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Non-Road Boards => Off-Topic => Topic started by: 7/8 on July 03, 2016, 09:45:43 PM

Title: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: 7/8 on July 03, 2016, 09:45:43 PM
I have an interest in regional accents, and I found out maybe a year ago that the "correct" pronunciation of asphalt is ASSphalt. My whole life, I've always said ASHphalt, and I assumed it was spelt that way too! Apparently this is common in (at least parts of) Canada.

So I'd like to ask people to post where they're from and how they pronounce asphalt. I'm curious where these two pronunciations are commonly found.

I've spent my whole life in Southern Ontario (Canada) for the record  :)
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: Max Rockatansky on July 03, 2016, 09:50:05 PM
I always pronounced it like "ass-fault" and I'm originally from Michigan...  But then again I'm told that I have a southern accent which makes no sense at all since I've spoke the way I do my whole life...  Apparently the correct way to pronounce asphalt is as follows:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a8/En-us-asphalt.ogg

Almost sounds like "As-fault" to me.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: hotdogPi on July 03, 2016, 09:52:04 PM
I've always said ass-fault. Would the British say arse-fault?
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: billtm on July 03, 2016, 10:00:31 PM
People have told me that the way I speak is called "standard American", whatever that means. Grew up most of my life (2 years old till now) in West Lafayette, IN and I have always pronounced it ass-fault.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: allniter89 on July 03, 2016, 10:17:38 PM
black top
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: Max Rockatansky on July 03, 2016, 10:18:47 PM
Quote from: 1 on July 03, 2016, 09:52:04 PM
I've always said ass-fault. Would the British say arse-fault?

Seems the Brits say "Ass-fault" too:

http://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/pronunciation/english/asphalt

Quote from: billtm on July 03, 2016, 10:00:31 PM
People have told me that the way I speak is called "standard American", whatever that means. Grew up most of my life (2 years old till now) in West Lafayette, IN and I have always pronounced it ass-fault.

Basically it's what the modern midwest accent has evolved into.  Most people in the midwest used to sound different from one state to the next.  My Grand Parents were from Detroit and spoke like Canadians, you had a lot of "da bears" Chicago accents on top of my cousin's family speaking Minnesota Nice.

Imagine you have to visit a rural farm in Minnesota in the 1980s and all the adults talk like this:



Or you live in Chicago for a couple years and have to listen to everyone over thirty sound like this when they talk about sports:



Especially when you still had some people in Chicago who talked like they were reading a radio news report about Elliot Ness fighting Al Capone and his gangland chronies:



Or your grand father from Michigan sounds like an older Steve Yzerman (this is the most tolerable by a country mile):



But hey, I got a Grandfather from Baltimore who still can't pronounce "wash" correctly and inserts an "R" into for some reason.  At least it's not as bad as the Boston accent dropping ALL the "R's" instead...don't ask them to "park the car in the garage."
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: Brandon on July 03, 2016, 10:20:55 PM
I've always used "ass-fault", and I speak Inland North with the ICVS.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: PurdueBill on July 03, 2016, 11:32:15 PM
I'm with the majority on this.  Cleopatra said: "Whoever refuses to fix these potholes can kiss my" BLANK.  Brett, what do you have?

(https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13600110_10106522258403808_3401912962349909027_n.jpg?oh=bdff8d541b70ffafd23d024f2e053dd4&oe=57EB08BB)

As far as Rs showing up in words like "warsh", I had always thought it was an Indiana thing based on people I knew and worked with who grew up there and lived there.  But not all such people had that R insertion.
Conservation of mass requires that the Rs dropped in Boston reappear somewhere, evidently Baltimore and Indiana.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: Max Rockatansky on July 03, 2016, 11:42:46 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on July 03, 2016, 11:32:15 PM
I'm with the majority on this.  Cleopatra said: "Whoever refuses to fix these potholes can kiss my" BLANK.  Brett, what do you have?

(https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13600110_10106522258403808_3401912962349909027_n.jpg?oh=bdff8d541b70ffafd23d024f2e053dd4&oe=57EB08BB)

As far as Rs showing up in words like "warsh", I had always thought it was an Indiana thing based on people I knew and worked with who grew up there and lived there.  But not all such people had that R insertion.
Conservation of mass requires that the Rs dropped in Boston reappear somewhere, evidently Baltimore and Indiana.

So in other words the Boston Accent is a linguistic black hole so massive that the singularity punches a hole in space-time resulting in the "R's" reemerging in jumbled disasters of regional dialects?

Now you got me thinking about Evil Richard Dawson from The Running Man.  :-D



Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: empirestate on July 04, 2016, 01:15:59 AM
It's definitely "ass-fault". I think the "ash-fault" pronunciation is just a matter of imprecision, similar to "comfterble" or "intregal" or "Worchester"–the eye sees the right letters but the tongue gets a bit confused as to their correct order.


iPhone
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: wxfree on July 04, 2016, 01:16:23 AM
I don't know if it's Texan or if it's Southern or if it's just me, but I've always pronounced it "azphalt."  It's a word not used frequently enough for me to have a good understanding of how it's pronounced widely around here, but from what I've heard (in places like public highway project meetings) it seems I picked up the common pronunciation.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: wanderer2575 on July 04, 2016, 02:11:31 AM
Just don't ask us to pronounce "realtor."
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: pumpkineater2 on July 04, 2016, 02:41:14 AM
I've always pronounced it ass-phalt and always have heard it pronounced that way.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: 1995hoo on July 04, 2016, 01:17:46 PM
Quote from: wxfree on July 04, 2016, 01:16:23 AM
I don't know if it's Texan or if it's Southern or if it's just me, but I've always pronounced it "azphalt."  It's a word not used frequently enough for me to have a good understanding of how it's pronounced widely around here, but from what I've heard (in places like public highway project meetings) it seems I picked up the common pronunciation.

Same here. The "as" part sounds like the word "as," with a hard "s" or "z" sound, whereas the word "ass" has a soft "s" sound. All my relatives are from Brooklyn, BTW, so I doubt it's a Southern or Texas thing.

"Ass-fault" sounds like a disease of the rectum.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: Mr. Matté on July 04, 2016, 03:37:59 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on July 03, 2016, 11:32:15 PM
I'm with the majority on this.  Cleopatra said: "Whoever refuses to fix these potholes can kiss my" BLANK.  Brett, what do you have?

(https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13600110_10106522258403808_3401912962349909027_n.jpg?oh=bdff8d541b70ffafd23d024f2e053dd4&oe=57EB08BB)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nSFuFc0Tr8A
"I glad you used your deep voice."
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: kphoger on July 04, 2016, 07:06:49 PM
I had never heard of any pronunciation other than ass-fault until this thread.  Never.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: GaryV on July 04, 2016, 07:59:29 PM
Some Boston/MA accents preserve the conservation of R within themselves.  For example, President Kennedy always talked about Cuba-er and California-er.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: SignGeek101 on July 04, 2016, 08:22:11 PM
Always "ashfault" for me. It appears I'm in the minority.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: Max Rockatansky on July 04, 2016, 08:27:10 PM
Quote from: SignGeek101 on July 04, 2016, 08:22:11 PM
Always "ashfault" for me. It appears I'm in the minority.

Given how asphalt is spelt I'm somewhat surprised to never recall someone calling it "asp-halt" like there was a den of snakes guarding the lost Ark or something:



Incidentally they never hit on what happened to Sallah in Crystal Skull but talked about what happened Henry Jones Sr. and Marcus Brody.  Were the camels in the Last Crusade enough to make for Sallah losing his brother-in law's car?...we may never know?
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: mukade on July 04, 2016, 08:53:35 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on July 03, 2016, 11:32:15 PM
As far as Rs showing up in words like "warsh", I had always thought it was an Indiana thing based on people I knew and worked with who grew up there and lived there.  But not all such people had that R insertion.
Conservation of mass requires that the Rs dropped in Boston reappear somewhere, evidently Baltimore and Indiana.

I live in central Indiana, and very, very few paeople here say things like "Warshington". Ditto for Northern Indiana - no one ever said that, but some really did say "da" instead of "the" - for example, "da region". I have worked with two people from Missouri (St. Louis and Kirksville) who did always say "warsh". I used to kid the guy from St. Louis about it, but he was not going to change.

As for "ash-falt", I did hear that as a kid more than once somewhere - either in Michigan or in a Canadian school I went to while in Japan. In Michigan, I also heard people call a chimney a "chimley".
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: jeffandnicole on July 04, 2016, 09:12:18 PM
Quote from: kphoger on July 04, 2016, 07:06:49 PM
I had never heard of any pronunciation other than ass-fault until this thread.  Never.

Same here.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt
Post by: 7/8 on July 04, 2016, 09:29:36 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on July 04, 2016, 01:17:46 PM
"Ass-fault" sounds like a disease of the rectum.

Lol, I knew someone would make this joke  :)

Quote from: SignGeek101 on July 04, 2016, 08:22:11 PM
Always "ashfault" for me. It appears I'm in the minority.

Yay, I'm not the only one! There seems to be a clear split between Canadians and Americans so far. I'm hoping some British and Australian posters will chime in too.

Quote from: PurdueBill on July 03, 2016, 11:32:15 PM
As far as Rs showing up in words like "warsh", I had always thought it was an Indiana thing based on people I knew and worked with who grew up there and lived there.  But not all such people had that R insertion.
Conservation of mass requires that the Rs dropped in Boston reappear somewhere, evidently Baltimore and Indiana.

From what I've read, this is most common in older people from the Midwest. I've never heard it myself though.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: slorydn1 on July 04, 2016, 10:17:27 PM
Ass-fault, and I grew up in the midwest, but I've lived in eastern NC 25+ years now too, and we say ass-fault here too. Now, I did hear an announcer that was doing the 6 hours of the Glen on Fox Sports this weekend say Ash-fault (I think it was Calvin Fish, but if it was he's a Brit that is now lives here).

+1 to whomever mentioned "warsh" above-that was big in southwestern lower Michigan when I was a kid-as well as "Melk" for milk, and pop for soda (etc etc etc).
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: cpzilliacus on July 05, 2016, 05:37:54 PM
Ass-fault in Maryland.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: bulldog1979 on July 06, 2016, 10:13:15 PM
I've heard both as-fault and ass-fault, with the hard and soft s sounds, respectively.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: westerninterloper on July 06, 2016, 10:49:51 PM
Western Indiana here; ass-fault.

My folks are from around the Vincennes area, and several of them say "warsh". There seems to be an interesting line of that particular pronunciation from Baltimore west toward St. Louis. I always thought that "warsh" was something particular about the Hoosier Apex, but maybe it's more common to southern Midland speech.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: english si on July 07, 2016, 07:57:56 AM
Quote from: 1 on July 03, 2016, 09:52:04 PM
I've always said ass-fault. Would the British say arse-fault?
Ash-falt, though someone might say as-falt (or is that az-falt? certainly a hard-s). And the falt bit depends a little on accent - mine is probably actually felt (or even feld or fel, as I drop/glottal stop my 't's) - it's never the same as fault would be pronounced by that person.

And as it isn't 'ass' (a donkey), we wouldn't use 'arse' (a bottom, and we spell it that way and put an 'r' in - it's very definitely 'ar' rather than a broad 'a'), which have different etymologies anyway. And 'ass' uses short-a, even in Southern English English where -ass words (glass, grass, class) almost all use the broad-a (crass doesn't, and probably a couple of others) that northerners confuse with r-inserting*. Grass might sound a like 'grarse' if you heard me say it, but ass sounds like ass, not arse, though Americans use 'ass' for bottom with an 'a' that sounds similar to 'ar' in Southern English English, hence the confusion.

*the confusion is that bath and scarf almost rhyme (the difference is very small with both the vowel and the th/f sound (ɑːθ vs ɑ˞ð), and often is indistinguishable to even those attuned) thanks to the trap-bath split in Southern English English and the non-rhotic nature of the dialects too meaning that r-colouring vowels is almost nothing and therefore ɑ˞ is basically the same as ɑː. It's more that we barely pronounce the r in scarf than we put one in bath. And θ and ð have very little difference most of the time in most southern English dialects.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: Henry on July 07, 2016, 10:57:20 AM
Ass-fault! DUH!!!
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: jemacedo9 on July 07, 2016, 12:23:10 PM
There have been some radio commercials here in Rochester NY where it's been pronounced ash-fault...and I believe that in watching episodes of Holmes Makes It Right (based in Canada), I've heard ash-fault as well.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: Brandon on July 07, 2016, 12:34:34 PM
Quote from: english si on July 07, 2016, 07:57:56 AM
Quote from: 1 on July 03, 2016, 09:52:04 PM
I've always said ass-fault. Would the British say arse-fault?
Ash-falt, though someone might say as-falt (or is that az-falt? certainly a hard-s). And the falt bit depends a little on accent - mine is probably actually felt (or even feld or fel, as I drop/glottal stop my 't's) - it's never the same as fault would be pronounced by that person.

And as it isn't 'ass' (a donkey), we wouldn't use 'arse' (a bottom, and we spell it that way and put an 'r' in - it's very definitely 'ar' rather than a broad 'a'), which have different etymologies anyway. And 'ass' uses short-a, even in Southern English English where -ass words (glass, grass, class) almost all use the broad-a (crass doesn't, and probably a couple of others) that northerners confuse with r-inserting*. Grass might sound a like 'grarse' if you heard me say it, but ass sounds like ass, not arse, though Americans use 'ass' for bottom with an 'a' that sounds similar to 'ar' in Southern English English, hence the confusion.

*the confusion is that bath and scarf almost rhyme (the difference is very small with both the vowel and the th/f sound (ɑːθ vs ɑ˞ð), and often is indistinguishable to even those attuned) thanks to the trap-bath split in Southern English English and the non-rhotic nature of the dialects too meaning that r-colouring vowels is almost nothing and therefore ɑ˞ is basically the same as ɑː. It's more that we barely pronounce the r in scarf than we put one in bath. And θ and ð have very little difference most of the time in most southern English dialects.

"Crass" most certainly sounds like and rhymes with "grass", "glass", and "class".

How do "bath" and "scarf" almost rhyme?  One very distinctly has an "r" after the "a", but of course, I'm speaking from an Inland North (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inland_Northern_American_English) (NCVS (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Cities_Vowel_Shift)) point of view.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: english si on July 07, 2016, 01:08:46 PM
Quote from: Brandon on July 07, 2016, 12:34:34 PM"Crass" most certainly sounds like and rhymes with "grass", "glass", and "class".
Trap-bath split (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pronunciation_of_English_%E2%9F%A8a%E2%9F%A9#Trap.E2.80.93bath_split) and inconsistent application of it to each ending.
QuoteHow do "bath" and "scarf" almost rhyme?  One very distinctly has an "r" after the "a"
Indeed - hence why, for me, it's an almost. I R-color vowels (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R-colored_vowel) that are followed by 'r'.

For southern English accents that don't R-color vowels, and are (like mine) non-rhotic (the further west, the more likely that the person pronounces 'r's more solidly and tuner and tuna sound different in more than just where the stress is), then it's a case of how they deal with th/f sounds as to whether its an exact rhyme or not, as the vowels would be the same. I have a distinction, but many don't.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: Brandon on July 07, 2016, 01:22:43 PM
Quote from: english si on July 07, 2016, 01:08:46 PM
Quote from: Brandon on July 07, 2016, 12:34:34 PM"Crass" most certainly sounds like and rhymes with "grass", "glass", and "class".
Trap-bath split (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pronunciation_of_English_%E2%9F%A8a%E2%9F%A9#Trap.E2.80.93bath_split) and inconsistent application of it to each ending.
QuoteHow do "bath" and "scarf" almost rhyme?  One very distinctly has an "r" after the "a"
Indeed - hence why, for me, it's an almost. I R-color vowels (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R-colored_vowel) that are followed by 'r'.

For southern English accents that don't R-color vowels, and are (like mine) non-rhotic (the further west, the more likely that the person pronounces 'r's more solidly and tuner and tuna sound different in more than just where the stress is), then it's a case of how they deal with th/f sounds as to whether its an exact rhyme or not, as the vowels would be the same. I have a distinction, but many don't.

Quite interesting.  While for those who speak a non-rhotic variety, they would be almost, if not a rhyme.  Meanwhile, you'd think I'm saying "beeyth" and "scahrrrf".  What we perceive here (Great Lakes region) as "ass-fault" would sound to others as "eeyss-fahlt".  And we completely lack the trap-bath split.  But, due to the NCVS, you'd probably hear "greeyss", "gleeyss", "cleeyss", etc.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: lordsutch on July 07, 2016, 01:39:31 PM
ass-fault here. British people would pronounce it "tar-mack." :)
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: noelbotevera on July 07, 2016, 09:59:28 PM
I've pronounced it asp-fault occasionally, but mostly I just say ass-fault.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: CNGL-Leudimin on July 08, 2016, 04:47:24 PM
As it is written: as-fal-to. Problem is, I don't speak the same language.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: Brandon on July 08, 2016, 05:16:16 PM
Quote from: CNGL-Leudimin on July 08, 2016, 04:47:24 PM
As it is written: as-fal-to. Problem is, I don't speak the same language.

The convenience of a language with an academy.  A bit of a primer of English accents and dialects:

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/UsefulNotes/AmericanAccents
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/UsefulNotes/BritishAccents
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/UsefulNotes/CanadianAccents
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/UsefulNotes/AustralianAccent
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: lordsutch on July 08, 2016, 08:42:06 PM
Quote from: Brandon on July 08, 2016, 05:16:16 PM
The convenience of a language with an academy.  A bit of a primer of English accents and dialects:

An academy doesn't necessarily help. Get an Argentinian, a Mexican, and two Spaniards from Madrid and Valencia in the same room and they'll pronounce the exact same Spanish words differently (although like most accented varieties of English, they'll get used to the differences fairly quickly).
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: empirestate on July 11, 2016, 12:04:46 AM
Those of you who answered "ash-fault", do you mean that's what you would typically say, or is that what you would consider to be correct when the word is being carefully pronounced? In other words, if you were giving a formal oration or in some other context where your speech was more precise than it is in casual conversation, would you still say "ash-fault" or would you shift to something more closely suggested by the spelling?
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: 7/8 on July 11, 2016, 07:45:46 AM
Quote from: empirestate on July 11, 2016, 12:04:46 AM
Those of you who answered "ash-fault", do you mean that's what you would typically say, or is that what you would consider to be correct when the word is being carefully pronounced? In other words, if you were giving a formal oration or in some other context where your speech was more precise than it is in casual conversation, would you still say "ash-fault" or would you shift to something more closely suggested by the spelling?

For me personally, I would still say "ash-fault" in formal speech because it's the common pronunciation where I live. Even my civil engineering professors (the ones born and raised in Canada) say "ash-fault".
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: billtm on July 14, 2016, 10:35:18 PM
OMG! This is the first time I've heard somebody say 'ash-fault'!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAdTDKgDy5M (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAdTDKgDy5M)
Skip to 1:58
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: 7/8 on July 14, 2016, 10:39:37 PM
Quote from: billtm on July 14, 2016, 10:35:18 PM
OMG! This is the first time I've heard somebody say 'ash-fault'!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAdTDKgDy5M (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAdTDKgDy5M)
Skip to 1:58

Oh yeah, he's definitely Canadian! Did you hear his pronunciation of "out"?  :)
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: billtm on July 14, 2016, 10:47:56 PM
Quote from: 7/8 on July 14, 2016, 10:39:37 PM
Quote from: billtm on July 14, 2016, 10:35:18 PM
OMG! This is the first time I've heard somebody say 'ash-fault'!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAdTDKgDy5M (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAdTDKgDy5M)
Skip to 1:58

Oh yeah, he's definitely Canadian! Did you hear his pronunciation of "out"?  :)

Wow, I didn't notice that at first! :-D
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: Roadrunner75 on July 15, 2016, 12:26:11 AM
I haven't heard someone call it "ash-phalt" in years, and then as soon as this thread comes along, somebody comes to our office for a meeting this week and calls it exactly that.
Title: Re: Pronunciation of "asphalt"
Post by: sparker on August 06, 2016, 06:08:57 AM
Have some friends living in Bennington, VT; in a discussion about the construction work on VT 279, they referred to it as "AZ-FAULT".  That would be the only variation on the "ass-fault" pronunciation common here in CA that I've encountered so far.