So I just encountered one of these on a signal somewhere in rural northeast PA. Took a while to figure out that's what it was, since I've never seen one before, and it's kind of hard to see the light displayed for cross traffic, so sat there waiting for the relatively heavy traffic on the cross street before figuring it out. I've heard of 4-way stop signs of course, but 4-way flashing reds don't give you any direct clue as to their existence. How common are these?
New York has a few.
They have them in Alabama and there used to be one in Yeehaw Junction, FL at the intersection of FL 60 and US 441. In most cases the STOP signs are still supposed to say 4 Way or ALL WAY.
Maybe you missed those signs as the MUTCD requires signals alone cannot be sole traffic control devices when being used as beacons.
Perhaps it wasn't clear from my post, but these appeared to be regular traffic signals (with red, yellow, and green balls) that happened to be flashing red in all directions. It wasn't anything like those permanent double-flashing red or yellow beacons I encounter quite frequently. In any case, there did not appear to be any stop signs in any direction at any approach.
Quote from: bzakharin on September 02, 2014, 01:07:40 PM
Perhaps it wasn't clear from my post, but these appeared to be regular traffic signals (with red, yellow, and green balls) that happened to be flashing red in all directions. It wasn't anything like those permanent double-flashing red or yellow beacons I encounter quite frequently. In any case, there did not appear to be any stop signs in any direction at any approach.
Are you sure the power wasn't out?
Quote from: corco on September 02, 2014, 01:19:28 PM
Quote from: bzakharin on September 02, 2014, 01:07:40 PM
Perhaps it wasn't clear from my post, but these appeared to be regular traffic signals (with red, yellow, and green balls) that happened to be flashing red in all directions. It wasn't anything like those permanent double-flashing red or yellow beacons I encounter quite frequently. In any case, there did not appear to be any stop signs in any direction at any approach.
Are you sure the power wasn't out?
Can't be 100 percent sure, but certainly there were no other signs of this. Why would that matter? Are traffic lights programmed to flash red when power is out? Or do you mean I didn't see the stop sign because the power was out? Since it was during the day, the latter is not the case.
Quote from: bzakharin on September 02, 2014, 01:45:32 PM
Quote from: corco on September 02, 2014, 01:19:28 PM
Quote from: bzakharin on September 02, 2014, 01:07:40 PM
Perhaps it wasn't clear from my post, but these appeared to be regular traffic signals (with red, yellow, and green balls) that happened to be flashing red in all directions. It wasn't anything like those permanent double-flashing red or yellow beacons I encounter quite frequently. In any case, there did not appear to be any stop signs in any direction at any approach.
Are you sure the power wasn't out?
Can't be 100 percent sure, but certainly there were no other signs of this. Why would that matter? Are traffic lights programmed to flash red when power is out? Or do you mean I didn't see the stop sign because the power was out? Since it was during the day, the latter is not the case.
Depending on the default, they can be made to flash yellow/red, or all red. Sometimes it depends on the sight conditions - if it's too dangerous for the side street to get a good sight view of the main road, it may have been programmed to default to all red.
It could have also been a new signal which are set to flash for a few weeks for motorists to get adjusted to it. Same thing though - defaulted to all red because of limited-sight conditions.
Quote from: bzakharin on September 02, 2014, 12:49:22 PM
So I just encountered one of these on a signal somewhere in rural northeast PA. Took a while to figure out that's what it was, since I've never seen one before, and it's kind of hard to see the light displayed for cross traffic, so sat there waiting for the relatively heavy traffic on the cross street before figuring it out. I've heard of 4-way stop signs of course, but 4-way flashing reds don't give you any direct clue as to their existence. How common are these?
Very common in some places if the signal isn't needed for lower traffic period such as the overnight hours. In Michigan, it is not uncommon for rural or small town signals to default to flashing red or flashing red/yellow in the overnight hours.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on September 02, 2014, 01:49:39 PM
Quote from: bzakharin on September 02, 2014, 01:45:32 PM
Quote from: corco on September 02, 2014, 01:19:28 PM
Quote from: bzakharin on September 02, 2014, 01:07:40 PM
Perhaps it wasn't clear from my post, but these appeared to be regular traffic signals (with red, yellow, and green balls) that happened to be flashing red in all directions. It wasn't anything like those permanent double-flashing red or yellow beacons I encounter quite frequently. In any case, there did not appear to be any stop signs in any direction at any approach.
Are you sure the power wasn't out?
Can't be 100 percent sure, but certainly there were no other signs of this. Why would that matter? Are traffic lights programmed to flash red when power is out? Or do you mean I didn't see the stop sign because the power was out? Since it was during the day, the latter is not the case.
Depending on the default, they can be made to flash yellow/red, or all red. Sometimes it depends on the sight conditions - if it's too dangerous for the side street to get a good sight view of the main road, it may have been programmed to default to all red.
It could have also been a new signal which are set to flash for a few weeks for motorists to get adjusted to it. Same thing though - defaulted to all red because of limited-sight conditions.
I've seen red/yellow and all yellow before, but not all red. Learn something new every day, I guess
Can also be used when traffic is loo light to warrant regular usage of the signals, such as at nights and/or weekends.
The intersection of Holmes Avenue and Woodson Street here in Huntsville is currently flashing red in all directions due to Holmes being closed for a bridge replacement. I've seen it happen at other intersections like the intersection California Street, Fraser Avenue, and Lowe Avenue, and the intersection of Whitesburg Drive, Franklin Street, and Marsheutz Avenue. I have a video of the signals at the latter intersection flashing.
Most of the time, however, the signals flash yellow for the main road and red for the side streets.
California uses them all around. Also Orlando uses it at Oakridge Road and Orange Blossom Trail.
The latter is up for discussion with the Orange County Traffic Engineering as Orange Blossom Trail should flash yellow in flash mode as Oakridge Road is not as major of a road as OBT is. Even in normal timing you have to wait two light changes in the early morning rush hour to cross Oakridge Road which has only a few cars cross OBT when you have to wait. It is all political reasons for this one that I do not want to go in to, but nonetheless it flashes as four way stop street when in beacon mode.
Quote from: bzakharin on September 02, 2014, 02:14:44 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on September 02, 2014, 01:49:39 PM
Quote from: bzakharin on September 02, 2014, 01:45:32 PM
Quote from: corco on September 02, 2014, 01:19:28 PM
Quote from: bzakharin on September 02, 2014, 01:07:40 PM
Perhaps it wasn't clear from my post, but these appeared to be regular traffic signals (with red, yellow, and green balls) that happened to be flashing red in all directions. It wasn't anything like those permanent double-flashing red or yellow beacons I encounter quite frequently. In any case, there did not appear to be any stop signs in any direction at any approach.
Are you sure the power wasn't out?
Can't be 100 percent sure, but certainly there were no other signs of this. Why would that matter? Are traffic lights programmed to flash red when power is out? Or do you mean I didn't see the stop sign because the power was out? Since it was during the day, the latter is not the case.
Depending on the default, they can be made to flash yellow/red, or all red. Sometimes it depends on the sight conditions - if it's too dangerous for the side street to get a good sight view of the main road, it may have been programmed to default to all red.
It could have also been a new signal which are set to flash for a few weeks for motorists to get adjusted to it. Same thing though - defaulted to all red because of limited-sight conditions.
I've seen red/yellow and all yellow before, but not all red. Learn something new every day, I guess
A signal should never be set to all-way yellow flash mode--that's a safety concern, so I hope you haven't really seen that.
Depending on the signal cabinet hardware and battery backups, the signal can continue to operate during power failure--for some types of signalized intersections (SPUIs, complex intersections, intersections near rail crossings), battery backup is either highly suggested or required. I once got to see inside a signal cabinet with a City of Sparks (NV) traffic engineer. For the basic 4-way/8-phase intersection we were at, he explained that the battery backup could keep the signal operating in regular mode for about an hour, followed by up to 2 (or was it 4?) hours in all-way red flash mode.
When a signal controller loses its main power supply, a battery backup system (if present) kicks in, which temporarily provides additional juice. At a typical intersection, a small cabinet (rather narrow in appearance) contains this system. It is almost always next to the signal controller cabinet.
Normally, a signal controller (computerized) will only put itself into flash mode if the conflict monitor in the set-up detects an issue that cannot fix itself. Also, you could program a signal controller to activate flash mode at a particular time of the day. This is likely true for the set-up you saw in Pennsylvania.
Quote from: roadfro on September 03, 2014, 05:33:09 AM
A signal should never be set to all-way yellow flash mode--that's a safety concern, so I hope you haven't really seen that.
Please advise the studio that made "Cars". The signal on flash in the town (Radiator Springs?) is on 4-way yellow flash, resulting in a "Hey..wait just a second here!" moment when I first saw the movie, which is probably why I belong on this forum...
Quote from roadrunner75:
QuotePlease advise the studio that made "Cars". The signal on flash in the town (Radiator Springs?) is on 4-way yellow flash, resulting in a "Hey..wait just a second here!" moment when I first saw the movie, which is probably why I belong on this forum...
This, along with the US 66 shield that said "ROUTE" in the state name area, are the two things that annoy me about this otherwise cool movie.
I'm pretty sure I've seen it somewhere along the way, but they're rare in the New York area. Most flashers here are yellow for one direction and red for the other.
IDOT has a policy if the signals go into flash mode, it is red for all sides.
Quote from: Big John on September 02, 2014, 02:35:05 PM
Can also be used when traffic is loo light to warrant regular usage of the signals, such as at nights and/or weekends.
Or when traffic is too light to warrant usage of the signals at all, like in Gary. Some of the many stoplight-turned-4-way stops in Gary have physical stop signs installed at the intersection, but many don't.
Quote from: pianocello on September 04, 2014, 03:51:17 PM
Or when traffic is too light to warrant usage of the signals at all, like in Gary. Some of the many stoplight-turned-4-way stops in Gary have physical stop signs installed at the intersection, but many don't.
this being Gary, I bet the stoplights don't work and the signs have been reappropriated. such is the case in East St. Louis.
Here are a few examples of traffic signals in all-red flash mode without any stop signs:
Ortonville, Michigan, at the intersection of Mill Street and South Street (scroll around to see it flash): https://www.google.com/maps/@42.8523167,-83.4451247,3a,75y,113.72h,78.53t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1so8oMkNeUge1PHhO5SONb2Q!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Denison, Texas:
Fannin Avenue and W Main Street: https://www.google.com/maps/@33.755515,-96.5415569,3a,75y,156.97h,110.12t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sh30x-UamsR4e0uvNCqP5Qw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656'
Mirick Avenue and W Main Street (you can see signs under the signal that say "4-way"): https://www.google.com/maps/@33.7555622,-96.5429682,3a,17.3y,265.33h,101.23t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s5G9SiYjE1bNrW775r4VRAA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Quote from: CJResotko on March 10, 2019, 11:18:40 AM
Here are a few examples of traffic signals in all-red flash mode without any stop signs:
Ortonville, Michigan, at the intersection of Mill Street and South Street (scroll around to see it flash): https://www.google.com/maps/@42.8523167,-83.4451247,3a,75y,113.72h,78.53t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1so8oMkNeUge1PHhO5SONb2Q!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Denison, Texas:
Fannin Avenue and W Main Street: https://www.google.com/maps/@33.755515,-96.5415569,3a,75y,156.97h,110.12t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sh30x-UamsR4e0uvNCqP5Qw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656'
Mirick Avenue and W Main Street (you can see signs under the signal that say "4-way"): https://www.google.com/maps/@33.7555622,-96.5429682,3a,17.3y,265.33h,101.23t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s5G9SiYjE1bNrW775r4VRAA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
I've always wondered if a signal were to go on permanent flash mode, wouldn't it make sense to just put in stop signs and remove the signal. Use the signal hardware and equipment at other intersections or simply just recycle the equipment.
In DC, there are many intersections in Capitol Hill that used to be regular signals but are now glorified 4-way stops. The streets are closed to regular traffic, unless you are on Congressional staff, due to security concerns. They will never have enough traffic to need signals again.
This is the closest that the Google car got to one:
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.8941829,-77.0058696,3a,75y,176.15h,79.48t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sJkzR9Wm94rJJvsSH7SsS6g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
At least once I saw a setup with flashing yellow on the main road, and flashing red on the sidestreet. Typical, but with one additional twist. There was a Left Turn Signal on the main road as well -- and that one flashed (circular) red. One installation flashed alternately/wig-wag style, the other in sync.
Not sure, but I think I saw this done once with a service road; the signals facing the service road flashed red (and presumably, the cross street did too) while the main road flashed yellow as usual. Don't remember the sync pattern, tho.
Lakeland, FL has one at Ariana Street and Wabash Avenue, but its a 3 way stop.
Orlando has a few, and many when two major arterials meet at a broken signal.
This one on CT 364 was put here to supplement the stop signs after a fatal accident about 40 years ago.
https://goo.gl/maps/L5qGUKKtUqu
Quote from: jp the roadgeek on March 18, 2019, 11:33:41 PM
This one on CT 364 was put here to supplement the stop signs after a fatal accident about 40 years ago.
https://goo.gl/maps/L5qGUKKtUqu
That's a beacon. This thread is about full three-color signals being set to flash red.
That is pretty common to have a four way red flashers. Caltrans uses them a lot. In Florida many big intersections uses them to avoid long waits on one or more of the sides.
Flashing beacons are almost everywhere that have three or four way stops.
One that is interesting is Central Florida Parkway at John Young Parkway in Orlando used to flash yellow on JYP and red on Central FL, but in recent years Orange County changed that to all red when flashing.
Quote from: mrsman on March 18, 2019, 09:19:50 PM
I've always wondered if a signal were to go on permanent flash mode, wouldn't it make sense to just put in stop signs and remove the signal. Use the signal hardware and equipment at other intersections or simply just recycle the equipment.
But then there's the risk that "permanent flash mode" would end up being not-so-permanent. If they needed to switch the signal back to regular cycles, then where would they be?
Quote from: kphoger on March 19, 2019, 01:43:05 PM
Quote from: mrsman on March 18, 2019, 09:19:50 PM
I've always wondered if a signal were to go on permanent flash mode, wouldn't it make sense to just put in stop signs and remove the signal. Use the signal hardware and equipment at other intersections or simply just recycle the equipment.
But then there's the risk that "permanent flash mode" would end up being not-so-permanent. If they needed to switch the signal back to regular cycles, then where would they be?
I would say that what you say is possible. But there are many that I see where the chances of that happening are negligible. The examples in Capitol Hill are done for security. A signal is no longer justified and it is nearly 95% chance that regular traffic will never be able to drive in front of the Congressional buildings. Secutiry only seems to get more severe. (See what happens at airports.)
There are also some intersections where it seems that there was never enough traffic to ever justify a signal in the first place, and given the configuration of the streets, unlikely to ever receive such traffic in the first place.
Again, it is shameful when in many jurisdictions there are busy 4-way stops that can't be converted to signals becuase of cost issues, yet a few blocks away, there are these wasteful all flashing reds. Wasting electricity. Utilizing light bulbs, sockets, timing hardware, etc. [Heck there are many unjustified functional signals as well, but when you see a permanent flash, you know that even the DOT understands that a signal is no longer justified.]
I've always wondered if a signal were to go on permanent flash mode, wouldn't it make sense to just put in stop signs and remove the signal. Use the signal hardware and equipment at other intersections or simply just recycle the equipment.
[/quote]
Sometimes, it's cheaper to just keep the signal there to let people know that they have to stop. Or, they replace the signal with beacons.
That's just it, though. mrsman is talking about a defunct signal left to serve no purpose, and then a new signal gets installed down the street. It can't be cheaper to install all new equipment for the new signal than it would be to move the old stuff over.
It's not uncommon in Michigan especially in rural areas for there to be a light like that.
The intersection of M-13 and M-57 has one, so does the intersection of M-52 and M-57. I use M-13 quite a bit south of Saginaw and you can see the red blinker at M-13 and M-57 from about 3 miles away.
This is one at the corner of Center and Washington in downtown Bay City, MI(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190323/e9ec23cb082e23a8785df21b24dc0835.jpg)
Quote from: Flint1979 on March 23, 2019, 12:57:08 PM
This is one at the corner of Center and Washington in downtown Bay City, MI(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190323/e9ec23cb082e23a8785df21b24dc0835.jpg)
Those are just beacons. The prompt in this thread is talking about RYG signals that have been placed into flash mode in red in all 4 directions. (However, this intersection was controlled by a traffic signal at one point).
M-83 and M-46(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190323/aa7186bdb466f19cd0e148a38ca5ec1f.jpg)
Quote from: CJResotko on March 23, 2019, 03:02:59 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on March 23, 2019, 12:57:08 PM
This is one at the corner of Center and Washington in downtown Bay City, MI(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190323/e9ec23cb082e23a8785df21b24dc0835.jpg)
Those are just beacons. The prompt in this thread is talking about RYG signals that have been placed into flash mode in red in all 4 directions. (However, this intersection was controlled by a traffic signal at one point).
Ok well it did make me think that there are several in Michigan like that. I can think of one that is a RYG during the day but a four way stop at night and that is the corner of M-52 and Swan Creek Road in Saginaw County. There are some in Saginaw that are four way stop's at night but RYG during the day, one is at Mackinaw and Weiss on the NW corner of the city of Saginaw.
https://youtu.be/HXx2-YZsbDU
Here are some signals at an intersection in Arcanum, Ohio. The intersection is a 4-way stop and the lights are flashing red in all 4 directions. Arcanum is a village, and the intersection the lights are at doesn't get a lot of traffic, so you can see why it's like this.
Quote from: CJResotko on March 23, 2019, 04:31:12 PM
Arcanum, Ohio: https://youtu.be/HXx2-YZsbDU
It looks like a ghost town.
Quote from: Flint1979 on March 23, 2019, 04:37:33 PM
Quote from: CJResotko on March 23, 2019, 04:31:12 PM
Arcanum, Ohio: https://youtu.be/HXx2-YZsbDU
It looks like a ghost town.
Arcanum isn't really busy. When I was in Arcanum observing these signals, there weren't a lot of cars in the area at the time, but I saw a good amount of cars passing through on OH-49. Heck, I got some pics of these grand old signals by standing on the road near the intersection! That's how quiet the town was.
South Carolina has plenty of these. This one on US 21 is a good example. They really want you to stop
https://www.google.com/maps/@33.6270326,-80.8844507,3a,38y,330.33h,88.59t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sgfO6HMDC9V0rS_cl0ZUT0Q!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Quote from: CJResotko on March 23, 2019, 04:49:39 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on March 23, 2019, 04:37:33 PM
Quote from: CJResotko on March 23, 2019, 04:31:12 PM
Arcanum, Ohio: https://youtu.be/HXx2-YZsbDU
It looks like a ghost town.
Arcanum isn't really busy. When I was in Arcanum observing these signals, there weren't a lot of cars in the area at the time, but I saw a good amount of cars passing through on OH-49. Heck, I got some pics of these grand old signals by standing on the road near the intersection! That's how quiet the town was.
I love small towns like that.
Sevierville, Tennessee (https://www.google.com/maps/@35.8673416,-83.5656686,3a,60y,205.37h,96.54t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sr0m6dt6qowf0BBYkaSzKSg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/5652/23708457329_a508b41c1b_z_d.jpg)
Denison, Texas
The GSVs do it no justice, but the intersection linked below at Sumter Landing, The Villages, FL is in permanent all-red flash mode. The significance is that it's the only intersection in The Villages that I've encountered that has a traffic light in flash mode to begin with, is the only intersection with a traffic light where there's no overhead lights, and it has always been in all-red flash mode. As you can see, there's no Stop signs. It even has a dog-house style light on the far left, if you zoom in. Some of me wonders if this was the intended theme to this particular intersection, especially as it's such an unusual occurrence in this area.
While the lights almost seem hidden in the picture, I've never had an issue seeing them when I'm down there flashing red, so I think, again, it's an issue of the GSV not really showing the lights properly (especially as it was probably taken when the lights were flashing with nothing showing).
https://goo.gl/maps/sSxAMQZ6RS8FWpLNA
For fun, scroll around this area and see all the golf carts on the roads and parked in the parallel parking spots!
Interesting
Quote from: jeffandnicole on November 26, 2019, 10:50:40 PM
As you can see, there's no Stop signs. It even has a dog-house style light on the far left, if you zoom in. Some of me wonders if this was the intended theme to this particular intersection, especially as it's such an unusual occurrence in this area.
I'm thinking this is part of a theme. A few blocks away, there is another similar signal with all 8-inch signals with
four doghouses, all of which were just installed as part of an upgrade of the signal:
https://goo.gl/maps/rjjTn6jbnoKyUzaF8
Quote from: jakeroot on November 27, 2019, 03:02:44 AM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on November 26, 2019, 10:50:40 PM
As you can see, there's no Stop signs. It even has a dog-house style light on the far left, if you zoom in. Some of me wonders if this was the intended theme to this particular intersection, especially as it's such an unusual occurrence in this area.
I'm thinking this is part of a theme. A few blocks away, there is another similar signal with all 8-inch signals with four doghouses, all of which were just installed as part of an upgrade of the signal:
https://goo.gl/maps/rjjTn6jbnoKyUzaF8
Ha...completely forgot about that intersection...been thru it many times on a golf cart too!
Seattle, WA (https://www.google.com/maps/@47.6545866,-122.322373,3a,58.6y,217h,94.13t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sSXr3m6hse3smu1EUSZPddg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
Where I live, when there's a malfunction or whatever, at intersections where neither road is more "major" than the other, all directions flash red to signal a 4-way-stop.