These routes don't end at other routes, state lines, bodies of water, or other even quasi-logical points like stubby freeway/expressway ends. It's pretty random.
NJ: Not counting tiny state takeovers like 13 and 64, only substantive routes.
NJ 7 — Ignoring the fact that it has a discontinuity in the middle, the north end is at the Passaic County line so close to NJ 3. It even crosses the county line before that without a problem — and has county maintenance there!
NJ 10 — Even if state maintenance always ended at CR 577, the NJ 10 designation at least continued east past there historically. Why wasn't it truncated at I-280?
NJ 26 — North end at New Brunswick border. Why not continue it to 171 at Suydam? Even secretly (like 171)? 171 is municipal, so 26 could be as well.
NJ 44 — Heading north ,it passes the ramps for I-295 SB, then ends at CR 640, with the ramps for I-295 NB to the east. If 44 is going to end at 295, at least end it at one of these sets of ramps. Makes sense for it to be the NB ramps — the overpass is a state highway anyway.
NJ 63 — Branches off of JFK Blvd. at the county line. No, wait, a few hundred feet south of the line. JFK Blvd. had to be improved north of 88th Street, but that remains under county jurisdiction. 63 is a spur without a cause.
NJ 91 — North end not even at the New Brunswick border, but at Van Dyke Ave. There's nothing there. Just extend it to 27 on the county route. 27 is county, so 91 could be as well.
NJ 122 — West end at a random street while concurrent with a county route. State maintenance ended at CR 519. Either end 122 there as a short spur into Pohatcong, or extend it back into Phillipsburg (signed or unsigned).
NJ 124 — 24 once extended into Newark, but 124 ends at the Irvington border. According to the SLDs, the entire route through Maplewood is town-maintained, so why end the route where it becomes county-maintained (603)? It should at least end at the Parkway, or swap it with Vauxhall Road to end at 78.
NJ 143 — This was once a tiny state takeover, but then NJDOT took the rest of it south from US 30. Why this couldn't have remained county is anyone's guess; it's not like a state psychiatric facility is always on a state highway in NJ.
NJ 161 — It begins at what was planned to be a state highway (Allwood Road as S-3), and ends at the then-existing street grid. Now it has two random ends, although each end has a raison d'être. Should be extended west to at least the NJ 3 WB ramps.
NJ 168 — Ends at the Camden line. You know this once went farther into Camden. If it's going to be truncated, truncate it to US 130.
NJ 172 — Yes, the western end is where state maintenance ends. But that doesn't stop 171. 172 should continue west to meet 171 at Livingston St.
Not random: NJ 23 (Bloomfield Ave. was once NJ 9), NJ 27 (once ended at 21 before being cut off at Broad Street)
bonus: NY 9A — Could end at I-478, could end at FDR Drive, instead continues above tunnel and ends at Battery Place.
[size=0pt]Why did I see every line like this when you first posted it?[/size]
Most of the state routes in Utah that "end" at an interstate actually end at the first cross road beyond the exit.
I like the way US 319 ends midway on a causeway just east of Apalachicola. However, I heard that was because the original crossing was a ferry and the old terminal was at the location of the current end of US 319, and FDOT never asked AASHTO to extend US 319 so it at least goes into Apalachicola itself where it would not be so random.
I believe I talked about this for another thread with a similar topic not too long ago as I feel dejavu while writing this.
I never also understood why FL 438 in Orlando just ends at Rio Grande Avenue, an unnumbered route where US 441 is just one block away and it could easily end there.
Then there is the south end of FL 424 that ends someplace in the College Park section of Orlando not marked at all. I believe its where the state maintenance ends, somewhere around Par Street.
Also FL 436 ends not at FL 528, but just south of it across a bridge over a creek as Airport Maintenance begins at that crossing and not 528 proper as signs would tell you otherwise. On a similar note, FL 536 western terminus ends at the Disney property line, but is signed on the pull through sign W Bound at the I-4 West exit at least being somewhat right.
IL 155 and IL 156 just end in the middle of nowhere, deep in Southern Illinois. Both serve rural communities west of IL-3, although 156 is a bit longer. What is strange is that they literally just end, pavement continues as as unnumbered roads, neither of which I don't believe is controlled by the state, further still, if they were state maintained, IL-155 could easily be absorbed by a much longer 156.
IIRC, US-12 ends at Michigan Ave and Cass St in downtown Detroit. I'm not sure why it ends at Cass St, since Cass isn't a state route, and I don't think it ever has been. They would have been better off keeping that section to Campus Martius Park/Cadillac Sq, or even truncating it to I-94. For that matter, I'm surprised Michigan hasn't truncated it all the way to Ypsilanti.
FL 648 548's western terminus in Lakeland, FL where it ends at George Jenkins Blvd instead of US 92 about a mile later.
NJ 7's north end is at NJ 3 according to signage (?) and Passaic County records: http://www.passaiccountynj.org/DocumentCenter/View/111 (p. 67)
Quote from: Alps on October 21, 2015, 08:47:16 PM
NJ 44 — Heading north ,it passes the ramps for I-295 SB, then ends at CR 640, with the ramps for I-295 NB to the east. If 44 is going to end at 295, at least end it at one of these sets of ramps. Makes sense for it to be the NB ramps — the overpass is a state highway anyway.
Per the Straight Line Diagrams, it actually Begins/Ends at a small U-Turn area just South of CR 644, which is about a mile north of CR 640 (This also lines up with my jurisdiction with plowing/salting the roadway). And since that is part of the ramp system for 295 South, it does have a logical end to it. The road signage is incorrect as the signs show the route beginning/ending at 640...AND a quarter mile north, at Woodbury Rd (the SB side is oddly marked with a MILE END sign). But per the SLD, neither of these signed locations are the proper begin/end points of 44.
However, the southern end of Rt. 44 doesn't have a logical end. It ends at Barker Ave, which is a small residential side street between NJ 44 & Rt. 130. And that road we have been highly instructed NOT to plow! Apparently there's some guy on the street that doesn't want heavy trucks using the road, and had called the local police to enforce the 4 ton restriction on the road. So...since NJDOT plow trucks are over 4 tons, we don't plow the road, even though we had historically treated the road as a courtesy because of the Rt. 130 connection.
Quote
NJ 168 — Ends at the Camden line. You know this once went farther into Camden. If it's going to be truncated, truncate it to US 130.
If that's the case, then Camden doesn't have any state routes within its city's borders whatsoever. I thought I saw a small piece of Camden (literally, a block) jut out from an otherwise smooth border just north of the 130/168 intersection, which allows 168 to enter Camden for a few hundred feet.
Florida is loaded with these; many routes shift from secondary/county maintenance seemingly willy-nilly. In built-up suburbs, many SRs give no notification that they're no longer state-maintained. But at least they don't really stop unless they connect to another numbered route, with the exception of roads that end on islands or terminate at parks.
Alabama has a few of these.
AL 227 just stops at the Etowah county line, instead of continuing along Duck Springs Road.
AL 255 might as well be signed along a few miles of Bob Wade Road.
NY 101 - randomly turns into an unnumbered county road. Extend it north to the end of Sands Point, and make Lighthouse Road a reference route with TO SOUTH NY 101 shields on it.
NY 107 - ends at the former NY 27A. Keep it as is but resurrect NY 27A along Merrick Road.
NY 108 - ends at Woodbury Road (Nassau CR 12) and Pulaski Road (Suffolk CR 11). Not sure what to do with this one.
NY 112 - ends at the former NY 27A. Keep it as is but resurrect NY 27A along Montauk Highway
Eastern NY 24 - ends at the former NY 27A. Ditto.
NY 878 - floating segment. Designate Rockaway Boulevard in Queens and Rockaway Turnpike (Nassau CR 257) as NY 878 to connect the two segments. Even better, designate the remainder of Rockaway Turnpike, along with Meadow Lane and Rock Hall Road, as Business NY 878
NY 171 - floating segment. Northern terminus is at the former NY 5S. Extend it north a little to the current NY 5S. Not sure what to do with the southern terminus.
NY 840 - turns into Oneida CR 840 a little bit past the end of the expressway. Extend it along the entirety of CR 840.
It'd be faster to give you a list of state highways in Wyoming that don't meet that definition.
OH 134 runs north out of Wilmington, crosses I-71 without an interchange, then ends in the town of Port William. Continuing on the county road, it's a straight shot to Jamestown, where a connection with OH 72 and US 35 would be logical.
OH 16's west end in downtown Columbus, along an overlap with US 40 on Broad St, is at Marconi Blvd / Civic Center Blvd, on the east bank of the Scioto. I think, for some years in the middle 20th century, that crossroad was southeastbound US 33.
I'd wager that half of Louisiana's highways don't have a logical terminus.
Trying to avoid California examples that are entirely the result of route relinquishment or are unsigned...
Route 59 becomes county route J59 at a turnoff east of the town of Snelling:
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Snelling,+CA+95369/@37.5207483,-120.4399722,15.42z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x80913c0886c7365b:0x1fee26bc2442f8af
Although the legislative definition for Route 281 is longer, the actual existing portion of the route ends at a random intersection north of Clear Lake Riviera:
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Bayshore+Ln,+Kelseyville,+CA+95451/@38.9643339,-122.7390738,1672m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x8083f3431bfc2f49:0xdb255fca85371583
Route 213 in San Pedro (Los Angeles) ends at 25th Street.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Western+Ave+%26+W+25th+St,+San+Pedro,+CA+90732/@33.7229486,-118.31507,17z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m2!3m1!1s0x80dd49cd30a023f7:0xa1b38d9a11e6410b
While Route 261 in Irvine has a seemingly logical terminus (Interstate 5), a county-maintained freeway (Jamboree Road) continues on for a whole two miles to Barranca Parkway.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Jamboree+Rd,+Irvine,+CA/@33.7135988,-117.8151035,13.25z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x80dcdc1957216161:0x600682491a7b2768
The southern segment of Route 39 ends along a former portion of US 101 (later Route 72) at the intersection of Harbor Boulevard and Whittier Avenue in La Habra. (I'm still not sure if the gap between La Habra and Azusa was ever actually signed as 39)
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Harbor+Blvd+%26+E+Whittier+Blvd,+La+Habra,+CA+90631/@33.9391837,-117.935241,17z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m2!3m1!1s0x80dd2aacd1b7f68d:0x21f2d91aafd87cb9
This intersection appears to be the northern terminus of Route 191 in Paradise:
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Clark+Rd+%26+Pearson+Rd,+Paradise,+CA+95969/@39.7522633,-121.6097616,17z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m2!3m1!1s0x809cd35f9a263013:0x2dcf9d46c9c79823
Quote from: dgolub on October 22, 2015, 10:08:26 AM
NY 171 - floating segment. Northern terminus is at the former NY 5S. Extend it north a little to the current NY 5S. Not sure what to do with the southern terminus.
You mean NY 5? NY 171 actually crosses current NY 5S.
NY 331
NY 309
NY 418
NY 421
NY 85
Quote from: ajlynch91 on October 21, 2015, 11:28:46 PM
IL 155 and IL 156 just end in the middle of nowhere, deep in Southern Illinois. Both serve rural communities west of IL-3, although 156 is a bit longer. What is strange is that they literally just end, pavement continues as as unnumbered roads, neither of which I don't believe is controlled by the state, further still, if they were state maintained, IL-155 could easily be absorbed by a much longer 156.
There also these:
IL-142 ends in Equality, a short distance south of IL-13.
IL-178 ends in Lowell, and becomes a county route.
IL-70 ends in Durand, and also becomes a county route.
IL-135 ends just past Alexis, east of US-67.
PA 114 eastern terminus thanks to US 111's decommissioning.
Arkansas has quite a few state routes that end and become county roads. There's a section of AR 264 north of Springdale that dumps you in Beaver Lake.
AR 7 ends at a state park in Diamond City
Many of Kansas' state highways are like that.
K-247: 3rd St in Ellis just south of I-70
K-264: The entrance of Larned State Hospital
Former K-257: City limits of Gorham (western Kansas between Hays and Russell)
K-114: City limits of Ogden
K-4: Western terminus is in the middle of nowhere at US-83 just north of Scott City.
Just to name a few.
Quote from: US71 on October 22, 2015, 03:09:24 PM
Arkansas has quite a few state routes that end and become county roads. There's a section of AR 264 north of Springdale that dumps you in Beaver Lake.
AR 7 ends at a state park in Diamond City
I think AR-23 is like that north and south of Eureka Springs.
Quote from: Alps on October 21, 2015, 08:47:16 PM
Not random: NJ 23 (Bloomfield Ave. was once NJ 9), NJ 27 (once ended at 21 before being cut off at Broad Street)
NJ 27 still ends at NJ 21 at least according to http://www.state.nj.us/transportation/refdata/sldiag/00000027__-.pdf
Quote from: cappicard on October 22, 2015, 03:13:41 PM
Quote from: US71 on October 22, 2015, 03:09:24 PM
Arkansas has quite a few state routes that end and become county roads. There's a section of AR 264 north of Springdale that dumps you in Beaver Lake.
AR 7 ends at a state park in Diamond City
I think AR-23 is like that north and south of Eureka Springs.
23 north ends at the Missouri State Line (Route P)
23 south ends at US 71 near Elm Park
I-495 in NYC has a messy ending. At the Midtown Tunnel, signage stops, and you get nothing until you cross into New Jersey (yet another strange end) on NJ 495. The BGSes at the beginning of I-495 call the Queens-Midtown Tunnel a part of it too.
Another weird end is I-76 east, at the NJ side of the Walt Whitman Bridge. You're suddenly dumped off the Walt Whitman into Camden, then thrown with an unfair split (1 lane to I-295, the rest of the 4 lanes of the 5 lane freeway onto NJ 42).
The ACE has a strange end at BOTH ends. You seemingly just merge onto NJ 42, while at the east end, you're blocks from the Boardwalk. Just extend it another block, please?
PA 163 - I've mentioned it before - at the west end, you're a good 100 or so feet from the MD line onto a...2 lane road? It just went from 4 lane divided to 2? That's actually MD 63, Williamsport Pike, pretty much I-81's 2nd alt route to Hagerstown.
Many of Nebraska's spur routes, or at least the ones I've been on, end right at the edge of town, and often where there is no cross street present. I don't know if it's really random, but it sure feels like it driving it.
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 22, 2015, 08:30:23 PM
I-495 in NYC has a messy ending. At the Midtown Tunnel, signage stops, and you get nothing until you cross into New Jersey (yet another strange end) on NJ 495. The BGSes at the beginning of I-495 call the Queens-Midtown Tunnel a part of it too.
Another weird end is I-76 east, at the NJ side of the Walt Whitman Bridge. You're suddenly dumped off the Walt Whitman into Camden, then thrown with an unfair split (1 lane to I-295, the rest of the 4 lanes of the 5 lane freeway onto NJ 42).
The ACE has a strange end at BOTH ends. You seemingly just merge onto NJ 42, while at the east end, you're blocks from the Boardwalk. Just extend it another block, please?
PA 163 - I've mentioned it before - at the west end, you're a good 100 or so feet from the MD line onto a...2 lane road? It just went from 4 lane divided to 2? That's actually MD 63, Williamsport Pike, pretty much I-81's 2nd alt route to Hagerstown.
Why are these random ends? These are freeways! The ACE ends at another freeway, so what is random about that? Then if you had the ACE go any further you would be in the Atlantic Ocean so its got to end someplace like on city street.
Quote from: vdeane on October 22, 2015, 01:29:29 PM
Quote from: dgolub on October 22, 2015, 10:08:26 AM
NY 171 - floating segment. Northern terminus is at the former NY 5S. Extend it north a little to the current NY 5S. Not sure what to do with the southern terminus.
You mean NY 5? NY 171 actually crosses current NY 5S.
Yes, I meant to extend it to NY 5. Oops!
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 22, 2015, 08:30:23 PM
I-495 in NYC has a messy ending. At the Midtown Tunnel, signage stops, and you get nothing until you cross into New Jersey (yet another strange end) on NJ 495. The BGSes at the beginning of I-495 call the Queens-Midtown Tunnel a part of it too.
Actually, it depends on where in Manhattan you are. If you're on NY 9A, the signs there all refer to the Lincoln Tunnel as I-495. Most of the local streets don't show any route designation. To the best of my knowledge, there are no NY 495 shields anywhere, even though that's what it's officially designated.
CT 4: Just ends on Farmington Ave at the corner of Boulevard in West Hartford (to produce the only state highway "END" sign in CT)
CT 34: West end is often mismarked. Does it end at I-84? Does it turn onto Wasserman Way? Many think it continues to meet US 6 in Sandy Hook
CT 71A: Just ends at Buell St in New Britain
CT 176: hardly any signage north of CT 175. Just kind of dies. Officially ends at Hartford city line.
CT 349: there used to be an END sign, but that appears to be gone
PA 441's northern end is weird, just randomly ending at Paxton Street (former US 322, but hasn't been that for decades).
Quote from: roadman65 on October 23, 2015, 08:28:29 AM
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 22, 2015, 08:30:23 PM
I-495 in NYC has a messy ending. At the Midtown Tunnel, signage stops, and you get nothing until you cross into New Jersey (yet another strange end) on NJ 495. The BGSes at the beginning of I-495 call the Queens-Midtown Tunnel a part of it too.
Another weird end is I-76 east, at the NJ side of the Walt Whitman Bridge. You're suddenly dumped off the Walt Whitman into Camden, then thrown with an unfair split (1 lane to I-295, the rest of the 4 lanes of the 5 lane freeway onto NJ 42).
The ACE has a strange end at BOTH ends. You seemingly just merge onto NJ 42, while at the east end, you're blocks from the Boardwalk. Just extend it another block, please?
PA 163 - I've mentioned it before - at the west end, you're a good 100 or so feet from the MD line onto a...2 lane road? It just went from 4 lane divided to 2? That's actually MD 63, Williamsport Pike, pretty much I-81's 2nd alt route to Hagerstown.
Why are these random ends? These are freeways! The ACE ends at another freeway, so what is random about that? Then if you had the ACE go any further you would be in the Atlantic Ocean so its got to end someplace like on city street.
The ACE peters out at Fairmount Street, suddenly turning into Missouri Avenue (Christopher Columbus Boulevard) and Arkansas Avenue. There's evidence it would've ended at Atlantic Avenue, as those streets are four lane (two lanes each way) and divided. Also one way too, running like the ACE.
Indiana has lots of highways with random ends because of INDOT's passion for unloading responsibility for maintenance to localities. State highways often end at a county line or city limit. There are so many that I won't attempt a list.
There is one that might seem on the surface to end randomly for that reason, but the reasoning is more involved. SR-332 extends east from I-69 to Muncie, ending at the intersection of Tillotson Avenue and McGalliard Road. The road began as a two-lane extension of McGalliard Road, built by Delaware County. The county built the road from Tillotson as far west as CR 600 W (Yorktown-Gaston Pike). A dispute in the County Council over funding prevented completion of the road to I-69, and that appeared to doom the project. INDOT eventually came to the rescue, taking over the extension and finishing it first as a two-lane road. It was widened to four lanes over time.
It would have been logical to extend 332 to the east along McGalliard, perhaps as far as the US 35-SR 3-SR 67 bypass, but that's not INDOT's M.O. The highway just becomes a city street at Tillotson.
Quote from: theline on October 23, 2015, 03:45:19 PM
Indiana has lots of highways with random ends because of INDOT's passion for unloading responsibility for maintenance to localities. State highways often end at a county line or city limit. There are so many that I won't attempt a list.
There is one that might seem on the surface to end randomly for that reason, but the reasoning is more involved. SR-332 extends east from I-69 to Muncie, ending at the intersection of Tillotson Avenue and McGalliard Road. The road began as a two-lane extension of McGalliard Road, built by Delaware County. The county built the road from Tillotson as far west as CR 600 W (Yorktown-Gaston Pike). A dispute in the County Council over funding prevented completion of the road to I-69, and that appeared to doom the project. INDOT eventually came to the rescue, taking over the extension and finishing it first as a two-lane road. It was widened to four lanes over time.
It would have been logical to extend 332 to the east along McGalliard, perhaps as far as the US 35-SR 3-SR 67 bypass, but that's not INDOT's M.O. The highway just becomes a city street at Tillotson.
INDOT's idiocy in this regard makes Indiana one of the most difficult states to navigate if you aren't native. The couple of split routes don't help either.
Quote from: jp the roadgeek on October 23, 2015, 10:18:10 AM
CT 4: (to produce the only state highway "END" sign in CT)
Not anymore (http://i.imgur.com/kwOdJbu.jpg)
QuoteCT 34: West end is often mismarked. Does it end at I-84? Does it turn onto Wasserman Way? Many think it continues to meet US 6 in Sandy Hook
Officially it ends at Pearl St, the first intersection north of I-84. This is simply where state maintenance ends, and is likely a product of Connecticut being highly allergic to designating state highways along road segments the state does not maintain. It did, however, at one point in time extend to Riverside Road, which is the old (then-current) alignment of US 6.
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 23, 2015, 03:41:12 PM
The ACE peters out at Fairmount Street, suddenly turning into Missouri Avenue (Christopher Columbus Boulevard) and Arkansas Avenue. There's evidence it would've ended at Atlantic Avenue, as those streets are four lane (two lanes each way) and divided. Also one way too, running like the ACE.
Just because a pair of one way streets leads into a freeway does not mean there were ever plans to extend the freeway. What practical reason would there have been to have the ACE extend to Atlantic Ave? Remember, the purpose was to get traffic to Atlantic City. At Fairmount Ave the road has served that purpose already, and it's quite a logical end.
The one way pair after that allows cars to turn onto/off of Fairmount and Arctic Aves directly which a freeway would not, unless you added a new pair of ramps to Fairmount and built frontage roads for the last couple blocks. There is not and never would have been any reason to have extended the Expressway further.
Bear in mind as well that just because something looks cool or tempting on a map does not mean it makes sense on the ground. This is a trap roadgeeks often fall into, looking at the road from the perspective of it being a hobby subject rather than from the perspective of it being useful to drivers. The latter, not the former, is what motivates roads to be built.
Quote from: corco on October 22, 2015, 11:23:05 AM
It'd be faster to give you a list of state highways in Wyoming that don't meet that definition.
No kidding. On the other hand, Wyo 253 (Hat 6 Road) does end at a perfectly logical place. The end of the pavement where there's an open range sign. If I ever get out that way again (no reason I couldn't), I should take a picture.
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 23, 2015, 03:41:12 PM
Quote from: roadman65 on October 23, 2015, 08:28:29 AM
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 22, 2015, 08:30:23 PM
I-495 in NYC has a messy ending. At the Midtown Tunnel, signage stops, and you get nothing until you cross into New Jersey (yet another strange end) on NJ 495. The BGSes at the beginning of I-495 call the Queens-Midtown Tunnel a part of it too.
Another weird end is I-76 east, at the NJ side of the Walt Whitman Bridge. You're suddenly dumped off the Walt Whitman into Camden, then thrown with an unfair split (1 lane to I-295, the rest of the 4 lanes of the 5 lane freeway onto NJ 42).
The ACE has a strange end at BOTH ends. You seemingly just merge onto NJ 42, while at the east end, you're blocks from the Boardwalk. Just extend it another block, please?
PA 163 - I've mentioned it before - at the west end, you're a good 100 or so feet from the MD line onto a...2 lane road? It just went from 4 lane divided to 2? That's actually MD 63, Williamsport Pike, pretty much I-81's 2nd alt route to Hagerstown.
Why are these random ends? These are freeways! The ACE ends at another freeway, so what is random about that? Then if you had the ACE go any further you would be in the Atlantic Ocean so its got to end someplace like on city street.
The ACE peters out at Fairmount Street, suddenly turning into Missouri Avenue (Christopher Columbus Boulevard) and Arkansas Avenue. There's evidence it would've ended at Atlantic Avenue, as those streets are four lane (two lanes each way) and divided. Also one way too, running like the ACE.
Last time I was there both Missouri and Arkansas was both a one way pair. They are not four lanes each with two lanes each way unless they changed it since I was there last.
I always remembered the ACE splitting into the two one way pairs equally and both Avenues were four lane each up until Atlantic Avenue where they both were much narrower after that. Atlantic Avenue is the main N-S thoroughfare in AC so the traffic from the toll road mostly distributes at that intersection to go north and south (technically NE or SW as Atlantic Avenue does not run true N-S).
Quote from: dgolub on October 22, 2015, 10:08:26 AM
NY 840 - turns into Oneida CR 840 a little bit past the end of the expressway. Extend it along the entirety of CR 840.
I believe a proposal has been floated around to extend it to Rome.
And, here it is:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2Fq4Xy0Fo.png&hash=a4bb635079aacbeff2aceaa5828893bde75e5895)
http://www.ocgov.net/oneida/sites/default/files/hoctsmpo/lrtp/LRTP2035May15/Appendix%20A%20-%20Potential%20Transporation%20Needs%20F.pdf
The north end of US 41 is at the entrance of Fort Wilkins State Park near Copper Harbor, MI. Similarly, US 385's south end is at the entrance of Big Bend National Park, in Texas.
Quote from: Buffaboy on October 23, 2015, 10:44:30 PM
Quote from: dgolub on October 22, 2015, 10:08:26 AM
NY 840 - turns into Oneida CR 840 a little bit past the end of the expressway. Extend it along the entirety of CR 840.
I believe a proposal has been floated around to extend it to Rome.
And, here it is:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2Fq4Xy0Fo.png&hash=a4bb635079aacbeff2aceaa5828893bde75e5895)
http://www.ocgov.net/oneida/sites/default/files/hoctsmpo/lrtp/LRTP2035May15/Appendix%20A%20-%20Potential%20Transporation%20Needs%20F.pdf
That would be cool if it got built. In case there aren't already enough routes converging on that interchange in Rome.
Quote from: national highway 1 on October 24, 2015, 04:25:20 AM
Similarly, US 385's south end is at the entrance of Big Bend National Park, in Texas.
Pretty much the opposite of random.
Quote from: Buffaboy on October 23, 2015, 10:44:30 PM
Quote from: dgolub on October 22, 2015, 10:08:26 AM
NY 840 - turns into Oneida CR 840 a little bit past the end of the expressway. Extend it along the entirety of CR 840.
I believe a proposal has been floated around to extend it to Rome.
And, here it is:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2Fq4Xy0Fo.png&hash=a4bb635079aacbeff2aceaa5828893bde75e5895)
http://www.ocgov.net/oneida/sites/default/files/hoctsmpo/lrtp/LRTP2035May15/Appendix%20A%20-%20Potential%20Transporation%20Needs%20F.pdf
What would that look like? Consolidation of driveways/at-grades with a new road built to the interchange? Or a full freeway? And if the latter, what would be done with the existing at-grades on NY 840?
Of course, the time to modify the interchange would have been BEFORE the bridges were rebuilt...
Quote from: national highway 1 on October 24, 2015, 04:25:20 AM
The north end of US 41 is at the entrance of Fort Wilkins State Park near Copper Harbor, MI.
Actually the north end is about 1/2 mile east of the park entrance, making it even more random.
Another one is the north end of M-93 outside Grayling. It runs northwest from I-75 to Hartwick Pines State Park. Several years ago the reconfigured roadways inside the park, and moved the park entrance closer to I-75. But the highway still extends to where the previous entrance was.
Is it true that the END US 41 is taken out when it snows in Calumet? I heard that somewhere, maybe on here.
I still can't believe it's a third of the distance from Calumet to Detroit Airport as it is for the entire length of US 41 (Copper Harbor is 603 miles from Detroit...Miami, FL, 1990 miles from Copper Harbor)
Quote from: national highway 1 on October 24, 2015, 04:25:20 AM
The north end of US 41 is at the entrance of Fort Wilkins State Park near Copper Harbor, MI. Similarly, US 385's south end is at the entrance of Big Bend National Park, in Texas.
Actually, it's just east of the entrance, ending in a circle just before a dirt road.
Quote from: OracleUsr on October 25, 2015, 03:39:18 PM
Is it true that the END US 41 is taken out when it snows in Calumet? I heard that somewhere, maybe on here.
I still can't believe it's a third of the distance from Calumet to Detroit Airport as it is for the entire length of US 41 (Copper Harbor is 603 miles from Detroit...Miami, FL, 1990 miles from Copper Harbor)
No, there is no end sign in Calumet for US-41. The end is 45 miles up the peninsula in the unincorporated community of Copper Harbor. The end sign in the circle is there, even in the snow.
Michigan is the biggest state east of the Mississippi River, and the Mackinac Bridge is only about halfway between Copper Harbor and Monroe.
QuoteNo, there is no end sign in Calumet for US-41. The end is 45 miles up the peninsula in the unincorporated community of Copper Harbor. The end sign in the circle is there, even in the snow.
I may have said it wasn't - it wasn't there when I drove through there in March 2014 en route to the St Louis meet, and the center circle appeared to be used as snow storage, but maybe that's not representative of normalcy.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.corcohighways.org%2Fendus41.jpg&hash=a0000baf19f646bb98f7e747baea2a99a5e2b5b6)
Quote from: NE2 on October 24, 2015, 12:03:41 PM
Quote from: national highway 1 on October 24, 2015, 04:25:20 AM
Similarly, US 385's south end is at the entrance of Big Bend National Park, in Texas.
Pretty much the opposite of random.
US 20 ends at Yellowstone National Park's west entrance, then resumes at the east entrance. US 287 is like that too.
iPad
Quote from: OracleUsr on October 25, 2015, 03:39:18 PM
Is it true that the END US 41 is taken out when it snows in Calumet? I heard that somewhere, maybe on here.
I still can't believe it's a third of the distance from Calumet to Detroit Airport as it is for the entire length of US 41 (Copper Harbor is 603 miles from Detroit...Miami, FL, 1990 miles from Copper Harbor)
479 miles in Florida too
Quote from: Brandon on October 25, 2015, 04:24:37 PM
Quote from: OracleUsr on October 25, 2015, 03:39:18 PM
Is it true that the END US 41 is taken out when it snows in Calumet? I heard that somewhere, maybe on here.
I still can't believe it's a third of the distance from Calumet to Detroit Airport as it is for the entire length of US 41 (Copper Harbor is 603 miles from Detroit...Miami, FL, 1990 miles from Copper Harbor)
No, there is no end sign in Calumet for US-41. The end is 45 miles up the peninsula in the unincorporated community of Copper Harbor. The end sign in the circle is there, even in the snow.
Michigan is the biggest state east of the Mississippi River, and the Mackinac Bridge is only about halfway between Copper Harbor and Monroe.
I think Georgia is bigger. Michigan, Florida and Maine seen to be much underestimated in their size by most people.
People think they can stay in Miami and pop up to Disney for a day trip
Yes, if you watch sitcoms that take place in Miami, many show writers even get that misconception. They think Disney is within a day's drive ( which it is, but over 3 hours each way)and make it out like its in the area.
NM 9's east end is at the Doña Ana County line. Not that random, though, even though it might look that way -- maybe NMDOT tried to fob off onto the counties all of NM 9 east of NM 11, but only Doña Ana County agreed. Other NM state routes also end at county lines.
AK 10 (Copper River Highway segment out of Cordova) peters out 0.538 mile past the Million Dollar Bridge over the Copper River, apparently at the point where the Bureau of Land Management takes over what passes for "maintenance" of that unpaved road. No signage indicates the route end -- Alaska seems to follow the apparent Arctic custom of using "end" signs only where they are totally pointless -- or change of maintenance.
Quote from: roadman65 on October 25, 2015, 11:25:39 PM
Yes, if you watch sitcoms that take place in Miami, many show writers even get that misconception. They think Disney is within a day's drive ( which it is, but over 3 hours each way)and make it out like its in the area.
Reminds me of Beverly Hills, 90210, when they all went to college at Cal...and commuted from home. A distance of roughly 400-500 miles one way, IIRC.
As for Calumet, I thought I had remembered the GPS on my phone saying the Copper Harbor Lighthouse could be viewed from Calumet, but nonetheless it was quite unsettling to know I had to drive 603 miles to Wayne Airport for a flight leaving the next day...at 4pm. Thankfully the flight was an evening flight, and I actually returned with enough time to go to Ann Arbor and Toledo before returning my rental car. Fun trip, admittedly.
Question for those who might know...is the Copper Harbor Lighthouse the northernmost one in the lower 48?
Quote from: OracleUsr on October 26, 2015, 12:28:36 AM
As for Calumet, I thought I had remembered the GPS on my phone saying the Copper Harbor Lighthouse could be viewed from Calumet, but nonetheless it was quite unsettling to know I had to drive 603 miles to Wayne Airport for a flight leaving the next day...at 4pm. Thankfully the flight was an evening flight, and I actually returned with enough time to go to Ann Arbor and Toledo before returning my rental car. Fun trip, admittedly.
Question for those who might know...is the Copper Harbor Lighthouse the northernmost one in the lower 48?
No, there are several in Washington that are farther north. Copper Harbor Lighthouse, according to Wikipedia, is at 47 degrees 28 minutes 28.1 seconds north. Patos Island Light is at 48.789 degrees north. There are others too, listed at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_lighthouses_in_Washington_(state)
Quote from: roadman65 on October 25, 2015, 11:25:39 PM
Yes, if you watch sitcoms that take place in Miami, many show writers even get that misconception. They think Disney is within a day's drive ( which it is, but over 3 hours each way)and make it out like its in the area.
My wife and I did that once...courtesy of energy drinks.
Quote from: jwolfer on October 25, 2015, 10:54:30 PM
Quote from: Brandon on October 25, 2015, 04:24:37 PM
Michigan is the biggest state east of the Mississippi River, and the Mackinac Bridge is only about halfway between Copper Harbor and Monroe.
I think Georgia is bigger. Michigan, Florida and Maine seen to be much underestimated in their size by most people.
GA is bigger than MI by land area, about 1000 sq miles. But if you add in the water, MI is almost as big as WY, larger than Utah.
Quote from: GaryV on October 26, 2015, 07:24:50 PM
Quote from: jwolfer on October 25, 2015, 10:54:30 PM
Quote from: Brandon on October 25, 2015, 04:24:37 PM
Michigan is the biggest state east of the Mississippi River, and the Mackinac Bridge is only about halfway between Copper Harbor and Monroe.
I think Georgia is bigger. Michigan, Florida and Maine seen to be much underestimated in their size by most people.
GA is bigger than MI by land area, about 1000 sq miles. But if you add in the water, MI is almost as big as WY, larger than Utah.
That makes sense
Quote from: jwolfer on October 25, 2015, 10:54:30 PM
Quote from: Brandon on October 25, 2015, 04:24:37 PM
Michigan is the biggest state east of the Mississippi River, and the Mackinac Bridge is only about halfway between Copper Harbor and Monroe.
I think Georgia is bigger.
Depends on if you include water. By strictly land area Georgia is ranked 21st (largest east of the Mississippi) and Michigan is ranked 22nd. By total area Georgia drops to 24th and Michigan rises all the way to 11th. Naturally, due to being surrounded by Great Lakes, Michigan claims a lot of water in its total area. (linky) (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_area)
I prefer going by land area since people don't live in open water and you can't drive around in open water (bridges, tunnels, and ferries notwithstanding). But, the reason US 41 spends so many miles in Michigan is not because of the state's area, it's because of the state being one of the least geographically compact in the country.
BL I-75 in Saulte Ste. Marie has sort of a random end. Instead of ending within the Downtown Area it goes along the St. Mary's River for a spell up until a random point along the road and then terminates. No intersections, no route junction, just a place along the road. Even if its the city limit of Saulte Ste. Marie, it still does not make sense unless Michigan is looking to burn state highway mileage or something.
A few come to mind.
WA 501 - Just ends abruptly
HI 270 (Big Island) ends at a parking lot just before the Waipo Valley (makes sense given the terrain ahead, still just stops there)
HI 560 (Kauai) ends at a parking lot
I understand that with Hawaii, the terrain doesn't really allow building beyond, but it's not often we see a state highway terminate in a parking lot.
US 40 and US 322 - eastern end. They both have a useless multiplex into Atlantic City instead of ending at US 9. Once you hit Atlantic Avenue, boom, US 40/322 end.
Belt Parkway in Brooklyn uselessly continues at the 2nd time it intersects I-278. Not sure why it did that.
I-78 at the Jersey City area. It's iffy because of information overload. Does it start in New York City? Does it end in Jersey City? It's unknown.
I-678 near the Bruckner Interchange. Once you cross the Whitestone Bridge, the road is suddenly the Hutchinson River Parkway.
Quote from: roadman65 on October 26, 2015, 09:37:00 PM
BL I-75 in Saulte Ste. Marie has sort of a random end. Instead of ending within the Downtown Area it goes along the St. Mary's River for a spell up until a random point along the road and then terminates. No intersections, no route junction, just a place along the road. Even if its the city limit of Saulte Ste. Marie, it still does not make sense unless Michigan is looking to burn state highway mileage or something.
It's the entrance to the Sugar Island Ferry dock. Which is part of the EUPTA, a govt transportation authority (they also have buses), so it makes some sense.
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 27, 2015, 04:32:03 PM
US 40 and US 322 - eastern end. They both have a useless multiplex into Atlantic City instead of ending at US 9. Once you hit Atlantic Avenue, boom, US 40/322 end.
they directly serve Atlantic City - why have them stop outside?
Quote from: noelboteveraBelt Parkway in Brooklyn uselessly continues at the 2nd time it intersects I-278. Not sure why it did that.
besides exit 1, it serves traffic heading to/from the Gowanus (the first interchange only serves traffic heading to/from the Verrazano).
Quote from: noelboteveraI-78 at the Jersey City area. It's iffy because of information overload. Does it start in New York City? Does it end in Jersey City? It's unknown.
I-78 ends in NYC; there are 5 numbered exits in SoHo beyond the tunnel. its endpoint location is due to the cancellation of the Lower Manhattan Expressway, which would have carried it across to the Williamsburg Bridge.
Quote from: noelboteveraI-678 near the Bruckner Interchange. Once you cross the Whitestone Bridge, the road is suddenly the Hutchinson River Parkway.
I-678 ends at I-95; hardly random.
Quote from: OCGuy81 on October 27, 2015, 03:57:57 PM
HI 270 (Big Island) ends at a parking lot just before the Waipo Valley (makes sense given the terrain ahead, still just stops there)
HI 560 (Kauai) ends at a parking lot
I understand that with Hawaii, the terrain doesn't really allow building beyond, but it's not often we see a state highway terminate in a parking lot.
More a matter of placing a parking lot (for HI 560, serving popular Ke'e Beach) where the road would otherwise end. Those roads go about as far as the terrain allows.
HI 583 also ends at a parking lot, for a Wailua River overlook.
On Maui, HI 37 turns into CR 31 for no obvious reason in the Ulupalakua area. But that's where a now-closed private road long ago took CR 31 travelers down to the coast, and also where HI 31 may theoretically someday climb the hill to connect to HI 37. Other transitions from state to county (like HI 340 -> CR 340 -> HI 30, or HI 160 -> CR 160) were placed where the pavement once ran out, with the state keeping the segments that were or would soon be paved, fobbing off on the counties the segments the state didn't want to keep for itself.
Quote from: jwolfer on October 25, 2015, 10:54:30 PM
Quote from: Brandon on October 25, 2015, 04:24:37 PM
Quote from: OracleUsr on October 25, 2015, 03:39:18 PM
Is it true that the END US 41 is taken out when it snows in Calumet? I heard that somewhere, maybe on here.
I still can't believe it's a third of the distance from Calumet to Detroit Airport as it is for the entire length of US 41 (Copper Harbor is 603 miles from Detroit...Miami, FL, 1990 miles from Copper Harbor)
No, there is no end sign in Calumet for US-41. The end is 45 miles up the peninsula in the unincorporated community of Copper Harbor. The end sign in the circle is there, even in the snow.
Michigan is the biggest state east of the Mississippi River, and the Mackinac Bridge is only about halfway between Copper Harbor and Monroe.
I think Georgia is bigger. Michigan, Florida and Maine seen to be much underestimated in their size by most people.
Florida is 2/3 the size of Michigan at 67,758 mi^2, with Georgia being 8K smaller. The next 2 largest states east of the Mississippi are Illinois and New York. Maine might be slightly smaller than the rest of New England combined, but it's only 35K mi^2, making it the 12th-smallest state and about the same size as Indiana and South Carolina.
Quote from: cl94 on October 27, 2015, 10:45:31 PM
Quote from: jwolfer on October 25, 2015, 10:54:30 PM
Quote from: Brandon on October 25, 2015, 04:24:37 PM
Quote from: OracleUsr on October 25, 2015, 03:39:18 PM
Is it true that the END US 41 is taken out when it snows in Calumet? I heard that somewhere, maybe on here.
I still can't believe it's a third of the distance from Calumet to Detroit Airport as it is for the entire length of US 41 (Copper Harbor is 603 miles from Detroit...Miami, FL, 1990 miles from Copper Harbor)
No, there is no end sign in Calumet for US-41. The end is 45 miles up the peninsula in the unincorporated community of Copper Harbor. The end sign in the circle is there, even in the snow.
Michigan is the biggest state east of the Mississippi River, and the Mackinac Bridge is only about halfway between Copper Harbor and Monroe.
I think Georgia is bigger. Michigan, Florida and Maine seen to be much underestimated in their size by most people.
Florida is 2/3 the size of Michigan at 67,758 mi^2, with Georgia being 8K smaller. The next 2 largest states east of the Mississippi are Illinois and New York. Maine might be slightly smaller than the rest of New England combined, but it's only 35K mi^2, making it the 12th-smallest state and about the same size as Indiana and South Carolina.
I am not saying anything about the actual size of the states in relation to each other or compared to Michigan.. People have an idea that Michigan doesn't even have the UP.. They think Miami is an hour drive from Orlando and Maine is small like all the other New England states.
VA-173 peters out into neighborhoods at both ends.
VA-172's northern end in Poquoson also seems pretty random. It doesn't end at the major intersection (VA-171), or at the end of the road (like VA-171 does), but at a fairly unimportant neighborhood road. The fact that Poquoson doesn't sign any of their routes died help either.
Nexus 6
ON 811 ends at a dying bridge of the Weaver River. There is poor END signage (an old 800 shield repainted with 811).
ON 802 ends at the fence that once was the entrance to Burchell Lake, ON.
VA 32 should probably end at US 258 near Smithfield. Instead it embarks upon a useless concurrency with it; US 17 joins this concurrency and crosses the James River into Newport News, where VA 32 disappears at US 60 (from which it isn't signed).
VA 35 doesn't end at US 301, or even at I-95; it continues for a short distance and ends at a weird intersection with some country roads.
VA 36 randomly changes into SR 602 at the intersection with SR 669 a few miles west of Petersburg.
VA 76 doesn't end at VA 288 even though it stops being a freeway. It also doesn't end at SR 950 Charter Colony Parkway (a signalized intersection just past the VA 288 interchange). Instead, it becomes SR 652 at an arbitrary point west of this intersection (Brandermill Parkway, the main entrance into a major community that's blocking VA 76's extension). Until recently this part of VA 76 was a 2-lane road; it's now 4 lanes divided and the intersection with Brandermill Pkwy is now signalized.
Quote from: WillWeaverRVA on October 28, 2015, 02:05:19 PM
VA 32 should probably end at US 258 near Smithfield. Instead it embarks upon a useless concurrency with it; US 17 joins this concurrency and crosses the James River into Newport News, where VA 32 disappears at US 60 (from which it isn't signed).
VA 35 doesn't end at US 301, or even at I-95; it continues for a short distance and ends at a weird intersection with some country roads.
VA 36 randomly changes into SR 602 at the intersection with SR 669 a few miles west of Petersburg.
VA 76 doesn't end at VA 288 even though it stops being a freeway. It also doesn't end at SR 950 Charter Colony Parkway (a signalized intersection just past the VA 288 interchange). Instead, it becomes SR 652 at an arbitrary point west of this intersection (Brandermill Parkway, the main entrance into a major community that's blocking VA 76's extension). Until recently this part of VA 76 was a 2-lane road; it's now 4 lanes divided and the intersection with Brandermill Pkwy is now signalized.
Talk about random for VA-35!
https://goo.gl/maps/o92YLGBdKht
Similarly for Virginia, VA 75 doesn't end at I-81, where it's joined by Alt. US 58. And it doesn't end at US 11, where it runs with Alt. 58 in a concurrency. It continues a block beyond US 11.
Virginia has a bunch of routes that end in odd locations.
Quote from: roadman65 on October 25, 2015, 11:25:39 PM
Yes, if you watch sitcoms that take place in Miami, many show writers even get that misconception. They think Disney is within a day's drive ( which it is, but over 3 hours each way)and make it out like its in the area.
Well, 3 hours each way is a day trip in some parts of the country. Such as west of the Mississippi, and especially between the Sierra Nevada and the Front Range.
Quote from: Brandon on October 28, 2015, 04:22:47 PM
Quote from: roadman65 on October 25, 2015, 11:25:39 PM
Yes, if you watch sitcoms that take place in Miami, many show writers even get that misconception. They think Disney is within a day's drive ( which it is, but over 3 hours each way)and make it out like its in the area.
Well, 3 hours each way is a day trip in some parts of the country. Such as west of the Mississippi, and especially between the Sierra Nevada and the Front Range.
3 hours is suitable for a day trip. Pittsburgh and Cleveland aren't hard to do as day trips from here and they're over 3 hours away.
Quote from: WillWeaverRVA on October 28, 2015, 02:05:19 PM
VA 32 should probably end at US 258 near Smithfield. Instead it embarks upon a useless concurrency with it; US 17 joins this concurrency and crosses the James River into Newport News, where VA 32 disappears at US 60 (from which it isn't signed).
IMO, VA-32 should end at US-13 south of Suffolk and exist solely as a VA extension of NC 32. That's the only part of the road that isn't concurrent with something else.
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 27, 2015, 04:32:03 PM
US 40 and US 322 - eastern end. They both have a useless multiplex into Atlantic City instead of ending at US 9. Once you hit Atlantic Avenue, boom, US 40/322 end.
While I'm normally not a fan of dead end routes, in this case it serves a city so it makes sense. Though I will give you that the multiplex is kinda unnecessary. If I were numbering things I'd have had 322 end at 40.
QuoteBelt Parkway in Brooklyn uselessly continues at the 2nd time it intersects I-278. Not sure why it did that.
History. What's now I-278 along 3rd Ave was originally built as the Gowanus Parkway, and tied directly into what is now the Belt Parkway (then known as Shore Parkway) without another highway splitting off. When the Verrazano Bridge was built, the section of I-278 around Bay Ridge was built to tie directly into it, and the Gowanus Parkway was upgraded to allow trucks to use it so it could serve the truck traffic coming off the new bridge. The route around Bay Ridge was built rather than simply upgrading the Belt Parkway in order to allow a smoother tie into the bridge. Meanwhile the segment of the Belt west of exit 3 remains because it's necessary to allow movements to/from downtown Brooklyn, which cannot be made at exit 3.
QuoteI-78 at the Jersey City area. It's iffy because of information overload. Does it start in New York City? Does it end in Jersey City? It's unknown.
Despite requiring passing through a few traffic signals and spottage being slightly spotty, I-78 does officially continue through the Holland Tunnel and ends where you get dumped out onto city streets in Manhattan. Would have extended deeper into New York City if not for the cancellation of several expressways and yes, there were plans to eliminate the intersections in Jersey City that have never come to fruition because as things stand there wouldn't be much benefit. The tunnel itself is much more of a bottleneck than Jersey City is since the lights are well timed and the one way pair of streets has lots o lanes.
QuoteI-678 near the Bruckner Interchange. Once you cross the Whitestone Bridge, the road is suddenly the Hutchinson River Parkway.
I-678 ends AT the Bruckner Interchange, not suddenly after the Whitestone Bridge. And yes, it continues as the Hutch, because again, history. The Hutch did originally continue as a parkway to the Whitestone Bridge, and the segment of what's now I-678 from the Bridge down to exit 13 was originally built as the Whitestone Parkway. Like with I-278, these roads were later upgraded to allow trucks so they had a direct means of getting from The Bronx to Queens. The Hutch north of the Bruckner Interchange never received any similar upgrade because with I-95 as a parallel route trucks can use, it wasn't necessary.
M-185 completely circles Mackinac Island, so it really has no end. They arbitrarily picked its "end" (both of them?) to be at the State Park Commission building.
Quote from: GaryV on October 30, 2015, 06:21:07 AM
M-185 completely circles Mackinac Island, so it really has no end. They arbitrarily picked its "end" (both of them?) to be at the State Park Commission building.
Given that Mackinac Island is a state park, having the zero milepost for M-185 be there makes sense.
Quote from: oscar on October 25, 2015, 11:44:58 PM
NM 9's east end is at the Doña Ana County line. Not that random, though, even though it might look that way -- maybe NMDOT tried to fob off onto the counties all of NM 9 east of NM 11, but only Doña Ana County agreed. Other NM state routes also end at county lines.
NM-9 used to end at NM-11 in Columbus. The road was improved east to the highway to the (then) new Santa Teresa border crossing west of El Paso. So, I'm assuming the state bore most of the cost of the project, but I'm at a loss as to why Doña Ana County's portion stayed a county road, while Luna County got the state highway.
As far as New Mexico routes that end strangely, a good example is NM-29. It begins on the east side of Chama, and goes for only about two miles to what the state describes only as "end of route". The road itself used to be a connector to roads into Colorado.
Some more:
US 29 near I-70 in Elicott City, Maryland. It just continues uselessly to MD 99 rather than ending at I-70.
MD 144 just begins in piecemeal segments all over the place.
MD 26 ends about a good ten or so blocks from US 1. It ends at Reisterstown Road in the Baltimore city limits. MD 140 instead continues to US 1.
MD 396, MD 500, MD 191, MD 190, etc. all end at the D.C. city limits.
VA 267 uselessly continues to I-66. Really, you can just exit onto I-495 and exit at I-66 there.
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 31, 2015, 10:19:16 AM
Some more:
US 29 near I-70 in Elicott City, Maryland. It just continues uselessly to MD 99 rather than ending at I-70.
MD 144 just begins in piecemeal segments all over the place.
MD 26 ends about a good ten or so blocks from US 1. It ends at Reisterstown Road in the Baltimore city limits. MD 140 instead continues to US 1.
MD 396, MD 500, MD 191, MD 190, etc. all end at the D.C. city limits.
VA 267 uselessly continues to I-66. Really, you can just exit onto I-495 and exit at I-66 there.
This is good stuff. Really, really good stuff.
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 31, 2015, 10:19:16 AM
US 29 near I-70 in Elicott City, Maryland. It just continues uselessly to MD 99 rather than ending at I-70.
ends at a state highway. also, the interchange with I-70 was built later.
Quote from: noelboteveraMD 144 just begins in piecemeal segments all over the place.
MD 144 consists of the former alignment of US 40, and all local termini are on a state or US highway.
Quote from: noelboteveraMD 26 ends about a good ten or so blocks from US 1. It ends at Reisterstown Road in the Baltimore city limits. MD 140 instead continues to US 1.
ends at a state highway.
Quote from: noelboteveraMD 396, MD 500, MD 191, MD 190, etc. all end at the D.C. city limits.
all end at the state line and continue on as a major thoroughfare on the other side.
Quote from: noelboteveraVA 267 uselessly continues to I-66. Really, you can just exit onto I-495 and exit at I-66 there.
er, what exactly is useless about this? the last thing any commuter wants to do is spend more time on I-495 or I-66. this is similar to saying I-283 shouldn't exist, since I-83 crosses the PA Turnpike anyway.
i'm not trying to pick on you, but you seem to be completely missing the point of this thread:
Quote from: Alps on October 21, 2015, 08:47:16 PM
These routes don't end at other routes, state lines, bodies of water, or other even quasi-logical points like stubby freeway/expressway ends. It's pretty random.
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 31, 2015, 10:19:16 AM
Some more:
US 29 near I-70 in Elicott City, Maryland. It just continues uselessly to MD 99 rather than ending at I-70.
MD 144 just begins in piecemeal segments all over the place.
MD 26 ends about a good ten or so blocks from US 1. It ends at Reisterstown Road in the Baltimore city limits. MD 140 instead continues to US 1.
MD 396, MD 500, MD 191, MD 190, etc. all end at the D.C. city limits.
VA 267 uselessly continues to I-66. Really, you can just exit onto I-495 and exit at I-66 there.
Err, what's wrong with US 29 having a four way interchange instead of a three way? Ending at MD 99 provides another way to access US 29/I-70, which isn't a random end at all. Come to think about it, ending at another primary state highway is one of the least random places to end.
VA 267 / Dulles Toll Road allows motorists to directly access I-66 instead of having to use I-495 to do so. Would you really take I-495 just to exit at I-66 when you can just directly access it by continuing on VA 267?
P.S. Is OSM changing colors for anyone else when they zoom in/out, as if the colors were updated but not fully yet?
Quote from: GaryV on October 30, 2015, 06:21:07 AM
M-185 completely circles Mackinac Island, so it really has no end. They arbitrarily picked its "end" (both of them?) to be at the State Park Commission building.
Leudimin's note: I didn't 'fix' the number because officially is correct. According to my way of referring to state routes, it would be MI 185
And by extension, any beltway. For example, both M-30 and M-40 around Madrid have their respective zero kmposts at their interchanges with A-1, while Z-40 (not to be confused with the Mexican drug lord) around Zaragoza has its zero kmpost at the start of the oldest section, built in the 70s as part of then A-2 (now AP-2). Since it was built long before it was decided to close the beltway, it uses current A-2's kmposts rather than Z-40 ones.
Can't say I'm crazy about a US route ending at a state route if it's not someplace like on the coast. To me, US 29 should end at I-70, and the stub that continues on should be a state route marked To US 29/To I-70.
TX RM 2424 (the northern continuation of Texas 118) just drops dead at Jones-Kent Road, for no apparent reason in rural Culberson County. It ends just after a junction with Foster Road, which would be at least a semi-reasonable terminus, but nope. Jones-Kent ends up going all the way to FM 2185.
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 31, 2015, 10:19:16 AM
VA 267 uselessly continues to I-66. Really, you can just exit onto I-495 and exit at I-66 there.
Uh, there are no ramps between I-495 SB and I-66 EB, or I-66 WB and I-495 NB. Not even after the major recent rebuild of that interchange to among other things make room for the I-495 HO/T lanes, since it saved a lot of money to let VA 267 continue handling that connection. To make that connection without using VA 267 inside I-495, you'd need to use stoplight-infested VA 7 or other non-freeway roads.
You could argue that the VA 267 designation inside the Beltway is unneeded. Indeed, until the last few years it was poorly signed. But calling the connector road by name rather than number could get awkward and confusing (the name was unsigned and not widely known, and "Dulles Airport Access Road" does not roll easily off the tongue in any case). It's more convenient to have a signed route number (which might as well be VA 267, if you're not going to make it an Interstate) for the major freeway connector between I-66, the Dulles Toll Road and free Dulles Airport road, and I-495 north of the DTR.
Forgot to mention these since we're talking about Virginia routes at the moment and I happened to be up in Manassas last week:
- VA 294 (Prince William Parkway) replaced SR 3000. However, part of the route exists in the City of Manassas, which, like all other independent cities, has no numbered secondary routes. A very short segment - consisting mainly of an intersection with Liberia Avenue and Wellington Road - is in the City of Manassas, and due to the former definition of SR 3000, it isn't now part of VA 294, and VA 294 is not signed at the intersection. Therefore, VA 294 begins at VA 234 south of Manassas, ends, then begins again outside the city limits.
- VA 213's entire existence is random. It begins at VA 28 in Manassas Park and snakes through a residential area before ending at an intersection with neighborhood streets. (VA 213 is pointless - you can't even say it's meant to run by Manassas Park City Hall because the portion of Manassas Drive that does isn't part of VA 213)
Someone mentioned US 12 near the beginning of the thread. In fact, very few termini in downtown Detroit (http://michiganhighways.org/maps/DetroitDowntownTrunklines.pdf) make any sense. Note that everything in grey has been decommissioned since 2000. M-1 made a bit more sense when it stubbed at Grand River (former US 16), but its current terminus of Adams is meaningless.
Others:
- M-150 used to end at Rochester city limits, but since 1935 its northern terminus (which has changed repeatedly) has been an arbitrary intersection.
- M-152 ends at a county line, 2 miles short of reaching M-140.
- M-154's southern terminus is at the intersection of a minor side street in the middle of a curve.
- M-188's southern terminus is a (former) railroad crossing.
- M-221 ends at a random point just before it reaches Brimley State Park (and its short east-west portion is unsigned, meaning it appears to end even further from the park).
There was also an M-125 (unrelated to today's route) from 1938 to 1957 that ran 3 miles from then-US 23 to a random rural intersection.
MN 169 abruptly turns into a county road a few miles east of Ely. There are numerous routes that end in the center of a small town with their other end at a more important route, but this is one of the only two I know of that dead-ends outside of a town.
US 75 dead-ends in Noyes, since the Canadians closed their former border crossing there over a decade ago and Minnesota/North Dakota have yet to submit a reroute proposal connecting 75 to I-29 to AASHTO, if they have any interest in doing so.
MN 11 ends at a resort east of International Falls.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on November 04, 2015, 10:47:09 PM
US 75 dead-ends in Noyes, since the Canadians closed their former border crossing there over a decade ago and Minnesota/North Dakota have yet to submit a reroute proposal connecting 75 to I-29 to AASHTO, if they have any interest in doing so.
Signs there tell you to use the I-29 crossing in Emerson, North Dakota. Just before the Noyes crossing, you're directed on MN 175 west to US 81, then turn on I-29 north. However, US 75 is still signed to Noyes.
Quote from: noelbotevera on November 05, 2015, 03:34:04 PM
Signs there tell you to use the I-29 crossing in Emerson, North Dakota. Just before the Noyes crossing, you're directed on MN 175 west to US 81, then turn on I-29 north. However, US 75 is still signed to Noyes.
Yes. And no "End" sign telling you that US 75 stops short of the barricade at the border, so the route may indeed end at the border even though you can't continue into Emerson MB.
I-691/CT 66 may seem like they randomly end/begin, but the signage is more random than anything.
Officially, I-691's eastern terminus is at I-91. However, I-691 East shields on the onramps morph into CT 66 East shields starting at Exit 8, about 1 1/2 miles east of I-91. The last reassurance shield is (or was?) just before Exit 8. No reassurance shields appear east of Exit 8, though there are CT 66 East pullthroughs starting 1/2 mile east of Exit 8.
Westbound, the last WB CT 66 reassurance shield is just west of the CT 147 intersection. About 1/2 mile to the west, the expressway starts and we see an overhead "WEST I-691" pullthrough, about a mile east of I-91, where I-691 technically begins, WB. Interestingly, there are no "TO I-691" shields anywhere on the non-expressway portion. There are, however, a couple "TO I-91" shields, coming out of CT 147.
So given existing onramp/guide signs, a motorist would believe I-691 West begins where the expressway begins, and that CT 66 East begins at Exit 8. In reality, CT 66 morphs into I-691 and I-691 magically becomes CT 66. Maybe one day, CDOT will put up a "I-691 ENDS / CT 66 BEGINS" sign. I still remember the sign that said "NOTICE- CT 66 IS NOW I-691" by the Exit 12 onramp. Must've been the mid 80s, the same time the expressway was finished to I-84.
Quote from: CNGL-Leudimin on October 31, 2015, 12:07:33 PM
Quote from: GaryV on October 30, 2015, 06:21:07 AM
M-185 completely circles Mackinac Island, so it really has no end. They arbitrarily picked its "end" (both of them?) to be at the State Park Commission building.
Leudimin's note: I didn't 'fix' the number because officially is correct. According to my way of referring to state routes, it would be MI 185
And by extension, any beltway. For example, both M-30 and M-40 around Madrid have their respective zero kmposts at their interchanges with A-1, while Z-40 (not to be confused with the Mexican drug lord) around Zaragoza has its zero kmpost at the start of the oldest section, built in the 70s as part of then A-2 (now AP-2). Since it was built long before it was decided to close the beltway, it uses current A-2's kmposts rather than Z-40 ones.
I-435's mileage resets at around mile 82.4 in the middle of the southern interchange with I-35. There is no Zero milepost that I can see. Then again, we're in the midst of the infamous JoCO Gateway project.
What about Boston where US 20 randomly ends instead of connecting to US 1. Of course that is due to highway alignments being changed over the years, but nonetheless it ends at Kennett Square near the infamous Citgo sign.
Of course US 3 transitions into MA 3 someplace in Cambridge instead of at US 1 or even I-93 for that matter. Some may say that MA 3 should be US 3 all the way as its changeover from US to state road makes no sense other than to keep US 3 west of US 1. However US 6 is south of US 20 in MA and US 44 is between US 20 and US 6 making the grid more out of wack, so I doubt that one very much.
Quote from: roadman65 on November 07, 2015, 02:04:34 PM
What about Boston where US 20 randomly ends instead of connecting to US 1. Of course that is due to highway alignments being changed over the years, but nonetheless it ends at Kennett Square near the infamous Citgo sign.
Of course US 3 transitions into MA 3 someplace in Cambridge instead of at US 1 or even I-93 for that matter. Some may say that MA 3 should be US 3 all the way as its changeover from US to state road makes no sense other than to keep US 3 west of US 1. However US 6 is south of US 20 in MA and US 44 is between US 20 and US 6 making the grid more out of wack, so I doubt that one very much.
US 20 ends at MA 2 and Brookline Avenue at a four way intersection. US 20 and MA 2 EB is Commonwealth Avenue, MA 2 WB is Beacon Street, and Brookline Avenue is nothing.
US 3 ends at the Harvard Bridge. Before Massachusetts Avenue on Memorial Drive, you come to a fork. Trucks have to exit right (US 3) and the exit ends at MA 2A, Massachusetts Avenue. MA 3 heads left past Massachusetts. The reason why it makes sense is because the Harvard is the way towards MIT and the 4th last bridge to cross the Charles River.
Quote from: noelbotevera on November 08, 2015, 12:59:52 AM
The reason why it makes sense is because the Harvard is the way towards MIT and the 4th last bridge to cross the Charles River.
If that makes sense, then I choose to remain confused.
Quote from: roadman65 on November 07, 2015, 02:04:34 PM
What about Boston where US 20 randomly ends instead of connecting to US 1. Of course that is due to highway alignments being changed over the years, but nonetheless it ends at Kennett Square near the infamous Citgo sign.
You must've had Chester County, PA on your mind :rofl:; you obviously meant
Kenmore square. :sombrero:
Quote from: noelbotevera on November 08, 2015, 12:59:52 AMUS 20 ends at MA 2 and Brookline Avenue at a four way intersection. US 20 and MA 2 EB is Commonwealth Avenue, MA 2 WB is Beacon Street, and Brookline Avenue is nothing.
Correct.
Colorado is noteworthy for some of their random "ends". , with a lot of them not marked with an END blade.
In this case, however, the end of CO-97 is double-marked at the edge of town, literally. Pan around and you'll see what I mean:
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.2714295,-108.5458598,3a,75y,7.86h,85.47t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sWVhQKSxumVJoNDiPPp57dw!2e0!7i3328!8i1664!6m1!1e1
Another one of Richmond's random ends: VA 150 doesn't end at a primary route - it ends at an intersection where southbound North Parham Road turns onto itself to access River Road. (Both of these roads are in Henrico County, which doesn't have numbered secondary routes.)
The terminus is just two miles shy of VA 6, which makes more sense as an endpoint. Of course, Parham Road as a whole should be primary (only a short segment of it between US 1 and I-95 is, as VA 73), but that's just me...
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.5724235,-77.5759483,3a,75y,35.6h,85.64t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sRwNdDSQ6BhIZJTwpOMt65g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Quote from: roadman65 on November 07, 2015, 02:04:34 PM
What about Boston where US 20 randomly ends instead of connecting to US 1. Of course that is due to highway alignments being changed over the years, but nonetheless it ends at Kenmore Square near the infamous Citgo sign.
Fixed it for you.
Quote from: GaryV on October 25, 2015, 07:58:17 AM
Quote from: national highway 1 on October 24, 2015, 04:25:20 AM
The north end of US 41 is at the entrance of Fort Wilkins State Park near Copper Harbor, MI.
Actually the north end is about 1/2 mile east of the park entrance, making it even more random.
Another one is the north end of M-93 outside Grayling. It runs northwest from I-75 to Hartwick Pines State Park. Several years ago the reconfigured roadways inside the park, and moved the park entrance closer to I-75. But the highway still extends to where the previous entrance was.
M-93 doesn't really make much sense at all
Quote from: getemngo on November 04, 2015, 01:01:28 AM
Someone mentioned US 12 near the beginning of the thread. In fact, very few termini in downtown Detroit (http://michiganhighways.org/maps/DetroitDowntownTrunklines.pdf) make any sense. Note that everything in grey has been decommissioned since 2000. M-1 made a bit more sense when it stubbed at Grand River (former US 16), but its current terminus of Adams is meaningless.
Others:
- M-150 used to end at Rochester city limits, but since 1935 its northern terminus (which has changed repeatedly) has been an arbitrary intersection.
- M-152 ends at a county line, 2 miles short of reaching M-140.
- M-154's southern terminus is at the intersection of a minor side street in the middle of a curve.
- M-188's southern terminus is a (former) railroad crossing.
- M-221 ends at a random point just before it reaches Brimley State Park (and its short east-west portion is unsigned, meaning it appears to end even further from the park).
There was also an M-125 (unrelated to today's route) from 1938 to 1957 that ran 3 miles from then-US 23 to a random rural intersection.
In the M-152 case, US-31 is only six miles beyond M-140, so if the US-31 link between Napier Ave and I-94 ever gets completed (no longer marked on some maps but still marked as "under construction" on the official MDOT map), M-152 could go all the way to I-94 or even to M-139.
Another random ending is M-42 ending at the west village limits of Manton, about a half mile west of Business US-131.
Also, M-44 has a pointless concurrency along M-37 from I-96 to M-11/28th St and M-46 ends at the former route of Business US-31 through Muskegon.
I would say US 1's southern terminus is random. Considering that you have the marker for the southernmost point in the contiguous 48 states, that should have been the point of end.
However, being that the Monroe County Courthouse lies at the intersection of Whitehead and Fleming Streets (US 1's southern terminus) that is why its there as many considered a courthouse to be a prominent place considering that state capitals are. That is why US 1 goes inland from Jacksonville to New York being west of US 9, US 13, US 15, and US 17 so it could transit the capitals of the states minus Maryland and of course Delaware where it does not even enter.
Don't forget Pennsylvania.
Quote from: roadman65 on November 15, 2015, 11:25:17 PM
I would say US 1's southern terminus is random. Considering that you have the marker for the southernmost point in the contiguous 48 states, that should have been the point of end.
why does that have any bearing on the matter?
Quote from: OracleUsr on November 16, 2015, 07:15:34 AM
Don't forget Pennsylvania.
what about Pennsylvania?
Quote from: odditude on November 16, 2015, 12:29:55 PM
Quote from: roadman65 on November 15, 2015, 11:25:17 PM
I would say US 1's southern terminus is random. Considering that you have the marker for the southernmost point in the contiguous 48 states, that should have been the point of end.
why does that have any bearing on the matter?
The marker is wrong anyways. The park goes further south and the base goes further south still. It's just the furthest south accessible by car, and the second furthest south accessible by the public.
It ends randomly as it is just ends at an intersection with no bearing whatsoever. If it ended at the Southernmost Marker than it would not be as random.
What about PA? If you are referring to Harrisburg, then you need to read up on why US 1 was routed so far inland in the Carolina's. PA, NY, CT, even RI and MA where US 1 does serve their capitals did not ask for stray routing for US 1 like NC and SC did.
It ends at the courthouse. Hardly random.
Quote from: Alps on October 21, 2015, 08:47:16 PM
These routes don't end at other routes, state lines, bodies of water, or other even quasi-logical points like stubby freeway/expressway ends. It's pretty random.
NJ: Not counting tiny state takeovers like 13 and 64, only substantive routes.
NJ 7 — Ignoring the fact that it has a discontinuity in the middle, the north end is at the Passaic County line so close to NJ 3. It even crosses the county line before that without a problem — and has county maintenance there!
According to Passaic County DPW, Cathedral Ave/Passaic Ave in Clifton is indeed county maintained as NJ-7 up to NJ-3. NJDOT acknowledges this on the signs for the exit on NJ-3, and Passaic County DPW has placed NJ-7 markers on that section of roadway.
Source: http://www.passaiccountynj.org/DocumentCenter/View/111
County placed Marker: https://goo.gl/maps/aNXGZjgEHkn
Since replaced with a "north" marker! Might actually be a NJDOT install: https://goo.gl/maps/zbyeFEt8kmm
FL A1A randomly ends in Key West at its southern terminus. You think that they would reconnect it to US 1, but they did not.
Quote from: ftballfan on November 15, 2015, 07:34:10 PM
Quote from: getemngo on November 04, 2015, 01:01:28 AM
Someone mentioned US 12 near the beginning of the thread. In fact, very few termini in downtown Detroit (http://michiganhighways.org/maps/DetroitDowntownTrunklines.pdf) make any sense. Note that everything in grey has been decommissioned since 2000. M-1 made a bit more sense when it stubbed at Grand River (former US 16), but its current terminus of Adams is meaningless.
Others:
- M-150 used to end at Rochester city limits, but since 1935 its northern terminus (which has changed repeatedly) has been an arbitrary intersection.
- M-152 ends at a county line, 2 miles short of reaching M-140.
- M-154's southern terminus is at the intersection of a minor side street in the middle of a curve.
- M-188's southern terminus is a (former) railroad crossing.
- M-221 ends at a random point just before it reaches Brimley State Park (and its short east-west portion is unsigned, meaning it appears to end even further from the park).
There was also an M-125 (unrelated to today's route) from 1938 to 1957 that ran 3 miles from then-US 23 to a random rural intersection.
In the M-152 case, US-31 is only six miles beyond M-140, so if the US-31 link between Napier Ave and I-94 ever gets completed (no longer marked on some maps but still marked as "under construction" on the official MDOT map), M-152 could go all the way to I-94 or even to M-139.
Another random ending is M-42 ending at the west village limits of Manton, about a half mile west of Business US-131.
Also, M-44 has a pointless concurrency along M-37 from I-96 to M-11/28th St and M-46 ends at the former route of Business US-31 through Muskegon.
M-42 ends in Manton in the middle of its concurrency with Bus. US 131 at the corner of Michigan Avenue and 7th St. M-42 ends instead of turning north with the business loop onto the old route of US 131 through town. The stub west of the business loop in the village is an unsigned trunkline, and not signed as part of M-42.
As for M-152, I assume that if MDOT ever gets the rest of the US 31 freeway north of Napier Avenue built that they'll transfer Napier back to local control. (Barring a successful transfer, they'd remove the signage and make it an unsigned trunkline line, like the part of M-42 in the village of Manton they still possess.)
Supposedly, MDOT was truncating M-44 several years ago, but the signage never changed. Maybe someday it will happen, but not yet it seems.
Quote from: ajlynch91 on October 21, 2015, 11:28:46 PM
IL 155 and IL 156 just end in the middle of nowhere, deep in Southern Illinois. Both serve rural communities west of IL-3, although 156 is a bit longer. What is strange is that they literally just end, pavement continues as as unnumbered roads, neither of which I don't believe is controlled by the state, further still, if they were state maintained, IL-155 could easily be absorbed by a much longer 156.
I've been to both ends. You're right they just stop. One is near Fults and the other near Kidd. 155 serves Prairie Du Rocher also. When I used to chase storms, I dreaded going down there because it floods pretty quick and the roads are like a maze.
In Willmar, MN the easternmost mile of MN 40 was lopped off several years ago because the city felt that the road was interfering with the expansion of their industrial sector. The road now ends at 30th Avenue West, and apparently has never been rerouted north over 30th to reach US 12; that route was MN 40's former terminus.