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National Boards => General Highway Talk => Traffic Control => Topic started by: Mr. Matté on October 12, 2014, 04:10:34 PM

Title: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: Mr. Matté on October 12, 2014, 04:10:34 PM
I passed by this interchange while out biking today and it got me wondering. The interchange I passed was at Howell Road and the NJ 33 freeway in central Monmouth County; had it been opened, the offramp from NJ 33 eastbound would have ended at a T-intersection with Howell Road, but due to the intended prevention of sprawl, etc., right turns would have been banned and the end of the ramp was striped to only "allow" left turns (see image below) . Ultimately because of a lot of stupid design flaws (http://nt.gmnews.com/news/2004-02-11/Front_Page/042.html), the ramp didn't open.

Are there any open examples of right turns being banned onto a two-lane road but left turns allowed, not counting temporary prohibitions or timed prohibitions (ie banned from 7-9 AM, Mon-Fri)?

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FsZNCit1l.jpg&hash=fc0fdc7e373ffc6cf83c10b347e6f59b90a072c8)
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: NE2 on October 12, 2014, 04:20:47 PM
Three cases that don't match your intent: very acute angles, places where a separate right-turn ramp is provided, and places where a third road angles in from the right.

Two cases that are interesting but probably don't match:
US 17-92 at SR 44 in downtown DeLand, FL: no turns are allowed in any direction; all eight turning movements must be made using side streets. Right turns are probably banned to make pedestrian phasing easier.
Somewhere in Alabama, I think there's an intersection where trucks cannot turn right directly, not due to trucks being banned in that direction, but due to limited turning space.
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: freebrickproductions on October 12, 2014, 05:21:22 PM
Here in Huntsville, AL, northbound traffic on Whitesburg can't make a right turn onto Bob Wallace Avenue. I believe it's mostly due to the sharp angle of the intersection there, but there isn't anything on Bob Wallace Avenue between Whitesburg Drive and California Street that can't be accessed from Whitesburg Drive. Here's the intersection on Google Maps:
https://maps.google.com/maps?q=34.712652,-86.574564&hl=en&ll=34.712672,-86.574458&spn=0.000621,0.001032&num=1&t=h&z=21

I think there are more intersections like this in Huntsville, but I'll have to go look around the city some.
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: NE2 on October 12, 2014, 05:31:27 PM
Quote from: freebrickproductions on October 12, 2014, 05:21:22 PM
Here in Huntsville, AL, northbound traffic on Whitesburg can't make a right turn onto Bob Wallace Avenue. I believe it's mostly due to the sharp angle of the intersection there, but there isn't anything on Bob Wallace Avenue between Whitesburg Drive and California Street that can't be accessed from Whitesburg Drive. Here's the intersection on Google Maps:
https://maps.google.com/maps?q=34.712652,-86.574564&hl=en&ll=34.712672,-86.574458&spn=0.000621,0.001032&num=1&t=h&z=21
Probably done to improve traffic at California and Wallace, since California acts as a right turn ramp. Interesting that the intersection is curved to allow that turn.
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: Roadrunner75 on October 12, 2014, 08:21:55 PM
Not exactly the same, but:
https://www.google.com/maps?ll=39.864065,-75.277749&spn=0.000006,0.00327&t=h&z=19&layer=c&cbll=39.864066,-75.278261&panoid=MRfYhLcfOnw9ZNdm0zc47A&cbp=12,80.63,,0,5.06 (https://www.google.com/maps?ll=39.864065,-75.277749&spn=0.000006,0.00327&t=h&z=19&layer=c&cbll=39.864066,-75.278261&panoid=MRfYhLcfOnw9ZNdm0zc47A&cbp=12,80.63,,0,5.06)
I believe this was done to prevent truck traffic looping around the back of the Philadelphia Intl. Airport from cutting through residential areas of Essington.
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: cl94 on October 12, 2014, 10:16:47 PM
This one's onto a one-way road- NY 254 in Queensbury: https://www.google.com/maps/@43.3284872,-73.6761829,3a,75y,87.83h,85.69t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sH0Iw_UK2CQvJ5UXtm2dp3A!2e0

WB can make a left onto it, but no right turns.
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: NE2 on October 12, 2014, 10:53:38 PM
Quote from: cl94 on October 12, 2014, 10:16:47 PM
This one's onto a one-way road- NY 254 in Queensbury: https://www.google.com/maps/@43.3284872,-73.6761829,3a,75y,87.83h,85.69t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sH0Iw_UK2CQvJ5UXtm2dp3A!2e0

WB can make a left onto it, but no right turns.

That's essentially a continuous-flow setup for the mall - right turns would be redundant, not to mention the acute angle. This (http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=40.286728,-74.058334&spn=0.005852,0.012392&t=k&z=17) in New Jersey is similar with the intersections combined.
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: jakeroot on October 12, 2014, 11:21:41 PM
Quote from: NE2 on October 12, 2014, 05:31:27 PM
Quote from: freebrickproductions on October 12, 2014, 05:21:22 PM
Here in Huntsville, AL, northbound traffic on Whitesburg can't make a right turn onto Bob Wallace Avenue. I believe it's mostly due to the sharp angle of the intersection there, but there isn't anything on Bob Wallace Avenue between Whitesburg Drive and California Street that can't be accessed from Whitesburg Drive. Here's the intersection on Google Maps:
https://maps.google.com/maps?q=34.712652,-86.574564&hl=en&ll=34.712672,-86.574458&spn=0.000621,0.001032&num=1&t=h&z=21

Probably done to improve traffic at California and Wallace, since California acts as a right turn ramp. Interesting that the intersection is curved to allow that turn.

At some point, traffic turning left from Center Ave may have needed to turn right onto Bob Wallace to make it California. But at some point, they must have decided that the amount of traffic interested in doing so paled in comparison to the traffic flow benefit of dis-allowing a right from Whitesburg to Bob Wallace.
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: jakeroot on October 12, 2014, 11:29:49 PM
BC-1 at 192 Street in Surrey: (http://goo.gl/CNNtwW)

Basically a duplicate of the original post. Unsure as to why right turns aren't allowed... :hmmm:

EDIT: I think they want traffic to use the previous exit (176 Street, just west). Perhaps they expected growth south of the TCH in this area?

The ramp just north is a right-turn only from southbound 192 Street to BC-1 West. Basically, if you live on 192 Street, south of the TCH, go somewhere else to access it.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2Fl9Fwz8H.png&hash=0123feaa612dbbedc9550015d01235b89bfa7351)
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: cl94 on October 12, 2014, 11:46:03 PM
Quote from: NE2 on October 12, 2014, 10:53:38 PM
Quote from: cl94 on October 12, 2014, 10:16:47 PM
This one's onto a one-way road- NY 254 in Queensbury: https://www.google.com/maps/@43.3284872,-73.6761829,3a,75y,87.83h,85.69t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sH0Iw_UK2CQvJ5UXtm2dp3A!2e0

WB can make a left onto it, but no right turns.

That's essentially a continuous-flow setup for the mall - right turns would be redundant, not to mention the acute angle. This (http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=40.286728,-74.058334&spn=0.005852,0.012392&t=k&z=17) in New Jersey is similar with the intersections combined.

Except the left is also redundant here. What's similar to your example is this, located ~50 miles to the south (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.6859463,-73.8518046,276m/data=!3m1!1e3).
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: PHLBOS on October 13, 2014, 01:32:06 PM
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on October 12, 2014, 08:21:55 PM
Not exactly the same, but:
https://www.google.com/maps?ll=39.864065,-75.277749&spn=0.000006,0.00327&t=h&z=19&layer=c&cbll=39.864066,-75.278261&panoid=MRfYhLcfOnw9ZNdm0zc47A&cbp=12,80.63,,0,5.06 (https://www.google.com/maps?ll=39.864065,-75.277749&spn=0.000006,0.00327&t=h&z=19&layer=c&cbll=39.864066,-75.278261&panoid=MRfYhLcfOnw9ZNdm0zc47A&cbp=12,80.63,,0,5.06)
I believe this was done to prevent truck traffic looping around the back of the Philadelphia Intl. Airport from cutting through residential areas of Essington.

The perspective your GSV is showing is from the Essington side and the right-turn prohibition prevents outbound (mostly truck) traffic from heading getting on Hog Island Road towards the UPS facility.  Actually, it's the barrier channelization that's preventing truck traffic (mainly UPS trucks) from cutting through Essignton (Tinicum Twp.)... although many have turned into the nearby Airport Business Center driveway and do a U-turn when the cops aren't around (despite the presence of one or two NO U-TURN signs).
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: Roadrunner75 on October 13, 2014, 01:42:07 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on October 13, 2014, 01:32:06 PM
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on October 12, 2014, 08:21:55 PM
Not exactly the same, but:
https://www.google.com/maps?ll=39.864065,-75.277749&spn=0.000006,0.00327&t=h&z=19&layer=c&cbll=39.864066,-75.278261&panoid=MRfYhLcfOnw9ZNdm0zc47A&cbp=12,80.63,,0,5.06 (https://www.google.com/maps?ll=39.864065,-75.277749&spn=0.000006,0.00327&t=h&z=19&layer=c&cbll=39.864066,-75.278261&panoid=MRfYhLcfOnw9ZNdm0zc47A&cbp=12,80.63,,0,5.06)
I believe this was done to prevent truck traffic looping around the back of the Philadelphia Intl. Airport from cutting through residential areas of Essington.

The perspective your GSV is showing is from the Essington side and the right-turn prohibition prevents outbound (mostly truck) traffic from heading getting on Hog Island Road towards the UPS facility.  Actually, it's the barrier channelization that's preventing truck traffic (mainly UPS trucks) from cutting through Essignton (Tinicum Twp.)... although many have turned into the nearby Airport Business Center driveway and do a U-turn when the cops aren't around (despite the presense of one or two NO U-TURN signs).
Yes - it works both ways.  The intent is to prevent trucks from cutting through Essington both to and from Hog Island Road.
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: vdeane on October 13, 2014, 02:45:53 PM
This odd intersection at Crossgates Mall has one: https://www.google.com/maps/@42.6859263,-73.8516633,3a,75y,213.26h,83.99t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s9B58jqi-Xv-nmjVCo03r5Q!2e0
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: Roadrunner75 on October 13, 2014, 05:54:33 PM
Quote from: vdeane on October 13, 2014, 02:45:53 PM
This odd intersection at Crossgates Mall has one: https://www.google.com/maps/@42.6859263,-73.8516633,3a,75y,213.26h,83.99t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s9B58jqi-Xv-nmjVCo03r5Q!2e0
This is typical of a lot of mall entrances, with a continuous flow intersection as noted by NE2 above.  Many of the malls around here have something like this.

Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: kj3400 on October 13, 2014, 06:04:09 PM
Howard St at Camden St in Baltimore: http://goo.gl/maps/8dEsJ
Howard St at Dolphin St where it splits into Preston St and Biddle St: http://goo.gl/maps/ubmpH
Yes, I know, light rail.

St Paul St (MD 2) at Mt Royal Av where the offramp from I-83 plugs in: http://goo.gl/maps/BRlHS
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: roadman65 on October 13, 2014, 06:13:07 PM
Fifth Avenue and Forty Second Street.  42nd is two ways and no turns are allowed on to it.

In New Jersey you have Broad Street and Market Street in Downtown Newark.
In Elizabeth, NJ you have Broad and Jersey Streets, however buses are exempt from the ruling and can make any turn.
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: NE2 on October 13, 2014, 07:05:43 PM
Quote from: Mr. Matté on October 12, 2014, 04:10:34 PM
Are there any open examples of right turns being banned onto a two-lane road but left turns allowed
Quote from: roadman65 on October 13, 2014, 06:13:07 PM
Fifth Avenue and Forty Second Street.  42nd is two ways and no turns are allowed on to it.

In New Jersey you have Broad Street and Market Street in Downtown Newark.
In Elizabeth, NJ you have Broad and Jersey Streets, however buses are exempt from the ruling and can make any turn.
All three of these ban left turns as well as right turns. There's one of these in Central Florida:
Quote from: NE2 on October 12, 2014, 04:20:47 PM
Two cases that are interesting but probably don't match:
US 17-92 at SR 44 in downtown DeLand, FL: no turns are allowed in any direction; all eight turning movements must be made using side streets. Right turns are probably banned to make pedestrian phasing easier.
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: roadman65 on October 14, 2014, 08:50:52 AM
Yeah you are definitely right about that, but where can you not make a right turn and not be allowed to make a left turn unless it is at the end of a freeway ramp.  Nonetheless, they are still two way streets that you cannot turn into.

I do not think that any direct right turn prohibition at a T intersection would be feasible as then hardly no traffic would be able to use the side street if on the main road there.

However I have seen driveways like that in Kissimmee, FL where you cannot turn right onto the main street it collects traffic from.  Long John Silvers on US 192's back exit, and the Oak Street Post Office all require you to turn left after leaving the parking lots even though you make a right turn easily.

Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: Kacie Jane on October 14, 2014, 12:15:33 PM
Quote from: NE2 on October 12, 2014, 04:20:47 PM
Somewhere in Alabama, I think there's an intersection where trucks cannot turn right directly, not due to trucks being banned in that direction, but due to limited turning space.

Lakewood Dr NB @ SW 100th St here in Lakewood, WA, has this.  Must be a recent restriction though, as Street View from Aug 2012 (https://www.google.com/maps/@47.166334,-122.5075646,3a,75y,9.69h,74.73t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sN6RfQIkIShkIbZlYri3Y1Q!2e0) doesn't show it.
Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: jeffandnicole on October 14, 2014, 12:28:58 PM
There's several trucks in the way, but you should be able to make out the 3 left turn lanes with no permitted right turning option here, on Connector Rd at 206 in Bordentown.  http://goo.gl/maps/egTLp

Literally 3 weeks ago, Gloucester County, NJ banned right turns from this intersection here (obviously so new, the GSV is too old to show it).  http://goo.gl/maps/L4chH  There's an intersection just before this intersection which leads you to the road anyway, but the biggest pain is trying to get to the Dunkin Donuts from this direction, as now one needs to make a series of left turns to enter their parking lot, rather than a few simple rights. 

Title: Re: Right turns banned onto a two-way road
Post by: vdeane on October 14, 2014, 12:44:32 PM
Albany also has an unusual example where the street is two-way on either side of an intersection but one-way through the intersection.  A partial barrier was created with the sidewalk to prevent traffic from using a neighborhood.
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.6630071,-73.818018,3a,75y,88.42h,67.64t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sBtWUBQkw4PAAiPfUdD-fnw!2e0