According to Wikipedia:
Since 1991, AASHTO has been in the process of eliminating all intrastate U.S. Highways less than 300 miles (480 km) in length, "as rapidly as the State Highway Department and the Standing Committee on Highways of the American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials can reach agreement with reference thereto"
This policy has been in effect for 24 years, and as far as I can tell not a single intrastate (single-state) U.S. highway has be decommissioned. Does anyone have an example?
First, to clarify, are you referring to this Wiki page?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Numbered_Highways
I don't see the reference to 1991.
It's here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Numbered_Highways (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Numbered_Highways)
The quote is on (at least) this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Numbered_Highways (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Numbered_Highways)
The citation links to an interesting document here: http://route.transportation.org/Documents/HO1_Policy_Establ_Develop_USRN.pdf (http://route.transportation.org/Documents/HO1_Policy_Establ_Develop_USRN.pdf)
To answer the question, I don't know of any short intrastate US routes that have been eliminated since 1991, but I'm not much of a highway historian.
The opposite has happened. I know that US 311 was once a intra-state US highway, but was extended into back Virginia
The only intrastate US highways that I know off-hand are US 92, US 192, US 290, US 57, US 181 and US 175.
Quote from: wxfree on May 06, 2015, 11:11:25 PM
The quote is on (at least) this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Numbered_Highways (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Numbered_Highways)
The citation links to an interesting document here: http://route.transportation.org/Documents/HO1_Policy_Establ_Develop_USRN.pdf (http://route.transportation.org/Documents/HO1_Policy_Establ_Develop_USRN.pdf)
To answer the question, I don't know of any short intrastate US routes that have been eliminated since 1991, but I'm not much of a highway historian.
Thanks for the link to the policy document. It doesn't seem to have been as effective as its drafters wanted.
Quote from: wdcrft63 on May 06, 2015, 10:17:33 PM
According to Wikipedia:
Since 1991, AASHTO has been in the process of eliminating all intrastate U.S. Highways less than 300 miles (480 km) in length, "as rapidly as the State Highway Department and the Standing Committee on Highways of the American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials can reach agreement with reference thereto"
This policy has been in effect for 24 years, and as far as I can tell not a single intrastate (single-state) U.S. highway has be decommissioned. Does anyone have an example?
If it actually happenned by now, US 158 in NC would be the only remaining intrastate US route thanks to it being longer than 300 miles :sombrero:.
Quote from: CNGL-Leudimin on May 07, 2015, 09:28:37 AM
Quote from: wdcrft63 on May 06, 2015, 10:17:33 PM
According to Wikipedia:
Since 1991, AASHTO has been in the process of eliminating all intrastate U.S. Highways less than 300 miles (480 km) in length, "as rapidly as the State Highway Department and the Standing Committee on Highways of the American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials can reach agreement with reference thereto"
This policy has been in effect for 24 years, and as far as I can tell not a single intrastate (single-state) U.S. highway has be decommissioned. Does anyone have an example?
If it actually happenned by now, US 158 in NC would be the only remaining intrastate US route thanks to it being longer than 300 miles :sombrero: .
Yep, and I can now say that I clinched it just last month. :sombrero:
Can we get rid of all intrastate INTERSTATE highways that are less than 300 miles in length? That would free up a ton of numbers.
Quote from: wdcrft63 on May 07, 2015, 08:36:18 AM
Quote from: wxfree on May 06, 2015, 11:11:25 PM
The quote is on (at least) this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Numbered_Highways (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Numbered_Highways)
The citation links to an interesting document here: http://route.transportation.org/Documents/HO1_Policy_Establ_Develop_USRN.pdf (http://route.transportation.org/Documents/HO1_Policy_Establ_Develop_USRN.pdf)
To answer the question, I don't know of any short intrastate US routes that have been eliminated since 1991, but I'm not much of a highway historian.
Thanks for the link to the policy document. It doesn't seem to have been as effective as its drafters wanted.
OK, so the first lines of that policy document do include a date of 1991, but reading through the contents, I see evidence that it was actually released in 1970. And I also suspect it borrows language and concepts from an even earlier document. So I think Wiki is misleading where it says "since 1991". In fact, the reality (from what I've observed) is that it was actually more like the 1980s when AASHTO's Standing Committee on Route Numbering
stopped following several of the policies set forth in that document.
Regarding the specific policy under discussion here (eliminating intrastate US routes under 300 mi.), there are still 20 routes that meet this criteria. During recent years, some of these states have petitioned AASHTO to approve changes to some of these routes. If AASHTO had been abiding by its own policies, their decisions would have been, "No, we do not approve that change, and furthermore, you need to change that to a state highway!" But that has not happened. Rather, it appears AASHTO has stopped concerning itself with the integrity of the US route system, and for several years has essentially rubber-stamped just about every proposal that the states have submitted (no matter how misguided or lame-brained).
Quote from: The Nature Boy on May 07, 2015, 09:43:40 AM
Can we get rid of all intrastate INTERSTATE highways that are less than 300 miles in length? That would free up a ton of numbers.
So long, I-45....
Yes, it was policy to decommission short in-state US routes long before 1970 too. Getting rid of in-state US routes was one of the goals of California's 1964 renumbering.
Quote from: triplemultiplex on May 07, 2015, 09:58:10 AM
Quote from: The Nature Boy on May 07, 2015, 09:43:40 AM
Can we get rid of all intrastate INTERSTATE highways that are less than 300 miles in length? That would free up a ton of numbers.
So long, I-45....
And just about every 3di in existence...
Quote from: freebrickproductions on May 07, 2015, 10:32:53 AM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on May 07, 2015, 09:58:10 AM
Quote from: The Nature Boy on May 07, 2015, 09:43:40 AM
Can we get rid of all intrastate INTERSTATE highways that are less than 300 miles in length? That would free up a ton of numbers.
So long, I-45....
And just about every 3di in existence...
Well, I would only get rid of 2dis that are less than 300 miles in length. 3di numbers can be reused in different states.
It's been policy since 1937: https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=10190
Quote from: NE2 on May 07, 2015, 10:55:01 AM
It's been policy since 1937: https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=10190
I have seen it cited in old California highway documents (from the 1930s). And yet, AASH(T)O disobeyed its own rule several times, authorizing the creation of U.S. 156 in Kansas, U.S. 57 in Texas, and - not sure of the date - possibly the relocation of U.S. 96 (a double rule-breaker) in Texas.
Quote from: national highway 1 on May 06, 2015, 11:26:00 PM
The only intrastate US highways that I know off-hand are US 92, US 192, US 290, US 57, US 181 and US 175.
US 266
Quote from: bugo on May 07, 2015, 11:32:02 AM
Quote from: national highway 1 on May 06, 2015, 11:26:00 PM
The only intrastate US highways that I know off-hand are US 92, US 192, US 290, US 57, US 181 and US 175.
US 266
US 46
Quote from: Big John on May 07, 2015, 11:48:45 AM
Quote from: bugo on May 07, 2015, 11:32:02 AM
Quote from: national highway 1 on May 06, 2015, 11:26:00 PM
The only intrastate US highways that I know off-hand are US 92, US 192, US 290, US 57, US 181 and US 175.
US 266
US 46
Guys, open the thread-link that NE2 posted (reposted below). All
currently-active intrastate US routes are the first items listed.
Quote from: NE2 on May 07, 2015, 10:55:01 AM
It's been policy since 1937: https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=10190
Quote from: usends on May 07, 2015, 09:47:46 AM
OK, so the first lines of that policy document do include a date of 1991, but reading through the contents, I see evidence that it was actually released in 1970. And I also suspect it borrows language and concepts from an even earlier document. So I think Wiki is misleading where it says "since 1991". In fact, the reality (from what I've observed) is that it was actually more like the 1980s when AASHTO's Standing Committee on Route Numbering stopped following several of the policies set forth in that document.
Thanks: these are illuminating comments. The U.S. numbered highways were established in 1926 to serve interstate (small "i") travel, a purpose now addressed by the Interstate (capital "I") system. The U.S. numbered highways have become a sort of trunk road system like the A roads in Britain.
Quote from: wdcrft63 on May 07, 2015, 06:48:13 PM
Quote from: usends on May 07, 2015, 09:47:46 AM
OK, so the first lines of that policy document do include a date of 1991, but reading through the contents, I see evidence that it was actually released in 1970. And I also suspect it borrows language and concepts from an even earlier document. So I think Wiki is misleading where it says "since 1991". In fact, the reality (from what I've observed) is that it was actually more like the 1980s when AASHTO's Standing Committee on Route Numbering stopped following several of the policies set forth in that document.
Thanks: these are illuminating comments. The U.S. numbered highways were established in 1926 to serve interstate (small "i") travel, a purpose now addressed by the Interstate (capital "I") system. The U.S. numbered highways have become a sort of trunk road system like the A roads in Britain.
I've always liked the comparison that the US system is the American counterpart to the British trunk (A) Roads; they have use wherever and whenever Interstates are not accessible.
I feel that such instances include stretches where US Routes roughly parallel Interstates but aren't concurrent with them (and where there are simply no other routes within a reasonable distance), such as I-84 and US-30 in Idaho and Oregon and I-70 and US-6 in Colorado. While most of the time it may be redundant, in the event of a crash or disaster a US Route may often be the best available route in case the nearby Interstate is closed, but not the US Route.
US 104 in Upstate NY which was decommissioned in 1970 and became NY 104.
US 106, thanks to New York not willing to allow it where NY 52 is. It eventually got cut up into PA 652, and PA 106 back in the early 70's. This was all part of a purge with US 111, US 230, US 309, and US 611 as all of these were intrastate minus US 111 that at least entered Maryland. Yes, US 611 did enter New Jersey for a short period, but only for 4 mile( hardly much of an appearance anyway) and still most of its life was exclusively to PA.
It should be the priority to extend these routes that have national value into another state, rather than decommission them. U.S. 104 should absolutely have been replaced with an extended U.S. 4, U.S. 301 should have replaced U.S. 611, U.S. 309 should have gone down NJ 42 or another important route, etc.
Highways like US 154 and 156 should have been allowed to remain because they were important roads connecting other US highways. US 154 is now part of the worthless US 400 but US 154 should have never been removed in the first place. US 383 was another victim of KDOT's jihad against intrastate US routes.
US 110 used to exist in Wisconsin back in the 1920s as a 40 mile long intrastate US highway. That became Wisconsin 110 in 1939 up until about 10-15 years ago when US 45 was reroute on to it from Oshkosh to US 10. Wis 110 is now just a 2 lane road from US 10 in Fremont to US 45 in Marion. That's the only example I can think of in Wisconsin history.
Quote from: hobsini2 on May 20, 2015, 04:20:21 PM
US 110...[is]...the only example I can think of in Wisconsin history.
There was also US 118...
http://usends.com/10-19/118/118.html
...but again, the entire list is here:
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=10190
I like how US 72 has both ends in TN, yet is not an intrastate US route as it goes through MS and AL :sombrero:.
Quote from: national highway 1 on May 06, 2015, 11:26:00 PM
The only intrastate US highways that I know off-hand are US 92, US 192, US 290, US 57, US 181 and US 175.
US 130 in NJ and it really should be a state highway.
Quote from: The Nature Boy on May 07, 2015, 09:43:40 AM
Can we get rid of all intrastate INTERSTATE highways that are less than 300 miles in length? That would free up a ton of numbers.
Case and point I-97 should be a 3di of 95. You'd have to run it over 695 to connect it to 95 but there's no need to waste 97 on such a short freeway.
At one point I-97 was going to have a 3di of its own (Either I-197 or I-297, IIRC one of them was going to be longer than its parent!), but now that it is not the case anymore I think it should be I-995.
QuoteUS 130 in NJ and it really should be a state highway.
I disagree. It's an important enough route that NJDOT and FHWA put most of it on the National Highway System.
QuoteCase and point I-97 should be a 3di of 95. You'd have to run it over 695 to connect it to 95 but there's no need to waste 97 on such a short freeway.
Minor nitpick: the proper term is
case-in-point. And it wouldn't necessarily have to run along 695. There's precedent elsewhere (I-980 CA, I-990 NY, I-190 MA, amongst others) of a 3di connecting only to another 3di of the same parent. In this case, replacing I-97 with I-995, I-995 would connect with I-695.
QuoteAt one point I-97 was going to have a 3di of its own (Either I-197 or I-297, IIRC one of them was going to be longer than its parent!),
In the initial plan from the late 70s, both I-197 AND I-297 would have existed. I-297 would have followed MD 3 between 50/301 and I-97/MD 32, while I-197 would have followed 50/301 from I-97 east into Annapolis, ending at MD 70. Neither would have been longer than I-97.
I know it's been discussed elsewhere, and I've probably commented in those places, but I don't understand the opposition, individual or by policy, against intrastate US or Interstate highways. It's the importance to the system overall that I want used to judge a road's worthiness to carry a number in one of these national grids. I'm sure we could (and likely have) come up with lists of US and Interstate highways entirely within a single state that are integral parts of the system overall, state routes that deserve an "upgrade" into the US or Interstate system, and US and Interstate routes that happen to cross a state border or two that should carry only state designations.
US 201 is intrastate (in Maine), but only because Quebec is part of Canada (and is not willing to renumber QC 173). It would definitely be a single route if the land was all in one country.
Advantages to extending US 201 along QC 173 (or just US/QC 201 as a single route):
1. The numbers match up across the border.
2. No longer an intrastate US route, as it is in both a state and a province.
3. US/QC 201 has a larger most populous city (Lévis, more populous than any city in Maine).
Disadvantages:
1. Current QC 201 would need to be renumbered.
2. Autoroute 73 would no longer have a meaningful number.
Quote from: Jim on May 23, 2015, 08:43:57 AM
I know it's been discussed elsewhere, and I've probably commented in those places, but I don't understand the opposition, individual or by policy, against intrastate US or Interstate highways. It's the importance to the system overall that I want used to judge a road's worthiness to carry a number in one of these national grids. I'm sure we could (and likely have) come up with lists of US and Interstate highways entirely within a single state that are integral parts of the system overall, state routes that deserve an "upgrade" into the US or Interstate system, and US and Interstate routes that happen to cross a state border or two that should carry only state designations.
+1
This is sort of what I was getting at re: US 154 and 156.
US 266 is another example, although not nearly as important these days with I-40 running parallel to it. US 266 connected US 64 to US 66, providing a major link on the Amarillo-Ft Smith highway. It was cut back in favor of US 62, but its importance as part of the system was not diminished.
US-223 is basically an intrastate US highway as it only runs about a mile in Ohio that's entirely concurrent with US-23. Heck, US-223 is close to being an intracounty US highway
Quote from: ftballfan on May 25, 2015, 09:08:28 PM
US-223 is basically an intrastate US highway as it only runs about a mile in Ohio that's entirely concurrent with US-23. Heck, US-223 is close to being an intracounty US highway
US 206 is just barley inside PA as it was truncated from its parent years ago, but it is still considered a two state roadway even though less than half a mile.
Quote from: roadman65 on May 25, 2015, 09:11:01 PM
US 206 is just barley inside PA
I thought the Goat Path was the only barley road in PA.
Quote from: NE2 on May 25, 2015, 09:58:44 PM
Quote from: roadman65 on May 25, 2015, 09:11:01 PM
US 206 is just barley inside PA
I thought the Goat Path was the only barley road in PA.
You're thinking of Barley Camp.
The champion in that is surely US 166. It escapes the threat of being deleted due to that AASHTO policy thanks to the quarter of mile it has in MO.
US 166 must be another barley road.
Quote from: roadman65 on May 11, 2015, 07:47:11 PM
This was all part of a purge with US 111, US 230, US 309, and US 611 as all of these were intrastate minus US 111 that at least entered Maryland.
I'm pretty sure US 111 was eliminated because I-83 made it a redundant designation, not because it was too short or intrastate (which it has been established that it was not). Also as a side note, I seem to recall reading that US 230 once (about 6 million years ago) went into MD, probably along present US 222, before being truncated to Lancaster.
Quote from: triplemultiplex on May 07, 2015, 09:58:10 AM
Quote from: The Nature Boy on May 07, 2015, 09:43:40 AM
Can we get rid of all intrastate INTERSTATE highways that are less than 300 miles in length? That would free up a ton of numbers.
So long, I-45....
As well as I-4 in Florida. That would probably be pretty tough to do.
Quote from: democraticnole on June 05, 2015, 02:32:57 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on May 07, 2015, 09:58:10 AM
Quote from: The Nature Boy on May 07, 2015, 09:43:40 AM
Can we get rid of all intrastate INTERSTATE highways that are less than 300 miles in length? That would free up a ton of numbers.
So long, I-45....
As well as I-4 in Florida. That would probably be pretty tough to do.
Goodbye, I-4; hello, I-495.
How about interstate US routes less than 300 miles in length be decommisioned? I'm looking at you, US 730.
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on June 10, 2015, 11:09:56 AM
How about interstate US routes less than 300 miles in length be decommisioned? I'm looking at you, US 730.
Not intrastate.
Quote from: Bickendan on June 10, 2015, 11:15:39 AM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on June 10, 2015, 11:09:56 AM
How about interstate US routes less than 300 miles in length be decommisioned? I'm looking at you, US 730.
Not intrastate.
He's saying that
any U.S. route under 300 miles should be removed (This includes 3 and 44...)
US 5 barely survives it.
Quote from: 1 on June 10, 2015, 11:33:21 AM
Quote from: Bickendan on June 10, 2015, 11:15:39 AM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on June 10, 2015, 11:09:56 AM
How about interstate US routes less than 300 miles in length be decommisioned? I'm looking at you, US 730.
Not intrastate.
He's saying that any U.S. route under 300 miles should be removed (This includes 3 and 44...)
US 5 barely survives it.
Yes
Quote from: ekt8750 on May 22, 2015, 03:51:39 PM
Quote from: national highway 1 on May 06, 2015, 11:26:00 PM
The only intrastate US highways that I know off-hand are US 92, US 192, US 290, US 57, US 181 and US 175.
US 130 in NJ and it really should be a state highway.
Quote from: The Nature Boy on May 07, 2015, 09:43:40 AM
Can we get rid of all intrastate INTERSTATE highways that are less than 300 miles in length? That would free up a ton of numbers.
Case and point I-97 should be a 3di of 95. You'd have to run it over 695 to connect it to 95 but there's no need to waste 97 on such a short freeway.
Extend 301 across Delaware memorial bridge and change 130 to 301.. Problem solved and let's 301 terminate at its parent
Agreed, that would leave out the routes in the Northeast where most are less than that and through two or more states. Many are important enough as there is quite the population and the need for off interstate thoroughfares.
QuoteProblem solved and let's 301 terminate at its parent
Not sure that's necessary considering that 301 already has two concurrencies (FL/GA and VA) with its parent.
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on June 10, 2015, 11:09:56 AM
How about interstate US routes less than 300 miles in length be decommisioned? I'm looking at you, US 730.
AASHTO guidelines do not prohibit US highways that are under 300 miles in length as long as they cross a state line. Haven't we been through this before?
Short interstate US highways serve a purpose, it provides a uniform numbering system for roads that cross state lines. That system would basically get rid of the US highway system in NH/VT/ME. It's a usual navigation tool.