I was wondering about the alignment of US 41 from Terre Haute north to Carbondale.
U.S. Route 41 is at least a 4 lane highway all the way from Evansville to Hammond, except for the section from Terre Haute to Carbondale. Why doesn't US 41 run via Indiana State Route 63? That's a 4 lane highway, plus it's 5 miles shorter, so it should be a faster route from Terre Haute north towards the Chicago area.
visualization:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi35.tinypic.com%2F15wkzyp.png&hash=7bb1bea0806ed42cd9d8d18a0368e8a5a60d3788)
By the way, since Terre Haute is a French name, how do you Americans pronounce that name?
Quote from: Chris on September 20, 2009, 03:07:09 PM
I was wondering about the alignment of US 41 from Terre Haute north to Carbondale.
U.S. Route 41 is at least a 4 lane highway all the way from Evansville to Hammond, except for the section from Terre Haute to Carbondale. Why doesn't US 41 run via Indiana State Route 63? That's a 4 lane highway, plus it's 5 miles shorter, so it should be a faster route from Terre Haute north towards the Chicago area.
Couldn't tell you. I do know that the signs encourage the long distance travelers (primarily the truckers) to use SR 63 rather than US 41. US 41 in many places isn't the most direct route between two of its points. For example, drivers between Green Bay, WI, and Covington, MI, would be better served using US 141, while between Menominee and Escanaba, M-35 is the better route.
QuoteBy the way, since Terre Haute is a French name, how do you Americans pronounce that name?
Terre Haute is surprisingly one of the foreign names pronounced correctly in Indiana, unlike Versailles (ver-SAYLES) and Steuben (emphasis on second syllable despite being named after the guy where emphasis is on the first syllable).
How about Veyvay, named by settlers from Veyvey, Switzerland. It was spelled phoenitcally in English so it would be pronounced as it is in French, and yet the locals all insist it is pronounced VeeVee.
While they were widening SR 63 back in the late 1970's, I drove it often between Evansville and West Lafayette, while still attending Purdue. BTW, 41 is very scenic thru the Turkey Run state park, while 61 is much fastter I remember reading a brief newspaper article back in those days about how they were going to move US 41 to the SR 63 alignment, and renumber existing 41 to something else. However, as we all know, it was never done. Why, I have no idea. It might have been political, where Rockville, Attica, etc along existing 41 fought not to have the number changed, but that is only speculation on my part.
My suggestion to number those two roads......... I would either change SR 63 to US 41 or at least co-sign them together. If co-signed, INDOT can keep that road as SR 63 on its "books", saving time and effort and making it more likely to happen. Plus SR 63 has not been around for a very long time, and most people are probably used to that road as 63.
I would then take existing US 41 and make it US 41A (or Alt. 41). The exisiting route would be the perfect fit as an Altnerate route, being it would parallel new US 41, but be slightly longer and an older route. However, I do know that the last bannered route in Indiana was US 31A north of Seymour, and it was gotten rid of by the mid 1980's, so I don't envision my "suggestion" ever happening.
Quote from: RoadWarrior56 on September 23, 2009, 09:29:36 PM
I would then take existing US 41 and make it US 41A (or Alt. 41). The exisiting route would be the perfect fit as an Altnerate route, being it would parallel new US 41, but be slightly longer and an older route. However, I do know that the last bannered route in Indiana was US 31A north of Seymour, and it was gotten rid of by the mid 1980's, so I don't envision my "suggestion" ever happening.
INDOT's policy now is no bannered routes, so I highly doubt they'd ever consider this.
Wasn't a rumor who mentionned then the corridor used by IN-63 would had been part of a possible future I-63?
Rawmustard........not surprised about INDOT policy on bannered routes. I figured there was a reason the bannered routes that existed have disappeared. BTW, even though I think US 41A would be appropriate for that route, I figure both route numbers will stay as they are nothwithstanding INDOT's policy. If there have been no changes in the least 30 yrs, I can't forsee any changes now.
As far as I-63 is concerned, all I know about that route number in Indiana is that INDOT tried to get it added to the interstate system back in '68 to provide a route between Evansville and Indianapolis, partially via I-70 between Indy and Brazil, IN. I-164 was a fragment of that proposal that did get adopted.
Will U.S. 41 be incorporated into the new Indiana 641 Terre Haute bypass? The project map (http://www.in.gov/indot/div/projects/sr641/images/SR641Phases.jpg) shows the corridor as a full freeway between U.S. 41 & 150 and an upgraded Interstate 70 interchange with Indiana 46. Also since Indiana has the mileage cap, will Indiana 46 be truncated to Indiana 641, leaving the road between I-70 and U.S. 40 unnumbered?
I was under the impressiong that Indiana 641 would be signed as such and that US 41 would be retained at its current route. As for SR 46, I would imagine that it would end at 641. Furthermore, the stretch of SR 46 north of I-70 to US 40 I think is supposed to be resigned at US 40 when US 40 is supposed to be rerouted around Terre Haute using the current SR 46 to I-70, and then following 70 west to across the Illinois border. As for the mileage cap, when all of this is done I doubt there will be a big difference.
Quote from: AARoads on October 14, 2009, 05:46:57 PM
Will U.S. 41 be incorporated into the new Indiana 641 Terre Haute bypass? The project map (http://www.in.gov/indot/div/projects/sr641/images/SR641Phases.jpg) shows the corridor as a full freeway between U.S. 41 & 150 and an upgraded Interstate 70 interchange with Indiana 46. Also since Indiana has the mileage cap, will Indiana 46 be truncated to Indiana 641, leaving the road between I-70 and U.S. 40 unnumbered?
Nothing that I've seen would indicate the bypass would extend to the northeast of Terre Haute, so I seriously doubt there'd be any consideration to routing U.S. 41 over it. As for a SR 46 turnback, it's certainly possible, but since it's the major connector between I-70, the Terre Haute airport, and U.S. 40, I think it may stay in state control in some form.
Quote from: leifvanderwall on October 14, 2009, 09:35:29 PM
Hey guys , I think this would be a good idea! Name the current 41 - 41E rename 63 -41 W .... Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha ; heh, heh, heh.... OK probably not funny. However, I like the idea of Interstate 63 but I would put it on the Illinois 1 corridor to gobble up Illinois 394 to terminate at the I-80/I-94. A better direct route to Chicago.
Leif, please stick to the forum guidelines and place your highway routing ideas entirely within the Fictional Highways subforum. The other threads are to be used for highways that are already in existence, being built, or under active consideration by their respective DOTs. I-63 exists only in the minds of imaginative roadgeeks, and thus should be contemplated only in the Fictional subcategory.
As someone who really enjoys the old roads, I rather like US 41 continuing to be signed along its historic route north of Terre Haute!
As for the segment of SR 46 between US 40 and I-70 -- Rumor's been floating around for years that INDOT wants to route US 40 along what is now SR 46 to I-70, and then have 40 run concurrently with 70 all the way out to near the state line where there's an existing concurrency of the roads. If that rumor's true, it would keep that road under state control for all the reasons stated earlier in this thread.
However, I have a 1963 Terre Haute map that shows SR 46 heading north (no I-70 there yet) and then turning left at Poplar St. and heading into town, co-signed with SR 42. Both roads ran all the way to 3rd St., US 41. Today, SR 42 ends at SR 46. The stretch of current SR 46 north of SR 42 was a local road, Hulman Rd. The map showed it as slightly offset from SR 46.
jim
Hi everyone. I just joined this board and saw this topic and this is what I was told when I live in Terre Haute.
Representative John Myers, who is from Attica (along US-41) was largely responsible for securing the funding for the expansion of IN-63 in the early 70s. However he made it clear that US-41 was to continue along its present routing when discussions about relocating the route came up.
IN-63 is a flat, straight and boring road, as opposed to US-41, which is beautiful, but hilly and windy.
Quote from: Chris on September 20, 2009, 03:07:09 PM
I was wondering about the alignment of US 41 from Terre Haute north to Carbondale.
U.S. Route 41 is at least a 4 lane highway all the way from Evansville to Hammond, except for the section from Terre Haute to Carbondale. Why doesn't US 41 run via Indiana State Route 63? That's a 4 lane highway, plus it's 5 miles shorter, so it should be a faster route from Terre Haute north towards the Chicago area.
I would favor swapping the highways. Especially since SR 63 thru Terre Haute ceased to be concurrent with US 41/150 making SR 63 a discontinuous highway, and I hate discontinuous highways.
Quote from: RoadWarrior56 on September 24, 2009, 12:55:20 PM
As far as I-63 is concerned, all I know about that route number in Indiana is that INDOT tried to get it added to the interstate system back in '68 to provide a route between Evansville and Indianapolis, partially via I-70 between Indy and Brazil, IN. I-164 was a fragment of that proposal that did get adopted.
Indiana at one time considered two toll roads, the East West (now I-80 and I-90) and a North South toll road, which was never built,as the interstate system finally came into being at that time. North-South was to connect the NW Indiana region to Evansville. Instead of a toll road, Indiana upgraded many of the US and SR routes to divided highways with at grade intersections as the cost ofa limited access freeway was much more.
Illinois once considered a supplemenatl freeway near Illinois It would have bypassed Danville near the state line. The only parts being built as 4 lane are in the far south of the state in large part because Because Indiana 4 laned 41 and 63.
I was told FHWA was baffled that IDOT wanted Illinois 1 on the NHS because 41/63 was so close.
Quote from: mobilene on October 20, 2009, 07:20:48 AM
As for the segment of SR 46 between US 40 and I-70 -- Rumor's been floating around for years that INDOT wants to route US 40 along what is now SR 46 to I-70, and then have 40 run concurrently with 70 all the way out to near the state line where there's an existing concurrency of the roads. If that rumor's true, it would keep that road under state control for all the reasons stated earlier in this thread.
This is indeed the case. I was there in November, and US-40 heads south along IN-46 to I-70, and then heads west to the IL line.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on February 20, 2012, 11:25:58 AM
Quote from: mobilene on October 20, 2009, 07:20:48 AM
As for the segment of SR 46 between US 40 and I-70 -- Rumor's been floating around for years that INDOT wants to route US 40 along what is now SR 46 to I-70, and then have 40 run concurrently with 70 all the way out to near the state line where there's an existing concurrency of the roads. If that rumor's true, it would keep that road under state control for all the reasons stated earlier in this thread.
This is indeed the case. I was there in November, and US-40 heads south along IN-46 to I-70, and then heads west to the IL line.
With this new trend of eliminating routes through cities, I wonder when US 41 will be routed along the I-164/69 corridor?
It's not a new trend, and US 41 is not much of a city street in Evansville, so I doubt it will happen.
Quote from: NE2 on February 20, 2012, 10:23:39 PM
It's not a new trend, and US 41 is not much of a city street in Evansville, so I doubt it will happen.
Furthermore, US-41 south of I-64 is not exactly what I would call urban....not like US-40 in Terre Haute is by any stretch. You still have a good ten miles or so before it enters Evansville if I remember right.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on February 21, 2012, 08:38:05 AM
Furthermore, US-41 south of I-64 is not exactly what I would call urban....not like US-40 in Terre Haute is by any stretch. You still have a good ten miles or so before it enters Evansville if I remember right.
There are a number of housing subdivisions starting south of Boonville-New Harmony Road, but you really start to see development south of the airport, specifically at the northern SR 66 junction at Diamond Avenue.
Quote from: The Great Whamini on February 20, 2012, 06:51:13 PM
With this new trend of eliminating routes through cities, I wonder when US 41 will be routed along the I-164/69 corridor?
If they wanted to reroute US 41 onto I-164, they could have done so already, there's nothing to stop them doing it now. That and I suspect that INDOT is alright with having two highways connect Evansville with Interstate 64. On a side note, I am getting ready to produce a guide for US 41 southbound across the state of Indiana which will include the Evansville area and with luck I may head north of US 41 to get pictures for a northbound set down the road.