When I lived in Clark, NJ we all believed that the former Lehigh Valley Railroad was the border between Clark and two neighboring communities which were Scotch Plains and Westfield. However, that was not the case.
As for the Clark/ Scotch Plains border it was Robinson's Branch of the Rahway River that was the actual boundary. As far as Westfield goes it had a line that went on a very shallow angle from where Robinson's Branch became Middlesex Reservoir and Scotch Plains no longer was bordering Clark to cross the former LVRR where the at grade crossing of CR 611 was completely in Westfield, but where CR 613 crossed the LVRR over a bridge the crossing was completely in Clark. In fact Clark had some of two subdivisions on the North side of the tracks, with one of them just a few houses on Dakota Street.
Yet, many of us thought that the railroad was the border of Clark. Even the AT& T phone center on Cellar Avenue in Clark thought it was Scotch Plains and referred to it as being there, when in fact it was on Clark's side of the river and the maps show it. Only where Lake Avenue crosses the Robinson's Branch does the township line deviate as the waterway was altered when the Lehigh Valley Railroad was built just in the same manner the Mississippi River was with some of the state lines between Kentucky and Missouri deviating from the River in some spots due to altering of the river, so was this one part.
Anybody else refer to one person's town as another per say?
Also, Rahway Prison is not in Rahway, NJ, but located in Woodbridge Township's Avenel neighborhood. Another great misconception that Rahway citizens hate.
Quote from: roadman65 on June 07, 2015, 04:43:19 PM
Also, Rahway Prison is not in Rahway, NJ, but located in Woodbridge Township's Avenel neighborhood. Another great misconception that Rahway citizens hate.
Hence why it's called East Jersey State Prison even though we all call it Rahway State. Avenel's not happy with it either, but there's not much we can do.
In Northwest Indiana, the Southlake Mall was built in an unincorporated area near the interchange between I-65 and US 30. Since the nearest town was Merrillville, everyone considered the mall to be a part of the town, referring to Merrillville as a shopping destination. About 10-15 years ago, the nearby town of Hobart annexed the previously unincorporated land that the mall and many other stores sit on, but people still refer to the area as "Merrillville."
The Detroit Zoo is referred to as being in Royal Oak, but most of it is in Huntington Woods. Only the entrance and the first couple exhibits are in the Royal Oak city limits.
Interestingly enough, Royal Oak is generally thought of as ending at Woodward Ave (except up at the northern end) and thus the zoo would not be in Royal Oak at all. But the line goes west of Woodward to take in a few residential blocks and that portion of the zoo.
Many people would be surprised to know that the Las Vegas Strip is not in the city itself, but is in an unincorporated area.
Closer to my area, some people consider the Walmart in Pearl, MS, to be Brandon, though the Brandon city limits is a stone's throw away. Speaking of Brandon, some portions of the city of Flowood have Brandon addresses.
Usually is based on Zip Code. Some Zip Codes cross town or city lines, and some Zip Codes that border a town or city may be in a different town or city.
Examples:
Some Scottsdale, AZ Zip Codes are in Neighboring Phoenix, Cave Creek & Carefree.
Some Glendale, AZ Zip Codes are In Neighboring Phoenix
And the worst examples Exist in Maricopa (Metro Phoenix), Pinal (Metro Phoenix & Metro Tucson) and Pima (Metro Tucson) are county islands surrounded by cities and towns, example: You could live at 15600 S 132nd Street Chandler, AZ 85255, but your house is in a county island not the city of Chandler, AZ
Lake Buena Vista, FL is part of Disney and the Reedy Creek Improvement District, but many of us think it is the commercial strip located outside of Disney World on FL 535 between I-4 and Lake Street(along Apopka-Vineland Road).
I used to think, that Downtown Disney (formerly Disney Village) was Lake Buena Vista which is why the area outside the resort became known as that. I thought Disney dropped the name for the Village and later Downtown and that LBV was unincorporated so the name just stood for the area with all post Disney businesses along 535 just using that as a name cause it caught on. Then I looked up the Reedy Creek Improvement District on line and found that it is technically one of two towns that are incorporated on Disney's Resort.
In the Washington, D.C. suburbs, there are many municipalities that have nearby reas (as defined by the Postal Service) that are much larger than their corporate limits.
In the Maryland suburbs we have:
Frederick;
Thurmont;
Chevy Chase;
Gaithersburg;
Rockville;
Chevy Chase;
Hyattsville;
Laurel;
Bowie;
Upper Marlboro;
Capital Heights; and
New Carrollton.
All have significant nearby unincorporated areas that have the same "city" name as the municipality of that name.
In Northern Virginia there are these:
Alexandria;
Falls Church;
Fairfax;
Vienna;
Manassas;
Dumfries;
Haymarket; and
Leesburg.
There are a bunch more that I did not enumerate.
There are a lot of misconceptions about municipal boundaries, especially in the outlying areas, here in Illinois. Here are but a few:
A section of Aurora that has a Naperville zip code: https://goo.gl/maps/0HJ5g It's right next to an area of the City of Naperville.
The Caton Farm Road corridor in Joliet that has a Plainfield zip code. Even includes Plainfield Township South High School (which is also in Kendall County): https://goo.gl/maps/sdx7U Most of the area was previously unincorporated Plainfield Township prior ro annexation.
The wonderful Village of Woodridge and how it snakes from north to south: http://www.vil.woodridge.il.us/DocumentCenter/View/435 Parts could be Lisle, Bolingbrook, Darien, Romeoville, or Lemont depending on where you are.
Bothell, WA, is split in two counties (yet is one city). All of the roads in Bothell follow the county numbering systems too, so it gets wonky at the line.
Quote from: roadman65 on June 08, 2015, 07:06:59 AM
Lake Buena Vista, FL is part of Disney and the Reedy Creek Improvement District, but many of us think it is the commercial strip located outside of Disney World on FL 535 between I-4 and Lake Street(along Apopka-Vineland Road).
I used to think, that Downtown Disney (formerly Disney Village) was Lake Buena Vista which is why the area outside the resort became known as that. I thought Disney dropped the name for the Village and later Downtown and that LBV was unincorporated so the name just stood for the area with all post Disney businesses along 535 just using that as a name cause it caught on. Then I looked up the Reedy Creek Improvement District on line and found that it is technically one of two towns that are incorporated on Disney's Resort.
There are some errors with Disney's location.
It is located in Bay Lake, Florida, a part of Orlando.
All mail is instead mailed to Lake Buena Vista, Florida, still part of Orlando.
The general public does not specify this and simply says Orlando, and think I'm wrong when I try to correct them. I have seen letters addressed to Disney World using Orlando and not Lake Buena Vista.
Quote from: noelbotevera on June 09, 2015, 12:16:46 AM
Quote from: roadman65 on June 08, 2015, 07:06:59 AM
Lake Buena Vista, FL is part of Disney and the Reedy Creek Improvement District, but many of us think it is the commercial strip located outside of Disney World on FL 535 between I-4 and Lake Street(along Apopka-Vineland Road).
I used to think, that Downtown Disney (formerly Disney Village) was Lake Buena Vista which is why the area outside the resort became known as that. I thought Disney dropped the name for the Village and later Downtown and that LBV was unincorporated so the name just stood for the area with all post Disney businesses along 535 just using that as a name cause it caught on. Then I looked up the Reedy Creek Improvement District on line and found that it is technically one of two towns that are incorporated on Disney's Resort.
There are some errors with Disney's location.
It is located in Bay Lake, Florida, a part of Orlando.
All mail is instead mailed to Lake Buena Vista, Florida, still part of Orlando.
The general public does not specify this and simply says Orlando, and think I'm wrong when I try to correct them. I have seen letters addressed to Disney World using Orlando and not Lake Buena Vista.
The ZIP code (if it is correct) will accurately specify the part of Orlando.
Quote from: noelbotevera on June 09, 2015, 12:16:46 AMI have seen letters addressed to Disney World using Orlando and not Lake Buena Vista.
Which surely the USPS can deal with easily?
I'd imagine that, like the UK, they barely use the town to sort it out - the code and street address normally giving the right information, with fairly rare duplicates. Of course, UK codes are fine detailed enough that even the street is rarely needed to discern (seriously - the use of letters means that each code covers a few houses. There's unlikely to be too many duplicates in the 3-4 character front part either, though they can cover several villages, so there will be some), but even the 5-digit zipcodes aren't going to cause issues.
And given that it's a common mistake, even without the zipcode it would get there - OK a bit late and dog-earred as the USPS won't be happy, but...
Quote from: english si on June 09, 2015, 06:28:47 AM
Quote from: noelbotevera on June 09, 2015, 12:16:46 AMI have seen letters addressed to Disney World using Orlando and not Lake Buena Vista.
Which surely the USPS can deal with easily?
I'd imagine that, like the UK, they barely use the town to sort it out - the code and street address normally giving the right information, with fairly rare duplicates. Of course, UK codes are fine detailed enough that even the street is rarely needed to discern (seriously - the use of letters means that each code covers a few houses. There's unlikely to be too many duplicates in the 3-4 character front part either, though they can cover several villages, so there will be some), but even the 5-digit zipcodes aren't going to cause issues.
And given that it's a common mistake, even without the zipcode it would get there - OK a bit late and dog-earred as the USPS won't be happy, but...
In the US, using the 9 digit zip code will get it to the correct street. A house number will get it to the house. Technically, that's all you need. Everything else is duplicated info.
Quote from: golden eagle on June 07, 2015, 10:27:48 PM
Many people would be surprised to know that the Las Vegas Strip is not in the city itself, but is in an unincorporated area.
Closer to my area, some people consider the Walmart in Pearl, MS, to be Brandon, though the Brandon city limits is a stone's throw away. Speaking of Brandon, some portions of the city of Flowood have Brandon addresses.
cgp grey has a good video on this, it's actually in paradise, and the reason shouldn't surprise anyone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=naDCCW5TSpU
Quote from: KEK Inc. on June 08, 2015, 10:34:31 PM
Bothell, WA, is split in two counties (yet is one city).
Maryland has municipalities that cross county boundaries, notably Mount Airy (Carroll and Frederick Counties), Queen Anne (Queen Anne's and Talbot Counties) and Hampstead (Carroll County and a small section in Baltimore County [the only part of Baltimore County that is within the corporate limits of a municipality]). Delmar is in two counties, Wicomico County, Maryland and Sussex County, Delaware, and at least some municipal services "cross" the state line. The City of Takoma Park used to be in Montgomery County and Prince George's County, but the county line was moved so that all of the city is in Montgomery County in about 2000.
Derby Line, Vermont. When the houses were built when it became a town, there were still discussions on where the Canadian border was. When the Canadian Border was finally decided, it turned out that most of the buildings in Derby Line were also in Stanstead, Quebec. The buildings and roads that dip into Canada have refused to move for a long time.
A famous misconception about borough lines is that NYC's Marble Hill neighborhood is in the Bronx.
More flippantly, a stereotypical misconception about the New York City boundary is that it coincides with the borough of Manhattan (below 125th Street, if we're really playing up the Manhattan-centrism).
Many of the businesses along the SH-9 corridor west of I-35 brand themselves as being in "Norman", as that is what zip code they are in. However, the businesses along the north side of the highway are technically in Newcastle and along the south side of the highway they are in Goldsby. This is all kind of stupid because the businesses are cut off from Norman proper by the river and many of them are chains that have locations in Norman, so it's less confusing to refer to them as "The McDonald's in Goldsby" or "The Shell in Goldsby" instead of "in Norman", where there are several other locations of the same business.
Even Goldsby Gaming Center, a small casino well into Goldsby city limits, gets in on the act, appearing on some promotional items as "Goldsby Gaming Center in Norman"!
Quote from: english si on June 09, 2015, 06:28:47 AM
Quote from: noelbotevera on June 09, 2015, 12:16:46 AMI have seen letters addressed to Disney World using Orlando and not Lake Buena Vista.
Which surely the USPS can deal with easily?
The zip codes that cover the area (32821, 32830, 32836) all have a default city of Orlando:
https://tools.usps.com/go/ZipLookupResultsAction!input.action?resultMode=2&companyName=&address1=&address2=&city=&state=Select&urbanCode=&postalCode=32821&zip=
...regardless of municipal boundaries. Zip code boundaries are much less likely to change than city boundaries, so when new cities are formed, annexations happen, etc., the zip codes retain their original city designations.
Other thoughts:
-Many people in the eastern (wealthier) section of Anaheim use Anaheim Hills in their addresses, I assume to give them some separation/exclusivity from the rest of Anaheim, even though USPS specifically requests to not use Anaheim Hills:
https://tools.usps.com/go/ZipLookupResultsAction!input.action?resultMode=2&companyName=&address1=&address2=&city=&state=Select&urbanCode=&postalCode=92807&zip=
It used to actually say "unacceptable - use Anaheim" on their site.
-Signal Hill was incorporated in 1924, but since it was entirely surrounded by Long Beach, used their postal codes for mailing (Long Beach 4, Long Beach 6, then 90804 and 90806) up until 2002 when it was finally given its own zip code of 90755.
Quote from: KEK Inc. on June 08, 2015, 10:34:31 PM
Bothell, WA, is split in two counties (yet is one city).
Living in a state where we have many municipalities that cross county lines, I don't see how that's special. Our second largest one, Aurora, crosses into four different counties (DuPage, Kane, Kendall, and Will).
Quote from: empirestate on June 09, 2015, 01:08:05 PM
A famous misconception about borough lines is that NYC's Marble Hill neighborhood is in the Bronx.
More flippantly, a stereotypical misconception about the New York City boundary is that it coincides with the borough of Manhattan (below 125th Street, if we're really playing up the Manhattan-centrism).
I've always wondered what county NYC was in, so the boroughs are all different counties? Or is that only partly true?
Quote from: silverback1065 on June 09, 2015, 03:23:37 PM
Quote from: empirestate on June 09, 2015, 01:08:05 PM
A famous misconception about borough lines is that NYC's Marble Hill neighborhood is in the Bronx.
More flippantly, a stereotypical misconception about the New York City boundary is that it coincides with the borough of Manhattan (below 125th Street, if we're really playing up the Manhattan-centrism).
I've always wondered what county NYC was in, so the boroughs are all different counties? Or is that only partly true?
It's entirely true. The five boroughs are exactly coextensive with five counties, three* of which have different names from each other:
-Manhattan/New York County
-Brooklyn/Kings County
-Queens/Queens County
-The Bronx/Bronx County
-Staten Island/Richmond County
*Technically, you could argue four, since the word "the" appears officially in the name of the borough of the Bronx, but not in the name of Bronx County. Also, Staten Island used to be called the borough of Richmond, but the borough name was changed to reflect the common practice of referring to the place by the name of the island.
Quote from: empirestate on June 09, 2015, 01:08:05 PM
A famous misconception about borough lines is that NYC's Marble Hill neighborhood is in the Bronx.
More flippantly, a stereotypical misconception about the New York City boundary is that it coincides with the borough of Manhattan (below 125th Street, if we're really playing up the Manhattan-centrism).
Yes, I never thought that one, but I am sure that there are some people who do think that NYC is only Manhattan and not the 4 other boroughs.
As for misconceptions based on ZIP codes, those aren't so much about where town boundaries are as they are about failing to distinguish at all between a town (municipal entity) and a postal city/ZIP code (area designated by the post office to organize the delivery of mail). For whatever reason, people generally identify very strongly with what the post office calls their piece of territory (even though the receiving of mail at home is much less important than it used to be) and often barely refer to the actual governmental entity they live under, if there even is one.
(And it's not only ZIP codes; people will also identify with a school district, or just with a nearby municipality if they happen to live in an otherwise unnamed unincorporated area adjacent to it.)
The Post Office considers where I live in Orlando. I live outside the city limits.
The Post Office considers Paradise, NV to Las Vegas, NV.
The Post Office considers each neighborhood in Queens to be independent cities.
The Post Office considers part of Woodbridge Township, NJ to be Metuchen, even though Edison separates it and Metuchen's Post Office does not deliver mail in between, but Edison's PO does.
Quote from: roadman65 on June 09, 2015, 04:11:19 PM
The Post Office considers...
Well, in a way. The
general public considers all those things, based on what the post offices are named and what areas they serve. While the postal service has had a lot of influence historically in establishing U.S. placenames because of its naming requirements for post offices, they aren't really in the business of determining what areas go together geographically. The Census Bureau is in charge of that (based of course on what the actual localgovernments do).
But, since the general public deals a lot more frequently with the mailman than with the census taker or even the tax collector, it's the postal nomenclature that catches hold in most people's parlance.
Quote from: empirestate on June 09, 2015, 03:47:22 PM
For whatever reason, people generally identify very strongly with what the post office calls their piece of territory (even though the receiving of mail at home is much less important than it used to be) and often barely refer to the actual governmental entity they live under, if there even is one.
(And it's not only ZIP codes; people will also identify with a school district, or just with a nearby municipality if they happen to live in an otherwise unnamed unincorporated area adjacent to it.)
I think many of these people will identify with whichever place gives them the most cache (read: highest home value, best scoring schools). When North Hollywood (itself part of Los Angeles) started to decline, people in those zip codes began identifying with smaller neighborhoods (Studio City, Toluca Lake, Valley Village) in order to disassociate from North Hollywood, keeping their home values (and I imagine their morale) up.
Quote from: empirestate on June 09, 2015, 05:34:11 PM
Quote from: roadman65 on June 09, 2015, 04:11:19 PM
The Post Office considers...
Well, in a way. The general public considers all those things, based on what the post offices are named and what areas they serve. While the postal service has had a lot of influence historically in establishing U.S. placenames because of its naming requirements for post offices, they aren't really in the business of determining what areas go together geographically. The Census Bureau is in charge of that (based of course on what the actual localgovernments do).]
However, in the case of CDPs, the Census Bureau often "creates" places that don't have any real-world use, grouping two or more communities/villages/hamlets/etc. together into one hyphenated CDP (or even making a name up that hadn't been in use by local governments, the Post Office or the general public). These communities, while geographically proximate, don't historically identify with each other the same "place." Similarly, the Census Bureau has named CDPs that are unincorporated pockets surrounded by cities, again assigning names that have not seen real-world usage.
Sometimes what the Post Office considers eventually leads to the municipality changing its name to suit. Witness Dover Township, NJ changing its name to Toms River Township. Why? Because the Post Office insisted all mail be marked that even though Toms River was a place name covering a small portion of Dover Twp.
Oddly some place names in Toms River Twp. still see common use even after the name change. People still claim they live in Silverton... but never Gilford Park.
Quote from: DTComposer on June 12, 2015, 12:35:14 PMHowever, in the case of CDPs, the Census Bureau often "creates" places that don't have any real-world use, grouping two or more communities/villages/hamlets/etc. together into one hyphenated CDP (or even making a name up that hadn't been in use by local governments, the Post Office or the general public). These communities, while geographically proximate, don't historically identify with each other the same "place." Similarly, the Census Bureau has named CDPs that are unincorporated pockets surrounded by cities, again assigning names that have not seen real-world usage.
Indeed they do, and these names seldom come into common usage after being devised by the Census Bureau, whereas postal names frequently have.
iPhone
Don't get me started on all the places that list their address as being in "Rochester, NY" or "Buffalo, NY" despite the fact that they are in neighboring municipalities. Stupid example: This post office is quite clearly in the town of Henrietta (https://www.google.com/maps/place/US+Post+Office/@43.0850099,-77.6290946,13z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x0000000000000000:0x64ae629fe81866e9), but nope, they say they're in Rochester and therefore so does everyone they deliver mail to.
Quote from: Duke87 on June 13, 2015, 11:39:48 AM
Don't get me started on all the places that list their address as being in "Rochester, NY" or "Buffalo, NY" despite the fact that they are in neighboring municipalities. Stupid example: This post office is quite clearly in the town of Henrietta (https://www.google.com/maps/place/US+Post+Office/@43.0850099,-77.6290946,13z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x0000000000000000:0x64ae629fe81866e9), but nope, they say they're in Rochester and therefore so does everyone they deliver mail to.
And that's actually the main post office for Rochester now.
But how would you have these places list their address, then? If they have a Rochester mailing address, that's what they'd list, no?
iPhone
Quote from: english si on June 09, 2015, 06:28:47 AM
Quote from: noelbotevera on June 09, 2015, 12:16:46 AMI have seen letters addressed to Disney World using Orlando and not Lake Buena Vista.
Which surely the USPS can deal with easily?
I'd imagine that, like the UK, they barely use the town to sort it out - the code and street address normally giving the right information, with fairly rare duplicates.
By default, they do indeed seem not to bother with the town name, relying entirely on the ZIP code. I experienced this firsthand about 15 years ago when a letter from a family member in Florida took an inordinately long time to arrive. When it finally got to me in Georgia, ZIP code 30xxx, there was a postmark on it from a town in Iowa, ZIP code 50xxx. Apparently they (or, more likely, some automated system) couldn't quite read her handwriting.
Connecticut has 169 municipalities, each with a distinct border.
Winsted is a part of Winchester.
Storrs, home to U-Conn, is a part of Mansfield.
Willimantic is a part of Windham.
Mystic is a part of Stonington and (I think) a sliver of Groton.
Kensington is a part of Berlin. The village shares its 06037 zip code with most of the remainder of Berln. Berlin's lesser village (hamlet?), East Berlin, has a different zip code, however.
The one anomaly I can find in this state is Groton. A municipality map of the state will only show one Groton, on the other side of the Thames River from New London. However, I've seen sites mention a separate town of Groton and city of Groton.
I live in New Britain, a city of roughly 72,000, give or take. There are no towns or villages within its 13.9 square miles that I'm aware of.
In Pennsylvania, Philadelphia city and county cover the exact same area (coterminous).
In Maryland, Baltimore city is separate from Baltimore County.
I've lost count on how many independent cities Virginia has. Would Arlington be considered a case like Philadelphia? I stayed at a hotel there two weeks ago. I seem to remember seeing Arlington County on a couple of vehicles there.
Quote from: empirestate on June 13, 2015, 12:04:58 PM
And that's actually the main post office for Rochester now.
But how would you have these places list their address, then?
Henrietta, NY. Or whatever town they're located within the political boundary of. Your address should not be in Rochester, NY if you are not in the city of Rochester. (Or the town of Rochester, but they should be made to change their name to avoid duplication)
Quote from: Duke87 on June 13, 2015, 11:10:27 PM
Quote from: empirestate on June 13, 2015, 12:04:58 PM
And that's actually the main post office for Rochester now.
But how would you have these places list their address, then?
Henrietta, NY. Or whatever town they're located within the political boundary of. Your address should not be in Rochester, NY if you are not in the city of Rochester. (Or the town of Rochester, but they should be made to change their name to avoid duplication)
Oh, I see; you mean you'd like to see mailing addresses changed to match physical addresses?
Many businesses around the Blanding Blvd exit of 295 in Jacksonville are thought if as if they are in Orange Park. Many of the car dealerships are xxxx of Orange Park. The zip codes are Jacksonville
Quote from: noelbotevera on June 09, 2015, 12:16:46 AM
Quote from: roadman65 on June 08, 2015, 07:06:59 AM
Lake Buena Vista, FL is part of Disney and the Reedy Creek Improvement District, but many of us think it is the commercial strip located outside of Disney World on FL 535 between I-4 and Lake Street(along Apopka-Vineland Road).
I used to think, that Downtown Disney (formerly Disney Village) was Lake Buena Vista which is why the area outside the resort became known as that. I thought Disney dropped the name for the Village and later Downtown and that LBV was unincorporated so the name just stood for the area with all post Disney businesses along 535 just using that as a name cause it caught on. Then I looked up the Reedy Creek Improvement District on line and found that it is technically one of two towns that are incorporated on Disney's Resort.
There are some errors with Disney's location.
It is located in Bay Lake, Florida, a part of Orlando.
All mail is instead mailed to Lake Buena Vista, Florida, still part of Orlando.
The general public does not specify this and simply says Orlando, and think I'm wrong when I try to correct them. I have seen letters addressed to Disney World using Orlando and not Lake Buena Vista.
It is mostly unincorporated Orange County.
The Reedy Creek Improvement District is in Orange and Osceola County. But the RCID is more or less independent
For people from NJ, PA, NY and New England unincorporated areas are a weird concept.
Quote from: jwolfer on June 14, 2015, 01:29:07 AM
For people from NJ, PA, NY and New England unincorporated areas are a weird concept.
Of course, I was going to say not so in NY–but you're right; just as towns aren't considered "incorporated", I've also never heard them referred to as "unincorporated" either. They're kind of not terms we even use, except perhaps to refer to the actual process of forming a city or village.
Quote from: mapman1071 on June 08, 2015, 02:28:26 AM
Usually is based on Zip Code. Some Zip Codes cross town or city lines, and some Zip Codes that border a town or city may be in a different town or city.
Examples:
Some Scottsdale, AZ Zip Codes are in Neighboring Phoenix, Cave Creek & Carefree.
Some Glendale, AZ Zip Codes are In Neighboring Phoenix
And the worst examples Exist in Maricopa (Metro Phoenix), Pinal (Metro Phoenix & Metro Tucson) and Pima (Metro Tucson) are county islands surrounded by cities and towns, example: You could live at 15600 S 132nd Street Chandler, AZ 85255, but your house is in a county island not the city of Chandler, AZ
More Phoenix area examples:
- Parts of the Tolleson zip code extend into far west Phoenix and parts of Avondale.
- Parts of far northeastern Gilbert are in a Mesa zip code.
Quote from: empirestate on June 14, 2015, 12:33:22 AM
Quote from: Duke87 on June 13, 2015, 11:10:27 PM
Henrietta, NY. Or whatever town they're located within the political boundary of. Your address should not be in Rochester, NY if you are not in the city of Rochester. (Or the town of Rochester, but they should be made to change their name to avoid duplication)
Oh, I see; you mean you'd like to see mailing addresses changed to match physical addresses?
Pretty much. Use whatever municipality the building is physically in when writing the address. No saying you're in the city when you're in a suburb. If Henrietta, Brighton, etc. wants to be part of Rochester so badly they should have Rochester annex them. Otherwise, no.
Of course, New York City messes with this standard since street names and addresses within the city are not unique, so to avoid ambiguity you need to specify the borough. Local convention is pretty much that "New York, NY" = Manhattan, The Bronx is written as "Bronx, NY", Brooklyn and Staten Island are written verbatim, and in Queens you use the neighborhood name (e.g. "Long Island City, NY"). I'm fine with this local convention so long as it is followed, but of course I've seen people write "New York, NY" when they're not in Manhattan, so...
As for unincorporated areas, the anal retentive way would be to just default to the lowest level of government available (e.g. "123 Sand Road, Lander County, NV"). But I'd accept using the name of an unincorporated CDP as well.
Over in the Capital District, Post Office addresses usually do correspond to the municipalities (rather than just using "Albany" or something), but it's not exact. Obviously there are the cases where the zip code line doesn't match the town line, but there are a couple interesting ones:
-There is a post office labeled Latham, even though Latham is technically a hamlet.
-There is no post office labeled Halfmoon; instead, the town is split between Clifton Park and Waterford for mail sorting purposes. This has actually become a political issue with Schumer trying to get them a zip code, as apparently some services (like fire) get confused by the addresses, drive to Clifton Park, and only realize later that they need to go to Halfmoon. Making things more complicated, the hamlet of Clifton Park actually IS in the Town of Halfmoon, and not the Town of Clifton Park.
Quote from: NJRoadfan on June 12, 2015, 01:29:34 PM
Sometimes what the Post Office considers eventually leads to the municipality changing its name to suit. Witness Dover Township, NJ changing its name to Toms River Township. Why? Because the Post Office insisted all mail be marked that even though Toms River was a place name covering a small portion of Dover Twp.
Oddly some place names in Toms River Twp. still see common use even after the name change. People still claim they live in Silverton... but never Gilford Park.
Also the fact that there is a Dover in Morris County, which would confuse people.
New Jersey allows duplicate municipality names such as the many different Washington's that they have scattered throughout the whole state with 3 of them being close to each other in Morris and Warren Counties. You even have two Freeholds as well. A borough named Freehold and a township named the same. However, most consider them both to be the same because they are neighboring communities even though they have separate police, fire, schools, and government.
The same could be said about Madison Township in Middlesex County becoming Old Bridge Township as it was confusing being Morris County has also a city named Madison.
Quote from: Duke87 on June 14, 2015, 03:26:36 PM
Quote from: empirestate on June 14, 2015, 12:33:22 AM
Quote from: Duke87 on June 13, 2015, 11:10:27 PM
Henrietta, NY. Or whatever town they're located within the political boundary of. Your address should not be in Rochester, NY if you are not in the city of Rochester. (Or the town of Rochester, but they should be made to change their name to avoid duplication)
Oh, I see; you mean you'd like to see mailing addresses changed to match physical addresses?
Pretty much. Use whatever municipality the building is physically in when writing the address. No saying you're in the city when you're in a suburb. If Henrietta, Brighton, etc. wants to be part of Rochester so badly they should have Rochester annex them. Otherwise, no.
I can sympathize with that viewpoint. However, your beef is with the postal system really, not with the businesses themselves for listing their addresses in some misleading way; they're just listing what the postal service has set up. Nor is it with the municipalities, for wanting to be something they're not; many of them would actually prefer to retain their separate identities.
I live outside Chambersburg (may be disputed - the "Chambersburg Welcomes You" signs may be a little off) but I still have a Chambersburg address - and even the ZIP code to boot.
I can relate.
I actually live in the town of River Bend, NC. We have our own police department, public works department (etc.)
My zip code is 28562, which is a New Bern zip code. The town of Trent Woods which is just NE of me and shares a common boundary with the city of New Bern is in the same boat-same zip code as me, too.
Meanwhile, the town of Bridgeton which is little more than a wide spot in the road has its own post office, hence its own zip code. Even stranger yet, Ernul which is along US-17 between Bridgeton and Vanceboro (near the US-17/NC-43 intersection) isn't even a town, heck it's not even a wide spot in the road, yet it has its own post office and zip code!
In NJ where we have some dry towns, it's not too uncommon for some bars to exist just on the other side of the boundary. Yet, for various reasons, people will associate those bars with the town that is dry. Pitman, NJ is one of those dry towns, but many will say they are going to a bar in Pitman, which in reality is literally just feet from the border in the neighboring town.
Heck, even the Pitman Golf Course is completely located in the neighboring town of Mantua. And since Mantua isn't dry, it serves liquor.
I noticed how Robbinsville in Mercer County, NJ was once Washington. What strikes me as odd is the New Jersey Turnpike and Exit 7A in that renamed township: There's a water tower nearby, still adorned with the town's old name. :)
USPS assigns cities to zip codes for its own convenience in routing mail and packages (before zip codes, city names were how they routed mail, so limiting the number of city names and avoiding confusion between similar city and county names was paramount - that's why you don't see county names used much as destinations, since in a lot of the US there's a big geographic distance between City/Town X and X County/Parish within the same state). Any correspondence with real world boundaries is largely coincidental.
See also: telephone area codes and exchanges, again assigned largely for the convenience of the phone company with only occasional political considerations coming into play.
I'd guess many people wouldn't know what municipality they live in unless they actually looked at their voter registration card (if registered) or a property tax bill (which renters wouldn't get, except in states with a personal property tax on cars), which are the only two reasonably reliable sources other than looking at boundary maps.
I may live inside the city of La Quinta CA, however I have an Indio CA zip code and across the street from me is Palm Desert and another is Riverside county jurisdiction (Bermuda Dunes). I can walk to Indian Wells and ride my bike 2 miles to another community: Sun City Palm Desert (the overwhelming majority of residents are over age 55-club policy states a home owner must be that age, and seasonal "snowbird" residents). I refer this place as "five points within a mile from me", ROFL.
The borders between ZIP codes, school districts and municipalities in the Capital Region of NY is bizarre, indeed. At one point, I technically lived in Bethlehem, NY with an Albany, NY address in the Guilderland, NY School District.
Quote from: KEVIN_224 on June 13, 2015, 10:58:53 PMI've lost count on how many independent cities Virginia has. Would Arlington be considered a case like Philadelphia? I stayed at a hotel there two weeks ago. I seem to remember seeing Arlington County on a couple of vehicles there.
There is no city or town of Arlington; there's just the county.
Quote from: Doctor Whom on June 18, 2015, 08:28:56 PM
Quote from: KEVIN_224 on June 13, 2015, 10:58:53 PMI've lost count on how many independent cities Virginia has. Would Arlington be considered a case like Philadelphia? I stayed at a hotel there two weeks ago. I seem to remember seeing Arlington County on a couple of vehicles there.
There is no city or town of Arlington; there's just the county.
Arlington in common principle is simply called a city - which is incorrect. Arlington is in fact a county, but most people interpret Arlington as a city; to boot, they say "Arlington, Virginia", and even TV shows say that.
My question is why in old maps is Belle Meade shown - but Hillsborough was always left out in the dust? We're the largest by land area in all of Somerset County, yet we always seemed to get shunned on older maps.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.interstate-guide.com%2Fmaps%2Fnew_jersey_central_1973.jpg&hash=0907b34d0bcf291557c4cc09ca0ffa5a637a7fb7)
From http://www.interstate-guide.com/i-095.html
Looking at the map, I believe Trenton is the only state capital on a state boundary, not placed in the middle of the state like NJ. My Mom's family friend is from Lawrenceville between Trenton and the ivy league college town Princeton. And how old is the map? It shows I-95 and I-295 under construction to connect Lawrenceville with NYC or Philly (I-95) and a commercial airport (I-295).
Quote from: noelbotevera on June 18, 2015, 08:34:52 PM
Arlington in common principle is simply called a city - which is incorrect. Arlington is in fact a county, but most people interpret Arlington as a city; to boot, they say "Arlington, Virginia", and even TV shows say that.
Right, although I'm pretty sure the postal service designates it as the "postal city" of Arlington, VA, and the Census Bureau reckons the whole county as an unincorporated place called Arlington.
Quote from: Zeffy on June 18, 2015, 09:32:25 PM
My question is why in old maps is Belle Meade shown - but Hillsborough was always left out in the dust? We're the largest by land area in all of Somerset County, yet we always seemed to get shunned on older maps.
It's because Hillsborough, being a township and thus a minor civil division, is considered an areal feature rather than a point feature. By contrast, Belle Mead, being a hamlet (or whatever NJ calls those), is a locatable place, however minor. In cartographic terms, an areal feature like Hillsborough Township would be shown by drawing a border or shading an area and labeling it subtly, probably, with spread-out lettering (as the counties are in your map example). However, the mapmakers have decided not to show areal features at the low level of townships on this map, so it's omitted. On the other hand, populated places, whether incorporated or not, are shown on this map by basically drawing a dot at the location of the population center.
The problem is that this kind of symbology doesn't jive well with modern population patterns, where many people live spread across a non-centralized area, often not incorporated in the traditional sense, and so not traditionally depicted on maps except at the largest of scales. However, to adopt a new symbology that accurately shows where the population lives would tend to conflict with the cartographic goals of your typical road atlas, so they haven't really bothered trying (other than to use a subtle built-up area shading, but your example hasn't elected to do so).
Quote from: Mike D boy on June 18, 2015, 09:45:46 PM
Looking at the map, I believe Trenton is the only state capital on a state boundary, not placed in the middle of the state like NJ.
Even more OT: Carson City NV borders California, Albany NY is pretty darn close to Massachusetts, Tallahassee is within 20 miles or so of the Georgia line, Cheyenne WY is right next to Colorado, and Juneau is closer to most of British Columbia than it is to most of Alaska. And Providence is basically on the Massachusetts line too, but in Rhode Island that's pretty much unavoidable (same deal with Hartford CT - it's hard to get far from a state line). So Trenton isn't that exceptional.
Quote from: lordsutch on June 18, 2015, 11:50:24 PM
Quote from: Mike D boy on June 18, 2015, 09:45:46 PM
Looking at the map, I believe Trenton is the only state capital on a state boundary, not placed in the middle of the state like NJ.
Even more OT: Carson City NV borders California, Albany NY is pretty darn close to Massachusetts, Tallahassee is within 20 miles or so of the Georgia line, Cheyenne WY is right next to Colorado, and Juneau is closer to most of British Columbia than it is to most of Alaska. And Providence is basically on the Massachusetts line too, but in Rhode Island that's pretty much unavoidable (same deal with Hartford CT - it's hard to get far from a state line). So Trenton isn't that exceptional.
And don't forget that the ocean is a boundary of some states. So Boston is on a boundary too.