Hello, I'll like to admit that I've been kind of a mean person (for a lack of better words I can't say) on these forums to certain people. As I have strong opinions and always seem to be down on myself.
Anyways, I'd like to know what your opinion is about studying civil engineering being ten years out of my natural year to start undergraduate. Yes, I am currently enrolled in a program, but I still feel like constant crap in how I have wasted the last ten years and can't seem to get over it. I'll be honest and admit I had mediocre grades back then, and I thought that it was all over for me. I realized years later that I could be given a second chance, and redid those same courses last year around this time with near flawless grades.
I'm now mostly studying with a group of people who can't visually remember 9/11, if that's a way to put it. These people are straight out of high school, I've wasted ten years of my life.
Sorry if I seem like I'm venting, but I would like to deeply apologize to cl94 if he reads this message, as I was kind of mean to him in posts in the past.
What makes me feel the worst is that I'll feel like I'm way too old when I finally do graduate, I'll be in my thirties, and that is the problem I can't seem to wrap my head around. I know it's impossible to repeat the past but I can't seem to move on from the mistakes I made years ago. There were absolutely no criminal mistakes made and I have never done anything against the law, but I just can't seem to get past it.
So what is your opinion on someone my age, who just turned 28 in November being a freshman (yes I know that's a US term) at a university?
If you can do the work now, go for it. Lots of people aren't up to undergrad work with they're 18 but can do it later. You could easily graduate then work in your career for 35 years.
I'm no engineer, but I know there are lots of us who would say "If only I had this attitude by 28."
If you have a passion and a vision of how to make it happen, go for it. Many people live their whole lives without being even that fortunate.
And, having been to school on a number of occasions at a variety of ages, I'll say you'll probably handle it better than those 20-year-olds.
OK, you wasted 10 years. It looks now like you're taking steps to not waste another 20 or 30. That's good, not bad.
I went back and got my masters in computer science at 53. Had some interesting discussions in my class, about what "sneaker-net" meant (I was sneaker-net in an earlier job) and why a percolator works. (Percolating refers to some sorting techniques.)
As a current civil engineering student at a university, I can say that 28 is not old at all. I know many people around your age who are studying civil engineering, some of which have families and whatnot. Most of the time, they integrate easily into their studies, and many times (like other members have pointed out) these students are more mature and capable than their 19 year old counterparts (like me).
As a matter of fact, I know a guy who is in his mid-late thirties, and about two-three years away from graduating. It's true that most of the other people in your classes will be younger than you, perhaps 18-22 range. But don't think that if you're 28, it's too late and game over.
Don't worry, when you graduate, there's a long career path still ahead of you.
I know Mark O'Neil (he used to have a sign photography web site back in 2000 and later started the the Plate Depot (https://www.platedepot.com/)) went back to college in his 30s to get his civil engineering degree. Before that he had an established career working for Rand McNally. So I'd say you should definitely continue pursuing it.
That out-of-place feeling is pretty natural, really. Colleges are, for the most part, "designed" for people in their late teens and early twenties. They know things you don't, but as you pointed out, you know things they don't, and so there's no reason to think that you won't be able to contribute, even if you're not necessarily fitting in like a glove. That said, you will probably get used to things over time.
If you don't, do keep in mind that there are almost certainly resources at the university that you can take advantage of. Take a look at some of them if things start to overwhelm you.
Those "kids" will keep you young! I employ mostly people in their early to mid 20s... they won't let me get old! They're always dragging the conversations into Pokemon territory, for example. That's something I knew nothing about until 2 years ago. My roommate, who is 32, has a lot of classes and does military work with people in that age bracket as well. He seems to have a little less patience for them than I do though. He's like "Ugh, I'm the only Iraq War veteran here simply because everyone else is too young."
Let me suggest you take a step back for a second and consider this: you may have less in common with your fellow students than they have with one another, but you will have more in common in terms of where you are in your life and mindset with your professors than they will.
I found from going back to school, and had this sentiment echoed to me by lots of others who have, that you'll just be more engaged and more a part of your education at this point then an 18-year-old would.
It sure is daunting to go back to school, but you will have much more fun because you you know why you were doing it and you're making a concerted effort to do it. I found that having been away from school for a while and having gained some perspective on the world, school was much more enjoyable and rewarding the second time around.
No offense taken. Really. I honestly don't take much of what I read too seriously. I know emotions run high and I'm certainly not one to say otherwise as I can get quite, shall I say, intense.
As to what we think, I can't speak for everyone else, but many of us admire people who go back to school. Why? Because we know you're there to learn. You don't stay up all night yelling and getting drunk and you don't set off fire extinguishers into smoke detectors every night (yes, people did that when I was a freshman and I spent many a cold Buffalo winter night waiting outside for the fire department to show up). I thought it was cool to see people who weren't fresh out of high school in classes. Granted, I might have a different view because my parents went to grad school pretty recently (and my mom got her second master's since I started undergrad), but there are some of us who understand the experience being in the real world can bring. I took some classes with people who went back to school and the real-world experience they were able to bring to group discussions probably made a huge difference for us.
So many people who go into engineering do it just because they want to make a decent amount of money. Granted, civil engineering doesn't get as much of the "I want to be rich" crowd as aerospace or biomedical, but there still is some of it. If you have the passion, go for it. We need more engineers who have the passion. If this is what you want to do, come join us. If you can do the work and do it well, we need you.
Quote from: cl94 on February 20, 2016, 09:10:59 PM
So many people who go into engineering do it just because they want to make a decent amount of money. Granted, civil engineering doesn't get as much of the "I want to be rich" crowd as aerospace or biomedical, but there still is some of it. If you have the passion, go for it. We need more engineers who have the passion. If this is what you want to do, come join us. If you can do the work and do it well, we need you.
Personal dissenting view: I have a PE in Civil Engineering and still can't find work.
Quote from: cl94 on February 20, 2016, 09:10:59 PM
No offense taken. Really. I honestly don't take much of what I read too seriously. I know emotions run high and I'm certainly not one to say otherwise as I can get quite, shall I say, intense.
As to what we think, I can't speak for everyone else, but many of us admire people who go back to school. Why? Because we know you're there to learn. You don't stay up all night yelling and getting drunk and you don't set off fire extinguishers into smoke detectors every night (yes, people did that when I was a freshman and I spent many a cold Buffalo winter night waiting outside for the fire department to show up). I thought it was cool to see people who weren't fresh out of high school in classes. Granted, I might have a different view because my parents went to grad school pretty recently (and my mom got her second master's since I started undergrad), but there are some of us who understand the experience being in the real world can bring. I took some classes with people who went back to school and the real-world experience they were able to bring to group discussions probably made a huge difference for us.
So many people who go into engineering do it just because they want to make a decent amount of money. Granted, civil engineering doesn't get as much of the "I want to be rich" crowd as aerospace or biomedical, but there still is some of it. If you have the passion, go for it. We need more engineers who have the passion. If this is what you want to do, come join us. If you can do the work and do it well, we need you.
Thanks for all the kind words from everyone, it really is nice, I sincerely thank you.
Great to hear from you, I do understand like what Big John said that taking civil can be a risk, and not a safe haven like biomed for instance (think of the baby boomers), but it is a way more practical alternative to my other big interest, astronomy. I guess it's a blessing in disguise that when I couldn't make it to an astronomy program years ago that I may have made the right choice. I did have an eventual plan to go to college and so lets just say that I won't have issues involving student loans (or shall I say student mortgages). If it was money I was after, I'd go into something different altogether, or law school after, but I've always wanted to do something positive for the world.
One thing that sort of bothers me is that I'm at a crappy school so to speak, Ryerson University. Although I had stellar grades when I had to retake those high school courses online, I'm talking about high 90s in them, the University of Toronto does not accept upgrades, even if it is 10 years after I first took them. Maybe I look to the negative and see us Ryerson Engineering students as the people who couldn't make U of Toronto, but we still are fairly bright. The average entrance grade was 88% for engineering I believe, and no one got in with an average below 80%.
Ryerson is like a frankenstein sort of school in a way, I mean in a layout in how portions of it are all over the place. Basically in a nut shell, this is how I describe it, could you imagine a campus where portions of it were on either side of Times Square and you would have to walk across Times Square to get to your next class. Yup, that's kind of like the way it's like. The "Ted Rogers" building is actually seven floors above street level, so yeah, there's a lot of up and down involved when going here, but I've gotten used to it. While no one really cares about college sports in Canada unfortunately, it's still real nice that the Ryerson hockey team plays in Maple Leaf Gardens, where the Leafs played from 1931-1999, a grand total of 68 years. Yes, the bottom floor of the building now contains a grocery store, but the upper floors belong to Ryerson and serve as a gym and arena. A real nice touch is how the arena up on the third floor resembles a miniature Maple Leaf Gardens in layout......yup and I remember actually seeing the Leafs play in that building, saw them play the Blackhawks in 1998.
What I was basically trying to say earlier is that Ryerson is unusually located arguably in the main touristy area of the city, Yonge-Dundas is easily Toronto's version of times square, which I know is not as grand of Times Square but serves the same sort of purpose. Combine that with being next to the Eaton Centre, a downtown shopping mall, and well, as I said, you're in the main touristy area of the city.
You can call it "mickey mouse" but believe it or not, we actually have lectures in the 24-plex theater at Yonge-Dundas square, yes some of the theatres in that complex double as lecture halls during the day. I thought it sounded very silly at first but it actually works surprisingly well believe it or not.
Of course, I'm a person who lives in Brampton, so I thankfully don't have to put up with those dormitory pranks that you did. But one of the things I'd like to point out with these kids, it's hard to do any sort of bonding. For instance, I usually take the same morning GO Train 5 days a week, and well, I practically know all my fellow train riders, and I described myself as the mature student of engineering, which they as well said the same thing that I am never too old to start.
On the topic of interacting, I will say that I have made good interactions with my instructors, that most of them know who I am by first name, it's kind of funny when the instructor I had for Linear Algebra would speak to me about his life, and his days of when he used to be a prof at Texas Tech for instance. I've even bumped into him while waiting at Union Station for my train, yup, he lives outside the city and takes the train like everyone else. He's a great instructor nevertheless. I find it unbelievable that a lot of these same students show disrespect in lectures and talk through lectures, when these are supposedly part of the brighter group from high school. Is this just a Ryerson thing, or is it common in schools everywhere where students are supposed to be bright.
That's me ranting too much for now, but yeah, I take kindly to the good words all of you have been saying to me and I appreciate it.
Quote from: Pete from Boston on February 20, 2016, 08:29:13 PM
Let me suggest you take a step back for a second and consider this: you may have less in common with your fellow students than they have with one another, but you will have more in common in terms of where you are in your life and mindset with your professors than they will.
I remember being a traditional-age student and actually being jealous of the older students becuase they got along with the professors so well. They'd have these long conversations in the hallway and during breaks laughing it up and having a good old time.
Quote from: GCrites80s on February 21, 2016, 10:55:48 AM
Quote from: Pete from Boston on February 20, 2016, 08:29:13 PM
Let me suggest you take a step back for a second and consider this: you may have less in common with your fellow students than they have with one another, but you will have more in common in terms of where you are in your life and mindset with your professors than they will.
I remember being a traditional-age student and actually being jealous of the older students becuase they got along with the professors so well. They'd have these long conversations in the hallway and during breaks laughing it up and having a good old time.
Even in class, though, I remember as a young undergrad I found the person in the front of the room who always answered–and asked–questions, engaging the professor at every opportunity, to be obsequious and, well, ass-kissing.
Returning to school years later, it astounded me that anyone would waste their opportunity by
not being that person.
Quote from: Pete from Boston on February 21, 2016, 11:13:55 AM
Quote from: GCrites80s on February 21, 2016, 10:55:48 AM
Quote from: Pete from Boston on February 20, 2016, 08:29:13 PM
Let me suggest you take a step back for a second and consider this: you may have less in common with your fellow students than they have with one another, but you will have more in common in terms of where you are in your life and mindset with your professors than they will.
I remember being a traditional-age student and actually being jealous of the older students becuase they got along with the professors so well. They'd have these long conversations in the hallway and during breaks laughing it up and having a good old time.
Even in class, though, I remember as a young undergrad I found the person in the front of the room who always answered–and asked–questions, engaging the professor at every opportunity, to be obsequious and, well, ass-kissing.
Returning to school years later, it astounded me that anyone would waste their opportunity by not being that person.
I like that. And never thought of it that way.
Quote from: Pete from Boston on February 21, 2016, 11:13:55 AM
Quote from: GCrites80s on February 21, 2016, 10:55:48 AM
Quote from: Pete from Boston on February 20, 2016, 08:29:13 PM
Let me suggest you take a step back for a second and consider this: you may have less in common with your fellow students than they have with one another, but you will have more in common in terms of where you are in your life and mindset with your professors than they will.
I remember being a traditional-age student and actually being jealous of the older students becuase they got along with the professors so well. They'd have these long conversations in the hallway and during breaks laughing it up and having a good old time.
Even in class, though, I remember as a young undergrad I found the person in the front of the room who always answered–and asked–questions, engaging the professor at every opportunity, to be obsequious and, well, ass-kissing.
Returning to school years later, it astounded me that anyone would waste their opportunity by not being that person.
And well, my belief is to question what you see if it doesn't make sense. I am always sure to engage with my professors, so yes I am that smart ass student in the front row, who usually sits 4 feet away from the professor. So I am very much that person you like to talk about.
And yes, even though I don't start the conversation, there would be many of times where I would sit on my computer waiting for the next class and one of my profs would talk to me. Funny how it was only me ever, but hey, that's a good thing I guess.