public input pursuant to chapter 1-26 before making the final designations.
I can't find this list.
Quote from: NE2 on January 19, 2014, 11:07:12 PM
There might be a few cases where an unpaved state highway becomes a paved road at a state line. For that matter, how many unpaved state highways are there? (primary only in NC-SC-VA-WV) Even out west there can't be too many.
There are several in Louisiana (at least that I know of):
LA 975 - entirety, from I-10 to US 190 east of Krotz Springs
LA 10 - from the east landing of the former Melville ferry to LA 77
LA 1003
LA 1004
LA 1013
LA 645 - all except the first block south of LA 1
LA 944 - all except the tree line section passing through Palo Alto Plantation
LA 69 - segment from west terminus at LA 1 to LA 405 (near Bayou Goula)
Quote from: Steve on January 20, 2014, 12:27:12 AM
Quote from: Duke87 on January 19, 2014, 11:48:48 PM
Connecticut I know for a fact has no unpaved state highways. As far as I'm aware, Rhode Island and Massachusetts don't, either. Vermont does have a few, though.
New York I don't think does, but I could be wrong. Pennsylvania I'm going to assume must have some unpaved quadrant route somewhere just because there are so many of them of so little significance.
I've never come across anything in RI, MA, NY, or PA. PA really paves every little road.
You are both correct in that Massachusetts does not have any unpaved state highways. There are some towns (like my current hometown of Wakefield) that have a few unpaved streets, but they are generally uncommon, even in the western part of the state.
Quote from: roadman on January 20, 2014, 05:18:46 PM
Quote from: Steve on January 20, 2014, 12:27:12 AM
Quote from: Duke87 on January 19, 2014, 11:48:48 PM
Connecticut I know for a fact has no unpaved state highways. As far as I'm aware, Rhode Island and Massachusetts don't, either. Vermont does have a few, though.
New York I don't think does, but I could be wrong. Pennsylvania I'm going to assume must have some unpaved quadrant route somewhere just because there are so many of them of so little significance.
I've never come across anything in RI, MA, NY, or PA. PA really paves every little road.
You are both correct in that Massachusetts does not have any unpaved state highways. There are some towns (like my current hometown of Wakefield) that have a few unpaved streets, but they are generally uncommon, even in the western part of the state.
What about New Hampshire?
Quote from: NE2 on January 20, 2014, 01:53:02 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on January 20, 2014, 01:08:27 AM
There's a good chunk of KY 199 in Pike County that's gravel.
Holy crap. The Goog doesn't even show the road, but it's on the aerial and signed where it meets KY 632 (http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=37.493537,-82.250412&spn=0.013807,0.028346&t=m&z=16&layer=c&cbll=37.493427,-82.249711&panoid=-OSQUtPcR0Igsg2TboNpzQ&cbp=12,306.32,,0,1.65).
Apparently KY 1679 (Little Shepherd Trail) was recently paved.
I drove across KY 199 back in late summer.
Right after you turn off KY 632, the road is paved but there's this sign:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm3.staticflickr.com%2F2892%2F10174185665_bcf9d0b679.jpg&hash=33c5deb8350d1166f772e1ecafaf678e76e2dc1b)
After a couple of residences not far off 632, the road looks like this:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm3.staticflickr.com%2F2844%2F10174315683_10712f334e.jpg&hash=8e107cf2a776b41a625275410733ef6522693d29)
This is pretty much the condition of the road all the way down to the other side of the mountain where it becomes paved again. There is no signage in the other direction where the narrow mountain road turns off of the paved road near the McVeigh community. Right at the end of the gravel portion, there is a switchback so tight that I could not navigate it without backing up a bit. There are no homes along the gravel portion and only a couple of private drives.
I don't know why this road is in the state system, but it has been designated KY 199 since the 1930s. I can't imagine this road gets any winter maintenance. I don't remember seeing any signage along the gravel portion except for possibly one mileage marker.
As for Little Shepherd Trail, my dad and I drove the length of it back in the late 1990s in a 4WD with decent ground clearance. At that time, the road was paved only from its southern terminus at US 421 to where it intersects a small road that crosses Pine Mountain (KY 2010, I think.) From that point on it was gravel, except for a short portion around Kingdom Come State Park. The gravel portion was in such poor condition that it took us four hours to drive the entire 40-mile route.
I know a portion in Letcher County extending southwest from US 119 was paved a few years ago, but I don't know if the entire road was blacktopped or not. There was some controversy over the paving; some locals liked it being a rutted gravel road so they could ride horses and ATVs on it without being inconvenienced by passenger car traffic.
One other state highway that was gravel for years was KY 1098 in Breathitt County. It has since been paved.
EDIT: Pike County maps showing KY 199.
Current Pike County map (http://transportation.ky.gov/Planning/SPRS%20Maps/Pike.pdf)
1937 Pike County maps showing KY 199 running all the way to Phelps (http://transportation.ky.gov/Planning/Maps/PikeCo1937.pdf)
Quote from: NE2 on January 20, 2014, 03:43:41 PM
http://legis.sd.gov/statutes/DisplayStatute.aspx?Type=Statute&Statute=31-4-14.5
QuoteThe Transportation Commission may designate, by rules promulgated pursuant to chapter 1-26, a segment of the state trunk highway system as a minimum maintenance road if the commission determines that the segment is used only occasionally or intermittently for passenger or commercial travel. The commission shall publish a list of the state highway segments proposed to be designated as minimum maintenance segments each year and provide an opportunity for public input pursuant to chapter 1-26 before making the final designations.
I can't find this list.
All I found was the bill from '99 that put that in the laws.
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 01:27:31 PM
Although there's no indication in that picture that the road north of that intersection is still signed as SD 1804, the pavement condition logs say it is
Where'd you find that? All I found was the law (http://legis.sd.gov/Statutes/Codified_Laws/DisplayStatute.aspx?Type=Statute&Statute=31-4-246) designating 1804. Please see if you can make more sense out of that than I can.
Quote from: SD Mapman on January 21, 2014, 12:01:56 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 01:27:31 PM
Although there's no indication in that picture that the road north of that intersection is still signed as SD 1804, the pavement condition logs say it is
Where'd you find that? All I found was the law (http://legis.sd.gov/Statutes/Codified_Laws/DisplayStatute.aspx?Type=Statute&Statute=31-4-246) designating 1804. Please see if you can make more sense out of that than I can.
Here (http://sddot.com/transportation/highways/planning/pavement/Default.aspx) is the list of logs. That portion of SD 1804 is in the Pierre Region (http://sddot.com/transportation/highways/planning/pavement/docs/Pierre_Region.pdf), and I assumed that "East Whitlock Access" is the road that leads to the West Whitlock Recreation Area.
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 21, 2014, 12:12:57 AM
Quote from: SD Mapman on January 21, 2014, 12:01:56 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 01:27:31 PM
Although there's no indication in that picture that the road north of that intersection is still signed as SD 1804, the pavement condition logs say it is
Where'd you find that? All I found was the law (http://legis.sd.gov/Statutes/Codified_Laws/DisplayStatute.aspx?Type=Statute&Statute=31-4-246) designating 1804. Please see if you can make more sense out of that than I can.
Here (http://sddot.com/transportation/highways/planning/pavement/Default.aspx) is the list of logs. That portion of SD 1804 is in the Pierre Region (http://sddot.com/transportation/highways/planning/pavement/docs/Pierre_Region.pdf), and I assumed that "East Whitlock Access" is the road that leads to the West Whitlock Recreation Area.
I'm having trouble matching up the mileage, but it seems to end less than a mile north of the bridge (the 0.097 mile piece), which puts the end right around the minimum maintenance sign. "East Whitlock Access" is probably old US 212, which goes to the "East Whitlock Lakeside Use Area" (derp).
Quote from: NE2 on January 21, 2014, 01:02:43 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 21, 2014, 12:12:57 AM
Quote from: SD Mapman on January 21, 2014, 12:01:56 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 01:27:31 PM
Although there's no indication in that picture that the road north of that intersection is still signed as SD 1804, the pavement condition logs say it is
Where'd you find that? All I found was the law (http://legis.sd.gov/Statutes/Codified_Laws/DisplayStatute.aspx?Type=Statute&Statute=31-4-246) designating 1804. Please see if you can make more sense out of that than I can.
Here (http://sddot.com/transportation/highways/planning/pavement/Default.aspx) is the list of logs. That portion of SD 1804 is in the Pierre Region (http://sddot.com/transportation/highways/planning/pavement/docs/Pierre_Region.pdf), and I assumed that "East Whitlock Access" is the road that leads to the West Whitlock Recreation Area.
I'm having trouble matching up the mileage, but it seems to end less than a mile north of the bridge (the 0.097 mile piece), which puts the end right around the minimum maintenance sign. "East Whitlock Access" is probably old US 212, which goes to the "East Whitlock Lakeside Use Area" (derp).
That makes more sense. I had to zoom in on Google Maps almost all the way to find out East Whitlock even existed (I assumed this was a stupid abbreviation practice or something and "East Whitlock" meant "accessing Whitlock from the east"). But if I'm wrong on that, that means I may have been right to say the highways weren't unpaved. :biggrin:
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 21, 2014, 01:18:18 AM
Quote from: NE2 on January 21, 2014, 01:02:43 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 21, 2014, 12:12:57 AM
Quote from: SD Mapman on January 21, 2014, 12:01:56 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 01:27:31 PM
Although there's no indication in that picture that the road north of that intersection is still signed as SD 1804, the pavement condition logs say it is
Where'd you find that? All I found was the law (http://legis.sd.gov/Statutes/Codified_Laws/DisplayStatute.aspx?Type=Statute&Statute=31-4-246) designating 1804. Please see if you can make more sense out of that than I can.
Here (http://sddot.com/transportation/highways/planning/pavement/Default.aspx) is the list of logs. That portion of SD 1804 is in the Pierre Region (http://sddot.com/transportation/highways/planning/pavement/docs/Pierre_Region.pdf), and I assumed that "East Whitlock Access" is the road that leads to the West Whitlock Recreation Area.
I'm having trouble matching up the mileage, but it seems to end less than a mile north of the bridge (the 0.097 mile piece), which puts the end right around the minimum maintenance sign. "East Whitlock Access" is probably old US 212, which goes to the "East Whitlock Lakeside Use Area" (derp).
That makes more sense. I had to zoom in on Google Maps almost all the way to find out East Whitlock even existed (I assumed this was a stupid abbreviation practice or something and "East Whitlock" meant "accessing Whitlock from the east"). But if I'm wrong on that, that means I may have been right to say the highways weren't unpaved. :biggrin:
Now that we've got that cleaned up, is part of SD 63 currently unpaved? I know there was an unpaved portion a few years ago but I don't know if they've paved it.
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 21, 2014, 01:18:18 AM
Quote from: NE2 on January 21, 2014, 01:02:43 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 21, 2014, 12:12:57 AM
Quote from: SD Mapman on January 21, 2014, 12:01:56 AM
Quote from: TCN7JM on January 20, 2014, 01:27:31 PM
Although there's no indication in that picture that the road north of that intersection is still signed as SD 1804, the pavement condition logs say it is
Where'd you find that? All I found was the law (http://legis.sd.gov/Statutes/Codified_Laws/DisplayStatute.aspx?Type=Statute&Statute=31-4-246) designating 1804. Please see if you can make more sense out of that than I can.
Here (http://sddot.com/transportation/highways/planning/pavement/Default.aspx) is the list of logs. That portion of SD 1804 is in the Pierre Region (http://sddot.com/transportation/highways/planning/pavement/docs/Pierre_Region.pdf), and I assumed that "East Whitlock Access" is the road that leads to the West Whitlock Recreation Area.
I'm having trouble matching up the mileage, but it seems to end less than a mile north of the bridge (the 0.097 mile piece), which puts the end right around the minimum maintenance sign. "East Whitlock Access" is probably old US 212, which goes to the "East Whitlock Lakeside Use Area" (derp).
That makes more sense. I had to zoom in on Google Maps almost all the way to find out East Whitlock even existed (I assumed this was a stupid abbreviation practice or something and "East Whitlock" meant "accessing Whitlock from the east"). But if I'm wrong on that, that means I may have been right to say the highways weren't unpaved. :biggrin:
Hold on there... you're still wrong.
SD 1806 south of SD 44
Quote1806 42.78 0.000 Gregory 07 1990 4255 26 3.0 1 1 2.007 17.018 Rural 6 2 183
* GRAVEL CHANGES TO ASPHALT
Here's the link: http://sddot.com/transportation/highways/planning/pavement/docs/Mitchell_Region.pdf (http://sddot.com/transportation/highways/planning/pavement/docs/Mitchell_Region.pdf). (page 169)
Quote from: DandyDan on January 20, 2014, 07:13:25 AM
Quote from: corco on January 19, 2014, 11:13:03 PM
Montana is a smorgasbord of unpaved state highways- a huge chunk of secondaries don't have pavement, and even at least one primary (38) is totally unpaved. I think NM has a bunch of dirt ones too. Wyoming is totally paved.
Other states I know of:
WA- the end of SR 165
AZ- parts of 288, 366, i know I'm missing at least one more that isn't coming to me off the top of my head
UT- a few, namely the Moki Dugway
ID- I'm 97% sure it's only that part of SH 7 and SH 64
NE- there's two highways whose numbers I don't know off the top of my head
SD- the first few miles of SD-20, probably more too
Nebraska's unpaved state roads are N-67 between N-2 and US-34 in Otoe and Cass Counties, N-65 going south from Pawnee City to the Kansas border, the easternmost segment of N-18, which ends at US-283, and the S67C spur, which goes west from the gravel portion of N-65 and bizarrely exists as state highway.
N-65 is paved for a couple miles south of Pawnee City, but then becomes gravel. Once it crosses the state line into Kansas, it loses state highway designation but does become paved again. Nebraska was also able to boast the last unpaved section of U.S. highway: U.S. 183 near Taylor was unpaved for a long time.
Fun fact: that bizarre section of highway that is 67C Spur is the remnant of the original plan for N-3S (now N-8) that was never completed: http://www.transportation.nebraska.gov/maps/historical/pdf/st_hwy55-hi-res.pdf What I don't understand is how it survived the renumbering of 1971.
Quote from: NE2 on January 19, 2014, 11:07:12 PM
There might be a few cases where an unpaved state highway becomes a paved road at a state line.
Of course, the opposite is very true. Tennessee SR 32, as it creeps toward North Carolina past Cosby TN, becomes quite hilly and curvy reminiscent of many famous roads of the area. The reason it's not as popular as the Dragon, NC 80, and so forth (especially with motorcyclists) is because when it hits the NC state line, the very well-maintained pavement stops dead, and it becomes a NC secondary gravel road. It also has far more driveways than many of those other well-known roads, so pushing the envelope around curves is not really recommended there.
There are no paved access points on or near the east end of TN 32, only the unpaved state line transition and a gravel local cut-through road (Tobes Creek Road). So if you want to take TN 32 for challenging driving/riding, you have to be prepared either to turn around, or to take a mile and change of hilly and curvy gravel to/from I-40.