South Dakota's Interstates are going to 80 MPH
http://www.argusleader.com/story/news/2015/03/17/mph-speed-limit-gas-tax-hike-signed-law/24924491
http://www.keloland.com/newsdetail.cfm/sd-highway-patrol-set-to-enforce-new-speed-limit/?id=177468
So does this mean that on April 1st all the 75 signs will change to 80, or will any changes be pending a study of the road in question?
It's a statute change from 75 to 80, so all 75s will become 80 automatically.
Quote from: corco on March 19, 2015, 11:00:34 AM
It's a statute change from 75 to 80, so all 75s will become 80 automatically.
Yeah, DOT will be changing all the 75 signs in the next couple weeks.
Quote from: Duke87 on March 19, 2015, 12:35:49 AM
So does this mean that on April 1st all the 75 signs will change to 80, or will any changes be pending a study of the road in question?
If they do all change on April 1, then the DOT should say that the new speed limit is 80 kph instead of mph and see if anyone realizes what day it is.
Quote from: vdeane on March 19, 2015, 10:56:18 PM
Quote from: Duke87 on March 19, 2015, 12:35:49 AM
So does this mean that on April 1st all the 75 signs will change to 80, or will any changes be pending a study of the road in question?
If they do all change on April 1, then the DOT should say that the new speed limit is 80 kph instead of mph and see if anyone realizes what day it is.
That would be funny! :-D
Would someone then assert the speed limit is invalid because the proper abbreviation is "km/h" instead of "kph"? :bigass:
Signs went up a day early. (sorry, no pic) It felt weird to go 80 and not be illegal.
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 01, 2015, 12:18:19 AM
Signs went up a day early. (sorry, no pic) It felt weird to go 80 and not be illegal.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F0Eeilg6h.jpg&hash=15f8df926d815def6960a5ce9dc9f8212fa24bfb)
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2Fa9VPh0Lh.jpg&hash=e17452ec80d796487d2e8b532a513e1d335fd45d)
I'm a little surprised they let it be posted at 80 mph even with no center divider.
Quote from: kkt on April 01, 2015, 04:51:57 PM
I'm a little surprised they let it be posted at 80 mph even with no center divider.
SH-130 east of Austin is 80 without a center divider. Hell, the southern half, posted at 85, has no center divider.
Quote from: kkt on April 01, 2015, 04:51:57 PM
I'm a little surprised they let it be posted at 80 mph even with no center divider.
Da faq?
There's a perfectly adequate median separating the two carriageways. That
is your center divider.
I'm sure it meets standards, at least when it was built. But loss of control and accidentally crossing a median is a fairly common accident, and a center divider is inexpensive.
Quote from: kkt on April 01, 2015, 05:38:56 PM
I'm sure it meets standards, at least when it was built. But loss of control and accidentally crossing a median is a fairly common accident, and a center divider is inexpensive.
That's a ditch, not a flat piece of ground. No car at speed is getting across that
Quote from: jakeroot on April 01, 2015, 05:13:55 PM
Quote from: kkt on April 01, 2015, 04:51:57 PM
I'm a little surprised they let it be posted at 80 mph even with no center divider.
SH-130 east of Austin is 80 without a center divider. Hell, the southern half, posted at 85, has no center divider.
Having driven TX-130 from I-35 down to I-10, I actually found it to be a little too curvy and there to be too many dips for an 85 mph limit. I think 80 would be more reasonable for the entire stretch. Part of it may be that I was driving a heavy-laden van.
Bear in mind that, on the open highway in the Midwest, if speed limits did not matter, I would generally drive about 85 to 90 mph.
TxDOT posts 75mph limits on non-access-controlled 2 and 4 lane roads with nothing but a yellow line between you and the opposite direction of traffic. 80 on a freeway with a nice wide median is a lot safer than that.
Quote from: kkt on April 01, 2015, 05:38:56 PM
I'm sure it meets standards, at least when it was built. But loss of control and accidentally crossing a median is a fairly common accident, and a center divider is inexpensive.
We don't do that. Like anywhere. Even in Sioux Falls. (OK, minus I-190)
And also, to put a center divider on Interstates throughout THE WHOLE STATE would get pretty expensive.
Quote from: kphoger on April 01, 2015, 10:50:12 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on April 01, 2015, 05:13:55 PM
Quote from: kkt on April 01, 2015, 04:51:57 PM
I'm a little surprised they let it be posted at 80 mph even with no center divider.
SH-130 east of Austin is 80 without a center divider. Hell, the southern half, posted at 85, has no center divider.
Having driven TX-130 from I-35 down to I-10, I actually found it to be a little too curvy and there to be too many dips for an 85 mph limit. I think 80 would be more reasonable for the entire stretch. Part of it may be that I was driving a heavy-laden van.
I just drove it last week in a new-ish Ford Fusion, and I had cruise on 90 the whole time (except where it dropped to 80, where I dropped the cruise to 85). Felt comfortable the whole time. My mom (riding shotgun) didn't say a word, so I can only assume she was perfectly happy with whatever speed I was doing.
Quote from: kphoger on April 01, 2015, 10:50:12 PM
Bear in mind that, on the open highway in the Midwest, if speed limits did not matter, I would generally drive about 85 to 90 mph.
As would I.
Now let's get some 75 mph stretches on the expressways and call it good. :nod:
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 02, 2015, 12:10:03 AM
Quote from: kkt on April 01, 2015, 05:38:56 PM
I'm sure it meets standards, at least when it was built. But loss of control and accidentally crossing a median is a fairly common accident, and a center divider is inexpensive.
We don't do that. Like anywhere. Even in Sioux Falls. (OK, minus I-190)
And also, to put a center divider on Interstates throughout THE WHOLE STATE would get pretty expensive.
Modern cable barriers ("wait-a-minute cables" in some roadgeek circles) aren't terribly expensive. Most of the interstates in Oklahoma have them throughout the entire state.
Not that I think the absence of barriers should have much of an effect on the speed limit; if you cross over you're going to have a bad time no matter what speed you're going. Hell, Oklahoma posts the Indian Nation Turnpike at 75, and I'm pretty sure that if I laid down crossways in the median both my head and my feet would be on pavement.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 02, 2015, 08:57:42 PM
Not that I think the absence of barriers should have much of an effect on the speed limit; if you cross over you're going to have a bad time no matter what speed you're going. Hell, Oklahoma posts the Indian Nation Turnpike at 75, and I'm pretty sure that if I laid down crossways in the median both my head and my feet would be on pavement.
Yeah, second that.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 02, 2015, 08:57:42 PMHell, Oklahoma posts the Indian Nation Turnpike at 75, and I'm pretty sure that if I laid down crossways in the median both my head and my feet would be on pavement.
I know the median on the Muskogee Turnpike has to be barely 5-6 feet. Every time I drive it, I always marvel at how tiny that thing is.
Quote from: galador on April 03, 2015, 09:10:16 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 02, 2015, 08:57:42 PMHell, Oklahoma posts the Indian Nation Turnpike at 75, and I'm pretty sure that if I laid down crossways in the median both my head and my feet would be on pavement.
I know the median on the Muskogee Turnpike has to be barely 5-6 feet. Every time I drive it, I always marvel at how tiny that thing is.
Using Earth Google's powerful and highly accurate ruler tool the median looks to be about 15 ft wide in the narrow places. Must be some sort of Einsteinian relativity thing that causes us to misjudge distances while we're in motion!
Quote from: Rushmeister on April 03, 2015, 01:05:36 PMUsing Earth Google's powerful and highly accurate ruler tool the median looks to be about 15 ft wide in the narrow places. Must be some sort of Einsteinian relativity thing that causes us to misjudge distances while we're in motion!
I suppose so, but it seems so darn small.
I personally think the 75 mph speed limit on Oklahoma's turnpikes with small grassy median humps is too high. I-35 and the turnpikes with barriers can be 85, but those grassy humps should only be 70, IMO.
Quote from: kphoger on April 03, 2015, 07:35:52 PM
I personally think the 75 mph speed limit on Oklahoma's turnpikes with small grassy median humps is too high. I-35 and the turnpikes with barriers can be 85, but those grassy humps should only be 70, IMO.
Is a 5 MPH speed difference really going to produce a measurable change in outcome in a crossover incident?
Quote from: Crazy Volvo Guy on April 01, 2015, 04:28:46 PM
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2Fa9VPh0Lh.jpg&hash=e17452ec80d796487d2e8b532a513e1d335fd45d)
Right place at the right time Cullen!
Quote from: Alex on April 04, 2015, 10:01:38 AMRight place at the right time Cullen!
Yes indeed.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 04, 2015, 02:23:27 AM
Quote from: kphoger on April 03, 2015, 07:35:52 PM
I personally think the 75 mph speed limit on Oklahoma's turnpikes with small grassy median humps is too high. I-35 and the turnpikes with barriers can be 85, but those grassy humps should only be 70, IMO.
Is a 5 MPH speed difference really going to produce a measurable change in outcome in a crossover incident?
No, but I do think it can make a crossover incident less likely. Honestly, I get the heebie jeebies passing a truck after dark just doing 70 on those roads.
Quote from: kphoger on April 04, 2015, 11:45:05 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 04, 2015, 02:23:27 AM
Quote from: kphoger on April 03, 2015, 07:35:52 PM
I personally think the 75 mph speed limit on Oklahoma's turnpikes with small grassy median humps is too high. I-35 and the turnpikes with barriers can be 85, but those grassy humps should only be 70, IMO.
Is a 5 MPH speed difference really going to produce a measurable change in outcome in a crossover incident?
No, but I do think it can make a crossover incident less likely. Honestly, I get the heebie jeebies passing a truck after dark just doing 70 on those roads.
How fast do folks drive on the turnpike at present? (Ignoring the speed limit).
On the three I-44 turnpikes, there's a wide range of speed, mostly due to trucks. I want to say that 60—80 MPH is the range most people are in. Doing 75 you will pass a lot of trucks (especially going uphill; the Turner Turnpike has a lot of hills) and occasionally be passed.
On the Indian Nation and Bailey Spur, there's not enough traffic for any generalization to be meaningful. I've never been on the Cimarron, Muskogee, or Cherokee. The Chickasaw has a 65 MPH limit because it struggles to even be a Super-2. And, of course, the Kilpatrick and Creek are entirely different animals because of their urban nature.
Personally, I think the 75 limit on turnpikes is a fantastic bit of marketing. It gives you a very reason to choose a turnpike instead of a shunpike route (and most Oklahoma turnpikes are trivial to shunpike). If the Turner were 70, using SH-66 (SL 65) to bypass it would be very attractive. But at 75, the time savings are difficult to pass up.
And yet more controversy:
http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html (http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html)
It's only been 4 days, people.
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 05, 2015, 05:52:12 PM
And yet more controversy:
http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html (http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html)
It's only been 4 days, people.
It would be nice to know if speed increases do correlate with more accidents and fatalities, and if so by how much... but you won't find out from reading that article. How about studying just the roads where the speed increased and accounting for number of vehicles on the roads?
And absolute stupidity, regarding I-15 in Utah in 2012:
"He found that crashes on 80 mph roads were 14 percent more likely to cause an injury or death; roads with 80 mph zones were "over-represented in crashes," because 0.5 percent of all the state's crashes happened on those roads, even though they make up only 0.3 percent of the state's total road mileage; and 80 mph zones were prone to higher crash severity on a five-point scale, with an average of 1.73 in 80 mph zones compared with 1.49 for all crashes."
Well no shit, I-15 in Utah has a lot more cars on it than most of the state highway system's road miles. The fact that .5% of crashes occurred on it and it's .3% of the road mileage probably means it's one of the very safest roads in Utah.
And the average crash severity is 1.73/5...
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 05, 2015, 05:52:12 PM
And yet more controversy:
http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html (http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html)
It's only been 4 days, people.
The numbers shown are meaningless because they seem to be simple year-to-year variations. The percentages shown seems to be extremely close, and they cited the one state where fatals actually went down before going up...which is common.
In some cases, the differences didn't even occur on 80/85 mph highways. They are simply representing state-wide figures. If crashes in 80 mph zones went down, but in 70 mph zones they went up, would that indicate 80 mph zones are safer than 70 mph zones? I'd bet that if that info was available, they would simply say "In State A, crashes went up" to further their agenda.
Quote
"It's simple physics," he said. "The faster you're traveling when you get in a crash, the more damage and more injury will happen."
Everyone clap for Captain Obvious.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F9Dsd7cZ.gif&hash=df6f8d7a7ea51cd762c787fdf0a30e827d43a0d1)
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 05, 2015, 02:02:06 PMOn the Indian Nation and Bailey Spur, there's not enough traffic for any generalization to be meaningful. I've never been on the Cimarron, Muskogee, or Cherokee. The Chickasaw has a 65 MPH limit because it struggles to even be a Super-2. And, of course, the Kilpatrick and Creek are entirely different animals because of their urban nature.
I have driven on the Cimarron, Muskogee, and Cherokee--the last times being 2013, 1995, and 2013 respectively. The original cross-section for the first two featured the same narrow grass median with curbs at left edge line that was used for all the first-generation Oklahoma turnpikes. (I agree with Kphoger that this is not really safe at 75, but more because of the curbs than the median width: more below.) On the Cimarron I set the cruise control at 75 and was not often passed. The NMSL was still in effect the last time I drove the Muskogee, but I suspect current conditions are now more or less the same as on the Cimarron. The Cherokee is really in the Ozarks and is a no-slack design. I vaguely recall long lengths posted for speeds less than 75 (65, maybe?) and not really feeling comfortable driving (let alone setting cruise control) even at that reduced limit, though of course there was the odd crazy who zipped past at a ridiculous speed.
The traditional AASHTO Green Book rule has been not to use barrier curbs on any road with a design speed greater than 50 MPH. I suspect the Oklahoma turnpikes have gotten around this by either (1) pre-dating the Green Book (IIRC, there was a collection of Policies, not even the Blue Book, at the time the Turner Turnpike was being designed, and most of the other first-generation turnpikes were designed and built during the Blue Book era; of course, none of these design references would have been binding since the turnpikes did not receive federal funding), or (2) using a rolled curb design that technically classifies as "mountable." But a curb is a curb, mountable or not, and is seen by the driver as unavailable for use in an emergency, and as such can prompt decisions that turn a survivable accident into a fatal one.
In recent years the OTA has been removing the curbs and grassed medians and replacing them with cable barrier set in paved concrete shoulders level with the traveled way. Considerable lengths of the Cimarron had already lost their grassed medians when we drove it in 2013.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 05, 2015, 08:56:52 PM
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 05, 2015, 05:52:12 PM
And yet more controversy:
http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html (http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html)
It's only been 4 days, people.
The numbers shown are meaningless because they seem to be simple year-to-year variations. The percentages shown seems to be extremely close, and they cited the one state where fatals actually went down before going up...which is common.
In some cases, the differences didn't even occur on 80/85 mph highways. They are simply representing state-wide figures. If crashes in 80 mph zones went down, but in 70 mph zones they went up, would that indicate 80 mph zones are safer than 70 mph zones? I'd bet that if that info was available, they would simply say "In State A, crashes went up" to further their agenda.
The Idaho State Police has been doing similar data manipulation to support their claim that 80 is dangerous- claiming that they're giving more citations now that the speed limit is 80 because people are driving too fast.
The reason is because in 2012 they didn't ticket 82 in a 75, but they ticket 82 in an 80.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/welcome_page/?shf=/2014/08/28/3344943_idahos-80-mph-brings-more-speeding.html
Quote from: corco on April 05, 2015, 09:18:47 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 05, 2015, 08:56:52 PM
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 05, 2015, 05:52:12 PM
And yet more controversy:
http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html (http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html)
It's only been 4 days, people.
The numbers shown are meaningless because they seem to be simple year-to-year variations. The percentages shown seems to be extremely close, and they cited the one state where fatals actually went down before going up...which is common.
In some cases, the differences didn't even occur on 80/85 mph highways. They are simply representing state-wide figures. If crashes in 80 mph zones went down, but in 70 mph zones they went up, would that indicate 80 mph zones are safer than 70 mph zones? I'd bet that if that info was available, they would simply say "In State A, crashes went up" to further their agenda.
The Idaho State Police has been doing similar data manipulation to support their claim that 80 is dangerous- claiming that they're giving more citations now that the speed limit is 80 because people are driving too fast.
The reason is because in 2012 they didn't ticket 82 in a 75, but they ticket 82 in an 80.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/welcome_page/?shf=/2014/08/28/3344943_idahos-80-mph-brings-more-speeding.html
Wow. I don't even think their radar guns are that accurate.
Quote from: jakeroot on April 06, 2015, 03:42:08 AM
Quote from: corco on April 05, 2015, 09:18:47 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 05, 2015, 08:56:52 PM
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 05, 2015, 05:52:12 PM
And yet more controversy:
http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html (http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html)
It's only been 4 days, people.
The numbers shown are meaningless because they seem to be simple year-to-year variations. The percentages shown seems to be extremely close, and they cited the one state where fatals actually went down before going up...which is common.
In some cases, the differences didn't even occur on 80/85 mph highways. They are simply representing state-wide figures. If crashes in 80 mph zones went down, but in 70 mph zones they went up, would that indicate 80 mph zones are safer than 70 mph zones? I'd bet that if that info was available, they would simply say "In State A, crashes went up" to further their agenda.
The Idaho State Police has been doing similar data manipulation to support their claim that 80 is dangerous- claiming that they're giving more citations now that the speed limit is 80 because people are driving too fast.
The reason is because in 2012 they didn't ticket 82 in a 75, but they ticket 82 in an 80.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/welcome_page/?shf=/2014/08/28/3344943_idahos-80-mph-brings-more-speeding.html
Wow. I don't even think their radar guns are that accurate.
That's not shady at all :banghead:
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 05, 2015, 08:56:52 PM
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 05, 2015, 05:52:12 PM
And yet more controversy:
http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html (http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html)
It's only been 4 days, people.
The numbers shown are meaningless because they seem to be simple year-to-year variations. The percentages shown seems to be extremely close, and they cited the one state where fatals actually went down before going up...which is common.
In some cases, the differences didn't even occur on 80/85 mph highways. They are simply representing state-wide figures. If crashes in 80 mph zones went down, but in 70 mph zones they went up, would that indicate 80 mph zones are safer than 70 mph zones? I'd bet that if that info was available, they would simply say "In State A, crashes went up" to further their agenda.
The one thing I've noticed over the years is that the Journal definitely has an agenda, whatever it is, and they will push it on the people.
None of the other newspapers in the state even care about this.
A speed limit's job isn't to be low for the sake of idiots who can't stay on the road. A speed limit's job is to provide a reasonable top speed for the geography of the area, taking into account reaction time and stopping distances.
Quote from: intelati49 on April 06, 2015, 08:40:30 AM
Quote from: jakeroot on April 06, 2015, 03:42:08 AM
Quote from: corco on April 05, 2015, 09:18:47 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 05, 2015, 08:56:52 PM
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 05, 2015, 05:52:12 PM
And yet more controversy:
http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html (http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html)
It's only been 4 days, people.
The numbers shown are meaningless because they seem to be simple year-to-year variations. The percentages shown seems to be extremely close, and they cited the one state where fatals actually went down before going up...which is common.
In some cases, the differences didn't even occur on 80/85 mph highways. They are simply representing state-wide figures. If crashes in 80 mph zones went down, but in 70 mph zones they went up, would that indicate 80 mph zones are safer than 70 mph zones? I'd bet that if that info was available, they would simply say "In State A, crashes went up" to further their agenda.
The Idaho State Police has been doing similar data manipulation to support their claim that 80 is dangerous- claiming that they're giving more citations now that the speed limit is 80 because people are driving too fast.
The reason is because in 2012 they didn't ticket 82 in a 75, but they ticket 82 in an 80.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/welcome_page/?shf=/2014/08/28/3344943_idahos-80-mph-brings-more-speeding.html
Wow. I don't even think their radar guns are that accurate.
That's not shady at all :banghead:
Don't speedometers have a variance of -+3 MPH? Because if my cruise control is set at 80 and that trooper dings me for 83...
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 06, 2015, 10:54:09 AM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 05, 2015, 08:56:52 PM
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 05, 2015, 05:52:12 PM
And yet more controversy:
http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html (http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html)
It's only been 4 days, people.
The numbers shown are meaningless because they seem to be simple year-to-year variations. The percentages shown seems to be extremely close, and they cited the one state where fatals actually went down before going up...which is common.
In some cases, the differences didn't even occur on 80/85 mph highways. They are simply representing state-wide figures. If crashes in 80 mph zones went down, but in 70 mph zones they went up, would that indicate 80 mph zones are safer than 70 mph zones? I'd bet that if that info was available, they would simply say "In State A, crashes went up" to further their agenda.
The one thing I've noticed over the years is that the Journal definitely has an agenda, whatever it is, and they will push it on the people.
None of the other newspapers in the state even care about this.
It's obvious from the tone of other articles they've written on the subject. They're labeled as "news", but they read like editorials.
Quote from: Bickendan on April 06, 2015, 08:46:10 PM
Quote from: intelati49 on April 06, 2015, 08:40:30 AM
Quote from: jakeroot on April 06, 2015, 03:42:08 AM
Quote from: corco on April 05, 2015, 09:18:47 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 05, 2015, 08:56:52 PM
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 05, 2015, 05:52:12 PM
And yet more controversy:
http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html (http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html)
It's only been 4 days, people.
The numbers shown are meaningless because they seem to be simple year-to-year variations. The percentages shown seems to be extremely close, and they cited the one state where fatals actually went down before going up...which is common.
In some cases, the differences didn't even occur on 80/85 mph highways. They are simply representing state-wide figures. If crashes in 80 mph zones went down, but in 70 mph zones they went up, would that indicate 80 mph zones are safer than 70 mph zones? I'd bet that if that info was available, they would simply say "In State A, crashes went up" to further their agenda.
The Idaho State Police has been doing similar data manipulation to support their claim that 80 is dangerous- claiming that they're giving more citations now that the speed limit is 80 because people are driving too fast.
The reason is because in 2012 they didn't ticket 82 in a 75, but they ticket 82 in an 80.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/welcome_page/?shf=/2014/08/28/3344943_idahos-80-mph-brings-more-speeding.html
Wow. I don't even think their radar guns are that accurate.
That's not shady at all :banghead:
Don't speedometers have a variance of -+3 MPH? Because if my cruise control is set at 80 and that trooper dings me for 83...
All the more reason SDHP is out of line.
Quote from: Bickendan on April 06, 2015, 08:46:10 PM
Quote from: intelati49 on April 06, 2015, 08:40:30 AM
Quote from: jakeroot on April 06, 2015, 03:42:08 AM
Quote from: corco on April 05, 2015, 09:18:47 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 05, 2015, 08:56:52 PM
Quote from: SD Mapman on April 05, 2015, 05:52:12 PM
And yet more controversy:
http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html (http://rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/claims-about-stats-in-other-mph-states-gloss-over-reality/article_86b87ec2-3b80-5e6e-abfd-0e4bede4fb4a.html)
It's only been 4 days, people.
The numbers shown are meaningless because they seem to be simple year-to-year variations. The percentages shown seems to be extremely close, and they cited the one state where fatals actually went down before going up...which is common.
In some cases, the differences didn't even occur on 80/85 mph highways. They are simply representing state-wide figures. If crashes in 80 mph zones went down, but in 70 mph zones they went up, would that indicate 80 mph zones are safer than 70 mph zones? I'd bet that if that info was available, they would simply say "In State A, crashes went up" to further their agenda.
The Idaho State Police has been doing similar data manipulation to support their claim that 80 is dangerous- claiming that they're giving more citations now that the speed limit is 80 because people are driving too fast.
The reason is because in 2012 they didn't ticket 82 in a 75, but they ticket 82 in an 80.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/welcome_page/?shf=/2014/08/28/3344943_idahos-80-mph-brings-more-speeding.html
Wow. I don't even think their radar guns are that accurate.
That's not shady at all :banghead:
Don't speedometers have a variance of -+3 MPH? Because if my cruise control is set at 80 and that trooper dings me for 83...
Officially, no. While a speedometer may not be exact, that's an issue to take up with the manufacturer of the vehicle. Unless state law specifies a tolerance, a limit is a limit. (PA for example requires a tolerance when officers use VASCAR, I believe)
A cop can pull you over for being just 1 over the limit, based on his radar gun. But if the state cares, they will step in and tell the police departments to knock off the minor speeding tickets.
If I had my way politically, any speed of less than 15 over the posted limit would be secondary enforcement only.
Basically, pulling someone over to the side of the road creates an unnecessary hazard. Arguably, an unnecessary hazard that is far greater than the one posed by someone going a few over the posted limit.
So, if someone was pulled for a more severe offense, such as texting while driving, and they happened to be going 7 over while doing it, they could then be written up for the 7 over; but pulling someone over for 7 over alone would not be allowed.
Quote from: Crazy Volvo Guy on April 09, 2015, 10:23:08 AM
If I had my way politically, any speed of less than 15 over the posted limit would be secondary enforcement only.
Basically, pulling someone over to the side of the road creates an unnecessary hazard. Arguably, an unnecessary hazard that is far greater than the one posed by someone going a few over the posted limit.
So, if someone was pulled for a more severe offense, such as texting while driving, and they happened to be going 7 over while doing it, they could then be written up for the 7 over; but pulling someone over for 7 over alone would not be allowed.
Honestly I don't care. However! I just want you to be consistent. If you catch a person doing 82 in an 80 and pull them over, then pull over the guy doing 72 in a 70.
But yes, that sounds good to me as well.
In the case of Idaho, it would not surprise me if (effective) zero-tolerance enforcement of the 80 limit is justified within police departments on the basis of the sorry state of I-84, which has sharp curves near the Sweetzer Road exit and a length near Burley and the I-86 wye where through traffic is urged to use the left lane because of poor pavement condition in the right-hand lane and limited merging area.
Personally, I would trade complete pavement reconstruction on the entire eastern two-thirds of Idaho I-84 for the 80 limit. It is not a lot of fun to drive fast if you are worried about the health of your bushings and control arms.
South Dakota has put serious money into rebuilding I-90 and it may very well be the first state to have 80 on long lengths of untolled and freshly reconstructed pavement, though Texas does have 85 on the relatively fresh new-build but tolled SH 130.
Quote from: J N Winkler on April 09, 2015, 11:48:32 PM
South Dakota has put serious money into rebuilding I-90 and it may very well be the first state to have 80 on long lengths of untolled and freshly reconstructed pavement, though Texas does have 85 on the relatively fresh new-build but tolled SH 130.
And I-29... there's just a few sections that need reconstruction. It's just funny how they tacked on a gas tax to that bill.
Quote from: M86 on April 10, 2015, 12:37:55 AM
Quote from: J N Winkler on April 09, 2015, 11:48:32 PM
South Dakota has put serious money into rebuilding I-90 and it may very well be the first state to have 80 on long lengths of untolled and freshly reconstructed pavement, though Texas does have 85 on the relatively fresh new-build but tolled SH 130.
And I-29... there's just a few sections that need reconstruction. It's just funny how they tacked on a gas tax to that bill.
No, the gas tax was the original idea, it was the speed limit increase that was tacked on at the last minute by the House Majority Leader.
SD is rebuilding I-90 pretty well, but from about Cactus Flat to just past Belvidere both lanes suck. Miserably. I think that is the worst non-NM stretch of road I've ever been on.
http://www.capjournal.com/news/sd-officials-mulling-reductions-on-new-mph-speed-limit/article_41729860-ea46-11e4-96a6-3f3ccac3dc59.html
QuoteA lengthy stretch of Interstate 90 in western South Dakota might see the speed limit rolled back from 80 mph to 75 under a proposal by the state Transportation Commission. The commission decided Thursday in Pierre to consider setting the speed limit at 75 mph on I-90 from the Wyoming border to the Rapid City area, a stretch of about 55 miles. There also could be a special 65 mph zone on I-90 for the 26-mile segment between Sturgis and Rapid City that would be in effect July 24 through Aug. 10 this year. Extremely high traffic is expected during the 75th annual motorcycle rally in Sturgis. Rapid City is a hub for many of the bikers attending the rally.
QuoteSeveral commission members said they're hearing from citizens about the change to 80 mph. One commissioner, Ed Seljeskog of Rapid City, favors rolling back to 75 mph west of Rapid City. He referred to "the recent calamity" in Wyoming on Interstate 80 that saw two days of major pile-ups – including some trucks afire. "I'm really uneasy," Seljeskog said. The 80 mph change was attached to the transportation funding legislation with an amendment brought by House Republican leader Brian Gosch of Rapid City.
Quote from: andy3175 on April 30, 2015, 12:16:00 AM
http://www.capjournal.com/news/sd-officials-mulling-reductions-on-new-mph-speed-limit/article_41729860-ea46-11e4-96a6-3f3ccac3dc59.html
QuoteA lengthy stretch of Interstate 90 in western South Dakota might see the speed limit rolled back from 80 mph to 75 under a proposal by the state Transportation Commission. The commission decided Thursday in Pierre to consider setting the speed limit at 75 mph on I-90 from the Wyoming border to the Rapid City area, a stretch of about 55 miles. There also could be a special 65 mph zone on I-90 for the 26-mile segment between Sturgis and Rapid City that would be in effect July 24 through Aug. 10 this year. Extremely high traffic is expected during the 75th annual motorcycle rally in Sturgis. Rapid City is a hub for many of the bikers attending the rally.
QuoteSeveral commission members said they're hearing from citizens about the change to 80 mph. One commissioner, Ed Seljeskog of Rapid City, favors rolling back to 75 mph west of Rapid City. He referred to "the recent calamity" in Wyoming on Interstate 80 that saw two days of major pile-ups – including some trucks afire. "I'm really uneasy," Seljeskog said. The 80 mph change was attached to the transportation funding legislation with an amendment brought by House Republican leader Brian Gosch of Rapid City.
As a Spearfish resident, that makes a lot of sense. Spearfish to Rapid is one of the only semi-urban areas in the state.